• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 08:27
CEST 14:27
KST 21:27
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team Liquid Map Contest #21 - Presented by Monster Energy1uThermal's 2v2 Tour: $15,000 Main Event12Serral wins EWC 202549Tournament Spotlight: FEL Cracow 202510Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202580
Community News
Weekly Cups (Aug 4-10): MaxPax wins a triple5SC2's Safe House 2 - October 18 & 195Weekly Cups (Jul 28-Aug 3): herO doubles up6LiuLi Cup - August 2025 Tournaments5[BSL 2025] H2 - Team Wars, Weeklies & SB Ladder10
StarCraft 2
General
Rogue Talks: "Koreans could dominate again" Lambo Talks: The Future of SC2 and more... RSL Revival patreon money discussion thread Team Liquid Map Contest #21 - Presented by Monster Energy uThermal's 2v2 Tour: $15,000 Main Event
Tourneys
SEL Masters #5 - Korea vs Russia (SC Evo) Enki Epic Series #5 - TaeJa vs Classic (SC Evo) ByuN vs TaeJa Bo7 SC Evo Showmatch Global Tourney for College Students in September RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 486 Watch the Skies Mutation # 485 Death from Below Mutation # 484 Magnetic Pull Mutation #239 Bad Weather
Brood War
General
ASL Season 20 Ro24 Groups BW General Discussion ASL20 Pre-season Tier List ranking! BSL Polish World Championship 2025 20-21 September StarCon Philadelphia
Tourneys
KCM 2025 Season 3 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0 [ASL20] Online Qualifiers Day 2
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Fighting Spirit mining rates [G] Mineral Boosting Muta micro map competition
Other Games
General Games
Total Annihilation Server - TAForever Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Beyond All Reason [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok)
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine The Games Industry And ATVI European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion! Korean Music Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Gtx660 graphics card replacement Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Gaming After Dark: Poor Slee…
TrAiDoS
[Girl blog} My fema…
artosisisthebest
Sharpening the Filtration…
frozenclaw
ASL S20 English Commentary…
namkraft
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 617 users

[Patch 1.0.0.145: Rengar] General Discussion - Page 52

Forum Index > LoL General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 50 51 52 53 54 189 Next
Shiv.
Profile Joined January 2011
3534 Posts
August 19 2012 19:53 GMT
#1021
On August 20 2012 02:42 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 20 2012 02:40 gtrsrs wrote:
On August 20 2012 02:30 JackDino wrote:
On August 20 2012 02:29 gtrsrs wrote:
i'm pretty sure everyone knows that jayce is a lane dominator
it's not like some well-kept secret that jayce/nidalee are good in lane
people aren't picking them up because their lategame presence is lacking
invisible? no. but as good as jax, riven, malphite, vladimir? ... not even close baby

Jayce belongs right in that list. High base damage, good scaling, a knockback, good poke and his acceleration gate is simply broken. 50% movespeed to the entire team.


he has no ult

Yeah, Nidalee doesn't have an ult either, huh/

Which is why he called her out for being bad late game too, huh.
currently rooting for myself.
OutlaW-
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Czech Republic5053 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-19 19:57:58
August 19 2012 19:55 GMT
#1022
I consider myself a fairly regular Draven player..

He has the best laning phase of all AD carries, frequently I find myself 1v2ing lanes like janna ezreal even when my support is out warding. Your poke is ridiculous, noone can really trade you as long as you have axes up. You also have the best level 1 and 2, so feel free to try surprise from behind tactics for easy FB. Another thing draven does well is poke people last hitting under the turret and running back. The thing is, in order to take advantage of these advantages that Draven has you need to be mechanically sound and you need to understand how bottom lane works. If you aren't aggressive and you don't take use this huge advantage, then draven is simply not worth taking over somebody with a jump. (every AD without an escape needs to have their advantage be used properly or ADs with a jump just outperform them)

Later in the game, draven has a few problems. Assassins are easily able to take him out as he has no jump and tanks who are able to tank and walk up to him also give him problems. These problems can be worked around with a teamcomp, though, so I still feel that Draven is very viable, it's just that people haven't tried or come up with how to do it yet.
To sum this all up, Draven has the best laning phase of AD carries that you have to take advantage of to snowball.
If you don't, you need a team that can protect you, or you will be useless in teamfights.

+ Show Spoiler +
Just yesterday I had a game where me and enten went even in laning phase (i was up 1 kill but he had 20 more CS) and the game ended in us getting absolutely smashed (he was ez btw) because their chogath got so tanky that in 30 min he could just run up to me and make me completely useless. The reason why we completely lost was because we had a very bad team for Draven; we had garen top who is in the middle of the fight trying to kill squishies, shyvana that dragon'd into their team and left me as well, leblanc support who couldnt protect me as sshe was also trying to kill squishies and a gragas who was also completely useless as his team didn't create opportunities for him to burst people down and run away.


The niche and interesting thing about him is that he can have one of the best and one of the worst AD late games in the game, all depending on if his team works with him or not.
Delete your post underage b&. You're incestuous for you're onee-chan so you're clearly not a bad guy, but others might not agree
Zaphod Beeblebrox
Profile Joined December 2010
Denmark697 Posts
August 19 2012 20:19 GMT
#1023
Sometimes unplayed champions are... just that, unplayed.
Sometimes there are good reasons, but sometimes the champion is just not FoTM, or noone has tried to figure out a competitive build.
Look at Nunu, he got a minor buff, people realized the strength of grail and he is suddenly one of the most common champs. Or when Koreans cracked the secret of Ezrael, when Mundo went from trash to top tier jungler or when Locket Veigar was discovered(RIP locket).

If a pro makes an underplayed champion work with a new build, or playstyle, they will get a lot of attention, and people start playing them.

I do think Jayce will get a lot of attention once someone figures out what he can provide for the team.

Also Poppy is insanely strong as a counterpick. Unfortunately her best lane opponents fell out of favor about the same time as Zekent showed her true strength (Panth, Trynd, Garen, Nasus and a few others are hard countered by Poppy).
That being said, she CAN be picked into less favorable machups and still win on her insane scaling.
Or you pick her against Olaf/Darius/Swain and get destroyed.
Go try StarBow on the Arcade. TL thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=440661
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
August 19 2012 20:22 GMT
#1024
Man, gone are the days of 4 philo stone poppy...
liftlift > tsm
overt
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States9006 Posts
August 19 2012 20:43 GMT
#1025
On August 20 2012 04:02 obesechicken13 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 20 2012 02:25 Morfildur wrote:
On August 20 2012 01:48 obesechicken13 wrote:
On August 20 2012 01:44 h3r1n6 wrote:
Poppy is literally the worst champion at farming. She has ridiculously good scaling, but she can't get items. It's very possible to play her in soloqueue (point in case Zekent), but it's hard to impossible to get her farmed if your opponents play it right/pick Olaf.

Jayce is just not played because of the too many champions syndrome. First, people need to put effort in to learn an underplayed champion. Second, why play that nerdy Jayce guy when you can play some chick with big boobs.

I think jayce should get a big boobs skin. I have no idea why he's not played. I'm buying him today. Dude is literally broken in lane according to my math. Like every time he puts a point in Q it's like he's putting two points in Q, whereas another champion only gets one point.

Also relevant to the boots discussion.
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Thanks for the horrible mental image of a Jayce with boobs...

np

I really like HSGG's nidalee but I don't think it fits in team comps anymore. He really couldn't teamfight as an AP and tried bruiser nidalee only briefly. Back when HSGG played nidalee in tournaments he was much better than everyone else and the meta was different. He was like Boxer. He could do anything he wanted and still win.

Eventually people were able to punish him for splitpushing.


You're forgetting the part where Nidalee was nerfed twice. First was when her heal along with every other heal in the game got nerfed. Then came the removal of dodge, mana cost changes to her heal, an AP ratio nerf to her heal, and other changes. After a bunch of her changes during the dodge removal is when bruiser Nidalee got fotm status because her heal's mana cost increased and the AP ratio got cut from like 1.2 to .7 or something along with the base heal healing Nid for less but having it ramp up later.

It wasn't just meta changes or other players "catching up with" Hotshot. The champion got nearly every spell changed. I have a suspicion that CLG developed their poke comp partly so that Hotshot could still play AP Nid.
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
August 19 2012 20:55 GMT
#1026
On August 20 2012 02:24 IMoperator wrote:
Are people ever going to realize that draven is a really really good adc, especially in laning phase? Those axes man, they chunk hard.


Draven wins lanes and loses in team fights.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
August 19 2012 20:57 GMT
#1027
I agree that Jayce's late game is not the best. Then again, a lot of top laners have this issue.

It is important that Jayce dominate the mid game. He also pushes towers really hard with his W. These are his strengths.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
August 19 2012 20:57 GMT
#1028
Who gives a damn about Jayce or the others? I'm still drooling over Syndra's kit <3 (and blatantly ignoring the fact that the only reason I'm successful with Orianna is her passive and not her zoning capability).
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
August 19 2012 20:58 GMT
#1029
On August 20 2012 05:57 Alaric wrote:
Who gives a damn about Jayce or the others? I'm still drooling over Syndra's kit <3 (and blatantly ignoring the fact that the only reason I'm successful with Orianna is her passive and not her zoning capability).


Sandra is not even out on PBE yet. It will take at least another 2-3 weeks before she is on LIVE.

https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
August 19 2012 21:05 GMT
#1030
Why do all the pros love nunu bot (the skin)? I personally hate it...
Freeeeeeedom
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
August 19 2012 21:08 GMT
#1031
Because of its laugh.

And it's 'k about Syndra, I waited around a month for Viktor, I'll survive.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
August 19 2012 21:12 GMT
#1032
On August 20 2012 06:05 cLutZ wrote:
Why do all the pros love nunu bot (the skin)? I personally hate it...


Ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha

Yummy

Towerdive! We must towerdive!

Bots are superior to non-bots.

https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
Leonite7
Profile Joined July 2011
Ireland921 Posts
August 19 2012 21:13 GMT
#1033
Dammit. I bought Orianna and the only thing I got out of it was the realisation that I suck at mid and I should have saved up for Rengar top lane.
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-19 21:16:21
August 19 2012 21:16 GMT
#1034
On August 20 2012 06:13 Leonite7 wrote:
Dammit. I bought Orianna and the only thing I got out of it was the realisation that I suck at mid and I should have saved up for Rengar top lane.


Orianna is not only very hard to play, she is also not very good for soloQ since her strength lies with teamfights. I bought her. I really regret it.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
overt
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States9006 Posts
August 19 2012 21:18 GMT
#1035
I dunno. Orianna is good in solo queue if your opponents group up. QWR wins team fights harder than any other AP carries combo imo. Although, maybe Zyra's combo wins teamfights harder now.
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
August 19 2012 21:23 GMT
#1036
On August 20 2012 06:18 overt wrote:
I dunno. Orianna is good in solo queue if your opponents group up. QWR wins team fights harder than any other AP carries combo imo. Although, maybe Zyra's combo wins teamfights harder now.


But it still requires a lot of coordination, something that is lacking in soloQ.

Also Orianna's laning phase is.... mediocre at best. She also can't roam really well because her damage against a single target is kind of low and her CC is pretty meh. There is no reason to play Orianna in soloQ right now because there is Zyra, who is easier to play, more damage, more CC, and facerolls pretty hard in lane.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
Leonite7
Profile Joined July 2011
Ireland921 Posts
August 19 2012 21:24 GMT
#1037
On August 20 2012 06:23 Sufficiency wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 20 2012 06:18 overt wrote:
I dunno. Orianna is good in solo queue if your opponents group up. QWR wins team fights harder than any other AP carries combo imo. Although, maybe Zyra's combo wins teamfights harder now.


But it still requires a lot of coordination, something that is lacking in soloQ.

Also Orianna's laning phase is.... mediocre at best. She also can't roam really well because her damage against a single target is kind of low and her CC is pretty meh. There is no reason to play Orianna in soloQ right now because there is Zyra, who is easier to play, more damage, more CC, and facerolls pretty hard in lane.


Ok. New rule for all future purchases. Must consult Team Liquid.
zer0das
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States8519 Posts
August 19 2012 21:34 GMT
#1038
On August 20 2012 06:05 cLutZ wrote:
Why do all the pros love nunu bot (the skin)? I personally hate it...


His laugh is one of the most annoying in the game. Pretty much every Nunu Bot I've run into just spams it 24/7. :>
1godless
Profile Joined August 2011
United States247 Posts
August 19 2012 21:43 GMT
#1039
On the topic of consulting TL, I am looking for a new jungler. I play mundo udyr alistar lee sin and lately amumu malphite. Who should I add? I have naut even though I don't play him that much. So basically who should I add? Maokai, Sej, Shy, Riven, Diana, Hec, Jarvan. Skarner or Volibear? It seems like a long list but I kinda want to be slightly hipsterish and add a slightly un orthodox jungler. Suggestions? Comments on their various strengths? thanks guys
The enemy's throne is down
koreasilver
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
9109 Posts
August 19 2012 21:44 GMT
#1040
How is Orianna's laning phase bad? She can last hit easily and farm under tower without missing any cs if pushed to tower, can push lanes easily when you want to, and she doesn't even really have many bad matchups. Utility is her great strength, yeah, but she still dishes out a shit ton of damage if you're landing your Qs properly. It actually boggles my mind that someone thinks Orianna's laning phase is bad. Zyra is easier to play but she gets banned sometimes while Orianna never gets banned.
Prev 1 50 51 52 53 54 189 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
WardiTV Summer Champion…
11:00
Group Stage 1 - Group A
WardiTV729
IndyStarCraft 130
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Lowko365
Harstem 237
IndyStarCraft 130
ForJumy 3
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 56764
Sea 6801
Calm 3887
Rain 3498
Horang2 1917
Jaedong 1500
Bisu 1205
Mini 963
ggaemo 456
Flash 418
[ Show more ]
BeSt 361
actioN 327
ZerO 315
EffOrt 291
Snow 277
Mong 247
Soma 215
Barracks 134
hero 99
ToSsGirL 89
Hyuk 78
Hyun 77
Soulkey 74
Rush 63
Mind 61
Backho 43
Sacsri 41
Aegong 40
Sea.KH 34
Shine 30
sSak 27
Movie 26
sorry 26
soO 24
Sexy 20
TY 19
[sc1f]eonzerg 19
HiyA 18
Icarus 16
SilentControl 11
Sharp 9
sas.Sziky 9
Bale 5
Terrorterran 5
Dota 2
qojqva1464
Cr1tdota724
XcaliburYe242
Counter-Strike
olofmeister2713
x6flipin744
flusha243
markeloff66
Super Smash Bros
Westballz28
Other Games
FrodaN3957
singsing2434
B2W.Neo1103
DeMusliM450
crisheroes376
RotterdaM259
XaKoH 217
Hui .196
hiko167
Fuzer 134
SortOf88
Mew2King71
rGuardiaN42
ArmadaUGS42
QueenE15
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 9
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 48
• davetesta15
• iHatsuTV 8
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• intothetv
• Kozan
• Migwel
• IndyKCrew
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 7
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 1070
• WagamamaTV471
League of Legends
• Jankos1105
• Stunt629
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
4h 33m
PiGosaur Monday
11h 33m
WardiTV Summer Champion…
22h 33m
The PondCast
1d 21h
WardiTV Summer Champion…
1d 22h
Replay Cast
2 days
LiuLi Cup
2 days
Online Event
3 days
SC Evo League
3 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
4 days
[ Show More ]
CSO Contender
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
WardiTV Summer Champion…
4 days
SC Evo League
4 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
5 days
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
Sharp vs Ample
Larva vs Stork
Wardi Open
5 days
RotterdaM Event
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Afreeca Starleague
6 days
JyJ vs TY
Bisu vs Speed
WardiTV Summer Champion…
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

StarCon 2025 Philadelphia
FEL Cracow 2025
CC Div. A S7

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Qualifiers
WardiTV Summer 2025
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
HCC Europe
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025

Upcoming

ASL Season 20
CSLAN 3
BSL Season 21
BSL 21 Team A
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters Fall
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
Roobet Cup 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.