EPT[Patch 4.7] Braum General Discussion - Page 112
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turdburgler
England6749 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
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turdburgler
England6749 Posts
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cLutZ
United States19573 Posts
On May 22 2014 01:05 TheYango wrote: I think it's really hard to correlate winrate with game impact--since high game impact means that not only would playing well result in wins more often, but playing poorly would result in losses more often, which should even out. Indeed. I would say its just indicative of a shallow champion pool with no niche picks that do well against that pool. Your typical soloq dominator is like the old rammus who was devastating in soloq because his weaknesses made him non meta, but were less exploitable without A team. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
- Champion is OP: if a champion is OP, then it's likely that someone who plays that champion wins more with it than their other less OP champions - Champion/role familiarity: A player who is good at a particular champion probably wins more with it than his off-champions. A player who is good at a particular role probably wins more with it than his off-roles - Game impact: This is still *potentially* a factor. Basically how this works out is that if a given role has lower game impact, then his winrates for individual champions in that role are likely to be closer to 50% because him playing exceptionally well at his good champions or exceptionally poorly at his bad champions are less likely to be game-deciding. There are other possible factors than this that I'm not thinking of, and aggregate winrate alone is probably not a good enough statistic to individually single out any one of these. | ||
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dae
Canada1600 Posts
On May 22 2014 01:26 TheYango wrote: If we assume that the majority of the players in the sample are close to 50% winrate (I don't think that's a terrible assumption since most people who are at Diamond have probably played enough for their winrate to be more or less stable), then the overall winrate of a particular player across all their champions should be 50%. Naturally, however, they will have champions they win more with, and lose more with. A higher than 50% average winrate means that this is one of the champions that they win more often with. There are a lot of possible factors that contribute to this, including: - Champion is OP: if a champion is OP, then it's likely that someone who plays that champion wins more with it than their other less OP champions - Champion/role familiarity: A player who is good at a particular champion probably wins more with it than his off-champions. A player who is good at a particular role probably wins more with it than his off-roles - Game impact: This is still *potentially* a factor. Basically how this works out is that if a given role has lower game impact, then his winrates for individual champions in that role are likely to be closer to 50% because him playing exceptionally well at his good champions or exceptionally poorly at his bad champions are less likely to be game-deciding. There are other possible factors than this that I'm not thinking of, and aggregate winrate alone is probably not a good enough statistic to individually single out any one of these. Theres also the fact that some players have pocket picks that are really really good in some comps/vs other comps, but which are not generally a good idea to pick. For example, I play Veigar alot, but there is so much stuff with/against that I just won't pick him for, since it just isn't a good idea if I want to win. This leads to when I do pick him, it's in a good game for it, which leads to a 70+% Veigar winrate. Yet Veigar really isn't that good of a champion right now. Edit: Same thing for stuff like old kassadin vs lux. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
On May 22 2014 01:35 dae wrote: Theres also the fact that some players have pocket picks that are really really good in some comps/vs other comps, but which are not generally a good idea to pick. For example, I play Veigar alot, but there is so much stuff with/against that I just won't pick him for, since it just isn't a good idea if I want to win. This leads to when I do pick him, it's in a good game for it, which leads to a 70+% Veigar winrate. Yet Veigar really isn't that good of a champion right now. Edit: Same thing for stuff like old kassadin vs lux. that fits under number two "role familiarity" | ||
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Goumindong
United States3529 Posts
On May 21 2014 18:18 GolemMadness wrote: How are champions like Velkoz, Jinx, Aatrox, Lissandra, Zac, etc, so much more versatile or anything than a bunch of the older ones? Yea, they kinda are. With maybe the exception of Velkoz. Compare them to their closest champion and not the peak of the early champions (so Jinx to immobile AD's like Ashe and Kog'Maw; Velkoz to immobile mids like Lux). I mean Lissandra has a Dash/Teleport, Slow, Root, and Stun/Zhonya + Slow. That is a pretty amazing amount of utility for a burst mage On May 21 2014 19:44 MattBarry wrote: Sona is pretty darn versatile. Probably equal with Nami Sona is worthless*. *OK, not entirely worthless but pretty close. She is dominated in most every aspect by another support. | ||
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turdburgler
England6749 Posts
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Gahlo
United States35093 Posts
TL;DR- Korean PC viewership of all-stars almost doubles from 750k from the 400k for S3WC. | ||
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Goumindong
United States3529 Posts
On May 22 2014 02:04 turdburgler wrote: shes fine solo q still. you just pick an ADC with a strong level 6 , use sonas sustain to make sure you dont die before six and then just blow them up. from there you can probably snowball the lane pretty hard, other supports with a strong level 6 dont have heals so shes not completely useless. Eh, just buy more HP pots on a non-sustain champion. Ok for serious here. Sona isn't useless, she is great in a hard push composition against a defensive support but she is pretty terrible otherwise. She will probably get some play against Braum. The bonus AD from her Q and her poke allow a stronger AD against a weaker support (like Janna) to continually shove and take towers and snowball really fast. This was a lot stronger last season when junglers were ganking top all the time instead of bottom but it can still be potent. The problem is that this requires that both the support and AD are on the same page (and so super push), requires that you're able to stay ahead consistently (as soon as you fall behind you're super squishy and easy to engage onto) , and requires that you've got the composition to do this. This makes it really poor in soloqueue unless you're duo queueing Currently the Support/AD combinations that this works against basically don't exist and all the ones which are marginal all have tools to turn the situation around swiftly and permanently. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
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Sponkz
Denmark4564 Posts
Sona is squishy and immobile and that will be her main-weakness until they decide to possibly revert some of the nerfs they did to her. I like Sona, but nowadays i'd rather just pick morg/braum/gragas over her, so i don't feel like a 5th wheel with a good aoe-ult. | ||
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
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Sponkz
Denmark4564 Posts
Thresh vs Sona, I'd give thresh the upper hand any day. You can win against him if you do good poking before he gets all 3 skills, but hooks will be your death (obviously). | ||
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
I mean it's really cool to walk a tightrope over a pool of sharks and if you get to the end everyone thinks you're awesome, but if you fall off then everyone is like lol report Sona for feeding. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
midgame and post she's fine too because of high damage and aoe ult also she's weaker against tanky team comps, who are less vulnerable to her ults and damage, and don't rely on poke sona can heal. Champions with lots of CC and stuff like black shield are great against tanky comps because they protect the AD who can kill them | ||
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
Sona vs Leona though... that shit is utterly impossible for me. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
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