• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 06:29
CEST 12:29
KST 19:29
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO4 & Finals Preview0[ASL21] Ro4 Preview: On Course12Code S Season 1 - RO8 Preview7[ASL21] Ro8 Preview Pt2: Progenitors8Code S Season 1 - RO12 Group A: Rogue, Percival, Solar, Zoun13
Community News
Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO8 Results2Weekly Cups (May 4-10): Clem, MaxPax, herO win1Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule !11Weekly Cups (April 27-May 4): Clem takes triple0RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event12
StarCraft 2
General
Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO4 & Finals Preview Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO8 Results Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO12 Results Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists MaNa leaves Team Liquid
Tourneys
KSL Week 89 2026 GSL Season 2 Qualifiers Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule ! $5,000 WardiTV Spring Championship 2026 SC2 INu's Battles#16 <BO.9>
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players
External Content
Mutation # 525 Wheel of Misfortune The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 524 Death and Taxes Mutation # 523 Firewall
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ vespene.gg — BW replays in browser BW General Discussion ASL21 General Discussion Pros React to: TvT Masterclass in FlaSh vs Light
Tourneys
[ASL21] Semifinals B Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Semifinals A
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates [G] Hydra ZvZ: An Introduction Simple Questions, Simple Answers Muta micro map competition
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Starcraft Tabletop Miniature Game PC Games Sales Thread
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread UK Politics Mega-thread YouTube Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
streaming software Strange computer issues (software) [G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
How EEG Data Can Predict Gam…
TrAiDoS
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1835 users

[Patch 1.0.0.132: Sejuani] General Discussion - Page 159

Forum Index > LoL General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 157 158 159 160 161 193 Next
Public Service Announcement
Use the Champion threads whenever appropriate.
Don't use General Discussion simply out of ease.
=====
If you want to whine about server lag, use the QQ thread. We all suffer alike when Riot servers kaput. No need to make a post about it in GD.
starfries
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Canada3508 Posts
January 29 2012 16:11 GMT
#3161
Is it really a zero-sum system? I seem to gain more Elo for won games than I lose for lost games. But then there's also queue dodging which lowers your Elo with no effect on everyone else.
DJ – do you like ramen, Savior? Savior – not really. Bisu – I eat it often. Flash – I’m a maniac! | Foxer Fighting!
necrosed
Profile Joined March 2011
Brazil885 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-29 16:13:52
January 29 2012 16:13 GMT
#3162
It is not zero sum because of Elo decay and queue dodges.
Shadow of his former self.
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
January 29 2012 16:16 GMT
#3163
But it IS kind of like mercantilism in the 1400's. Only so much elo to go around, you need to take it from others in order to get any yourself.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
anmolsinghmzn2009
Profile Joined June 2011
India1783 Posts
January 29 2012 16:16 GMT
#3164
On January 30 2012 00:06 Hidden_MotiveS wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 29 2012 23:17 anmolsinghmzn2009 wrote:
On January 29 2012 23:11 Craton wrote:
On January 29 2012 19:12 pschiu wrote:
Watching bigfatlp's stream, he's been queueing for 14 minutes and still counting lolol.

Highest I've seen jiji get is ~50 minutes. I personally usually get a ranked game in 3-4 minutes, a normal blind in 5-6, and a normal draft in 10-12. Normals being longer than ranked is kinda dumb.


That's pretty weird. I get normals faster than that on SEA lol. And on NA my normal queue is like 30s.

I could be wrong/rude but I think it's because fewer people play at his ELO.

Of course I understand that, I was just surprised that his blind pick queue times were more than ranked. I wouldve imagined it to be the other way round.
Dunk first. Ask questions while dunking.
Frolossus
Profile Joined February 2010
United States4779 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-29 16:25:15
January 29 2012 16:25 GMT
#3165
how should i be building karthus now?
also what summoner spells?
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
January 29 2012 16:30 GMT
#3166
On January 30 2012 01:25 Frolossus wrote:
how should i be building karthus now?
also what summoner spells?

Ask thur.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=238148
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
January 29 2012 17:17 GMT
#3167
On January 29 2012 18:19 Inflicted_ wrote:
Builds for AD carry that stray away from the glass cannon IE/BT into PD only work in a premade/if you trust your allies enough. Items like Wit's End and early defensive items (Wriggle's) means that you're basically relying on your team (mainly top and mid) to win the teamfights while you just focus on staying alive in order to gain gold/EXP and eventually become strong late-game.

What? This is the exact OPPOSITE of what's true. Defensive/Offensive hybrid items like Triforce and Wit's have BETTER out-of-the-box cost-effectiveness than pure AD items. Late-game is when they get totally outscaled by AD items because of the multiplicative scaling benefits of AD items.

Going conventional pure AD items makes you LESS self-sufficient and MORE team-reliant because of how much comparative protection you need in teamfights.
Moderator
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
January 29 2012 17:20 GMT
#3168
I seriously think that in addition to whatever mod notes Neo posts at the top of the forum the following message should be at the top of the list every patch:

"DO NOT BE A SHEEP. That means thinking for yourself, understanding why certain things are done, and above all, NEVER use or accept the argument: everyone does X, so it must be right."
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
Shiragaku
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Hong Kong4308 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-29 17:22:04
January 29 2012 17:21 GMT
#3169
On January 30 2012 02:20 Two_DoWn wrote:
I seriously think that in addition to whatever mod notes Neo posts at the top of the forum the following message should be at the top of the list every patch:

"DO NOT BE A SHEEP. That means thinking for yourself, understanding why certain things are done, and above all, NEVER use or accept the argument: everyone does X, so it must be right."

But trying to argue that clarity is good is a whole different story...someone tried using the stop being a sheep argument to justify the use of that ability and prebuff heal...
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
January 29 2012 17:23 GMT
#3170
On January 30 2012 02:21 Shiragaku wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 30 2012 02:20 Two_DoWn wrote:
I seriously think that in addition to whatever mod notes Neo posts at the top of the forum the following message should be at the top of the list every patch:

"DO NOT BE A SHEEP. That means thinking for yourself, understanding why certain things are done, and above all, NEVER use or accept the argument: everyone does X, so it must be right."

But trying to argue that clarity is good is a whole different story...someone tried using the stop being a sheep argument to justify the use of that ability and prebuff heal...

Id rather have people think about mana regen mechanics and try to come to a better understanding of how to maximize the amount of mana you have in lane than people who blindly accept Clarity is bad simply because no one uses it.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
January 29 2012 17:24 GMT
#3171
Healbait2stronk.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
turdburgler
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
England6749 Posts
January 29 2012 17:26 GMT
#3172
people get away and get killed by ignite as often as they get away because you have no mana. clarity has its uses.
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
January 29 2012 17:35 GMT
#3173
On January 30 2012 02:21 Shiragaku wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 30 2012 02:20 Two_DoWn wrote:
I seriously think that in addition to whatever mod notes Neo posts at the top of the forum the following message should be at the top of the list every patch:

"DO NOT BE A SHEEP. That means thinking for yourself, understanding why certain things are done, and above all, NEVER use or accept the argument: everyone does X, so it must be right."

But trying to argue that clarity is good is a whole different story...someone tried using the stop being a sheep argument to justify the use of that ability and prebuff heal...

"Stop being a sheep" is not an argument in and of itself. Neither is "nobody does it, so it's bad."

The whole point is that we should be judging ideas based on their merits, not based on any predisposition toward or against them.
Moderator
Abenson
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Canada4122 Posts
January 29 2012 17:44 GMT
#3174
On January 30 2012 02:35 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 30 2012 02:21 Shiragaku wrote:
On January 30 2012 02:20 Two_DoWn wrote:
I seriously think that in addition to whatever mod notes Neo posts at the top of the forum the following message should be at the top of the list every patch:

"DO NOT BE A SHEEP. That means thinking for yourself, understanding why certain things are done, and above all, NEVER use or accept the argument: everyone does X, so it must be right."

But trying to argue that clarity is good is a whole different story...someone tried using the stop being a sheep argument to justify the use of that ability and prebuff heal...

"Stop being a sheep" is not an argument in and of itself. Neither is "nobody does it, so it's bad."

The whole point is that we should be judging ideas based on their merits, not based on any predisposition toward or against them.


I don't see anything wrong with doing what others are doing.
However, I do agree that one must think about what they're doing instead of blindly following the trend.
Noocta
Profile Joined June 2010
France12578 Posts
January 29 2012 17:57 GMT
#3175
I used to take clarity on Anivia because Ignite range is often too low for her to use it proprely. And she's slow as hellto catch up to people.
Some friend often troll me about that but i thought it was fine.. Beside, what else to use ? Teleport maybe but that's as niche as clarity. :/
" I'm not gonna fight you. I'm gonna kick your ass ! "
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-29 18:05:40
January 29 2012 18:04 GMT
#3176
On January 30 2012 02:57 Noocta wrote:
I used to take clarity on Anivia because Ignite range is often too low for her to use it proprely. And she's slow as hellto catch up to people.
Some friend often troll me about that but i thought it was fine.. Beside, what else to use ? Teleport maybe but that's as niche as clarity. :/

Teleport is way less niche than Clarity. It was the most common set of summoners for Anivia back when she was bugged so that you could channel TP during Egg (which meant you could start it just as you were about to get egged and get out of a bad spot). Flash/Ghost is "standard" (movespeed/repositioning is extremely good on Anivia), but I can see Flash/Cleanse or Flash/Heal being good also.

The problem with Clarity on Anivia (and on any AP for that matter) is that the amount of mana restored scales as a flat amount, meaning that as a game goes on, and you get more mana/regen/blue buff, it becomes more and more irrelevant. I've said this before, but IMO Clarity would be way more useful if it restored a fixed % of maximum mana, rather than returning a flat amount of mana.
Moderator
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
January 29 2012 18:16 GMT
#3177
Or if clarity had a passive mana regen boost that doubled or something when you activated it.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
Inflicted
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Australia18228 Posts
January 29 2012 18:24 GMT
#3178
On January 30 2012 02:17 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 29 2012 18:19 Inflicted_ wrote:
Builds for AD carry that stray away from the glass cannon IE/BT into PD only work in a premade/if you trust your allies enough. Items like Wit's End and early defensive items (Wriggle's) means that you're basically relying on your team (mainly top and mid) to win the teamfights while you just focus on staying alive in order to gain gold/EXP and eventually become strong late-game.

What? This is the exact OPPOSITE of what's true. Defensive/Offensive hybrid items like Triforce and Wit's have BETTER out-of-the-box cost-effectiveness than pure AD items. Late-game is when they get totally outscaled by AD items because of the multiplicative scaling benefits of AD items.

Going conventional pure AD items makes you LESS self-sufficient and MORE team-reliant because of how much comparative protection you need in teamfights.


You're right, I don't know what I was thinking at the time of the post since I usually have the same view as you.

Wit's End and Wriggle's are better early game since they are relatively cheap and provide a range of stats which are helpful to you, but become less effective late-game as they're going to have void staff/last whisper, you're using an item slot on a lower tier item and delaying the AD items. Building Wit's End/defensive items means that you're forced to capitalize on your early advantage (compared to their AD) in order to be on equal footing with their AD late-game.
Liquipedia"Expert"
cascades
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Singapore6122 Posts
January 29 2012 18:52 GMT
#3179
You lose 20 elo afaik when dodge, aka not advisable.
HS: cascades#1595 || LoL: stoppin
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17282 Posts
January 29 2012 19:06 GMT
#3180
10, as stated several times
twitch.tv/cratonz
Prev 1 157 158 159 160 161 193 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
RSL Revival
10:00
Season 5: Playoffs Day 2
Clem vs Rogue
Bunny vs LamboLIVE!
Tasteless752
IntoTheiNu 370
RotterdaM226
Ryung 217
TKL 179
IndyStarCraft 77
3DClanTV 44
Rex39
CranKy Ducklings37
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Tasteless 752
RotterdaM 226
Ryung 217
TKL 179
ProTech151
IndyStarCraft 77
mouzStarbuck 66
Lowko42
Rex 39
MindelVK 11
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 2486
Zeus 244
ggaemo 172
Mind 158
ZerO 103
Dewaltoss 98
Last 65
Hm[arnc] 52
Pusan 52
Backho 42
[ Show more ]
Bonyth 35
Noble 21
Sacsri 20
Liquid`Ret 15
Dota 2
Gorgc3025
League of Legends
JimRising 408
Heroes of the Storm
Trikslyr33
Other Games
gofns20769
singsing1737
crisheroes202
monkeys_forever99
XcaliburYe32
ZerO(Twitch)12
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL34646
Other Games
gamesdonequick795
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 18
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Adnapsc2 10
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 2
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos2042
• Stunt415
Upcoming Events
IPSL
5h 31m
Dewalt vs nOmaD
Ret vs Cross
BSL
5h 31m
Artosis vs Sterling
eOnzErG vs TBD
BSL
8h 31m
Bonyth vs Doodle
Dewalt vs TerrOr
Patches Events
12h 16m
GSL
21h 31m
Cure vs herO
SHIN vs Maru
IPSL
1d 5h
Bonyth vs Napoleon
G5 vs JDConan
BSL
1d 8h
OyAji vs JDConan
DragOn vs TBD
Replay Cast
1d 22h
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
[ Show More ]
The PondCast
2 days
GSL
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
GSL
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: W7
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
Acropolis #4
KK 2v2 League Season 1
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
SCTL 2026 Spring
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
Heroes Pulsing #1
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2

Upcoming

YSL S3
Escore Tournament S2: W8
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Maestros of the Game 2
WardiTV Spring 2026
2026 GSL S2
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.