EPT[Champion] Udyr - Page 11
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crate
United States2474 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
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crate
United States2474 Posts
On September 14 2011 16:02 TheYango wrote: Who says you have to skip Nimbleness? 0/9/21 -- Presence of the Master CDR does more than the Smite mastery. Unless for some reason you really think the 5 gold per Smite is worth that much to you. This is exactly what I was saying. Perhaps I should've been clearer in pointing out I was responding to dnastyx. | ||
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forgotten0ne
United States951 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On September 16 2011 06:46 forgotten0ne wrote: Why do you need 21 in Util? I'd rather give him even more def, with nimbleness, and just go down to flash (or ghost if you prefer like I do). 1/13/16 6% CDR and 15% summoner CDR vs. -1 minion damage, -1 autoattack damage, and 4 MR First feels significantly better than the 2nd unless the 3rd tier Defense masteries unless you absolutely need them to stay safe on your first clear (which Udyr doesn't). More defense seems like a decent proposition until you realize that the difference between 1/13/16 and 0/9/21 is comparing some of the poorer defense masteries with some of the better util masteries. | ||
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Happy Frog
Australia490 Posts
Udyr setup and mini guide by Jatt on Monday, September 12th 2011 - 00:41 / 13041 Views / Following this weekend's IEM qualifier, I've been getting alot of questions about how I play Udyr. The setup: Runes: 15% attack speed from reds. 4.5% movespeed from quints. 13 flat mr from Blues. 13 armor or 6.8% dodge from yellows. (dodge against things like ashe to avoid slows) Masteries: 1/13/16. make sure you spec the movespeed mastery because udyr is about speeed. Starting Items: Cloth armor 4 hp pots. If you use more than 4 hp pots in the entire game on udyr you're doing it wrong Jungling paths: Udyr has tons of options in the jungle because he is so fast at clearing. the path I would suggest for everyone starting off is as follows. Kill the wolve camp with 2 activations of pheonix stance. Get your team to pull blue and give you a bit of damage on it. From there, Kill Wraiths. After Wraiths you will be level 3. Skill order ir RWR. clear the red buff by swapping between Pheonix and Turtle, your smite won't be up don't worry about it. After red kill double Golums using your smite. If all goes well it should be between 3:10 and 3:20 on the gameclock and you should be level 4. Shop, Buy boots and go to town on some fools. Skilling: RWREWRRWR -- max W -- Max E also acceptable RWRWE or RWRERW Items: I usually build Mercury treads directly after my cloth armor. like I said Udyr is all about the movement, and getting boots 2 should be a priority. if the other team is EXTREMELY low on slows and stuns Ninja Tabi would be okay but I would recommend building mainly merc treads on udyr. I build Wriggles maybe 1/15 games. I"ll only build it in extreme situations like when I need armor or if wits end isn't going to benefit me in the slightest. As you may know I go for Wits end directly after Merc Treads. Unlike Tiger Udyr, Pheonix Udyr scales with Attack Speed and you clear jungle just as fast with Wits end as you would with Wriggles. After Wits end it's all about situational tank items. Whatever gold works out to is what you should go with. FoN, Spirit Visage, Aegis, Randuins, and Reverie are all acceptable tank items for Udyr. Keep in mind Resists and CDR are more most valuable on udyr thanks to the magic that is turtle stance. That's all for now, Happy hunting. Source | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23464 Posts
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gtrsrs
United States9109 Posts
On September 16 2011 06:55 TheYango wrote: 6% CDR and 15% summoner CDR vs. -1 minion damage, -1 autoattack damage, and 4 MR First feels significantly better than the 2nd unless the 3rd tier Defense masteries unless you absolutely need them to stay safe on your first clear (which Udyr doesn't). More defense seems like a decent proposition until you realize that the difference between 1/13/16 and 0/9/21 is comparing some of the poorer defense masteries with some of the better util masteries. actually the -2 minion damage and -1 damage go a LONG way in the jungle when you're getting hit by 3+ minions 10+ times at every camp. that's like 90 damage per camp that you aren't taking. compare that to having your flash up a few seconds earlier and it makes a lot more sense to do 0/14/16 or 1/13/16 and before you ask, yes, i just tried them both consecutively, and yes, jatt's way is much much much better | ||
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Blitzkrieg0
United States13132 Posts
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Craton
United States17303 Posts
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dnastyx
United States2707 Posts
Hey that looks suspiciously like a list of some of the top junglers in the game! I've done it to all of these guys so far, but it might be an issue of them being bad or whatnot. Either way, it's not too difficult to do for a lot of junglers, so just have your support player CV and you'll learn to estimate it. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23464 Posts
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Xedat
Germany358 Posts
Why not get higher levels in bear then, the bonus movement speed sounds better than the shield from W. Edit: Also, is it useful to active 2 stances in the brush so that you have 2 stacks of the passive and then activate bear and start running for full passive? Or is this too hard on your mana, especially in the beginning? | ||
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topoulo
253 Posts
Lee sin isnt even top 3 anymore , after the overhyping ( the disappointing performance in every tournament he got picked lately ) just saying , trundle and nocturne are far better. Udyr without armor penetration marks... | ||
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freelander
Hungary4707 Posts
On October 24 2011 21:34 topoulo wrote: Udyr is easily the best jungler atm. Lee sin isnt even top 3 anymore , after the overhyping ( the disappointing performance in every tournament he got picked lately ) just saying , trundle and nocturne are far better. Udyr without armor penetration marks... why would you put apen marks on udyr tiger stance does magic dmg, so does phoenix tiger scales ridiculously with flat ad, and phoenix scales ridiculously with attackspeed | ||
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SlapMySalami
United States1060 Posts
On October 24 2011 21:25 Xedat wrote: Hi, I have a question of ganking with udyr, which I really suck at. In theory what you should do is hide in the brush and in the right moment activate bear, stun the enemy and then use tiger or phoenix, when he starts running activate bear again and repeat until he is dead? Why not get higher levels in bear then, the bonus movement speed sounds better than the shield from W. Edit: Also, is it useful to active 2 stances in the brush so that you have 2 stacks of the passive and then activate bear and start running for full passive? Or is this too hard on your mana, especially in the beginning? you wont have any sustain to farm or any tankiness for dmg also the stun is always 1 second nobody stopping u tho if u want to max e first also dont get ghost you noobs its not worth it on udyr especially because when you get into high movement speed the +ms gets severely nerfed | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On October 24 2011 21:25 Xedat wrote: Hi, I have a question of ganking with udyr, which I really suck at. In theory what you should do is hide in the brush and in the right moment activate bear, stun the enemy and then use tiger or phoenix, when he starts running activate bear again and repeat until he is dead? Why not get higher levels in bear then, the bonus movement speed sounds better than the shield from W. Edit: Also, is it useful to active 2 stances in the brush so that you have 2 stacks of the passive and then activate bear and start running for full passive? Or is this too hard on your mana, especially in the beginning? The shield from W is crazy. It's what gives Udyr such absurd survivability in fights. 220 damage block after resists every 5-ish seconds with CDR is A LOT of mitigation. And activating Monkey's Agility before ganks is a waste of mana. 10% ASpd and 3% Dodge do nothing for you where you're just Bear Stancing toward the guy. On October 24 2011 22:07 freelander wrote: why would you put apen marks on udyr tiger stance does magic dmg, so does phoenix tiger scales ridiculously with flat ad, and phoenix scales ridiculously with attackspeed Getting 12 ArPen is probably OK on either Udyr to optimize autoattack damage in jungle--slight boost to early speed at slight cost to later utility. Whether you feel it's worth it probably comes down to playstyle. | ||
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Sandster
United States4054 Posts
My question is - how good is Shurelya's? In theory it should be amazing on Udyr, but where would it fit in the build? Boots+Phil Stone+HOG delays Wit's End significantly, and Boots+Phil Stone+Wit's End means you're pretty squishy. Also, what are people's input on AS vs MS quints? Assuming standard AS red, armor/dodge yellow, MR/lvl blue. | ||
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TheKefka
Croatia11752 Posts
On October 24 2011 23:34 Sandster wrote: Saintvicious likes to go Cloth, Merc Threads, HoG, (Rejuv Bead), Wit's End, Randuins. I've also seen Udyr's that skip the HoG to rush Wit's End if they want something besides Randuins. My question is - how good is Shurelya's? In theory it should be amazing on Udyr, but where would it fit in the build? Boots+Phil Stone+HOG delays Wit's End significantly, and Boots+Phil Stone+Wit's End means you're pretty squishy. Also, what are people's input on AS vs MS quints? Assuming standard AS red, armor/dodge yellow, MR/lvl blue. I think the reason no one gets Shurelya's(or a small amount of people at least) is because your gp/5 item of choice should be HoG and the reason is because it gives you health and builds into a Randuins which is just a perfect item for a Udyr because the more the game progresses on the more tanky you will have to become and a utility item like Shur will just not cut it.You should always be able to outspeed people in lanes when you chase them and that's when the slow comes in from Randuins.Don't know for sure but I feel like Randuins is overall the superior choice and dumping extra gold into a utility item is counterproductive for a udyr. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23464 Posts
Shurelyas isn't that much a utility item but a health item. CDR is health because of the increased turtle shield spam, also slight movement speed uptime and a bit more damage if you maxed 5 in tiger and 3 in bear. If you have philo stone its 1400 for 330 hp, 15% cdr and a 40% movement active (philo stone will mostly pay for itself, a giants belt is 430 hp for 1100, and the cdr easily makes up for the difference) all which are insanely good on udyr not to mention increased regens which are very nice and lets you spam a bit more and survive a bit more poke. Currently I find that shurelyas, randuins, force of nature and trinity force are the big 4 items and you have to mix and match based on the situation. Saint always goes randuins into trinity and it's the most balanced alternative but not necessarily the best. There's always some things to consider. -Fon usually not needed with wits and mercs. Trinity, fon and shurelyas all movement speed so you don't need them all. Randuins is nearly always good assuming that have powerful auto attacker ADs. Trinity is also always good. Force of nature is pretty much the thing to go against large magic damage poke/kite though, and shurleyas is a team initiate as well as a good all around item for udyr so keep that in mind. Shurleyas+FoN gives you insane survivability versus a double ap kiting and poking teamcomp and lets you get in and out and keep full hp when you aren't in. EDIT: Jatt also likes aegis and spirit visage and doesn't favour trinity as much. I get aegis whenever I'm not getting randuins fast for whatever reason and I can imagine spirit visage+shurelyas will give you 31% cdr which means you are almost maxed without bluebuff. I still prefer trying to ninja blue buff from other team/kills and get 40% with shurelyas and penta kill :3 I can't imagine skipping MS quints for AS. MS is so hugely important early levels before you get at least high level bear and FoN/Trinity/Shurelyas and nets you a lot of kills and also speeds up your map roaming enough to compensate for very slightly slower jungle. | ||
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