Experimental Mini Mafia

On December 01 2010 01:27 Aeres wrote:

Now this is interesting.

The "two men" part clearly means there are two players that this refers to. Having a "third eye" is often meant to imply some sort of extrasensory perception, a method of seeing past what normal people are capable of. In the case of Mafia, I would think the Third Eye allows the player to see the true alignment of a player.

One Eye lies, one tells the truth. Perhaps this means that one of the Third Eyes is sane, and the other is insane.

Of course, I doubt that in a game as crazy as the Doc wants it to be, there would be two roles that are identical in function and opposite in results. These "Third Eye" people must have some sort of difference in their roles besides the obvious "liar / truth-teller" dichotomy.

On December 01 2010 02:34 Barundar wrote:
You forget that

was posted at the same time and could be related. Say 1 person "fell in love", and decided to fall in love with person 2, who was our Pharmocology student. By choosing person 2, person love gained his power of pharmocology.

On December 01 2010 07:13 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:

Aidnai is the best candidate right now if not for any other reason than because I said so.

Jcarlsoniv:
All he does is agree with people on speculative topics

I am currently in 3 games of mafia, in the last 3 weeks of my college semester, and I am a varsity athlete, so excuse me if people post things that I agree with before I can post them. Speculative topics are just that, completely speculative, and I believe a lot of the speculation that has been made is correct, so I agree with it.

Asking questions, seems unsure. Answer them yourself man.
Doesn't even give off any possible information
Scum play
So unsure of himself, "That's possible. I'm not sure he would give someone two roles though? Not sure"
Very unlike his assertive self in Salem, he hardly EVER uses "I think" or "Possibly" or "just a guess" etc
Even in Sengoku, states his opinions strongly

This is because in Salem, I know facts. In Sengoku, I know facts. I can be confident about the facts I know, and can convey this confidence. This is a game that has just started and everyone is just speculating. I cannot be sure if any of my speculations are correct, so I don't post them in a definite manner.

On December 01 2010 11:09 orgolove wrote:

Again, really? Look, one way or another, we'll get short "descriptions" of each role eventually. And then, if I think up a bullshit role that somehow doesn't have a matching description, I've immediately painted myself a big fat lynch target. Why would I do something so risky like that unless I, you know, actually got that sort of PM?


The number of attacks directed at my "reveal" really strongly hints that this has got to be a red role.

On the first night, thou may speak the truth or thou may lie. Your role may be revealed, the documents can not.

"Sometimes the day is over before you think"

Someone got caught speeding in a car.

Repetition the new epidemic of Liquidia?

all fear or love the hammer

The vote that ends the day is called "the hammer".

On December 01 2010 11:48 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
The system is corrupt.

And i think that is a hint for every role.

GG GL HF (I'm rooting for mafia and certain roles to do well, suck it town!)

On December 01 2010 12:16 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
BTW i know mod said don't roleclaim

but i'm the "jerk riddler"

my role is i have to make confusing riddles and rhymes to confuse everyone so i can laugh at how wrong they are about stuff

if i don't post a riddle once per day i get modkilled

On December 01 2010 16:12 kingjames01 wrote:
I had a plan to try and fill out our list, but I just asked DrH about it via PM and he said that my plan is too close to roleclaiming to be legal. Basically, my plan was for us to say whether or not our clue was in the list and if the guess about our role was correct or not. We would not say which clue nor would we be revealing what our actual role was. This was an attempt to reduce the amount of possible defenses that the mafia could try to use and also flesh out our list of roles.





I'm trying to fit it in with the clues. Maybe 'corruption' is related to the clue about the epidemic? Both words can be applied to decay.

If not, then that means our list is either incomplete or a role has been incorrectly assigned.

On December 01 2010 11:48 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
The system is corrupt.

And i think that is a hint for every role.

GG GL HF (I'm rooting for mafia and certain roles to do well, suck it town!)

On December 02 2010 01:07 ~OpZ~ wrote:
13 is zombie not brain surgeon. I don't want to discuss blues because they aren't important. What is important is finding scum. Now stop discussing them.
##Vote: kingjames01

On December 02 2010 02:02 Pandain wrote:
What the heck guys. It's like I'm not actually here and people don't actually respond to my pointing out that people are voting aidnai for no reason.

I want everyone who voted Aidnai to give reasons why they did, or immediate FoS on them(even more so, at least)

On December 02 2010 02:13 ~OpZ~ wrote:
And why was this post ignored?

On December 02 2010 05:27 Coagulation wrote:
im pretty sure that fishballs role requires him to get lynched.

On December 02 2010 13:46 kingjames01 wrote:
Coagulation, we have an issue of whether or not we can trust the DT checks. Based on the clues, there should be two DTS - "one tells the truth and the other lies."

We should try to establish the truthfulness of your and Barundar's checks. By the way, your role is pretty insane... =)

As has been suggested previously, if you both check the same person then we can try to establish which of you is the liar and which is not.

On December 02 2010 16:08 Barundar wrote:
what will stop jcarlsoniv from turning red when he dies?

On December 03 2010 02:44 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
One strikes with the hammer the other with an axe.

One strikes back, the other strikes early

im annoyed by how far off everyone is with these hammer clues, damn

These two concepts are related but not identical. I don't completely understand the phrase strikes back. It makes me think of retaliation. Maybe the person who almost cast the last vote yesterday was actually mafia and would have been killed by the hammer.

On December 03 2010 08:12 ghrur wrote:


I think you guys are relying way to much on pharmacists. So we know they exist, but do we know how many? 1? Maybe 2? I mean, it's a 15 person game, it isn't that big. If Mafia has 2 KPs and aims for both Coag and Barundar, I'm thinking we just lost 1 DT night one. The thing is... why did you guys claim night 1? >_< And Fishball, making Decond would be WAYYYYY to OP to mafia. There are already 3 members, if they only need 4 to lynch every other day, then they can basically screw town over every other day. No way Decond's mafia if his roleclaim is true.

Anyway, I feel like we should be scum hunting, but i'm not so sure about my suspects anymore. I say there's no way Decond's mafia. jcarlsoniv, idk, he seems uncharacteristically held back for someone who basically can't die, but on the other hand, there's no way mafia would volunteer to lynch themselves (WIFOM not included in the argument). I'm just keeping a watch on Aidnai right now. =/ I have another thought; I guess I'll wait until morning to make an accusation if anything. :p

On December 03 2010 11:16 Node wrote:
Jcarlson, your role is unable to do anything until you have died, correct?

On December 03 2010 12:50 kingjames01 wrote:
I used to get excited waiting for the Day/Night posts... F5ing over and over until they appeared... Then I joined Sengoku.

On December 03 2010 13:07 DoctorHelvetica wrote:


Orgolove was found with gunshot wounds to the chest and shoulders in the parking lot of the mall. No one else died that night.

As the ambulance took him away, Orgolove got up and walked out the back of the speeding vehicle. After tumbling a great distance he got up and began walking the streets as an undead.

The next day has begun.

On December 03 2010 13:51 ghrur wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +

Nah, I have hardly any doubts on you right now. Your defense was adequate, your volunteering for lynch is uncharacteristic of mafia, I'm just stupid. xP

On December 03 2010 20:04 Barundar wrote:

http://mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=Executioner

Fishball does look like the best lynch candidate though.

On December 03 2010 22:45 Coagulation wrote:
EBWOP



ok orgolove i know your town now i just wanted to point out that im also confirmed town before i say this.

please think very carefully about pushing a bandwagon on fishball. If he is town then he will be the easiest lynch to pull off for mafia based on his behavior.
It is extremely likely that they hit you because they feared both meds DTs would be protected due to roleclaims and they had no better snipe options

they seen fishball is highly suspected/incriminated town player in game
and then hit the person who campaigned against him the hardest.

they get to deliver a lynch + chance to snipe medic.

Coag, you may be confirmed town, but you came up green, not blue. If you're green, wouldn't you be roleless, and thus not the DT?
do not make this easy on them.

On December 04 2010 00:02 Fishball wrote:


No I hate you all, and I'm achieving what I want to achieve so I'm happy with that.

But remember I said I have two things to announce? Since more people have spoken up, here it is.

1. I got a PM from DH; Someone "whispered me" another players role. This matches Coagulation's claim. Yes, there is a possibility that this could be a Mafia role and he can plant false messages, but to be honest, it does not seem likely, at least at this point of the game.
Punch line: I know who Coagulation checked, and the role of said person, given that he is indeed a DT, and there is no extra twist (sanity issues etc.)

2. Remember where I asked Lebron to quote "jcarlsoniv" on his claim since I missed it? I waited till Night to end so I can bring this up. Very damn conveniently, based on the lines DH provided us thus far, I have a spirit inside of me too! My power is activated upon being lynched. Hmm, this sounds very familiar... Unless DH has two roles with "OooOo Spirits inside them", or one of these roles were meant for another hint/clue/lead/guide/pointer/sign/trace, jcarlsoniv is lying.
I also like how jcarlsoniv said "don't lynch me just yet, I would like to see how other people think". I for one don't care if people lynch me or not, hence I never gave a crap on Day 1. I would have voted for myself if I could, which I actually tried.

On December 04 2010 00:55 LSB wrote:

Very risky, remeber, they probably checked a doctor. And fishball is very certantly not lieing
I'd rather it go, Fishball reveals the role. Coag Decides whether or not to flip who it is.

On December 04 2010 05:17 Fishball wrote:
Alright, time for some action.



@ Coagulation - No, I will not be converted, I will not come back to life, I will die. Let me word it this way. If I get lynched, and I am still alive, feel free to kill me again.



@ jcarlsoniv - This cannot get more typical. Out of all reasons, you choose "you're not helping town, you have to die". We've seen this a million times, where Mafia tries to soft play and blend in with their vote, killing an innocent while wasting the Town's lynch. Also, you haven't even replied to the contradiction of your claim to mine at all.



@ Aeres - Think of it. If I weren't in the interest of town, why would I reveal two pieces of crucial information? That I know who Coagulation checked and the role of said player, and pointing out jcarlsoniv's role is contradicting with mine? Why would I want to draw more myself further more into the middle of attention? If I die and flip Mafia, everything I say can be disregarded. Why would I want to put myself in such position and waste my own effort, and get myself killed in the process? Think about it.

With that being said, keep your vote on me.



@ Barundar - Coagulation is NOT the preacher. I am. I will not further reveal my role, but I'm 99.99% sure I am the preacher. I'll admit I'm guilty of not reading much of DH's posts since the game started, in fact, I haven't read much of the thread at all until Day 2 started, due to my little personal experiment (which worked), and slack.

This is one of DH's comment:



Which means everyone so far was off with his clues regarding the Hammer. Now time for my turn.

The Hammer is the person who voted last during a lynch, the person who activated the kill.
This is what DH said:
"A teacher and a preacher, a mouse and a house all fear or love the hammer "

Basically, it means there are 4 players that have their roles tied with the lynch. Now I have two different understandings regarding this statement.
1. Among these 4 players, some benefits from the hammer, some don't.
2. Among these 4 players, some can be the hammer (as in voting last), some can't. Why do I say that? Because my role description prohibits me from being the hammer, or I will be mod-killed. (Oh I just revealed more of my role!)

I think it's likely #2. It would be hard to benefit if you are lynched and dead. Yes, a player might have certain abilities that occurs upon being lynched, but that doesn't really benefit the player in any way, since he is dead. He can't play anymore. The term "fear" and "love" is also hard to apply in this case.

If it were #2, everything would make sense. Certain players have to be the hammer every time, and some can never be the hammer, like me.

I suggest everyone to closely observe the voting patterns from here on. Even if the town figure who these 4 players are, we'll still need to figure out the alignment from these players.

---

Here are my top suspects for now.
1. jcarlsoniv - Instant kill if I were a vigilante.
2. Orgolove - He can very well be a naive Townie, but coming from my perspective, he is trying too hard, way too hard. I also don't like the idea of the Zombie role coming back to life. Let me ask you people something. What do Zombies eat? Brains. Who has Brains? The other players.

Regarding the rest of the players, it's just quite hard and too many to get a read right now. Hell I haven't even been tracking the lurkers.

Barundar/Coagulation - Now regarding the quote "Two men with a third eye, one tells the truth and the other lies", we don't know if DH means sane/insane, or deliberately lying from the players. Let's assume Barundar and SR (who is dead) are the two men with a third eye, we still can't throw out the fact that we can't put Barundar in the clear just yet. If it is Barundar and Coagulation that has the third eye, same scenario applies. I'm not exactly pointing fingers at anyone here, but certain players can't just ignore certain facts and make a conclusion.

deconduo - I don't know. He claims he is the Axe and have ended the Day early. Everything makes sense, but something just doesn't add up with the Hammer thing. I'll have to think about it more later.

On December 04 2010 01:14 jcarlsoniv wrote:


Your power may be activated upon lynch, mine is just activated upon my death, no matter the cause. My role isn't very special, so if I can avoid dying for no cause, I would like that. I asked for people to hold off voting for me until a DT check comes back because I was afraid people would just start voting me when day started before we had any information. I don't want to die, but if it will verify a DT, I am more than willing to do so.

P.S. A role that is activated upon lynch only sounds not friendly for town.

On December 04 2010 05:39 Fishball wrote:
One thing I just noticed after reading the last page.

kingjames or someone, can you help me do a count on the clues regarding each roles. Do they add up to 15? (One per player)

The way I see it, the quote "A teacher and a preacher, a mouse and a house all fear or love the hammer " is just an extra hint regarding the relationship between certain players and the hammer, on top of the 15 role clues.

This is why I claimed Preacher and Spirit, I think they are the same role.

On December 05 2010 02:55 Coagulation wrote:
gl town your gonna need it. i will explain my actions post game

On December 05 2010 03:19 jcarlsoniv wrote:


Uh oh...this worries me.

On December 05 2010 03:32 orgolove wrote:
So on day one there was just one KP, but on day 2 there's 3 KP?

On December 05 2010 13:15 ~OpZ~ wrote:

I said kinda, and why wouldn't a mafia go after him so hard?

He had arguably a decent amount of scummy posts day one, and then you apologized crazily. You laughed he used a role wrongly. I dunno....seems cockily teasing to me. You been rather jocular all game actually, besides your posts with him. Your last posts have been pretty spammy, and not to mention you haven't done anything since posting analysis on Decoundo. Dr. H didn't post the final vote counts in the last day post, which is kinda messing with me.

Aidnai stopped posting too.

Jcarl needs to explain why lynching him would be bad for the town. If its bad for the town, then we don't want to do it, but how would not telling us why benefit the mafia.

Don't have much done on Annul, his arguments with KJ scrambled my brains a little, but it was completely irrelevant.

And why couldn't Aeres vote fishball either. Peculiar.

On December 06 2010 04:12 annul wrote:
next, KJ tries to use our argument as a vehicle to suspect i am mafia? he is just as guilty - if not more so - of any beef we have. he started the garbage up in sengoku and he continues the garbage here. so he uses this as a predicate to attack me?

he is not the "insane detective". i am. and i know that node is a green. thats it, so why would i come out? waste of a DT really. but now the town wants to attack me and i need to save my ass. the ghrur/KJ connection is pretty obvious.

i have one check remaining, then i run out of DT power. keep me alive and tonight i will return a verdict on ghrur. KJ is very good at writing a whole bunch of convincing shit while being utterly incorrect and misleading - i know this for a 100% fact now. i was on his ass forever and now hes taking an opportunity to lynch me because i hate him. im not the mafia - he is. and so is ghrur, probably.

in the meanwhile because KJ is an obvious liar,

##vote kingjames01

On December 06 2010 05:01 annul wrote:
i said i only had that information, not that that was all i have checked. think about it, two nights to check, one target, hmmmm maybe one of my checks is dead?

LSB was my other check.

of course i am asking for a reprieve, because i am not mafia, and now i know for sure that you are. is there any other time in the game that a player is going to ask for a reprieve other than when people are on their ass for day lynch? think about it.

i hate you because you are ridiculously incendiary for no reason. your arguments are always very offensive, even if you deny this until the end. our fight in sengoku (which, by the way, your 50 pages of accusations turned out to be false, go figure)... our fighting here... all you do is cause problems. and ghrur conveniently overlooks the mutuality of it all. it really is interesting.

my "proof" is who do you believe more? there are two competing claims. you claimed insane DT and called me out. i am the true insane DT. i really do not know why you did this, because when i do flip town, you die tomorrow. its a weird sacrifice that i do not understand. but nevertheless, it is true; i am town, and if he is saying otherwise, he must be mafia.

also, you never showed "proof" either - you posted a chain of convenient situations that somehow makes you the insane DT. this is hilarious because now i know PRECISELY what you are capable of doing while red. any future games, i will trust you 0%.

so if i die today, when i flip blue (green i guess in this game ;\), look at KJ and look next at ghrur. and if i dont die today, i will check ghrur out tonight.

KJ has a history of making very long posts that sound great and look nice but ultimately are full of logical holes. do not let him win this time.

On December 06 2010 05:59 annul wrote:
"ive been told" - what?

it was KJ who is pulling this garbage out this time. he is mafia and lying and is targeting me, specifically, because of the reaction he knows i will have.

yes, when i run out of juice i can do limited things. obviously i would say what they were if i didnt think it was a dumb idea to do so. presuming i do live i dont want people knowing what it is, because then they can possibly prevent it from happening.

furthermore, "the free pass to kill who i want" is fallacious. IF i were mafia (which i am not), mafia is going to be able to kill tonight all the same... so people are gonna die tonight no matter what, why would killing me (or, in the actual case, any mafia to begin with) stop that from happening?

On December 06 2010 09:45 ghrur wrote:
Annul, at least counterclaim fully if you're going to say that you're the insane DT and not KJ. Right now, your counterclaim doesn't even give us enough information to believe you. What clue points to your role? What're your other minor abilities? Why does your role "run out of juice?" Why wouldn't you be willing to fully claim to kill a mafia member? What is the name of your role? Come on, unless you tell us all those, are you seriously expecting us to believe your counterclaim over KJ's claim? Furthermore, your description of a role is nowhere to be found on Mafia Wiki. From the roles seen before, every role has an equivalent on Mafia Wiki. Why would you suddenly get a mash-up of a temporary insane DT followed by random "weaker" powers that you won't even share with us? I think this is just a last ditch attempt to confuse town and escape from your lynch.

##Vote Annul

On December 07 2010 09:44 ghrur wrote:


Decond's dead.
Okay... if we still have 2 pharmacologists, then is jcarl lying? Because we have 6 remaining.
If we have:
1 insane
1 veteran
2 pharmacologists
1 spirit
then we'd have to have 5 blue and 2 red, this doesn't add up, what?

On December 07 2010 11:04 orgolove wrote:
I think I agree about the red pharmacist. One of the 3 deaths had claimed that he had a pill and won't die.

That would also account for the seemingly weird role count right now.

On December 07 2010 12:34 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:
Your evolving jcarl! Don't be sad, it means you are getting better :D