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On July 26 2011 02:01 Amber[LighT] wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2011 01:59 chaos13 wrote:On July 26 2011 01:57 sandroba wrote:
Not really. Assuming DB is town, which I think he is, they couldn't be certain that he would reveal who got the Tim role. supersoft was basically cornered into shooting whoever shot YM, to prove he wasn't lying. Maybe they indeed did not think things through, but a more plausible explanation is that they are both mafia. It's not certain, but it explains things better than "mafia is dumb". It's worth keeping him around for DT checks anyway. If he's not mafia he's going to get shot eventually or confirm half the town. Hmm. But if he is mafia we can't trust his checks at all. I hadn't thought of things from that angle, so it's semi possible he could be scum. If he is, his DT power is useless because it would be so easy to lie about it. However, it depends on whether decon would post it publicly or PM supersoft. I'm guessing it would be PM'ed to soft, in which case he would have no trouble lying The second he starts lying we axe him.
Problem is, how do we know if he's lying?
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I would expect better play from kita than that if he's mafia. From what I recall in other games he almost always gets called out for this day 1, even as town. I would want more solid evidence against him than this. I can't say I like the play style, but it matches his meta and I haven't seen anything horribly condemning against him so far.
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On July 26 2011 02:09 syllogism wrote:Someone lied about Supersoft's role though Supersoft: Show nested quote +This action will blow your cover and this will cause your alignment and role abilities to be revealed to the mafia Dropbear: Show nested quote +His kill causes his alignment and role abilities to be PMd to everyone of the opposite alignment to him
lol did you just give yourself away as mafia?
"Hm, they said this but decon hasn't PM'ed it to me or my team yet."
Before I go ahead and lynch your scummy neck please explain to me if I'm seeing things right here.
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So I really don't understand why BC is so against people voting Kurumi and supersoft using his alignment check. Why should we bother keeping Kurumi around? I don't see any pro-town leanings from him, and an alignment check is a powerful tool
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BC, what you're saying is absolutely ridiculous.
1. You do not want people to vote on Kurumi, based on that you think he has a vote-activated power, despite how he is simply trolling and being anti-town. He has not hinted at all that his power is activated based on how many votes he receives though, all he said is that it happens when he dies. Worst case scenario, he is town and his power harms town. Best case scenario, he is mafia and his power harms town. I don't know about you, but I would gladly trade a likely mafia for a townie. We come out far better from that than scum do.
2. You do not want supersoft to use his DT check. Wat. Wat. WAT. You're reasoning is that "he will confirm someone town and mafia will kill them." Let's get him to check one of our top suspects. If they're town, rather than lynching them we will move onto someone else who is now that much more likely to be mafia. If they're scum, we lynch them without hesitation (duh). Let's face it, people are going to die from mafia tonight anyway. If we get a confirmed town, then we get any medic-type roles to protect them. I really see no possible way that getting him to use his power can harm us. A DT check that we all get to know the results of is good.
I'm really not liking your play here BC. I can't see why a townie would want to protect a spammer or avoid using a DT check.
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Well apparently we'll have to wait for kita to get back from work before he can be checked
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Wait, isn't supersoft's check an alignment one, not a role check? BC seems to have these mixed up...
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On July 26 2011 05:21 syllogism wrote:
I can only see two possibilities: BC has a really odd posting restriction or he isn't town aligned. Leaning on former as this would be incredibly bad scum play and there are no village idiots.
He already claimed a post restriction. However, I am having serious trouble figuring out what it is, if it even exists.
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On July 26 2011 06:53 Lanaia wrote:
I don't think BC is a good lynch today.
Why not?
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On July 26 2011 07:05 Lanaia wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2011 06:58 chaos13 wrote:On July 26 2011 06:53 Lanaia wrote:
I don't think BC is a good lynch today.
Why not? Although he's strange, I think he's town. It's gut, most likely, but I feel strongly he's just stubborn town. He's giving me townvibes. I really can't explain it more than that.
Hmm, okay. Who do you think is a good lynch then?
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Oh and it's time for a...
LURKER ROLE CALL!
The following people have not been posting as much as I want them to:
-Jackal58
-Nisani201
-Amber[Light]
-Drazerk
-ketomai
-Mig
-Varpulis
Any of you there?
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23 hours left. Switch is at 6:00 KST
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The problem with giving Jackal the stone is that if he is mafia, then we may have just given him the power to save a fellow mafioso. That just really complicates things, and it's something we don't need. At the same time, I'm uneasy leaving a med kit wasted. That just doesn't seem like a good thing to do.
Curu, what would you think of lynching kitaman or Kurumi over BC?
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On July 26 2011 07:36 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2011 07:32 sandroba wrote:
BC, let's assume ss is scum. How does an aligment check benefits him?
Also, you don't seem conviced Kita is scum. Would you oppose a aligment check on him? -_- they benefit him by A) giving info that regardless if you think it does or not, it helps "confirm" his legitimacy. It doesnt B) It lures town into false control of a role C) It sets up a slope of trusting someone we shouldn't trust D) It allows mafia to control general thoughts on rolechecks / lets them manipulate town as a whole There are more reasons but you should get the idea. An unconfirmed aligned dt's checks could be legit or not when he gives us the answers but if 1-2 of those checks turn up legit people will assume that dt is town when it does not mean that at all. There is far to much emphasis put on dt's and giving the mafia a potential tool to control town is terrible. As such, why would I want him to check anyone?
Hmm...this is interesting. So what you're saying is that we would basically have to let him live if we want him to check people, but have to lynch him if we wanted to confirm his checks.
That's something of a dilemma...
Your entire theory is based on him actually being mafia though.
On the one hand, we let him live while "checking" people's alignment.
On the other, we let him live without being put in the spotlight with his checks.
Or in a third scenario, we lynch him to confirm/refute his checks. If he flips town, we have truthful checks. If mafia, we just lynched scum and we can ignore all his 'checks'.
The question is, which of these scenarios benefits us the most?
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On July 26 2011 08:19 Curu wrote:
What's with all this "I'll get checked if you do xxx and xxx and xxx for me first" bullshit.
If we want to enforce this check, then we lynch anyone who refuses to do it. Remember that people we want checked are people that we probably want lynched too.
I completely agree with you. Kita is asking us to completely give up the democracy of voting and let a single player decide who to lynch.
19 heads are better than 1
What I think a big problem will be is getting supersoft and his check target to be online at the same time
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On July 26 2011 11:35 Mig wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2011 11:34 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
I love when morons fall into place. Of the 5 people currently voting for me vigi's feel free to clear the numbers out. There will be at least 2 anti town there already. Thank you dumb tards for playing the game I call "mafia are bad". BC would you say your 10 page argument was good for the town in anyway?
Look who crawls out of the woodwork. Good to see you again Mig. You haven't said much all game
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Alright guys, sorry I haven't been active lately. Just started work two days ago and it's not leaving me much time for mafia.
So last nights kills we have:
Mig
Wiggles
red
Why would mafia want to kill these guys specifically? Were any of these players really pushing someone?
Also, you guys are herp derping left and right. I haven't seen any proper analysis of lynch candidates so far. What I want you to do is if you have a suspect, filter their posts and actually write something up on them. Explain why you think they are mafia, and reference it with quotes. Actually provide some evidence. Then others can comment on it and suddenly we have an organized town that is working together to catch scum. In this environment mafia will stick out like a sore thumb,.
While I'm talking about it, I would like to add my analysis on a player.
Syllogism
On July 25 2011 17:23 syllogism wrote:
It makes no sense for mafia to fake role PM like that as it could only lead to town lynching ON and confirming his alignment. I'm more inclined to believe the whole alignment thing in the PM is a red herring or that he is third party.
This post was made in regards to Jackal58. In it he states that it just wouldn't make sense for scum to say that, because it would lead to them being lynched. He defends Jackal rather strongly.
On July 25 2011 18:29 syllogism wrote:
Pretty sure you people pushing jackal aren't this gullible/blind, but rather not town aligned
Care to explain why mafia jackal would reveal his role immediately, knowing ON's real aligned and what will likely happen when ON flips town
In this one he makes a chainsaw defense of Jackal. Apparently anyone who thought Jackal was mafia is scum.
Defending Mafia = check
On July 26 2011 04:45 syllogism wrote:
So you are admitting the role is likely confirmed. What exactly will mafia/third party supersoft do with his alignment checking role that town is forcing him to use? At worst we will be mislead, but we are always free to ignore his checks. At best he gives us red today. There's no risk at all unless it's a gambit and they are ALL red.
This post seems solid at first glance, but it reveals a scum agenda. Encouraging alignment checks is a great way to come across as pro-town. However, he suggests ignoring checks and brings up a reason not to trust them in the same post. Perhaps a mafia even created a role for BC and they knew he was a miller.
On July 26 2011 22:19 syllogism wrote:
I'm up for lynching Lanaia, Redff or possibly Palmar. I concur with Foolishness' thoughts on BC; I find it quite unlikely he would act like this if he was mafia aligned as he must realize most of the town will immediately jump on him. Refusing to get checked is suspicious, but for now I'm not willing to lynch him based on just that. Palmar has been keeping quite a low profile so far, jumped on the easy and quite weak wagon and done little to no scum hunting so far, which is quite uncharacteristic of him.
In this one he takes three seemingly random names that he has not mentioned previously once, and suggest lynching them. He only provides reasoning for one of them.
This is all during a huge drawn-out argument with BC that did nothing but clutter up the thread. While BC did flip town, this argument was still anti-town. Much more productive things could have been happening in that time.
On July 27 2011 05:58 syllogism wrote:
I switched to Jackal because I STILL can't believe this is your scum play.
So...a red check from a DT, and he still moves his vote? This seems like classic mafia not wanting to be caught voting for town. He even moves it to a mafia, who ended up not lynched. At this point since the check is red he knows that BC is going to be lynched. He also knows that it's because he is a miller, as BC is not on his mafia team. When BC flips green he can say "told you so" and when Jackal flips red he can say "see, I'm town. I voted for scum".
On July 28 2011 06:32 syllogism wrote:
Chaos13 and Foolishness definitely look like the best lynches as of now.
Then he goes on to pick two MORE random names and suggest they be lynched, again without providing any reasoning.. Note to all town players: explain your votes. It makes things go much better.
Worth noting as well though, is that he doesn't vote for any of the players he says he would like to lynch. He is waiting for a reaction from the town to see if he will have support. He doesn't want to be caught pushing a townie lynch. All he wants to do is plant the seed of suspicion and then watch it grow.
And then we have what just ended up happening. supersoft was ready to check syllogism, and then he is hit by a day vig. A town player would have claimed a day hit like this immediately, especially to explain why they hit such an obvious townie. This means it was scum. Why would scum risk a day hit like this with no warning? They didn't want syllo to be checked.
syllogism is scum
That's as coherent as I can make this post right now, I hope it makes sense. I'm exhausted.
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Oh and ##vote: syllogism
And nobody should be handing out hallows. Potter and voldy are dead. Anyone who wants them probably has an HP role and can use them, but that's not good since we aren't aware of any roles like that. in other words, you're giving power to someone completely unconfirmed. Don't do it.
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What is there to explain?
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I guess it does. You're ignoring all my other points against him though
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EPT
