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On April 18 2010 15:03 nAi.PrOtOsS wrote:
Does anyone know how the roles are given out? If the roles are specifically selected by the narrator then it seems likely that more difficult roles such as mafia, and assassin would be given out a majority of mafia veteran players. I would guess that the percentage of mafia veterans that are mafia as opposed to newer players(there are 6 new players) would be significantly higher. Letting newer players have an easier roles allows them to learn the game, and not mess it up for others.
Trade secret.  It varies from game to game. Some hosts rig things more, some use totally random setups.
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I knew Bill Murray was smart, but this plan seems fool proof. Being a fool and a total newwwb I can respect that.
Altair, please leave me be when the night comes 
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...
I have returned to the thread, and I'm not quite sure why the last 2-3 pages have been spent analyzing BM's plan.
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On April 18 2010 15:00 flamewheel91 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2010 11:06 Jugan wrote:On April 18 2010 08:57 KF91 wrote:On April 18 2010 08:52 Jugan wrote:
I just wanna say i got the role that i usually am guys. i wanna see the clues already :O so bored First of all: On April 18 2010 07:26 KF91 wrote:On April 13 2010 11:22 flamewheel91 wrote:
Clues:
No clues. I will not have the time, most likely.
I don't think there will be any clues in the day posts with the deaths, unless you guys are referring to the reactions of people after the night post. O.o And second, how are we supposed to believe you that you got the role that you usually get? From what I can search, you've only played in Incognito's Mafia XVI? man you are so observant. i'm sure if you actually looked, you would be able to find out. genius. oh and speak of the devil. STUFF TO READ right after you decided to bash on me. Be more respectful.Show nested quote +On April 18 2010 13:50 Jugan wrote:
alright, just saying you should read before you start bashing on someone. ESPECIALLY to Qatol.
This is a warning.
Bill: CONSOLIDATE.
let me edit!
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Zona is afraid to post because he's too busy on IRC
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FREEAGLELAND26781 Posts
On April 18 2010 15:26 Bill Murray wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2010 15:00 flamewheel91 wrote:On April 18 2010 11:06 Jugan wrote:On April 18 2010 08:57 KF91 wrote:On April 18 2010 08:52 Jugan wrote:
I just wanna say i got the role that i usually am guys. i wanna see the clues already :O so bored First of all: On April 18 2010 07:26 KF91 wrote:On April 13 2010 11:22 flamewheel91 wrote:
Clues:
No clues. I will not have the time, most likely.
I don't think there will be any clues in the day posts with the deaths, unless you guys are referring to the reactions of people after the night post. O.o And second, how are we supposed to believe you that you got the role that you usually get? From what I can search, you've only played in Incognito's Mafia XVI? man you are so observant. i'm sure if you actually looked, you would be able to find out. genius. oh and speak of the devil. STUFF TO READ right after you decided to bash on me. Be more respectful.On April 18 2010 13:50 Jugan wrote:
alright, just saying you should read before you start bashing on someone. ESPECIALLY to Qatol.
This is a warning.
Bill: CONSOLIDATE. let me edit!
No.
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On April 18 2010 08:16 IntoTheWow wrote:
harro evelyuan LOL obvious mafia.
On April 18 2010 08:06 AcrossFiveJulys wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2010 07:58 madnessman wrote:On April 18 2010 07:42 d3_crescentia wrote:
2) BC, we can't establish DT circles in this game because there are no PMs allowed, so this strategy seems pretty invalid as well. I've already brought this up, and BC has replied. On April 18 2010 06:28 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On April 18 2010 06:12 madnessman wrote:On April 18 2010 05:47 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On April 18 2010 05:36 Zona wrote:
Hah, as I post you I see that you are still making arguments based on the idea DTs can PM. Confirmed townies are somewhat useful in a game without out of thread communications, but are a LOT LESS USEFUL THAN FINDING MAFIA. When a town member has to be publicly confirmed, the value is a lot less.
I would like you to elaborate on your "town circle" idea in this game where no town members have the ability to PM. If you truly believe you are right and I am wrong, you should have no problem explaining how it would work to benefit the town. If you are unable to figure out how a DT can create a town circle by clearing townies in this format I have no inclination to tell you. IT IS INSANELY EASY. Dropping mafia down to a list of x people is alot easier than sacrificing a DT for one red. As hey, I doubt we have 1 dt for every red. Remember, with millers around a checked red is never a confirmed red. Whereas a checked green or blue is more likely town as only 1 gf is alive to infiltrate. Assassins show up as what they are. I would have to agree with Zona and say that it seemed pretty clear cut to me that nobody besides mafia are granted the ability to PM. It'd be really complicated and confusing. If you're a special blue role (say DT), and you PM a green role, he/she would be unable to respond. If you PM a red role, is the mafia member allowed to PM you back? Mafia are given the ability to PM, but that's assuming it's for use within their own mafia circle to choose their hits. And then mafia would know you have a special blue role.. If you PM a fellow blue role, you may only start your town circle if he/she has also been granted special PMing abilities. So basically, you'd be PMing people based on a hunch that they are blue, and I suppose there's a decent chance that you end up PMing a fellow blue if you're good at behavioral analysis. But then he/she might not also have the special PM ability. And just by PMing somebody, you're giving away information that you have a special role. So yeah... flamewheel creating special PM abilities just seemed very unlikely and too complicated to moderate. Either way, I think Zona has cleared it up that forming town circles are impossible since town-aligned players don't have PM abilities. So I'm not exactly sure what you're arguing in the quote above o_O. You do not need PM's to form town circles. Seriously. Only the Dt's can form the circle effectively. I make reference to if they have the ability use it. If not you play without it, its pretty simple. In this game, with 38 players there will be anywhere between 2 and 4 dts most likely, lets for this argument say there are 3. Those 3 are able to form a circle easily. Hell, even greens can form a town circle with a bit of work, but it takes alot more work on their part than dts. I interpret this to mean that BC thinks a good plan of action would be for DT's to garner a list of confirmed townies/blue roles, and then post them publicly so as to create a 'town circle'. I've personally always thought that 'town circle' implied private communication, but I guess I'm mistaken... The thing about this plan is that it would require the DT to roleclaim later on in the game. Sure, by putting him/herself in the public sphere, medics will know who to protect. But with mafia role blocker and assassins, I don't know whether the town and DT will necessarily be in a better off position because the DT can't have guaranteed protection. I agree with BC in that there are definitely pros to knowing who the DT has checked, so mad hatters/vigils don't hit the wrong people, and DT's don't waste hits checking people who have already been checked, etc etc. But I don't want to sacrifice a DT for the sake of knowing 2-3 confirmed townies. I guess the DT should see first what roles he is able to collect from role checks, and determine whether he thinks his information is worth the risk of RCing (eg. if he has found mafia, he might think it more important to publicly share his list with the town)... DTs should of course show discretion on when they RC in order to post their list, but they have to do it at some point, otherwise what good are they? One person's non-RC'd opinion probably won't be able to sway the town to lynch mafia/not lynch townies, especially when there are no clues. I don't think a DT is useless if he doesn't post his list. We shouldn't have to DEPEND on the DT to know who is town-aligned; everyone who is town-aligned should make it their top priority to try and do what is in the best interest of the town and not be inactive or generally useless and cause the town to waste a lynch on them. If you're a DT, and you find out person X is mafia, there are ways to convince the town without rcing and being like "hay I'm DT so trust me!" I'd have to disagree with your statement that "one person's non-RC'd opinion probably won't be able to sway the town to lynch mafia".. it's not like we're without reason. If you know that somebody is CONFIRMED mafia, with that insight you should be able to look at all of person X's previous posts and make a strong case against him. When I was mafia with Foolishness last game, KNOWING that he was mafia, a lot of what he said seemed obviously scummy to me (no offense to his skill level or anything, I'm very sure he felt the same way about me as well).
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FREEAGLELAND26781 Posts
On April 18 2010 15:11 Qatol wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2010 15:03 nAi.PrOtOsS wrote:
Does anyone know how the roles are given out? If the roles are specifically selected by the narrator then it seems likely that more difficult roles such as mafia, and assassin would be given out a majority of mafia veteran players. I would guess that the percentage of mafia veterans that are mafia as opposed to newer players(there are 6 new players) would be significantly higher. Letting newer players have an easier roles allows them to learn the game, and not mess it up for others. Trade secret. It varies from game to game. Some hosts rig things more, some use totally random setups.
I used a sorting hat!
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On April 18 2010 16:03 flamewheel91 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2010 15:11 Qatol wrote:On April 18 2010 15:03 nAi.PrOtOsS wrote:
Does anyone know how the roles are given out? If the roles are specifically selected by the narrator then it seems likely that more difficult roles such as mafia, and assassin would be given out a majority of mafia veteran players. I would guess that the percentage of mafia veterans that are mafia as opposed to newer players(there are 6 new players) would be significantly higher. Letting newer players have an easier roles allows them to learn the game, and not mess it up for others. Trade secret. It varies from game to game. Some hosts rig things more, some use totally random setups. I used a sorting hat!
No wonder. He always puts me in miller house =/
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On April 18 2010 16:10 Jugan wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2010 16:03 flamewheel91 wrote:On April 18 2010 15:11 Qatol wrote:On April 18 2010 15:03 nAi.PrOtOsS wrote:
Does anyone know how the roles are given out? If the roles are specifically selected by the narrator then it seems likely that more difficult roles such as mafia, and assassin would be given out a majority of mafia veteran players. I would guess that the percentage of mafia veterans that are mafia as opposed to newer players(there are 6 new players) would be significantly higher. Letting newer players have an easier roles allows them to learn the game, and not mess it up for others. Trade secret. It varies from game to game. Some hosts rig things more, some use totally random setups. I used a sorting hat! No wonder. He always puts me in miller house =/
Millers don't know they are millers though, so you might be lucky this game  unless you like the colour red so much.
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On April 18 2010 16:03 flamewheel91 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2010 15:11 Qatol wrote:On April 18 2010 15:03 nAi.PrOtOsS wrote:
Does anyone know how the roles are given out? If the roles are specifically selected by the narrator then it seems likely that more difficult roles such as mafia, and assassin would be given out a majority of mafia veteran players. I would guess that the percentage of mafia veterans that are mafia as opposed to newer players(there are 6 new players) would be significantly higher. Letting newer players have an easier roles allows them to learn the game, and not mess it up for others. Trade secret. It varies from game to game. Some hosts rig things more, some use totally random setups. I used a sorting hat!
is that why i'm always in gryffindor and i havent been in slytherin in about ten games that ive played?
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On April 18 2010 16:32 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2010 16:10 Jugan wrote:On April 18 2010 16:03 flamewheel91 wrote:On April 18 2010 15:11 Qatol wrote:On April 18 2010 15:03 nAi.PrOtOsS wrote:
Does anyone know how the roles are given out? If the roles are specifically selected by the narrator then it seems likely that more difficult roles such as mafia, and assassin would be given out a majority of mafia veteran players. I would guess that the percentage of mafia veterans that are mafia as opposed to newer players(there are 6 new players) would be significantly higher. Letting newer players have an easier roles allows them to learn the game, and not mess it up for others. Trade secret. It varies from game to game. Some hosts rig things more, some use totally random setups. I used a sorting hat! No wonder. He always puts me in miller house =/ Millers don't know they are millers though, so you might be lucky this game unless you like the colour red so much.
yeah but i'm 100% for miller so far, so i mean... seeing green again is gotta be a trap (again). right?
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I can't actually tell if Bill is serious with that plan or not. It seems like he is, but I don't understand it at all. It seems to me that the mafia will just want to hit people that have non-mafia on both sides of the killer/killee list, and that's that.
Also, it just looks like a plan to randomly out townie power roles. Legit townies then have to lie or be exposed. And if they start lying, well that helps create the mass confusion BM wants us to avoid.
Add to this that BM is suggesting the idea of a mass roleclaim...because it worked wonders in one game where people could PM each other and there were no green roles...yeah, I'm not listening to any plan from this guy.
I didn't notice that Abenson was practicing spamming before the thread, but he's doing a good job of it so far now that the day is done.
d3_cres posted that there are at least two assassins. I've got to believe that there are no less than three. Otherwise, why would you get a kill refunded for hitting an assassin?
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I'm suspicious of Zona, his attack on BC seems forced somehow, too condescending, but also too fervent for both to be scum. Why is everyone, that is to say BM, focusing on the assasins anyway? It seems to me they are very unlikely to win in the end, as they will probably be lynched or killed by other assassins well before the end of the game.
Here's my supergenius plan: lynch the least active player, it's the quiet ones you gotta watch!
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I disagree I think that members of the mafia will try to take a role in the strategy planning process, meaning they are the most active early on.
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Radfield
Canada2720 Posts
It seems to me that there are two ways to go about our Day 1 lynch. Lynch someone quite inactive, or lynch someone who jump out at us as being scummy. At this moment I feel like an inactive lynch is the best course of action for a few reasons. First, it makes the game more fun in the long run, as more activity equals more fun. Second, with a lot of new players in this game, I think it likely that those new players who get mafia roles will try to keep to the sidelines as much as possible(although certainly the opposite will be true for some, that at least is good for the Town because more mafia posting gives us more information). Third, if the inactive member was a townie, its not a huge loss because we need townies who post, not lurk.
Also, it seems likely that the mafia will be trying to off the strongest and most experienced players amoung us, I think it would be tragic for us to lynch one of our more active members without decent evidence and hence do the job for the mafia.
People who's posts are scummy now will likely only get more scummy as time goes on, there's no reason to rush on the first day and mistakenly vote out a solid town member.
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On April 18 2010 05:25 Zona wrote:
A message to assassins:
Although your goal in this game is to eliminate your fellow assassins, for all other aspects of the game, you should start off playing pro-town (at least until the town has an overwhelming advantage). It is in your own self-interest to do so. Why? It's in YOUR OWN SELF INTEREST to prolong the game as long as possible. And at least initially, it looks to me that mafia has the numbers advantage, if you as assassins are ignored.
Why? First of all, notice the odds. Likely 5-7 mislynches allowed for 8 successful lynches. It's not easy for the town to go >50% success in lynching, so if we don't do well here, it's likely mafia will win early, reducing the amount of time you have to reach your own personal goal. So helping the town with your votes helps you prolong the game and increase your OWN PERSONAL CHANCES OF WINNING.
Also - HOLD YOUR KILL unless you are sure your target is another assassin. Why? First, you only have 2 chances to screw up - so if you use your kill casually you could waste your killing abilities and be left impotent and relying on the chance that others will somehow kill your opponents for you. FURTHERMORE - EACH OF YOUR SCREWED UP KILLS HELPS EITHER THE TOWN OR MAFIA TOWARDS WINNING, and reduces the amount of time you have to win yourself. So don't deprive yourself of time by killing casually. Only in desperate times (when one of mafia or town are visibly dominating) will you have to employ your kill to try to balance the numbers so that the winning side won't immediately win and end the game for you as well.
A random lynch > A no lynch so either you don't know that, Zona, or you are scum, and I'm pretty sure that you're smart enough to know that the town does well in the situation where random kills go through... it's proven statistically to benefit the town. You doing this = you are scum.
since your bombs don't activate until you die, go ahead and place some bombs early - but try not to get killed early either! If you're going to die early you might as well hold back on your bombs, as they will then act as early-game vigilante hits.
Now that's two instances in which Zona has already had anti-town actions attributed to his name. For all of you newer players, I will explain to you why he has been scummy in his assertions. He is, in the cases of Mad Hatters holding their bombs, and in the case of Assassins not lynching, trying to take away from our chances of killing mafia with his terrible suggestions. You know why it's better to have a lynch than a no lynch?
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Been a tad busy sorry guys, my brothers been in the hospital for tonsillitus so im catching up now
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Oh and lets lynch BC L O L
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why did I sign up for this game? So many useless players.
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EPT
