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Same rules apply, per usual. Please use the appropriate threads (QQ, Brag, Champion, etc) whenever appropriate. Keep the resident Banling content.
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She suffers from the "leblanc syndrome" as I call it, in which if you can extend the game to late game, a fed lux isn't a problem at all
True, but not as harshly. Unlike LB, she can fire her combo from a rather safe distance, and has a fair amount of utility with each of her abilities.
Taric's problem is that he has some of the individually worst abilities of any support, aside from his E early/midgame. His heal is huge CD if you're not meleeing, Shatter's active relies on him being in melee (and isn't even the strongest variant of that kind of ability), Dazzle falls off really hard later in the game, and Radiance is just a shitty version of Sona's Q that, again, requires being in melee.
Combine all those things with the complete change in his ultimate from "AoE team heal over time effect" to "strong self-heal" to "like Hymn of Valor, but bad", and you're left with a champion whose only lategame factor is that he gives +30 armor and has +60 armor naturally.
The problem is that his incentives for being "aggressive" aren't really worth being aggressive for. I'd like it if they kept the whole "Be in the battle and get incentives thing" but made it a lot better. A Shvayana-like passive for each of his abilities, if you will. Increased Radiance effect with each attack (and maybe more damage on activation), CD reduction or even increased stun time on E, more stats/duration from his Ult, stuff like that.
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United States47024 Posts
I stand by the idea I made months ago that "Radiance" should have come with a short-range facing-conditional blind.
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The major problem with Taric is that inital Taric was good because his ult actually was supporty. It was just an aura, so riot decided that it didnt "feel" good. But it was super useful.
Then they remade it into something that didnt fit the character OR the role, hence you have a character that cant really do anything because his kit doesnt mesh.
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Also, I was thinking about it, and due to how Evelynn works, if she had Taric's passive she'd actually tear up the jungle because of Hate Spike. Kinda funny that she would be massively improved by switching passives.
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And the minion damage reduction wouldn't be too bad on Taric either. Would enable some aggression with minions nearby.
Swapping Swain's and Veigar's passive would probably be beneficial to both as well. Swain wouldn't be as reliant on Blue, and it partially solves Veigar's early mana problems.
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United States47024 Posts
Eve's passive would actually be really good if it were on a top laner. Consider that minions do 12 and 25 damage at level 1, and scale up their damage--her passive basically is as good or better than Fizz's passive at all points in the game.
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Lux has long cooldowns. I don't know why someone said she has short ones. I've been playing her a lot recently and she doesn't have much kill potential even though her level 6 QERIgniteautoDetonateEauto combo does a decent amount of burst because it's hard to get that all off.
It's hard to die with her though, and if you ward and position properly, mejais is probably a consideration for lux. I like her better than Xerath from when Xer was free week.
I like to build a lot of CDR on Lux because I don't always have blues and my junglers/AD carries recently have been taking it T_T
I don't think she's that strong though. Her ult is a nice chunk and the AoE factor means she really doesn't fall off any point in the game, but I feel like someone like cass or karth has more sustained damage.
Also mana is a huge ass issue. 130 mana on her E on like an 800 mana pool? No thx. You can get around it easily with runes and chalice but that's about 1000 free gold that a champion like morde has that you don't.
Also. I love her laugh and spam it A LOT.
If you go more AP than CDR you can last hit more easily. Her passive makes last hitting easy.
Her champ spotlight is a bit dated. Her ult actually now triggers and reapplies her passive now.
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I think Taric is allright as a solo top o.O Wits end works great, he can spam stun for amazing harrass and outsustains anything, gets a ton of armor and armor penetration and his ulti works as a decent steroid
On March 14 2012 04:24 TheYango wrote:
Eve's passive would actually be really good if it were on a top laner. Consider that minions do 12 and 25 damage at level 1, and scale up their damage--her passive basically is as good or better than Fizz's passive at all points in the game.
Not even close, actually. Fizz's passive gives him unitwalking.
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On March 14 2012 04:24 TheYango wrote:
Eve's passive would actually be really good if it were on a top laner. Consider that minions do 12 and 25 damage at level 1, and scale up their damage--her passive basically is as good or better than Fizz's passive at all points in the game.
If I remember right, Fizz, Evelynn and Amumu's passives apply post-mitigation, which makes Eve's passive significantly weaker than it looks and Fizz/Amumu's significantly stronger. I think Fizz's passive is reliably better than Eve's passive on most of the bulky top laners just because of the creepwalking effect.
On March 14 2012 04:28 Shikyo wrote:
I think Taric is allright as a solo top o.O Wits end works great, he can spam stun for amazing harrass and outsustains anything, gets a ton of armor and armor penetration and his ulti works as a decent steroid
Except his mana regeneration isn't good enough even WITH frequent use of his passive and he's designed to require other people around to work at his best. He's not really a good solo top because anything he can't max Shatter against completely shuts him down.
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On March 14 2012 04:21 ManyCookies wrote:
Swapping Swain's and Veigar's passive would probably be beneficial to both as well. Swain wouldn't be as reliant on Blue, and it partially solves Veigar's early mana problems.
Swain's passive is just straight up better than Veigar's. If Swain had Veigar's passive he'd be even more of a push over early game.
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On March 14 2012 04:29 Niton wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2012 04:24 TheYango wrote:
Eve's passive would actually be really good if it were on a top laner. Consider that minions do 12 and 25 damage at level 1, and scale up their damage--her passive basically is as good or better than Fizz's passive at all points in the game. If I remember right, Fizz, Evelynn and Amumu's passives apply post-mitigation, which makes Eve's passive significantly weaker than it looks and Fizz/Amumu's significantly stronger. I think Fizz's passive is reliably better than Eve's passive on most of the bulky top laners just because of the creepwalking effect. Show nested quote +On March 14 2012 04:28 Shikyo wrote:
I think Taric is allright as a solo top o.O Wits end works great, he can spam stun for amazing harrass and outsustains anything, gets a ton of armor and armor penetration and his ulti works as a decent steroid Except his mana regeneration isn't good enough even WITH frequent use of his passive and he's designed to require other people around to work at his best. He's not really a good solo top because anything he can't max Shatter against completely shuts him down.
Sure the mana regen is good enough, it's not like you'll ever need anything but shatter and the stun in lane, just need to not spam too much.
Also of course you wouldn't play him vs Kennen, but that doesn't make him a bad solo top. Just counter tryndamere with him and enjoy those 50 dmg crits
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On March 14 2012 04:30 overt wrote:
Swain's passive is just straight up better than Veigar's.
Laning, yes, but a free chalice would be REALLY useful in prolonged standoffs later on.
If Swain had Veigar's passive he'd be even more of a push over early game.
Wait, what? Well alright, maybe he's weakish level 1-3, but his QE does a TON of damage.
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On March 14 2012 04:33 Shikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2012 04:29 Niton wrote:On March 14 2012 04:24 TheYango wrote:
Eve's passive would actually be really good if it were on a top laner. Consider that minions do 12 and 25 damage at level 1, and scale up their damage--her passive basically is as good or better than Fizz's passive at all points in the game. If I remember right, Fizz, Evelynn and Amumu's passives apply post-mitigation, which makes Eve's passive significantly weaker than it looks and Fizz/Amumu's significantly stronger. I think Fizz's passive is reliably better than Eve's passive on most of the bulky top laners just because of the creepwalking effect. On March 14 2012 04:28 Shikyo wrote:
I think Taric is allright as a solo top o.O Wits end works great, he can spam stun for amazing harrass and outsustains anything, gets a ton of armor and armor penetration and his ulti works as a decent steroid Except his mana regeneration isn't good enough even WITH frequent use of his passive and he's designed to require other people around to work at his best. He's not really a good solo top because anything he can't max Shatter against completely shuts him down. Sure the mana regen is good enough, it's not like you'll ever need anything but shatter and the stun in lane, just need to not spam too much. Also of course you wouldn't play him vs Kennen, but that doesn't make him a bad solo top. Just counter tryndamere with him and enjoy those 50 dmg crits
Ok, so, without using Shatter/Dazzle combo frequently or healing ever, explain how you expect to win the sustain trade against someone like Tryndamere. His heal is expensive as balls and you need to autoattack for something like 1100 damage just to cast it once at rank 1. I used to like winning trades with him (he was a hard, hard counter to old Jax before the changes), but his laning isn't anywhere near strong enough to justify giving top lane's farm to a completely nonscalar champion.
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I have no idea about that or math or the theory xD I've only played Taric vs Tryndamere one time and I forced him off the creeps and to recall plenty of times, every time we exchanged autos I took 0 dmg and trynd dropped to like half and then complained about insane armor and imba and overpowered.
Of course he could have been a noob, but it still felt really good and I never felt like I was running out of mana either
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On March 14 2012 04:12 NeoIllusions wrote:
From a competitive standpoint, any time you'd want to pick Lux, ask yourself "Why not Xerath?"
And Riot built Taric as a support champion. That auto-attack passive, real wtf. They should redesign that...
Jungle Taric, always auto, always mana, always heal.
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United States37500 Posts
On March 14 2012 04:44 JackDino wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2012 04:12 NeoIllusions wrote:
From a competitive standpoint, any time you'd want to pick Lux, ask yourself "Why not Xerath?"
And Riot built Taric as a support champion. That auto-attack passive, real wtf. They should redesign that... Jungle Taric, always auto, always mana, always heal.
If they actually tweaked Taric's ratios, this could totally be plausible. Give Taric's passive to a Jungler, would make a champ very happy.
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United States47024 Posts
On March 14 2012 04:29 Niton wrote:
If I remember right, Fizz, Evelynn and Amumu's passives apply post-mitigation, which makes Eve's passive significantly weaker than it looks and Fizz/Amumu's significantly stronger. I think Fizz's passive is reliably better than Eve's passive on most of the bulky top laners just because of the creepwalking effect.
Yeah, you're right. I forgot about that.
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I only once saw a Taric top but I recall people saying he was a common top before a relatively recent nerf. The taric in my game did well, more damage than I expected, but still not extraordinary amounts. Some guy raged at the Taric solo top pick too :/ but one of my other allies and I defended the pick since it used to be common.
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On March 14 2012 04:50 Hidden_MotiveS wrote:
I only once saw a Taric top but I recall people saying he was a common top before a relatively recent nerf. The taric in my game did well, more damage than I expected, but still not extraordinary amounts. Some guy raged at the Taric solo top pick too :/ but one of my other allies and I defended the pick since it used to be common.
He actually fits as a solo top better than he does as a support IMO, even now.
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On March 14 2012 04:50 Hidden_MotiveS wrote:
I only once saw a Taric top but I recall people saying he was a common top before a relatively recent nerf. The taric in my game did well, more damage than I expected, but still not extraordinary amounts. Some guy raged at the Taric solo top pick too :/ but one of my other allies and I defended the pick since it used to be common.
not common, but viable
epik i think ran it in a tourney. decent success. don't think it would work any more
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EPT
