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Want to rage about your latest loss? Use the QQ thread. If you whine in GD, you'll get warned. ===== + Show Spoiler +If your [Stream] thread was moved to the general TL Stream subforum (aka SC stream land), find your thread and PM it to me and I'll move it back to LoL territory. I can argue with staff that moving a non-SC thread into a SC subforum is just asking for that thread to get buried.
- Neo, Dec. 15 2011, 6:33 KST I have admin approval. I'll be moving LoL streams back to the subforum. Stream name will be based on Summoner name. - Neo 7:07 KST |
I'd edit but the oh-so-civil conversation regarding Hynda's ban and ingame behaviour's running too fast for me.
About Viktor's Hexcore @level 18:
Power: 54 AP, 220 HP, +6hp5, small speed boost on a short cd provided he's got a target
Gravity: 54 AP, 200 mana, 10% cdr, +5mp5, stun range extended too 800+
Death: 99 AP, gets a 30% damage increase on a pretty decent AoE line-skillshot
Gravity seems a bit weak (altho my fav' because of the cdr), I'd need to see the full implication for the +30% range on the stun tho.
Death definitely not bad, assuming you've already got your big items (for that slot to matter) 99 AP's a pretty good amount amongst the remaining items and the damage boost is worth ~200 damage with 350-400 AP.
Power seems weak, objectively less so than Gravity (but there's no cdr!  ), the utility may be good when chasing and fleeing tho. Q those creeps!
It's more a matter of "when is it available/what are the prices/how can the augments be fitted into a 'normal' AP build" to me.
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On December 23 2011 01:37 Alaric wrote:Show nested quote +On December 23 2011 01:19 Requizen wrote:On December 23 2011 01:12 Alaric wrote:
Looks like a sustained dps mage to me. Probably not Swain or Ryze-level, as he has less damage spells and more burst in his ult, but I find him quite similar to them. Probably more suited to solotop than mid too, since the spotlight (I mean, not official SL, but that thing shown to IGN is obviously spotlight footage) showed that the shield return from his Q isn't instant, I can't see it being too useful to trade against other ranged champs. Not in lane harass at least, 600 range's pretty short too compared to most mid so he'd be hit before he's got his shield.
Also, low-CD protective single-target spell? Rylai please. Kiting Viktor with Rylai and Power Augment might be reminiscent of Vlad. Ooh, Rylai tanky-dps Viktor in top lane? Anyone without a dash gettin stunned. Rylai to slow, drop AoE, shoot lasers and laugh. First thing I tought about when I read his skills — but when I read here some weeks ago about the unescapable 1v1 Rylai-Vlad I was so flabbergasted that it stuck in my mind.  Depending on the responsiveness of his ult repositioning mechanic and the radius of his AoE it might be downright broken tho, the numbers are absurd if you manage to keep somebody in for the full duration so with an AoE permaslow added... I was a bit disappointed by his stun and ult animations but eh, you can't get everything packed in one.
I don't think they look bad. The cloud could be cooler, but I rather like the slow/stun field.
I think it's supposed to be broken, though. They said that newer champions were going to be more and more complex. Good players will be able to use his ult along with his stun for massive, inescapable AoE damage, while bad players will likely miss both or only get the initial burst of his ult and not position it correctly.
Now, I wonder if you can still control it while under the effect of Hourglass's active. You get jumped, ult is up, you invuln and have it chase them, because it moves really fast while near to you.
On December 23 2011 01:48 Alaric wrote:I'd edit but the oh-so-civil conversation regarding Hynda's ban and ingame behaviour's running too fast for me. About Viktor's Hexcore @level 18: Power: 54 AP, 220 HP, +6hp5, small speed boost on a short cd provided he's got a target Gravity: 54 AP, 200 mana, 10% cdr, +5mp5, stun range extended too 800+ Death: 99 AP, gets a 30% damage increase on a pretty decent AoE line-skillshot Gravity seems a bit weak (altho my fav' because of the cdr), I'd need to see the full implication for the +30% range on the stun tho. Death definitely not bad, assuming you've already got your big items (for that slot to matter) 99 AP's a pretty good amount amongst the remaining items and the damage boost is worth ~200 damage with 350-400 AP. Power seems weak, objectively less so than Gravity (but there's no cdr! ), the utility may be good when chasing and fleeing tho. Q those creeps! It's more a matter of "when is it available/what are the prices/how can the augments be fitted into a 'normal' AP build" to me.
Yeah, I don't think Power will be taken that often, maybe in Dominion where skirmish fights are less rare. Gravity seems to be the AoE/CC/disruption comp upgrade, while Death is the bursty/fed upgrade.
On the note of upgrades, have they said anything about a cost? Does it cost just gold, or items, or is it just free at the start of the game?
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On December 23 2011 01:44 BlackPaladin wrote:
Any game that has rules about insults and such are generally vague in the rules about it. They just say try not to insult people. But generally actual support are told to use their better judgment on the matter, although things like real life threats or insults "Fuck you, I will fuck your mother you piece of shit" (like that) are frowned upon fully. >_>
I've never in my life played a game/been on a forum that had rules against insults where it wasn't vague. You simply CAN'T be specific about such things.
edit: Also, the ignore function is more of a band-aid and temporary fix for the person who has to deal with people talking trash. The point of bans is to punish someone and try to teach them a lesson for what they did wrong. Obviously, it doesn't always work. But the point of bans has always been to punish someone to try to either teach them a lesson or to remove them permanently from the game if they don't learn their behavior isn't acceptable.
Riot's only real problem is they don't tell the accused what they did wrong. They're missing the full point of a ban system. zzz
As said that is my personal feelings about not my professional feelings. Curse words and swearing has a very good general guideline for most games which is simply.
if it's a throw away comment it's fine, if it turns to harrasment it's not.
example lets say you wipe at a boss in a game of war and crafting.
"Oh you piece of crap, why would you stand in the god damn fire? You absolute moron." - no ban
"Oh you fucking worthless piece of shit, why would you stand in the motherfucking fire you retarded son of a bitch" - Warning
"Oh you fucking worthless piece of shit, why would you stand in the motherfucking fire you retarded son of a bitch"
"Sorry"
"No I don't want to hear any fucking excuses you're getting gicked and I'll fuck up any guild you'll ever try to join, fuck you". - ban
it makes pretty distinct cut.
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They didn't say anything, but since there's no timer on LoL's shop (compared to, say, DotA) I guess they'll put a price to prevent people from getting Death at level 1 with a full AP runepage.
1200 gold was mentioned, but I wouldn't be able to recall where, and by who. So take it with a grain of salt, nothing official here.
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On December 23 2011 01:56 Alaric wrote:They didn't say anything, but since there's no timer on LoL's shop (compared to, say, DotA) I guess they'll put a price to prevent people from getting Death at level 1 with a full AP runepage. 1200 gold was mentioned, but I wouldn't be able to recall where, and by who. So take it with a grain of salt, nothing official here.
http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Viktor_the_Machine_Herald
mentioned here? unless you don't consider this official
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I saw it on the official forums one or two days ago, but it wasn't a red and it was before the wiki was updated. But since Viktor was added to the shop by today's patch I guess the item's there too and somebody datamined to find this. Must be legit then. And actually quite cheap for its effects.
Also I said "nothing official" regarding my claim, not the number. ^^'
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Seems a bit high? I don't know how it measures up in cost effectiveness, but I'm sure augmenting specific abilities is hard to put a price on. When it comes down to it, what order would you build it in? I'm not sure if it's worth getting ahead of your core, given the stats. Would you really put off a Rylai/RoA/Deathcap/whatever your core item is that long?
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On December 23 2011 01:46 unichan wrote:Show nested quote +On December 23 2011 01:38 Hynda wrote:On December 23 2011 01:29 unichan wrote:On December 23 2011 01:16 Hynda wrote:On December 23 2011 01:15 unichan wrote:On December 23 2011 01:13 Hynda wrote:On December 23 2011 01:11 unichan wrote:On December 23 2011 00:58 Hynda wrote:On December 23 2011 00:55 starfries wrote:On December 23 2011 00:49 Hynda wrote:
You could get a guy that think what you did was right and pardon you or you could get one that will ban you, because they are humans to and will interperate the code differently. Were you expecting a robot or something? And you post on TL, where mods can ban to their discretion and don't have to give you a detailed explanation. It's not like it's a unique situation. It's Riot's game, they can ban whomever they want. But there is a hell of different situation when you have outlined rules that you can refer back to. Riot doesn't use that. A rioter is allowed to ban you cause he had a bad day and felt like punishing someone. I've never once stated that they can't do whatever the fuck they want to do. What started this was that I called Riots tribunal and banning staff a joke. Which is something I still hold firm to. people don't want your criticism, deal with it if you know what you did wrong and you don't want to be banned anymore then stop doing it it's annoying as fuck when someone who thinks he's god at the game and believes he is clearly better than anyone else playing thinks he deserves to tell other people what they're doing wrong. contrary to popular belief, many players are actually aware of when they fucked up and they don't need you to rub it in their face. You seem to have missed the point entierly. I don't blame you for it but there isn't really anything I can respond to here, since it's not relevant. cause i just skimmed through the last pages lol cause you wrote too much but i don't know why you're writing pages about why the system is flawed when you're clearly just mad you got banned Yea I asumed so and that is fine. I don't expect people to put effort into reading something they are not interested in. Lets ignore all the arguments and just say "lol u mad". I'm not taking your troll bait, however you are allowed to believe whatever you want. yea this still doesn't explain why you believe you're allowed to be a jerk in game and not get banned just because the summoner's code is "vague"? or are you going to try to say that's not what you're saying at all As for getting banned just for giving advice, was just an experiment just to show myself that the summoners code is way to vague and it's super easy to get banned even though you follow it word for word. That has nothing with my personal view of it, it has to do with my professional view of it. It's a joke from a professional standpoint. From the experiment I concluded: Player one following the code to a tee: Says A Player two Breaks the code and tells that player to go fuck himself. Player one gets banned, player two gets to plan on. Why does player one get reported. Simply because people asume you're an asshole and only say stuff to be mean. From a personal standpoint I have a much dimmer view. I hate that companies makes their players walk on eggshells around each other as if they can't take someone being ass, there is an ignore function. Use it. If people were allowed to be as much an absolute dick in chat as they wanted sure the ignore lists would be massive, but those that had valid things to say could communicate with eachother freely. Social Engineering. sux that you feel that way man what experiment btw, did you play on one account being the helpful douche and on another being the super douche? if you would like to elaborate on that or if you already have please point it out to me cause i don't see how you arrived at that conclusion
Exactly what I did was this. At first I got very rightly banned for mostly handling situations like this. Someone would be doing something real stupid: I would go something like "B" or "wait" or a ping. They would do something dumb such as thinking they are immune to damage under a turret. And I would respond with a "I told you so" and if they mouthed of a that just call them bad and move on with my life. That isn't promoting good play, that's just laughing at people when they do stupid shit. Justified ban 100% both acording to me and to the rules.
I got back and decided I would type out what was going to happen before it happened and afterwards just type "please listen in the future". In hopes of stoping some people from doing stupid shit. This is acording to the code the way to do it. It's a team game after all if you see something they don't you should call it out.
However regardless of my intentions with this, people will just see that as someone being an asshole because they can't take being bad at something and being called out being bad. So they react badly to it because someone says "Oh this will happen if you don't b" then it happens they know that they fucked up. In essence what it is, is someone trying to help the team without shouting or being unpleasant but simply by stating what will happen. Acording to the summoners code that is both something to be admired and something that should be banned. Hence acording to that thing it's a ban cause acording to the summoners codex no matter what you do there is something in there that will get you banned.
what really happens is that people think "Oh he is just doing to be a smartass" instead of the actually having trust in their teammates, so they react violently and starts cursing and going "report this asshole". And no I don't think I'm the best player in the world, there has been plenty of situations when people called me out and I went "Nah, it'll be fine" failed horribly but the difference between me and most idiots that play this game is that my reaction to that isn't "Fuck this guy" it's "Fuck, he saw something I didn't, how can I improve". But then again it's hard to argue with someone that doesn't actually read the posts (and I don't blame you for that) cause you keep asuming so much shit I allready adressed.
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On December 22 2011 17:29 Ferrose wrote:Show nested quote +On December 22 2011 14:42 UniversalSnip wrote:On December 22 2011 14:09 rigwarl wrote:On December 22 2011 13:34 Chrispy wrote:
I'm pretty sure Morde is back to being good. My last three games (mid lane):
vs Morg: Huge farmfest for both of us.
vs Veigar: Easy lane for me, farm 5eva.
vs Tryn: Easy lane, outfarmed him by a lot until he got enough lifesteal to stay.
I've been bringing summoner heal rather than ignite because I'm going more for the push and farm forever strat rather than getting kills. If I brought ignite I'm sure I'd kill more but I'd also die more. Heal and flash basically nullifies any gank attempt on Morde. I had a Vayne, Maokai and Tryn all try to towerdive me at like level 8 and I ended up getting a kill. And of course you've got to play Morde as obnoxious as possible, meaning that the enemy wraiths and sometimes even your own wraiths = yours! :D
Btw, is the respawn time on the wraiths 50 seconds now?
Also, summoner heal works for your clone. If you do the math he never really was bad, you get 6 less shield by level 5 Siphon'ing the enemy champ + 3 ranged minions than before- this was pre-latest patch, so actually now you get more shield than ever doing that. It just sounded big because it was a "50%" cut in creepshield but they buffed the base gain so it really wasn't much at all. SIX LESS SHIELD Iron Man - Shield regeneration adjusted to 30% at all levels from 25/27.5/30% - Shield regeneration is now half effective versus minions Mace of Spades bonus damage reduced to 65% from 75% Siphon of destruction no longer adds additional shield for each unit hitMaybe I'm misunderstanding the notes but isn't that last one a pretty substantial nerf? I love the LoL community. Months ago: Morde OP Morde gets nerfed Community thinks Morde sucks Morde gets slight buffs Dyrus owns with Morde on stream in record fashion OMG MORDE IS OP AGAIN
I saw a lot of Morde's immediately after the buffs, and they seemed to be doing a lot better than before. He's about right where he should be- reasonable, but he's easy enough to deal with by focusing him down still.
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On December 23 2011 02:11 zer0das wrote:Show nested quote +On December 22 2011 17:29 Ferrose wrote:On December 22 2011 14:42 UniversalSnip wrote:On December 22 2011 14:09 rigwarl wrote:On December 22 2011 13:34 Chrispy wrote:
I'm pretty sure Morde is back to being good. My last three games (mid lane):
vs Morg: Huge farmfest for both of us.
vs Veigar: Easy lane for me, farm 5eva.
vs Tryn: Easy lane, outfarmed him by a lot until he got enough lifesteal to stay.
I've been bringing summoner heal rather than ignite because I'm going more for the push and farm forever strat rather than getting kills. If I brought ignite I'm sure I'd kill more but I'd also die more. Heal and flash basically nullifies any gank attempt on Morde. I had a Vayne, Maokai and Tryn all try to towerdive me at like level 8 and I ended up getting a kill. And of course you've got to play Morde as obnoxious as possible, meaning that the enemy wraiths and sometimes even your own wraiths = yours! :D
Btw, is the respawn time on the wraiths 50 seconds now?
Also, summoner heal works for your clone. If you do the math he never really was bad, you get 6 less shield by level 5 Siphon'ing the enemy champ + 3 ranged minions than before- this was pre-latest patch, so actually now you get more shield than ever doing that. It just sounded big because it was a "50%" cut in creepshield but they buffed the base gain so it really wasn't much at all. SIX LESS SHIELD Iron Man - Shield regeneration adjusted to 30% at all levels from 25/27.5/30% - Shield regeneration is now half effective versus minions Mace of Spades bonus damage reduced to 65% from 75% Siphon of destruction no longer adds additional shield for each unit hitMaybe I'm misunderstanding the notes but isn't that last one a pretty substantial nerf? I love the LoL community. Months ago: Morde OP Morde gets nerfed Community thinks Morde sucks Morde gets slight buffs Dyrus owns with Morde on stream in record fashion OMG MORDE IS OP AGAIN I saw a lot of Morde's immediately after the buffs, and they seemed to be doing a lot better than before. He's about right where he should be- reasonable, but he's easy enough to deal with by focusing him down still.
Even with recent buffs, I still don't think he's even that viable still... Maybe 40% is more reasonable?
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He's still pubstompy as hell, and was even after his nerfs. When you have an innately tanky AP champion with an ult as silly as Morde's, he's always just going to shit on bad players if you're anywhere near good with him.
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But would you consider him more pub stompy than other tanky APs like Swain or Ryze?
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The few tribunal cases i did today were mostly just very simple. There are so many players out there that cannot stop at thinking, they need to write it all down. How can you write 32 times "omg noob" in the chat? HOW?!?!?!?
Some are borderline, they seem to rage a bit and then they play normal and do their job. But the second they tell the other guy that they will fuck their mothers, what can you do? The only persons that really get pardoned by me are those, that are reported for intentional feeding, because mostly they just had a bad game. So the numbers seem to be about right. And yeah, if you ask, you should get told what you got banned for.
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On December 23 2011 02:36 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:
But would you consider him more pub stompy than other tanky APs like Swain or Ryze?
He snowballs harder than those two. If he gets fed a little bit and you don't spot that, then he can 1v2 and burst you down and suddenly he's even more fed.
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That just results in the culprits starting to argue, like Hynda - who in fact knows exactly what he was banned for. People that can´t tell what about their behaviour might be offensive to other people are "socially challenged" and need more than an explanation to improve their behaviour. Maybe it IS a sad case of a weird disability but such a person is STILL a pain to play with.
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On December 23 2011 02:36 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:
But would you consider him more pub stompy than other tanky APs like Swain or Ryze?
Yeah, because he's inherently easier to play, in my opinion. His burst is much higher and easier to land, and some players forget how hard % health ult that also heals Morde can hit them for. Ryze and Swain need to chain together spells quickly and correctly, while Morde just kind of blows everything and dominates his lane after a certain point.
Just my experience, though. I play with a pretty good Morde player, and I've not seen him lose his lane unless they put a good level 1 duelist who outranges him top, like Vayne or something. Even then, his AoE damage and sustain with a Revolver/WotA is pretty silly to deal with.
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On December 23 2011 02:07 Requizen wrote:
Seems a bit high? I don't know how it measures up in cost effectiveness, but I'm sure augmenting specific abilities is hard to put a price on. When it comes down to it, what order would you build it in? I'm not sure if it's worth getting ahead of your core, given the stats. Would you really put off a Rylai/RoA/Deathcap/whatever your core item is that long?
Rough number for replacement cost of just the stat bonuses (not pricing the ability augments, using basic item stat cost) and ignoring the 3ap/level that the slot gets regardless;
Power: health and health regen: 770g
Gravity: mana, cdr, mp5: 1020g
Death: ap: 980g
Can't really price power or gravity's ability benefits. With more time, you could roughly price the dot damage as equivalent AP on just that ability, but it'd be wishy washy at best.
Edit: at level 18, you can add 1175g for the default AP of the core if anyone wants comparison of slot value versus other items.
Conversely, I could also switch the numbers around to determine the cost efficiency of upgrading the core versus buying a new item. But the wikia loads like shit on my work comp and phone. Bah.
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On December 23 2011 02:41 Unentschieden wrote:
That just results in the culprits starting to argue, like Hynda - who in fact knows exactly what he was banned for. People that can´t tell what about their behaviour might be offensive to other people are "socially challenged" and need more than an explanation to improve their behaviour. Maybe it IS a sad case of a weird disability but such a person is STILL a pain to play with.
I think the way that Riot is pretty responsive to their customers leads to people feeling entitled. This is why you have people thinking Tribunal is a justice system and that the Summoner's Code is a legal document that you can find loopholes in and that you should be able to get off on a technicality. In fact, it's more like TL's benevolent dictatorship of "this is our house" and Riot can ban you solely on the fact that they don't like you.
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On December 23 2011 02:49 Prinate wrote:Show nested quote +On December 23 2011 02:07 Requizen wrote:
Seems a bit high? I don't know how it measures up in cost effectiveness, but I'm sure augmenting specific abilities is hard to put a price on. When it comes down to it, what order would you build it in? I'm not sure if it's worth getting ahead of your core, given the stats. Would you really put off a Rylai/RoA/Deathcap/whatever your core item is that long? Rough number for replacement cost of just the stat bonuses (not pricing the ability augments, using basic item stat cost) and ignoring the 3ap/level that the slot gets regardless; Power: health and health regen: 770g Gravity: mana, cdr, mp5: 1020g Death: ap: 980g Can't really price power or gravity's ability benefits. With more time, you could roughly price the dot damage as equivalent AP on just that ability, but it'd be wishy washy at best.
So, going off that, Power's MS boost costs 430g, Gravity's range costs 180g, and Death's damage costs 220g, about? Again, hard to math out.
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Well isn't that the point Hynda. I don't mind if you call me out for being dumb, in fact I mostly appreciate it as many players here will attest.
Point is we are a minority and most people respond negatively, as indicated from your experience.
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EPT
