Like slushy said You prolly will get trucked. Its not like zilean is particularly strong in lane. Any Kayle support would have to be like zyra level in lane.

Gahlo

United States35118 Posts

March 31 2019 03:10 GMT

#42

I was thinking more of Kayle carry and Zilean support.

cLutZ

United States19573 Posts

March 31 2019 03:20 GMT

#43

On March 31 2019 12:10 Gahlo wrote:
I was thinking more of Kayle carry and Zilean support.

Support for Kayle*

Slusher

United States19143 Posts

March 31 2019 03:29 GMT

#44

Just run Kayle top and Zilian mid, it's a great combo, but they actually just can't fend for themselves level 1,2,4,5 in a 2v2

Slayer91

Ireland23335 Posts

March 31 2019 09:27 GMT

#45

why would you want to run kayle with zilean?

kayle just wants someone who can either go in or buy time until she hits lvl 16

Gahlo

United States35118 Posts

March 31 2019 09:35 GMT

#46

On March 31 2019 18:27 Slayer91 wrote:
why would you want to run kayle with zilean?

kayle just wants someone who can either go in or buy time until she hits lvl 16

I was just curious because when she came out the question was "How does she get through lane?" and the concept of her being a bot lane carry was immediately dismissed in discussions I read because of her level based nature, which Zilean alleviates the 40% duo XP penalty with his passive.

Slayer91

Ireland23335 Posts

March 31 2019 12:56 GMT

#47

except if you're playing zilean/kayle bot lane the enemy bot lane is probably going to bully you the whole lane phase

most people play kayle top and get a bit behind but its harder to punish with melee top lanes and junglers are more scary if you're a top laner

there's generally much less action top lane which means it's not a big deal having no pressure, wheras bot lane having no pressure is a bigger problem cause of 4 man dives bot, support roams mid, drakes etc

Gahlo

United States35118 Posts

March 31 2019 13:20 GMT

#48

On March 31 2019 21:56 Slayer91 wrote:
except if you're playing zilean/kayle bot lane the enemy bot lane is probably going to bully you the whole lane phase

most people play kayle top and get a bit behind but its harder to punish with melee top lanes and junglers are more scary if you're a top laner

there's generally much less action top lane which means it's not a big deal having no pressure, wheras bot lane having no pressure is a bigger problem cause of 4 man dives bot, support roams mid, drakes etc

Never claimed it was good, just asking if anybody has tried it and how it worked out.

Uldridge

Belgium4711 Posts

March 31 2019 14:39 GMT

#49

Zilean/Kayle/Olaf/Taric/Utility or hypercarry.

I've seen the invulnerable Olaf.. it's quite disgusting.

Slayer91

Ireland23335 Posts

March 31 2019 14:56 GMT

#50

if you didn't think it was good then why ask

i dont ask if anyone tried olaf+teemo botlane

On March 31 2019 23:39 Uldridge wrote:
Zilean/Kayle/Olaf/Taric/Utility or hypercarry.

I've seen the invulnerable Olaf.. it's quite disgusting.

played against yi taric jungle+top 2v1 again yesterday, we had a huge lead and still lost lol

they had kaisa too who can follow if yi is going1v5

Gahlo

United States35118 Posts

March 31 2019 15:16 GMT

#51

On March 31 2019 23:56 Slayer91 wrote:
if you didn't think it was good then why ask

i dont ask if anyone tried olaf+teemo botlane

Because I wanted to know. That's kinda how questions work.

Slayer91

Ireland23335 Posts

March 31 2019 15:42 GMT

#52

but why did you want to know?

even if some guy tried it and it went well/badly it wouldn't mean anything because there are lots of factors at play in a game

i mean the reason to try something is if you think its a good idea theoretically and want to test it in practice but if you don't think its a good idea then you're just asking how some guys game went

Slusher

United States19143 Posts

March 31 2019 16:20 GMT

#53

On March 31 2019 18:27 Slayer91 wrote:
why would you want to run kayle with zilean?

kayle just wants someone who can either go in or buy time until she hits lvl 16

I don’t think this was directed at my suggestion but pre 11 mid Zilean has good stalling, and can feed Kayle xp and post 11 he can

Post 11 his e and are are good enabling tools for top Kayle, specifically because top Kayle does not want to ult herself (she can’t auto if she ult herself)

chipmonklord17

United States11944 Posts

March 31 2019 16:43 GMT

#54

Between Kelpto and Zilean passive it definitely felt like I was hitting the powerspikes faster, but as someone else said it probably would have worked out better if both were solo laners instead of being a bot lane together. But it definitely worked out

Slusher

United States19143 Posts

March 31 2019 17:00 GMT

#55

Another thing I didn’t mention when talking about defending yourself, when playing Zilean support , good players will use your harass against you by standing on the wave to get the lane position they want. If your supporting a melee carry you will have a hard time resetting the minion equilibrium without taking the cs yourself

Gahlo

United States35118 Posts

March 31 2019 17:48 GMT

#56

On April 01 2019 00:42 Slayer91 wrote:
but why did you want to know?

even if some guy tried it and it went well/badly it wouldn't mean anything because there are lots of factors at play in a game

i mean the reason to try something is if you think its a good idea theoretically and want to test it in practice but if you don't think its a good idea then you're just asking how some guys game went

It's literally as simple as my mind wandering while sitting at a red light and thinking about a discussion I read when she came out where people were discussing where Kayle would fit on the map. Bot was discarded due to her being level based and I thought "Zilean might be able to alleviate that as a support and he's been played in that position in the past."

That's literally the beginning and end of it. It's entirely a matter of curiosity as I've not played SR heavily for years, nor do I have a desire to play either of those champs. Congrats on being a dick about it, that is your brand after all.

Slayer91

Ireland23335 Posts

March 31 2019 19:03 GMT

#57

Yes, but that implies you DID think it might be a good idea. I provided some further arguments why I think it's a bad idea, and then you said "lul I never said it was a good idea".

that's disingenuous. You are asking if someone tried it because you thought it might be a good combo.

You thought it might be a good combo because you are following the reasoning that someone said "kayle needs levels" but I provided some more reasons why she could struggle in bot lane and wouldn't work well with zilean.

I don't have a problem if you come up with an idea, and someone trashes it, and you discard it, but it annoys me if you come up with an idea, and then say "oh I never said it would be good".
If you knew it wasn't good, you wouldn't care if anyone tried it.

Hope this post made sense. I realize I'm making lots of words out of a throwaway post but it's hard to explain why my brain got annoyed at your second post.

Fildun

Netherlands4122 Posts

March 31 2019 21:33 GMT

#58

Teut's brain is annoyed. It hurt itself in its confusion.

Gahlo

United States35118 Posts

April 01 2019 00:53 GMT

#59

On April 01 2019 04:03 Slayer91 wrote:
Yes, but that implies you DID think it might be a good idea. I provided some further arguments why I think it's a bad idea, and then you said "lul I never said it was a good idea".

that's disingenuous. You are asking if someone tried it because you thought it might be a good combo.

You thought it might be a good combo because you are following the reasoning that someone said "kayle needs levels" but I provided some more reasons why she could struggle in bot lane and wouldn't work well with zilean.

I don't have a problem if you come up with an idea, and someone trashes it, and you discard it, but it annoys me if you come up with an idea, and then say "oh I never said it would be good".
If you knew it wasn't good, you wouldn't care if anyone tried it.

Hope this post made sense. I realize I'm making lots of words out of a throwaway post but it's hard to explain why my brain got annoyed at your second post.

My thoughts were a range of "it could at best be playable", since if it was actually good I wouldn't have to ask the question, I would have read about it somewhere else, to "it could just be bad" because Kayle would have too much of a problem csing for the synergy of the passives to be worth it as a bot lane. I don't tend to think in boolean logic. If I say I "Never claimed it was good"(my actual words, btw) that doesn't mean I was claiming it was bad either.

I get that you got frustrated because you thought I was disregarding your post out of hand though. I wasn't, it just wasn't what I was asking for.

Jek

Denmark2771 Posts

April 01 2019 15:44 GMT

#60

To play the devil's advocate.

Kayle only really need level 11 to take off which doesn't take that much longer in a duo lane, especially with a Zilean support. The biggest issue with playing her as the botlane carry is she's very weak in the duo lane that can abusive it much harder than the solo lanes. She would need a support that can effectively play 1v2 for a large part of the laning phase or have the jungler live down there.

The biggest question to me is why pick her over Vayne/Kaisa/Twitch/Kog if you're looking for a hyper carry botside?