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jaymik
Korea (South)425 Posts
On April 07 2014 19:44 IMoperator wrote: oh and also looks like tribunal is finally back up and running, got banned for 3 days on my smurf all with games from the past week. so be careful out there. ty for that chuckle | ||
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IamPryda
United States1186 Posts
On April 07 2014 15:02 cLutZ wrote: Well, you kinda get to pick out of those things. But balancing the toplane and jungle as a whole is not fairly easy. But that is simply because most of their recent changes to both have gone in the wrong direction, which means the sweeping changes that need to happen would temporarily throw things into a crazy imbalanced state ala when BC and Warmogs were crazy in S3. Step 1: Champions without mana get all cooldowns increased dramatically, and/or all healing removed from their kits. Champions that use mana, but have manaless forms have the same treatment applied to said form. Step 2: Rewards on jungle camps shifted away from all big monsters to small monsters, same with HP of said monsters. 3: Increase overall rewards of jungle, but move the camps back towards the base. After that it comes down to tweaks. Should you shorten the sidelanes? Maybe, or maybe you give lategame champions better scaling, or reduce the scaling of earlygame champions, At the point you just have to recognize that you should balance champions based on when you want champion XX to overtake champion YY, and when you do that you need to account for the lead that champion XX should already have. Like, currently only the Shyvana vs. Renekton matchup even works in that manner anymore, sometimes Shen vs. Renekton will, but thats more of just weird lane. Most of those changes you are talking about may balence the game better but seem to just force things back to the days of farm all day and never fight. I really think all riot needs to do is buff some of the mana Based tops laning phase. Giving champs like malphite singed Olaf tiny early game buffs to spell cost/mp5 and lvl 1/2 abiltys | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
On April 07 2014 15:13 Scip wrote: You have done a very good job of explaining what you would like to see happen. Can you explain what effect do you want to achieve with those things? Because link between the changes you proposed and "balance in the jungle and toplane" are not at all obvious, I think it would be greatly appreciated. (on my phone so a bit brief) Manaless is simple: In the jungle it means they practically do not care about donating blue. In lane, it means they have too much wave clear, sustain, and/or trading power (if they are strong). The problem is they easily swing the other way as well, because if they are balanced against mana users in any way, every matchup turns into pantheon: can you tank the mana pool, if so, you win, if not, painful. Jungle camps is two things: Clearing Power and ganking should be inversely proportional (generally) and less single target helps that. Secondly I generally disfavor the smite steal jungle style even including dragon and baron, because it rewards champions that are already good at ganking. The second half of that is pure aesthetics, but the first is essential. Rewards nearer base also should be to even out rewards of ganking and farming. Camps closer to base make this easy to tweak. After you are there, then addressing scaling is a numbers thing, plus items, which is half + of warwicks problem, for instance. | ||
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phyvo
United States5635 Posts
One of Riot's new favorite buzzwords for reworks is "fantasy". It makes me uncomfortable when the designers are outright saying "how do you want to escape reality?" | ||
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Gahlo
United States35170 Posts
On April 07 2014 21:13 phyvo wrote: One of Riot's new favorite buzzwords for reworks is "fantasy". It makes me uncomfortable when the designers are outright saying "how do you want to escape reality?" To be fair, they're making a videogame where you play a wizard that possesses people to participate in a bloodsport. I think it applies. | ||
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RouaF
France4121 Posts
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MattBarry
United States4006 Posts
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
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Zdrastochye
Ivory Coast6262 Posts
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Zdrastochye
Ivory Coast6262 Posts
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
On April 07 2014 22:19 Zdrastochye wrote: Sure, make it .3 bonus AD scaling, and it does the same damage no matter where it hits you from. Lets get things as stale as possible. No. Make it 0.6 to 2.4 bonus AD scaling based on distance. Voila, she is fixed. Her problem is that her E and Q both scale with AP. If you change one of them she will be easier to balance. | ||
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zer0das
United States8519 Posts
On April 07 2014 21:44 RouaF wrote: Aaaand Riot is going to completely rework my most played champ this season (the wolf).... WHY ? They are? Oh god. He's my fallback freelo jungler noooo. | ||
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
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MattBarry
United States4006 Posts
On April 07 2014 22:37 Roffles wrote: Scip, since you have a decent understanding of the challenger scene in EU, can you tell me if any of the teams (NiP, C9 EU, Denial Esports, Reason Gaming) have a legitimate shot at making it into the summer split of LCS? Poor Millennium is going to get slaughtered by NiP | ||
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
On April 07 2014 22:37 zer0das wrote: They are? Oh god. He's my fallback freelo jungler noooo. Freeelo top laner, yes. He is a terrible jungler. | ||
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
Riot doesn't rework champions for balance purposes most of the time. If the champion can be balanced with numbers tweaks, that's what they do. Riot reworks champions when their kits are awful, and are either not fun to play, don't make any logical/thematic sense, or not fun to play against. Warwicks kit is awful. He only has two abilities. One of them is his ult which is about as point and click boring as you can get, and pales in comparison to newer similar abilities like Vi ult or Yasuo ult or even Skarner ult, both in effect and in just how neato it is. Warwicks other ability is his Q, which is what makes him an antifun top laner. It's also a pretty stupid ability, you just walk up to the other guy, press Q and you won the trade. It's entirely on the other guy to never get into your Q range to begin with. His W and E are so boring they're basically not even there, they're just passive buffs that barely even cost mana, they may as well be on all the time so you don't have to press the button. I'm not sure how you could see Warwick as anything but an antiquated and idiotic champion that badly needs a rework. | ||
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zer0das
United States8519 Posts
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Scip
Czech Republic11293 Posts
On April 07 2014 22:37 Roffles wrote: Scip, since you have a decent understanding of the challenger scene in EU, can you tell me if any of the teams (NiP, C9 EU, Denial Esports, Reason Gaming) have a legitimate shot at making it into the summer split of LCS? Here are my best guesses: C9 is the team with K0u and Voidle right? K0u is imo top 3 euw jungler (alongside Amazing and Svenskeren), the laners are pretty good. Not sure who their ADC is, but it looks like he is too high on ladder for me to ever meet him LOL. I would be very surprised if they didn't make it with current lineup (maybe K0u will still be 16 then? or is he 17 already, not sure), I would even expect them to be in the upper half of the league if they keep their current lineup (k0u is toxic as all hell lololool) NiP is really good too, not as good though imo. Zorozero is god and Hulberto is not to be underestimated and he used to play shaco sonofabitch, nukeduck was pretty bad in LCS though so not so sure about him. Bottom lane is pretty good, as much as I hate to admit it Freeze is good but again toxic as all hell holy shit. Not too sure what to think about Denial, another polish team so who knows they could surprise, Kikis is a fucking legend but he is a legendary Akali and solo laner in general, not a jungler lol. He's been playing jungle for a while but I'm not sure he's a beast yet. NiQ has been really good for a while but if I'm not mistaken the 3 other guys are polish randoms. Giving this team low chance of success. RG I don't know, the name beansu (their toplane according to LP) sounds really familiar and I think he's beast and so is BarneyD but I dont know the other 3 guys at all. I'd give these very low chance of success. My knowledge of EUW scene has diminished though, I've been in very low challenger/high D1 for a while now and it's not really sufficient to meet all these people, so take with a grain of salt. | ||
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
He's a champion where screwing up the rework would be pretty hard to do, IMO! | ||
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
On April 07 2014 16:13 Ryuu314 wrote: I had it happen to me once in an URF game. Definitely seeing an increase in the number of people drophacking. A year ago you'd almost never see any legitimate complaint about hackers. I'm not entirely surprised though since League has been and is getting bigger and bigger. I also can't imagine Riot won't be doing anything about it. My guess is that they're gonna stay quiet on the issue until they've fixed the vulnerability because that's how 99% of online gaming companies deal with hackers. Except 99% of those never really get around to patching those exploits. On April 07 2014 20:10 Doctorbeat wrote: Just tried out MF. She's still pretty damn weak, they should remake her E. Oh and is Heal OP now. Im seeing teams with 3xHeal in it... Until they give MF insane damage, she's going to be weak as a pretty immobile AD. I kinda like her E from a non-competitive angle, its very fun on URF and ARAM. Heal is dumb. Oh you're focusing my carry? Let's just give him an extra 1000 hp! On April 07 2014 22:59 Ketara wrote: Warwick is obviously in glaring need of a rework, I'm not sure what's up with you guys. Riot doesn't rework champions for balance purposes most of the time. If the champion can be balanced with numbers tweaks, that's what they do. Riot reworks champions when their kits are awful, and are either not fun to play, don't make any logical/thematic sense, or not fun to play against. Warwicks kit is awful. He only has two abilities. One of them is his ult which is about as point and click boring as you can get, and pales in comparison to newer similar abilities like Vi ult or Yasuo ult or even Skarner ult, both in effect and in just how neato it is. Warwicks other ability is his Q, which is what makes him an antifun top laner. It's also a pretty stupid ability, you just walk up to the other guy, press Q and you won the trade. It's entirely on the other guy to never get into your Q range to begin with. His W and E are so boring they're basically not even there, they're just passive buffs that barely even cost mana, they may as well be on all the time so you don't have to press the button. I'm not sure how you could see Warwick as anything but an antiquated and idiotic champion that badly needs a rework. I'm not sure what world you're playing in where Warwick outtrades other toplaners. I think he's viable as a jungler. He's very weak and basically can't gank till 6, but if you ward well and have good map awareness, you can negate your lanes getting smashed in by ganks. Of course, it doesn't stop them from getting their faces smashed in by their lane opponents. Probably not competitive, but not too bad. | ||
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