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On September 05 2012 13:55 Flakes wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 13:41 upperbound wrote:On September 05 2012 12:44 Flakes wrote:On September 05 2012 12:31 Requizen wrote:
Is it just me, or do duo queues who go bot seem to always be really sub par? You'd think with communication it'd be better, but it never seems that way. Well, a lot of times duo queues get their MMR boosted above one/both of the players' skill range -- presumably to compensate for the communication, but unfortunately mechanics are pretty important botlane. When I duo'd with my friend chipsahoy, we had a lot more success when he jungled and just ganked my lane. Alternately, duoing with a smurf is completely broken -- you just destroy people since the random factor of your teammates' skills is that much smaller, and their elo is still higher than you and your partner's because of the MMR boost. Meanwhile the other team will have lower rated players (somewhere in between the duo and the 3 pubs). I don't understand -- are you expecting people playing at an Elo below their true skill to be balanced? Nah, just pointing out that a duo with a smurf breaks the entire 5v5, since each of the other three teammates will all have a higher average elo than their lane opponents, due to the MMR boost and 'team rating' mechanics. This is what causes the "90%/10%" Dgiese mentioned, since duo queues are usually lower rated than both their teammates and opponents, but occasionally much higher.
At my low ELO (1300 ish), when I met premade bot lane, there is usually a gap between the two (most of the time a 200 elo or more difference) and the last pick always wants the AD carry which often leads to situation where they get smashed in game.
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On September 05 2012 15:52 oHInsane wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 13:55 Flakes wrote:On September 05 2012 13:41 upperbound wrote:On September 05 2012 12:44 Flakes wrote:On September 05 2012 12:31 Requizen wrote:
Is it just me, or do duo queues who go bot seem to always be really sub par? You'd think with communication it'd be better, but it never seems that way. Well, a lot of times duo queues get their MMR boosted above one/both of the players' skill range -- presumably to compensate for the communication, but unfortunately mechanics are pretty important botlane. When I duo'd with my friend chipsahoy, we had a lot more success when he jungled and just ganked my lane. Alternately, duoing with a smurf is completely broken -- you just destroy people since the random factor of your teammates' skills is that much smaller, and their elo is still higher than you and your partner's because of the MMR boost. Meanwhile the other team will have lower rated players (somewhere in between the duo and the 3 pubs). I don't understand -- are you expecting people playing at an Elo below their true skill to be balanced? Nah, just pointing out that a duo with a smurf breaks the entire 5v5, since each of the other three teammates will all have a higher average elo than their lane opponents, due to the MMR boost and 'team rating' mechanics. This is what causes the "90%/10%" Dgiese mentioned, since duo queues are usually lower rated than both their teammates and opponents, but occasionally much higher. At my low ELO (1300 ish), when I met premade bot lane, there is usually a gap between the two (most of the time a 200 elo or more difference) and the last pick always wants the AD carry which often leads to situation where they get smashed in game.
I always felt last pick in general was always the "bitch" role of whatever the hell everyone else didn't want. I mean you are last pick, you don't really get a choice in the matter. Afterall, if you just troll and whine it's just gonna be a dodge anyway.
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On September 05 2012 15:58 Celestial wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 15:52 oHInsane wrote:On September 05 2012 13:55 Flakes wrote:On September 05 2012 13:41 upperbound wrote:On September 05 2012 12:44 Flakes wrote:On September 05 2012 12:31 Requizen wrote:
Is it just me, or do duo queues who go bot seem to always be really sub par? You'd think with communication it'd be better, but it never seems that way. Well, a lot of times duo queues get their MMR boosted above one/both of the players' skill range -- presumably to compensate for the communication, but unfortunately mechanics are pretty important botlane. When I duo'd with my friend chipsahoy, we had a lot more success when he jungled and just ganked my lane. Alternately, duoing with a smurf is completely broken -- you just destroy people since the random factor of your teammates' skills is that much smaller, and their elo is still higher than you and your partner's because of the MMR boost. Meanwhile the other team will have lower rated players (somewhere in between the duo and the 3 pubs). I don't understand -- are you expecting people playing at an Elo below their true skill to be balanced? Nah, just pointing out that a duo with a smurf breaks the entire 5v5, since each of the other three teammates will all have a higher average elo than their lane opponents, due to the MMR boost and 'team rating' mechanics. This is what causes the "90%/10%" Dgiese mentioned, since duo queues are usually lower rated than both their teammates and opponents, but occasionally much higher. At my low ELO (1300 ish), when I met premade bot lane, there is usually a gap between the two (most of the time a 200 elo or more difference) and the last pick always wants the AD carry which often leads to situation where they get smashed in game. I always felt last pick in general was always the "bitch" role of whatever the hell everyone else didn't want. I mean you are last pick, you don't really get a choice in the matter. Afterall, if you just troll and whine it's just gonna be a dodge anyway.
Last pick = support. Hue.
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On September 05 2012 15:58 Celestial wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 15:52 oHInsane wrote:On September 05 2012 13:55 Flakes wrote:On September 05 2012 13:41 upperbound wrote:On September 05 2012 12:44 Flakes wrote:On September 05 2012 12:31 Requizen wrote:
Is it just me, or do duo queues who go bot seem to always be really sub par? You'd think with communication it'd be better, but it never seems that way. Well, a lot of times duo queues get their MMR boosted above one/both of the players' skill range -- presumably to compensate for the communication, but unfortunately mechanics are pretty important botlane. When I duo'd with my friend chipsahoy, we had a lot more success when he jungled and just ganked my lane. Alternately, duoing with a smurf is completely broken -- you just destroy people since the random factor of your teammates' skills is that much smaller, and their elo is still higher than you and your partner's because of the MMR boost. Meanwhile the other team will have lower rated players (somewhere in between the duo and the 3 pubs). I don't understand -- are you expecting people playing at an Elo below their true skill to be balanced? Nah, just pointing out that a duo with a smurf breaks the entire 5v5, since each of the other three teammates will all have a higher average elo than their lane opponents, due to the MMR boost and 'team rating' mechanics. This is what causes the "90%/10%" Dgiese mentioned, since duo queues are usually lower rated than both their teammates and opponents, but occasionally much higher. At my low ELO (1300 ish), when I met premade bot lane, there is usually a gap between the two (most of the time a 200 elo or more difference) and the last pick always wants the AD carry which often leads to situation where they get smashed in game. I always felt last pick in general was always the "bitch" role of whatever the hell everyone else didn't want. I mean you are last pick, you don't really get a choice in the matter. Afterall, if you just troll and whine it's just gonna be a dodge anyway.
Well if his premade partner is going to support, its almost better imho to give him AD, then the other roles.  And then u just have to hope that his 200+ elo partner can babysit him good enough so he does not feed. :#
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when im last pick i always support unless someone else takes it, when im not last pick and the last pick calls a non support role i always fill the role we need which is usually support, past a certain elo that is. People need to believe in their teammates more.
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Shouldn't that be motivation though? If you're gonna be last pick support every game, then just get good at support and win.
I guess it helps that I like playing support anyway : /
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On September 05 2012 16:14 zulu_nation8 wrote:
when im last pick i always support unless someone else takes it, when im not last pick and the last pick calls a non support role i always fill the role we need which is usually support, past a certain elo that is. People need to believe in their teammates more.
supports have just as much influence on the game as any other role. I think the reason why people do not prefer playing it, is the fact that they are bad at playing support, which leads to a low win% with that role. dedicated supports often have pretty sick win ratios and I've yet to meet a dedicated support player who does not have at least decent if not high elo.
the reason I do not like to play it all the time, is because I'am too afraid of duo lanes in general. You can mess up duo lanes so easily just because one guy makes a perfectly viable decision while the other guy makes a perfectly viable decision which happens to be the complete opposite of the other, which leads into messing up. Alot of guys lose their temper and especially their trust when even only slightly behind in lane.
then there are alot of people who don't get how duo lanes work. in most lanes the support has to be proactive and the carry has to react on the supports plays, in other lanes the ad carry has to lead the flow and the support enhances/reacts on it and some lanes are based on poke/disengagements. For example with EZ+soraka vs taric+vayne I would not go balls in with soraka, but let ez do his pokes, W him at the right moments and silence taric if he closes in. When in this example EZ just never pokes because he is too afraid of their stun combo, then we would lose the lane without me having a chance to turn it around. In this case I would just try to not lose it that badly. experiences like this are frustrating and just plain not fun.
that said, most players don't mess up that badly and you often have a guy who is bad at playing support at the other side so you can win your lane more easily. If your carry knows the basics about positioning and kiting in teamfights most of the time, you can maintain a very good win% with playing support I think, just because you have those additional skills in that role the other guy does not have, because he thinks playing support is some kind of punishment.
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I personnaly dont mind playing support if needed, my problem is people that pick blitzcrank just because they have to support (and they originally didnt want to) but dont have a clue about what they're doing.
Perfect exemple from yesterday, i had a 2 blitz support, the first one (1900+) managed to grab amumu into our team 3 times in a row (1 time its ok, could be a mistake but 3... its just being stupid) and the second one was ok during laning phase but kept suiciding in teamfight because we was going balls deep and too far to try some retarded plays.
I mean i see why you would want to pick blitz if you have to play support but dont want to he's fun and stuff, but ffs if you dont know that you can mess up teamfight when you fail a grab or E the wrong guy, just play taric. No skill shots, stomp lane and win early.
btw, playing support with an ad who knows his shit is real fun. Especially kill lanes.
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If nothing else, I'm at least grateful to the rising star of Blitzcrank as the go-to support-for-people-who-hate-supporting (combination of Alistar bans, across-the-board sustain nerfs, and the price reduction from 6300 to 3150 IP?) - there's markedly fewer Doran's Ring-starting Lux/Nidalee players rushing Mejai's Soulstealer out of spite.
My last fifty-odd games have been approximately 50% support, 40% jungle, 10% solo top Nunu. With Alistar permabanned, I'm enjoying Leona for the ability to dictate engagements if needed.
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a perfectly timed malphite ult after a diana e might be the most beautiful thing i've ever seen in this game
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Now add tibbers sona ultimate and graves... I've seen it. I cried at the beauty.
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No love for Orianna ult in that compo? /sadface
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well i mean if you have an annie after a diana/malph combo their entire team is already dead, no need for 2 other champs
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450 ip Garen makes me happy ^^
Although I must admit that after the overly dramatic wall of text that the new marketing guy posted in the riot forums I expected more... but I guess I'll take whatever I can get for (almost) free. Now time to mess around with hp regen Garen :D I just compared him with Mundo and both Garen's passive and base health regen are stronger than Mundo's :O
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On September 05 2012 19:22 qtiehunter wrote:
450 ip Garen makes me happy ^^
Although I must admit that after the overly dramatic wall of text that the new marketing guy posted in the riot forums I expected more... but I guess I'll take whatever I can get for (almost) free. Now time to mess around with hp regen Garen :D I just compared him with Mundo and both Garen's passive and base health regen are stronger than Mundo's :O
Garen deserves to be 450 IP. He is one of *THE* most newbie-friendly bruiser in the game.
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amumu kennen ziggs sona mf is the most beautiful thing i've ever seen 5 health bars melting away simultaneously.
On the support discussion: I got decent at support because no one ever wants to take it and as long as my ad is not brain-dead it's usually pretty easy to win the lane and snowball. Just think about synergies while picking and make sure your support fits well in your team comp. I don't particularly love the role, but it's fairly enjoyable because I know I'm doing my shit right and it's going to get me a win. It's specially fun vs cheese lanes. I had a draven / ap soraka today. supporting corki as sona. got pushed to tower till lvl 4 then just outplayed them. ended up 1/1/10 and corki was 7/0/4.
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I am in love with early Aegis... Have been building it with some junglers, and first i was skeptical, but the first few team fights made me a believer...
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On September 05 2012 19:23 Sufficiency wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 19:22 qtiehunter wrote:
450 ip Garen makes me happy ^^
Although I must admit that after the overly dramatic wall of text that the new marketing guy posted in the riot forums I expected more... but I guess I'll take whatever I can get for (almost) free. Now time to mess around with hp regen Garen :D I just compared him with Mundo and both Garen's passive and base health regen are stronger than Mundo's :O Garen deserves to be 450 IP. He is one of *THE* most newbie-friendly bruiser in the game.
yi vs garen newbie showdown of the century
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On September 05 2012 19:36 qtiehunter wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 19:23 Sufficiency wrote:On September 05 2012 19:22 qtiehunter wrote:
450 ip Garen makes me happy ^^
Although I must admit that after the overly dramatic wall of text that the new marketing guy posted in the riot forums I expected more... but I guess I'll take whatever I can get for (almost) free. Now time to mess around with hp regen Garen :D I just compared him with Mundo and both Garen's passive and base health regen are stronger than Mundo's :O Garen deserves to be 450 IP. He is one of *THE* most newbie-friendly bruiser in the game. yi vs garen newbie showdown of the century
Except Yi doesn't fit into the current meta.
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On September 05 2012 20:15 Sufficiency wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 19:36 qtiehunter wrote:On September 05 2012 19:23 Sufficiency wrote:On September 05 2012 19:22 qtiehunter wrote:
450 ip Garen makes me happy ^^
Although I must admit that after the overly dramatic wall of text that the new marketing guy posted in the riot forums I expected more... but I guess I'll take whatever I can get for (almost) free. Now time to mess around with hp regen Garen :D I just compared him with Mundo and both Garen's passive and base health regen are stronger than Mundo's :O Garen deserves to be 450 IP. He is one of *THE* most newbie-friendly bruiser in the game. yi vs garen newbie showdown of the century Except Yi doesn't fit into the current meta.
AP Yi is a strong mid laner with good midgame teamfighting. We've seen him a couple of times in tournaments too.
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EPT
