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[Champion] Teemo

Forum Index > LoL Strategy
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Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-02 13:23:42
October 01 2013 19:04 GMT
#1
Teemo, the Swift Scout
[image loading]
aka Teeto, aka Timmo, aka FUCK, aka Batman

+ Show Spoiler [Patch Notes] +
http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Teemo/Background

+ Show Spoiler [Stats] +
http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Teemo


Abilities:

Passive: Camouflage
Description: If Teemo stands still and takes no action for 2 seconds, he becomes stealthed. Taking any action will break his camouflage, granting him 40% attack speed for 3 seconds.
Notes:
+ Show Spoiler +
-The ward passive. Useful occasionally, mostly against dumb opponents.
-Will not activate if you have taken damage in those 2 seconds.
-At the start of the game, you can use it to ambush an opponent if you get to lane before them.
-Can be used to juke if you get ahead of an opponent you’re running from and jump into a bush for 2 seconds.


Q: Blinding Dart
Description: Teemo shoots a dart at an enemy, dealing magic damage and blinding them for a few seconds.
Cooldown: 8 seconds
Cost: 70/80/90/100/110 Mana
Range: 580 arbitrary units
Damage: 80 / 125 / 170 / 215 / 260 (+ 80% AP)
Blind Duration: 1.5 / 1.75 / 2 / 2.25 / 2.5 seconds
Notes:
+ Show Spoiler +
-Blind is good, especially in top lane where many champions are auto attackers like Jax, Trynd, Nasus, etc.
-This is a relatively long ranged nuke, and can be used to poke under turret or against someone that is playing further back than your auto range.
-Blind will not affect on-hit effects, so Darius slow, Garen silence, etc. will still hit you.
-Blind only prevents bonus physical damage, so any bonus magic damage (Ori passive, Wit’s, Kayle’s Fury) will still deal damage.
-While it’s a strong harass tool, it can be quite price-y mana-wise, so don’t spam it with impunity. Autos will do the same or more damage from a harass perspective, though with slightly more risk involved.
-If you get Rylai’s, this will proc the full slow and make you an annoying shit.


W: Move Quick
Passive Description: Teemo gains increased movement speed. Damage from champions and structures will disable this bonus for 5 seconds.
Active Description: For 3 seconds, Teemo doubles his passive movement speed bonus. While active, Move Quick's bonus cannot be disabled via champion or structure damage.
Cooldown: 17 seconds
Cost: 40 Mana
Passive MS: 10 / 14 / 18 / 22 / 26%
Active MS: 20 / 28 / 36 / 44 / 52%
Notes:
+ Show Spoiler +
-One of the things that make you annoying as fuck. Your chasing/escaping potential is huge due to your high MS.
-Minions will not deactivate his passive, so you can harass within the minion wave without worrying about anything but a bit of damage.
-Do not use the active to chase unless you’re 100% certain you won’t need it. There’s nothing worse than chasing the enemy to their tower with W up, only to get ganked from the jungle and have no sprint.
-Max this early against people you need to kite. It’s not as necessary against low-mobility opponents.


E: Toxic Shot
Description: Teemo's auto-attacks deal bonus magic damage and poison his target, causing them to take additional magic damage over 4 seconds. Subsequent attacks only refresh the duration.
On-Hit Damage: 10 / 20 / 30 / 40 / 50 (+ 30% AP)
Tick Damage: 6 / 12 / 18 / 24 / 30 (+ 10% AP)
Total DoT Damage: 24 / 48 / 72 / 96 / 120 (+ 40% AP)
Notes:
+ Show Spoiler +
-Generally the ability you’ll be maxing first. The damage is actually huge and adds up quite quickly against any melee champion that is forced to eat autos when he goes to farm.
-Careful harassing with this near turret, as the poison will still cause aggro even when running in and out of range.
-The damage will activate Hexdrinker/Maw, and will deal damage to the shield. The standard auto portion will still damage their health.
-The magic damage applied from this will not proc Liandry’s or Rylai’s.
-The magic damage WILL proc Morellonomicon, making it an excellent buy against someone like Voli.
-Your poison can be used by Cass to proc her Twin Fang CD.


R: Noxious Trap
Description: Teemo places a mushroom trap on the ground, which stealths and arms after 1 second. While armed, the traps grant vision in a 212.5 radius. If an enemy comes within 60 range of the trap, it will detonate, slowing and dealing damage over 4 seconds to nearby enemies within 200 radius. Each mushroom has 100 health and can only be destroyed by auto-attacks.

Noxious Traps have a 10 minute duration. Teemo generates a new trap periodically, affected by cooldown reduction, and can only store up to 3 traps at once.
Reload Time: 35 / 31 / 27 seconds
Cooldown: 1 second
Cost: 75 / 100 / 125 mana
Range: 230 arbitrary units
Tick Damage: 50 / 81.25 / 112.5 (+ 20% AP)
Total Damage: 200 / 325 / 450 (+ 80% AP)
Slow Power: 30% / 40% / 50%
Notes:
+ Show Spoiler +
-Aw yiss. This is what you know Teemo for.
-Ward yo lane
-Ward yo baron
-Can be used to push, if you get a decent amount of AP one shroom can kill caster minions and bring melee down to nothing.
-REMEMBER BATTLE SHROOMS. Always drop at least one shroom in a fight. The damage is high (even the base), so if you get forced into a stand-up fight (should be never), it helps kill people.
-Place ahead of you while kiting, or on top of you if you’re getting jumped.
-Once Oracles start coming out, Shrooms in the open don’t last long. Place them in brush so opponents have to facecheck them to clear.
-The range isn’t quite enough to check a bush for you (unlike a ward), but you can place them over thin walls if you’re careful.


Summoner Skills:
[Flash](/[Ghost]) + [Teleport]/[Ignite]
+ Show Spoiler [Reasonings] +
Flash is Flash. It probably will save your life at least once or twice per game. An argument can be made for Ghost if you don’t think you need Flash, as it gives great chasing/run away potential, which is Teemo in a nutshell.

Ignite is a lane killing summoner. As you’re a lane bully, it’s good. Shroom DoT + Ignite + E DoT can deal a huge amount of damage even after you walk away, for dives and the like. Also, as a Marksman with AP scaling, if you take the Ignite Mastery, you benefit from both portions nicely.

Teleport is great. It allows split pushing and gank assists to other lanes, or just general Teleport stuff like backing quickly. I would take this in lanes I don’t predict killing too much, or if I want to hard splitpush but also will be needed for teamfights. Again, standard Teleport shit.

Ghost as a second summoner (as in, Flash/Ghost) may be worth a look. It gives you huge mobility spikes and chasing/escaping power, which, again, is Teemo in a nutshell. Taking both limits your map presence and kill potential, but can make you even more of an annoying shit.


Masteries:
My general Masteries are 9/21/0, the usual AP bruiser masteries. I prefer MPen and AP in the Offensive tree over AD and ArPen as you generally are getting more out of your EQE combo than you are just the auto damage. It also helps more late game with Shrooms and what not.

Other options are:

9/21/0 with an AD focus if you are looking to rush BotRK and FMallet.

21/9/0 if you want higher damage and don’t think you need Defensive masteries, generally works best with a full AP build.

15/15/0 as an experimental option with dual pen masteries and Spellsword. You could take out Spellsword if you aren’t planning on building a lot of AP.

...Don’t quote me on the specifics of the Defensive tree masteries, I like the CC and Slow reduction because hard engages and CC are your worst enemies, but I know many people take Juggernaut. There’s a lot of wiggle room in all of these, use your own preferences and judgements.

Runes:

Quints: MS Quints have no real equal for someone like Teemo. Other options include Hybrid Pen or AP.
Marks: Hybrid Pen is the best choice 99% of the time. AS or MPen are decent alternatives if you can’t afford them.
Seals: Armor.
Glyphs: MR. Flat is my preferred option, but scaling are fine too.

You may also find it useful to run an Armor heavy page for someone like Panth, who can be quite the annoyance.

Skill Order:

EQEWER, R > E > Q > W is my general skill order. You may want to change it depending on matchup, however.

-W is useful to level if you’re going to be running in and away a lot.
-Q is best to level against autoattackers with a hard gapcloser that you can’t deny. Fantastic against Xin/Yi, especially once they start trying to charge and fight you.

Item Build/Playstyle:

Here’s a list of good Teemo items, and reasonings. Afterwards are my ideas for building him.

+ Show Spoiler +
Doran’s Ring: A good starting item. The mana return on kill means you can basically always use Q and W and lets you plant Shrooms with impunity. If you don’t think you need early defenses, this is probably your best starting item with 2 potions.

Doran’s Shield: A decent starting item against certain champs. Since you’re Teemo, you shouldn’t be taking a lot of early game auto harass except from maybe Kennen or Jayce. However, it’s still a good chunk of health and regen, so consider it if the situation warrants it.

Boots: A fine start if you don’t want to futz around with Doran’s items.

Later Boots: I generally prefer Tabi or Merc’s as my boot options, even as AP Teemo. Sorc’s if you’re really not worried about being jumped at all is fine, I suppose.

Don’t do Mobos, Swiftness are only good if you’re ahead and want to be an asshole to that Garen, Zerker’s don’t give you nearly enough with just AS. I guess you could do CDR boots, but I wouldn’t.

Nashor’s Tooth: Probably my favorite item on Teemo. Against anyone that you can auto, it turns you from annoying to a monster that makes people ragequit. AS/AP/AP on autos makes your E harass even scarier than you could imagine.

Zhonya’s: Seeker’s is a great item against heavy AD laners, you can even start Cloth and build into it easily. Also Zhonya’s active is great for being a troll and letting your DoTs kill people.

Guardian Angel: A great item, in all honesty. Look, you’re Teemo. People are going to jump you and try to instagib you, that’s just the way it is. It’s a strong defensive item and the passive can save your life or dissuade people from focusing you.

Blade of the Ruined King: IMO the best item for a Tank Teemo build. One stop shop for damage and AS, Active for chasing/kiting, sustain on someone who generally doesn’t have any.

Frozen Mallet: Another Tankmo item. Probably my favorite on him, though the build time can be quite annoying now that you can’t build it through Phage. Your auto harass is just a monster with this.

Liandry’s Torment: Not a bad choice for Teemo at all. His damages on shrooms and autos are strong enough to take advantage of the flat MPen, and you can tick away health with your DoTs by proccing Lidandry’s DoT.

Rylai’s Crystal Scepter: Not the best item, but a possibility. If you want health and a slow, I would wager FMallet is a much better option, but Rylai’s can be a fantastic boost to your Shrooms, especially if you have a Liandry’s. Additionally, if you’re AP and want a slow, I guess it scales better with Nashor’s and DC.

Rabadoodle’s Deathcap: If you’re AP Teemo and want to laugh as people’s health melts away. I find it hard to justify going straight AP most of the time, but if you are, this will make you laugh.

Wit’s End: A great choice for Tankmo, a pretty good choice for AP Bruiser builds if you need MR. Teemo does great with all the stats, pretty straightforward here.

Morellonomicon: A good buy if you’re against heavy sustain folks like Voli (passive), Mundo, Vlad, etc. As your E’s damage will proc it, you just kind of buy it and fuck them. The stats aren’t bad, either, and an early Kage’s in a lane you’re bullying can be nice.

Lichbane: I would advise against this as a first item, as you can’t really proc it enough to make it your main source of damage, but it makes Auto - Q - Auto combos super chunky. A great damage item to round out a build.

Runaan’s Hurrican: Yep, this item actually still exists. You can use it to be a total menace, too. If you’re going Tankmo and can afford to dedicate a slot to straight AS, the only other item that can really compete with this is like, Zephyr. Not to mention with FMallet you can slow 3 people per auto and kite like a motherfucker. Situational but good.

Void Staff: Same as it is on any AP champ. If you’re building AP and they’re stacking MR to the point where Wit’s/Liandry’s won’t cut it, you can grab this. Not core, though.

Trinity Force: Meh. Meh, in my opinion. Your AD isn’t super high, you’re not spammy, you don’t want Crit… meh. But Phage is a pretty good item so I guess you can do this if you want Phage in lane and don’t like selling.

Randuin’s Omen: Not a super great option, but can dissuade divers and give you a lot of kiting power..


In my opinion, there are two or three main build paths for Teemo - AP Bruiser, Tankmo, and AP.

AP Bruiser:
Focus on defenses and AP as the game goes on, allowing flexibility but without being super strong in either area. Sort of an in-between of the other two, my normal build path. Great in 1v1s where you’re going to take some damage back.

For this one I generally start with DRing and 2 pots, then build Nashor’s Tooth. From there, I vary depending on how the game is going.

Liandry’s Lament is a good next item, again being a good AP Bruiser item and giving health and damage. Makes your autos and Shrooms deadly potent.

If I’m getting focused hard, I’ll go Zhonya’s Hourglass if heavy AD/burst avoidable with the active, or Guardian Angel if I’m just getting dove and instagibbed.

If I can afford to go high amounts of damage fast, Deathcap, Void Staff, and Hourglass are acceptable options.

My final build will generally look like Nashor’s, Deathcap, Guardian Angel, Liandry’s, Merc’s, Zhonya’s Hourglass.

Tankmo
Probably the least overall effective build, but situationally it can be super strong and is, in my opinion, probably the most fun one to play. This focuses around getting tanky items and then BotRK as your one “straight damage” item.

I will generally start with DRing and 2 Pots if I feel safe enough, as it gives you sustain for the lane and just enough AP to harass hard early on with Auto-Q-Auto combos. Boots and 4 Pots is an acceptable start for this as well, as is Doran’s Shield 1 Pot or Cloth Armor 5 Pots.

Your main core for this build is Blade of the Ruined King and Frozen Mallet. This combo will let you be rather survivable and still have strong ranged harass. Your autos will do less damage than an AP build, but with the slow, % health, and Active, you can be a veritable threat.

Guardian Angel is again an all around good item for defensive purposes, especially against mixed damage opponents. If you’re worried about AP, Wit’s End with Merc’s is your best option. Against AD, Tabi is a solid early buy and Zhonya’s is still rather good, despite requiring a NLR to complete. If you want a straight defensive Armor item. Randuin’s Omen is good for kiting and denying divers.

If you have your core and are looking for more damage from this build, Wit’s, Liandry’s, and Runaan’s Hurricane are all good choices. Well, Hurricane is much more situational, but nice if you can afford it.

My final build with Tankmo is generally something like BotRK, Boots (Tabi or Merc’s), FMallet, GA, Liandry’s/Zhonya’s, and Wit’s.

AP Teemo
+ Show Spoiler [old and busted] +
I dislike straight AP Teemo. It has potential to be huge, but without hard CC, AoE, or a reliable escape, he’s really prone to just getting jumped and killed instantly. However, depending on teamcomp, enemy teamcomp, and how the game is going, you can make it work and do insane amounts of damage.

As with AP Bruiser, you’ll likely want to start Doran’s Ring and 2 Pots, but can even start Amp Tome if you’re feeling frisky.

Your first buy will, again, be Nashor’s Tooth, as it works too well with him and has such a good build path. You’ll want to follow this up with a Needlessly Large Rod item in Hourglass or Deathcap.

At this point, a MPen item is a good option, so either Liandry’s Torment or Void Staff. Abyssal Scepter is a decent option as well, but it does not affect your shrooms, and once people leave the range your poisons will not benefit from it anymore. Still, you can grab Abyssal if you want.

Grab Rylai’s or Guardian Angel if you need to fill a slot with a defensive item.

My general final build as AP Teemo looks like Sorc’s, Nashor’s, Deathcap, Rylai’s, Zhonya’s Hourglass, and Liandry’s Torment.

Here's some notes on AP Teemo from someone much better at it than I:

On October 02 2013 21:03 RouaF wrote:
Overall good advices, the only thing I don't understand is why you never start with a ward, to me it seems like suicide, I'd really like to start with doran ring but it's pretty much impossible, you will die to ganks. I often start with boots 2 pots+ward or in matchups where they can trade with you, faerie 5 pots ward.

Here's my teemo experience :

I play full ap in diamond 1 running 21/9 but I never buy nashors. Ap teemo's strength comes from mushrooms, the aoe damage and the control they give is great . Basically if you play full AP you HAVE to use your shrooms correctly and your team HAS to play with them. If they commit to teamfights in open space where you hadn't time to setup shrooms, you will most likely lose.

The key to winning is just to be able to plant shroom forests around baron/dragon and force fights there, you will win these 100%. You'll also need to kill the enemy supports when he comes with pinks/oracle to destroy your precious shrooms, just stealth in a brush and wait for him to facecheck, with 1 shroom and auto Q auto he will be dead.

While this build might not be the easiest to play, it's insanely fun and will even sometimes makes teemo look overpowered, there's nothing more satisfying than seeing shrooms explode on 5 people when you have liandries+decent ap, also people "safe recalling" in brushes when they're low, *boom*.

Tbh i'd rate ap teemo mid/late game as very strong but his laning phase is really what's tricky, if you get ganked and your jungler is like meh teemo top i'll gank somewhere else you have a ton of chances to be heavily screwed because teemo needs to stay ahead and push his advantage. Once he gets behind he dies very quickly and doesn't have a lot of tools to outplay - the only one that I know of is shroom under your turret and bait a dive -.

TL;dr my teemo build 21/9 AP (sometimes 30/0/0 if I know they can't harass back), hybrid reds, scaling ap blues (if the enemy laner is ad), armor yellows, flat ap quints. Haunting guise/sorc core, then buld whatever AP, turn guise into liandries, build grail if needed. Laning phase extremely important, try to be nice to your jungler and ask him for counterganks.


Laning
This is where you’re an asshole to like 90% of top champions. Any melee autoattackers more or less just cry against you, most other melees fear seeing you as well.

Harass, last hit, and run. These are the tenets of laning Teemo. Early on, you can’t fight pretty much anyone from 100-0, but you can harass them down to half from a range and then force them to run and chug pots. If they ever jump to engage on you, drop a shroom, hit W, and run, orbwalking if you have the ability. Even if you’re full health, it’s generally a bad idea to fight anyone in melee once your blind wears off.

Ranged champions like Kennen, Jayce, or Elise can give you trouble. They can generally trade harder than you and will usually not take your harass without chunking you in return.

I would recommend Tankmo in these situations. As long as you can survive, get tank stuff, and then splitpush as normal, you won’t be a huge liability to your team. Don’t expect to get kills in these lanes, and if you’re under your turret trying to last hit and push with Shrooms, well, that’s better than feeding.

Splitpushing
This is where you shine. With an AP item or two, your Shrooms will instaclear a wave, or at least put it to the point where you can last hit in 2 seconds. Grab wards, put them in the usual spots, and Shroom entrances to the lane. As long as you see someone coming, between your Passive, W, and Shrooms, you should never get caught.

With Nashor’s or BotRK, you’ll drop towers pretty quick too. You will force at least one person to respond (if not more), and then you can either kite them or fight them. You can also steal buffs rather quickly depending on which build you went, so if you have good vision don’t be afraid to sneak off with their Red/Blue.

Teamfigthing
Eventually, you have to teamfight. You can’t just splitpush all game, sad to say, either your team will rotate to you and group to push the tower, or you’ll have to go fight at Baron or one of your towers.

Teemo… is not the best teamfighter. No CC, no burst, middling range. That said, though, not all hope is lost. You can set up shrooms to give you an environmental advantage, and place them in fights to peel divers.

You have pretty darn good single target damage with any build, so utilize your kiting and orbwalking to whittle away at front/midliners.

If you have Zhonya’s or GA, don’t be afraid to run in and be a distraction, drawing fire with your fuzzy goodness.

Don’t use Blinding Dart for damage in a teamfight as long as there is a viable target to use it on. Your team should thank you for using it on Zed, Yi, and Jax when they jump in, though they probably won’t. If you’re able to use it on the enemy ADC, laugh and fuck them up.

Tips and Tricks
-Your general combo is Auto-Q-Auto. Q has just the right length of cast/travel time to fit in between autos, so that combo will do a surprising chunk in lane.
-Shrooms are expensive! Throw as many down as possible, but don’t get into a situation where you can’t use Q or W afterwards.
-Battle Shrooms! Drop Shrooms in the middle of a fight, never have them sitting in your inventory if you can.
-Teemo is not a complicated champ. You want to Blind autoattackers, Shroom to either slow or ward, and run like fuck with W.
-Spam laugh. Trust me.
-If you experience a lane swap and you are 1v2, you can go to lane and stealth there, you will be able to get full XP, they can't zone you if they don't see you ! :D

+ Show Spoiler [changelog] +
10-1-2013: hiiiiiiiiiiii
It's your boy Guzma!
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
October 01 2013 19:04 GMT
#2
Will update later with images.
It's your boy Guzma!
GhandiEAGLE
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States20754 Posts
October 01 2013 19:16 GMT
#3
I've been morally obligated to approve this guide.
Oh, my achin' hands, from rakin' in grands, and breakin' in mic stands
Anakko
Profile Joined August 2012
France1934 Posts
October 01 2013 20:37 GMT
#4
My heart skipped several beats at that picture.

I feel like I won't sleep well for quite some time... I don't thank you req
TrAce/Cpt Jack for president (or both)
Lord Tolkien
Profile Joined November 2012
United States12083 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-01 21:00:36
October 01 2013 20:47 GMT
#5
The one point I would make is that DFG on AP Teemo is an especially strong item, if you're looking to assassinate 1 person. With it, you become effectively a ranged assassin in terms of damage; your single target damage also spikes heavily, especially if you've been maxing Q (an alternate to E if you're looking for burst/short trades over sustained damage).

That being said, I've been returning to the viability of mid lane Teemo, where Q max is generally superior for trading.

I also feel Nashors Tooth, while an excellent item for the CDR, is a poor damage choice on AP Teemo, given the relatively weak AP ratio on it. A Lichbane on AP Teemo is more effective for the added burst (and the MS is nice), or DFG, which is, relatively speaking, what you play AP Teemo for.

That being said, Teemo top is probably his most viable position, but I'm reminiscing about the short burst of Mid AP Teemo FOTM, and will try to fiddle with it in SoloQ sometime.

CDR, while useful for more Shrooms, is a relatively weak stat on Teemo as well, given his poor AP Scaling/Second (link).
"His father is pretty juicy tbh." ~WaveofShadow
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
October 01 2013 20:59 GMT
#6
I'm nowhere near an authority on AP Teemo, I've done it like twice, and then only in lanes I know I'd demolish.

Still, I never really would associate Teemo with high amounts of burst. With a single nuke (two, if you count Lichbane), he's not really bursty in any sense and most of his damage comes from autos. DFG I could see if you could drop a Shroom on them after the active goes off, but I still don't really see him as a 100-0 champ like Ahri can be.
It's your boy Guzma!
Lord Tolkien
Profile Joined November 2012
United States12083 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-01 21:17:25
October 01 2013 21:06 GMT
#7
On October 02 2013 05:59 Requizen wrote:
I'm nowhere near an authority on AP Teemo, I've done it like twice, and then only in lanes I know I'd demolish.

Still, I never really would associate Teemo with high amounts of burst. With a single nuke (two, if you count Lichbane), he's not really bursty in any sense and most of his damage comes from autos. DFG I could see if you could drop a Shroom on them after the active goes off, but I still don't really see him as a 100-0 champ like Ahri can be.

I've done it a couple of times, and you can certainly burst down a single target with a DFG-AA-Q-AA-AA+ignite combo (or a Shroom+combo), though given the relative dearth of non-MS mobility (like Ahri's dashes), such a build relies on the enemy stepping on a Mushroom for you to catch up, or else ambushing them with the passive. At the 1 item timing (with a DFG), he becomes a major single target threat to targets without a major MR item with strong (conditional) pick potential.

I'll probably look into this abit more in my off-time. I agree with alot of what you've written about top lane Teemo.

Ahri's total AP ratio (for a single rotation with all her spells) hovers at a 2.86 AP ratio, while Teemo's entire ratio is 2.4 (+.3AP per AA, in addition to additional poison ticks per AA). Because of this, his actual AP burst ratio with additional AP is already pretty good. Lich Bane adds another .75 AP ratio every 2 seconds (or a burst rotation of 3.1AP +.3AP per additional AA), versus (2.55AP+.45 AP per additional AA). Nashors is better than Lich Bane if you expect to get more than 5 AAs in (and assuming only 1 Lich Bane Proc), which may make it worth it for an AP bruiser build, but for a pure AP burst build, Lich Bane (and DFG) are better. DFG amplifies Teemos Damage to 2.88+.36AP, with a significant nuke attached to it and more AP overall.

Again, further testing required. Will get back to this thread in a few weeks/a month.
"His father is pretty juicy tbh." ~WaveofShadow
Duvon
Profile Joined October 2011
Sweden2360 Posts
October 01 2013 21:14 GMT
#8
Haunting Guise ASAP if you're planning on getting Liandry's anyway no?
Nothing is impossible, only some things for some people.
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
October 01 2013 21:16 GMT
#9
On October 02 2013 06:14 Duvon wrote:
Haunting Guise ASAP if you're planning on getting Liandry's anyway no?

It's a fair enough buy most of the time. Health/AP/MPen is never going to be bad, but depending on the situation you may not want it before your Nashor's/DC/BotRK/FMallet/etc.

I don't advocate blindly building any single item 100% of the time on Teemo. He's a variable champion who works well with a lot of things, and can change based on the matchup, jungle pressure, how your team is doing, etc.
It's your boy Guzma!
HAL9OOO
Profile Joined January 2011
United States176 Posts
October 02 2013 02:33 GMT
#10
I will play Teemo next just because of that picture. And this :



C̨A͉͒P͚͚̟̖͙̻̣̌̂̒̕Tͥ̐͒̑̑ͣA̲̘ͧ̽̂­̹I̸͉͌N͚̰͟ ̠̘̦̾͌ͣͫͫͬT͇̹̳̙͍̜͚͒̋̎͝Ḙ͙̗͕̍̏͞ͅ­͉̫E͍̥͙̙͖̟͐ͬ̃̃̓ͨͣ͟M͚͕̟O̢̱̘̜͈̪̝ͧ ̩̝̜͖̖͔̔ͪ̐ͮ͌͂̚ͅR̡̥̞̘̜̲͚͊̍Eͧͥ̊͊̽­̙́̑Pͮ͐̏̌͝O̹̬̯̻͇̔͂̉͐Rͤ̋ͭ̈́̀T̋̃̑̓­͑ͣ͗͏̠̺̫I̹̲̓ͧͩ͑̀ͯͫ́N̜̹̗̥̟͖͍̆͂̅͒­G̈́́ ̙̻̱̩͕̙͡F̮̞̳ͪ̕O̸͔R̪̟̤͚̣̽̅ͩ̇̄̚ ̮̬̲̞̭͑͘ͅD̸̠ͧÜ͔̘̣̫͖̻͚͒̿̍̍͟T̅͌ͥ­̼̒̿̌ͥY̱̠͖̗̼͍ͮ́̓͒ͣ
ZataN
Profile Joined July 2010
New Zealand414 Posts
October 02 2013 03:58 GMT
#11
The AP Bruiser and the Full AP builds are like the same build.... And you say you don't like AP teemo. Lol.
CJ BABY | FAKER > PAWN BELIEVE IT
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
October 02 2013 04:05 GMT
#12
On October 02 2013 12:58 ZataN wrote:
The AP Bruiser and the Full AP builds are like the same build.... And you say you don't like AP teemo. Lol.

Full AP goes 21/9/0, gets DC early, and likely doesn't build a defensive item other than maybe Zhonya until later into the game.

As AP bruiser, I run 9/21/0 and after Nashor generally get Liandry's or GA, being much more defensive and survivable.

I dislike full AP because it means anything that looks your way kills you, more or less. It has a much higher damage potential, especially once you hit your Nashor's/DC timing.

If Tolkein is to be believed, it should also skip Nashor's in favor of straight DC and AP items.
It's your boy Guzma!
StarStruck
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
25339 Posts
October 02 2013 05:57 GMT
#13
Teemo is ARAM hell. I've gotten him what... the last 6 out of 11 games in ARAM? He's so strong with a hurricane and people really seem to have a problem jumping me in time before I blow everyone up. ;3
RouaF
Profile Joined October 2010
France4120 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-02 12:06:48
October 02 2013 12:03 GMT
#14
Overall good advices, the only thing I don't understand is why you never start with a ward, to me it seems like suicide, I'd really like to start with doran ring but it's pretty much impossible, you will die to ganks. I often start with boots 2 pots+ward or in matchups where they can trade with you, faerie 5 pots ward.

Here's my teemo experience :

I play full ap in diamond 1 running 21/9 but I never buy nashors. Ap teemo's strength comes from mushrooms, the aoe damage and the control they give is great . Basically if you play full AP you HAVE to use your shrooms correctly and your team HAS to play with them. If they commit to teamfights in open space where you hadn't time to setup shrooms, you will most likely lose.

The key to winning is just to be able to plant shroom forests around baron/dragon and force fights there, you will win these 100%. You'll also need to kill the enemy supports when he comes with pinks/oracle to destroy your precious shrooms, just stealth in a brush and wait for him to facecheck, with 1 shroom and auto Q auto he will be dead.

While this build might not be the easiest to play, it's insanely fun and will even sometimes makes teemo look overpowered, there's nothing more satisfying than seeing shrooms explode on 5 people when you have liandries+decent ap, also people "safe recalling" in brushes when they're low, *boom*.

Tbh i'd rate ap teemo mid/late game as very strong but his laning phase is really what's tricky, if you get ganked and your jungler is like meh teemo top i'll gank somewhere else you have a ton of chances to be heavily screwed because teemo needs to stay ahead and push his advantage. Once he gets behind he dies very quickly and doesn't have a lot of tools to outplay - the only one that I know of is shroom under your turret and bait a dive -.

Your jungler has to understand that 1v1 you'll be ahead but the lane can very quickly turn into a disaster for you if you get ganked, teemo doesn't have the best escape mechanics and he dies very fast early if stunned/slowed. Ask your jungler for counterganks, teemo should always win 2v2 because his direct lane opponent WILL be low life. Also when you pick teemo be prepared to be ganked, ALL junglers LOVE to gank teemo, when I pick him I get ganked like twice more often.

I don't agree that CDR is a bad stat on teemo, at least on full AP teemo it allows you to shroom more, you will probably have mana issues if you don't build grail though, I often build it if the opposing team is quite ap heavy. More shrooms = more map control + more chances to plant shrooms at places where skirmishes can happen, giving your team a large advantage in those even if you're on the other side of the map.

Funny trick : if you experience a lane swap and you are 1v2, you can go to lane and stealth there, you will be able to get full XP, they can't zone you if they don't see you ! :D

TL;dr my teemo build 21/9 AP (sometimes 30/0/0 if I know they can't harass back), hybrid reds, scaling ap blues (if the enemy laner is ad), armor yellows, flat ap quints. Haunting guise/sorc core, then buld whatever AP, turn guise into liandries, build grail if needed. Laning phase extremely important, try to be nice to your jungler and ask him for counterganks.
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
October 02 2013 13:21 GMT
#15
Thanks for the insight, I'll add it to the OP. As I said, I'm not the best AP Teemo player, generally preferring more defenses. I'll also add Ward openings, though I don't find them as necessary when running defensive masteries. If I know that they have a strong ganking jungler and I have to burn Flash early, I'll back immediately and buy wards, but usually I find that I can harass the opposing laner down enough that even a 2v1 from a gank isn't as dangerous as it would be otherwise.

I just think CDR is a good stat on any champion. Anything that lets you do what you do more often is good.

I'll also add that 1v2 trick to the OP, never thought of that! Probably quite dangerous, though, as a random pink ward in the lane brush means you die lol.
It's your boy Guzma!
Lord Tolkien
Profile Joined November 2012
United States12083 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-02 17:08:47
October 02 2013 16:49 GMT
#16
While the utility advantage of CDR is important in that you do plant more mushrooms (and that's difficult to quantify), in pure "burst" perspective (if you're looking for the dmgz), it's a relatively weak damage stat on Teemo all told because only 2 damage active spells, and one is conditional. His ratios are pretty good if you get a mushroom or multiple autoattacks in, however, but the AAs/Blinding Dart is single target (which does allow him to assassinate supports or squishies in roam/pick scenarioes quite readily, however). But in general, if you're looking for more damage, more AP/MPen is the way to go, not CDR. CDR is much more useful for map control, however, so it's not a weak stat, just a weak "Damage" Stat, so to speak, which is a clarification I should make. There's utility in getting CDR.

In contrast, other AP casters like Ahri have sustained damage that is much more greatly boosted by CDR as a stat.
"His father is pretty juicy tbh." ~WaveofShadow
Magus
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada450 Posts
October 02 2013 20:09 GMT
#17
So on AP Teemo are you maxing E or Q? I know AD Teemo goes E > W > Q, but from my experience laning against AP Teemo's (as Kayle in Gold-Plat games) Q max is significantly more dangerous compared to E. This is probably a little biased based on the fact that Kayle's damage is partially auto-based, but the E max Teemo lost every single trade while the Q max stayed even.

Is Q vs E subject to change based on the champ you lane against? So Q vs auto attack harassers/traders, and E vs people you can chase for a bit?

Q max: gains 180 damage and 1s of blind
E max: gains 136 damage per hit (less on additional hits since I don't think poison stacks, just refreshes)

So based on that, E is always better if you hit more than once. But Q has higher range than your autos, so are there any specific champions (again, Kayle) that you'd want to max Q against because it's too dangerous to go in for autos or who can't trade without their autos?
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
October 02 2013 20:24 GMT
#18
Like you said, completely situational. Q gives more "burst" poke and is also a good choice if you're going to be trading with someone who can get autos on you that you can't avoid (like Xin charging you or Jax QEing you). E is generally better as long as you can get multiple autos off, and is also less of a manahog (obviously).
It's your boy Guzma!
Lord Tolkien
Profile Joined November 2012
United States12083 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-02 20:46:04
October 02 2013 20:45 GMT
#19
On October 03 2013 05:24 Requizen wrote:
Like you said, completely situational. Q gives more "burst" poke and is also a good choice if you're going to be trading with someone who can get autos on you that you can't avoid (like Xin charging you or Jax QEing you). E is generally better as long as you can get multiple autos off, and is also less of a manahog (obviously).

Yep.

In mid lane for instance, Q max is likely to be more substantial, as it's far better in short trades against ranged champions with burst, or champions like Zed whom can close distances in a threatening manner. It gives you the ability to poke them out early, and the mana usage pre-6 of Q is pretty sustainable, especially if you have a Dorans Ring. Post-6, you'll start having to manage mana (without a blue buff), the more CDR you have especially, but otherwise Q max isn't the most mana intensive.

If you're up against, say, melee champions without threatening gapclosers, E is better if you can get multiple autos off, and is a staple of top lane, given the range of champions you'll face there.
"His father is pretty juicy tbh." ~WaveofShadow
krndandaman
Profile Joined August 2009
Mozambique16569 Posts
October 03 2013 00:17 GMT
#20
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