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Sermokala
United States13933 Posts
The kat remake has come out and I'm really interested in a support kat. Get a quick kages and kindel and then get agressive with roaming at 6-9 all blaze style. I'm thinking that w will be whats good to max first. with the timing on a shunpo w ult combo it should be up twice while you're bulldogging whoever you're on before shunpoing out of the turret. Can I do a ward shunpo combo like lee sin? | ||
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
I hope riot doesn't take too much consideration into two of the posts on reddit. The kat talk says she will become a good jungler even though she lacks cc. And buffing her shunpo cooldown will make her a better jungler... because moving around... | ||
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Frolossus
United States4779 Posts
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MusicalPulse
United States162 Posts
 Been talking about my friend about this for the past hour, and he has concluded that basically Kat is more of a tanky dps (due to W) instead of a burst assassin like she is now (which is what I loved about her). E damage is cut by 1/3, ratio is down to 0.5 from 0.75. Q no longer scales from gunblade, but is now 0.5 from ap. W is also 0.5. Total scaling is higher, but only at level 18. All of this makes her so that she does more continuous damage, but less burst damage. You basically go in, ult which does most of the damage now, and spam W and hope you can proc some marks. And you'll die faster too because its 20% damage reduction instead of 35% reduction (this is big). Why Riot :'( | ||
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Seuss
United States10536 Posts
On August 15 2012 14:49 MusicalPulse wrote: Upset about this rework Been talking about my friend about this for the past hour, and he has concluded that basically Kat is more of a tanky dps (due to W) instead of a burst assassin like she is now (which is what I loved about her). E damage is cut by 1/3, ratio is down to 0.5 from 0.75. Q no longer scales from gunblade, but is now 0.5 from ap. W is also 0.5. Total scaling is higher, but only at level 18. All of this makes her so that she does more continuous damage, but less burst damage. You basically go in, ult which does most of the damage now, and spam W and hope you can proc some marks. And you'll die faster too because its 20% damage reduction instead of 35% reduction (this is big). Why Riot :'( You'll take more damage initially, but the key is that every single Shunpo results in damage reduction, rather than just the first. If you can cap CDR you'll reach 3.6s Shunpos, which is 83% uptime on the 20% reduction. So the 35% reduction is only better when you're tanking an initial wave of burst. It's capping CDR that's the hard part. | ||
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Frolossus
United States4779 Posts
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Klive5ive
United Kingdom6056 Posts
I never understood why Kat is an AP champion, it just doesn't make any sense. If it had an AD ratio new Kat would be a really good jungler and viable top lane. Now she's another gimmicky melee AP champ just like Diana. | ||
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Zato-1
Chile4253 Posts
On August 15 2012 16:44 Seuss wrote: You'll take more damage initially, but the key is that every single Shunpo results in damage reduction, rather than just the first. If you can cap CDR you'll reach 3.6s Shunpos, which is 83% uptime on the 20% reduction. So the 35% reduction is only better when you're tanking an initial wave of burst. It's capping CDR that's the hard part. Not so sure about CDR on Kat though; before the remake, Kat played cleanup in teamfights, and due to her passive, her skills refreshed on kill or assist, regardless of how much CDR you had on her, so CDR was a shit stat on her. After the remake, I can't be sure just yet but I still think CDR should mostly be avoided... the bigger question for me is whether hybrid items (Gunblade) are still worthwhile now that 2/4 abilities scale only with AP, or if you should go for stuff like Deathcap -> Rylai's instead to get your slow effect. Also, if you want to go AP Kat, what to build early game? Doran's Rings waste a lot of budget on mana5, buying Dblades (like AP kennen does sometimes) gives you AD at a time when only one of your skills has an AD ratio, and if you're rushing deathcap then saving up 1600g so early in the game seems daunting... maybe you should go for Revolver anyway, but with the intent to build it into a WotA instead of a Gunblade. | ||
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Sermokala
United States13933 Posts
revolver rylias abyssial sfc wota dcap I think | ||
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
On August 16 2012 00:16 Zato-1 wrote: Not so sure about CDR on Kat though; before the remake, Kat played cleanup in teamfights, and due to her passive, her skills refreshed on kill or assist, regardless of how much CDR you had on her, so CDR was a shit stat on her. After the remake, I can't be sure just yet but I still think CDR should mostly be avoided... the bigger question for me is whether hybrid items (Gunblade) are still worthwhile now that 2/4 abilities scale only with AP, or if you should go for stuff like Deathcap -> Rylai's instead to get your slow effect. Also, if you want to go AP Kat, what to build early game? Doran's Rings waste a lot of budget on mana5, buying Dblades (like AP kennen does sometimes) gives you AD at a time when only one of your skills has an AD ratio, and if you're rushing deathcap then saving up 1600g so early in the game seems daunting... maybe you should go for Revolver anyway, but with the intent to build it into a WotA instead of a Gunblade. I'd think Haunting Guise would be the ideal first item. Cheap stats including some health and nice damage. | ||
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
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phyvo
United States5635 Posts
On August 16 2012 00:16 Zato-1 wrote: Not so sure about CDR on Kat though; before the remake, Kat played cleanup in teamfights, and due to her passive, her skills refreshed on kill or assist, regardless of how much CDR you had on her, so CDR was a shit stat on her. After the remake, I can't be sure just yet but I still think CDR should mostly be avoided... the bigger question for me is whether hybrid items (Gunblade) are still worthwhile now that 2/4 abilities scale only with AP, or if you should go for stuff like Deathcap -> Rylai's instead to get your slow effect. Also, if you want to go AP Kat, what to build early game? Doran's Rings waste a lot of budget on mana5, buying Dblades (like AP kennen does sometimes) gives you AD at a time when only one of your skills has an AD ratio, and if you're rushing deathcap then saving up 1600g so early in the game seems daunting... maybe you should go for Revolver anyway, but with the intent to build it into a WotA instead of a Gunblade. While I'm mathing out a bunch of different items for Kat all I see are tradeoffs. Nothing seems inherently wrong. You can go rageblade/gunblade and rely on autos to do more DPS than deathcap + more AP, gaining sustain and a slow but relying on an item CD's burst. You can go GRB + DC and lose basically nothing at all compared to DC + more AP. Rushing WotA puts your behind personally but could be good for your team. Rylai's would sacrifice damage but make you hard to escape and tough. DFG ties your burst in with an unrefreshable CD but the increase in ability usage during non-cleanup would be big. Even sunfire cape the only downside I see is getting reported (ok maybe that's actually more troll). As a result I think new Kat is not theorycraftable. If we were all me I would stop jabbering and just go and try *everything*, because *everything* might work. | ||
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Zato-1
Chile4253 Posts
Base damage per dagger reduced from 50/65/80 to 40/50/60 AP ratio reduced from .25 to .175 AD ratio reduced from .5 to .3 So that's a 20%/23%/25% nerf to base damage, a 30% nerf to AP ratio, and a 40% nerf to AD ratio, probably a 25-30% damage nerf overall. And this is without taking Killer Instincts into consideration. At level 18 with 400 AP and no bonus AD, old Kat's DL would deal 80 damage base, +24 from Killer Instincts, +400*.25 = 100 from AP = 204 per dagger; New Kat DL would deal 60 base + 400*.175 = 130 per dagger, for a total of 36% less overall damage. EDIT: As to Shunpo and BB: Shunpo was nerfed from 80/120/160/200/240 (+0.75 AP ratio) to 40/70/100/130/160 (+0.5 AP ratio) so that's 33% reduced damage, and BB was changed from 60/95/130/165/200 (+0.8 AD, +0.35 AP) to 50/85/120/155/190 (+0.5 AP) and can detonate mark for 15/30/45/60/75 (+0.2 AP) so that's roughly 30-40% more damage than old BB if you detonate the mark. | ||
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
She will probably be played like Diana/Kassadin now, except less tanky and more escape. | ||
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Frolossus
United States4779 Posts
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
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Frolossus
United States4779 Posts
On August 16 2012 04:29 Sufficiency wrote: Also I think there is no longer any point in getting even hextech revolver. Might as well go for straight AP.... no AD ratio on Q makes me want to DFG rush or something now over gunblade | ||
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MusicalPulse
United States162 Posts
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FakeSteve[TPR]
Valhalla18444 Posts
i would imagine sandstorm looks pretty well the same cuz it wasn't hair in the first place | ||
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
On August 16 2012 06:08 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote: million dollar question, what does she look like? im at work D: i would imagine sandstorm looks pretty well the same cuz it wasn't hair in the first place lolking.com | ||
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