EPTOn June 13 2011 11:40 Treadmill wrote:
Hmm. I hadn't seen that iGrok added Vain to his "experienced player list" despite not really being experienced. Considering I've been doubting the grush57 vote a little its enough for me to switch.
Show nested quote +
On June 13 2011 11:32 TranceStorm wrote:
I quoted my own posts a couple of times because you happened to 'skip by them' multiple times so I called you out asking you to respond multiple times. Only when I have finally pinned you down here have you finally responded to any attacks against yourself. So lets look at your responses:
Post #1: Ok, so you voted to lynch rookie on the basis that it was a 50/50 and you didn't want to investigate anyone else further. That sounds fishy by itself, but I won't press the issue here.
Post #2: The first thing you miss in that post is that I compare your current behavior in the thread to that in your previous game. (the first two paragraphs) There was a complete different between the way you posted in the beginning of this game and Slightly Normal Mini Mafia I. Only now, have you become more active in your postings. Is this because I called you out? Now onto the subpoints:
Post #3: The key issue in this post was not GGQ's accusations. Its Pyo's collection of your posting history. A key thing to note is that you had not expressed a strong opinion on any issue. You had not advocated for a lynch or advocated for a plan or what not. In fact the only consistent thing in your posting history was your constant defense of iGrok and your suggestion that he not be lynched.
Post #4: This is where I accuse you of dodging accusations. I called you out repeatedly, and judging by the fact that you say you read back on grush's posts, I expect that you must have read those posts. Why did you delay responding until I forced you to respond? The reason is that you have been trying to hide and dodge those suspicions. Don't say that I am dodging accusations, when I am repeatedly calling you out.
On June 13 2011 09:51 Vain wrote:
So, i hope that's enough for now.
On June 13 2011 09:33 TranceStorm wrote:
Ok, I stand corrected on the quote issue. (That still doesn't clear grush by any means - he's only saying that iGrok probably isn't blue).
But when I'm talking about accusations I mean responding to the following posts:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=52#1022
Well as i stated before it was pretty much a 50/50 scum/blue flip i just don't really like talking about blues and i didn't feel like investigating the rest again. Day one lynch is most of the time wrong anyways.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=58#1157
point one: GGQ,Kurumi and a few others are also on that list. Ty for bringing that up. It could very well be those are all townies. Igrok was positioning himself as head townie remember?
Point two: same as first link
Point three: Well igrok said something about at least one vet being in the mafia. I found that a very good theory. One of the two had to be mafia but i picked the wrong one. I dind't think igrok would put so much effort in appearing town while he was godfather.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=61#1212
Jeah, really i don't know what GGQ was smoking but i didn't even talk about lafali once before i died
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=65#1286
Especially considering that the last of the set of 4 posts is just 2 posts above one of yours and is on the same page where we have had such a nice conversation, it looks to me like you are dodging the accusations against yourself.
On June 13 2011 09:22 Vain wrote:
there, now do your own research without a stupid search function. now accusing of what, not voting on scum? guilty as charged but you have to come with more than that.
On June 13 2011 09:10 TranceStorm wrote:
Please link me to where grush ever accused iGrok of being mafia (or in fact agreed that iGrok was not blue). In fact a quick search of grush's posts with reference to iGrok (hooray for search function!) reveals that he always defending iGrok and suspicious of the people who bandwagon against iGrok.
In the meantime, I notice how you haven't responded to the accusations against yourself yet again, please do so.
On June 13 2011 09:02 Vain wrote:
Several pages later he changed his mind and agreed he wasn't blue either. I'll vote when ill see fit and don't make it seem there have been strong cases against any player yet. We lynched 1.5 times a blue so you go ahead and make a very strong case on a scum. But if it turns out to be a blue you stop playing this game forever ok?
Btw, i also thought voting for jackal while igrock was alsmost about to be lynched was a huge scumtell. but i just really hoped you didn't notice
On June 13 2011 08:53 TranceStorm wrote:
Read this again. Grush isn't calling igrok scum, he's defending him given that he's responding to an attack on iGrok and saying that "which could also mean he is a blue". Then he says "Not saying whether iGrok is mafia or town/blue", and concludes by articulating that isn't actually defending iGrok "Inb4 grush57 is trying to defend iGrok, he is scum!", when he actually is.
In the mean time, would you mind responding to the numerous accusations against yourself? You seem to be selectively responding to accusations against grush instead of yourself.
Also, given that the day vote is ending soon, pick out a candidate and give good reasons for voting for them, I haven't seen you strongly support a lynch all game. I've only seen you defend iGrok and grush, so please, I would love for you to make a vote and back it up now.
On June 13 2011 08:41 Vain wrote:
Ok, i went trough grush57 posts again. Most of them are just reactions or agreements of people so i am not going to post those.
Grush57 is calling igrok scum. This was irr before he was in alot of danger so this pleads for him
Ok, i went trough grush57 posts again. Most of them are just reactions or agreements of people so i am not going to post those.
On June 09 2011 06:55 grush57 wrote:
[quote]
So, he is the most passive, which could also mean he is a blue and then later in another post, you try to get other people to bandwagon with You. Not saying whether iGrok is mafia or town/blue, but u do have good analysis of those players. Inb4 grush57 is trying to defend iGrok, he is scum!
[quote]
So, he is the most passive, which could also mean he is a blue and then later in another post, you try to get other people to bandwagon with You. Not saying whether iGrok is mafia or town/blue, but u do have good analysis of those players. Inb4 grush57 is trying to defend iGrok, he is scum!
Grush57 is calling igrok scum. This was irr before he was in alot of danger so this pleads for him
Read this again. Grush isn't calling igrok scum, he's defending him given that he's responding to an attack on iGrok and saying that "which could also mean he is a blue". Then he says "Not saying whether iGrok is mafia or town/blue", and concludes by articulating that isn't actually defending iGrok "Inb4 grush57 is trying to defend iGrok, he is scum!", when he actually is.
In the mean time, would you mind responding to the numerous accusations against yourself? You seem to be selectively responding to accusations against grush instead of yourself.
Also, given that the day vote is ending soon, pick out a candidate and give good reasons for voting for them, I haven't seen you strongly support a lynch all game. I've only seen you defend iGrok and grush, so please, I would love for you to make a vote and back it up now.
Several pages later he changed his mind and agreed he wasn't blue either. I'll vote when ill see fit and don't make it seem there have been strong cases against any player yet. We lynched 1.5 times a blue so you go ahead and make a very strong case on a scum. But if it turns out to be a blue you stop playing this game forever ok?
Btw, i also thought voting for jackal while igrock was alsmost about to be lynched was a huge scumtell. but i just really hoped you didn't notice
Please link me to where grush ever accused iGrok of being mafia (or in fact agreed that iGrok was not blue). In fact a quick search of grush's posts with reference to iGrok (hooray for search function!) reveals that he always defending iGrok and suspicious of the people who bandwagon against iGrok.
In the meantime, I notice how you haven't responded to the accusations against yourself yet again, please do so.
On June 09 2011 07:20 grush57 wrote:
Yea, I don't really think he would be blue either.
Yea, I don't really think he would be blue either.
there, now do your own research without a stupid search function. now accusing of what, not voting on scum? guilty as charged but you have to come with more than that.
Ok, I stand corrected on the quote issue. (That still doesn't clear grush by any means - he's only saying that iGrok probably isn't blue).
But when I'm talking about accusations I mean responding to the following posts:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=52#1022
Well as i stated before it was pretty much a 50/50 scum/blue flip i just don't really like talking about blues and i didn't feel like investigating the rest again. Day one lynch is most of the time wrong anyways.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=58#1157
point one: GGQ,Kurumi and a few others are also on that list. Ty for bringing that up. It could very well be those are all townies. Igrok was positioning himself as head townie remember?
Point two: same as first link
Point three: Well igrok said something about at least one vet being in the mafia. I found that a very good theory. One of the two had to be mafia but i picked the wrong one. I dind't think igrok would put so much effort in appearing town while he was godfather.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=61#1212
Jeah, really i don't know what GGQ was smoking but i didn't even talk about lafali once before i died
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=65#1286
Especially considering that the last of the set of 4 posts is just 2 posts above one of yours and is on the same page where we have had such a nice conversation, it looks to me like you are dodging the accusations against yourself.
So, i hope that's enough for now.
I quoted my own posts a couple of times because you happened to 'skip by them' multiple times so I called you out asking you to respond multiple times. Only when I have finally pinned you down here have you finally responded to any attacks against yourself. So lets look at your responses:
Post #1: Ok, so you voted to lynch rookie on the basis that it was a 50/50 and you didn't want to investigate anyone else further. That sounds fishy by itself, but I won't press the issue here.
Post #2: The first thing you miss in that post is that I compare your current behavior in the thread to that in your previous game. (the first two paragraphs) There was a complete different between the way you posted in the beginning of this game and Slightly Normal Mini Mafia I. Only now, have you become more active in your postings. Is this because I called you out? Now onto the subpoints:
- 1. Yes GGQ and Kurumi and the others were on the list. But that was because they had contributed significantly or were seen as veterans - you had not done much analysis. In fact iGrok lumped you into his 'experienced players category' when you had been modkilled in his Sleeper Cell Mafia Game.
2. Same as Post #1.
3. My argument was that you were extremely hesistant and unwilling to associate yourself with either side. You seemed extremely unsure and unwilling to accept responsibility for your vote which piqued my interest as you seemed to wish to 'hide'.
Post #3: The key issue in this post was not GGQ's accusations. Its Pyo's collection of your posting history. A key thing to note is that you had not expressed a strong opinion on any issue. You had not advocated for a lynch or advocated for a plan or what not. In fact the only consistent thing in your posting history was your constant defense of iGrok and your suggestion that he not be lynched.
Post #4: This is where I accuse you of dodging accusations. I called you out repeatedly, and judging by the fact that you say you read back on grush's posts, I expect that you must have read those posts. Why did you delay responding until I forced you to respond? The reason is that you have been trying to hide and dodge those suspicions. Don't say that I am dodging accusations, when I am repeatedly calling you out.
Hmm. I hadn't seen that iGrok added Vain to his "experienced player list" despite not really being experienced. Considering I've been doubting the grush57 vote a little its enough for me to switch.
Yep, right here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=19#377. Which is funny considering that Vain was modkilled in iGrok's game.
