EPT[Patch 6.22] Pre-Season 7 General Discussion - Page 3
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
How is J4 in the new jungle? | ||
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Kinie
United States3106 Posts
Olaf is still busted with clearing it, biggest issue is figuring out which Keystone you want because he 100% cannot proc CoC, so you're probably forced into going Bond of Stone on him. | ||
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General_Winter
United States719 Posts
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On November 11 2016 08:32 Kinie wrote: Dunno, Kindred seems like ass in the jungle. She takes like no damage from the camps other than chickens due to proper kiting, but the birds just wreck her. The major problem is she just does no damage to quickly clear the camps compared to the other meta junglers. Olaf is still busted with clearing it, biggest issue is figuring out which Keystone you want because he 100% cannot proc CoC, so you're probably forced into going Bond of Stone on him. You prolly want Stormraiders Surge. Warlords Bloodlust might be good too. | ||
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Kinie
United States3106 Posts
On November 11 2016 13:19 iCanada wrote: You prolly want Stormraiders Surge. Warlords Bloodlust might be good too. I had Warlord's Bloodlust, that's why I felt that she could clear it pretty well, it's just the damn little chickens don't get killed by 1 or even 2 uses of her Q (the amount you can usually get off with Q - W - Q - Q with AAs in-between each cast of your skills), when she can kill the big bird with 3 Qs and AAs in-between each one. The little chickens do too much damage and have too much HP. | ||
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Scip
Czech Republic11293 Posts
On November 11 2016 13:19 iCanada wrote: You prolly want Stormraiders Surge. Warlords Bloodlust might be good too. wat really my first guess would be fervor, second guess would be thunderlords you usually dont need speed n shit unless you're a chicken who doesn't go blue smite On November 10 2016 09:31 Zess wrote: Some data points from testing jungle clears (none of these are with a leash): Olaf - full clear from blue -> gromp down to krugs - 3:40 and half HP Shyvana - 3:30-3:45 depending on if you take AS blues or not, side choice doesn't matter, although starting from blue side leaves you slightly healthier being able to put a 2nd point into W before doing raptors Graves - full clear from blue - 3:50 basically don't need to use potions at all and still full HP (lol hella broken wtf). Clearing from red side is much worse. Around 4:00, and you both run oom and need more pots Nidalee - full clear from blue - 3:50 and dangerously unhealthy first two camps but then you faceroll raptors and krugs (with a leash should be super good) Rengar - full clear from red 4:10. The free ferocity stack from jumping out of a bush + the bush mastery help a ton. Start talisman because you no longer get empowered Q super AS to lifesteal off of. You finish at 1/4 hp Nautilus - 4:30 starting from blue, finishes around 1/2 hp Olaf at 3:40 sounds pathetic, you can easily get 3:20 and 3:10 is probably close to optimal haven't tried others but I'm gonna go ahead and be sceptical about other values on the grounds of your olaf clear being trash so far got 3:16 with EWQQ 18/12/0 AD/Armor18/CDR/AD runes starting machete but can definitely improve on a lot of things | ||
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Yorbon
Netherlands4272 Posts
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Scip
Czech Republic11293 Posts
On November 11 2016 16:51 Yorbon wrote: Just a quick question following the post above. How important is the duration of the first clear? Is it important because it translates directly into clear speed later (and that's important?)? I get that you can get a tempo advantage with a faster clear; is it always a net win to maximise early clear? Yea the tempo advantage is pretty huge. Besides some pretty clear exceptions if you're a level ahead of the enemy, you can safely walk in the river and your enemy can not, given your middle lane isn't getting rekterino'd. That just snowballs for various reasons. Future clear is of course important as well, and first clear is a decent but not perfect predictor (depends on whether you build cinderhulk or a man item, jumps get disproportionately better over time when it comes to clearing) | ||
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Yorbon
Netherlands4272 Posts
On November 11 2016 17:14 Scip wrote: Yea the tempo advantage is pretty huge. Besides some pretty clear exceptions if you're a level ahead of the enemy, you can safely walk in the river and your enemy can not, given your middle lane isn't getting rekterino'd. That just snowballs for various reasons. Future clear is of course important as well, and first clear is a decent but not perfect predictor (depends on whether you build cinderhulk or a man item, jumps get disproportionately better over time when it comes to clearing) Thanks! | ||
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
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Sent.
Poland9331 Posts
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
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kongoline
6318 Posts
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
On November 11 2016 22:36 kongoline wrote: i agree with scarra this should be called supports not assassins patch, so many strong support items got added and buffed assassins pale in comparison any time assassins are played supports become incredibly important. | ||
GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On November 11 2016 16:51 Yorbon wrote: Just a quick question following the post above. How important is the duration of the first clear? Is it important because it translates directly into clear speed later (and that's important?)? I get that you can get a tempo advantage with a faster clear; is it always a net win to maximise early clear? The best way I've heard it explained is that getting better at jungling is mostly about being more efficient. You have a limited time budget that you can spend on ganking, counterganking, counterjungling, deep warding, pressuring, etc., and every second counts. If you show up at the right place but a few seconds too late, that can make all the difference between who snowballs early game. Now imagine that you're playing a jungler who gets an extra 30 seconds for free because the clear is that much faster; you have so much more time now and can get so much more done. Hence why Nidalee was 100% pick/ban at worlds. | ||
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Scip
Czech Republic11293 Posts
On November 11 2016 22:32 Alaric wrote: Wait, going E first on Olaf is more damage than W or Q at level 1 now (assuming you're starting blue or gromp)? I think so the problem is the jungle is a fking joke now, it takes you ages to drop to low HP if you level W lol | ||
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
On November 12 2016 01:34 Scip wrote: I think so the problem is the jungle is a fking joke now, it takes you ages to drop to low HP if you level W lol i can confirm. i finished a full clear with Ziggs jungle at half hp. lol Pretty easy to stay high on hp with a ton of random champs. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
On November 12 2016 01:43 PrinceXizor wrote: i can confirm. i finished a full clear with Ziggs jungle at half hp. lol Pretty easy to stay high on hp with a ton of random champs. This is a good thing for the future. We've had a very problematic jungle because everyone but the "good" junglers would be nearly dead when Elise pops her head in. | ||
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
On November 11 2016 23:40 PrinceXizor wrote: any time assassins are played supports become incredibly important. They are only being played because ppl are testing 1 or 2 at best will be meta when thing settle | ||
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