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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
 I know I was voting for cosmicomics, but after reading Wiggles' filter I'd thought he wouldn't be that bad of a lynch, either. Honestly, that guy needs to flip soon. It seems as though nobody is really willing to talk about him. Does anybody have a town read on him, and why? | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
On March 25 2013 14:15 DarthPunk wrote: These kind of posts are super weird after we mislynched again. When I mislynch three times in a row my confidence is shot. I double and triple think every read because I am worried about mis-lynching again. So when people come straight out after a mislynch like that fearlessly wanting to lynch into lynch bait. It worries me immensely. What about cosmicomics makes him lynch bait? I mean, people are simply ignoring him or refusing to talk about him, and I don't understand why town is so eager to ignore him. I've felt like he's looked scummy every single day, and while some have agreed and others have simply ignored him, I haven't heard anybody read him as town. You call him "lynch bait" but don't say how or why he looks scummy enough to be lynch bait, or what about him makes him town that just looks scummy. | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
On March 19 2013 13:28 Wade Fell wrote: You know what geript? I'm tired of you flinging shit like a monkey in a zoo from the sidelines. If you had something to say, you'd have said it during D1. Everything you've done this game has been with the purpose of hurting town, and you're just mad I've attacked you and other people who didn't like VE's idea for forming a town circle. Your so-called evidence regarding how I began this night is bullshit, like everything else you spew. of COURSE I look into the filters of dead townies. of COURSE I'll take his reads into account. we were literally talking about this over the course of the mafia podcast, but you didn't absorb any of that because you're just another grush, just another player who is worthless as a townie, so worthless scum keeps him alive until lylo because he never does anything remotely useful, the perfect scum player. VE told me to hold back on attacking you tonight, he said that he'd try to coax something useful out of you, but what's this? You're flinging shit at everything useful town has tried to do this game, because the very idea of veterans, of skilled players, trying to hunt scum is offensive to you. You're just a fly, geript, a fly on the wall that I will crush like all the other players who stand against me this game. I'm tired of listening to your garbage. tomorrow try to start a wagon on me, I fucking dare you. I'll lynch you first. I really doubt that geript is scum considering how hard WF worked to go after him. Geript was WF's back-up for his TPC obsession. | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
He also didn't have much to say about kenpachi, layabout, or kitaman. Layabout is another player who has really escaped attention despite posting almost nothing and I'll be reading his filter. | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
On March 18 2013 09:21 layabout wrote: What do you think of zarepath or WoS? On March 18 2013 10:26 layabout wrote: Right now the 3 wagons are zarepath darthpunk and greymist. I wouldn't want to encourage ppl to do this but the way he calls everyone suspicious of him scum is remarkably town-like. Grey's looks fine to me so ## votezarepath night all On March 19 2013 02:19 layabout wrote: vivax i really like your case on zarepath, particularly the way he calls greymist scum for not pushing him. Isn't that more or less what prom did last game? On March 20 2013 00:26 layabout wrote: What do you make of keirathi's take on zarepath? Layabout has a short filter (5 pages or so) and I recommend that everybody read it. I'm at a point where I'm worried that I can open anybody's filter and become convinced their scum, and so second/third opinions would be very helpful here. The quotes above are everything that layabout saying on Day 1 about me. Note that the only time he mentioned me before actually voting for me was in asking someone ELSE about me, and his vote is more giving town reads on two other wagons than it is actually thinking critically. I think his day 1 lacked any critical thought and was motivated by a desire to be with town. On Day 2, he was very erratic and back-and-forth, seemingly dependent on thread sentiment. He agreed with Ace that VE needed to be lynched (note that WF was as well). Note also this very confusing non-statement about BH's likely scumminess: On March 20 2013 08:27 layabout wrote: It's normal so we have a rough idea, i think in the mafia podcast drh mentioned wanting to use hidden communication roles, if BH is the scum mason and can mason people all the time why would town's only mason be grey's role? Keir was saying that he thinks they will be balanced am i am inclined to agree. So i think it's more likely that his role belongs to town. BH's defense of GK was scummy. His filter looks quite normal for him, i tend to skim his posts. When called out for this whishy-washiness, his response is the least critical way to think about someone whom he seems to be saying quite a bit (without actually saying anything): On March 20 2013 08:39 layabout wrote: Maybe i am not saying this right. I think that there are likely quite a few mason roles in this game because of greymists role, he is a sudo-mason/vig. It would be really weird if that was the only mason role that belongs to town. BH claims mason but a more powerful mason than grey. Either there are no more masons and since grey's mason is so weak i think that would leave BH town. Or there a more masons and one of the masons is scum. I don't like how his scum read of BH, which can only be a scum read when pressed to it by others, is based entirely on town blue-claiming. In fact, he asks for yet another blue claim in the following post: On March 20 2013 10:08 layabout wrote: Haven't filtered WoS since day1, his attitude didn't look good and grey thought he was scum. I want to resolve stuff to do with BH though. If you are a town aligned mason i strongly suggest claiming. night. Why demand a blue claim just to make BH suspicious? Why is this scum read based entirely upon the possible number of masons, and nothing actually within the content of BH? Then in his reads post, he puts BH under a "reasonable to be mafia" section but he is the only one with a caveat: On March 22 2013 10:02 layabout wrote: Players that stand a reasonable chance of being mafia@ Glurio Wade Fell (depending on other roles) TestSubject893 Mr. Wiggles Players that admited to being 3rd party and are currently advocating their own lynch: VisceraEyes So he spends all this time talking about the various ways that BH might be mafia depending upon blue roles, but he actively defends BH from actual content-based arguments: On March 20 2013 00:42 layabout wrote: Vivax that is literally the worst reason to lynch BH i have ever seen or thought of. But for all this talk and discussion about BH, he doesn't actually want any attention on BH: On March 20 2013 08:15 layabout wrote: I don't want to look at BH until we have more masons out or flipped, it's really unlikely that grey would be the only one since he was supposed to be the vig. So for someone who so very much doesn't want BH to be talked about (but is doing it anyway), who is the main object of his pressure? VE, the vet claim who layabout never calls mafia. It's the simple thing to do, he says, etc. Which I find odd, because just before this, he said: On March 20 2013 06:13 layabout wrote: Why the hell is there a push on VE? dude is supertown. But when he caught up and realized that VE may have joined 3P, or at least that others suspected it, he piled on the pressure with the rest of the thread. Why is a townie so carefree with terms like "supertown" if they can so easily toss them aside in favor of joining thread sentiment? What made VE so "supertown" and yet is entirely worthless evidence in the face of VE outing a 3P player and posting the logs? Why does this "supertown" read not give layabout a MINUTE of reconsidering that perhaps VE didn't actually join the 3P, as he obviously posted the entire log (but took time to remove the time stamps)? We don't see evidence of that read actually being a read anywhere in the thread. I posit that only mafia would have the confidence to waltz into a thread where there is a serious push to lynch someone, and before actually catching up on those arguments say "why are we trying to lynch mr. supertown himself?" and then join the thread in trying to lynch that person -- not even on the basis of their scumminess. There is zero consistency with his reads and votes, most of his filter is him asking other people what they think about various people that he hasn't present his own read on yet, and the few times he's forced into making statements one way or the other, as in with BH, he states it both ways and then tries to back out of it awkwardly. His final post is an admission that he doesn't have much time right now, which is the only point that I will give him in his favor right now. But even before then his contributions were lightweight and compromised, and incredibly awkward in anything and everything having to do with BH. | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
On March 20 2013 08:27 layabout wrote: It's normal so we have a rough idea, i think in the mafia podcast drh mentioned wanting to use hidden communication roles Okay, so this is a setup speculation-based argument, not exactly the greatest for forming reads to begin with. if BH is the scum mason and can mason people all the time why would town's only mason be grey's role? Things get confusing here. He enters the hypothetical, essentially stating that BH can only be the scum mason if there is another town mason. Think about that argument for a second, and the number of assumptions that it's based on, and remember that layabout is going out of his way to say this IMMEDIATELY after stating that he doesn't want to look at BH right now. Keir was saying that he thinks they will be balanced am i am inclined to agree. So i think it's more likely that his role belongs to town. The very beginning of this sentence has a minor tell -- he doesn't just say that he thinks mason roles will be balanced, he has to frame it within what someone else has already said -- someone who has already flipped town. But what he's actually saying doesn't make a lot of sense, either. He's assuming that there will be a balanced number of mason roles, and that therefore his role is more likely to belong to town. But if mason roles were balanced, wouldn't that mean that there must be another mafia mason role somewhere that layabout must know about in order for BH to more likely be town? His conclusion seems to be the opposite of the logic he just presented us. Now, you can say, "oh, he just miscommunicated, or made a mistake." If you make a mistake, it is much more likely to be on the logical side of your argument than it is on the actual conclusion side. You don't say that BH is more likely to be town as an accident -- there must be a reason for that, and that reason is not anywhere in this post. I think the reason could be found more in the motivations that drive layabout than in any argument that he's presented. BH's defense of GK was scummy. His filter looks quite normal for him, i tend to skim his posts. So if BH is more likely to be town, why is this statement here? It seems that he still feels like he hasn't produced enough of a read for whoever asked him whether he thought BH was scummy or not, and so he feels compelled to say something more. But this statement reveals that layabout's read of BH has exactly no bearing on his argument that BH is town -- he admits something scummy about BH that I don't think anybody actually cares about, but then tempers that with the statement that BH's filter looks NORMAL, ie, indescript, not worth looking into. And then the final statement he makes, the fact that layabout hasn't actually thoroughly read BH's filter, makes this entire post looks like the most awkward possible dance to avoid saying anything concrete about BH at all. It looks fueled by a motivation to clear himself of any statement about BH's actual scumminess or towniness, an admission that he hasn't given serious thought to a person he is spending a serious amount of time and effort talking about, and an attempt to drive the discussion towards setup and role speculation and away from filter content and rational argument. I think this is an incredibly scummy post, and I think he knew it, too, which is why he posted a follow-up which clarified his statement into "BH might be scum if there is another town mason." But whether that's what layabout meant to say in the first place or not doesn't matter; the confusion and mistakes in this post I've dissected above reveal the motivations and priorities of layabout, and those motivations and priorities are SCUM. ##vote: layabout | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
On March 20 2013 23:44 WaveofShadow wrote: Apparently so? There is a circumstance where I think this may not be true since again, my PM says nothing about alignment, but my rolecheck result surprised me. What was surprising about your N1 rolecheck, WoS? This was never clear to me. | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
On March 20 2013 23:40 WaveofShadow wrote: DP I already linked it. You quoted it. Had I gone longer without having to reveal, before every nightcheck I would refer to someone being 'particularly interesting.' Also, where are your breadcrumbs for each of your other nightchecks? You never gave any breadcrumb that you would check who you actually alleged to check, and convenientely both times those people ended up as dead, and you only claimed to have checked them after they were dead. Another question is this: if you have been roleblocked the past two nights, why did literally nobody claim that they were roleblocked on N1? | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
WoS is now on my radar again and I intend to look more into geript's case on him. If I don't have time to give myself a serious look at him, it'll be between cosmic and layabout for me. I've been wanting a cosmic lynch for days now so I can easily join a cosmic wagon if town wants to consolidate there, but I'd really like more opinions on my layabout case. So far I've heard "good case" from a few people. | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
On March 21 2013 01:45 zarepath wrote: From Bureaucracy mafia: layabout, Sandroba, VE, BH Mr. Orange ... does that refer to Fruity Mafia? hopeless1der, layabout, sandroba, yamato, Vivax Layabout is the mirror, isn't he? I'm beginning to wonder if layabout is the mirror and thus a third party. BH, Sandroba, and VE are all dead, and since he explicitly refers to Bureaucracy mafia, the only person left is layabout. I wonder if this explains some of his scummy play -- unwilling to make cases, quick to claim that BH is the mirror and should be lynched, etc. It's also possible, however, that someone else put that there so as to make VE think it was someone else recruiting him, so this is mostly speculation without a real case. The main thing that makes me question my layabout read is the fact that he called for a BH lynch based on the fact that BH was the mirror (he was masoning). That turned out to be a dumb thing that he retracted, though, because logs were posted and we got BH's role name, and it wasn't the Eye. Does anyone else have an opinion on this? Is this a good enough reason to consider layabout town, or a good enough reason to not lynch him today even in the face of his super weird comments about BH? | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
I am no longer advocating a layabout lynch for today. On another review of his filter, his push to lynch BH does not seem to be scum-motivated, even though it is almost immediately withdrawn -- I can see scum maybe doing it knowing that they are going to withdraw the case because it was based off of misinformation, but that's not my read of what happened. That leaves to me WoS and cosmicomics. On Day 3 I posted this, adding in Wiggles in a subsequent post: On March 22 2013 01:26 zarepath wrote: Vivax, right now I'm convinced there's scum in one of these three players: TestSubject, Trance, and CC. I'm more convinced of CC than the others, but I haven't studied their filters in full since the beginning of D2. In the end, Wiggles got lynched, and at this point the only person left on my list is CC. I've suspected him since Day 2 and he hasn't done anything to look pro-town that I can tell. BH said literally nothing about him, many people have mentioned he looks scummy for the same reasons that Wiggles was scummy and yet Wiggles is the one who got the votes, not CC. His votes have all been scummy, his justifications for his votes have been scummy, and his cases and reads are insubstantial. I think CC is our most surefire lynch, and while WoS' blue claim looks sketchier by the day and layabout looks anti-town, I am most sure of CC being scum of the three. At this time I think that if you are okay with CC being lynched (ie, top 3 scumreads okay) you need to put the vote down on him now before mafia control the lynch as they did the last 3 days. I am not convinced that I can be around for any significant participation leading up to the lynch tonight, and I don't want another Ace lynch on our hands. ##unvote layabout ##vote: cosmicomics | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
On March 27 2013 04:47 geript wrote: Umm there's what 14 people left... Why do you think this is LYLO? What you hiding bro? Someone said for a 24 person game, there can be 5-8 scum. We don't know if 3P has KP that it hasn't used yet. We mislynch, we're at 13 people, scum kill 2, we're at 11. If there are 7 scum in this game and none of them were modkilled, we've lost if we mislynch today. If there are 6 scum in this game and none of them were modkilled, then we're at 6-5 after the night, but 5-5 if 3P kills someone or we screw up another vigi shot. I think we should treat today as our last chance to not lose. | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
geript kenpachi WoS glurio zarepath DoYouHas layabout kitaman27 RyuSuzaku ThePeashooter Ten of us, and 4 or fewer scum. (I think I'm correct in assuming that if there were 5 scum left we would have already lost.) Since their KP is apparently still 2 but we haven't lost, we have to lynch scum today, making it 6 to 3, at which point I don't know if they will still have 2 KP or not (I think we can still win either way at that point). I don't think there's any excuse for any townies left to NOT read the full filter of everyone left on this list. I have some suspicions but I won't be posting anything until I've given every single player a full read and then laid out how I think things fall. | ||
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