EPT[Patch 5.13] Tahm Kench General Discussion - Page 40
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Caiada
United States3052 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
It still doesn't *do* anything. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
On July 22 2015 03:58 TheYango wrote: One thing that hasn't been brought up is now much RNG the weak spot mechanic is subject to. If it appears at a random angle, the actual effectiveness/practicality of a weak spot can be heavily dependent on where it appears. This is doubly so given the near-instantaneous turning speed of champions in LoL, which means there's much higher dependence on where the weak spot appeared and where the enemy chooses to face than on your own character's actual movement. For example, if the weak spot appears at the front of the enemy's model, they cannot fight you without letting you hit the weak spot; if it appears at their back, you basically have to run straight through them and ignore them to actually ever hit it. The videos are really bad about this (Riot pls), but the ult's seems to suggest that the weal spots are fixed on the "ground" rather than on your character's direction. So it's more a "you're boned if you're red-side and your weak spot appears on your left" top lane. | ||
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Seuss
United States10536 Posts
On July 22 2015 03:58 TheYango wrote: One thing that hasn't been brought up is now much RNG the weak spot mechanic is subject to. If it appears at a random angle, the actual effectiveness/practicality of a weak spot can be heavily dependent on where it appears. This is doubly so given the near-instantaneous turning speed of champions in LoL, which means there's much higher dependence on where the weak spot appeared and where the enemy chooses to face than on your own character's actual movement. For example, if the weak spot appears at the front of the enemy's model, they cannot fight you without letting you hit the weak spot; if it appears at their back, you basically have to run straight through them and ignore them to actually ever hit it. I'm working under the assumption that week spots do not turn with the champion, they're just random cardinal directions. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
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krndandaman
Mozambique16569 Posts
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
And while thematically weak spots might make sense as a fencer, how does she see a weak spot behind her target? The heal on the ult is weak thematically. There's a lot of RNG added to her passive. And while she may seem like a low skill champion according to champion.gg's chart of winrates by number of games played, you don't need to add a skill shot to her lunge. That ability wrecks me whenever I play Jayce or Kayle top and I'm hiding behind creeps. The current Fiora scares me and has a role in league as she's a high dps, high burst, melee, with a decent early game, that has a lot more ease sticking to champions due to the double lunge. The only other champs that scare me like that are Riven, Irelia, and Renekton due to their similar high damage and double dashes. I don't think this Fiora will do the same due to lunge becoming a skillshot. There are other ways to increase her skill cap, removing her current ult isn't one of them. | ||
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Caiada
United States3052 Posts
On July 22 2015 04:03 Alaric wrote: The crit "mechanic" on it is stupid as hell and I don't see what purpose it serves. 'cept maybe to let her do stuff even when underfarmed. The videos are really bad about this (Riot pls), but the ult's seems to suggest that the weal spots are fixed on the "ground" rather than on your character's direction. So it's more a "you're boned if you're red-side and your weak spot appears on your left" top lane. Reward for hitting the second attack. I assume they wanted to give her a free critical attack along with the aspd, but just saying 'your next hit autocrits' is boring and would interact weirdly with Lunge burst. Instead, one weak attack with a slow, one free burst attack. Also prevents giving too much IE incentive. There's a lot of subtle shit to the weak spot thing as well. Lunge through a target, E the weak spot for a slow, autocrit the next weak spot. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On July 22 2015 04:03 Seuss wrote: I'm working under the assumption that week spots do not turn with the champion, they're just random cardinal directions. The point about RNG still stands (outcome of a trade is hugely different if you get 3 weak spots that appear facing toward you vs. having them on the opposite side). And that just means the text about "defending weak spots" counterplay is just bullshit because the only way to "defend" a weak spots if it doesn't turn with your champion is to run away, lol. | ||
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
On July 22 2015 04:11 Caiada wrote: Reward for hitting the second attack. I assume they wanted to give her a free critical attack along with the aspd, but just saying 'your next hit autocrits' is boring and would interact weirdly with Lunge burst. Instead, one weak attack with a slow, one free burst attack. Also prevents giving too much IE incentive. There's a lot of subtle shit to the weak spot thing as well. Lunge through a target, E the weak spot for a slow, autocrit the next weak spot. Oh, you can lunge through targets? That's different then. I kind of liked the bonus AD on her W, while it was an invisible stat, it encourages her towards crit builds rather than on-hit builds. I'm not sure her current kit does the same. On her E one attack can't crit. The next one has to crit. So if you have a 20% crit, the first attack loses a 20% crit chance, the second one hits for 80% bonus crit chance. But if you get to a late game crit build, where you have 75% crit chance, your first attack will lose a 25% crit chance and your second will gain a 25% crit chance. No increase in expected dps. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On July 22 2015 04:11 Caiada wrote: E the weak spot for a slow, autocrit the next weak spot. There's not any indication that critting on a weak spot hit affects the bonus damage. Most likely it's just a fixed damage proc that scales with your level or your AD. That's why I said they don't synergize well. Her E wants her to just stand and attack twice in quick succession, while her passive and ult want her to move between every attack, meaning attack speed past a certain point becomes less useful since she'll spend her attack cooldown moving anyway. | ||
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Caiada
United States3052 Posts
On July 22 2015 04:20 obesechicken13 wrote: Oh, you can lunge through targets? That's different then. I kind of liked the bonus AD on her W, while it was an invisible stat, it encourages her towards crit builds rather than on-hit builds. I'm not sure her current kit does the same. On her E one attack can't crit. The next one has to crit. So if you have a 20% crit, the first attack loses a 20% crit chance, the second one hits for 80% bonus crit chance. But if you get to a late game crit build, where you have 75% crit chance, your first attack will lose a 25% crit chance and your second will gain a 25% crit chance. No increase in expected dps. It's to disincentivize crit past a certain point, logistically, I'm sure. It basically averages her crit out to 50% whenever you use E, and you want to use E for the slow. If I had to guess, it'll steer the ideal build to Tforce->Ghostblade->one of Hydra/IE. On July 22 2015 04:21 TheYango wrote: There's not any indication that critting on a weak spot hit affects the bonus damage. Most likely it's just a fixed damage proc that scales with your level or your AD. That's why I said they don't synergize well. Her E wants her to just stand and attack twice in quick succession, while her passive and ult want her to move between every attack, meaning attack speed past a certain point becomes less useful since she'll spend her attack cooldown moving anyway. The attack speed is weird, yeah. Though in straight duels with an opponent you're already in range of, you could do E->AA/Q to next point/AA. | ||
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GhandiEAGLE
United States20754 Posts
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
On July 22 2015 04:33 GhandiEAGLE wrote: While the complaints about how Weak Spots feel/function are valid, can we please assume that Riot has at least done some playtesting? I mean we're talking about basic flaws that would be revealed after 1-2 games. We can at least give Riot more credit that that >.> lol.How about that time ryze reached live and he could perma root people and you could find out after 1 game of testing? | ||
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
Someone made a funny comment on reddit about her ult: "we Janna now boys" | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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krndandaman
Mozambique16569 Posts
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
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GolemMadness
Canada11044 Posts
DAMAGE 40/55/70/85/100 ⇒ 40/50/60/70/80 Nerf Eve's main damage ability by 20% at max rank, but don't touch Rek'sai, Gragas or Nidalee. Makes sense. | ||
Inflicted
Australia18228 Posts
On July 22 2015 05:22 GolemMadness wrote: Q - Hate Spike DAMAGE 40/55/70/85/100 ⇒ 40/50/60/70/80 Nerf Eve's main damage ability by 20% at max rank, but don't touch Rek'sai, Gragas or Nidalee. Makes sense. I think Rek'sai is fine. He's not too OP outside of competitive Grag/Nid definitely need a nerf though RIP Azir though | ||
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