Liquid City Mafia

On October 02 2012 05:27 austinmcc wrote:

I made it because he wrote the word SPIES. That word doesn't appear ANYWHERE in this game.

Same as...q-bertz or whoever writing the word "mole" in bureaucracy. If you know something about a role that nobody knows EXISTS yet, then you're not town.

Spies doesn't exist, he mentions spy reads, therefore he's not town. Turns out spies exist in some similar game, as a normal thing that people know about.

On October 01 2012 19:13 risk.nuke wrote:

Fist things first. Now you don't have the first clue about what fake-contribution is which makes it difficult to discuss the subject. A person fake-contributing is someone floating around, have proven to be active + Show Spoiler + and at a first glance looks too be blending in but taking a closer looks you see the majority of this persons contributions belong for instance and example in the following categorys. Setup-speculation, answering general and setup related questions or alignment speculation and other things but scumhunting. I like to define the categorys as posts scum can make without advancing the thread in any way and extend it to answering questions that if they don't answer or post it someone else very likely will. Note: this can include important and even great posts if they fall in the category someone else was bound to post it sooner or later.

As for most fake-contributing posts they are not some sort of evil posts in disguise only visible to your lens of truth. They are simply general posts and most often helpful to a lesser degree. Most importantly what you don't grasp is both townies and scum do them and are because of this null-tells. I have absolutely no idea what you mean when you say townies have absolutely no purpose fake-contributing. It's purified dumb.

1 Having now explained the term fake-contributor I can answer your post. It's bullshit to call someone a fake-contributor day 1 almost without exception because it's in generally to early to tell the persons agenda.
2 I voted for shady because it's down to him versus KingJames. Additionally I agreed and considered Shady being scummy even as I suggested the kush lynch. Which was done because I didn't want to sheep others the first thing I did (because there is little value in that) and because I wanted to discuss other candidates then shady (which was shutdown asap by marv, but nevertheless told me something about marv) As for why I choose kush the filters weren't implied so I picked the first suspicious filter I found.
3 A kush lynch i don't see happening and a voteswitch to kush now I'd disagree with because my suspicion against a successful late bandwagon switch would be greater then my suspicion against kush. (Node. you're late to the party.) If you rephrase the question. Am I still suspicious against kush I will tell you I think kush is scummier now then I did at the time I suggested the vote on him.

On October 02 2012 05:57 Kreb wrote:

That is another reason Im starting to feel a bit bad about him. Him moving on from extremely general advice to the whole thread about "we need to play like this guys" to taking light jabs at a lurker or two (who admittedly didnt contribute much) also follows what I could see being a inexperienced player trying to get out of trouble.

That said I still dont really feel comfortable voting Kush either. He is very hard to read but as marv pointed out this might be town-kush playing and not mafia-kush.

Too bad the deadline is pretty much the worst ever for me (at about 2h before I get up for work) so I wont be able to change my vote should anything come up the last 4-5h. Im still leaning towards KJ because its seemingly much less of a loss mislynching him than someone more active though. I'll try to make up my mind in the next 2h or so and present my vote.

On October 02 2012 06:50 kushm4sta wrote:
BC I like your defence of kj more than your scumreads. You basically you are distancing yourself from this lynch without pushing a viable alternative.

The recent post from VE.
I'm not quite sure why you keep saying it doesn't matter even though you clearly think it does.
Do not take this as a flame:
Anul made you hid bitch and now you are dickriding him?
You prod him lightly, he rages, you run away scared, then you praise him for being a difficult target?

What makes him a difficult target...high hanging fruit?

On October 02 2012 06:53 marvellosity wrote:
Kinda glad you did that VE, because I didn't want to have to come into the thread saying "VE has a valid excuse for not posting like a mofo, but I don't want to share without him saying so".

The rest of talis' case is just bad. How is VE stirring up things a little (not even a lot, and he doesn't keep harping on about it) in the slightest alignment indicative? VE happily does the same as either town or scum.

The 'low-hanging fruit' business barely merits a response. Can otherwise be read as "comments on stuff relevant to the thread". And the hypocrisy behind the activity thing is just immense. I find the entire case quite scummy, but it's ameliorated by the fact that talis didn't know of VE's activity stuff, and could have had terrible confirmation bias for the rest of the case. I'll be looking for talis to conform to *his* town meta with more posts and contributions.

BC: that's news to me about kj's meta, I've never seen him play before. Going to have to reconsider. I don't really share your feelings about risk though, the biggest surprise to me is how much and the length with which he's posted. It seems he's already posted more than in his entire scum game in Bureaucracy, I'm not feeling it.

On October 02 2012 07:05 kushm4sta wrote:


I got a null read on all those people you said.
And your cases? A few sentences if that. The cases are weak.

They are not viable lynches because no one has voted for them as of yet. You need some kind of epic case to convince all those people quick enough. And your cases, if you wanna call them that, aren't going to convince anybody.

On October 02 2012 07:07 risk.nuke wrote:
BC talk to me scumshit. You show up late with a forced post in which you wildly misinterpret what I said, trying to twist find loopholes in my words too frame shit on me and. Additionally you state out of the blue you want to lynch 3 new targets with half of europe asleep untill the daypost. What are you trying to accomplish and how are you trying to make that happen?

On October 02 2012 07:13 marvellosity wrote:
Your point on austin is way better though, BC There are a couple of things about austin:

- he gives way too much thought and time to setup speculation and shenannies and can go off on tangents.

So with that alone I wouldn't find him banging on about spy that relevant, except for two things (which you mention)

- the fact that it specifies pretty damn clearly in the OP that all available role names are known to us
- that's all he's talked about having been absent for a long time.

If you're gonna derp around talking about setup and spy lololol you'd imagine you'd at least fucking read the setup first. Gonna give his filter another look. Anyway I'm gonna unvote kj for now

##unvote

On October 02 2012 07:31 Mementoss wrote:
Im going to placeholder vote on shadysands, and then wash the dishes then read the game,so many lurkers (me included) day 1. I'll see what I can dig up tho.

On October 02 2012 07:35 risk.nuke wrote:
It's forced because it screams I need to make up a post about someone fast. That's the only possible reason you typed up a shitpost like that. You can't even have had time to properly read through it. And if you did read through it you must have once again felt forced or you would had deleted that shit.

I never said I thought shady was scummy in the thread. Nor did I claim to have had. So how can you say I'm lying. I stated that I was suspicious of him and I was. I give reasoning for the rest of my actions which I sincerely wonder if you've even read. But your case isn't that you have a problem with my reasoning. You just straight out attempt to misinterpret it to the thread.

I said I thought kush was scummier now then then which to me translates into. Kush has done absolutely nothing to redeem himself of my suspicions. On the contrary the posts he's made has only made me more suspicious. But no fucking where do I say that he's my strongest scumread.

Leaving out the name calling generalizations of my posts. These are your only 2 actual points against me which are both fucking untrue.

And don't think you can claim coming in late bringing not one but three new names to the table and expected it to generate anything but distraction from the other candidates.

On October 02 2012 07:39 Sharrant wrote:
@Risk.Nuke
I was at work like I said I would be. I did have to cover for someone for an extra hour, that's why I was late getting on here.

In response to your earlier question, on Saturday I worked all day, then went to another city for Nuit Blanche, then came back to work despite not having slept because my boss asked me if I could cover for someone who was sick. After that it was Sunday night, I saw that I had a PM, saw it was about this game, and was way too fucking tired to do anything. So I set my alarm early to give myself time to make one decent post in the morning before work. Unfortunately I was so rushed I forgot to actually follow with my vote, and I felt really stupid about halfway into work. I'm a little surprised no one called me out on it.

I'm just going to post this part now, the rest will follow in a little bit. Just reading through filters.

On October 02 2012 07:55 risk.nuke wrote:
BC not posting my suspicion doesn't mean I didn't have them. It means I can't prove I had them. It's not the same as a small lie which I don't believe for a second you don't understand.

You want to be usefull. Who would you vote for amongst the people with votes.

On October 02 2012 08:21 Mattchew wrote:
BC mind telling me why you think i am scum?

also, I could get down with an austin lynch. he doesn't feel like he is hunting scum as much as he is hunting for an easy out to vote.

I am willing to ##unvote for the meantime. I am caught up on the thread but don't actually understand some of the arguments.

On October 02 2012 08:44 marvellosity wrote:
Ugh, too much screwing meta. I don't really want to lynch austin because I know he can be totally useless day 1 as here, and others don't want to lynch the pretty scummy annul because they want to wait and see.

Why do you think austin has a higher chance of flipping scum than annul, BC?

On October 03 2012 04:46 marvellosity wrote:


You're not making sense. The Node push makes no sense from a mafia distraction point of view because Shady was a townie heading inexorably for the lynch. It's in these situations mafia are usually happy to sit back as town happily hops on to the townie wagon.

On Node: tell me, does his posting look like he cares for town? iamperfection pointed it out perfectly earlier: When Node was at great risk of being lynched, did he come in to drop reads and shit? No, he came in to call town stupid, and then promptly left again without making any reads or anything. How are you reading this as townie? You also, presumably from your attitude, find his defence of Shady townie. How?

Want to talk about your connection stuff a little. You don't even realise how strongly you're doing it, or how it's affecting how you think. We have:



You place your vote on him and you're not sure at all. Your very next post goes into theories about the Node wagon and how it looked and how it makes austin look much worse (which I think I've helped establish that it doesn't really). So you, yourself, never actually had strong feelings on austin if the quote above is true, until you started ladeling Node/austin/me/VE/wagon stuff on top of it.

On October 03 2012 07:05 Mattchew wrote:


I wasn't around for when the lynch went down.

Sloosh should still be lynched, do you disagree with my assessment of it or just my lack of pushing it?

I didn't think that shady did anything (other than come back last minute to the thread) that warranted him being lynched, but because of so many people getting away with little to no information about why their vote was on him or node, I struggle to find the difference there between bad town and scum.

Forgot to unvote, woulda ended up not voting (which is basically what I did). Honestly I just had a really bad day 1 and was not able to really get a strong read on anyone through just overall reading, and then when I looked at sloosh I was away for when I should have been pushing him.

Anyway lets chat about sloosh, BC and annul. These are the players that feel weird.

Sloosh seems to be struggling to post, and seems like he is struggling to type out his thoughts. I think this is because he is scum. I was easy to make a case on because I played like shit day 1. He skews the truth in his case about me when he mentions my stop voting shady sands point. I was clearly saying this to the people that at that moment were voting shady which there were still a lot of at that time (in this thread and +2 to the voting thread). I was also not saying what alignment Shady was, I was just saying that at that time votes on him were stupid.

BC reminds me a lot of foolish playing in Bureaucracy. He knows that a lot is expected of him which makes it really really hard for him to post a lot. He is focusing in on people here and there while not actively driving discussion and calling out bad play. His posting looks really weak for a normally very confident player, and the % of fluff/bs to actual content in his filter is not up to his town-standards

Annul, his 5 page filter has nothing of actual value in terms of reasoning, scum-hunting, or explaining his thought process. He also was extremely active in the hours leading up the lynch and ended up pushing no candidate. Here is annul's last scum game filter, I feel it reads very very similar to his filter this game (link plz click)

On October 03 2012 07:29 VisceraEyes wrote:
I remember the game - I don't specifically remember the situation you're referencing. Not to say that I think you're lying, and I don't remember which game (high 40s I think), just saying that as a town player remembering a town performance (pisspoor btdubz) I don't remember that specific thing happening. Your memory is...specialized BC. You should play more.

On October 03 2012 08:09 marvellosity wrote:


Yes, that's one way to look at it; on the flip side, the right thing for austin to do as townie is to make reads and push things like he did, and like Node very much did not. How are you reading the both of them? I find austin quite townie now.

talismania - What is your current read on VE? Do you still think he is scum?

On October 03 2012 08:18 marvellosity wrote:


Ok, I get where you're coming from. I experienced similar with austin in the very last game I played with him. I voted for him on Day 1 for only talking about himself for a while then completely afking for ages when there was tonnes going on in the thread, but it turned out he was being lazy/dumb whatever, which is why I was so antsy about it this game. His contributions look more thought out, researched and I guess not-skewed than what I'd expect from scum, and I see them as good contributions.

On October 03 2012 08:32 kushm4sta wrote:
To these people saying annul should be Vig not lynched:
Please explain why.

No one has made a better case than the many against annul.
Why not save Vig for the endgame when we have more information and better reads?

On October 03 2012 09:19 annul wrote:
i guess to BC "disruption" is posting cogent arguments and/or defending claims made against yourself

On October 03 2012 09:50 Coagulation wrote:


lol..

What you think about me BC?

On October 04 2012 04:47 Mementoss wrote:


Why do you think marv shot you?

On October 04 2012 04:54 marvellosity wrote:


No, I was punished for *good* play. Useless, bad mechanic.

On October 04 2012 05:00 Z-BosoN wrote:
Wait, so Risen the paramedic, another medic on BC, and, incredibly, another one @ austin, who was also shot?? Do we have three medics, does everyone buy this??

On October 04 2012 05:02 VisceraEyes wrote:
Node is almost certainly not the scum. There was a very real possibility that he would have been lynched and annul was right, a bus in that situation would have been pretty suboptimal.

Marv is definitely the scums. Whoever he never mentions in the game I'd probably have a hard look at. Otherwise I haven't reread the game (as I said I would :<) so I'm crippled until I do.

BC what do you think of Mattchew?

On October 04 2012 05:04 VisceraEyes wrote:


He's not disputing the possibility of 4 kp...only the existence of 3 medics.

On October 04 2012 05:09 marvellosity wrote:
'weak' doctor my ass

On October 04 2012 04:56 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Also, after looking through marv's filter and gazing at the people he was fine with lynching and those he defended / tried to suggest were bad options for lynches were

Risk.nuke
Kush
Sharrant.

Of these 3 I think it is highly likely that at least 1 is scum. Of the people he accused I think mattchew is most likely to flip red as well.

On October 04 2012 05:37 risk.nuke wrote:
Who on that list would do you feel like going after then BC, I've been wanting to go after Sharrant however having been to lazy to actually read the last 20-25ish pages properly+ Show Spoiler + it felt inapropriate to make up my mind who I want to lynch.

While I'm posting, people who voted marv before this are more suspicious then the rest. Seeing as the mafia knew risen did protect marvellosity while the rest of us would still have to deal with other possibilitys, my point is that mafia would probably have wanted to get on marv as quickly as possible.

On October 04 2012 10:58 slOosh wrote:
Yea I know what you mean. Like, a post that scares me is

Like, I don't understand how he picked the pool (people marv was fine with lynching and defended from lynching seems to cover the whole pool) and saying that at least 1 is scum seems so prone to a string of mislynches (lynch A, flips town, oh B and C must be more likely to be scum). I'm agreeing with the mattchew read though and can understand the players he picked objectively, but yea it's scary.

Anyone you want to talk about?

On October 04 2012 11:31 slOosh wrote:
Ah I see. It's scary when you do it without explaining like you now did because you might be doing some high level scum play given your reputation.

Then let's talk about the list. I think kush is town based on his demeanor (throwing up thoughts onto thread without the scummy tendency to double check / review). Your turn.

On October 04 2012 11:15 kushm4sta wrote:
im so town though

On October 04 2012 12:03 kushm4sta wrote:


Dude my mom is an english major too... I think that means we are spiritual brothers.
And that's cold about my recent posts! I think my posting has improved greatly since the first day as it always does.
I've been giving my thoughts and reads freely. I've been asking people questions.
The only thing I haven't done is made big wall of text cases.
But honestly I threw away all my towncred d1 so I doubt anyone would read them anyway.
ALSO This is a huge game so people who are better at this game always say what I would say better and before I do. Therefore there hasn't really been the opportunity or the drive for walls of text.

ALSO compiling all those cases against VE.. that took like 20 minutes give me some credit there.

On October 04 2012 12:16 slOosh wrote:

It's a general heuristic that town post more freely than scum, who have inherent guilt and are scared of making scumslips etc. That's how you caught goodkarma last game no? I agree that there isn't much substance in his filter, but it's feels different from the typical trying-to-blend-in-with-town lack of substance. Worth a vig shot, not a lynch kinda thing.

Thoughts on Sharrant's more recent posts?

On October 04 2012 12:41 kushm4sta wrote:

I got mad because I hate the idea of being vig shot.

Why are people always suggesting: don't know if this guy's scum. Someone vig him. Why not vig people you actually believe to be scum???

On October 08 2012 04:03 Kreb wrote:

Just quickly: Were you targetted this night again? We still havent heard anyone claim anything.

On October 06 2012 06:37 risk.nuke wrote:
I'm just to lazy to build a case before the nightflip. I'm always watching the thread incase someone decides to pull some shenanigans. As for why I'm not posting. I consider the atleast last 20 pages useless shit and I haven't seen a point in joining the conversations that's been had.

On October 01 2012 06:15 slOosh wrote:
This is the most upsetting start to a game I've played. So I'm gonna lay some ground rules because people are playing in a way that they shirk responsibilities with their actions / words.

Biggest thing is stop saying "I wanna lynch player X what do you think?". There is no back up analysis, and it allows people to toss out names at random. You think someone is scum, back it up. Don't say "seems scummy maybe". It lets people sow seeds of suspicion and it makes mislynches more untraceable.

On October 08 2012 08:14 Coagulation wrote:


Sure I wouldnt mind a BC lynch.

zboson is more of a null read to me now. He did look scummy as fuck to me at first. then he had a bit of a townie tell and now hes back to being scummy. I wouldnt lynch him yet tho cause hes at least active.

On October 08 2012 08:45 risk.nuke wrote:
nice case BC, I can also spend 5 minutes too call all the afk vets scummy for beeing afk. Really nice demonstration of your scumhuntingskills. And you're different how?

On October 08 2012 08:45 BroodKingEXE wrote:
@BC Ive found both Matt and Coag to be scummy. I personally would like to lynch Coag to draw out Matt (as I think Coag has been more scummy). Who would you lynch first/ have a bigger scumread?

On October 08 2012 08:53 Coagulation wrote:
Im not scum bc. I think your greatly over estimating my abilitys to play town well. Not to mention I got a shit role so Im not really too worried about playing the "OMG I GOTTA DO WHATEVER I CAN TO MAKE EVERYONE KNOW IM TOWN CAUSE IM BLUE"

not happening this game. I will be sure to raise hell soon as I see scum tho.

My best bet so far would be either YOU or risk

On October 08 2012 08:59 Coagulation wrote:
also your acting like we havnt had 2 confirmed scum in a row completely stagnate town discussion 2 lynch cycles in a row now. This isnt really a "standard" game in that aspect.

On October 08 2012 09:06 risk.nuke wrote:
You say lurking but I atleast am more simmilar to afk. I'm on a break because nothing is happening in this game, the last 40 pages are useless and might well not have existed because too many are just waiting for it to come to an end. we have our lynch and there isn't anything else to it. Too me personally I can't be bothered to make a case for the lynch 3 days from now, I can't motivate myself for that. Not to mention that after the nightflips you will have better information hence making time spent scumhunting post nightflips more effective then before the flip.

This is how I feel and that is all to it. And you might have been forced to be away and unable to scumhunt but you're here now and I'm telling you your case does not impress me the slightest. If this is the best you'll give us I'll lynch you because I know you can do alot better then those sorry lines for scumhunting.

On October 08 2012 09:06 Coagulation wrote:


oh please. People pushing shit doesnt mean they are fucking town in the slightest. I generally spend more time "contributing" as scum than I do as town just for that stupid misconception alone.

On October 08 2012 09:11 Coagulation wrote:
Like honestly Its going on night 3. IF BC doesnt die hes scum. Theres no way he would be alive still if hes town.
Thats pretty much gonna be my fucking lynch campaign in a nutshell.

On October 08 2012 09:20 Coagulation wrote:
you know damn well if town BC is alive end game theres something wrong.

On October 09 2012 04:35 Mementoss wrote:
I am the Medical Examiner aka, I am the watcher, after clues got taken away my role was changed.

Breadcrumb, the only breadcrumb would be I changed my quote to "mommy whats a gravedigger" cause I imagined the medical examiner digging up dead people to examine them. The other would be how I exchanged words with BC after he claimed he was shot.

Okay to the more juicy stuff.

Night 1:

I watched BC, BC was visited by Node(Hapa) or the mafia vigilante. So he did not lie about the shot. However, he did lie about being medic protected.





Why would town lie about this? I can't think of motivation. The only reason BC would lie about this would be because he wanted to make scum think there was a medic saving his ass. Actually, the only possible way BC is town is if he is veteran, I don't see why he would lie about this as town, and just say hai guys I was shot, but I was veteran so give me some protection tonight. However, I doubt Blackmamba would take out the veteran role after one of the vets already lost his life. Also, given the fact that Mafia didn't try to shoot him again makes me 95% sure BC is the 3rd Party Night Immue Serial Killer.



This quote also seems like he knows a bit too much, it implies that third party has some kp since no one is claiming vig.

I would 100% lynch BC tomorrow because of this lie.

That brings me to my next point. Mafia knew BC was third party after night 1.





Last minute ploys by dead mafia players to get the lynch on the third party to try and save members of their team or just to put WIFOM not to kill BC. We can use this now known knowledge to our advantage. Anyone who has been pushing BC hard after night 1 without much reason, or seems like they know too much, is scum. They are scum looking for some town cred for leading a lynch on anti town.



This post rubbed me the wrong way. BC is scum because he lied about getting shot, yet kushm4ster has no evidence to prove BC lieing about being shot. He is using this as his only reasoning. Also Marv, hard defended this guy, almost single handedly getting a wagon off him with a meta case.






I could see kushm4sta as scum.

Night 2:

I watched sloosh and nothing happened.

I wish the night deadline was earlier so I could do this last minute and get one last watch. But hopefully this will prove to be useful. Since I was shit all game and I'm sorry lol.

But yeah look back after night 1/2 and see people that seemed to have a switch of thoughts on BC or knew too much. Because scum knew BC was 3rd party pretty early. I wish I could be more helpful but I haven't been doing enough reading into the game.

I would say lynch BC > lynch kushm4ster

TLDR;

BloodyC0bbler
kushm4stap

On October 09 2012 06:07 Keirathi wrote:

Err, what?

What kind of watcher is a watcher AND a tracker?

On October 09 2012 06:12 Mementoss wrote:
Why would you lie about being Medic'd BC?

On October 09 2012 06:12 Mementoss wrote:
Why would you lie about being Medic'd BC?

On October 09 2012 06:17 VisceraEyes wrote:


Except you did that for them with the claim by thanking a magical medic - you wanted them to specifically think that you were medic protected. Why?

On October 09 2012 06:23 Keirathi wrote:
@BC:

Again, since you didn't answer me.

What makes you think that a watcher sees that someone leaves to go do something when you watch them? The specific role information doesn't suggest that at all, nor does the watcher information on mafiascum wiki. I've not played with a ton of watcher, but all of them have been the exact same variation (except in heavily themed games): you see who targets your target, and thats it.

On October 09 2012 06:24 Mementoss wrote:


I think the answer is fairly obvious. Both days we had an auto scum lynch, why would I out myself when I could get more free watches in? Also it was more revealing after node flipped scum, I thought you were scum up until that point.

On October 09 2012 06:43 Mementoss wrote:


I thought it was possible mafia medic.

On October 09 2012 06:43 Coagulation wrote:
bc are you saying mementoss is scum?

On October 09 2012 06:50 Mementoss wrote:


Because you almost always die on day 1? Gives you a cop-out for everyone that says day 3, BC not dead he must be scum, you can just say you got hit they scared of it not going through again or some shit. You could be vet, but lieing about being medic'd when there was already a couple medics claimed made no sense.

On October 09 2012 21:35 Kreb wrote:
@BC
Small question that has been annoying me since your claim:

How do you know "Veteran" was the miller role?

On October 03 2012 08:00 BlackMamba24 wrote:


I am removing the role of Veteran from the game. It was this game's equivalent to a non-aware miller. So I'm striking that off the role list. Carry on.

On October 01 2012 06:15 slOosh wrote:
This is the most upsetting start to a game I've played. So I'm gonna lay some ground rules because people are playing in a way that they shirk responsibilities with their actions / words.

Biggest thing is stop saying "I wanna lynch player X what do you think?". There is no back up analysis, and it allows people to toss out names at random. You think someone is scum, back it up. Don't say "seems scummy maybe". It lets people sow seeds of suspicion and it makes mislynches more untraceable.

---

Shady's vote makes no sense as VE pointed out. In fact the whole thing doesn't make sense, including how he has already started making connective tells on Kush based on Z-Boson. But it seems just as explainable by a combination of poor play / leftover emotions from TL-LVII. I'd wait to see what he can produce (case wise or whatnot) since arguing whether acting like a troll to incite a mod warning isn't conclusive to determining alignment.

VE I don't see your issue with annul - or are you doing one of those reaction things because its leaning on the destructive side right now.

On October 02 2012 12:33 slOosh wrote:
Guh didn't realize how much time I actually take to read. Between Node and Shady Sands I'm leaning Shady.

With a total lack of follow through after his troll antics, he has disrupted early day discussion and dropped off. Not lynching him today on the basis of a potential modkill is stupid - he could easily trade his life for hurting day 2 discussion as well and he might not even be lynched.

The nature of the Node lynch is really strange. Reason enough to lean the former.

##Vote: Shady Sands

On October 02 2012 12:49 slOosh wrote:

Node is scummy. I think what you found about his post was valid. However we can only lynch 1 at a time and I find Shady a better target for the reasons I stated. The strangeness of Node's lynch was that there was a disconnect between the push and the votes - you tossed out a bunch of names and his was just picked up. It's enough to sway me to Shady.

On October 04 2012 10:23 slOosh wrote:
What do you think of BC?

On October 04 2012 10:58 slOosh wrote:
Yea I know what you mean. Like, a post that scares me is

Like, I don't understand how he picked the pool (people marv was fine with lynching and defended from lynching seems to cover the whole pool) and saying that at least 1 is scum seems so prone to a string of mislynches (lynch A, flips town, oh B and C must be more likely to be scum). I'm agreeing with the mattchew read though and can understand the players he picked objectively, but yea it's scary.

Anyone you want to talk about?

On October 04 2012 12:16 slOosh wrote:

It's a general heuristic that town post more freely than scum, who have inherent guilt and are scared of making scumslips etc. That's how you caught goodkarma last game no? I agree that there isn't much substance in his filter, but it's feels different from the typical trying-to-blend-in-with-town lack of substance. Worth a vig shot, not a lynch kinda thing.

Thoughts on Sharrant's more recent posts?

On October 05 2012 01:27 slOosh wrote:

Yea I'd go further and put him at probable scum given his latest post.

His comments on players are more summaries and recaps of thread sentiments, he shies away from making any concrete stances, and does a good job spreading suspicions over a large pool even on his not-scum reads.

He hasn't bothered to comment / vote on marv so it shows that he isn't actually reading the thread, but wants to make sure he is seen with contribution, probably in light his name being brought up for discussion by us.

On October 06 2012 07:11 slOosh wrote:


My initial Mattchew case still stands - he hasn't properly addressed it and is compounded by his continuous inactivity / contribution-less posting. Furthermore the only times he pops into the thread is when his name is mentioned.

Along those lines I'm kind of wary of BC. I engaged in his 3 of 1 must be scum idea to get better reads off the people and him, but he dropped off and hasn't really followed up on the thought, which suggests that what I initially thought of the post:
might be the correct interpretation. But this might just be wariness of a feared scum player, if he posted follow up my suspicions would probably subside.

I had a slight townread on kush, as one of those (unintentionally) disruptive town players. The gut feel is still there.

You just started posting so I'll have a better idea soon enough.

On October 09 2012 12:57 slOosh wrote:
Guh Mondays, finally over.

To all concerned that I'm not playing like I usually do - you are all using meta terribly. My playstyle is reactive. I poke and prod and gather information and then bust out a case. If people are lurking and give 1 line responses I can't do my thing. Now that we finally have an open lynch tomorrow and people are actually posting you can expect my "regular" play.

Excusing BC because the benefits of an SK is ridiculous - we don't know the nature of the 3rd party role, and people are forgetting that it has some higher order win condition that ends the game. BC is the best lynch for tomorrow. We have mementoss' claim, and you can see even how he reacted to the claim by discrediting him ("horribly bad townie or mafia") instead of trying to come to mutual understanding.

On October 03 2012 00:42 slOosh wrote:
@austin
I had less than two hours to reread everything and determine where my vote should go. I wasn't going to waste it talking about people who probably won't get lynched.

---

It's evident that this town suffered a day 1 of inactivity and scum were probably happy to go along with that. The one that stuck out most to me was Mattchew:

The clearest thing in his filter is that he is happy to take no stances at all, and is not interested in getting a solid lynch.

Which amounts to "Shady could be town because of this, and scum because of this". The next time he posts follow up is


This post shows how detached he is from thread. The context surrounding it is discussion centered around kushm4sta and kingjames01. There is no avalanche of dumb sheep votes on Shady, people are looking into other lynch candidates. There is no purpose other than opposing the Shady lynch without actually calling him town.

The rest of his post he calls Coag scummy and then takes it back, calls austinmcc scummy without actually saying it, parroting other people about kingjames and calling out BC.


He says he is caught up on the thread, but doesn't understand the arguments. However, he makes absolutely no effort to understand. He doesn't ask questions, he doesn't apply pressure, nothing. He doesn't care about the lynch.

The biggest thing is that he doesn't actually unvote but leaves his vote on kingjames the whole time


It is clear cut that Mattchew is making sure that he isn't labeled a lurker with "contributions" when in reality he doesn't care about the lynch at all. He is Scum.

On October 11 2012 00:00 kushm4sta wrote:

he is quite right. how about you don't lynch me and lynch someone else...that is a good option imo.
BTW why did VE reveal so early? he didn't even fight for the lynch to keep his roll a secret. Revealing this early, ad mattchew pointed out, stiffles discussion.

On October 10 2012 22:47 Mattchew wrote:

i see the benefits, i don't think you see how unrealistic and hard it is to get real discussion going when the biggest threat is the mighty feared FOS

On October 10 2012 16:15 VisceraEyes wrote:
The point is that you jumped off of Node resulting in the lynch of your townread. He might have been lynched anyway based on the voting rules, but a vote for Node put Shady one step closer to safety rather than damning him inexorably to the noose. *shrug*

kushm4sta, ZBoson

I know I said the focus on the BC thing was a bad idea, but I've been thinking about it and the whole Mementoss/BC thing is...strange. On the one hand I can't understand Mementoss' assumption that BC is third party - I mean, we don't know if medic saves are informed (to my knowledge) so why would Mementoss assume BC was lying about thinking he was medic saved. On the other hand, I can't understand BC's assumption that Mementoss is scum based on a role not functioning the way he's used to in a closed setup game where the roles are obviously fucked with.

That's everyone's homework assignment for tomorrow (or today if your brain can take it). Go back over Mementoss and BC's filters. See if their play matches up with the claims. Is passive-ass BC really a veteran? Is Mementoss convenient claim of a flipped role just a bit TOO convenient? The truth is in this thread.

On October 11 2012 00:33 kushm4sta wrote:
VE has stifled other people's discussion i meant.
but yeah he has been pretty good recently.

On October 11 2012 00:55 VisceraEyes wrote:
What do you think of ZBos BC?

On October 11 2012 01:24 VisceraEyes wrote:


If he's scum then he knows (presumably) that he shot BC. He can also postulate that, given a dead watcher, no other watcher is going to counterclaim him. He also knows the name of the watcher role as it has flipped.

Anyone can say anything if they surround it with enough truth.

On October 11 2012 01:36 iamperfection wrote:
but if we believe that mementoss is lying that would suggest that the scum role blocked one of their own correct. No one else made a claim of rb right?

I would say the scum team would invest a lot for this to be true. Memen making a fake claim and scum team wasting a role block.

On October 11 2012 01:35 VisceraEyes wrote:
What sucks about it is that scum can just leave him alive and kill ME tonight, setting town up for a mislynch if he IS town. X(

BC your play doesn't match what I see optimal as veteran play. You went AFK/passive early on when you should have been trying to get scum to shoot you.

Before you say it, yes I'm aware that whatever you did "worked" because you got shot. I'm just saying in general that you seemed...too passive to be Veteran. Explain.

On October 11 2012 01:43 iamperfection wrote:

they didnt know about the 3rd check.

On October 11 2012 22:59 Kreb wrote:

Dudedudedudedudedudedude. This totally had me thinking. Look at this:
+ Show Spoiler +
And this:
+ Show Spoiler +
And look at VEs claim:

Is it possible VE added the prefix Mafia to an existing role (could be both town or mafia)? Theres no Mafia prefix on any role BM ever mentioned. If so, thats a pretty telling slip.

On October 08 2012 13:01 BlackMamba24 wrote:



Breaking news tonight coming out from Liquid City: Prominent business owner and community figurehead Hapahauli was found dead today after being brutally beaten in his home in the late afternoon. Sources close to the scene of the crime witnessed a small group of people enter his home and kill the man while he was eating dinner.

The head of the LCPD investigation unit issued this statement concerning the crime and Mr. Hapahauli himself:



It is indeed shocking to learn that someone of Hapahauli's status and prominence in the community was involved in clandestine crime. Once again, we here at Liquid City News urge citizens to take extreme caution while the police department investigates this crime family.

Hapahauli, the Mafia Enforcer, was lynched!

Flip:
+ Show Spoiler +

Night 3 has begun.
You have 24 hours to send in all night actions to this account.

On October 12 2012 05:33 Coagulation wrote:
whats up bc. you should night kill ve for us

On October 12 2012 06:08 VisceraEyes wrote:


That's strange...because Godfathers only fuck with, from what I can gather, 1 role in the game...

Anyway, it doesn't matter what world because we're playing a game in this world. And in this world, I received "Mafia Coroner" as my report from checking kush. If you don't believe that, that's fine. But that's a fact.

On October 12 2012 06:17 Coagulation wrote:
BC thats like exactly what I said less than a page ago. How are you gonna call me useless one post and then fucking parrot shit I already said with your very next post. Also how the fuck do you think mafia would benefit using it on marv when he pretty much all but claimed being mafia after he was caught.

On October 12 2012 15:38 VisceraEyes wrote:
I'm never checking BC you hear me? NEVER.

On October 13 2012 09:19 VisceraEyes wrote:


It was because I was high and when I decided you're probably third, I saw "Paranoid Arsonist" and assumed that you can only fuck with people who target you. So no, I'm not checking you bro.

Don't tell me who I would check. I told town that I didn't check someone I thought was scum already. I don't care if you don't like that.

On October 13 2012 09:22 VisceraEyes wrote:


You're being ridiculous. How do I go from "Dude he's obviously contributing, generating discussion and etc etc" to "Dude he's obviously scum"

Work with me here - you're not going to get town to lynch me. I promise you.

On October 13 2012 09:30 VisceraEyes wrote:


Arsonist primes target - chooses when to ignite or whether to ignite. Or something. I don't know BC. All I know is that "Paranoid" is in the title.

I understand that my check didn't benefit town. I've already explained it was for me.

I suspect you of third because you're not scum and you're not PLAYING like any townBC I've ever seen. But I'm not interested in "removing you from the game" because I don't KNOW that you're third...and I don't fucking CARE BC because I'm looking for SCUM.

Why do you "know" that I'm scum now? That's so against everything you've been saying all game.

On October 13 2012 09:47 Z-BosoN wrote:


Why?? Because he's right or because he's wrong?

On October 13 2012 09:54 VisceraEyes wrote:
Or in other words:

"He didn't check who I would have checked, ergo, scum."

On October 13 2012 09:56 Z-BosoN wrote:
Then why didn't he just say he confirmed you as 3rd party?
If he realized this, as scum, he would have said exactly that, no?

On October 13 2012 10:19 Z-BosoN wrote:


Why not just say something like serial killer? Regardless of what he'd said you would have gone after him calling him scum because you are actually town, no?

On October 13 2012 10:21 iamperfection wrote:
.....BloodyC0bbler you accuse ve of not playing his role properly yet you yourself are the one that LIED causing the shit storm of what claims we should believe. Your lying showed you cared of one thing and one thing only your survival. You can die now 3rd party. We should of lynched you the second we found out about your lie it makes no sense from a town perspective. Your lying only pushed forward your interests of survival.

## Unvote
## Vote BloodyC0bbler

On October 13 2012 10:29 iamperfection wrote:

Ve claimed he was a veteran but first he claimed medic protection. He lied kill him. Its not optimal play no matter what he says it just leads to confusion. Why should i believe anything BloodyC0bbler say in relation to anything. And i didnt say it caused somebody to claim i said it just adds to confusion because his lie causes confusion with relation to other players claims.

On October 13 2012 10:32 iamperfection wrote:

you should have said nothing if you were town instead playing gambits it just adds to the confusion.

Why should i believe you? it seems from my point of view you only cared about your survival.

On October 13 2012 10:38 iamperfection wrote:

of course im not 100% sure stop playing stupid word games. I was under the impression that gambits like this were bad. Why would he need to lie if was town? just so the mafia wont shoot again. give me a break a town member should not worry about whether he lives or dies.

On October 13 2012 10:36 VisceraEyes wrote:
##Vote: BloodyC0bbler

Sorry guy. I wanted to wait.

For anyone who cares, he's taking the one self-motivated decision I've made this game (the 'toss check) and saying that I'm playing in my own self-interest. Except...I'm not. The reason I wanted to know if I can trust 'toss is because I've played with the guy before and besides BC (who I was NOT checking) the one I considered to be A) the least likely to be framed and B) the one who is most likely to look at the thread objectively and find scum with me. It was self-motivated only in that it allowed ME to have peace of mind about another town player so that, with 'toss, we could find the remaining scum. Add to that the fact that I fully expected to die. Add to that the fact that all the people I mentioned during the night were all potential frame targets.

Now: if BC is town, as he claims, then he should know that he should be dead. It's like...just one of those things. If BC is alive late game, he's anti-town. And he's saying that it would have been OPTIMAL for me to check someone WHO HAD ONE OF THE HIGHEST CHANCES OF DYING OVERNIGHT THAN ANYONE IF HE'S TOWN.

This is a load of bullshit that he's injecting into the thread guys. I mean, yeah...he's just playing to his win-condition...but honestly if he's not going to help me find scum, then I prefer he just die outright.

On October 13 2012 10:46 iamperfection wrote:

nope you shouldn't really give a shit about survivng. if you were town you should have been contributed the entire time you were not. and not playing silly gambits. I didnt know the key to a town victory was having you last as long as possible. Give me a break.

On October 13 2012 10:53 iamperfection wrote:

that bullshit for a mafia game. Why would anyone believe a late game BloodyC0bbler if he has to sacrifice being a legitimate town player. He would have to lie and make himself look scummy in order to survive and then when it comes to late game the town will now suddenly believe him? Ya come on that doesn't apply here.

On October 13 2012 10:58 VisceraEyes wrote:
I'm not killing you because you're alive. I'm killing you because you're obviously third party and you're trying to kill town's cop rather than look for scum. Very anti-town of you. Very lynch-worthy.

Anyway, thanks for the theory lesson and everything - maybe my check WASN'T optimal. But like...I don't care. It's my check to do with what I will to help town win. You don't lynch every vig who shoots a townie do you? You don't lynch every medic who fails to protect someone?

My claim has made sense for days - you picked a pretty fucking opportune time to say "Whoa wait guys, WHOA. I just cracked this game wide open. You know all that stuff I said about VE being obviously town based on his actions and NOT on his claim? Well SCRAP all that because he checked MEMENTOSS instead of ME!"

Feel free to backtrack and get on Kreb BC, I'll join you. But as long as you insist that I'm scum, I'm going to insist that you don't give a fuck about finding scum. And I'm going to insist that you die.

On October 11 2012 00:36 Mattchew wrote:
Thanks BC for that I'll write a case before the end of the night

On October 14 2012 03:43 Mattchew wrote:
I believe VE to be town and I believe VE's check to be real. I don't really know/care if thats where the mafia KP went, I think we lynched scum with kush.

If this is true, we should be looking at those who tried to push away from a kush vote. What townie (who have no information) would not lynch a claimed dt red vote? Especially after we had 2 straight scum lynches putting us ahead.

iamperfection is who we should be looking at to lynch.

Iamperfection tries to push the zboson lynch on the back of Darthpunk's waivering from the kushmasta lynch.

here is iamperf's posting in this time period

+ Show Spoiler +

He tries to get a last hour vote switch, but doesn't provide any reasoning for doing so. His sole reason is DP's thoughts, which he doesn't even quote or comment on. His pushing of this switch does not have a sense of urgency or care to it. I believe he is doing this last minute switch idea just because he knows what kush will flip.

##vote iamperfection

On October 14 2012 10:50 Kreb wrote:
Shiao, Coag and Sloosh appearing within 8minutes after a few Shiao votes go down. If I am to move to a secondary target, thats the kind of stuff thats gonna decide where my vote go. Both Matt and Shiao are similarly scummy because of their inactivity to me, but the sudden resistance appearing for Shiao after several hours of very surprisingly low activity despite the very unfavourable situation for town with votes everywhere. Thats might definitely tip me over.

Couple that with:

Which is likely directed at me. And since I know Im town, a scum should have little reason to do this.

Heavily leaning towards a Shiao vote here if I am to switch.

On October 14 2012 10:56 Keirathi wrote:

I already did. VE made me paranoid that scum had an ability that they could use to change the flip today. If we no-lynched, there wouldn't be a flip to change.

But, I said that without reading the op again to see if it was even possible to vote no-lynch.

On October 14 2012 10:59 Keirathi wrote:

Coroner hasn't flipped though?

On October 14 2012 11:01 Kreb wrote:

Its sudden because..... it happened right after the votes went down?

Though its definitely a possibility its a designed wagon.

On October 14 2012 11:05 ShiaoPi wrote:
sudden cuz I wake up and check the threqd again…?
@iamp
limiyrd time caused mr to rmphasize it. cant write full cases

On October 14 2012 11:07 Kreb wrote:

Theres been surprisingly little activity last hours. That tells me mafia was fine with the situation at hand.

On October 14 2012 11:09 Keirathi wrote:

The only reason anyone has ever thought that coroner could change a flip was because VE FUCKING SUGGESTED IT.

In my experience, people only speculate about roles that they should have no fucking clue about when they actually have some information about said role.

On October 14 2012 11:25 DarthPunk wrote:


We have an hour. Why not?

On October 14 2012 11:32 Kreb wrote:
BC, whats your thought on DP?

On October 14 2012 11:35 DarthPunk wrote:


Hmm. Ok. but that entirely dismisses the chance of him being scum. Which is weird cause you were voting him earlier.

On October 14 2012 11:37 DarthPunk wrote:
Do you really think another 72 hours of speculating on VE's alignment and the setup is good for town?

On October 14 2012 11:51 DarthPunk wrote:


This assumes He is town though. What if he is scum?

On October 14 2012 11:58 DarthPunk wrote:


Why the fuck would scum not shoot in order to mislynch someone they could have shot. 0_o

On October 14 2012 13:02 Coagulation wrote:
whats up bc?

On October 18 2012 21:25 Kreb wrote:

I wouldve revealed myself and pretty much confirmed him as Lucky Citizen in that case, so I dont think that would have happened. I was pretty close to revealing it at one point.

Which is why I really wanna know how he knew of my role....

On October 18 2012 21:29 DarthPunk wrote:


The cases were not that strong. Not enough to get me lynched anyway.