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The Champions Feedback ThreadGeneral Warning: Do not caster bash in this thread. If there's something specific you don't like about OGN's casting, use the Feedback thread above for constructive criticism. Otherwise, don't comment about it. ~ Neo, 30.03.12, 20:25 KST |
On April 25 2012 21:32 nehcnhoj wrote:
hotshot after hannover "i need to learn more champions" 1 month later at ipl. plays same champions. comes all the way to korea. plays same champions.
Besides his nidalee, he doesn't play any aggresive champions. even his olaf almost always becomes a support / tank defensive line. If your top lane has almost no potential for aggresive snow-ball champions you lose so many options as a team. At this point even his swain would have been a good pick over what he played in a few games. Imo honestly, split-pushing champs are good when you dominate in pushing and 1v1 matchups over every member the other team can send to stop you, but with the current meta of fast pushing junglers and him being less dominant in lane (yes he did increase the cs gap against the talon, but alot of other way more aggresive / mobile tops could have even exp-zone'd the talon at that point.)
all of this is just my 5am opinion though ;;;
this doesn't have to do anything with why they lost these games today though
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On April 25 2012 21:32 nehcnhoj wrote:
hotshot after hannover "i need to learn more champions" 1 month later at ipl. plays same champions. comes all the way to korea. plays same champions.
Besides his nidalee, he doesn't play any aggresive champions. even his olaf almost always becomes a support / tank defensive line. If your top lane has almost no potential for aggresive snow-ball champions you lose so many options as a team. At this point even his swain would have been a good pick over what he played in a few games. Imo honestly, split-pushing champs are good when you dominate in pushing and 1v1 matchups over every member the other team can send to stop you, but with the current meta of fast pushing junglers and him being less dominant in lane (yes he did increase the cs gap against the talon, but alot of other way more aggresive / mobile tops could have even exp-zone'd the talon at that point.)
all of this is just my 5am opinion though ;;;
Umm, he did say that, but I think their main goal after IPL was that chauster starts to play top as well. Only problem is hotshot's support, which is beyond bad if you ask me, and they might not want to switch things up mid tournament.
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On April 25 2012 21:32 StUfF wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2012 21:31 beefhamburger wrote:
So does CLG leave Korea asap? I see no reason to waste more money on that apartment if they don't have a tourney to play for anymore. "We're about to go on air and play in about 15 minutes. If we lose we're out and we go back home empty handed, if we win we'll secure 18k. After playing with the asian teams, they are very strong. Comparable or even better to US/EU teams. We lost constantly vs emfire like 15 times in a row and took second at IPL. Do watch this." HotShot on Reddit.
Yeah I read that but that doesn't really say when they leave Korea, only that they get no prize money.
But as Woony said, might as well stay if they already prepaid for 3 months. Hope they don't kill each other in the mean time and find their bearings again.
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they had some bad plays but real turning point of the game was dragon fight..
even though they were a little behind in gold, talon was basically useless. then in that fight doublelift gets caught out of position + they got engaged on with kennen ult on CS. that got everyone else in the game more ahead and made talon an actual threat
gonna be interesting to see what CLG does going forward. chauster has basically been calling out hotshot on CLGs website for not practicing at all and its pretty obvious.. he doesn't really play anything except cho/olaf/swain/nidalee/irel. they can't pick a lot of the popular tops now like kennen/vlad/riven/rumble/lee sin/ECT
it was also pretty obvious they weren't going to have jiji play kennen but put him mid after seeing their picks. hes not bad at kennen but he doesn't play it much and he played pretty badly this game
biggest problem was doublelift though. that team comp is relying on vayne for like 80% of their damage and he farmed poorly + went full retard multiple times. i don't think CLG had a single 5v5 with everyone there and kennen ult that entire game
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On April 25 2012 21:34 beefhamburger wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2012 21:32 StUfF wrote:On April 25 2012 21:31 beefhamburger wrote:
So does CLG leave Korea asap? I see no reason to waste more money on that apartment if they don't have a tourney to play for anymore. "We're about to go on air and play in about 15 minutes. If we lose we're out and we go back home empty handed, if we win we'll secure 18k. After playing with the asian teams, they are very strong. Comparable or even better to US/EU teams. We lost constantly vs emfire like 15 times in a row and took second at IPL. Do watch this." HotShot on Reddit. Yeah I read that but that doesn't really say when they leave Korea, only that they get no prize money. But as Woony said, might as well stay if they already prepaid for 3 months. Hope they don't kill each other in the mean time and find their bearings again.
From their vlogs I'd say they're gonna leave asap. "korea's good and all, but only for the experience, not to live for long periods of time" is basically the gist of it.
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On April 25 2012 21:33 Itsmedudeman wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2012 21:32 nehcnhoj wrote:
hotshot after hannover "i need to learn more champions" 1 month later at ipl. plays same champions. comes all the way to korea. plays same champions.
Besides his nidalee, he doesn't play any aggresive champions. even his olaf almost always becomes a support / tank defensive line. If your top lane has almost no potential for aggresive snow-ball champions you lose so many options as a team. At this point even his swain would have been a good pick over what he played in a few games. Imo honestly, split-pushing champs are good when you dominate in pushing and 1v1 matchups over every member the other team can send to stop you, but with the current meta of fast pushing junglers and him being less dominant in lane (yes he did increase the cs gap against the talon, but alot of other way more aggresive / mobile tops could have even exp-zone'd the talon at that point.)
all of this is just my 5am opinion though ;;;
Umm, he did say that, but I think their main goal after IPL was that chauster starts to play top as well. Only problem is hotshot's support, which is beyond bad if you ask me, and they might not want to switch things up mid tournament.
TBH that's chauster's opinion. He's been saying they should go Champ specific for a while now, but egos on team means no one listens to each other and they kinda just cruise by solo queue mentality. The fact they got IPL5 second probably didn't help, they need to really start losing and more importantly lose popularity before they start giving a shit and try to win?
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Pretty obvious that CLG hated living with each other. I remember Doublelift saying something like that in an interview. It's why they're not going to get a gaming house in the USA.
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Dayuuuum. God damn, when are they gonna have an actual international tournament.
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On April 25 2012 21:22 Itsmedudeman wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2012 21:21 luckybeni2 wrote:On April 25 2012 21:17 cvt wrote:
Koreans making foreigners look silly... what a surprise :p. It has mostly to do with CLG playing pretty bad. In Korea they haven't been playing very well in general. There was no reason for HS to suicide 2 times in 2 minutes like that or to pick all those stupid fights. They're getting straight up outplayed, not so much to do with any sort of issue they have on stage. Leading up to IPL4 they lost to like everyone in scrims.
They played 5 games in Korea and in 2 of them they had unwinnable team compositions. Chogath was basically a useless pick too and HS played really bad in general missing a lot of cs and later losing the teamfights because he whent out alone. Bot lane is basically impossible to win for CLG anyway even against far worse players so they just tried to farm to lategame. DL suicided too to catch mundo she dove in 5v1. That is simply bad play. When you already are down 4v5 you dont sacrifice your ad carry to maybe finish off a bruiser. That cost them baron and then HS ran out to river in midlane ALONE with no turrets anywhere near and got killed of course and DL did the same at botlane shortly after. After that CLG had pretty much lost all outer towers, dragon, baron and shortly after that the game.
Before the dragon fight the game was pretty ok for them. Vayne was slowly getting to the point where she was getting better than Graves even if she gets outfarmed, mid Kennen is extremely strong in teamfights(if he doesn't forget his hourglas) and jungle was pretty fed too. The only teamfights that happened though were after mig had baron and all towers.
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this mig interview... so cocky lol
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Loco added so much to the broadcast I hope they will have him on friday as well.
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On April 25 2012 21:40 Itsmedudeman wrote:
Dayuuuum. God damn, when are they gonna have an actual international tournament.
IPL5 I guess, though I duno when IEM starts again.
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Really, really hyped for IPL5 and hope that both MiG teams get to face M5, CLG EU, and TSM!
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On April 25 2012 21:40 Itsmedudeman wrote:
Dayuuuum. God damn, when are they gonna have an actual international tournament.
i really hope MLG will invite some of these korean teams to the next MLG that has LoL. even if they don't though, riot will 100% for sure have some way for the koreans to qualify for the season 2 championship since they have been putting tons of money into promoting LoL in KR.
TBH I don't think the KR teams are way ahead or anything like that. CLG just played very badly and kinda got exposed for some of the issues that they have had for a while. Najin and MiG Frost are probably the only ones good enough to compete with the top US/NA teams as of right now though.
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They still have that go4lol asia tourney to play in.
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On April 25 2012 21:41 luckybeni2 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2012 21:22 Itsmedudeman wrote:On April 25 2012 21:21 luckybeni2 wrote:On April 25 2012 21:17 cvt wrote:
Koreans making foreigners look silly... what a surprise :p. It has mostly to do with CLG playing pretty bad. In Korea they haven't been playing very well in general. There was no reason for HS to suicide 2 times in 2 minutes like that or to pick all those stupid fights. They're getting straight up outplayed, not so much to do with any sort of issue they have on stage. Leading up to IPL4 they lost to like everyone in scrims. They played 5 games in Korea and in 2 of them they had unwinnable team compositions. Chogath was basically a useless pick too and HS played really bad in general missing a lot of cs and later losing the teamfights because he whent out alone. Bot lane is basically impossible to win for CLG anyway even against far worse players so they just tried to farm to lategame. DL suicided too to catch mundo she dove in 5v1. That is simply bad play. When you already are down 4v5 you dont sacrifice your ad carry to maybe finish off a bruiser. That cost them baron and then HS ran out to river in midlane ALONE with no turrets anywhere near and got killed of course and DL did the same at botlane shortly after. After that CLG had pretty much lost all outer towers, dragon, baron and shortly after that the game. Before the dragon fight the game was pretty ok for them. Vayne was slowly getting to the point where she was getting better than Graves even if she gets outfarmed, mid Kennen is extremely strong in teamfights(if he doesn't forget his hourglas) and jungle was pretty fed too. The only teamfights that happened though were after mig had baron and all towers.
They were 4k gold down and 3 towers down before the dragon fight even though talon got absolutely dumped on and was 45 cs down at one point. After that point the game was over pretty much yeah, and nothing CLG did that looked like bad play really mattered.
And uhh, I was talking about SCRIMS. Hotshott said they lost 16 times in a row to emfire. If you think this was them having an offday/bad picks and not the superiority of the korean teams (at least CLG tier teams), you're gonna be in for a surprise.
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I feel like the play that lost the game was the fight at dragon which led into MiG's first Baron.
MiG made a good play waiting in the dragon-river bushes with oracles with the knowledge that Dragon was spawning and CLG was moving towards it. Usually even if you have some standard of coordination, at that semi early to mid point in the game when you are moving towards an objective that's spawning soon you don't stick together really tightly. The mundo cleaver from no-vision on i think it was kennen really surprised CLG, they backed off before SV probably made the call to go in when he twisted into them. However, at that point they had already front loaded their damage off on Hotshot who was low - into dead, doublelift had also backed off as he was the lagging member in the move towards dragon and was probably surprised by the mundocleaver from no-vision bushes, talon also made a bee-line for him.
At that point CLG could still turn it around, even after hotshot died, but jiji missed the most crucial shuriken that could have turned into an ult + w for a stun proc on the tf ult, the tf ult secured the kill on vayne and they made a 5v1 instant burst + ali pulv turn onto kennen, if TF was stunned and potentially killed, it could still have been an even fight with doublelift kitting the single talon on him. But small mistakes turned it into a 4 for nothing and they took baron and it was pretty much a straight snowball from there unless MiG threw.
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I'm really, really, really worried about Fnatic on Friday now. If they can at least beat team OP, they can lose in the semi finals. That would be respectable, right? ;P
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If fnatic win on Friday they will defintely exceed everyone's expectations lol.
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EPT
