From what I have seen so far, mafia must be having a field day with this thread.
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BloodyC0bbler
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From what I have seen so far, mafia must be having a field day with this thread. | ||
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However I see a major difference like no major scumslip. Also given that near everyone seems content on him being a choice (although no real major voting), I am not inclined to lynch him until he posts more to get a better read. I would however like to see more from (surprise) Mattchew at this moment. Given his ballsy play last game, and the fact that my experience with him is that he is slightly more confident a player, I am not very impressed with his current play this game. It feels too underwhelming from my experience with him. If I am wrong I do apologize on this, but he has only really justified the behaviour of Shady, and asked people for their opinions. Not a lot to go on, and very non commital. I would like to see more posting from both these players, as well as seeing a more from sloosh and marvel so I can solidify a read on them. | ||
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On October 02 2012 05:27 austinmcc wrote: I made it because he wrote the word SPIES. That word doesn't appear ANYWHERE in this game. Same as...q-bertz or whoever writing the word "mole" in bureaucracy. If you know something about a role that nobody knows EXISTS yet, then you're not town. Spies doesn't exist, he mentions spy reads, therefore he's not town. Turns out spies exist in some similar game, as a normal thing that people know about. -_- if you read the OP you would clearly see above the roles that all in the game are included but details of them are not known. If their was a role with the name of spy everyone would know about it just not what it does. You jumping on him for something that is obviously not a role and wanting to lynch screams to me "i found a powerrole, lets lynch it" You have a horrible reason for jumping on KJ and it screams desperate for a reason to lynch him. As for everyone else currently voting. What exactly did he do that he hasn't done as town before? I am serious, KJ has behaved near identical in wtfness in games as town before, been lynched for it and we all groan and sigh. Again as a reader I have seen near no backlash to said lynch which means it seems people don't give a shit about it. Any lynch with such a passive case with near no push against it suggests mafia are fine with said lynch. I am going to sort through the thread now in more detail but seriously this is retarded. Killing an active player day 1 on the case built so far is appalling. People are being allowed to get by with 0 posting (I am at fault currently for not posting) and random shit isn't being called out for shitty behaviour. Going to read and analyze currently, hopefully I can find something salvagable in this day. | ||
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On October 01 2012 19:13 risk.nuke wrote: Fist things first. Now you don't have the first clue about what fake-contribution is which makes it difficult to discuss the subject. A person fake-contributing is someone floating around, have proven to be active + Show Spoiler + otherwise they must fall into the lurker category untill they reach a certain amount of posts which has nothing whatsoever do to with their posts/day ratio) Meaning they can be both lurkers and fake-contributers but not for a couple of days. As for most fake-contributing posts they are not some sort of evil posts in disguise only visible to your lens of truth. They are simply general posts and most often helpful to a lesser degree. Most importantly what you don't grasp is both townies and scum do them and are because of this null-tells. I have absolutely no idea what you mean when you say townies have absolutely no purpose fake-contributing. It's purified dumb. 1 Having now explained the term fake-contributor I can answer your post. It's bullshit to call someone a fake-contributor day 1 almost without exception because it's in generally to early to tell the persons agenda. 2 I voted for shady because it's down to him versus KingJames. Additionally I agreed and considered Shady being scummy even as I suggested the kush lynch. Which was done because I didn't want to sheep others the first thing I did (because there is little value in that) and because I wanted to discuss other candidates then shady (which was shutdown asap by marv, but nevertheless told me something about marv) As for why I choose kush the filters weren't implied so I picked the first suspicious filter I found. 3 A kush lynch i don't see happening and a voteswitch to kush now I'd disagree with because my suspicion against a successful late bandwagon switch would be greater then my suspicion against kush. (Node. you're late to the party.) If you rephrase the question. Am I still suspicious against kush I will tell you I think kush is scummier now then I did at the time I suggested the vote on him. This is by far one of the scummiest posts I have read in this game so far. First off if you notice the bolded section I made nice for you guys by his second point to his "answer" to kreb you will notice him directly lying. He never once said he found shady scummy while suggesting a new lynch. His only posts before attempting to "push" a new choice was his in post, saying how epic drH games were, then saying we should vote for kush. You know what he didnt do? Tell people why he thinks we should kill kush, why he thinks kush is even a valid lynch choice. Pushing a lynch or attempting to push a lynch usually means justification is needed. He doesn't even give a reason except hes suspicious. Yet has stated that he finds the person he wanted to lynch scummier now then he originally did. WHY IS HE NOT PUSHING THIS. A townie should not in any circumstance be fine with killing someone else without at least attempting to push their own read if they are more certain of it. The following posts risk have made since this one have all been fluff and actually follow through on his entire "fake contribution" non sense. He states you cannot determine someones agenda day 1 but you can easily do so if a person is being so obvious about it. I am going to continue reading through the thread more but this is post screams red to me as it as well as every post he has done since has screamed "fake contribution" and not actually caring about the game. | ||
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On October 02 2012 05:57 Kreb wrote: That is another reason Im starting to feel a bit bad about him. Him moving on from extremely general advice to the whole thread about "we need to play like this guys" to taking light jabs at a lurker or two (who admittedly didnt contribute much) also follows what I could see being a inexperienced player trying to get out of trouble. That said I still dont really feel comfortable voting Kush either. He is very hard to read but as marv pointed out this might be town-kush playing and not mafia-kush. Too bad the deadline is pretty much the worst ever for me (at about 2h before I get up for work) so I wont be able to change my vote should anything come up the last 4-5h. Im still leaning towards KJ because its seemingly much less of a loss mislynching him than someone more active though. I'll try to make up my mind in the next 2h or so and present my vote. As someone who is familiar with KJ as a player. When he gets going, he is one of the most active players you can see in a game. If he fails to keep up said activity once it starts, or is pushing insanely mafia aligned moves then it is likely he is scum, however I have yet to personally see anything from him that isn't part of his normal meta. Also, given that near no one is contributing in meaningful ways at the moment having shitty posts from people is going to happen. Attempting to force discussion is fucking hard and near no one does it without looking bad. | ||
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Given the play I have witnessed, I feel austin and risk have a higher chance at striking red compared to mattchew given that its day 1. I am unsure as of which I will vote for. One has what I think is the worst post in the thread given following behaviour, the other appears to be rolefishing/attempting to lynch someone with obvious fucked logic/trying to lynch a potential blue claim. | ||
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On October 02 2012 06:50 kushm4sta wrote: BC I like your defence of kj more than your scumreads. You basically you are distancing yourself from this lynch without pushing a viable alternative. The recent post from VE. I'm not quite sure why you keep saying it doesn't matter even though you clearly think it does. Do not take this as a flame: Anul made you hid bitch and now you are dickriding him? You prod him lightly, he rages, you run away scared, then you praise him for being a difficult target? What makes him a difficult target...high hanging fruit? I believe I pointed out two alternatives. Both for reasons I am willing to lynch them for. Given that neither has posted much, what else would you like me to do? I had given you a reason why I won't help lynch KJ and two possible alternatives. So before you spout lies, how about you read my posts. Do you agree with my read on risk? yes or no? Do you think my pointing out of austins behaviour revolving the "spy" word as fucking odd beyond belief given information required to know its not a role is in the OP. Seriously. Please read before you poke at me. | ||
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On October 02 2012 06:53 marvellosity wrote: Kinda glad you did that VE, because I didn't want to have to come into the thread saying "VE has a valid excuse for not posting like a mofo, but I don't want to share without him saying so". The rest of talis' case is just bad. How is VE stirring up things a little (not even a lot, and he doesn't keep harping on about it) in the slightest alignment indicative? VE happily does the same as either town or scum. The 'low-hanging fruit' business barely merits a response. Can otherwise be read as "comments on stuff relevant to the thread". And the hypocrisy behind the activity thing is just immense. I find the entire case quite scummy, but it's ameliorated by the fact that talis didn't know of VE's activity stuff, and could have had terrible confirmation bias for the rest of the case. I'll be looking for talis to conform to *his* town meta with more posts and contributions. BC: that's news to me about kj's meta, I've never seen him play before. Going to have to reconsider. I don't really share your feelings about risk though, the biggest surprise to me is how much and the length with which he's posted. It seems he's already posted more than in his entire scum game in Bureaucracy, I'm not feeling it. eh id say using bureaucracy is a bad choice. Completely different game mechanic compared to this one no? | ||
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Do you at least see why I would be suspicious of him at least marvel? and you have your read disagreeing with mine based on his previous game meta? | ||
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On October 02 2012 07:05 kushm4sta wrote: I got a null read on all those people you said. And your cases? A few sentences if that. The cases are weak. They are not viable lynches because no one has voted for them as of yet. You need some kind of epic case to convince all those people quick enough. And your cases, if you wanna call them that, aren't going to convince anybody. A single case should near never start the lynch. It should start a discussion (much like what is going on) to see if via discussion the consensus is someone is mafia. If you believe you are 100% right on your read then obviously you push it beyond all belief. However it requires more than a single post. | ||
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On October 02 2012 07:07 risk.nuke wrote: BC talk to me scumshit. You show up late with a forced post in which you wildly misinterpret what I said, trying to twist find loopholes in my words too frame shit on me and. Additionally you state out of the blue you want to lynch 3 new targets with half of europe asleep untill the daypost. What are you trying to accomplish and how are you trying to make that happen? Forced? you had a shit post and I commented on it. Surprisingly easy to analyze posts that look horrifically scummy. As for loopholes? How have you not done exactly as you outlined as fake contributing? Remove the horrible "you cant tell this day 1" bullshit. You have done absolutely dick fuck all that has been in any shape or form helpful. You have lied. I am not twisting your words I am telling you my interpretation of them. Don't like it? Then prove me wrong and step it up. As for me pointing out 3 new targets? I am generating discussion, something that this thread has sorely lacked. I cannot solely blame the player base given that I didn't even know this game had started until after near a full day had elapsed. I am sure i was not the only one who got hit with this. As for what I want to accomplish? Ideally a dead mafia, realistically I would like to salvage some of day 1 by giving it some content that isn't rehashed "i want to off KJ, Kush or Shady" | ||
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On October 02 2012 07:13 marvellosity wrote: Your point on austin is way better though, BC There are a couple of things about austin: - he gives way too much thought and time to setup speculation and shenannies and can go off on tangents. So with that alone I wouldn't find him banging on about spy that relevant, except for two things (which you mention) - the fact that it specifies pretty damn clearly in the OP that all available role names are known to us - that's all he's talked about having been absent for a long time. If you're gonna derp around talking about setup and spy lololol you'd imagine you'd at least fucking read the setup first. Gonna give his filter another look. Anyway I'm gonna unvote kj for now ##unvote Fair enough. I did state I couldn't make up my mind via voting for similar reasons. Also, this is a general question to any who have played with sloosh. Is this is town meta day 1? He did a similar level of inactivity in LVII and was third party so am curious if not posting much is a normal day 1 thing or if I am right for being irked by it. | ||
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On October 02 2012 07:31 Mementoss wrote: Im going to placeholder vote on shadysands, and then wash the dishes then read the game,so many lurkers (me included) day 1. I'll see what I can dig up tho. I find votes on ones self or votes on someone not likely to be lynched the best placeholders as you don't look like someone jumping onto a bandwagon for the sake of it being a bandwagon | ||
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On October 02 2012 07:35 risk.nuke wrote: It's forced because it screams I need to make up a post about someone fast. That's the only possible reason you typed up a shitpost like that. You can't even have had time to properly read through it. And if you did read through it you must have once again felt forced or you would had deleted that shit. I never said I thought shady was scummy in the thread. Nor did I claim to have had. So how can you say I'm lying. I stated that I was suspicious of him and I was. I give reasoning for the rest of my actions which I sincerely wonder if you've even read. But your case isn't that you have a problem with my reasoning. You just straight out attempt to misinterpret it to the thread. I said I thought kush was scummier now then then which to me translates into. Kush has done absolutely nothing to redeem himself of my suspicions. On the contrary the posts he's made has only made me more suspicious. But no fucking where do I say that he's my strongest scumread. Leaving out the name calling generalizations of my posts. These are your only 2 actual points against me which are both fucking untrue. And don't think you can claim coming in late bringing not one but three new names to the table and expected it to generate anything but distraction from the other candidates. I voted for shady because it's down to him versus KingJames. Additionally I agreed and considered Shady being scummy even as I suggested the kush lynch. Those are your exact words you said about shady, yet you never once said you had suspicions of him being mafia. This is a lie. Regardless of big or small it is one. Now, if hes not your strongest scumread, or one of them why the fuck wouldn't you attempt to push him? Why even now, rather than combined defending yourself are you not analyzing kush, why are you not analyzing anyone? As for coming in late and expect to generate anything but distraction? i have discussed them plus the three I named. Only two of which I believe could be lynched today / have far higher a likelyhood of flipping red. If you would look past your understandable annoyance at me for calling you out, you would surely see that the last few pages has at least generated some meaningful discussion that was on new subject matter, and honestly to some degree required. | ||
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On October 02 2012 07:39 Sharrant wrote: @Risk.Nuke I was at work like I said I would be. I did have to cover for someone for an extra hour, that's why I was late getting on here. In response to your earlier question, on Saturday I worked all day, then went to another city for Nuit Blanche, then came back to work despite not having slept because my boss asked me if I could cover for someone who was sick. After that it was Sunday night, I saw that I had a PM, saw it was about this game, and was way too fucking tired to do anything. So I set my alarm early to give myself time to make one decent post in the morning before work. Unfortunately I was so rushed I forgot to actually follow with my vote, and I felt really stupid about halfway into work. I'm a little surprised no one called me out on it. I'm just going to post this part now, the rest will follow in a little bit. Just reading through filters. you have about 1.5 hours to start contributing before you become a person to harass. | ||
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On October 02 2012 07:55 risk.nuke wrote: BC not posting my suspicion doesn't mean I didn't have them. It means I can't prove I had them. It's not the same as a small lie which I don't believe for a second you don't understand. You want to be usefull. Who would you vote for amongst the people with votes. understand yes, hell everyone does it without realizing. Not admitting to it once called out looks bad. As for who would I vote for of all the people with votes? mementoss. Hes not even going to get lynched though. Given your reaction I would prefer an austin lynch at this moment however. | ||
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On October 02 2012 08:21 Mattchew wrote: BC mind telling me why you think i am scum? also, I could get down with an austin lynch. he doesn't feel like he is hunting scum as much as he is hunting for an easy out to vote. I am willing to ##unvote for the meantime. I am caught up on the thread but don't actually understand some of the arguments. Posts rub me the wrong way and I want to see more out of you. Its why I don't want to lynch you at this time as well as i could easily be wrong. | ||
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As for annul Marvel. My personal belief is that he is always a good vig shot. His mafia play is infuriating to deal with, and his town can be either really good or really bad depending on the game. If we have a ton of reasons to lynch him then lynch otherwise I'd let a vig sort it out. If he doesn't start contributing soon I'd put him on the lynch list. | ||
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By contributing I mean into day 2 of the game. Or late into night 1. | ||
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On October 02 2012 08:44 marvellosity wrote: Ugh, too much screwing meta. I don't really want to lynch austin because I know he can be totally useless day 1 as here, and others don't want to lynch the pretty scummy annul because they want to wait and see. Why do you think austin has a higher chance of flipping scum than annul, BC? Austin did what I think is insanely weird play and jumped out at me as scummy whereas annul has only done things that leap out and scream annul. He is one of the few people I find extremely hard to read and always have. | ||
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On October 03 2012 04:46 marvellosity wrote: You're not making sense. The Node push makes no sense from a mafia distraction point of view because Shady was a townie heading inexorably for the lynch. It's in these situations mafia are usually happy to sit back as town happily hops on to the townie wagon. On Node: tell me, does his posting look like he cares for town? iamperfection pointed it out perfectly earlier: When Node was at great risk of being lynched, did he come in to drop reads and shit? No, he came in to call town stupid, and then promptly left again without making any reads or anything. How are you reading this as townie? You also, presumably from your attitude, find his defence of Shady townie. How? Want to talk about your connection stuff a little. You don't even realise how strongly you're doing it, or how it's affecting how you think. We have: You place your vote on him and you're not sure at all. Your very next post goes into theories about the Node wagon and how it looked and how it makes austin look much worse (which I think I've helped establish that it doesn't really). So you, yourself, never actually had strong feelings on austin if the quote above is true, until you started ladeling Node/austin/me/VE/wagon stuff on top of it. This stands out to me for one major reason. It makes perfect sense for mafia to push node as a distraction case regardless of the fact shady flipped green. Ask VE or Node if they remember a game in the high 30's or low 40s run by FW with the weird mason mechanic (each player could mason any two players they chose but only two players) where on day 3 or 4 as mafia my entire team sat firmly on two sides of a townie vs townie lynch pushing each. Also pushing node as a "distraction" case would be perfect if austin is red. Why? Because it got heat off himself. However, this is me merely clearing up something I find instantly wrong and misleading. In regards to the lynch yesterday. Not sure how shady was lynched, thought we had passed that when I was active in the thread yesterday. Also not sure how the node picked up so much steam the way it did given that the main person pushing said case was under some heat from people and the votes were slowly swinging the way. Why do you ask? Because node had so very few posts and was easy to cherry pick. The case was also poor on him given the fact that well, its node. The only thing that speaks badly about his posting thus far is the lack of it. Making odd posts like he has is very typical of his play regardless of alignment, and the biggest tell is his lack of involvement in the game. Rather then making a case on his posts someone should have brought up the fact that a veteran player had made such few and weird looking posts as the main tell over his one sentence on his why he thought shady wasn't scum. I am back for most of the night so I will go through the thread to make sure I can get more info out given that I have a horrible trend of dying day 1's these days. | ||
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On October 03 2012 07:05 Mattchew wrote: I wasn't around for when the lynch went down. Sloosh should still be lynched, do you disagree with my assessment of it or just my lack of pushing it? I didn't think that shady did anything (other than come back last minute to the thread) that warranted him being lynched, but because of so many people getting away with little to no information about why their vote was on him or node, I struggle to find the difference there between bad town and scum. Forgot to unvote, woulda ended up not voting (which is basically what I did). Honestly I just had a really bad day 1 and was not able to really get a strong read on anyone through just overall reading, and then when I looked at sloosh I was away for when I should have been pushing him. Anyway lets chat about sloosh, BC and annul. These are the players that feel weird. Sloosh seems to be struggling to post, and seems like he is struggling to type out his thoughts. I think this is because he is scum. I was easy to make a case on because I played like shit day 1. He skews the truth in his case about me when he mentions my stop voting shady sands point. I was clearly saying this to the people that at that moment were voting shady which there were still a lot of at that time (in this thread and +2 to the voting thread). I was also not saying what alignment Shady was, I was just saying that at that time votes on him were stupid. BC reminds me a lot of foolish playing in Bureaucracy. He knows that a lot is expected of him which makes it really really hard for him to post a lot. He is focusing in on people here and there while not actively driving discussion and calling out bad play. His posting looks really weak for a normally very confident player, and the % of fluff/bs to actual content in his filter is not up to his town-standards Annul, his 5 page filter has nothing of actual value in terms of reasoning, scum-hunting, or explaining his thought process. He also was extremely active in the hours leading up the lynch and ended up pushing no candidate. Here is annul's last scum game filter, I feel it reads very very similar to his filter this game (link plz click) Hi, I was pushing discussion off of two main lynch candidates while heavily getting discussion + possible vote swing (it was in mid process before swapping to node). That is actively driving discussion. I am sorry I am not here to handhold you and get all dem mafia lynched but as I don't know who they all are it is moderately hard to do. I can't always have someone out themself in their first post for me to get a dog with a bone moment and tunnel till said person dies. I have a question for you as well Mattchew. Why do you only surface and do anything whatsoever when you are pressured but you can't find time to push your reads, or even remotely attempt to help the town in a constructive manner? Popping in like you are right now is very similar to your play last game when you got called out and ran for the hills and would randomly appear before just giving up. | ||
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On October 03 2012 07:29 VisceraEyes wrote: I remember the game - I don't specifically remember the situation you're referencing. Not to say that I think you're lying, and I don't remember which game (high 40s I think), just saying that as a town player remembering a town performance (pisspoor btdubz) I don't remember that specific thing happening. Your memory is...specialized BC. You should play more. Dude I remember games from like 3-4 years ago sort of deal, my memory is arttarded. The game I am referencing is the one where I mindfucked you royally and led to mataza quitting TL mafia. The two lynch choices for that day I am referencing I believe was Youngminii and mataza with RoL being heavily pressured (all 3 were town). As for my read of annul, someone vig him. I think he warrants one more than most players but hasn't quite earned being lynched yet. | ||
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Game I am referencing | ||
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On October 03 2012 08:09 marvellosity wrote: Yes, that's one way to look at it; on the flip side, the right thing for austin to do as townie is to make reads and push things like he did, and like Node very much did not. How are you reading the both of them? I find austin quite townie now. talismania - What is your current read on VE? Do you still think he is scum? He had to to avoid being lynched. As townie or mafia he had to do what he did. I find him less scummy then he was before, however it doesn't mean he doesn't still get my gaze for only pushing someone when his ass was on the line. I more stated what I did because of how you stated your post I responded to which basically stated mafia wouldn't do what he did, or have a reason to push a second townie candidate. Making a case on a terrible poster as mafia or pushing a lynch on a bad scum player on ones team is standard play. | ||
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On October 03 2012 08:18 marvellosity wrote: Ok, I get where you're coming from. I experienced similar with austin in the very last game I played with him. I voted for him on Day 1 for only talking about himself for a while then completely afking for ages when there was tonnes going on in the thread, but it turned out he was being lazy/dumb whatever, which is why I was so antsy about it this game. His contributions look more thought out, researched and I guess not-skewed than what I'd expect from scum, and I see them as good contributions. I do and don't. I feel his case on node was hasty and well, not great. I feel his posting since however has improved. I still think the entire lynch period was weird as hell with how it operated at the end. However I don't feel he should be shot or lynched tommorrow currently which I would say is a bonus for him. I am fine with either happening to mattchew now though. He has done nothing to make me think he is town and is only making me believe he is scum. | ||
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On October 03 2012 08:32 kushm4sta wrote: To these people saying annul should be Vig not lynched: Please explain why. No one has made a better case than the many against annul. Why not save Vig for the endgame when we have more information and better reads? I prefer shooting players who are A) Hard to read B) perform badly or trolly or whatever else you want to call it while being active C) disruptive but not helpful He hasn't had any massive scumslip and thus I believe offing him without wasting a day lynching him is better. If he flips scum its helpful and if he flips town it sucks but removes a disruptive player and stops us from spending 2 days discussing him / the day of talk after if he flips town. That is how I operate usually on vig shots unless its a policy shot. | ||
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On October 03 2012 09:19 annul wrote: i guess to BC "disruption" is posting cogent arguments and/or defending claims made against yourself I actually tend to find near all your posts disruptive -_- I always have. Its like facing a bill murray player but having to fear some form of coherent thought behind the name. | ||
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eh you aren't cursing like a jerkbag, caps lock is mostly off and you are posting similar levels you did one of the last games we played together when we were both town. So you can stay for now. | ||
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I find it highly unlikely a town vig shot me over any of the other players in the game tbh. Given that I was shot and survived I assume it was the mafia and thus thanking the magical medic. | ||
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Risk.nuke Kush Sharrant. Of these 3 I think it is highly likely that at least 1 is scum. Of the people he accused I think mattchew is most likely to flip red as well. | ||
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On October 04 2012 04:54 marvellosity wrote: No, I was punished for *good* play. Useless, bad mechanic. nah it was obvious bad play yo. Why else would the town dt doctor check you As for mementoss, how do I know I was shot? I was pm'd about it. | ||
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On October 04 2012 05:00 Z-BosoN wrote: Wait, so Risen the paramedic, another medic on BC, and, incredibly, another one @ austin, who was also shot?? Do we have three medics, does everyone buy this?? Given that no one has claimed any of the shots on the dead players, (ie no one is claiming vig) We know we have two dead vanilla's, shots on me and austin, and risen raped himself while giving us marv. We know we have mafia, and 1 third party based on setup, so 4 kp appearing isn't that unlikely I think. | ||
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On October 04 2012 05:02 VisceraEyes wrote: Node is almost certainly not the scum. There was a very real possibility that he would have been lynched and annul was right, a bus in that situation would have been pretty suboptimal. Marv is definitely the scums. Whoever he never mentions in the game I'd probably have a hard look at. Otherwise I haven't reread the game (as I said I would :<) so I'm crippled until I do. BC what do you think of Mattchew? I still think he could be scum given that his play this game has been spectacularly bad. I also don't think marv was dumb enough to not attack at least one member of his own team, and given that his only "cases" were on known greens, calling kreb horrible, and mattchew I am banking that mattchew is the real red. | ||
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On October 04 2012 05:04 VisceraEyes wrote: He's not disputing the possibility of 4 kp...only the existence of 3 medics. I don't see how thats a weird issue. Given that no vig has claimed a shot on a green player (note i am assuming 1 shot vigi's here if we have them) and given that at least one of the medics so far who has flipped was the weak doctor variant I don't find it so unlikely that there could be 3 medics. At the same time I am also not discounting that their could be a mafia medic who was active last night as well who could have stopped a shot on someone as well. | ||
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On October 04 2012 05:09 marvellosity wrote: 'weak' doctor my ass It is commonly referred to as the Weak variant of doctor even though its OP. | ||
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On October 04 2012 04:56 BloodyC0bbler wrote: Also, after looking through marv's filter and gazing at the people he was fine with lynching and those he defended / tried to suggest were bad options for lynches were Risk.nuke Kush Sharrant. Of these 3 I think it is highly likely that at least 1 is scum. Of the people he accused I think mattchew is most likely to flip red as well. | ||
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On October 04 2012 05:37 risk.nuke wrote: Who on that list would do you feel like going after then BC, I've been wanting to go after Sharrant however having been to lazy to actually read the last 20-25ish pages properly+ Show Spoiler + King procastination first due to a 10 page gap after day 1 and then marv instantly outing himself. While I'm posting, people who voted marv before this are more suspicious then the rest. Seeing as the mafia knew risen did protect marvellosity while the rest of us would still have to deal with other possibilitys, my point is that mafia would probably have wanted to get on marv as quickly as possible. mattchew and one of sharrant or kush provided you start posting like I know you can. If you continue to be lazy and unhelpful I will start pushing you again. | ||
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On October 04 2012 10:58 slOosh wrote: Yea I know what you mean. Like, a post that scares me is Like, I don't understand how he picked the pool (people marv was fine with lynching and defended from lynching seems to cover the whole pool) and saying that at least 1 is scum seems so prone to a string of mislynches (lynch A, flips town, oh B and C must be more likely to be scum). I'm agreeing with the mattchew read though and can understand the players he picked objectively, but yea it's scary. Anyone you want to talk about? if you are curious to know why I picked the three names I did with risk, kush and sharrant is because of how he did it. They weren't strong reads, it was like "ima use my name to push this on "meta" or the like". Given that a fair number of the people he actively wanted to lynch have flipped town leads me to believe the ones he defended but kept from talking about in detail are likely people to keep a strong eye on. -_- I am not sure why this is a scarey post, it seems rather logical to me. What specifically are you guys expecting from me here? | ||
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On October 04 2012 11:31 slOosh wrote: Ah I see. It's scary when you do it without explaining like you now did because you might be doing some high level scum play given your reputation. Then let's talk about the list. I think kush is town based on his demeanor (throwing up thoughts onto thread without the scummy tendency to double check / review). Your turn. Er? Its scummy thing to recheck / review? I don't do that ever unless I am town making some epic post by post analysis. I think he could easily be mafia given his interactions with people, his odd post that he just made On October 04 2012 11:15 kushm4sta wrote: im so town though This may just be the living up in a household with a mother who is an english major, but using the word "so" as he did seems weird to me. However throwing ones thoughts into the thread mean near jackshit when you look at the last three pages of his filter have been basically none useful. I don't see solid reasoning for reads, I see summarizing of other peoples shit, spam, and the same. I honestly believe if someone is active like he has been this game there should be real content in his filter, and honestly I am not seeing it. | ||
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On October 04 2012 12:03 kushm4sta wrote: Dude my mom is an english major too... I think that means we are spiritual brothers. And that's cold about my recent posts! I think my posting has improved greatly since the first day as it always does. I've been giving my thoughts and reads freely. I've been asking people questions. The only thing I haven't done is made big wall of text cases. But honestly I threw away all my towncred d1 so I doubt anyone would read them anyway. ALSO This is a huge game so people who are better at this game always say what I would say better and before I do. Therefore there hasn't really been the opportunity or the drive for walls of text. ALSO compiling all those cases against VE.. that took like 20 minutes give me some credit there. I can give credit for compiling, but its not giving original content, its just pushing old content. I think you can understand why I would have an issue with it? | ||
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On October 04 2012 12:16 slOosh wrote: It's a general heuristic that town post more freely than scum, who have inherent guilt and are scared of making scumslips etc. That's how you caught goodkarma last game no? I agree that there isn't much substance in his filter, but it's feels different from the typical trying-to-blend-in-with-town lack of substance. Worth a vig shot, not a lynch kinda thing. Thoughts on Sharrant's more recent posts? I caught goodkarma that way yes and no. His post was huge and looked heavily "tailored'. When I do giant posts that are heavy in analysis I do edit them regardless of my alignment but a tailored post is more alignment indicative as its a post that appears to be useful while saying shit all. It takes a good eye to realize a huge cloud of bs went into the air. I will keep a better eye on kush to see if my view of him is off but hes still suspect to me. Sharrant needs to post more. Looks too much like feigned activity and given that he hasn't even posted once since the day post went up I will keep him on my possible scum list. What is your view on him? | ||
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On October 04 2012 12:41 kushm4sta wrote: I got mad because I hate the idea of being vig shot. Why are people always suggesting: don't know if this guy's scum. Someone vig him. Why not vig people you actually believe to be scum??? if you know the guy is 100% scum or insanely high chances you do shoot him. However if someone could be scum and their behaviour is disruptive, counter productive or the like then shooting them and having them flip green is not the end of the world as it removes a negative influence from the town. It also helps get rid of players who are basically mafia players without realizing due to bad reads or the like who will never get mafia shot or lynched and end up losing town the game. | ||
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Again, I am sorry for the disappearance and will begin sifting through the thread. | ||
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On October 08 2012 04:03 Kreb wrote: Just quickly: Were you targetted this night again? We still havent heard anyone claim anything. I was not. Based on the kills I saw, and given that we have had a vig claim in thread, I would guess some townie was shot and didn't claim, or mafia stacked toutestchaos or austin / third party shot one of these two as well. I would say it was likely toutestchaos given that he was mod confirmed as town. | ||
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This guy has got to go. If anyone would like to quickly take a gander at his filter with me. Here You will quickly find that for a player of his caliber that his filter contains near nothing in forms of reads. However, the reads he has shared however are nearly all universally from day 1. He has not shared a single read since the start of day 2. He did nothing to further hunting for mafia day 2, he has not done anything day 3. Day 1 his views of near every person he was ok with lynching has flipped town in the exception of sloosh who is someone he has mentioned many times but not attempted to actually try and get people to see the guy as scum. More importantly he has spent most of his time only responding to the thread once called out rather then being here contributing. This shows that he has been concerned with keeping himself alive, but doesn't give jack shit about the thread. Matchew is Mafia Coagulation Hi coag. You have done nothing productive this game. You can say "i have no meta" all you want but you and I both know you have one vital difference between your scum and town play. The difference? You actually give a shit about finding mafia as town. Instead you sit back and are active while saying sweet fuck all. You haven't attempted to convince anyone in the game of someone who is mafia, you haven't called people out for their retarded shit. Instead you have a ton of one liners defending yourself as why you 'arent scum". Content is telling and you have 0 of it. I don't need to find a scumtell for you as your entire filter is the proof of your alignment. 0 content with a lot of confrontation for anyone who pushes at you while not providing anything helpful to town = scum. You and I both know it. Coagulation is mafia Risk.nuke This guy is universally one of the scummiest players in the game. He has been defended by a known scum (marv) day 1. He is apathetic and has even said straight out On October 06 2012 06:37 risk.nuke wrote: I'm just to lazy to build a case before the nightflip. I'm always watching the thread incase someone decides to pull some shenanigans. As for why I'm not posting. I consider the atleast last 20 pages useless shit and I haven't seen a point in joining the conversations that's been had. This guy doesn't give two shits about the thread given that he has outright said "i'm always watching the thread" ie hes actively reading and keeping up to date, then "I haven't seen a point in joining the conversations had" which means he doesn't A) have opinions on said thread B) bother to attempt to change the conversations into something that would have a point to him. He actively doesn't care about the game. He has outright said he is actively reading the thread and then says in his next post that he hadn't bothered to do any scumhunting. The only name he was able to offer up as potential scum was kush. A player being universally harassed by everyone at the time. He has offered nothing original to the thread, and has outright said hes too lazy to make cases but is actively reading. He makes a point of coming into the thread to defend himself, but nothing else. Clearly doesn't give two shits about the town winning or losing. Risk.nuke is scum These are my top three reads. All of them follow the pattern of how a mafia player would play. Even when active in thread none of them do jack shit to scumhunt, none of them do anything to help sort good cases from bad or interact in any real positive way. They are all around enough to ensure they survive modkilled but offer nothing to help further the day in any productive way. All of them are playing a very clear scum game. If there is for some reason another scum player after we kill these 3 + hapa we should move into offing Mementoss and then potentially into sloosh. Both of these players have horrible filters. Mementoss has done nothing but make sure he survives a modkill as he has 0 worthwhile content in his posts but has alot of excuses as to why he can never contribute. Sloosh is capable of heavy serious analysis on players and has the voice to make sure his message gets heard and has spent 0 time doing so. However his biggest tell to me is this On October 01 2012 06:15 slOosh wrote: This is the most upsetting start to a game I've played. So I'm gonna lay some ground rules because people are playing in a way that they shirk responsibilities with their actions / words. Biggest thing is stop saying "I wanna lynch player X what do you think?". There is no back up analysis, and it allows people to toss out names at random. You think someone is scum, back it up. Don't say "seems scummy maybe". It lets people sow seeds of suspicion and it makes mislynches more untraceable. See the bolded spot in that quote? Go take a gander through his filter and compare his play after day 1. He is guilty of alot of that behaviour and has no solid analysis on any player. Any reads of his are near aside comments made to appear to be contributing but never trying to get people solidly looking in any specific direction. I am going to continue sifting through the thread but near universally the behaviour of all the players I mentioned have very little in form of contributions and near always pop into the thread to avoid modkills / directly respond to suspicion put on them but refuse to help in any other way. (sloosh is the slight exception to this but his play has been horrific given his ability and he has proven that he is reading the thread actively). | ||
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On October 08 2012 08:14 Coagulation wrote: Sure I wouldnt mind a BC lynch. zboson is more of a null read to me now. He did look scummy as fuck to me at first. then he had a bit of a townie tell and now hes back to being scummy. I wouldnt lynch him yet tho cause hes at least active. zboson has put more time into this game then you have and has been quite open with his reads, pushed down early on one known mafia and has been aggressively pushing his opinions. He has quite clearly illustrated his alignment. The fact you are unable to see this is frightening given a player of your quality. | ||
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On October 08 2012 08:45 risk.nuke wrote: nice case BC, I can also spend 5 minutes too call all the afk vets scummy for beeing afk. Really nice demonstration of your scumhuntingskills. And you're different how? I'm sorry my grandmother was in the hospital and thus haven't been around to keep up with the game but hey, mafia more important am i rite? Prove me wrong, do something productive and useful, oh wait you openly stated you don't give a shit. My bad. Compare our filters dude, when I am here I am far more productive then everyone I mentioned. Its also impressive that you are thinking I called you out for being afk. I called you out for being scummy as shit who is actively lurking and not helping. Mattchew for the same shit, and coag isn't afk. Hes useless as fuck and I know what hes capable of as town. Douchebag town coag still does scumhunting and the like, hes just a dick about it. Still prove me wrong broski. Do something productive. | ||
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On October 08 2012 08:45 BroodKingEXE wrote: @BC Ive found both Matt and Coag to be scummy. I personally would like to lynch Coag to draw out Matt (as I think Coag has been more scummy). Who would you lynch first/ have a bigger scumread? I would lynch mattchew/risk/coag in that order. No one will defend coag on a scum team from my experience and he tends to just do what he wants as scum so attempting to get solid reads on his team is annoying as hell. However the people who come out in defense of either risk or mattchew or based on how they play while being up for a lynch will net more information about their team to solidify the mafia team. | ||
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On October 08 2012 08:53 Coagulation wrote: Im not scum bc. I think your greatly over estimating my abilitys to play town well. Not to mention I got a shit role so Im not really too worried about playing the "OMG I GOTTA DO WHATEVER I CAN TO MAKE EVERYONE KNOW IM TOWN CAUSE IM BLUE" not happening this game. I will be sure to raise hell soon as I see scum tho. My best bet so far would be either YOU or risk You are seriously trying to tell me that by day 3 of a mafia game, you have 0 solid reads that you'd be willing to push? Seriously? You and I both know what you just said is horseshit. | ||
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On October 08 2012 08:59 Coagulation wrote: also your acting like we havnt had 2 confirmed scum in a row completely stagnate town discussion 2 lynch cycles in a row now. This isnt really a "standard" game in that aspect. I expect a slightly stagnate discussion because of this, however if you look at the thread its the same people pushing the new discussion trying to keep hunting. So there are people obviously trying to make productive use of said cycles while you are fine with sitting back with your feet up waiting till someone posts on you to jump in and go "luls no im not scum" and go back to your sitting there. Don't make excuses for your shitty play. If you want to avoid a lynch because your town and afraid you will be misslynched do something to prove your actually town. You are only looking worse with every post. | ||
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On October 08 2012 09:06 risk.nuke wrote: You say lurking but I atleast am more simmilar to afk. I'm on a break because nothing is happening in this game, the last 40 pages are useless and might well not have existed because too many are just waiting for it to come to an end. we have our lynch and there isn't anything else to it. Too me personally I can't be bothered to make a case for the lynch 3 days from now, I can't motivate myself for that. Not to mention that after the nightflips you will have better information hence making time spent scumhunting post nightflips more effective then before the flip. This is how I feel and that is all to it. And you might have been forced to be away and unable to scumhunt but you're here now and I'm telling you your case does not impress me the slightest. If this is the best you'll give us I'll lynch you because I know you can do alot better then those sorry lines for scumhunting. luls. Apathy isn't a town trait when town is winning arttard. Yet here it is, a butthurt risk nuke who is apathetic while winning a game. Why so mad yo. Pissed that your team is getting raped so easily? Mad that you've had people on your case since day 1? Yet don't give enough shit to actually help town win the game, or try and stop useless conversation. As for motivate yourself to make a case for a lynch 3 days from now? All you just said is "i don't want to have my name associated with any specific player in the off chance they flip green and im fucked" | ||
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On October 08 2012 09:06 Coagulation wrote: oh please. People pushing shit doesnt mean they are fucking town in the slightest. I generally spend more time "contributing" as scum than I do as town just for that stupid misconception alone. Actually town aligned contributions are fairly distinct from mafia aligned ones. Its not a stupid misconception, its often people can't differentiate between the two. Good try though. | ||
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On October 08 2012 09:11 Coagulation wrote: Like honestly Its going on night 3. IF BC doesnt die hes scum. Theres no way he would be alive still if hes town. Thats pretty much gonna be my fucking lynch campaign in a nutshell. So we should lynch you, me, VE, and sloosh as we are all the "biggest" names left and alive by day 3. Hey guys Coag solved the thread, I found the remaining scum team right here. | ||
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On October 08 2012 09:20 Coagulation wrote: you know damn well if town BC is alive end game theres something wrong. Sure, but is this the end game? Its day 3 dude with town doing extremely well. Hell, mafia has already tried to off me once. Should be pretty clear I'm not scum. | ||
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On October 09 2012 04:35 Mementoss wrote: I am the Medical Examiner aka, I am the watcher, after clues got taken away my role was changed. Breadcrumb, the only breadcrumb would be I changed my quote to "mommy whats a gravedigger" cause I imagined the medical examiner digging up dead people to examine them. The other would be how I exchanged words with BC after he claimed he was shot. Okay to the more juicy stuff. Night 1: I watched BC, BC was visited by Node(Hapa) or the mafia vigilante. So he did not lie about the shot. However, he did lie about being medic protected. Why would town lie about this? I can't think of motivation. The only reason BC would lie about this would be because he wanted to make scum think there was a medic saving his ass. Actually, the only possible way BC is town is if he is veteran, I don't see why he would lie about this as town, and just say hai guys I was shot, but I was veteran so give me some protection tonight. However, I doubt Blackmamba would take out the veteran role after one of the vets already lost his life. Also, given the fact that Mafia didn't try to shoot him again makes me 95% sure BC is the 3rd Party Night Immue Serial Killer. This quote also seems like he knows a bit too much, it implies that third party has some kp since no one is claiming vig. I would 100% lynch BC tomorrow because of this lie. That brings me to my next point. Mafia knew BC was third party after night 1. Last minute ploys by dead mafia players to get the lynch on the third party to try and save members of their team or just to put WIFOM not to kill BC. We can use this now known knowledge to our advantage. Anyone who has been pushing BC hard after night 1 without much reason, or seems like they know too much, is scum. They are scum looking for some town cred for leading a lynch on anti town. This post rubbed me the wrong way. BC is scum because he lied about getting shot, yet kushm4ster has no evidence to prove BC lieing about being shot. He is using this as his only reasoning. Also Marv, hard defended this guy, almost single handedly getting a wagon off him with a meta case. I could see kushm4sta as scum. Night 2: I watched sloosh and nothing happened. I wish the night deadline was earlier so I could do this last minute and get one last watch. But hopefully this will prove to be useful. Since I was shit all game and I'm sorry lol. But yeah look back after night 1/2 and see people that seemed to have a switch of thoughts on BC or knew too much. Because scum knew BC was 3rd party pretty early. I wish I could be more helpful but I haven't been doing enough reading into the game. I would say lynch BC > lynch kushm4ster TLDR; BloodyC0bbler kushm4stap You are correct, I did claim medic prot to avoid getting shot again. Given that I only have 1 extra night life. Not sure why everyone keeps coming at me about being a third party but since your reasoning for your conclusion is wrong I will sum it up for you. Miller was removed from this game, the miller role was named "veteran". The actual veteran role however was not removed from the game. I am Lucky Citizen . Whats even worse is that you assumed I was a third party serial killer. If you watched me you would have seen me visited and me go out and do something had I had a night action. Given that you knew that I had not visited anyone, and that I was visited you should realize the only logical conclusion is that I am town. You base your conclusion on false information as well as trusting two dead mafia. Not sure what to say here other then you are a horribly bad townie or mafia desperately attempting to remove me from the game. | ||
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On October 09 2012 06:07 Keirathi wrote: Err, what? What kind of watcher is a watcher AND a tracker? Watchers know if the person watched goes out and does something, and who visits them if anyone does. They don't follow you to where you visit just that you went somewhere. | ||
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On October 09 2012 06:12 Mementoss wrote: Why would you lie about being Medic'd BC? Because as a vet you don't claim it as losing your life early in the game. Why? It discourages mafia from shooting you again. If I say "hey my extra night life is gone" they will just shoot me again. Town is unlikely to believe it regardless as the vet role is one mafia love to blend in using. | ||
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It also forces mafia into trying to figure out if you are infact a vet, got medic prot, or both. It makes them speculate on a role that may or not exist and thus potentially fuck with their night shots. Not sure why people think this is a big deal. | ||
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On October 09 2012 06:12 Mementoss wrote: Why would you lie about being Medic'd BC? Now my question for you is. Why if you believed me to be third party all this time, or even suspected it would you not expose me the moment you saw that I lied about the medic? Virtually any other player in your situation would have done this day 2 rather then waiting until almost day 4. You have already proven you were around the thread by voting so whats the deal. | ||
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On October 09 2012 06:17 VisceraEyes wrote: Except you did that for them with the claim by thanking a magical medic - you wanted them to specifically think that you were medic protected. Why? Disagree. If you notice day 2 there was at least one person who believed the possibility of over 2 medics was near nil. Mafia will likely think the same thing. It puts them at a disadvantage because they need to spend time figuring it out. This is pretty standard play when you take a hit. | ||
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On October 09 2012 06:23 Keirathi wrote: @BC: Again, since you didn't answer me. What makes you think that a watcher sees that someone leaves to go do something when you watch them? The specific role information doesn't suggest that at all, nor does the watcher information on mafiascum wiki. I've not played with a ton of watcher, but all of them have been the exact same variation (except in heavily themed games): you see who targets your target, and thats it. Rofl, because apparently I have been wrong on how watchers have worked for years. To my knowledge I have only personally played in 2-3 games where watchers were used and was 100% that was how they operated -_- as in they should operate that way it makes sense lol. *shrugs* I am aware how bad that looks on me but i am 100% serious when i say that is how I have always believed the role has operated. On October 09 2012 06:24 Mementoss wrote: I think the answer is fairly obvious. Both days we had an auto scum lynch, why would I out myself when I could get more free watches in? Also it was more revealing after node flipped scum, I thought you were scum up until that point. Vig who didn't fire then shoots me? You didn't know nodes alignment at the time so if you thought I was scum then you must have at the time thought node was town? You didn't know you would have an auto town lynch, you didnt know if you were going to avoid being shot or roleblocked. As you believed I was scum outing me to get a vig to shoot me, or to set up the day 3 lynch (as you wouldn't have known it was going to be set up via mfub). You also waited back receiving a ton of heat from people for your inactivity and opted to not try and save yourself until you might be killed? Seems unlikely. | ||
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Why would I claim a non existent hit? It only puts me in a spotlight and makes people count kills throughout following days to see if shots mesh out at all. If I claim a hit and everyday thereafter there is always one KP missing from that day (barring mafia deaths or vigi's accounting for the days kp) Id be auto lynched. | ||
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On October 09 2012 06:43 Coagulation wrote: bc are you saying mementoss is scum? its certainly possible given two known mafia have attempted to get me lynched on the same response. He claims a flipped role, and his watch just happens to include a dead scum, and his second check turns up notta. The timing is odd given that I had called him out yesterday for shitty behaviour and likely being scum. Does this mean he 100% is? No, but the time of his claim is weird as shite, even you should see that. | ||
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On October 09 2012 06:50 Mementoss wrote: Because you almost always die on day 1? Gives you a cop-out for everyone that says day 3, BC not dead he must be scum, you can just say you got hit they scared of it not going through again or some shit. You could be vet, but lieing about being medic'd when there was already a couple medics claimed made no sense. Why? At the time of my claim we had 1 outed medic who was also dead. I would also highly suspect I was given my role because I am so frequently killed day 1 / night 1. Playing the way I did is optimal play in the situation. It was day 2 start, not day 4 or 5 when both town and mafia will have an idea of exactly what roles are floating around. | ||
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On October 09 2012 21:35 Kreb wrote: @BC Small question that has been annoying me since your claim: How do you know "Veteran" was the miller role? On October 03 2012 08:00 BlackMamba24 wrote: Mod Update I am removing the role of Veteran from the game. It was this game's equivalent to a non-aware miller. So I'm striking that off the role list. Carry on. This was how. Going through the "accusations on me" and will respond in like 10-20 | ||
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Lets move on to Sloosh. Lets look at your first post of the game mr Sloosh On October 01 2012 06:15 slOosh wrote: This is the most upsetting start to a game I've played. So I'm gonna lay some ground rules because people are playing in a way that they shirk responsibilities with their actions / words. Biggest thing is stop saying "I wanna lynch player X what do you think?". There is no back up analysis, and it allows people to toss out names at random. You think someone is scum, back it up. Don't say "seems scummy maybe". It lets people sow seeds of suspicion and it makes mislynches more untraceable. Shady's vote makes no sense as VE pointed out. In fact the whole thing doesn't make sense, including how he has already started making connective tells on Kush based on Z-Boson. But it seems just as explainable by a combination of poor play / leftover emotions from TL-LVII. I'd wait to see what he can produce (case wise or whatnot) since arguing whether acting like a troll to incite a mod warning isn't conclusive to determining alignment. VE I don't see your issue with annul - or are you doing one of those reaction things because its leaning on the destructive side right now. Now lets really look at the bolded part there. He clearly says if you think someone is scum you should be backing it up. This is important as it shows he really cares about analysis and wants to avoid miss lynches. Its also something a townie sloosh would be doing all game. On October 02 2012 12:33 slOosh wrote: Guh didn't realize how much time I actually take to read. Between Node and Shady Sands I'm leaning Shady. With a total lack of follow through after his troll antics, he has disrupted early day discussion and dropped off. Not lynching him today on the basis of a potential modkill is stupid - he could easily trade his life for hurting day 2 discussion as well and he might not even be lynched. The nature of the Node lynch is really strange. Reason enough to lean the former. ##Vote: Shady Sands On October 02 2012 12:49 slOosh wrote: Node is scummy. I think what you found about his post was valid. However we can only lynch 1 at a time and I find Shady a better target for the reasons I stated. The strangeness of Node's lynch was that there was a disconnect between the push and the votes - you tossed out a bunch of names and his was just picked up. It's enough to sway me to Shady. Note these two posts. A townie sloosh would have discussed his personal views of node originally rather than having to be pushed for them. On top of that given that we know node flipped red, and that shady and austin (who pushed the node case first) were both town. Whats worse is sloosh also discredits the "case" in a sense against node by saying austin just threw out some names and node was latched onto. If there had been no case no one would have taken it, so obviously the case had to be compelling. It is a very subtle defense of node. Lets move into some of his day 2 posts as the rest of his day 1 are an accusation of mattchew (i will mention near the end of my post) and him asking questions. On October 04 2012 10:23 slOosh wrote: What do you think of BC? On October 04 2012 10:58 slOosh wrote: Yea I know what you mean. Like, a post that scares me is Like, I don't understand how he picked the pool (people marv was fine with lynching and defended from lynching seems to cover the whole pool) and saying that at least 1 is scum seems so prone to a string of mislynches (lynch A, flips town, oh B and C must be more likely to be scum). I'm agreeing with the mattchew read though and can understand the players he picked objectively, but yea it's scary. Anyone you want to talk about? On October 04 2012 12:16 slOosh wrote: It's a general heuristic that town post more freely than scum, who have inherent guilt and are scared of making scumslips etc. That's how you caught goodkarma last game no? I agree that there isn't much substance in his filter, but it's feels different from the typical trying-to-blend-in-with-town lack of substance. Worth a vig shot, not a lynch kinda thing. Thoughts on Sharrant's more recent posts? Now, these posts from day 2 are almost all in order. I skipped one as it was quoted in a response of a response he had to me that I had quoted his post. He starts off by asking for opinions on me. Now, remember the first post of his, and his first post of the game I have up at the top of this post? It comes off as odd as before he shares his own view, he opts to wait until he gets a response. He then tosses up a post that shows why he finds me suspicious yet openly states with the words "I don't understand how he picked the pool" yet then in the next sentence states "I agree with his read on mattchew and can understand the players he picked objectively" He OPENLY STATES HE DOESNT UNDERSTAND. Then states that he does? and that he agrees with one of those reads? He casts doubt via 1 post while agreeing with it and being contradictory in his own post. This is not something someone who was honestly suspicious of me being scum would do. If he believed I was scum for this he would not be this contradictory. Town Sloosh is very careful with his posting, and this is incredibly poor for a post. Don't worry, he then backed off when I explained how I did so, then asked why I thought kush was scum, and when I give a general reason he instantly defends him. Keep in mind this is sloosh' best read to this point. He is damn near certain mattchew is scum, and that kush is town. Again he asks for my opinion on a player before giving his own. On October 05 2012 01:27 slOosh wrote: Yea I'd go further and put him at probable scum given his latest post. His comments on players are more summaries and recaps of thread sentiments, he shies away from making any concrete stances, and does a good job spreading suspicions over a large pool even on his not-scum reads. He hasn't bothered to comment / vote on marv so it shows that he isn't actually reading the thread, but wants to make sure he is seen with contribution, probably in light his name being brought up for discussion by us. Again he finds out the opinion of the player he asks a question to, then "buddies" to them and gives a 1 post reason on why the guy is likely red. Now, past this he has no useful interaction that discuss reads for the rest of day 2. Now, Into day 3 he doesnt do anything with reads at all UNTIL CALLED OUT. On October 06 2012 07:11 slOosh wrote: My initial Mattchew case still stands - he hasn't properly addressed it and is compounded by his continuous inactivity / contribution-less posting. Furthermore the only times he pops into the thread is when his name is mentioned. Along those lines I'm kind of wary of BC. I engaged in his 3 of 1 must be scum idea to get better reads off the people and him, but he dropped off and hasn't really followed up on the thought, which suggests that what I initially thought of the post: might be the correct interpretation. But this might just be wariness of a feared scum player, if he posted follow up my suspicions would probably subside. I had a slight townread on kush, as one of those (unintentionally) disruptive town players. The gut feel is still there. You just started posting so I'll have a better idea soon enough. This is his first massive scumtell. Why? Because he hasn't mentioned his view on mattchew until this point in game 3 for 2 days. More importantly, mattchew is the only player in the game he was able to give a single solid analysis post on for the entire game aside from "this post looks bad might be scum" after fishing what someone believes that player might be. He then defends kush, and pulls out the same post he "feared me for" yet he agreed with and understood how I reached my conclusions and with one of my reads! But he doesn't build a case on it, he adds doubt by saying "feared scum player". He doesn't have a case, he is seeding doubt. This is a key bit. On October 09 2012 12:57 slOosh wrote: Guh Mondays, finally over. To all concerned that I'm not playing like I usually do - you are all using meta terribly. My playstyle is reactive. I poke and prod and gather information and then bust out a case. If people are lurking and give 1 line responses I can't do my thing. Now that we finally have an open lynch tomorrow and people are actually posting you can expect my "regular" play. Excusing BC because the benefits of an SK is ridiculous - we don't know the nature of the 3rd party role, and people are forgetting that it has some higher order win condition that ends the game. BC is the best lynch for tomorrow. We have mementoss' claim, and you can see even how he reacted to the claim by discrediting him ("horribly bad townie or mafia") instead of trying to come to mutual understanding. His final case that is him justifying his vote on me. Note the lack of case. He wants to lynch me because we as a town "dont know the nature of the 3rd party role, and people are forgetting that it has some higher order win condition that ends the game." He doesn't make a case as to why I am third party, he makes a case that the third party role could end the game. He then states mementoss' claim (which I already responded to) is justification along with how I reacted. Given that mementoss was on my scum read list, given that scum have been trying to get me shanked all game, it is pretty obvious I would be wary of said player. However this is all he has. He hasn't made a single case since day 1 and just seeds doubt. He doesn't state through example posts why he believes he is right, or even attempt to solidly push me, he instead opts to do a 1 post with 0 analysis and seed doubt. A townie sloosh builds cases. The only case sloosh has made this entire game is On October 03 2012 00:42 slOosh wrote: @austin I had less than two hours to reread everything and determine where my vote should go. I wasn't going to waste it talking about people who probably won't get lynched. It's evident that this town suffered a day 1 of inactivity and scum were probably happy to go along with that. The one that stuck out most to me was Mattchew: The clearest thing in his filter is that he is happy to take no stances at all, and is not interested in getting a solid lynch. Which amounts to "Shady could be town because of this, and scum because of this". The next time he posts follow up is This post shows how detached he is from thread. The context surrounding it is discussion centered around kushm4sta and kingjames01. There is no avalanche of dumb sheep votes on Shady, people are looking into other lynch candidates. There is no purpose other than opposing the Shady lynch without actually calling him town. The rest of his post he calls Coag scummy and then takes it back, calls austinmcc scummy without actually saying it, parroting other people about kingjames and calling out BC. He says he is caught up on the thread, but doesn't understand the arguments. However, he makes absolutely no effort to understand. He doesn't ask questions, he doesn't apply pressure, nothing. He doesn't care about the lynch. The biggest thing is that he doesn't actually unvote but leaves his vote on kingjames the whole time It is clear cut that Mattchew is making sure that he isn't labeled a lurker with "contributions" when in reality he doesn't care about the lynch at all. He is Scum. This has not changed in anything he has said for his strongest scumread. He isn't pushing his scum read. Instead he is pushing a player he has not analyzed and has been seeding doubt on for days for being third party. You know who currently is more scared of me being third party? Scum. Sloosh has done absolutely nothing to help this town, and has sat back in the sidelines. He has stated as a reason for not contributing solid reads is that he is a reactive player, yet he was able to get enough information to build a case day 1 on mattchew (one he never pushed forward to have him lynched btw but was fine defending scum node and killing shady) and has not even touched on him since aside to say "i still think hes scum". Vote sloosh | ||
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On October 11 2012 00:00 kushm4sta wrote: he is quite right. how about you don't lynch me and lynch someone else...that is a good option imo. BTW why did VE reveal so early? he didn't even fight for the lynch to keep his roll a secret. Revealing this early, ad mattchew pointed out, stiffles discussion. Stiffles discussion? He's done nothing but promote discussion since his claim. He not only continued to push you and make sure you die, but hes also been jumping on z-boson. We have players calling out mattchew, we have people still commenting on me and sloosh. I would actually say his reveal has prompted MORE discussion given that till his claim near the only talk in thread was on me and sloosh. Revealing as he did actually ensured the day wasn't wasted and he coming out in the last 12 hours and busting out a dt claim no one would believe as it would come off as him desperately trying to get you lynched and bsing reasons. By claiming when he did showed everyone exactly why he was gunning for you so hard when the concensus was you were retarded and not scum. | ||
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On October 10 2012 22:47 Mattchew wrote: i see the benefits, i don't think you see how unrealistic and hard it is to get real discussion going when the biggest threat is the mighty feared FOS You haven't done fuck all in 4 game days. You have been called out EACH DAY for said behavior and this is one of your reasonings for not doing shit? You are better then this. | ||
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On October 10 2012 16:15 VisceraEyes wrote: The point is that you jumped off of Node resulting in the lynch of your townread. He might have been lynched anyway based on the voting rules, but a vote for Node put Shady one step closer to safety rather than damning him inexorably to the noose. *shrug* kushm4sta, ZBoson I know I said the focus on the BC thing was a bad idea, but I've been thinking about it and the whole Mementoss/BC thing is...strange. On the one hand I can't understand Mementoss' assumption that BC is third party - I mean, we don't know if medic saves are informed (to my knowledge) so why would Mementoss assume BC was lying about thinking he was medic saved. On the other hand, I can't understand BC's assumption that Mementoss is scum based on a role not functioning the way he's used to in a closed setup game where the roles are obviously fucked with. That's everyone's homework assignment for tomorrow (or today if your brain can take it). Go back over Mementoss and BC's filters. See if their play matches up with the claims. Is passive-ass BC really a veteran? Is Mementoss convenient claim of a flipped role just a bit TOO convenient? The truth is in this thread. My assumption wasn't that he was scum before the role worked differently then I thought it did. It was that I had a huge scum read on mementoss before he claimed. He then claimed a role that had already flipped in thread, with information mafia could easily fake while only giving out that I was not medic protected. He then follows up his second check with getting nothing, and is roleblocked on the third. I think the timing of his claim, and combined with how he claimed and the assumptions he made were really weird. It didn't seem normal to my eye thus I suspected him more given he was already one of my scum reads. | ||
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On October 11 2012 00:33 kushm4sta wrote: VE has stifled other people's discussion i meant. but yeah he has been pretty good recently. Disagree. He wanted people to stop discussing third party shite. The thread has been more active today in general discussion then it has in awhile, and he is one of the core reasons for it. | ||
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On October 11 2012 00:55 VisceraEyes wrote: What do you think of ZBos BC? He is looking extremely bad at this moment in time. However I might be to much in tunnel vision but I see sloosh as red, and i see mattchew as red. Mementoss is likely as fuck there as well -_- I can't see this many people still being scum so trying to sort out which are bad town and which are scum might be annoying. I currently believe lynching him or mattchew tommorrow should be what we do as based on thread today and overall they seem most likely to net us scum. (mattchew only if he fails to provide the analysis he just promised). | ||
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##unvote ##vote kushm4sta | ||
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On October 11 2012 01:24 VisceraEyes wrote: If he's scum then he knows (presumably) that he shot BC. He can also postulate that, given a dead watcher, no other watcher is going to counterclaim him. He also knows the name of the watcher role as it has flipped. Anyone can say anything if they surround it with enough truth. Also given that no medic had come forward saying they had defended me day 1, it was likely that I survived the nk due to my own role, and not based on a medic. His reasoning for "hiding" it was also poor. He wanted to get as many free watches off as possible yet also wanted me lynched for day 4. He didn't opt to come out and off me at the beginning of the day making sure he got a third check, he outed himself in a way that he would either die or be rb'd. He then sheeped me at the start of the day on who I wanted to vote for when he believed I was third party and not town -_- | ||
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On October 11 2012 01:36 iamperfection wrote: but if we believe that mementoss is lying that would suggest that the scum role blocked one of their own correct. No one else made a claim of rb right? I would say the scum team would invest a lot for this to be true. Memen making a fake claim and scum team wasting a role block. eh? You just don't use a rb, then have a scum member claim being hit by it. It adds an air of "confirmation" to a fakeclaim. As for alot to invest? Its day 4 and they just have had 3 red checks on them in a row. They would need something like this to try and do a comeback. | ||
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On October 11 2012 01:35 VisceraEyes wrote: What sucks about it is that scum can just leave him alive and kill ME tonight, setting town up for a mislynch if he IS town. X( BC your play doesn't match what I see optimal as veteran play. You went AFK/passive early on when you should have been trying to get scum to shoot you. Before you say it, yes I'm aware that whatever you did "worked" because you got shot. I'm just saying in general that you seemed...too passive to be Veteran. Explain. Day 1 I didn't even know the game started for the first entire day, came home from work into the second day of it and saw my role pm. I then caught up on the thread and began posting. You are right in that I was more passive for day 1, but a ton of people were. The time I was around I attempted to move the lynch off of shady and kingjames while proposing new lynch prospects. Given that at the time of my posting people were slowly peeling from both kj and shady I thought I had done well then had do RL stuff and head back to work. The points I have been around I have made sure to be as productive as I can as well, my life is far busier then it used to be. It obviously makes me look off given my history as a player but I have done what I could. My play day 1 was suboptimal given my role, yet Scum still shot me, likely fearing what I can do as an active poster. | ||
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On October 11 2012 01:43 iamperfection wrote: they didnt know about the 3rd check. True. However given the progression of the game thus far who's been harassed non stop and likely to have been up for a lynch? People have been pushing at kush every day, and each day a confirmed red took precidense. The only person they could hope to make a claim in any regards over and attempt to push to have killed is me given the information they would have and what at least two of them pushed as an idea in thread. | ||
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You have a claim that makes no fing sense. | ||
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On October 11 2012 22:59 Kreb wrote: Dudedudedudedudedudedude. This totally had me thinking. Look at this: + Show Spoiler + 1. iamperfection 2. 3. BloodyC0bbler 4. 5. 6. ShiaoPi 7. 8. Mattchew 9. risk.nuke 10. Coagulation 11. Z-BosoN 12. 13. Keirathi 14. 15. VisceraEyes 16. 17. slOosh 18. 19. 20. Kreb 21. Mementoss 22. 23. 24. 25. Set-up: And this: + Show Spoiler + Lucky Citizen Vigilante Concerned Citizen Enforcer Hitman Paramedic Private Investigator Medical Examiner Coroner Detective Godfather Paranoid Arsonist Scoreboard And look at VEs claim: Is it possible VE added the prefix Mafia to an existing role (could be both town or mafia)? Theres no Mafia prefix on any role BM ever mentioned. If so, thats a pretty telling slip. Not a slip given that On October 08 2012 13:01 BlackMamba24 wrote: Night 3 Breaking news tonight coming out from Liquid City: Prominent business owner and community figurehead Hapahauli was found dead today after being brutally beaten in his home in the late afternoon. Sources close to the scene of the crime witnessed a small group of people enter his home and kill the man while he was eating dinner. The head of the LCPD investigation unit issued this statement concerning the crime and Mr. Hapahauli himself: It is indeed shocking to learn that someone of Hapahauli's status and prominence in the community was involved in clandestine crime. Once again, we here at Liquid City News urge citizens to take extreme caution while the police department investigates this crime family. Hapahauli, the Mafia Enforcer, was lynched! Flip: + Show Spoiler + You are the Enforcer. Your job is to carry out hits for the mafia. You have no additional powers. Night 3 has begun. You have 24 hours to send in all night actions to this account. | ||
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On October 12 2012 05:33 Coagulation wrote: whats up bc. you should night kill ve for us If I had a gun I woulda shot your useless ass days ago. Sadly I just had 1 extra night life. Lucky you. | ||
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On October 12 2012 06:08 VisceraEyes wrote: That's strange...because Godfathers only fuck with, from what I can gather, 1 role in the game... Anyway, it doesn't matter what world because we're playing a game in this world. And in this world, I received "Mafia Coroner" as my report from checking kush. If you don't believe that, that's fine. But that's a fact. You see why I find the framer and sanity thing fucked up though? The only thing I can think of is that mafia has an ability to hide one of their own flips, but I don't know why they didnt use it on marv day 2 -_- | ||
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On October 12 2012 06:17 Coagulation wrote: BC thats like exactly what I said less than a page ago. How are you gonna call me useless one post and then fucking parrot shit I already said with your very next post. Also how the fuck do you think mafia would benefit using it on marv when he pretty much all but claimed being mafia after he was caught. he didn't have to troll if they have a power like that. He raged based on the role that caught him. If they had such a power at their advantage losing him wouldn't have been a "huge deal" regardless of how he was caught. Also, I call you useless because you have done pretty well dick all this game. You can't deny that. | ||
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On October 12 2012 15:38 VisceraEyes wrote: I'm never checking BC you hear me? NEVER. Just so you guys know, this is where VE gave his scumtell. Why would a DT who gets back role / alignment not check the only player in the game suspected thus far of being third party who could out me if I am lying? Why would he only check someone we had the alignment of? The single only way for him to prove his sanity and thus the existence of a mafia framer was to check the one player in the game everyone believes is not town or mafia? Why? Because of all the people VE named last night as his check options I was most likely to be framed. Of all of them pushing me to be lynched right after to confirm framer existence would remove a player most of you believe to be anti town. Instead he "checks" a player who has already claimed a role in thread thus to prove that a framer must exist. A town player would choose someone believed to be anti town as if that belief was correct a check would reveal a role that has not flipped. Also, contrary to popular belief I was not shot, roleblocked, or any other form of night targeted that would kill me or inform me I was targeted. | ||
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Myself, Kreb, Zboson, risk.nuke, keir, imperf and possibly coag are all likely town. Given the night actions and the way VE is currently playing, MMtoss is also likely town. Shiaopi is a null read to me. Making remaining scum in the VE (for sure) Sloosh Mattchew dp | ||
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On October 13 2012 09:19 VisceraEyes wrote: It was because I was high and when I decided you're probably third, I saw "Paranoid Arsonist" and assumed that you can only fuck with people who target you. So no, I'm not checking you bro. Don't tell me who I would check. I told town that I didn't check someone I thought was scum already. I don't care if you don't like that. Incorrect. Checking me proved if framer existed / confirmed me or you. Why? Because If I am third party and you revealed the wrong role I would out you and you'd die in a 1 for 1 trade with me. This would benefit the town. Stress THIS WOULD BENEFIT TOWN. In any exchange I would always be offed first given the massive suspicion on me and it would confirm your theory while removing what everyone believes an anti town influence from the game. Yet instead you opted to check SOMEONE WHO HAS ALREADY CLAIMED. Who no one has doubted the claim of. Unlike any other player in the game, it has been proven I cannot be scum, thus if you are mafia and believe I am third party you would have to guess at my role. If you are town you would receive my role. As for you just claiming that you thought I was paranoid arsonist and assumed I can only fuck with people that target me? Why did node not die the moment he targeted me? Why did I not off him before he was replaced? Does this mean you doubt MMtoss claim because he also visited me and nothing has happened to him? Please enlighten me. | ||
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On October 13 2012 09:22 VisceraEyes wrote: You're being ridiculous. How do I go from "Dude he's obviously contributing, generating discussion and etc etc" to "Dude he's obviously scum" Work with me here - you're not going to get town to lynch me. I promise you. You made the biggest scumtell I have ever seen. Easily. Anyone can look back into the thread and see your only defense is the existence of a role that is meant to only fuck with you. You did speculation of sanity, a possible framer, or a role that essentially hides the flip of a player. Guess what? I don't believe any of these roles exist. There was already a GF and given that I highly doubt mafia had a secondary role that only fucked with 1 blue role in the entire game that was already useless towards one mafia player. Then you opt not to check the only player in the game that has been confirmed NOT SCUM. Thanks but you slipped, hard, and you don't get away with it. | ||
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On October 13 2012 09:30 VisceraEyes wrote: Arsonist primes target - chooses when to ignite or whether to ignite. Or something. I don't know BC. All I know is that "Paranoid" is in the title. I understand that my check didn't benefit town. I've already explained it was for me. I suspect you of third because you're not scum and you're not PLAYING like any townBC I've ever seen. But I'm not interested in "removing you from the game" because I don't KNOW that you're third...and I don't fucking CARE BC because I'm looking for SCUM. Why do you "know" that I'm scum now? That's so against everything you've been saying all game. For the same reason I fucked Mattchew last game. You fucked up. You made the biggest slip in this entire game. One thats only going to be caught by a seasoned player. Simple. You are using role speculation as a reason to not check the only person in the game that A) is believed to be third party B) Confirmed not mafia. This simple check as much as you "dont want to remove me from the game" would have removed a potential third party thus not town, while confirming the existence of a framer or a mafia cover up role while CONFIRMING YOUR FUCKING ALIGNMENT. This is the best and most efficient use of the gd role you claimed while removing a believed anti town and confirming yourself. It then *gasp* confirms coag removing 3 players from the fucking pool of people to be analyzed, forcing mafia to shoot into a pool of players etc.... You take any bit of control they might be getting in thread and remove it. Instead you "checked" for your personal use, Dts don't check for themselves, they check for town. Unless you are scum, then you check to ensure the watcher was a real watcher and not bullshitting, or you check your scumbuddy and confirm his "claim" | ||
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Instead you bail, afraid youll slip up yo? | ||
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On October 13 2012 09:47 Z-BosoN wrote: Why?? Because he's right or because he's wrong? It outs him fully and completely regardless of his alignment. It also potentially outs a third party. How in any sane mind is it ok to not confirm a potential non town player while confirming not just yourself, but two other players in the process? You in 1 fell swoop remove 4 players from a pool of potential mafia and thus have a serious ground to scumhunt and leave the town in a Insanely superior position. There are 13 players alive by my count. Removing 4 of those from a pool of suspects? you have 9 players that could combine the remaining scum. Not just that based on the amount of shots on average per night, it looks like top kp is 2 atm by scum. IE of 3 remaining players from the situation I outlined, at least 1 would still be alive or two depending on the situation. It also allows everyone to begin analyzing on the only people in the game that matter as they would be the only remaining players that could be scum. Any player who gives a shit as town would at least attempt to prove them self not scum in some manner, while scum would be eventually fucked quite quickly. | ||
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On October 13 2012 09:54 VisceraEyes wrote: Or in other words: "He didn't check who I would have checked, ergo, scum." Welcome back. Also no, you didnt check to benefit town, ergo scum. You admitted it. Also you spent to much time on setup speculation rather then real scum hunting. Even now your play is not remotely town. Giving up because people are pushing at you? You would know that you put yourself in that situation with the kush flip. A town player would have done anything to prove himself instead of "ima do what I want and youll accept it" | ||
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On October 13 2012 09:56 Z-BosoN wrote: Then why didn't he just say he confirmed you as 3rd party? If he realized this, as scum, he would have said exactly that, no? He would have to know exactly which role third party was, does third party appear as a different role to dt checks, etc.... A third party role at this point in time is a complete unknown as no one knows what it will flip. Thus it is the only role that could clear him from all suspicion while clearing all of his current checks. Given that the best shot for said check was me, why would he not do it? Why would he try to only benefit himself instead of trying to benefit the entire town? He has no way to know that he won't die at night thus should be using his checks as efficiently as possible to benefit the town, yet he hasn't. | ||
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On October 13 2012 10:19 Z-BosoN wrote: Why not just say something like serial killer? Regardless of what he'd said you would have gone after him calling him scum because you are actually town, no? Most definetly, but I would have been killed and him confirmed. Along with two checks. He has outright said he is playing in his own self interests as opposed to that of the town, He has outright admitted he doesn't give two shits for the town and will do as he pleases. This is not a townie mentality. | ||
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On October 13 2012 10:21 iamperfection wrote: .....BloodyC0bbler you accuse ve of not playing his role properly yet you yourself are the one that LIED causing the shit storm of what claims we should believe. Your lying showed you cared of one thing and one thing only your survival. You can die now 3rd party. We should of lynched you the second we found out about your lie it makes no sense from a town perspective. Your lying only pushed forward your interests of survival. ## Unvote ## Vote BloodyC0bbler I lied about a medic prot. I have already addressed why and near universally its a normal play. Please tell me how not letting the mafia know they shot a vet and make them try and figure out how many protective roles are in the game is at all a bad play? The only people who should honestly care about the # of blues is mafia unless the # gets astronomically high that it just doesn't add up. Then town cares. | ||
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On October 13 2012 10:29 iamperfection wrote: Ve claimed he was a veteran but first he claimed medic protection. He lied kill him. Its not optimal play no matter what he says it just leads to confusion. Why should i believe anything BloodyC0bbler say in relation to anything. And i didnt say it caused somebody to claim i said it just adds to confusion because his lie causes confusion with relation to other players claims. How does it cause confusion? The confusion with Mementoss was not my lie, it was the timing of his claim, mixed with his checks, the roleblock, how he did it. The issue with VE is he claimed dt, his target appeared nothing related to his claim, and he spent time wifom possible setup speculations on why that was. He acts as a confirmed blue where he is not. Currently the confusion isn't my claim, the confusion was brought to both players by me given blind belief in ones claim should not be taken. Whereas my claim is the most confirmed given that of VE and Mementoss, one has confirmed I was infact visited by a mafia goon, thus I could only have been shot. | ||
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On October 13 2012 10:32 iamperfection wrote: you should have said nothing if you were town instead playing gambits it just adds to the confusion. Why should i believe you? it seems from my point of view you only cared about your survival. Said nothing? And not inform the town of all the hits in one single night? The only person who benefits from hiding KP from the town is third party or scum. | ||
BloodyC0bbler
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On October 13 2012 10:38 iamperfection wrote: of course im not 100% sure stop playing stupid word games. I was under the impression that gambits like this were bad. Why would he need to lie if was town? just so the mafia wont shoot again. give me a break a town member should not worry about whether he lives or dies. My play may not have been the best this game, but I have put forth more overall contribution then most players still alive. Also given that near universally the biggest point of suspicion I was garnering for ages was "hes still alive" obviously the expectation of me is to perform at a far higher level then most players. As such would me wanting to survive to attempt to reach that expectation be far more intelligent then say, saying "im a vet, feel free to shoot me now" | ||
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On October 13 2012 10:36 VisceraEyes wrote: ##Vote: BloodyC0bbler Sorry guy. I wanted to wait. For anyone who cares, he's taking the one self-motivated decision I've made this game (the 'toss check) and saying that I'm playing in my own self-interest. Except...I'm not. The reason I wanted to know if I can trust 'toss is because I've played with the guy before and besides BC (who I was NOT checking) the one I considered to be A) the least likely to be framed and B) the one who is most likely to look at the thread objectively and find scum with me. It was self-motivated only in that it allowed ME to have peace of mind about another town player so that, with 'toss, we could find the remaining scum. Add to that the fact that I fully expected to die. Add to that the fact that all the people I mentioned during the night were all potential frame targets. Now: if BC is town, as he claims, then he should know that he should be dead. It's like...just one of those things. If BC is alive late game, he's anti-town. And he's saying that it would have been OPTIMAL for me to check someone WHO HAD ONE OF THE HIGHEST CHANCES OF DYING OVERNIGHT THAN ANYONE IF HE'S TOWN. This is a load of bullshit that he's injecting into the thread guys. I mean, yeah...he's just playing to his win-condition...but honestly if he's not going to help me find scum, then I prefer he just die outright. Except you say if I am town I should be dead. So should you, So should mementoss, so should coag for sheer reason for being a vet/checked by you and flipped green. Mattchew was not as useless day 1 as he is now and avoided major suspicion for days and would never have likely taken a bullet, thus he should have been shot early on, etc.... The level of vets still alive at this point in the game IS NOT A REASON TO LYNCH SOMEONE. Given that the near universal decision was I am a third party thus immune to NK's then checking me should have been your first choice as if we both lived you played the most optimally. You can say that Mementoss is also the person most likely to help you find scum but we both know its not true given his stellar level of inactiveness overall and thus hes not going to help you do jack. Banking on both you and him still being alive, or one alive and not roleblocked is retarded. You should be treating each check like its your last and praying to god you live, not throwing suspicion on everyone who looks at you and making up bullshit reasons to off people. | ||
BloodyC0bbler
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On October 13 2012 10:46 iamperfection wrote: nope you shouldn't really give a shit about survivng. if you were town you should have been contributed the entire time you were not. and not playing silly gambits. I didnt know the key to a town victory was having you last as long as possible. Give me a break. I have given reads, attempted day 1 to divert the lynch away from two flipped players who both turned town (who were the only main targets till that point) and that addition of conversation led to a near scum lynch because it forced austin to post. Next we had day 2 and 3 where yes, I did far less, but guess what? EVERYONE DID. We were handed free lynches by two blues where universally near no one was talking. Day 4 rolls around and I provided reads when I was here. Gasp, seems like I have been helping as best as I could for when I am here. Do you honestly not see any issue with VE's claim? His defense? His open admission that he is not going to play optimally in the interests of the town but in his own? Does town really suffer from a vet claiming med prot to fuck with scum day 2 to make them wifom the setup / # of blues when it shouldn't matter to town? Does town suffer if a Mafia fake claims dt, treats it as confirmed, misslynches a townie, then proceeds to "waste his checks" to keep himself alive longer where his only defense is "mafia must have a framer / role flip hider" when they already had a role that was in play to counter his? Start using your head dude. | ||
BloodyC0bbler
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On October 13 2012 10:53 iamperfection wrote: that bullshit for a mafia game. Why would anyone believe a late game BloodyC0bbler if he has to sacrifice being a legitimate town player. He would have to lie and make himself look scummy in order to survive and then when it comes to late game the town will now suddenly believe him? Ya come on that doesn't apply here. Go read games like closed casket where I was town. I have made up complete roles as town to attempt an early game win given how 100% sure I was on my reads / to make mafia shoot me. Me playing in a way to fuck with mafia's heads is actually quite standard of my play given that It is how I play. | ||
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On October 13 2012 10:58 VisceraEyes wrote: I'm not killing you because you're alive. I'm killing you because you're obviously third party and you're trying to kill town's cop rather than look for scum. Very anti-town of you. Very lynch-worthy. Anyway, thanks for the theory lesson and everything - maybe my check WASN'T optimal. But like...I don't care. It's my check to do with what I will to help town win. You don't lynch every vig who shoots a townie do you? You don't lynch every medic who fails to protect someone? My claim has made sense for days - you picked a pretty fucking opportune time to say "Whoa wait guys, WHOA. I just cracked this game wide open. You know all that stuff I said about VE being obviously town based on his actions and NOT on his claim? Well SCRAP all that because he checked MEMENTOSS instead of ME!" Feel free to backtrack and get on Kreb BC, I'll join you. But as long as you insist that I'm scum, I'm going to insist that you don't give a fuck about finding scum. And I'm going to insist that you die. You bread crumbed the possibility of you being insane/framer/role hider role existing even as you started pushing kush's lynch. Given that there was no reason at all in the setup thus far in the game to suggest a role could be insane, or framer/role flip hider existing you not being 100% sure on a kush lynch is pretty fucking retarded. As for your claim making sense? IT DID UNTIL KUSH FLIPPED NOTHING REMOTELY CLOSE TO WHAT YOU CLAIMED HE WOULD FLIP. You just said you don't care that you didn't play optimally. Why do you think you could afford that given your chance of being shot was as high as mine? How did checking someone else as likely to get shot or blocked help town win at all? As for lynching a vig who shoots a town? God no he just proved he had a bullet. As for a medic who fails to protect someone? How would we know? The situations are different. You are playing suboptimally, have only used fear mongering of setup as a defense of why you have to be a town dt as opposed to scum. As for me not giving a shit about finding scum? I have analyzed many players over the days VE. You also know reads of players change based on how they play over time, and in a few short span of time can have a read on them reversed for shitty play. Also, I believe Kreb is town. He has been playing very much for the best interests of the town this game so I see no need to lynch him. Build me a solid case and persuade me. You as town would know exactly why I doubt you and thus should be playing to change my mind. | ||
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I am leaving my vote on you till I am back from work tommorrow early afternoon. By then I hope we both have distanced ourselves enough to not be as heated as we currently are. | ||
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I still find the situation around kush's flip fucked beyond belief but I am willing to give you time to prove yourself given the name you said Kush had, and thus it may make sense that he can hide his own flip. As such ##unvote | ||
BloodyC0bbler
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On October 11 2012 00:36 Mattchew wrote: Thanks BC for that I'll write a case before the end of the night You're first case then arrives On October 14 2012 03:43 Mattchew wrote: I believe VE to be town and I believe VE's check to be real. I don't really know/care if thats where the mafia KP went, I think we lynched scum with kush. If this is true, we should be looking at those who tried to push away from a kush vote. What townie (who have no information) would not lynch a claimed dt red vote? Especially after we had 2 straight scum lynches putting us ahead. iamperfection is who we should be looking at to lynch. Iamperfection tries to push the zboson lynch on the back of Darthpunk's waivering from the kushmasta lynch. here is iamperf's posting in this time period + Show Spoiler + On October 11 2012 10:29 iamperfection wrote: anyone up for..... dare i say it..... some last minute shenanigans. On October 11 2012 10:45 iamperfection wrote: we would need 8 votes to do anything correct? On October 11 2012 11:05 iamperfection wrote: dp makes more sense than zboson and i believe kush is town. He panicked the last time he was under pressure of lynch as scum he did not do it here. ## Vote Z-Boson On October 11 2012 11:17 iamperfection wrote: alright bed time for me. If i remember right the deadline is unofficial so you have up to the night post to get votes in. He tries to get a last hour vote switch, but doesn't provide any reasoning for doing so. His sole reason is DP's thoughts, which he doesn't even quote or comment on. His pushing of this switch does not have a sense of urgency or care to it. I believe he is doing this last minute switch idea just because he knows what kush will flip. ##vote iamperfection So, given that it did not arrive when you said, you have done no real work since then and keep jumping in to appear helpful/active while doing nothing I am going to vote for you. You are consistently not around or helpful and in no way can I see you being town. ##vote mattchew | ||
BloodyC0bbler
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On October 14 2012 10:50 Kreb wrote: Shiao, Coag and Sloosh appearing within 8minutes after a few Shiao votes go down. If I am to move to a secondary target, thats the kind of stuff thats gonna decide where my vote go. Both Matt and Shiao are similarly scummy because of their inactivity to me, but the sudden resistance appearing for Shiao after several hours of very surprisingly low activity despite the very unfavourable situation for town with votes everywhere. Thats might definitely tip me over. Couple that with: Which is likely directed at me. And since I know Im town, a scum should have little reason to do this. Heavily leaning towards a Shiao vote here if I am to switch. How is it sudden resistance? To my understanding Shiao was not really ever on the docket until what? an hour or two ago, tops of 3? Meanwhile you have a player like mattchew who has been on near universally everyones scumlist at some point through this game. Why is a player who has been so apathetic and unhelpful, who isn't even playing in the interests of the town getting a free pass repeatedly? The entire shiao wagon looks like its designed to keep mattchew alive another day which I have no clue as to why. | ||
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On October 14 2012 10:56 Keirathi wrote: I already did. VE made me paranoid that scum had an ability that they could use to change the flip today. If we no-lynched, there wouldn't be a flip to change. But, I said that without reading the op again to see if it was even possible to vote no-lynch. The only role in the game that could feasibly change a lynch flip was likely the coroner. Given that it is extremely unlikely scum had more then 1 of that role, I think we should be able to trust lynches at this point. | ||
BloodyC0bbler
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If you believe VE at all (you seem to via you believe mafia has an ability that fucks with flips) then kush would have been said role and self used. | ||
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On October 14 2012 11:01 Kreb wrote: Its sudden because..... it happened right after the votes went down? Though its definitely a possibility its a designed wagon. Given how close it is to lynch deadline, when else would it happen? If people waited till just before deadline it would look insanely weird. Given the Shiaopi lynch is a very late choice in the day, it should be getting all resistance to it early. | ||
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On October 14 2012 11:05 ShiaoPi wrote: sudden cuz I wake up and check the threqd again…? @iamp limiyrd time caused mr to rmphasize it. cant write full cases what? | ||
BloodyC0bbler
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On October 14 2012 11:07 Kreb wrote: Theres been surprisingly little activity last hours. That tells me mafia was fine with the situation at hand. Or people weren't around to talk. Any way you look at it you can find reasons to dislike mattchew, and dislike shiaopi. The obvious difference to me which seperates the two is one has actively said he doesn't care, promised to do things that he doesn't follow through on and attempts to be active while never being around to leave his mark on the thread. These are all scum characteristics and everytime he is mentioned as a possible lynch case it suddenly gets pushed aside for other reasons, or people just stop discussing it and move to different things. Look at the last game where BM, and Grush were left alive in a lylo situation and how by not being around 1 townie lost the game. I honestly can say I don't ever want to see a repeat of that. | ||
BloodyC0bbler
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On October 14 2012 11:09 Keirathi wrote: The only reason anyone has ever thought that coroner could change a flip was because VE FUCKING SUGGESTED IT. In my experience, people only speculate about roles that they should have no fucking clue about when they actually have some information about said role. You are right. VE did suggest it. However your options are, hes lying, or hes right that mafia somehow fucked with the flip. Given that the name coroner is likely something to do with dead bodies (as each role has thus far has been somehow related to its name) its not unreasonable thing to leap to. Could he be wrong? yes, but its the most obvious explanation if you think hes telling the truth. | ||
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Because the only reason he is really in a position to be lynched is because he wasn't shot last night. Yes the kush flip looks bad however it can easily be explained via the likelyhood mafia could hide a flip. By offing someone who is quite possibly what he claims, all you are doing is reducing the amount of confirmed townies to a lower amount and thus let them be picked off far more quickly. More specifically however, of VE, Coag and MMtoss, VE is overall doing the most thus losing him if he is town is the bigger detriment. | ||
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On October 14 2012 11:32 Kreb wrote: BC, whats your thought on DP? possibly scum, but he isn't my strongest read thus I am not sure of it. I have not seen anything he has posted jump out at me in any way like I have with others. At this time I am not really comfortable lynching him | ||
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On October 14 2012 11:35 DarthPunk wrote: Hmm. Ok. but that entirely dismisses the chance of him being scum. Which is weird cause you were voting him earlier. Yes, yes I was. I also was tunneling him hard for near similar reasons you wanted to off him for. I had to take a break and come back and think more objectively and less angry with the flip of Kush. | ||
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On October 14 2012 11:37 DarthPunk wrote: Do you really think another 72 hours of speculating on VE's alignment and the setup is good for town? If mafia shoot him and he flips, it confirms his checks. If mafia shoot one of his checks, it confirms his checks / him. Basically, to keep the speculating going means they have to guess who he will check / confirm next and narrow the noose. If he checks someone they don't shoot it reduces the possible pool of players. Him being alive backs them into a corner. | ||
BloodyC0bbler
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On October 14 2012 11:51 DarthPunk wrote: This assumes He is town though. What if he is scum? Again, they have to avoid shooting those he checks or it fucks him in the ass. As well it forces him to actually confirm some people (likely the early ones) as if he comes out saying "so and so is this" and they actually had a different role they could out him, etc... If he calls one more person red based on his ability and they flip town he is 100% not town. However given all the information it is too convoluted for mafia to claim. | ||
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On October 14 2012 11:58 DarthPunk wrote: Why the fuck would scum not shoot in order to mislynch someone they could have shot. 0_o Because if the coroner power we have assumed is accurate it would leave the mafia with a likely number of what? 1 or 2 members left? Doing a play like that is basically the only thing they have left. Shooting him confirms players instantly, forcing town to misslynch allows them to off the confirmed players quickly. | ||
BloodyC0bbler
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VE is a confirmed PI, and mementoss confirmed power role. Neither are confirmed as town, but it is likely both are given they were both passively roleblocked by me. Coag is likely town as well. Sloosh is scum, as is one of DP or shiaopi. Sorry I couldn't be more help, but well, tis not my objective. And with that I am pretty sure the day is over. Good luck town, mafia dont deserve to win. | ||
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On October 14 2012 13:02 Coagulation wrote: whats up bc? I won? | ||
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I handed you guys the win and you still refused to take it. So sad. | ||
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On October 18 2012 21:25 Kreb wrote: I wouldve revealed myself and pretty much confirmed him as Lucky Citizen in that case, so I dont think that would have happened. I was pretty close to revealing it at one point. Which is why I really wanna know how he knew of my role.... Marvellosity and I both did actuallly. When they removed the role of "veteran" from the game as it was the miller role and I looked over the list of remaining roles the only one that was left that could be a vet was lucky citizen. It was pure setup speculation. Just as I accurately realized arsonist was a mad hatter role as I was the third party role Also, i have no idea how you guys believed I wanted VE dead after my exit game post where I say his role was confirmed and that he was likely town + giving you my scum reads. My entire reasoning for the shit I did with VE was to tilt the thread and leave it confused to slip in a mattchew lynch. IE I had to do something to make sure people followed me on who I wanted to lynch to achieve my win condition. It is a shame paramedics played such a rampant role for the first few days of the game as I couldn't attempt my solo win because of it -_- | ||
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On October 18 2012 21:29 DarthPunk wrote: The cases were not that strong. Not enough to get me lynched anyway. Disagree. The reason you were never pushed for a lynch wasn't the strength of the case, but the people doing the pushing. You have to have the ability to out argue / push whoever is the dominant "thread leader" at the time. Pushing a lynch by me or VE was retardedly hard for anyone as both of us can just shut a player down with massive posts / convincing thread our case is better. Also, given we had 3 days of blue checks to lynch from near no one was seriously talking cases as the game seemed that it was handed to us on a silver platter. | ||
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