EPTPenalty Mafia
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Ace
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/in | ||
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With basically no information needless to say we are in a bad position to start off. But fear not! Based on reading my role PM I can make some guesses as to what's possibly a good idea. I think my role, while not powerful is potentially good enough to almost break the game if my hunch is correct. Let me think about what other possible penalties are available. | ||
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Looking at what we know town has almost no information at all. Not even what roles are in the game or a count. All we have is that there are 3 scum in the game. I know for sure though that the town has to have a Vigilante. Based on this I need everyone to chime in because of something pretty awesome. We don't have to roleclaim, but it's in our best interests to publicly announce what our penalty is if we have one. I'll share how we'll go about this when more players start posting. | ||
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Chaoser we have 10 townies and 3 scum. 7 townies vs 3 scum is like, uber ridiculous. | ||
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On August 08 2010 10:17 citi.zen wrote: I think everyone but the mafia has a penalty: If all the townies have penalties but scum don't then we have to have some kind of overpowered roles. Either way this is pretty good news. I know scum have fake claims but I think we can figure this out. | ||
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You know you're terrible if on Day 1 in every game you play you are close to getting lynched. | ||
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On August 08 2010 16:03 Bill Murray wrote: Oh god help me I'm so confused qq :'( It's all starting to make sense now. | ||
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On August 08 2010 16:12 Pyrrhuloxia wrote: Hmm so I guess we have a list of Ace and BM with a mafia in it? Although Ace seems to be hinting that he will argue BM is a confused/insane DT sort of role. never said that either. Why are you making things up?  | ||
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You should know better than that. | ||
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On August 08 2010 16:23 Pyrrhuloxia wrote: I said seems to, meaning that was how I interpreted it. What did you mean then? You quoted BM's unedited post but completely changed the words to something about him being confused. BM's claiming that he has been given your name as mafia as part of his role PM. You are denying that you are mafia, but you don't seem to immediately jump on BM as mafia. So you must be thinking he is mistaken? I was mocking Bill Murray. If I believe someone is Mafia I'll make it clear as day. I don't soft claim or jump around to conclusions so fast. | ||
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On August 08 2010 16:28 Pyrrhuloxia wrote: But that's not really important- maybe you don't speak as cautiously as me. Let's get down to the real business, Ace. What is your reaction to Bill Murray's claim that he has been given your name as mafia? ? Where did he claim that? He hasn't. Even if he did why would I care and why would you? I know I'm not scum, and if you've ever read a game with Bill Murray in it you know he throws out at least 6 scum accusations per day. | ||
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Ace
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Where has Bill Murray said I'm scum. Don't just assume because you asked him to do that he followed it because he knows what he's doing. If you are so sure that Bill Murray in fact did what you said because he is sure I'm scum you wouldn't even be discussing this with me - you'd be trying to rally the town to vote me off because I'd be confirmed scum. He's bullshitting around and for some reason you're trying awfully hard to make his penalty which is allegedly a post restriction a finger pointing to me being scum. You've already asked him once, no need to ask him to do it again involving Divinek. He did what you asked him to do once already, so either you believe him that I'm definitely scum and you stop talking to me and get the town to vote me off, or you think he is bullshitting in which case you've got no reason to even ask him to do it again. What's going on over there, you sure aren't acting logical right now. | ||
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But I'm wondering why you have so much stock invested in his decision if this is a well known fact. You've obviously seen him play before so why would you even think he'd seriously be doing something smart. Like I said you should have believed him from the first time if you are trying to actually find scum. Imo it looks like you're just fishing for time. It's very simple, you either believe Bill Murray or you don't. If you do, then one of us is scum for sure and this discussion ends, because the first person the detective will investigate is you. | ||
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P.S. - I don't care if I die, I don't get mad or take this game seriously. Anyway here is the full plan now that we have more people here. 1.) Knowing what I know about my own role PM, I know my role is almost surely weak. As in if I ever acted out my role the town would lose because it not only stops me from role claiming but I'm the worst person in this game to get this kind of role. The only way this role would work is if I had a hidden condition the mod didn't give me. Being that I can't know that and even if I did it would still be somewhat underpowered... 2.) The town has to have a Vigilante or some kind of night killing role. It would be damn near impossible to confirm innocents if all the town players have penalties. However here's where our only known advantage at the moment comes in: This setup also has another twist in it; all Townies (not mafia) will have specific penalties that either diminish strength of one's ability or simply anti-town. No post restriction bs though. This tells us 2 things: The town roles have penalties and the scum don't. Even with a safe fake claims from the mod we know this to be true and I'll get back to this soon. Secondly we know Bill Murray is bullshitting and this makes me even more suspicious of Pyrr. Bill Murray can't have a post restriction because the op says there aren't any!. So why are people seriously pointing fingers at me for nonsense when the "proof" Bill Murray is offering is banned by the very OP of the game? Good question if I do say so myself. Back to the penalty claims. If any townies have penalties then you'll know based on your OWN role PM which penalties should make sense when we all claim them. We should all reveal our penalties in a way that doesn't make it blatantly obvious what our roles are since even Vanilla Townies have penalties. For example this is my penalty in a nutshell: Anything I do must be telegraphed to the rest of the player base if it is a valid action. If you're town-aligned and you have a similar penalty you should be able to understand what that means. If you don't as more people claim their penalties we'll start to make sense of this. The idea here is that penalties that the town have should make sense in the game because we know our roles are weakened. With this in mind once everyone penalty claims before anyone else dies then we have all 13 players information. Once someone dies and their roles is revealed we scratch their penalties out we can start making sense of what other penalties would be in the game that could possibly make it balanced. Oh before I forget so you guys don't try and kill me off of some bullshit. ## vote Pyrr | ||
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Aside from Bill Murray talk about the mass penalty claim. | ||
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And if we aren't going to mass penalty claim then what do you think we should do? | ||
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On August 09 2010 07:37 Pyrrhuloxia wrote: "If any townies have penalties then you'll know based on your OWN role PM which penalties should make sense when we all claim them." I don't agree - I have no idea what to expect in other penalties and I don't see how claiming them will make certain people stand out. It might help us plan some strategies but it might help the mafia, too. What if someone's penalty is that they can't do anything till night 4? Then the mafia knows to avoid that person until night 3 and kill them then. What if the penalties for townies look a lot different from the penalties for blues? That could bite us in the ass. If someone's penalty is they can't do anything until night 4 thats great. Because then we can remove them from any actions that happen at night, and if they still live on Night 4 we ask them to prove their action. Obviously if you can't act until Night 4 which would be ridiculous in any mafia game you've gotta have something damn near game breaking. So if the scum want to let that person until night 3 that's cool with me because before that said person better be going all out doing some intelligent scum hunting. But even all of this is moot because I did say don't make it too obvious what your role could be. On death once your role is revealed we can piece everything together. It doesn't even matter if Vanilla penalties look different than blue penalties - we just need a list of penalties period to even move forward. So what if it helps the mafia? Would you rather the town not have any direction on where to go and just stumble around mindlessly? It's like complaining that Terran's are making infantry knowing that Zerg has lurkers. Execution of the plan is just as important as the plan itself. If you don't agree come up with a better idea because I'm all ears. @divinek: now you're starting to get it ^_^ We KNOW for a fact that townies have restrictions and scum don't. They only have fake claims the host gave them. So if we are aware of our own penalties and KNOW that we have to behave a certain way then we can't do things that go against our PM where as scum can because theirs are fake. They can't fake their actions because once we see what most people's penalties look like and people start dying the picture becomes very clear. | ||
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On August 09 2010 08:48 bumatlarge wrote: Alright basically, I am a tree stump. If I use my power, I cannot die, and cannot vote. BUT if I use it, town pop goes down 1, and mafia pop goes up by 1. I.E. if i used it right now, town population would be 9 and mafia count would be 4. Im assuming that, if all the mafia are lynched out, then town wins regardless. There are no PMs allowed, so I cant accept mass roleclaim, so I dont really see a reason for me to use it anyway. ##Vote Bill Murray I figured you had some kind of tree stump role. Thats a really fucked up penalty tho. Jesus there has to be an overpowered town role somewhere. Either way don't stump and just stay normal townie ^_^ | ||
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On August 09 2010 09:09 Divinek wrote: why is the logic that way? why cant it be the other way around, i was going to go into some big thing of explaining propositional calculus to you and other people but im sure that would just confuse people more. infact why does it have to go either way at all for sure. Surely there can be reasons for them both being mafia, or one and not the other...or even oddly enough neither i suppose Pyrr's action earlier in the day (his arguments + vote on me) suggests that he figures BM had a penalty of a post restriction. Bill Murray kept voting for me based on this assumption Pyrr had. We know for a fact that based on the OP this role restriction doesn't exist. This means that Bill Murray is lying, or isn't even trying to clarify his position. If he's lynched we know he's scum or just someone playing like a shitty townie. Regardless of if Pyrr is scum I think LSB is saying for now try and resolve what's going in with Bill Murray. From that IF Bill Murray were to flip scum, then there would be strong evidence that Pyrr tried to force a false penalty through which would have gotten me killed. Bill Murray having this "false" post restriction would be in the clear anyway since he can't even explain himself anyway and Pyrr could have just worded his assumption wrong. ## vote Bill Murray I'm still highly suspicious of Pyrr because I put more stock in his intelligence than to take Bill Murray's posting seriously. | ||
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Yes really. Remember Bill Murray voted for me without any explanation, and then Pyrr came up with the idea that Bill Murray's penalty might be he can get results of scum without talking about it. Then he asked Bill Murray twice to prove it through vote switches and then switching back on to me. Bill Murray did it and hence we had Bill Murray's penalty. Did I misread some posts or get the order of events wrong? | ||
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1.) Knowing what I know about my own role PM, I know my role is almost surely weak. As in if I ever acted out my role the town would lose because it not only stops me from role claiming but I'm the worst person in this game to get this kind of role. The only way this role would work is if I had a hidden condition the mod didn't give me. Being that I can't know that and even if I did it would still be somewhat underpowered... 2.) The town has to have a Vigilante or some kind of night killing role. It would be damn near impossible to confirm innocents if all the town players have penalties. However here's where our only known advantage at the moment comes in: This tells us 2 things: The town roles have penalties and the scum don't. Even with a safe fake claims from the mod we know this to be true and I'll get back to this soon. Secondly we know Bill Murray is bullshitting and this makes me even more suspicious of Pyrr. Bill Murray can't have a post restriction because the op says there aren't any!. So why are people seriously pointing fingers at me for nonsense when the "proof" Bill Murray is offering is banned by the very OP of the game? Good question if I do say so myself. Back to the penalty claims. If any townies have penalties then you'll know based on your OWN role PM which penalties should make sense when we all claim them. We should all reveal our penalties in a way that doesn't make it blatantly obvious what our roles are since even Vanilla Townies have penalties. For example this is my penalty in a nutshell: Anything I do must be telegraphed to the rest of the player base if it is a valid action. Based on this post can you tell me what my role is? | ||
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Bill Murray is known to be terrible. He plays town in an extremely anti-town matter. I believe that Pyrr indeed does know this which is why I found it suspicious he would think that BM really does have a penalty. If you know the kind of player BM is then this is why I find Pyrr trying to rationalize BM's actions as highly scummy. If say, someone like Divinek popped in and voted for me, then Pyrr tried to figure out if this was his penalty I'd take it as a townie trying to figure something out. Regardless since I know I'm not scum, I already know that even if the OP didn't ban post restrictions Bill Murray was lying. | ||
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On August 09 2010 09:55 Pyrrhuloxia wrote: Well I'm not certain that it's a bad idea at this point. But if it is, we can always analyze behavior and have blues act silently and, you know, play the game. What do you think I've been doing all this time? I don't just throw things out and ignore behavior. If you haven't noticed I put things together precisely because of behavior. This plan isn't the end all scum catcher - it's here to point us in the right direction. Silent blues are terrible. Please don't spread that bad idea. | ||
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On August 09 2010 09:58 LSB wrote: Looks like your making the same mistake that BM did I want the town to lynch BM, and work from there. Where's the mistake? Hessmyrr's post doesn't say that penalties are tied to roles. I also know that from my role PM my penalty is NOT tied to my role. Likewise if you looked at bumatlarge's penalty claim his tree stump ability is also NOT tied to his penalty of upping scum population.You're making bad assumptions. | ||
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On August 09 2010 10:00 citi.zen wrote: Why are we so sure penalties are not linked to roles? From what I've seen, and knowing my penalty, people with a blue role have penalties pertaining to that role (ex: can't use power Y unless X happens). Greens can't have that type of penalty. Telling everyone "I can't use my power unless X" means you are blue = pleasant sniping reds. So I'd advise you to reconsider, unless you think some sort of mass role-claim is a good play. In some set-ups that is the case, in this one I personally haven't come to that conclusion. I'll admit that, as usual, I don't pay close attention on weekends, am I missing something? no need for role claims yet, just penalties. Like I said I gave you all my penalty and if you all think it's that simple then tell me what my role is ^_^ Look at bumatlarge's penalty claim: no one would know he was a tree stump (role) based on the fact that acting increases mafia population by 1 (penalty). The idea that penalties implies roles is false based on bumatlarge's post and the fact that my penalty also does not imply my role. | ||
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On August 09 2010 10:02 Pyrrhuloxia wrote: His tree stump ability, if used, ups the scum population. How could those two be any more linked, when there is a direct causal link between them? I think you're misunderstanding. The TREE STUMP role has nothing to do with upping scum population. If bumatlarge said "my penalty ups scum population" no one in the history of mafia would know he was a tree stump. It has nothing to do with his role. Get it now? | ||
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On August 09 2010 09:39 zeks wrote: i'm up for the penalty posting basically when i'm lynched, a random person is picked out of the people who voted for me, and that person gets permanent +1 vote to all future lynch votes no matter what yeah i'm not very useful oh dear :/. A random person or random [/b]townie?[/b]. Check the wording very carefully. If it's a random person that's pretty terrible. If it's a random townie that sucks also but we can have possibly have a confirmed townie. Penalties: Ace : Must telegraph moves to the town before acting bumatlarge: If acting mafia population goes up by 1, town population goes down by 1 zeks: If lynched, random person(?) on the wagon gets permanent +1 voting power @bumatlarge: Does the PM tell you how the population works? Like do mafia basically get a townie recruited into their ranks or is it some other way it works? | ||
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On August 09 2010 10:04 citi.zen wrote: That's just it: he has to use his "ability" = he has an "ability". So he's some sort of blue that just got outed. Being BLUE doesn't matter. You are looking at it wrong. Everyone has a role. EVERYONE. Ignore anything about blue roles for now. We only care about PENALTIES. If bumatlarge didn't tell you he was a tree stump you would never know. zeks just told us his penalty, do you know his role? I told you my penalty, do you know my role? See where I'm going now. also *yawn* at Pyrr. I didn't out any blues but nice job at trying to spread some panic. I hope the Vigilante or whatever killing role we have shoots you asap. | ||
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On August 09 2010 10:12 citi.zen wrote: Are you claiming there are no vanilla townies? Not at all. Reading the OP: This setup also has another twist in it; all Townies (not mafia) will have specific penalties that either diminish strength of one's ability or simply anti-town. No post restriction bs though. If you are town you have a penalty. Doesn't matter if you are blue or green. Scum have fake penalties. # vote Pyrr Bill Murray may be an idiot, but I'm pretty certain you're scum. | ||
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On August 09 2010 10:16 Divinek wrote: [/b][/b]um ace i think only yours out of that list is a penalty because the op says if you violate your penalty 3 timse you get mod killed and the latter 2 are one use abilities and have no way of being violated eh? It's still a penalty even if it's only 1 use. That doesn't change the fact. I also can't violate my penalty either. | ||
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I'm still of the idea one of the town players has an insanely broken killing role. Also Pyrr is scum, leave Bill Murray for a DT to investigate. | ||
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On August 09 2010 10:20 Divinek wrote: [/b][/b]what are you saying it's impossible to not telegraph a move before doing it Exactly. Just make sure you read carefully. | ||
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Does bumatlarge's penalty DIMINISH his tree stump ability? It doesn't. It's simply ANTI-TOWN. Highlight the entire quote and READ. | ||
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On August 09 2010 10:23 bumatlarge wrote: No, town victory is still my win condition, and for all intents and purposes I have to want town to win. They basically get another mafia who cant die until they do. hmmm ok I think I get it. | ||
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There are only so many times you can ignore lies | ||
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On August 09 2010 10:39 LSB wrote: What that tells the mafia is that the medic has an ability that can be used at night. The mafia won't know if the medic is a DT, or a Bus Driver, or a Vig, or a Medic. But all they will know is that they should kill the medic before night 2. It sounds like your part of the mafia, trying to get a nice hit list. wrong. You don't know it's a medic. You've only seen the penalty. How does telling the town you can act on certain nights imply you're a medic? Explain, especially since any sane person's first thought would be Vigilante. | ||
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If bumatlarge didn't tell you he was a tree stump NONE of you would have known. You don't know my role. You don't know zek's role. All townies have penalties regardless of "blue" or "green". Action does not imply blue. This is a simple case of reading and you're mucking this up. If you think I'm scum then put your vote on me right now and keep it there so you can get the axe tomorrow. Do it. | ||
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On August 09 2010 10:44 LSB wrote: What that tells the mafia is that the person has an ability that can be used at night. The mafia won't know if the person is a DT, or a Bus Driver, or a Vig, or a Medic. But all they will know is that they should kill the medic before night 2. and how will they find said medic? They can't because they don't know who the medic is. They just know penalties. Once again penalties do not imply roles. If it does then tell me my role, and tell zeks his role if you believe this. And Pyrr is mafia. Stop voting for Bill Murray and deal with him tomorrow. | ||
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On August 09 2010 10:44 Pyrrhuloxia wrote: Did you read what LSB said? I think you did. Why would we be okay with giving away our vigilante? Vigi or medic, either way mafia knows it is someone to hit because they have a night action. Bullshit post to scare townies from penalty claiming. | ||
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@chaoser: You can't know who's blue. Everyone has a role. Everyone has a penalty. I've already said that if anyone is so sure that knowing penalties will reveal who is blue then tell me what roles myself and zeks have if it's that simple. Lol @ LSB and Pyrr. Put your votes where your mouth is so I can destroy you. The problem with being smarter than everyone else is that it takes my death to make people realize why I am so feared in this game. Let's get it! | ||
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On August 09 2010 10:52 Pyrrhuloxia wrote: Not all penalties imply roles. ##vote Ace Exactly. So if you know this to be true, why would you be against penalty claiming. You just admitted we can't figure out who's role is what based on penalties Hi scum :D | ||
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On August 09 2010 11:02 Divinek wrote: ace i was just asking for like a formal presentation of your reasoning against pyrr oh ok. Do you want like, an entire breakdown of Day 1 with all my logical queries and conclusions, with big picture breakdown + small quips or do you want the simple one paragraph stuff where I say he's scum and just quote some of his nonsense? | ||
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[Shy Townie] You are Townie! however you are shy and likes to avoid a crowd. You cannot vote for player with highest number of votes at that moment (it is fine if the player you have once voted becomes the one with the highest vote). The role is Townie. The action is you can't vote for a certain player. If I only told you that you can't vote(the action) for a certain player (the penalty) you have no idea that the role is Townie. You are Townie! You are also terrified of mafia lurking in the night, so must choose one person to visit every night (it will be randomly determined in case no decision was given). If mafia targets you on that night, you will be intercepted on the way to your target and will die alone. The role is Townie once again. The action is visiting a player at night. The penalty is if you're caught visiting someone by mafia you die. Looking at both penalties, how could you know whether the person is blue or green? You can't. The people coming up with this nonsense are bullshitting. | ||
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1.) The link to the tree stump role has already been revealed. Tree stump can talk. 2.) No one is putting pressure on anyone to reveal roles. I've only asked for penalties. You yourself even stated that penalties do not imply roles here where I called you out on it: On August 09 2010 11:01 Ace wrote: Exactly. So if you know this to be true, why would you be against penalty claiming. You just admitted we can't figure out who's role is what based on penalties Hi scum :D So you've just contradicted your stance again within one day. there have been no slip ups of information but thanks for taking another shot at me while you had the chance. Even throwing all of that out of the window there is another odd little situation I noticed: Before I revealed my plan and Bill Murray voted on me you were so gung ho in figuring out Bill Murray's penalty. So when I revealed my plan why did you all of a sudden change your stance on revealing penalties? Surely if you thought it was a bad idea then you wouldn't have been trying to figure out what Bill Murray's penalty is. Secondly you've done a very fast flip to vote on Bill Murray with no good reasoning. All he did was deny your points and vote for you. You on the other hand opened up with this little gem to undermine him: you don't get to fuck the town over all day, show up and claim its my fault How many times are you going to do that? He never even claimed it was your fault. Hell the town isn't even "fucked up" or in a bad position. The town is actually in a pretty good state right now considering other games we've all played in. But then to make it worse I was going to throw my scum tally on you to the side for a second. But every time you open your mouth you say something that even a confused townsperson wouldn't say. Like this: I wasn't as worried about you because I thought you might be blue BECAUSE YOU WERE FUCKING LYING, ASSHOLE. Er? So if you knowingly thought Bill Murray might be blue...but you were up in arms against my plan because you felt it would reveal blues...then why did you try to derive BM's penalty? In fact, if you knew he was lying isn't that a very good cause to be worried? Wait a sec - how did you know he was lying Pyrr? | ||
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Penalties: Ace : Must telegraph moves to the town before acting bumatlarge: If acting mafia population goes up by 1, town population goes down by 1 zeks: If lynched, random person(?) on the wagon gets permanent +1 voting power Bill Murray: If he dies, a town power role dies You don't have to tell us anything about the role that dies. Just the penalty. | ||
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Penalties: Ace : Must telegraph moves to the town before acting bumatlarge: If acting mafia population goes up by 1, town population goes down by 1 zeks: If lynched, random person(?) on the wagon gets permanent +1 voting power Bill Murray: If he dies, a town power role loses their power | ||
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On August 09 2010 14:21 Pyrrhuloxia wrote: "Secondly you've done a very fast flip to vote on Bill Murray with no good reasoning." I don't need good reasoning, I'm about to get killed when someone who has lied to town all day is getting off scott free and the guy he was trying to kill doesn't give a shit. stop squirming. I've already said I'm of the idea we'll deal with Bill Murray later. I find you more suspicious though. You had the motive, situation and the behavior to do something any anti-town player would have done on Day 1 with Bill Murray in the game. | ||
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I also don't care about Pyrr's claim because I think he's scummy. If Pyrr wants to save himself he can just role claim before the lynch if shit gets that bad. Otherwise my vote stays - he's made way too many mistakes on Day 1 to be playing this bad. Also I did not chainsaw defend Bill Murray, get your terms straight if you want to be taken seriously and not looked at as scum. LSB when are you actually going to contribute anything to the town instead of trying to attack me? | ||
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:D | ||
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On August 10 2010 07:35 Pyrrhuloxia wrote: I am detective. When I am dead, go after: Ace: Mafia Bill Murray: Mafia / Ass Sorry to town for playing like shit this game. GJ Ace for defenestrating the town with a scummy plan that couldn't be argued against effectively without the blues giving themselves away. The greens will see it as harmless and jump in, isolating, identifying and FoSing the blues who will be hurt by it. Very clever. I lol'd. Let me get this straight... You are a detective right? But you must wait TWO days to act? L O L So you can't use your powers at all on Night 1, but somehow using it on Night 2 makes it all better? But you admit you played like shit this game, as if that's a reason to take sympathy on you. Ignoring your play though this is what your entire role looks like: You are a detective. Your penalty is that you can't act until Night 2. Yea, ok. Whatever. If this is true then we all might as well stop playing this game because all our roles would be so bad I don't think Hessmyrr would have even created the game. Town would have no chance due to the possibility of starting off with a good shot of 2 mislynches (2 Day 1's) and the chance of 2 power roles getting clocked before we get it straight. You're bullshitting. | ||
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On August 10 2010 07:45 Pyrrhuloxia wrote: You of all people should know that no blue confirmation plan is necessary for town to win. And once again you're putting words in my mouth. Show me where I said I'm making a blue confirmation plan. Hell, show me ANYWHERE where I've said I'm valuing blue roles over green? | ||
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On August 10 2010 07:52 bumatlarge wrote: I believe he said his actions dont get registered til two days after, which is long time for such a small game, Id imagine mafia have some harsh penalties to compensate. Like no KP :D one can hope. That's the thing, the mafia don't have any penalties. @Pyrr: You know if you really wanted to save yourself you'd be trying to convince the rest of the town to change their vote. Not me. But you don't even seem like you care about living so if you die to a lynch it's your own fault. Toodles ^_^ | ||
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What's conflicting about that? | ||
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On August 10 2010 08:01 Pyrrhuloxia wrote: If I don't get lynched, you just kill me tonight before I can use my role. If I die, people see why your plan was scummy and apparently that's the wake up call this town needs because they've been ignoring logic from LSB and I. *yawn* Stop talking to me and appeal to the town. I'm not changing my vote. Talk to everyone else and make your case if you're so innocent. Come on, this is basic Mafia gameplay 101. Stop playing like shit and man up. | ||
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On August 10 2010 08:02 citi.zen wrote: Cute. I replied, and you know it. Those examples were easy to read. If you think that's the case I'll give you a simple task: come up with an idea of your own instead of complaining. You don't have to listen to me, you can just do something yourself. | ||
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I'm no longer talking though. The rest of you can complain all you want but until you scum hunt and show something better then keep it moving. | ||
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On August 10 2010 08:55 LSB wrote: Okay scum, I'm doing this for the town Ace: BS penalty cause he's scum Bumatlarge: Tree stump Zeks: Townie Bill Murray: Townie or Red Korynne: He thankfully made his penalty really general, and he hasn't posted much so I can't tell. I think green, but I haven't found his 'penalty claim' post yet. Give me more penalties, I give you more answers There you go scum. Let's keep this straight, your plan Sucks. If I can figure roles out, a complete noob who hasn't survived the first night yet. The mafia can do it All you say is "LOL People are dumb! They can't figure it out! lol" Then the mafia can crack it. To me it sounds like a mafia honeypot Let's talk about our feelings I feel a bit queasy, cause I ate some fried stuff for dinner. I also feel a bit tired. Talking about feeling is really fun :D! Pyrr is offering himself as a sacrifice so we can take down BM. You didn't take it. Definition of Chainsaw defense. Scum defending their own by attacking someone else. I want to congratulate you scum. You pulled it off well. We know BM is scum, and you've successfully starved off his lynch in favor of Pyrr. kkthxbai You want to know what I'm contributing to the town? I'm trying to take down a known scum. Bill Murry. Your kill our DT. Congratulations. I lol'd. I find it funny that you not once even tried to appeal to the rest of the town and attacked me all of Day 1, knowing that no matter if BM or Pyrr flipped town you'd go after me. Scum much? Anyway I'm about to break this game wide open. I have a hunch and unless we've all got shitty roles this game is over. | ||
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As soon as Hessmyrr answers my PM I'll know if I can role claim or not. This game is over. | ||
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The game has 10 town and 3 scum. In a typical game of Mafia this would be slightly unbalanced in favor of the scum unless the town has a Vigilante. This is why I'm extremely sure we have a Vigilante. Otherwise this game would be ridiculous. Call this assumption 1. Now based on my own role PM, I know our roles are weakened. Taking this into account let's call the 10 vs 3 setup neutral or 0:0. When everyone's penalties came out I was wondering if all of us had negative effects. So far it seems like it. For every negative effect I subtracted 1 from the town side. My penalty bumatlarge's penalty zeks penalty So now we're at -3: 0. At this point since the Mafia have no penalties the game would be highly unbalanced in their favor. There is no way that the town from a standard game got ALL weakened abilities because this would be a bastard game: The town could never win. I highly doubt this is the case. And so I came to the conclusion my role has a hidden ability: If I visit scum at night I die. This is why I said my abilities are potentially game breaking. I can tell you what I'm going to do and if it happens to be a scum aligned player, I automatically die regardless of what else happens that night. If this assumption holds true, and I'm pretty sure it can then we've got this game finished. I can just claim who I'm going to visit ahead of time and if I come back alive the person is town aligned. If I die and there's only one kill at night you'll know I got him by scum (barring a Vigilante hit). So with that said - let's get the show on the road | ||
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Thanks for taking responsibility of the vote switch though. It almost makes you innocent in my blood stained eyes. | ||
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But if you feel disrespected or something just replace out, no one is forcing you to play the game. | ||
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*shrug* | ||
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On August 10 2010 12:24 citi.zen wrote: How can you even begin to make these calculations without knowing what other blue roles there are? Not only that, but you assume based on them that you have a "hidden ability" which may or may not make sense. I see how these claims would be convenient though, now that you're to be lynched next. *yawn* How much you wanna bet I don't get lynched? | ||
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All my logic adds up very nicely. None of you have been able to deduce any roles based on penalties and for some reason you keep skipping this point. Claim your penalties or find another way to win. It's really that simple. | ||
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:/ | ||
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I looked at my role and literally said lol ok this won't be good if I ever use it unless we have some kind of role that's overpowered for the town, this is where my "there has to be some kind of overpowered town role" came into effect. From this I started thinking about a neutral game of town/dt/medic/vigilante vs scum (with a roleblocker). Of course I have no idea there are just 3 straight scum but that didn't change the outcome: I had a 0-0 meaning neutral in terms of town-scum strength. When I thought about my role I was assuming I had to be a weak doctor, meaning if I protected any anti-town player I would die that night which is what I was trying to explain to the town Day 1 about possibly having a broken role. This is why I said it could be very good or very bad. I put myself as -1 for the town side, meaning using my powers is a loss for the town more than a gain. As soon as I saw bumatlarge's penalty I actually added -2 for him (probably even -3 was more accurate) because his penalty was super bad. In fact I almost thought he might have been scum because that was kind of out there. This had the town score at -3-0 and I already was set firm in the idea something had to give on the town side to even it up. When zeks claimed it was either a +1 for the town or -1/0 for the town. That's why I asked zeks if his penalty of someone getting a permanent +1 vote on his wagon said it went to someone or town. This was super important because if it said town zeks getting lynched would automatically confirm a townie because the next day they could vote and you'd see +2 votes on the tally. Once he admitted it said person I went v_v because that means a townie or scum on the wagon could get the vote, which means no confirmed townie which is a +1 for us. It didn't so I had put a -1 down bringing us to -4. The only way it would be a 0 is if a townie did indeed get the +1 vote. However if bumatlarge was legit AND actually stumped, and zeks got lynched and the mafia got the vote that was automatically gg. At this point I was pretty certain the town had to have some kind of epic murder role: A vigilante with an ability to kill more than one scum, a detective that could get multiple scum, or me being a weak doc that could confirm pro-town players by protecting them and not dying at night. This brought me to an interesting dilemma because I REALLY didn't want to use my powers. I was debating hard whether to gamble protecting someone and revealing the protection (leading to my death) or not doing it and letting the scum not know a medic would probably protect me. I pm'd Hessmyr too late anyway when I finally decided that I should act on my hunch of being a Weak Doc though. But back to how Day 1 played out - this was a classic case of people thinking I'm scummy because of some hidden idea I want their roles. I had already shown that essentially everyone has a role - there is no "blue" role. I just wanted everyone to claim penalties so you could HOLD everyone to their penalties and kill off the liars asap. This was a huge argument which was only surprising because I never thought of Pyrr as someone who would misread what I was saying so many times in a row and jump to conclusions. Along with him trying to find out Bill Murray's penalty early in the day, and then rejecting a mass penalty claim I just didn't think he was being legit. I actually thought he was better than that so I figured no way a pro-town Pyrr could be this ridiculous. LSB was doing the same thing as Pyrr but being even more ridiculously scared of a penalty claim. citizen was being citizen which means any game I'm in he argues about any plan I propose. I think this is the third time we've both been pro-town and he's argued about a plan I made up. Of course this didn't really set off my scumdar at all. At the end of Day 1 before the lynch my suspect list was like this: Pyrr (definite scum) Bill Murray(definite scum) LSB(highly possible) ----------- everyone else I didn't bother to read too much into yet. The only thing about Day 2 that shocked me is that nobody went back to the lynch Bill Murray train. Really what the hell happened here? This is probably the first really big town mistake that happened during the game. The second was Bill Murray claiming he was a vigilante and not shooting the first night he got a chance - that should have been the kicker right there if anyone had doubts. Of course chaoser missed his chance to shoot BM Day 2 but that doesn't explain why no one made a grand effort to right the ship and go back to Day 1. But scum deserve lots of credit for managing to not only get Bill Murray to survive after being caught lying TWICE but also just watching town kill ourselves. Even at the end of the game I had no idea that Scamp was scum because trying to figure out what the hell was going on with the votes was too confusing. Add in the fact that I couldn't even believe some of the penalties I just figured someone with a crazy penalty had to be lying. Turns out Scamp's penalty of having limited votes,which isn't even that bad at all and was one of the most harmless penalties was a fake claim. Maybe thinking against the grain was the only way to win this game. EDIT: @Hessmyrr - How was the town going to clear anyone? Between a detective that has to wait 2 days before checks, a second detective who is a gimp that relies on the first detective dying (the semi-useful one)and a medic that has to telegraph protections how is the town confirming anything? By the time Pyrr gets a check we're on DAY 3 and EVEN then he has to be right about his check. Assuming he's even right and all the usual chaos of believing him as a detective comes out and he gets the right lynch he's going to die the next night. This is also assuming I haven't been killed yet either. Pretty much you need both the medic and the DT to survive to get just the DT confirmed and then you have to pray the DT is right AND you have to hope he survives the night. That is a lot to ask for. | ||
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On August 18 2010 23:27 LSB wrote: I think the doctor is more for protection. He're what I think Hesmyrr was thinking. Day 1, random person gets killed Day 2, Pyrr goes check someone, finds if they are green or red. Claims DT. Ace's role was to protect Pyrr. If the mafia decided to hit Pyrr, they'd have to waste the next nights role. Either way, that should create at 2 confirmed townies. Confirmed Townie 1: Ace, Hesmyrr's post in the night automatically gets him confirmed When Pyrr dies, whoever he checks will be confirmed, so that would leave 2 Confirmed Townies Which would come down to lots of luck 1.)Pyrr would need to find scum with his DT check or else no point in claiming 2.) He'd then have to convince the town about this 3.)Both of us would have to survive 4.)Assuming this all happens, surely Mafia is going to trade their KP of the next night and shoot Pyrr or bank on the fact that he's going to only find a townie and shoot someone else. 5.)If I roleclaim early that I'm protecting Pyrr, they shoot me. If Pyrr's next investigation results in town they shoot him the next night and now we are just down to 1 confirmed townie and 2 scum. And this is if everything goes right. I don't see how thats such a major advantage to the town here. | ||
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Damn  | ||
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@Bill Murray: tis true. Amazingly I think both times you were scum you ended up winning when I was town. sigh | ||
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I asked like 50 times if you don't like the plan how would we go about winning the game but you couldn't give me an answer | ||
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