• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 22:55
CET 04:55
KST 12:55
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!12[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
Dark completes military service, returns to SC211[BSL23] RO16 Group Stage19Weekly Cups (Nov 2-8): herO back on top?2Weekly Cups (Oct 26 - Nov 1): MaxPax, herO, Solar win0Weekly Cups (October 19-25): Clem triples first in 5.0.175
StarCraft 2
General
Dark completes military service, returns to SC2 Greetings.. No more SC2 streamers on team liquid? Serral's getting trashed by New Catsle's Mind Weekly Cups (Nov 2-8): herO back on top?
Tourneys
Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) Dark returns! GSL CK #7 4v4 Team Battle (Nov 19) soO & FanTaSy return! SC2 Kevin Scrim 4v4 (Nov 16) RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22 Tasteless Time Warp: SC Evo Showmatch (May 25)
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[G] How to playtest arcade maps Starcraft 2 Advance [D] the control group Simple Questions/Answers
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 551 Robotic Revival Mutation # 550 Graveyard Shift Mutation # 549 Endless Sparkles
Brood War
General
Korean players' earnings Hit New All-Time High! SOOP Hosts SC1 & SC2 Event Tournament: Kevin Scrim BW General Discussion Recommended BW Settings for Mouse and Video List of top players active on ShieldBattery
Tourneys
[BSL23] Ro16 Group A - Saturday 21:00 CET [$1250] International ShieldBattery League [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Bisu's Team vs Shuttle's Team 2026-11-14
Strategy
Pluto's TvP 5Marine 2Medic Push Simple Questions, Simple Answers Infested Terran strategies in 2026 Nuke strategy worked in K-League 2026-11-09
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Free Space RTS Game, optimised f. Phone/Tablet etc List of Game Threads The PlayStation 5
Dota 2
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Artificial Intelligence Thread Trading/Investing Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread
Fan Clubs
Fan Club Resource Thread Reynor Fan Club The Flash Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
The time I organised my…
AssyrianKing
Why I built Repalyzer (1.1.…
BlueStar
Innovate or Game Over?
TrAiDoS
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 12491 users

[Crs] Pro Invitational Discussion - Page 18

Forum Index > LoL Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 16 17 18 19 20 23 Next All
Seiuchi
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States931 Posts
February 19 2012 02:37 GMT
#341
How to throw a game by Dan Dinh.
Seiuchi
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States931 Posts
February 19 2012 02:48 GMT
#342
Salce is hitting such beautiful Ori ults but he can't carry EG alone.
triangle
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States3803 Posts
February 19 2012 02:49 GMT
#343
On February 19 2012 11:48 Seiuchi wrote:
Salce is hitting such beautiful Ori ults but he can't carry EG alone.

Yeah I feel bad because Salce Ori play is so sexy. That ult was fantastic
Also known as waterfall / w4terfall
nojitosunrise
Profile Joined August 2011
United States6188 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-19 02:59:23
February 19 2012 02:56 GMT
#344
meh I don't get why everyone is hating on rainman's kennen.

The only reason TSM lost was because no one else on the team did anything.

edit: haha i should refresh before posting..didn't realize EG vs Dig was happening
iCanada
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada10660 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-19 02:58:09
February 19 2012 02:57 GMT
#345
Wow, that was... decisive.

EDIT: Is CLG vs Dignitas right now?
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
February 19 2012 02:58 GMT
#346
On February 19 2012 11:37 Seiuchi wrote:
How to throw a game by Dan Dinh.

I think that's being overly unfair to Dan. I'd say other than derping out once, he played better than most of his teammates.
Moderator
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-19 02:58:41
February 19 2012 02:58 GMT
#347
On February 19 2012 11:57 iCanada wrote:
Wow, that was... decisive.

Ya DD really needs to improve as a jungle. You really cant afford to do weird shit as a jungler just cuz their isnt enough gold to skimp on actual effective items.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
PartyBiscuit
Profile Joined September 2010
Canada4525 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-19 03:00:13
February 19 2012 02:59 GMT
#348
On February 19 2012 11:58 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 19 2012 11:37 Seiuchi wrote:
How to throw a game by Dan Dinh.

I think that's being overly unfair to Dan. I'd say other than derping out once, he played better than most of his teammates.

Letting your team get aced (again) and losing baron right after you finally equalize is pretty big in the scale of derps.
the farm ends here
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
February 19 2012 03:00 GMT
#349
On February 19 2012 11:58 Two_DoWn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 19 2012 11:57 iCanada wrote:
Wow, that was... decisive.

Ya DD really needs to improve as a jungle. You really cant afford to do weird shit as a jungler just cuz their isnt enough gold to skimp on actual effective items.

Hey now, Wriggle's Stark's Aegis isn't "weird shit" to Dan--that's been his go-to Warwick build for like 2 years now lol.
Moderator
Seiuchi
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States931 Posts
February 19 2012 03:01 GMT
#350
On February 19 2012 11:58 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 19 2012 11:37 Seiuchi wrote:
How to throw a game by Dan Dinh.

I think that's being overly unfair to Dan. I'd say other than derping out once, he played better than most of his teammates.


Westrice's top was pretty bad, but Dan took an even game that was slightly tilting towards Epik and handed Dig and ace + Baron. Pretty much dropped the game.
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-19 03:08:24
February 19 2012 03:04 GMT
#351
On February 19 2012 11:59 PartyBiscuit wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 19 2012 11:58 TheYango wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:37 Seiuchi wrote:
How to throw a game by Dan Dinh.

I think that's being overly unfair to Dan. I'd say other than derping out once, he played better than most of his teammates.

Letting your team get aced (again) and losing baron right after you finally equalize is pretty big in the scale of derps.

He took a gamble on how far the enemy team was from the Dragon (they had no vision in the enemy jungle, and it was still possible that some of Dignitas' team was on their way to lanes rather than coming straight to Dragon).

You might disagree whether that gamble was necessary (and I'll concede that Dan tends to feel such risks are necessary sooner than they actually are), but given how far behind they were (2 towers, a ton of kills, all 3 carries comparatively underfarmed), he might have felt it was necessary to take that gamble to give them a shot at winning the game.

On February 19 2012 12:01 Seiuchi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 19 2012 11:58 TheYango wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:37 Seiuchi wrote:
How to throw a game by Dan Dinh.

I think that's being overly unfair to Dan. I'd say other than derping out once, he played better than most of his teammates.


Westrice's top was pretty bad, but Dan took an even game that was slightly tilting towards Epik and handed Dig and ace + Baron. Pretty much dropped the game.

Oh come on, that game wasn't even close to even before the Baron. EG had one good teamfight, but being down 2 towers and several kills and being disadvantaged in all 3 lanes is not "even". The global gold gap was already 5k+ and growing.
Moderator
Seiuchi
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States931 Posts
February 19 2012 03:09 GMT
#352
On February 19 2012 12:04 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 19 2012 11:59 PartyBiscuit wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:58 TheYango wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:37 Seiuchi wrote:
How to throw a game by Dan Dinh.

I think that's being overly unfair to Dan. I'd say other than derping out once, he played better than most of his teammates.

Letting your team get aced (again) and losing baron right after you finally equalize is pretty big in the scale of derps.

He took a gamble on how far the enemy team was from the Dragon (they had no vision in the enemy jungle, and it was still possible that some of Dignitas' team was on their way to lanes rather than coming straight to Dragon).

You might disagree whether that gamble was necessary (and I'll concede that Dan tends to feel such risks are necessary sooner than they actually are), but given how far behind they were (2 towers, a ton of kills, all 3 carries comparatively underfarmed), he might have felt it was necessary to take that gamble to give them a shot at winning the game.

Show nested quote +
On February 19 2012 12:01 Seiuchi wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:58 TheYango wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:37 Seiuchi wrote:
How to throw a game by Dan Dinh.

I think that's being overly unfair to Dan. I'd say other than derping out once, he played better than most of his teammates.


Westrice's top was pretty bad, but Dan took an even game that was slightly tilting towards Epik and handed Dig and ace + Baron. Pretty much dropped the game.

Oh come on, that game wasn't even close to even before the Baron. EG had one good teamfight, but being down 2 towers and several kills and being disadvantaged in all 3 lanes is not "even".


Maybe Observer mode makes things look a bit more clinical than playing the game itself so you can see that the global gold difference isn't that bad, because that certainly is an argument, but blind ulting a Maokai when your team's in bad shape and you don't see the rest of his team is a reckless gamble at best and just fucking stupid at worst.
iCanada
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada10660 Posts
February 19 2012 03:11 GMT
#353
Maybe it is because I am used to watching SC tournaments, but most LoL tournaments seem so unprofessional.

It feels like they didn't prep at all and just said "screw it, we have a tournament."

Would it really be that hard for curse to get an overlay that isn't notepad, or not have everyone watching them herpderp about getting in game for an hour between every game?

-.-
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-19 03:15:05
February 19 2012 03:12 GMT
#354
On February 19 2012 12:09 Seiuchi wrote:
Maybe Observer mode makes things look a bit more clinical than playing the game itself so you can see that the global gold difference isn't that bad, because that certainly is an argument, but blind ulting a Maokai when your team's in bad shape and you don't see the rest of his team is a reckless gamble at best and just fucking stupid at worst.

When you're in bad shape is EXACTLY when you take a gamble to try and put yourself back in the game. It's why in SC mid-level pros cheese players that are significantly better than them, or why you go for an all-in when you're on the back foot.
Moderator
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
February 19 2012 03:13 GMT
#355
On February 19 2012 12:00 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 19 2012 11:58 Two_DoWn wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:57 iCanada wrote:
Wow, that was... decisive.

Ya DD really needs to improve as a jungle. You really cant afford to do weird shit as a jungler just cuz their isnt enough gold to skimp on actual effective items.

Hey now, Wriggle's Stark's Aegis isn't "weird shit" to Dan--that's been his go-to Warwick build for like 2 years now lol.

Doesn't make it good.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-19 03:19:07
February 19 2012 03:14 GMT
#356
It's easy for us to judge his error when we have vision of both sides, and in hindsight the gamble looks stupid, but how can you say that gamble wasn't necessary? Again, all 3 lanes were losing, they had zero map control, and were down 2 towers.

If Voyboy had gone to top instead of coming to Dragon that Dignitas obviously wouldn't get to in time and it turned into a 4-for-1 trade, everyone would be saying that play turned the game around entirely.

On February 19 2012 12:13 Two_DoWn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 19 2012 12:00 TheYango wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:58 Two_DoWn wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:57 iCanada wrote:
Wow, that was... decisive.

Ya DD really needs to improve as a jungle. You really cant afford to do weird shit as a jungler just cuz their isnt enough gold to skimp on actual effective items.

Hey now, Wriggle's Stark's Aegis isn't "weird shit" to Dan--that's been his go-to Warwick build for like 2 years now lol.

Doesn't make it good.

I was being facetious. Sorry that wasn't clear.
Moderator
Seiuchi
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States931 Posts
February 19 2012 03:19 GMT
#357
On February 19 2012 12:14 TheYango wrote:
It's easy for us to judge his error when we have vision of both sides, and in hindsight the gamble looks stupid, but how can you say that gamble wasn't necessary?

If Voyboy had gone to top instead of coming to Dragon that they obviously wouldn't get to in time and it turned into a 4-for-1 trade, everyone would be saying that play turned the game around entirely.

Show nested quote +
On February 19 2012 12:13 Two_DoWn wrote:
On February 19 2012 12:00 TheYango wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:58 Two_DoWn wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:57 iCanada wrote:
Wow, that was... decisive.

Ya DD really needs to improve as a jungle. You really cant afford to do weird shit as a jungler just cuz their isnt enough gold to skimp on actual effective items.

Hey now, Wriggle's Stark's Aegis isn't "weird shit" to Dan--that's been his go-to Warwick build for like 2 years now lol.

Doesn't make it good.

I was being facetious. Sorry that wasn't clear.


It didn't look good when it was happening either. Like if that was your WW in a game, and you were blind of the global vision and saw him pulling that move off, would you think that was a good play as it was happening?

I see where you're saying that it's a coin flip move because Voyboy COULD HAVE gone top, but when you just finished dragon after a contested fight and they've all came up around the same time, is it a smart risk to try to pick Maokai? You don't think it's really likely they could have came as 5 and tried to come to see if Dragon was still there/pick a team coming out of the pit?
Nehsb
Profile Joined May 2009
United States380 Posts
February 19 2012 03:30 GMT
#358
On February 19 2012 12:04 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 19 2012 11:59 PartyBiscuit wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:58 TheYango wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:37 Seiuchi wrote:
How to throw a game by Dan Dinh.

I think that's being overly unfair to Dan. I'd say other than derping out once, he played better than most of his teammates.

Letting your team get aced (again) and losing baron right after you finally equalize is pretty big in the scale of derps.

He took a gamble on how far the enemy team was from the Dragon (they had no vision in the enemy jungle, and it was still possible that some of Dignitas' team was on their way to lanes rather than coming straight to Dragon).

You might disagree whether that gamble was necessary (and I'll concede that Dan tends to feel such risks are necessary sooner than they actually are), but given how far behind they were (2 towers, a ton of kills, all 3 carries comparatively underfarmed), he might have felt it was necessary to take that gamble to give them a shot at winning the game.

Show nested quote +
On February 19 2012 12:01 Seiuchi wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:58 TheYango wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:37 Seiuchi wrote:
How to throw a game by Dan Dinh.

I think that's being overly unfair to Dan. I'd say other than derping out once, he played better than most of his teammates.


Westrice's top was pretty bad, but Dan took an even game that was slightly tilting towards Epik and handed Dig and ace + Baron. Pretty much dropped the game.

Oh come on, that game wasn't even close to even before the Baron. EG had one good teamfight, but being down 2 towers and several kills and being disadvantaged in all 3 lanes is not "even". The global gold gap was already 5k+ and growing.


I agree with you to some extent, but one of us is misremembering (or we're referring to different situations) because I recall that, when dan ulted, EG was behind < 1k gold.
Seiuchi
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States931 Posts
February 19 2012 03:35 GMT
#359
On February 19 2012 12:30 Nehsb wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 19 2012 12:04 TheYango wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:59 PartyBiscuit wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:58 TheYango wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:37 Seiuchi wrote:
How to throw a game by Dan Dinh.

I think that's being overly unfair to Dan. I'd say other than derping out once, he played better than most of his teammates.

Letting your team get aced (again) and losing baron right after you finally equalize is pretty big in the scale of derps.

He took a gamble on how far the enemy team was from the Dragon (they had no vision in the enemy jungle, and it was still possible that some of Dignitas' team was on their way to lanes rather than coming straight to Dragon).

You might disagree whether that gamble was necessary (and I'll concede that Dan tends to feel such risks are necessary sooner than they actually are), but given how far behind they were (2 towers, a ton of kills, all 3 carries comparatively underfarmed), he might have felt it was necessary to take that gamble to give them a shot at winning the game.

On February 19 2012 12:01 Seiuchi wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:58 TheYango wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:37 Seiuchi wrote:
How to throw a game by Dan Dinh.

I think that's being overly unfair to Dan. I'd say other than derping out once, he played better than most of his teammates.


Westrice's top was pretty bad, but Dan took an even game that was slightly tilting towards Epik and handed Dig and ace + Baron. Pretty much dropped the game.

Oh come on, that game wasn't even close to even before the Baron. EG had one good teamfight, but being down 2 towers and several kills and being disadvantaged in all 3 lanes is not "even". The global gold gap was already 5k+ and growing.


I agree with you to some extent, but one of us is misremembering (or we're referring to different situations) because I recall that, when dan ulted, EG was behind < 1k gold.


That's what I thought too, but I was giving him the 5k for the sake of argument. : /
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
February 19 2012 03:36 GMT
#360
On February 19 2012 12:30 Nehsb wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 19 2012 12:04 TheYango wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:59 PartyBiscuit wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:58 TheYango wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:37 Seiuchi wrote:
How to throw a game by Dan Dinh.

I think that's being overly unfair to Dan. I'd say other than derping out once, he played better than most of his teammates.

Letting your team get aced (again) and losing baron right after you finally equalize is pretty big in the scale of derps.

He took a gamble on how far the enemy team was from the Dragon (they had no vision in the enemy jungle, and it was still possible that some of Dignitas' team was on their way to lanes rather than coming straight to Dragon).

You might disagree whether that gamble was necessary (and I'll concede that Dan tends to feel such risks are necessary sooner than they actually are), but given how far behind they were (2 towers, a ton of kills, all 3 carries comparatively underfarmed), he might have felt it was necessary to take that gamble to give them a shot at winning the game.

On February 19 2012 12:01 Seiuchi wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:58 TheYango wrote:
On February 19 2012 11:37 Seiuchi wrote:
How to throw a game by Dan Dinh.

I think that's being overly unfair to Dan. I'd say other than derping out once, he played better than most of his teammates.


Westrice's top was pretty bad, but Dan took an even game that was slightly tilting towards Epik and handed Dig and ace + Baron. Pretty much dropped the game.

Oh come on, that game wasn't even close to even before the Baron. EG had one good teamfight, but being down 2 towers and several kills and being disadvantaged in all 3 lanes is not "even". The global gold gap was already 5k+ and growing.


I agree with you to some extent, but one of us is misremembering (or we're referring to different situations) because I recall that, when dan ulted, EG was behind < 1k gold.

Checked the VOD. You're right.

In which case, yeah, that was definitely a pointless gamble to make.
Moderator
Prev 1 16 17 18 19 20 23 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 6h 5m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RuFF_SC2 208
WinterStarcraft3
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 14593
Noble 18
Icarus 6
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm180
League of Legends
JimRising 697
Reynor13
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor134
Other Games
summit1g9755
ToD115
ViBE42
Organizations
Other Games
BasetradeTV313
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 88
• davetesta50
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Rush286
Other Games
• Shiphtur275
Upcoming Events
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6h 5m
WardiTV Invitational
8h 5m
IPSL
13h 5m
Art_Of_Turtle vs KameZerg
Radley vs George
BSL
16h 5m
Artosis vs Dewalt
Ret vs Tech
SOOP
1d 6h
soO vs FanTaSy
WardiTV Weekly
1d 8h
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
PiGosaur Cup
2 days
The PondCast
3 days
GSL
4 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
4 days
KCM Race Survival
5 days
RSL Revival
6 days
BSL
6 days
eOnzErG vs StRyKeR
Cross vs JDConan
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-11-14
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
International ShieldBattery League
BSL Season 23
IPSL Winter 2026-27
Calamity Cup Div. A Season 8
Underdog Cup 2026 Div 2-3
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026

Upcoming

YSL S4
Sector 591
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
StarCraft2 Weekly Open Tournament 2026 Grand Finals
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
IEM Kraków 2027
PGL Bucharest 2027
BLAST Bounty Winter 2027
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.