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On January 25 2013 00:41 Ghost-z wrote:
I find it impossible to play a farming jungle in soloq because all your lanes will just feed the enemy jungler reguardless of wards and then QQ about how bad their jungler is for not ganking even though you are 40 cs ahead of the enemy jungler.
So go gank. Set some plays up for your team. It's not particularly hard to just farm the jungle all day long and do nothing else.
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On January 25 2013 01:10 AnomalySC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 25 2013 00:41 Ghost-z wrote:
I find it impossible to play a farming jungle in soloq because all your lanes will just feed the enemy jungler reguardless of wards and then QQ about how bad their jungler is for not ganking even though you are 40 cs ahead of the enemy jungler. So go gank. Set some plays up for your team. It's not particularly hard to just farm the jungle all day long and do nothing else.
Or counter-jungle, if the enemy jungler is spending too much time setting up ganks. I'm by no means "good" at this game, but I end up farming a lot more than ganking because it seems like my lanes are almost always pushed past mid. If one of my lanes is approximately even with their lane mate and is getting pushed I gank a few more times.
It's very rare that ALL of your lanes feed the enemy jungler. If so, the enemy jungler is carrying and is just better than you and your team. It's not the end of the world though to give up on one your lanes and focus on helping the other lanes get big enough to carry. At least that's what I've always heard.
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damn I almost lost it when I saw someone named "In Cholesterol" on Xj9's stream, his Vi looks really strong, I didn't want to play her after release because she was too buggy but you guys think she's worth picking up for the jungle?
I don't main jungle but when I have to I mostly play fun stuff like olaf, lee.
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United States15536 Posts
On January 25 2013 01:18 AsnSensation wrote:
damn I almost lost it when I saw someone named "In Cholesterol" on Xj9's stream, his Vi looks really strong, I didn't want to play her after release because she was too buggy but you guys think she's worth picking up for the jungle?
I don't main jungle but when I have to I mostly play fun stuff like olaf, lee.
Sounds like you like axing/punching things. If this is true, then Vi for anything is a good idea.
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United States23745 Posts
On January 25 2013 01:18 AsnSensation wrote:
damn I almost lost it when I saw someone named "In Cholesterol" on Xj9's stream, his Vi looks really strong, I didn't want to play her after release because she was too buggy but you guys think she's worth picking up for the jungle?
I don't main jungle but when I have to I mostly play fun stuff like olaf, lee.
From what I've heard the QoL bug fixes have made her much more enjoyable to play. As for if you should pick her up, that just depends on your play style. She is perfect for XJ9 because he gets massive farm and she's able to to absurd damage, if you're not taking lane farm/securing kills she kinda falls behind. Reminds me of jungle Riven in that sense.
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On January 25 2013 01:08 obesechicken13 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 25 2013 00:40 Bladeorade wrote:
Trynd actually has really good ganks. E in with W slow is a lot of ganking power and if your laner has any CC at all you do tons of damage Yi has really good ganks too even though he lacks CC. Run up to people and hit them. The only problem is he's really squishy so I've been having some success playing him as a tank. I don't get to make much use of his E or R damage scaling though so I stopped playing him. Like even if I became fed as Yi and built squishy I wouldn't trust myself to be able to carry whereas with a ranged AD I might. Bruiser really fails at using multiplicative scaling.
Ah Yi has crap ganks compared to Trynd imo. Relies on red.
I have been jungling Yi often I go wriggles zerkers PD GA IE and just crush people. Its the getting there thats hard. I often have to put my laners on mute because if I take even 1 CS they complain.
Tank Yi works well BECAUSE of his E and R not because you cant use the scaling. He gets free 70 AD and so much free AS and MS that building tank he still does crazy damage. Strap a frozen mallet and some resists on him and he can do great. I just dont find it as fun.
I wish they would change his Q to AD damage and just make him AD Caster/Melee Carry. I mean guy is flying along hitting people with his sword but it does magic. Dislike. But then one of Fiora or Yi would be obsolete but they pretty much both are right now anyway.
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On January 25 2013 01:18 AsnSensation wrote:
damn I almost lost it when I saw someone named "In Cholesterol" on Xj9's stream, his Vi looks really strong, I didn't want to play her after release because she was too buggy but you guys think she's worth picking up for the jungle?
I don't main jungle but when I have to I mostly play fun stuff like olaf, lee.
I am testing Vi jungle and I have mixed feelings about her. On a positive note she clears the jungle pretty fast, she is not that mana hungry so no arguments here about her jungling, however, on the other side she is a poor ganker before level 6, its fuckin hard to hit with her Q (mainly due to the speed handycap on it and you also need to wait to make it worth the hit) and even when u hit with it, its not a real disable, if you are not coordinated perfectly with your lane buddy, the enemy just walks away (especially when you are still without boots, you can't even place your E punches). So, she cannot gank successfully, nevertheless, she needs to get fed to bi viable late game, she is kind of diving in type of champions but without survivabilty qualities like Olaf, Malph etc., she cannot do it if she is not fed, and you are not getting fed in jungle without good early ganks, but yet again she clears the jungle pretty fast, and she can bully the other jungler if she wants coz she doesnt lose a lot of health in the jungle.
Overall, this is my observations on her, and I still cannot decide how to play her in the jungle or do I like her there.
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On January 23 2013 07:50 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On January 23 2013 07:47 cLutZ wrote:On January 23 2013 07:41 LaNague wrote:
people switch in soloqueue now?
Not even the pros understand when switch and often put themselves in a worse situation than without switch.
Lane matchup, farming cosiderations, powercurves, map control, gank protection and ganks, dragon control....
All that and probably more plays a role for switches.
Not to mention, you make the 1v2ers game a miserable experience :D There are not enough toplane champs that are good at 1v2. This is a fundamental problem in LoL right now, when if you are not Olaf you can't farm and survive. If you are Vlad/Kayle/Jayce, you can farm, but you die. If you are Shen/Malph you can survive, but not farm, but it doesnt matter. GL playing Jax, Singed, Xin, Irelia, etc 1v2 though. Jarvan, Galio, Lee, Maokai, Yorick, Cho'gath all 1v2 at an acceptable level (some of them much better than that).
Hey this is pretty late but i like running 1v2 lanes with my friends cos then no one has to be stuck in a difficult 2v2 lane because that's the fastest way to destroy friendships ever.
SO here's rugfeeder's list of good 1v2 laners that rugfeeder enjoys (in addition to the ones mentioned above):
Gragas really good
Morgana ok
Urgot with Teleport ok, you can harass fine but you have a hard time pushing creepwaves without blowing all your mana on Q
Karthus pretty good, Q spam to clear waves but you die ezpz.
Karma good, very dangerous to dive her but she has a hard time clearing waves safely against some lanes. Low farm bad tho
Heimer maxing E first can clear waves safely but doesn't really accomplish too much outside of that, still works ok though
Those are the ones that I've played, and I think the following ones would work but I have no experience with them
Nautilus hook to run away, Riptide to clear. Shield can absorb some damage for you.
Nasus spam spirit fire free creep wave
Cassiopeia same as Karthus but with even better long range wave clear?
Diana Q is still cheap and creepslaughtery
On most of these I run mp5 yellow, AP blue/quint, and mpen reds to one shot creep waves faster. Urgot I run ad mp5 cdr arpen (or the closest runepage I have to that hue).
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On January 25 2013 01:18 AsnSensation wrote:
damn I almost lost it when I saw someone named "In Cholesterol" on Xj9's stream, his Vi looks really strong, I didn't want to play her after release because she was too buggy but you guys think she's worth picking up for the jungle?
I don't main jungle but when I have to I mostly play fun stuff like olaf, lee.
She's really, really good. Xj9 maxes E and builds mostly damage so he gets to spam E to farm quickly (Q is superior in terms of mana and damage but is constricted by its cooldown, while E max can use 2-3 Es to clear the golems fast, then by the time you walk to the top turret where your top just died/recalled, you already have another E to use and farm the whole wave with).
Her W gives her burst early, and excellent dps later on, while the ability to auto reset twice with E with added damage gives her good burst. If you can reach somebody without using your ult, a phage/red buff ensures a W proc on top of the basic damage from Q, auto, E, and if they flash/use an escape spell (hai Lee, Ezreal) you just ult them and they can't do anything.
She's a very strong duelist once she gets some levels/items and you get to stick to your opponent after the initial hits.
She also farms quite fast thanks to Q base damage, W, and E AoE (really I auto the wolves once, the wraiths not a single time, and the rest of their HP is done through the Q in and the AoE cone from E) and whenever you want to cover/push, just charge a Q to hit the whole wave, then turn around and E the tail minion to blast everything to your bank account.
It's not that she was bad before the bugs. She had a few issues that could make her awkward (her burst was slower, and her dps a bit lower, because of E wind-down (it did reset the auto timer, but the wind down almost compensated that by itself) and you could be scewed by cc in teamfights as taking a root/stun while charging your Q would put it on cooldown. It's better now, but her clearing power and speed were already there, and the fun factor too.
On January 25 2013 01:33 M2 wrote:
however, on the other side she is a poor ganker before level 6, its fuckin hard to hit with her Q (mainly due to the speed handycap on it and you also need to wait to make it worth the hit) and even when u hit with it, its not a real disable, if you are not coordinated perfectly with your lane buddy, the enemy just walks away (especially when you are still without boots, you can't even place your E punches)
I failed at ganking because of not hitting Q too, but I decided to work on it and now that I'm able to reliably Q the opponent even if he tries to juke in the bushes her ganks are actually pretty good.
Q is a slight knock-back with good base damage, and applies a W stack. The cc allows you to chain an auto, which you can cancel into E to immediatly proc W. Since I max Q first in the jungle it does good damage already, and I've got an AS buff well the enemy armour is reduced, so there should be no way for them to keep fighting.
They can't always run because boots are my first buy, and I get phage too (or I just gank with red buff). If your laner has some follow-up cc (they shouldn't burn it on the engage, your Q should be enough) then you can drop a target quite low. She's not insta-100-0 material with her base damage, but if an opponent pushes, or drop at 2/3 health from trading early, you can easily get a first blood gank off them;
Also note that her auto range goes from 125 to 175 when using E (to help the reset on moving targets), it's more or less the same as Wukong auto->Q combo in terms of range. That one change was a straight-up buff when they integrated it to the QoL stuff.
As for the late game, if you build her like Xj9 then sure you need to get fed, but he doesn't play for the late game, he plays the "get fed and snowball" game. In one game which VoD I linked a day or two ago he had all of his jungle stolen from him save from wolves and golems at level 1 and mid and top snowballed off of the invade, so he decided to buckle up for a long game and actually built for a tanking/peeling Vi. The cc immunity and displacement on her ult is good, W is enough dps for a bruiserish style later on, and her passive helps her tankiness, so she can do just fine (that's actually how Monte and I build her: tanky, and punch people for ages without dying, W'll do the job).
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On January 25 2013 01:33 M2 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 25 2013 01:18 AsnSensation wrote:
damn I almost lost it when I saw someone named "In Cholesterol" on Xj9's stream, his Vi looks really strong, I didn't want to play her after release because she was too buggy but you guys think she's worth picking up for the jungle?
I don't main jungle but when I have to I mostly play fun stuff like olaf, lee. I am testing Vi jungle and I have mixed feelings about her. On a positive note she clears the jungle pretty fast, she is not that mana hungry so no arguments here about her jungling, however, on the other side she is a poor ganker before level 6, its fuckin hard to hit with her Q (mainly due to the speed handycap on it and you also need to wait to make it worth the hit) and even when u hit with it, its not a real disable, if you are not coordinated perfectly with your lane buddy, the enemy just walks away (especially when you are still without boots, you can't even place your E punches). So, she cannot gank successfully, nevertheless, she needs to get fed to bi viable late game, she is kind of diving in type of champions but without survivabilty qualities like Olaf, Malph etc., she cannot do it if she is not fed, and you are not getting fed in jungle without good early ganks, but yet again she clears the jungle pretty fast, and she can bully the other jungler if she wants coz she doesnt lose a lot of health in the jungle. Overall, this is my observations on her, and I still cannot decide how to play her in the jungle or do I like her there.
I don't find her pre6 ganks to be that bad actually. I'd recommend focusing on using q to get close enough to apply red buff rather than actually trying to hit them. In fact, if you're ganking from behind (esp in something like top lane), then you REALLY don't want to use q, since the hitbox is weird enough that you can just sail right past them
edit: I havn't played her since the patch, would you say the cc-immunity on her ult is more reliable now than it was before, alaric? Kus i remember it being about 50/50, and def not something to bet any money on.
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If you're ganking with Vi pre-6 think like Xin Zhao. You don't want to use your gap closer immediately unless you absolutely have to because they're just going to flash the moment you jump to them anyway.
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On January 25 2013 01:08 obesechicken13 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 25 2013 00:40 Bladeorade wrote:
Trynd actually has really good ganks. E in with W slow is a lot of ganking power and if your laner has any CC at all you do tons of damage Yi has really good ganks too even though he lacks CC. Run up to people and hit them. The only problem is he's really squishy so I've been having some success playing him as a tank. I don't get to make much use of his E or R damage scaling though so I stopped playing him. Like even if I became fed as Yi and built squishy I wouldn't trust myself to be able to carry whereas with a ranged AD I might. Bruiser really fails at using multiplicative scaling.
I've seen a fed jungle Yi maybe twice in my life. One actually almost got a cross-map septakill/ace at around 19 minutes, but Kogmaw juked him under a turret. Everyone built a thornmail and ignored little old Ryze who promptly got a triple and a penta. <3
I feel like playing against a Yi jungle means you just have to be careful. If you're anywhere under half health after he hits 6, if he runs into lane even a flash probably can't save you b/c he just Q's back onto you. I feel like its surprisingly strong.
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jungle vi is really strong imo, she does SO much dmg i think she really excels at like dueling or like 2v2 top situation type things, great counter ganker / somewhat counter jungler..
then at 6 her ganks are ridiculous. ive seen so many vi jungles get really fed and carry so hard.
idk i feel like with some of thew new releases they have all had new mechanics and such but it seems like they havnt really added anything new to the pool, so its kinda like either they are good at everything or just slightly worse  .. i dont think vi has somehting really special about her, same with like elise, syndra, nami, etc. - they all just kinda have just good solid all around kits with weird mechanics
its not like champions like ashe or something who have specific niches or janna, cass, karth, etc.
so when i see vi played and play her im like woah shes really cool but she only really has the lasting effect of a standardish tanky dps >_>
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United States15536 Posts
O_o If that's true, that seems out of nowhere. Well, not "nowhere" but I didn't think they were doing THAT poorly. Wow.
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On January 25 2013 02:52 AsmodeusXI wrote:O_o If that's true, that seems out of nowhere. Well, not "nowhere" but I didn't think they were doing THAT poorly. Wow.
I wouldn't be surprised if several organizations owned money took some steps after all the drama surfaced. It only takes 1 lawsuit for breach of contract to make you end it very quickly
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On January 25 2013 02:58 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On January 25 2013 02:52 AsmodeusXI wrote:O_o If that's true, that seems out of nowhere. Well, not "nowhere" but I didn't think they were doing THAT poorly. Wow. I wouldn't be surprised if several organizations owned money took some steps after all the drama surfaced. It only takes 1 lawsuit for breach of contract to make you end it very quickly
Its not that much out of nowhere since after the thing with Destiny CLG announced their thing with AZUBU, Na'vi GuardsmanBob and a few others left for Twitch and things clearly havent been going well for a while with own3d and this last batch of bad was the final nail in the coffin so to speak
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I for one welcome our new Twitch overlords. I just hope Twitch is actually profitable.
To clarify, I wrote this before reading the Reddit post of the exact same joke.
In my opinion part of what made Twitch win the war (besides obvious better performance) was the very easy registration and fun and accessible chat. Plus there is a whole slew of other gaming channels/communities on Twitch. I love me some speedrunning.
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United States23745 Posts
On January 25 2013 03:06 Chrispy wrote:
I for one welcome our new Twitch overlords. I just hope Twitch is actually profitable.
To clarify, I wrote this before reading the Reddit post of the exact same joke.
In my opinion part of what made Twitch win the war (besides obvious better performance) was the very easy registration and fun and accessible chat. Plus there is a whole slew of other gaming channels/communities on Twitch. I love me some speedrunning.
Yeah, I really like Twitch, but I'm interested to see what Azubu does with their thing. Competition is a good thing, prevents stagnation.
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On January 25 2013 03:24 onlywonderboy wrote:Show nested quote +On January 25 2013 03:06 Chrispy wrote:
I for one welcome our new Twitch overlords. I just hope Twitch is actually profitable.
To clarify, I wrote this before reading the Reddit post of the exact same joke.
In my opinion part of what made Twitch win the war (besides obvious better performance) was the very easy registration and fun and accessible chat. Plus there is a whole slew of other gaming channels/communities on Twitch. I love me some speedrunning. Yeah, I really like Twitch, but I'm interested to see what Azubu does with their thing. Competition is a good thing, prevents stagnation.
In theory.
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EPT
