EPT[Patch 1.0.0.141: Draven] General Discussion - Page 95
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ninjakingcola
United States405 Posts
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arb
Noobville17921 Posts
On June 18 2012 02:57 gtrsrs wrote: finally got into the server, checked out all the new splash arts they literally all look worse than the american counterpart pieces except for the TF ones and bloodfury renekton i want refunds on all of these skins that i own, i don't even want to play amumu any more ugh Actually the more I look at Renektons default the more I like it, however the Mundo default I agree, all the others I dont know how you can agree, they look 1000x better | ||
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gtrsrs
United States9109 Posts
when you buy a work of art, you don't give the artist the right to come to your house and change it whenever they want you buy it for what you like about the original piece changing alternate skins just feels... cheap to me | ||
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JackDino
Gabon6219 Posts
On June 18 2012 03:16 gtrsrs wrote: i guess i don't know why they would change the splash art on skins that are not default skins when you buy a work of art, you don't give the artist the right to come to your house and change it whenever they want you buy it for what you like about the original piece changing alternate skins just feels... cheap to me Jokes on you for paying for splashart in that case. Pretty sure I got mine for free. | ||
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MetalMarine
United States1559 Posts
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r.Evo
Germany14080 Posts
On June 18 2012 02:31 Flakes wrote: I queue'd up, alt-tabbed to play Megaman, came back once I heard "Welcome to Summoner's Rift," and I'd been given Darius. Basically perfect for Mogwai. High elo queues can get pretty long, a lot of those players do other stuff while waiting, and also focus on a single role/lane in terms of champion picks. But yes as I mentioned I don't think they should accommodate AFKers. For those guys the League window pops up when it's their turn to pick. =P | ||
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AleKSei23
Mexico75 Posts
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chalice
United States1945 Posts
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
And unfortunately, DayZ isn't working for me atm QQ | ||
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
On June 18 2012 03:16 gtrsrs wrote: i guess i don't know why they would change the splash art on skins that are not default skins when you buy a work of art, you don't give the artist the right to come to your house and change it whenever they want you buy it for what you like about the original piece changing alternate skins just feels... cheap to me They changed the ingame skin? Because splash art you can easily change yourself to whatever you like | ||
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zer0das
United States8519 Posts
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Evilmonkey.
United States1628 Posts
 . So this is Riot's new scheme to get people to buy skins... | ||
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Simberto
Germany11723 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On June 18 2012 02:19 Flakes wrote: (Also Yango you should mathcraft "most DPS on single item with no other DPS items," I still think it was MBR, at least before the IE buff  )For this, I'm going to assume the base stats of level 12 Ashe, a standard 21 offense setup, AD reds/AD quints runepage, and common items of 2xDBlade+Zerks. Below are the DPS and DPS/gold values against 50, 100, and 150 armor. First, the easy stat items: Base, no additional items, 108/82/66 Infinity Edge, 247/0.0363 @ 50 armor, 187/0.0274 @ 100 armor, 150/0.0219 @ 150 armor Phantom Dancer, 190/0.0288 @ 50 armor, 144/0.0218 @ 100 armor, 116/0.0176 @ 150 armor Last Whisper, 160/0.0227 @ 50 armor, 132/0.0218 @ 100 armor, 112/0.0201 @ 150 armor Full Bloodthirster, 194/0.0287 @ 50 armor, 146/0.0213 @ 100 armor, 118/0.0173 @ 150 armor Black Cleaver (full stacks), 223/0.0401 @ 50 armor, 160/0.0272 @ 100 armor, 124/0.0202 @ 150 armor Nothing really surprising here. Infinity Edge has the best overall performance. PD and BT trade raw damage for their respective extra utility. Black Cleaver has strong performance at low armor that tapers off rapidly at medium/higher armor values, while LW does the opposite (note that BC's DPS is slightly over-valued due to the fact that it assumes full stacks straight from the beginning). Analyzing other items is a bit trickier. We'll begin with Triforce. To do this, we'll first calculate the raw DPS gained from the stats, then calculate the number of procs per second required to match other DPS items (in practice, Triforce is only capable of 0.5 procs per second in ideal circumstances, and on most heroes, much less than that). Triforce raw stats, 183 @ 50 armor, 139 @ 100 armor, 111 @ 150 armor Ashe has 80.5 AD at level 12. This translates into 53.67 damage @ 50 armor, 40.25 @ 100 armor, 32.2 @ 150 armor From a cursory analysis, it's pretty clear that Triforce isn't going to match up against IE at any point for pure damage, even on its best users. If you're buying Triforce, you're paying a LOT for the utility. However, for Corki and Ezreal players, it's worth noting that Triforce DOES beat full BT for DPS, even with less-than-optimal Triforce proc usage. It also only has marginally worse DPS/gold, which is more than made up for in the vast amount of other stats the item gives. We look at the proc items last, Wit's End and Bloodrazor. As with Triforce, we'll calculate the raw stats first, then determine how good the proc has to be. Wit's raw stats, 134 @ 50 armor, 101 @ 100 armor, 81 @ 150 armor Bloodrazor raw stats, 176 @ 50 armor, 133 @ 100 armor, 107@ 150 armor I'll skip Wit's for now because I'm lazy. For Bloodrazor, it's straightforward because its cost is basically the same as IE. We just calculate the required proc damage at each armor value. With the appropriate items, Ashe has 1.376 attack speed. @ 50 armor: proc needs to do 51.6 damage after mitigation @ 100 armor: proc needs to do 39.24 damage after mitigation @ 150 armor: proc needs to do 31.25 damage after mitigation Lets assume that our targets have balanced mitigation--similar amounts of armor and MR. We can then calculate breakeven HP values for Bloodrazor: @ 50 armor/MR: 1935 HP breakeven @ 100 armor/MR: 1962 HP breakeven @ 150 armor/MR: 1953 HP breakeven So for single-item DPS, Bloodrazor is approximately equivalent to IE against ~2k HP targets, assuming they have similar amounts of armor and MR. | ||
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SnK-Arcbound
United States4423 Posts
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
On June 18 2012 03:55 TheYango wrote: For this, I'm going to assume the base stats of level 12 Ashe, a standard 21 offense setup, AD reds/AD quints runepage, and common items of 2xDBlade+Zerks. Below are the DPS and DPS/gold values against 50, 100, and 150 armor. First, the easy stat items: Base, no additional items, 108/82/66 Infinity Edge, 247/0.0363 @ 50 armor, 187/0.0274 @ 100 armor, 150/0.0219 @ 150 armor Phantom Dancer, 190/0.0288 @ 50 armor, 144/0.0218 @ 100 armor, 116/0.0176 @ 150 armor Last Whisper, 160/0.0227 @ 50 armor, 132/0.0218 @ 100 armor, 112/0.0201 @ 150 armor Full Bloodthirster, 194/0.0287 @ 50 armor, 146/0.0213 @ 100 armor, 118/0.0173 @ 150 armor Black Cleaver (full stacks), 223/0.0401 @ 50 armor, 160/0.0272 @ 100 armor, 124/0.0202 @ 150 armor Nothing really surprising here. Infinity Edge has the best overall performance. PD and BT trade raw damage for their respective extra utility. Black Cleaver has strong performance at low armor that tapers off rapidly at medium/higher armor values, while LW does the opposite (note that BC's DPS is slightly over-valued due to the fact that it assumes full stacks straight from the beginning). Analyzing other items is a bit trickier. We'll begin with Triforce. To do this, we'll first calculate the raw DPS gained from the stats, then calculate the number of procs per second required to match other DPS items (in practice, Triforce is only capable of 0.5 procs per second in ideal circumstances, and on most heroes, much less than that). Triforce raw stats, 183 @ 50 armor, 139 @ 100 armor, 111 @ 150 armor Ashe has 80.5 AD at level 12. This translates into 53.67 damage @ 50 armor, 40.25 @ 100 armor, 32.2 @ 150 armor From a cursory analysis, it's pretty clear that Triforce isn't going to match up against IE at any point for pure damage, even on its best users. If you're buying Triforce, you're paying a LOT for the utility. However, for Corki and Ezreal players, it's worth noting that Triforce DOES beat full BT for DPS, even with less-than-optimal Triforce proc usage. It also only has marginally worse DPS/gold, which is more than made up for in the vast amount of other stats the item gives. We look at the proc items last, Wit's End and Bloodrazor. As with Triforce, we'll calculate the raw stats first, then determine how good the proc has to be. Wit's raw stats, 134 @ 50 armor, 101 @ 100 armor, 81 @ 150 armor Bloodrazor raw stats, 176 @ 50 armor, 133 @ 100 armor, 107@ 150 armor I'll skip Wit's for now because I'm lazy. For Bloodrazor, it's straightforward because its cost is basically the same as IE. We just calculate the required proc damage at each armor value. With the appropriate items, Ashe has 1.376 attack speed. @ 50 armor: proc needs to do 51.6 damage after mitigation @ 100 armor: proc needs to do 39.24 damage after mitigation @ 150 armor: proc needs to do 31.25 damage after mitigation Lets assume that our targets have balanced mitigation--similar amounts of armor and MR. We can then calculate breakeven HP values for Bloodrazor: @ 50 armor/MR: 1935 HP breakeven @ 100 armor/MR: 1962 HP breakeven @ 150 armor/MR: 1953 HP breakeven So for single-item DPS, Bloodrazor is approximately equivalent to IE against ~2k HP targets, assuming they have similar amounts of armor and MR. Bloodrazor has issues because of the lack of any followup being effective - any second item you add onto bloodrazor won't scale as well as the AD + crit + AS combination of stats, because MBR only scales with AS and enemy HP. I'm curious on followup math, and math when you mix in various ADcarry's steroids. For example Trist is going to absolutely shine with IE because of rapid fire, where Kog will shine more with an AS item. I'm going to borrow your math if I get unlazy to look at followup items. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
The point is that the straightforward intuition people have about DPS items in this game isn't really wrong. | ||
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Flakes
United States3125 Posts
On June 18 2012 04:01 sylverfyre wrote: Bloodrazor has issues because of the lack of any followup being effective - any second item you add onto bloodrazor won't scale as well as the AD + crit + AS combination of stats, because MBR only scales with AS and enemy HP. But that was the point of going bloodrazor + pure tank on Warwick. Slot efficiency, and the razor for early jungling. If you include a Frozen Mallet, that's the same AD as the two dblades Yango used. and Yango you are awesome btw edit: I think you also vindicated my Corki strategy of getting Black Cleaver instead of LW 99% of the time. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
I just don't understand why they have to bother changing everything over. I mean, I know art is subjective and all and many people will like it/not like it but why bother changing anything at all? Like, what's the reason for it? Was it not clear who Renekton and Pantheon were beforehand? | ||
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gtrsrs
United States9109 Posts
On June 18 2012 03:21 JackDino wrote: Jokes on you for paying for splashart in that case. Pretty sure I got mine for free. that's... exactly what i'm saying? the joke IS on me and that's not right from a consumer standpoint also, shikyo, define easy if there's anything about manually changing any files or downloading any splashes, that's not easy if it's as easy as a menu option that says "use old splash art," that's easy | ||
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