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De4ngus
United States6533 Posts
On June 22 2012 04:13 BlasiuS wrote: Let support get aegis, Mundo needs his tankyness. lol aegis is not tanky? ok. aegis is pretty annoying to build on a support. its almost always better buy on the jungler if he can carry it. | ||
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BlasiuS
United States2405 Posts
On June 22 2012 04:26 De4ngus wrote: lol aegis is not tanky? ok. aegis is pretty annoying to build on a support. its almost always better buy on the jungler if he can carry it. Yeah I'm more comparing it to warmog's. Warmog's makes mundo way tankier than aegis due to his kit. If you have to get aegis, get it after warmog's + SV | ||
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Alzadar
Canada5009 Posts
On June 22 2012 04:32 BlasiuS wrote: Yeah I'm more comparing it to warmog's. Warmog's makes mundo way tankier than aegis due to his kit. If you have to get aegis, get it after warmog's + SV Please explain what you mean by "due to his kit". The only reason health would be more valued on Mundo than resists is the health costs on Q, W and E. Maybe that's enough, but seeing as Warmog's is pretty rarely built on other champions anymore, I question it. | ||
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Ghost-z
United States1291 Posts
In what situation is rushing Warmogs first bad on Mundo? Or is it never bad but that other items may be situationally better? | ||
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Ghost-z
United States1291 Posts
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De4ngus
United States6533 Posts
On June 22 2012 04:40 Ghost-z wrote: Here's a question? In what situation is rushing Warmogs first bad on Mundo? Or is it never bad but that other items may be situationally better? when you're poor. which is why every jungle mundo in competitive play builds boots2, hog, spirit visage, and aegis in whatever order. | ||
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BlasiuS
United States2405 Posts
On June 22 2012 04:39 Alzadar wrote: Please explain what you mean by "due to his kit". The only reason health would be more valued on Mundo than resists is the health costs on Q, W and E. Maybe that's enough, but seeing as Warmog's is pretty rarely built on other champions anymore, I question it. lol? both his passive and his ult directly scale with max health. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
Aegis > warmogs when you gank, unless you want to dive solo. Remember your other laners will benefit from the aura too. If you have to get aegis, get it early, when it has the most impact—and a farmy jungler like Mundo can get it way before your support. | ||
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Alzadar
Canada5009 Posts
On June 22 2012 04:40 Ghost-z wrote: Here's a question? In what situation is rushing Warmogs first bad on Mundo? Or is it never bad but that other items may be situationally better? If the entire enemy team is rushing Bloodrazors and/or Deathfire Grasps. Also if your team consists of four of Janna, Shen, Karma, Lux, Orianna or Lulu. In all seriousness, the thing with Warmogs is that it brings no utility at all, only defense. Other defensive items like Frozen Heart, Randuin's Omen, Frozen Mallet, Aegis, Reverie, they all bring huge utility to a team. If you can build any of those and still be tanky enough, then they are better choices. | ||
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Alzadar
Canada5009 Posts
On June 22 2012 05:00 BlasiuS wrote: lol? both his passive and his ult directly scale with max health. Are you aware of the associative property of real numbers? a*(b*c) = (a*b)*c When discussing the relative value of Health vs Resists, only flat steroids (such as Rammus W, or Renekton ultimate) are relevant. | ||
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Praetorial
United States4241 Posts
On June 22 2012 05:06 Alzadar wrote: Are you aware of the associative property of real numbers? a*(b*c) = (a*b)*c When discussing the relative value of Health vs Resists, only flat steroids (such as Rammus W, or Renekton ultimate) are relevant. What. Mundo's ultimate and passive scale directly with max health, as the person you quoted said. A mundo with, say, three hundred health, is going to heal more quickly than a Mundo with 200. The more health he has, the more he can regenerate every time he presses R, thus making him very hard to kill. I'm honestly not sure whether you know what the associative property is. | ||
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h3r1n6
Iceland2039 Posts
Anyway, flat costs on QWE make max health beneficial. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On June 22 2012 04:13 BlasiuS wrote: Let support get aegis, Mundo needs his tankyness. Someone clearly has not seen the extraordinary difference between teamfighting at 15-20 minutes with Aegis vs. teamfighting at 30 minutes with Aegis. If you get Warmog's as your first major item, you can only really continue farming, because of how much gold it spends on a lopsided mix of non-teamfighting stats. You need to get Warmog's stacked before its pulling its weight in gold in fights. Contrast this with Aegis that's pulling MORE than its gold value immediately in teamfights. Warmog's is good if you somehow have a team that doesn't need you to teamfight until 30 minutes, but most teams pick their junglers to be active teamfight participants in the 15-20 minute area, which is when Aegis is strong. EDIT: I just mathcrafted Aegis+GBelt vs. Warmog's. Warmog's fresh is essentially equivalent to Aegis+GBelt for survivability. Stacking Mog's pulls it ahead, but this doesn't account for the absolutely monstrous teamfight presence 15 minute Aegis has. There's absolutely no comparison between 15-20 minute Aegis vs. having Ruby+Regrowth+Giant's Belt at the same point in time. Again, if you can afk-farm Warmog's stacks, it'll be stronger by a significant amount at about 30 minutes, but Aegis makes you a teamfight powerhouse 10 minutes earlier than that. | ||
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NeedsmoreCELLTECH
Netherlands1242 Posts
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SagaZ
France3460 Posts
anger gives alot of extra sexual tension on your W and Q. the aoe does alot of damage and the cleavers become insane poke with more tension. on items i shy away from warmogs now, it gives alot of hp but stacking it is very hard in the jungle. I prefer going for items with extra utility and good resistances. first of all you don't want to be naked, the journey will be long and cold in the jungle, for the same reason you also spend your remaining money in red drinks after looting dead monsters for a while your feet will starthurting from all the walking, good time to go back and graba pair of shoes. after that you make your way towards the jewish health item. being healthy doesn't stop there, you next build a kindle gem and upgrade your shoes, they will help you on your journey. the order of items after that are up to you but i always build towards the 4 same items those are, spirit visage, witch you tipically build first since the magic damage is the scariest thing around the map around that time. tipically the second one is randuins omen, discouraging enemy champions and making them lose motivation is very usefull during teamfights. lastly i will go for either, zeke's herald, rounds up your cdr very nicely, gives health and increase your damage since you will be raising your E now and attack speed scales fenomenaly with it. Also it will make your own allys more cheerfull, witch is a good thing in soloqueue. the fourth item i tipically build is locket of solari. it is cheap and you being the jungler is going to be highter level than your support making the active that much stronger. if you want to build this one, you profit more for going jewish just after randuins, but it's not really necessary. with said items you are very tanky, bring alot of utility to the team, and being mundo you also do alot of damage. besides you get some street credit cause your items pop out in the chat when you complete them. | ||
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
On June 22 2012 05:00 BlasiuS wrote: lol? both his passive and his ult directly scale with max health. Resists scale directly with max health too, bro. Feel free to do some math. % Max health things will treat resists and health the same as if you had no defensive abilities at all. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
Core items on Mundo now are basically HoG, Aegis. Visage and Wit's are also great buys; Visage is more common than Wit's in my experience since it synergizes so well with Mundo's kit; on the other hand Wit's provides great dps and stats all around. Follow up items can be stuff like Zeke's, Mallet, FoN, Randuin's or basically anything really. Once you get HoG, Aegis, SV and some levels you're pretty damn unkillable already and do good damage. I prefer armor pen since it makes jungling faster than mpen and while mpen definitely helps you do damage, you end up doing more physical damage throughout the game. | ||
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Blyf
Denmark408 Posts
On June 22 2012 05:36 Praetorial wrote: What. Mundo's ultimate and passive scale directly with max health, as the person you quoted said. A mundo with, say, three hundred health, is going to heal more quickly than a Mundo with 200. The more health he has, the more he can regenerate every time he presses R, thus making him very hard to kill. I'm honestly not sure whether you know what the associative property is. 1000 hp with 100 armor = 2000 effective hp (EHP) 2000 hp with 0 armor = 2000 EHP Now if you heal 1% per second you would heal 20 EHP per second in either case. The reason HP is good on Mundo compared to many bruisers is this: Buying health is generally more cost-effective for EHP than buying resists. However, when you have sustain in the form of flat healing (most bruisers with lifesteal or similar) or heal spells (summoner heal, supports) resists are often more valuable, as they improve the efficiency of flat healing. Take summoner heal in the above example: Say summoner heal heals you for 300 hp. 300 hp with 100 armor = 600 EHP 300 hp with 0 armor = 300E HP For tankiness on any champ you should always balance HP and resists, but as most bruisers lean towards resists because of flat healing, mundo leans towards HP. Not because HP is better for him, but because HP is cheaper for increasing his EHP. Flat HP costs also make HP more favorable. Some humility would suit you well here. Alzadar was completely correct in his statement. In the future, please make an effort to try and understand what is conveyed before arguing against it. | ||
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Tooplark
United States3977 Posts
For reference, he can start longsword+2 pots and do a full clear in 3:30ish (didn't get exact time). | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
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