Newbie Mini Mafia XXIII

On August 06 2012 11:19 Golbat wrote:


I'm suspicious of you as well, because it's pretty common to be suspicious of someone who tries to start discussion using obviously false information. Because that could also be mafia sowing confusion.

On August 06 2012 23:10 YourHarry wrote:


He is sure that my post was a joke, but still suspects that I am scum at the same time. Scum Harry may intentionally mess up the quotes to make it more difficult for town, in which case I won't be joking. Town Harry would accidentally mess up the quotes and joke about not fixing the quotes.

So it seems to be a forced argument to show commitment and throw fake "reads" out there. This is scummy because scums have harder time coming up with genuine reads because they have to build a case on someone they know is town.

On August 07 2012 01:40 Hapahauli wrote:
So how is Golbat not beeing productive? Surely you can tell us why you think so instead of throwing out your "cautious" accusations. Has Golbat been less productive than you so far?

On August 07 2012 02:41 Dandel Ion wrote:

When I read his posts in this thread I saw him as my #1 scum read (though that does not mean too much, I don't have any realy strong reads yet).
Then I read his previous game and saw him flip green.

Now I just don't know what to think of him....
If he's town, his play makes no sense. If he's scum, his play makes no sense because it's TOO obvious.

I just don't know what he IS, what I know is that his play doesn't help town.

Also, sorry about the fluff, will try to not post random shit, but old habits die hard...

On August 07 2012 10:02 Promethelax wrote:


please don't start making connection theories without a single flip. We'll be so deep in WIFOM that we'll need gills to breathe.

On August 07 2012 10:15 Shady Sands wrote:
Synystyr looks scummy to me. Here's why:



What is he trying to say here? We should avoid lynching active players? Or do scum already know that they should be active? Or is there a benefit? Or isn't there? Is the wine in front of me?



Here, he doesn't say very much at all. First off, policy lynching lurkers is not because activity indicates alignment, it's because when town can lurk, then scum gets a free ride to lurk, too. Policy lynches are designed as punishment to "dry up the pond" for scumfish to swim around in.

Second, when he says that scum like to cause discord amongst the town, it's almost like he's painting anyone who comes out with an early case as a potential scum. Why would a town want to do that? Town benefits from discussion and active scumhunting, even to the point of arguments, if necessary.



Scum have to look like they're trying to catch scum, without committing to anything. Here, Synystyr does that, as well as basically priming Golbat for a lynch, without having to commit himself. This is anti-town play at best.



Scum try to buddy other players very aggressively in the early parts of the game. This is a classic scumslip.



Wait a second: earlier Synystyr says that "activity is not indicative of alignment"; now, when people pressure him, he argues for a lurker policy lynch. This is the biggest slip in the thread so far.

In conclusion: town doesn't have to act like they're scumhunting without actually committing. Town doesn't have to try and buddy other players. Town doesn't have to self-consciously apologize for fluff posts and then immediately contradict their own post from 2 pages ago. There is no reason to do any of this... unless he's scum.

## Vote Synystyr

On August 07 2012 10:42 Lvdr wrote:
Having reviewed iamperfection's posting from the beginning, he is another person that has contributed no unique analysis. He has posted on policy, attacked YH way more than is needed, and fluff. Directing discussion to another game doesn't look good. Talk about something other than lurkers and YH.

Since Synyster and YourHarry are taken, I will make a case for Golbat

Golbat has made a number of fluff posts, with the only real material coming when he attacked my confusion about his role in the last game he played. The cases he claimed to be forming are not in evidence (yet). As it stands, Golbat might be a semi-lurker mafia.

However, Synyster remains my top suspect.

Like most players so far, Golbat hasn't done much to seem solidly town. Doesn't mean he's scum.

Golbat's main contribution has been noticing my early flub. That points to an being an active townie or a mafia jumping on an early mistake. Worth watching but not explicitly a suspect.

I dream of catching scums by trolling.

This game though, it just took one post for me to trust you.

@ YourHarry:
Thanks for your trust, but keep in mind that most players in-game had a strong town read on me in XXI... and we all know what happened out of that! I'll be sure to make my townie motives clear throughout the game =)

Honestly, I read through it and I felt it was a great case and you somehow convinced me a bit (enough to make Lvdr my number 1 suspect) ! The "Both hapa and yh are mafia or both are town?" got me ! Being town, I would only have written "Both Hapa and YH are mafia ?" or at least in a different order (town before mafia)...

On August 10 2012 07:06 iamperfection wrote:

I aint going to fabricate a case just to defend myself.

The "Both hapa and yh are mafia or both are town?" got me ! Being town, I would only have written "Both Hapa and YH are mafia ?" or at least in a different order (town before mafia)...

Agreeing with mkfuba's case is not what I found suspicious.

Here's to hoping that there won't be like 3+ lurkers this game... -_-

s a side-note, I'm betting we don't have many lurkers anyway. We are very fortunate to have had this game restarted, as it's given lurkers a chance to weed themselves out from playing .

On August 10 2012 13:00 Shady Sands wrote:


Got it. What I was concerned with was pushing a newbie so hard that they end up in a situation where the more they try to defend themselves, the deeper the hole gets, and inevitably it creates a situation where they become the "easy lynch".

That being said I've been watching Axero too (if you read my earlier posts). He hasn't crossed the scum threshold yet but he is something I am keeping an eye on. But I want to get a neutral read on him before I start the pressure... I don't want my read on him to be colored by the fact that I am pressuring him.

Second, why make lurkiness and incoherent posting the sole criteria for how to lynch D1?

Lvdr seems to be pointing at several people currently. About 80% of his posts this game have been on the topic of lurkers and calling lurkers out, instead of actually discussing anything that actually involves other people's posts. He has a couple, but not many.

Yes indeed, we can see that he thinks I'm concerned that I'm on a case, trying to draw attention from people on me ! (I'm not concerned, I'm just explaining myself)

He even says that if I die, it would only help town to get more info about the people who would bandwagon on me...
Why would a town player be happy to get information from a sacrifice of his mate !?
On the first hand, why would he ever think about that if he was town ?!

Doing so, he's again trying to get the attention off of him and Lvdr (Saying Lvdr because it all started because I was talking about Mkfuba's case).

point 1 : As you know, we are 9 towns and there are 3 mafia. 6 of everbody talked about Mkfuba's case.
Assuming that you are mafia I would assume that mafia players wouldn't comment on the case or at least, they would try to find something bad about the case which didn't happen. So, my guess is that all 6 people who commented are town and lurkers could be town as well.

they would try to find something bad about the case which didn't happen.

The thing is that YourHarry, before Dandel Ion comments, DOESN'T behave like a scum !

I want you to explain me how do I seem to lack a basic mafia strategy ? I mean, why would we sacrifice a town to get information when we can lynch someone who looks scummy ?!

On August 11 2012 04:29 Hapahauli wrote:
To be honest, I'm shocked at how little attention that Axero is getting. He's laying low and has demonstrated some clear anti-town behavior. Some players have mentioned having suspicions of him, but no one has so much as FOS'd him.

Go with me a bit here:
If Axero was town, wouldn't he be a REALLY EASY MISLYNCH FOR MAFIA? Why has NO ONE voted for him? I'm inclined to think that his mafia buddies are covering for him!

On August 11 2012 05:42 Promethelax wrote:
Does anyone have the votecount in their notes? I don't and don't want to go back through the thread to see where we stand if I can use that time for something useful. Like re reading Axero's posts and hitting myself in the face with a brick.

As such, I accept full responsibility if a bandwagon forms on Lvdr, as at this time I firmly believe he is scum.

On August 11 2012 05:53 Dandel Ion wrote:
Alright I thought about it.
I think this is how I want to proceed:

We lynch lvdr.

He flips town, we lynch Sideni day 2 and probably mkfuba on day 3
He flips scum, you guys probably lynch me day 2

I'm pretty sure we get at least 1 scum with that.

I won't lie, I'd like to have Sideni out of the game as fast as I can, but we all make our sacrifices....

On August 10 2012 11:36 Lvdr wrote:
Also, regarding my drunk-posting: clearly they were controversial snap judgments made early on D1. In terms of content they are completely irrelevant now. However the main argument against me right now is that they 'caused confusion' and therefore I am mafia.

Instead of endlessly discussing policy, giving strong reads and attracting attention in this way gives the town something to actually analyze. Imagine going back to read the discussion after a few flips. The motives of those accusing me AND defending me would be quite informative.

Probably my last mafia game

On August 11 2012 06:54 Dandel Ion wrote:
Can we just lynch a lurker now?
Shady Sands preferrably, Axero is also acceptable

I don't think we're on the right track right now

GK didn't post a lot in XXII, but when he did, he made long posts with good analysis. I'm not that worried yet, but if he still doesn't get us something by 8-10 hours before the lynch deadline then that would be weird. If that's the case, then I'd be willing to push for a lynch, if no other candidates have emerged yet.

On August 11 2012 07:12 Kronen wrote:
FoS Lvdr, Axero, Dandel.

If I had to vote now, it'd be Lvdr.

LoD Sideni

@Sideni: (that's for Look of Disapproval by the by) Caaaaaaalm down! Deep cleansing breath.

I'm here for the vote and beyond... cogitating thoughts...

Either way, my gut feeling says GoodKarma - his play has been way too clean. Suspiciously clean in a pretty batshit crazy Day 1.

The answer is ShadySands. He's the only guy without serious suspicion on him.

Why else would Promethelax make such a big deal about including ShadySands in his suspicion list?

Secondly, I believe there's a good case to be made against ShadySands even if Promethelax doesn't flip red.

Please explain to me how me coming in with a random accusation on someone with a lot of towncred qualifies as scumhunting. Hint: it's not.

Pressuring me this way only makes it more, not less, likely that whatever case I come up with is hasty and half-baked, and less usable as a result.

Shady does Jack Shit Day 1

Huh what? He ignores my bolded point and focuses on the least important part of my logic! In addition, Shady Sands is the only force against the GK lynch, and does so in a way that twists my wording and logic.