EPT[Patch 7.19] Post Worlds 2017 General Discussion - Page 4
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Sent.
Poland9331 Posts
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Ansibled
United Kingdom9872 Posts
On September 29 2017 23:49 Sent. wrote: At least they (try to) fix their mistakes quickly instead of forcing us to watch "beautiful fungals" and "top 3 bloord lord control in the world" for months. I've always thought it was absurd to compare how often LoL gets patched to how often SC2 gets patched, if you fuck something up it can be banned and it's not a massive deal. If you attempted to do similar things in SC2 you'd end up with race winrates and playstyles massively jumping every 2 weeks and I really don't think that is any better. You annoy significantly more of the playerbase because most people don't just randomly switch to different races compared to people playing a lot of different champions. I guess you can say it's kind of similar to when things like ADC as a role suffered for a while, but that also took time to fix properly and most 'issues' with the overall meta take a long time to fix. Also it's probably time to get over WoL? lol... at least Riot's balance team isn't doing what Blizzard did 5 years ago? | ||
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
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kongoline
6318 Posts
On September 29 2017 23:49 Sent. wrote: At least they (try to) fix their mistakes quickly instead of forcing us to watch "beautiful fungals" and "top 3 bloord lord control in the world" for months. i disagree, the fact they hotfixed janna doesnt effect me shes still perma bannned in ranked, on the other hand we have to endure months of cancer censer/coin meta and they still haven't nerfed it properly | ||
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Ansibled
United Kingdom9872 Posts
On September 29 2017 23:56 kongoline wrote: i disagree, the fact they hotfixed janna doesnt effect me shes still perma bannned in ranked, on the other hand we have to endure months of cancer censer/coin meta and they still haven't nerfed it properly It's better than when we had an entire season of things like Azir/Sivir stalling to lategame. | ||
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
On September 29 2017 23:56 kongoline wrote: i disagree, the fact they hotfixed janna doesnt effect me shes still perma bannned in ranked, on the other hand we have to endure months of cancer censer/coin meta and they still haven't nerfed it properly What meta isn't cancer? Whatever is strong at any given time is almost always called the new "cancer". There will always be something that is strong. This isn't a league only thing, it happens in Dota 2. Metas form around the new current strong stuff. This season has just been largely two metas, the carry junglers in the start and the censor/coin. Is that inherently bad? Next year will have new different metas where new things are the "cancer". It keeps the game fresh and interesting. edit: I forgot about the tank meta! So we've had 3 distinct varied metas in this season. Seems like a win to me. You may not enjoy some of them, I know I haven't but that's just the nature of the game. | ||
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Jek
Denmark2771 Posts
On September 29 2017 23:31 GrandInquisitor wrote: Like LL or Reddit is any better ... To be honest in this case (Janna) I think they are. The issue with Janna was/is the strength and bonus AD on her shield combined with her beyond strong teamfighting, it was not CD on shield for the same reason gutting Leblanc's Distortion CD didn't destroy her - you very rarely use it constantly the instant it's off CD in the early game anyway. The mega buff to Janna was clearly Riot not doing any sort of QA on her or if they did had no Janna players try her. I legit dont think any Janna mains above platinum thought this rework was going to do anything other than make her go from very strong to broken. Her win rate in Korea after the patch was approaching 70% for crying out loud. | ||
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VayneAuthority
United States8983 Posts
Well you get a balance team that is always a patch or two behind the actual state of the game, barring outlers like janna in this case. You see it often where they will make a change down the line to a champ that isn't even a problem anymore. Like this patch they raised the price of RG, who the fuck thought that was a problem or was complaining about it? Maybe it was too strong a month or so ago when tanks were completely dominant, but that hasnt been the case for a while, ADC/support overrides everything at the moment. This also means for whatever issue is currently plaguing actual high elo, it doesn't usually get touched/fixed for 2 or 4 weeks, and by then other changes they've made have already created new issues. If you had a balance team that actually PLAYED up to date games on the meta and had a feel for the game this wouldn't happen, but instead we get this system (that is still the best game company in the world at balancing currently, thats the kicker) | ||
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
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Jek
Denmark2771 Posts
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
On September 30 2017 00:14 VayneAuthority wrote: The main problem with Riot's balance team is that it is a group of low elo people that collect data basically. What does this mean? I think this is a dangerously misguided notion that one has to be proficient in what they are designing. In fact often the people that are the best or in the top bracket of something are terrible at actually developing that. There are vastly different skillsets are work there. Those people are amazing at finding what is broken and exploiting that so you always want them part of a group that develops but you never want them to be primary developers. This problem is kind of worse in League since the player base is awful at adapting to new things. They generally stick to what they know and crying about imbalance then actively fighting it. This is partly Riots fault though as they have for years responded rapidly to complaints of imbalance instead of giving time for community to try figure out solutions before changing things. They may be attempting to correct their balance pattern now but it's a bit late so it'll time a long time to find a good middle ground. | ||
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
On September 30 2017 00:20 Numy wrote: I think this is a dangerously misguided notion that one has to be proficient in what they are designing. In fact often the people that are the best or in the top bracket of something are terrible at actually developing that. There are vastly different skillsets are work there. Those people are amazing at finding what is broken and exploiting that so you always want them part of a group that develops but you never want them to be primary developers. I mean. you should at least be knowledgeable in what you are designing. Riot does seem like their team struggles to know what makes champs good or bad, or what the potential impact of their changes might be. They dont have to be good at the game, but they should probably know how flat CDR on movement abilities (lucian dash) improves a ranged champ significantly or how Level scaling on an item you dont get until lvl 7-10 means that looking at the low early values and saying its balanced doesnt mean anything (duskblade). They seem like they have a set way they look at the game, and anything outside of that is dealt with hotfixes or other patches. Remember designers being upset people played taliyah without Q max so they changed the champ until you had to? | ||
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
EDIT: Remember that xin bug i talked about? in one of the hotfixes they just removed the reference to his W in the tooltip. lol. But now it heals, but no damage. | ||
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VayneAuthority
United States8983 Posts
One is engaging in it in real time, the other is getting a backlog of info that needs to be analyzed because they don't have the ability to process the power in real time, so it takes a while to get this stuff fixed. On another note speaking of CD, im interested to see how losing one of the most powerful rune sets in the game (Flat CD blues) affects balance in champs. There are so many champs that can abuse starting with 8% CD or higher that are going to lose this. Riven is a big one. | ||
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
On September 30 2017 01:54 VayneAuthority wrote: On another note speaking of CD, im interested to see how losing one of the most powerful rune sets in the game (Flat CD blues) affects balance in champs. There are so many champs that can abuse starting with 8% CD or higher that are going to lose this. Riven is a big one. The word was that champs starting stats and base numbers are getting tweaked to accommodate the change in starting stats with runes. But we've heard nothing about what those changes are. Im very curious. Because even if they just multiple every stat by 1.1 or something, it'll shake up what champs are capable of. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
On September 30 2017 01:54 VayneAuthority wrote: I was merely observing why some blatantly broken things like ardent stay untouched for a while, because collecting data and playing at a high level are two very different things, surely you can agree there? One is engaging in it in real time, the other is getting a backlog of info that needs to be analyzed because they don't have the ability to process the power in real time, so it takes a while to get this stuff fixed. On another note speaking of CD, im interested to see how losing one of the most powerful rune sets in the game (Flat CD blues) affects balance in champs. There are so many champs that can abuse starting with 8% CD or higher that are going to lose this. Riven is a big one. How long was Censer a widespread problem(being one of the few who catch on to something and abusing it for a while isn't much of a problem large picture) before Riot tried fixing it? | ||
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kongoline
6318 Posts
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