EPTNewbie Mini Mafia XXXVII - Page 81
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geript
10024 Posts
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
Because SKs are basically a balance tool for the game. So if town are lynching mafia, SK shoots at town to keep town numbers down. If town are lynching town, SK shoot at mafia to try to keep it even. This relies on the SK being alive, and the SK being able to discern who is mafia, past a point (one reason why SK setups are so hard in newbie games). | ||
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Dandel Ion
Austria17960 Posts
On February 20 2013 02:56 geript wrote: The Setup isn't the problem but a vigilante wouldn't hurt. Vig on top of this would have ended the game even faster, I reckon. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
On February 20 2013 02:57 Dandel Ion wrote: Vig on top of this would have ended the game even faster, I reckon. I agree. No one knew shit. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
On February 20 2013 02:57 marvellosity wrote: SK games are typically much more fast-paced than non-SK games, with fewer mislynches/lynches and more deaths. Because SKs are basically a balance tool for the game. So if town are lynching mafia, SK shoots at town to keep town numbers down. If town are lynching town, SK shoot at mafia to try to keep it even. This relies on the SK being alive, and the SK being able to discern who is mafia, past a point (one reason why SK setups are so hard in newbie games). vigilantes suffer from the same problem in newbies as what i've bolded, relying on someone being able to discern who is mafia, or at least use their shot wisely. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17992 Posts
Worst-case scenario was: Mislynch D1 2 townies shot N1 Mislynch D2 2 townies shot N2 Lylo D3 2 "free" mislynches in a mini is fairly standard. The joker in this game was the SK. The SK doesn't want the worst-case scenario for either town or scum. Basically if a townie is lynched, he should want to shoot scum and if a scum is lynched he should want to shoot town. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17992 Posts
Town MVP: TestSubject893. In the brief period he played, he tracked the SK and a scum (not the one delivering KP). He also posted calm and collected, despite the very aggressive tone in the thread. Scum MVP: Mandalor for showing up and voting on D3  In all seriousness: Mocsta played an active game, but all of scum relied heavily on town not doing any real analysis at all. There was one point where Mocsta made a (rather big) mistake and instead of a townie jumping on it and pushing Mocsta, Sevryn used it to distance them from eachother AND gloss over the mistake. | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
On February 20 2013 02:55 Dandel Ion wrote: Scum RB doesn't stop Vet. Vet is passive. Not to be a douche, but did you read the OP Dandel? This is the second time you have disagreed with what was openly stated in the OP. On February 20 2013 02:55 Dandel Ion wrote: Since the SK only shot once (and as I understand it, also tried to hit scum), you can pretend it was a vig. Vig hits townie. 3 (effective) mislynches. Vet doesn't get shot. It was kind of a worst-case scenario for town, but shit happens. So if we pretend OO was vig, then you recommend we don't lynch the SK and just let scum RB the SK all day? I guess that KINDA turns him into a vig but a vig who doesn't actually want town to win... (with the semi-plus of vet status?). I just don't see how our only active power role hitting on his first try ends up as "Worst case scenario" for town  On February 20 2013 03:06 zarepath wrote: My new policy lynch is to policy lynch Mocsta. Feels that way. | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
We really should have done better work on D3. We had the Mocsta slip and two easy filters to really delve into. | ||
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Mandalor
Germany2362 Posts
On February 20 2013 03:06 zarepath wrote: My new policy lynch is to policy lynch Mocsta. I said that pregame, should've listened I'm sorry I gave you all such a poor game. What I said in the thread was true and I asked Acro for a replacement actually (he couldn't get one). gg anyway, and wp by my scum buddies. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17992 Posts
On February 20 2013 03:11 Sn0_Man wrote: Not to be a douche, but did you read the OP Dandel? This is the second time you have disagreed with what was openly stated in the OP. So if we pretend OO was vig, then you recommend we don't lynch the SK and just let scum RB the SK all day? I guess that KINDA turns him into a vig but a vig who doesn't actually want town to win... (with the semi-plus of vet status?). I just don't see how our only active power role hitting on his first try ends up as "Worst case scenario" for town Feels that way. He hit the SK, which is good, but trading SK for a tracker is not the deal you want. OO was quite obviously the SK too. While I don't expect optimal play from power roles, saying he "hit" first try is only part of the truth: he tracked someone to a kill. At the time he posted, it was clear there was either an SK or a vig in the game. Btw, I'm not saying the claim was bad. It wasn't. But it could have been played differently which might have made the game easier for town (as is, everybody went to sleep D2 and never really woke up again). Scum RB'd what they thought could be a JK and took their chances with a potential watcher in order to kill the tracker. This was totally logical, because in addition to a power role, TestSubject was the only one who was both fairly active and making much sense. This all meant that you effectively traded a power role for an SK, with no additional use because nobody bothered to ever look at the D2 posts again. That is not a "win" for town. | ||
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Sevryn
698 Posts
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
Lesson learned though: I guess town has to keep the SK alive all game to have a hope of victory in the future. Gotcha. Although OO seemed to be pretty far off the mark on who to shoot anyway (not that anybody really had better ideas). Even if we hit Mand/Sev, I still see mocsta winning the game eventually since at some point town HAS to lynch the SK. I do want to point out that all the analysis of keeping the SK alive in the obs qt thread kinda forgets that he can be perma-roleblocked by scum. | ||
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Sevryn
698 Posts
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Sevryn
698 Posts
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warbaby
United States510 Posts
I was certain one of the active players was scum, but I was leaning more towards sn0_man and zarepath since they boogied out for all of D3 like that. I wanted to be suspicious of Mocsta, but I don't know how I would have convinced Corazon to go along. And nobody else in town was interested in lynching an active player D2 or D3 (or doing much of anything at all). I feel this was more a failure of town than a victory due to the effort of scum. Not to say that Mocsta didn't play really well. | ||
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warbaby
United States510 Posts
I think a big town mistake in this game (that I made as well) was the lack of effort to hunt scum among active players on D2 and D3. Lynching lurkers is cool but that doesn't mean we should sit around whining for 24 hours about how lurky the lurkers are. | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
Sorry for going AFK -- I had family obligations almost all of Saturday, and Sundays are crazy. | ||
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thrawn2112
United States6918 Posts
Cor, when you made that post about "I have a case but I don't want to post it yet".. that's pretty much the opposite of what you should have been doing. you win the game by creating discussion, not by shutting it down at every turn gg mafia team | ||
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