EPT[Patch 1.0.0.136: Lulu] General Discussion - Page 86
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Remember guys, this is the general discussion thread. Keep whine/QQ posts in the appropriate QQ memorial thread! Thanks! | ||
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TwoToneTerran
United States8841 Posts
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nosliw
United States2716 Posts
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TwoToneTerran
United States8841 Posts
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
On March 27 2012 04:11 Zergneedsfood wrote: Maybe it's because I play with bad players all the time (as I'm in a relatively low ELO), but I'm not feeling the nerf that hard. I just take defensive tree and open wriggles more often to compensate. I think it's just forcing me to play a little smarter and play a bit more defensively because I can't life steal it back as easy. Trade wise, it still does the same damage, so I can trade just fine if I keep my health from dropping too low. Offensively she's still good, but I felt like I took a lot more damage during trades. Granted, it was my first game post-nerf, and against a Mundo (I had armor quints because I expected Nidalee, she went support, their Alistar jungled, and Mundo was against me), but it was way harder than usual. I took more damage, felt like I couldn't afford to harass as much (like 1-2 aa when he tries to last hit near me) nor shrug off some harass (a tick of flames or two when I go to last hit) because those little amounts that I'd be able to lifesteal back in some hits actually stick now. Teamfights, I felt more fragile too. I'm kind of used to go in and out of teamfights, but that one had me dying several times where I'd have lived pre-nerf, and I had to stay out longer to get some health back before diving again. Nothing I can't adjust to, but the feeling of "damn this hurts, I need to be way more defensive now" is what surprised me. Yay, Eleanore Rigby on Dyrus' stream. | ||
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Shiv.
3534 Posts
On March 27 2012 04:14 NeoIllusions wrote: Surprised no Yorick here. huehue It's amusing that even Wickd's given up on Irelia for Renek. What says you, Smash? :O haha He said she was useless now. I'm also relatively sure that was his exact wording. The guy talks a lot out of his ass. He's obviously a great player, but he seems to have a tendency of talking and THEN thinking. Didn't he also say Soraka didn't do much in teamfights on one SotL? | ||
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Seuss
United States10536 Posts
On March 27 2012 05:11 TwoToneTerran wrote: All 3 of those champs sit at the melee creeps and zone him. You might eat some Qs in the process but you're wasting his mana and zoning him off creeps really hard, and he can't afford trades with them. Maybe Talon less so but I still think he does really well. You'd have to bulwark before he jumps to and silences you and early level in bulwark weakens your wave clearing and costs you more mana. I'm focused on Talon specifically because I don't have much experience against either Pantheon or Lee Sin, but I've ended up against Xpecial's Talon as Galio top two or three times in blind pick normals and won every time. You don't really have to Bulwark before Talon jumps (though it certainly helps a lot) because Talon's E only silences for 1 second, but his Q's DoT lasts for 6 seconds. Bulwark's duration is 4 seconds, meaning you're guaranteed to get at least 4 ticks of healing every exchange with Talon. With 66 MR (30 base, 6 from masteries, 30 from Bulwark itself) that's going to total 103 healing with rank 1 Bulwark. Even if we assume Talon penetrates all of Galio's Armor his total damage for a level 3 trade is ~180, so all Galio has to do is auto attack once or twice and/or land a Q and between his damage and healing he's won the trade. It's important to note that I'm making assumptions largely in favor of Talon here. If you do manage to get Bulwark off before Talon's combo the healing jumps to 130-140 (six or seven ticks instead of four) and the damage drops to ~140. In that case Talon spends more than twice Bulwark's mana cost to do effectively no damage, and ends up taking autos from Galio plus creep damage for his trouble. I'm also not accounting for any Armor, MR, or AP Galio might have from a rune page or items. As you bring those factors into play Talon's ability to trade early on diminishes further. This is just the math to back up my experience, but Talon can't effectively zone Galio unless Galio severely misplays. In fact, Galio can easily end up zoning Talon early. It's only much later that Talon becomes a threat to Galio, by which point Galio has had plenty of time to farm up items. | ||
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Wolverox
3 Posts
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Juicyfruit
Canada5484 Posts
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Shifft
Canada1085 Posts
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skrzmark
United States1528 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On March 27 2012 07:41 skrzmark wrote: after aegis cuz aegis is expensive for a support. IMO jungle should usually be buying Aegis anyway. | ||
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Craton
United States17281 Posts
faerie 2 green 1 pink 1 hp pot 1st back philo 1 ward 2nd back boots ward(s) ruby crystal finish hog boots 2 (cdr/mercs) shurelyas aegis wota/zekes/locket If you're a tank support like Leona, you often want to rush an Aegis. You can go faerie > hog > philo on most supports if you really need that HP and don't need the regen as much. I don't get Kage's on any support these days. When to get oracles really depends on a lot. It's a lot easier to keep yourself alive as a Janna or Alistar than it is a Soraka or Taric. If you're dominating the bot lane, there's a lower chance of losing it in a 2v2. If they have globals, there's a higher chance of losing it to an unwardable gank (especially since you're now a priority target). I buy a lot of pink wards as support and try to deprive the enemy team of vision and open gank paths. It's a gold difference of only 25g if you get to kill their ward. I have a tendency to grab an oracles after my boots 2 (toward the end of lane phase), so my Shurelya's usually comes out after lane phase is fully over. | ||
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Amui
Canada10567 Posts
On March 27 2012 08:05 TheYango wrote: IMO jungle should usually be buying Aegis anyway. I thought about it for a moment, and it suddenly clicked to me why this is a good plan, Pre-15 minutes, the jungler is going to be the only person present in almost every initiated fight. Aegis is a boost of ~5-10% survivability in most cases to everybody it affects that early. | ||
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Dandel Ion
Austria17960 Posts
OR Philo -> HoG -> shurelias Boots whenever you can buy them without compromising the other items or wards. I mostly play non-tanky supports, so idk about leona/blitz/etc. Usually, game doesn't last much longer than that (items on supports take loooong), but I really like hyper-defensive items afterwards, Warmogs, Glacial shroud, stuff like that. But that's because at my elo, positioning is impossible, so I have to semi-tank for the carries... On March 27 2012 08:35 Amui wrote: I thought about it for a moment, and it suddenly clicked to me why this is a good plan, Pre-15 minutes, the jungler is going to be the only person present in almost every initiated fight. Aegis is a boost of ~5-10% survivability in most cases to everybody it affects that early. Try actually explaining that to that hero free-week Nocturne on your team that NEEDS to rush BT + PD right now. | ||
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HazMat
United States17077 Posts
I like Crayon's build. Getting Shurelias early is super important but on someone like Leona Aegis first is good. I have a habit of getting my boots 2 super late on support T_T | ||
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Shifft
Canada1085 Posts
On March 27 2012 08:29 Craton wrote: My generic support build: faerie 2 green 1 pink 1 hp pot 1st back philo 1 ward 2nd back boots ward(s) ruby crystal finish hog boots 2 (cdr/mercs) shurelyas aegis wota/zekes/locket That's exactly what I do as well, just with a couple extra wards thrown in on 1st/2nd back, and changing up the opening depending on stuff (faerie 4 green 1 hp, faerie 3 green 3 hp, faerie 3 green 2 hp 1 mana, or what you said). | ||
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nosliw
United States2716 Posts
On March 27 2012 08:38 HazMat wrote: Did you guys know Burger King does delivery? Fucking finally. I like Crayon's build. Getting Shurelias early is super important but on someone like Leona Aegis first is good. I have a habit of getting my boots 2 super late on support T_T They DO? Why would fastfood deliver? Where are you btw? | ||
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HazMat
United States17077 Posts
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Niton
United States2395 Posts
On March 27 2012 08:46 nosliw wrote: They DO? Why would fastfood deliver? Where are you btw? He's either in Maryland or Virginia, I just looked at the site and they only deliver there >  .They also deliver in Europe. Back when I raided in WoW, our european hunter delayed our raid for a half hour when he went to his door to get his Burger King from his delivery man, then proceeded to sit down at his table and eat it without telling us. | ||
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ManyCookies
1164 Posts
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