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[Patch 5.22] League of Legends General Discussion

Forum Index > LoL General
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If you've played around on the new patch and have some secret TL-op builds we should try out, post about them here! http://www.liquidlegends.net/forum/lol-strategy/498168-patch-522-what-is-marksman-gameplay-discussion
NeoIllusions
Profile Blog Joined December 2002
United States37500 Posts
November 10 2015 20:23 GMT
#1
Welcome to this patch's General Discussion thread for the League of Legends subforum. This thread is for discussion around League of Legends. Free feel to talk about anything LoL related here that does not already have its own thread. While posting standards tend to be rather lax in this thread, pointless spam will not be tolerated.

Gameplay discussion should go in the Patch Discussion thread.

Non-League of Legends dicsussion should go in the LiquidLegends Lounge.

Certain topics are blacklisted from LoL General Discussion and they include:
  • "Elo hell"
  • The Tribunal
  • Bans, either from TL.net or LoL

Additionally, the TL LoL Ten Commandments are available for you to reference if you have any questions about this subforum.

Use the LoL Strategy subforum if you have game or champion specific questions. Lastly, confine QQing and bragging to their respective threads.

There is no new champion this patch.

Patch 5.22: Live on Nov. 11th, 2015

+ Show Spoiler [Previous GD Threads & Patch Notes] +
Patch 5.22 General
Patch 5.20 General
Patch 5.19 General Discussion
Patch 5.18
Patch 5.17
Patch 5.16
ModeratorFor the Glory that is TeamLiquid (-9 | 155) | Discord: NeoIllusions#1984
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
November 10 2015 20:25 GMT
#2
Re: Illaoui

Nautilus would still be decent in defense situations without his Q (or if it was a hard cc but not a grab) just because he's so damn hard to kill and spams shit to make your backline hard to reach (or keep the fight in the same place).
She can do, at least defensively. You probably don't want to dive if she's had time to setup a few tentacles around the tower.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
GrandInquisitor *
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
New York City13113 Posts
November 10 2015 20:40 GMT
#3
Is there going to be a meta shift to have a duo lane in mid now, and your AP carry in bot?
What fun is it being cool if you can’t wear a sombrero?
Numy
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
South Africa35471 Posts
November 10 2015 20:41 GMT
#4
On November 11 2015 05:40 GrandInquisitor wrote:
Is there going to be a meta shift to have a duo lane in mid now, and your AP carry in bot?


Think lane swapping to top would be better than mid. Mid doesn't give you many more options than going top with your duo lane. Currently supports roam enough to be active in all 3 lanes from that position anyway.
MoonBear
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-11-10 22:51:50
November 10 2015 22:27 GMT
#5
Oh my god did AP Kog just get nerfed RIP

But buff for execution snipes hmmm

New tower armour/MR system really really rewards push comps, especially with the level and minion dmg snowballing effect.

Red buff hurts towers omg
ModeratorA dream. Do you have one that has cursed you like that? Or maybe... a wish?
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-11-10 23:01:30
November 10 2015 22:59 GMT
#6
Ambient Gold
With items costing more as part of our global efficiency pass, we're injecting more cash into the flow, as well as a little extra for the down-and-out.
FOR DOING NOTHING, YOU GET9.5 gold per 5 seconds â‡' 10.2 gold per 5 seconds
BAILOUTAfter 12 minutes, the 2 members of each team with the least gold at any given moment gain an additional 2 gold per 5 seconds (increasing by 0.1 per minute)


Not a fan.

they increased minion gold too, people are going to finish their builds really fast this season.. maybe.
Carrilord has arrived.
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
November 10 2015 23:39 GMT
#7
--- Nuked ---
Goumindong
Profile Joined February 2013
United States3529 Posts
November 11 2015 00:32 GMT
#8
Ambient gold i am eh over but holy fuck the minion damage changes coming in the next patch

UPDATE: We froze the pushing changes below at the last minute, so these won't be going live in 5.22. They'll make their official debut in 5.23!

Comboing with the turret changes above, minions now get stronger to help the winning team press their advantage and close out the game

MINION DAMAGE BONUS If your team's average level is higher than the enemy's, your minions deal 10% bonus damage to enemy minions. If you've taken cumulatively more turrets than the enemy team, damage is further increased by 10% for each turret you have over your opponents.

ENRAGE If your team's average level is at least 3 higher than the enemy's and you've taken 2 or more towers in a given lane, your minions in that lane deal 90% more damage to enemy minions

MINION DAMAGE REDUCTION If your team's average level is higher than the enemy's, your minions take less damage from enemy minions equal to (tower differential x level differential) + 1. This number can't fall below 1.

IRONCLAD If your team's average level is at least 3 higher than the enemy's and you've taken 2 or more towers in a given lane, your minions in that lane take 7 less damage from enemy minions


Like Holy fuck pushing just got INSANE.

If you're a higher level than the enemy all your lanes auto push. For every turret advantage you have over the enemy your minions auto push harder. If you're really ahead your turrets auto push in the lane you're winning in to an insane degree.
oo_Wonderful_oo
Profile Blog Joined December 2013
The land of freedom23126 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-11-11 00:46:27
November 11 2015 00:43 GMT
#9
On less serious note.

Is there anyone who has maths on lw vs bt as third item on adcs?

Because there was HTC game right now where Ashe went bt third against team, where biggest armor items were hourglass/dmp and no armor besides that, is bt significantly better?

Thanks in advance, mathguys. <3
LiquidLegends StaffFPL 25 #1 | tfw I cast games on-air | back-to-back Liquibet winner
101toss
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
3232 Posts
November 11 2015 00:53 GMT
#10
is it just me or does the adc base damage increase look broken as shit
Math doesn't kill champions and neither do wards
Celial
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
2602 Posts
November 11 2015 01:21 GMT
#11
my brain hurts
Do not regret. Always forward, never back.
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-11-11 01:32:34
November 11 2015 01:29 GMT
#12
On November 11 2015 09:32 Goumindong wrote:
Ambient gold i am eh over but holy fuck the minion damage changes coming in the next patch

Show nested quote +
UPDATE: We froze the pushing changes below at the last minute, so these won't be going live in 5.22. They'll make their official debut in 5.23!

Comboing with the turret changes above, minions now get stronger to help the winning team press their advantage and close out the game

MINION DAMAGE BONUS If your team's average level is higher than the enemy's, your minions deal 10% bonus damage to enemy minions. If you've taken cumulatively more turrets than the enemy team, damage is further increased by 10% for each turret you have over your opponents.

ENRAGE If your team's average level is at least 3 higher than the enemy's and you've taken 2 or more towers in a given lane, your minions in that lane deal 90% more damage to enemy minions

MINION DAMAGE REDUCTION If your team's average level is higher than the enemy's, your minions take less damage from enemy minions equal to (tower differential x level differential) + 1. This number can't fall below 1.

IRONCLAD If your team's average level is at least 3 higher than the enemy's and you've taken 2 or more towers in a given lane, your minions in that lane take 7 less damage from enemy minions


Like Holy fuck pushing just got INSANE.

If you're a higher level than the enemy all your lanes auto push. For every turret advantage you have over the enemy your minions auto push harder. If you're really ahead your turrets auto push in the lane you're winning in to an insane degree.

TBH I don't think the Enrage and Ironclad effects are ever really going to be all that relevant.

In virtually every situation where your team's average level is 3+, you're already stomping super hard. It just closes out one-sided games much faster.

Also, apparently this change had been on the PBE for a while, but no one ever noticed...
Source
Amarok
Profile Joined August 2010
Australia2003 Posts
November 11 2015 01:59 GMT
#13
I thought the minion damage changes were to stop someone with a lead freezing a wave.
Fighting for peace is like screwing for virginity
Frolossus
Profile Joined February 2010
United States4779 Posts
November 11 2015 02:30 GMT
#14
On November 11 2015 09:43 oo_Wonderful_oo wrote:
On less serious note.

Is there anyone who has maths on lw vs bt as third item on adcs?

Because there was HTC game right now where Ashe went bt third against team, where biggest armor items were hourglass/dmp and no armor besides that, is bt significantly better?

Thanks in advance, mathguys. <3

last whisper is always better for damage as a 3rd item. the reason ashe would go for BT is because the sustain would've been more important than the damage at that point
oo_Wonderful_oo
Profile Blog Joined December 2013
The land of freedom23126 Posts
November 11 2015 02:32 GMT
#15
On November 11 2015 11:30 Frolossus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 11 2015 09:43 oo_Wonderful_oo wrote:
On less serious note.

Is there anyone who has maths on lw vs bt as third item on adcs?

Because there was HTC game right now where Ashe went bt third against team, where biggest armor items were hourglass/dmp and no armor besides that, is bt significantly better?

Thanks in advance, mathguys. <3

last whisper is always better for damage as a 3rd item. the reason ashe would go for BT is because the sustain would've been more important than the damage at that point


I'd just like to see maths same to Koggles pd/lw debate but not as detailed.
LiquidLegends StaffFPL 25 #1 | tfw I cast games on-air | back-to-back Liquibet winner
crimethinking
Profile Joined February 2015
Vietnam765 Posts
November 11 2015 02:35 GMT
#16
Nerfing Bloodthirster pushing it further into the abyss?
ktrolster | OMG | worldelite
kongoline
Profile Joined February 2012
6318 Posts
November 11 2015 03:11 GMT
#17
On November 11 2015 09:32 Goumindong wrote:
Ambient gold i am eh over but holy fuck the minion damage changes coming in the next patch

Show nested quote +
UPDATE: We froze the pushing changes below at the last minute, so these won't be going live in 5.22. They'll make their official debut in 5.23!

Comboing with the turret changes above, minions now get stronger to help the winning team press their advantage and close out the game

MINION DAMAGE BONUS If your team's average level is higher than the enemy's, your minions deal 10% bonus damage to enemy minions. If you've taken cumulatively more turrets than the enemy team, damage is further increased by 10% for each turret you have over your opponents.

ENRAGE If your team's average level is at least 3 higher than the enemy's and you've taken 2 or more towers in a given lane, your minions in that lane deal 90% more damage to enemy minions

MINION DAMAGE REDUCTION If your team's average level is higher than the enemy's, your minions take less damage from enemy minions equal to (tower differential x level differential) + 1. This number can't fall below 1.

IRONCLAD If your team's average level is at least 3 higher than the enemy's and you've taken 2 or more towers in a given lane, your minions in that lane take 7 less damage from enemy minions


Like Holy fuck pushing just got INSANE.

If you're a higher level than the enemy all your lanes auto push. For every turret advantage you have over the enemy your minions auto push harder. If you're really ahead your turrets auto push in the lane you're winning in to an insane degree.
or enemy gets fed free minion while u get starved(similar to super early inhibitor being pretty bad for "winning" team especially in soloQ), either way i hate it
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
November 11 2015 03:23 GMT
#18
On November 11 2015 12:11 kongoline wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 11 2015 09:32 Goumindong wrote:
Ambient gold i am eh over but holy fuck the minion damage changes coming in the next patch

UPDATE: We froze the pushing changes below at the last minute, so these won't be going live in 5.22. They'll make their official debut in 5.23!

Comboing with the turret changes above, minions now get stronger to help the winning team press their advantage and close out the game

MINION DAMAGE BONUS If your team's average level is higher than the enemy's, your minions deal 10% bonus damage to enemy minions. If you've taken cumulatively more turrets than the enemy team, damage is further increased by 10% for each turret you have over your opponents.

ENRAGE If your team's average level is at least 3 higher than the enemy's and you've taken 2 or more towers in a given lane, your minions in that lane deal 90% more damage to enemy minions

MINION DAMAGE REDUCTION If your team's average level is higher than the enemy's, your minions take less damage from enemy minions equal to (tower differential x level differential) + 1. This number can't fall below 1.

IRONCLAD If your team's average level is at least 3 higher than the enemy's and you've taken 2 or more towers in a given lane, your minions in that lane take 7 less damage from enemy minions


Like Holy fuck pushing just got INSANE.

If you're a higher level than the enemy all your lanes auto push. For every turret advantage you have over the enemy your minions auto push harder. If you're really ahead your turrets auto push in the lane you're winning in to an insane degree.
or enemy gets fed free minion while u get starved(similar to super early inhibitor being pretty bad for "winning" team especially in soloQ), either way i hate it

Depending on your team strategy it could either be a buff or nerf to powerfarming the jungle
Freeeeeeedom
Gahlo
Profile Joined February 2010
United States35165 Posts
November 11 2015 03:41 GMT
#19
On November 11 2015 11:30 Frolossus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 11 2015 09:43 oo_Wonderful_oo wrote:
On less serious note.

Is there anyone who has maths on lw vs bt as third item on adcs?

Because there was HTC game right now where Ashe went bt third against team, where biggest armor items were hourglass/dmp and no armor besides that, is bt significantly better?

Thanks in advance, mathguys. <3

last whisper is always better for damage as a 3rd item. the reason ashe would go for BT is because the sustain would've been more important than the damage at that point

Even with the changes to it?(assuming LW now refers to the items it upgrades into.) In the case off opposing armor items being DMP or Hourglass, even counting runes, you're only punching through 17.7 armor.
Goumindong
Profile Joined February 2013
United States3529 Posts
November 11 2015 04:48 GMT
#20
On November 11 2015 09:43 oo_Wonderful_oo wrote:
On less serious note.

Is there anyone who has maths on lw vs bt as third item on adcs?

Because there was HTC game right now where Ashe went bt third against team, where biggest armor items were hourglass/dmp and no armor besides that, is bt significantly better?

Thanks in advance, mathguys. <3


Lots of things changing so its hard to say. Consider this cursory. With new masteries and 10 AD in runes[this is higher than i think is optimal]

Level 18 Ashe will have about 195 AD with IE, PD and. 20 AD from runes/masteries.

So 265 AD with BT and 235 with Domincks Regards. 50% crit changes this to 463.75/411.25. So NO stacks of the bonus damage mastery leads us to.

411.25(1+armor+.6bonus-.07) = 463.75(1+armor+bonus-.07)

.6BONUS = 52.5/411.25 (1+armor-.07)
-,52765 bonus = 52.5/411.25 (1+armor-.07)
bonus = .22+armor/4.1332583

So it depends on their bonus armor and base armor where LW is better at about a rate of 22 +base armor/4. So at 100 base armor its about 50 Bonus armor.

Same thing again, but now with another 80 damage/hit

bonus =.196+armor/4.742

Or about 40 bonus armor for 100 base armor.

So LW will do more damage on almost everyone who has a single armor item. BT is probably still the better overall buy though, you don't do damage if you're dead.
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