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[Patch 1.0.0.124: Talon] General Discussion - Page 107

Forum Index > LoL General
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Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
September 02 2011 05:19 GMT
#2121
i dont see the problem with elo resets. baddies will be bad and not get higher elo regardless of how many times they reset their elo. it's just more money for Riot.
r.Evo
Profile Joined August 2006
Germany14081 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-02 05:32:14
September 02 2011 05:26 GMT
#2122
On September 02 2011 09:41 phyvo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 02 2011 08:44 Odds wrote:
On September 02 2011 08:21 NeoIllusions wrote:
Watching Dan jungle Skarner just makes me happy I didn't waste IP on that terribad champion.

Hopefully Talon can jungle decently. I know he's fairly potent solo top. :3

Jingling Skarner = doing it wrong. Way, way wrong.


How do you do skarner right, then?

Because honestly outside of that one Grassy vid I've never seen a skarner amount to anything. Does crap DPS, no zone control/range/initiation, and doesn't have much utility. Your gap closer is breakable, if you're not within 150 range of your target none of your skills will hit, and if you're not auto attacking everything has a wicked longer cooldown.

In my eyes his weaknesses just pile up on each other and he doesn't have any strengths whatsoever. I've watched Dan Dihn and Shushei stream him but I'm simply not impressed by them or by any of the lower elo skarners I've ever met, including ones that got solo lane farm.


Since Odds and me are the sekrit Skarner fanboys on here.. ( I guess the only ones, hurpdurp)

Skarner has (imho) a role that wasn't in the game before in this form. That's why people keep assuming he's bad, because he build and play him by common standards (just another tanky dps) while his true strength is another (anti-assassin). He is full of "IF"s, but he can be played around those. Just people run right into his "yeah he would be good IF...."-traps without realizing they can just ignore that case and play him to his strengths.

Skarner is built to rape anti-carries like Irelia, Akali, Nocturne (sometimes Jarv/Panth) and similar champs. (I'm not sure how he performs Jax, but I assume it's very similar.)

While you have strong babysitters who basicly cc their target to hell and back to keep him off your carry (think Cho/Janna) you have no one else besides Skarner who is purely built around that. (And yes, he fucking is.)


His Q is effectively a strong permaslow IF he is next to a target. The targets you need to fuck up will come to you.

His W is an INSANE steroid, considering it also gives him CDR - IF he is not the main target. Your targets will focus someone else over you, period.

His E is basicly a cute skill that gets you through laning and does some AoE damage. It's the only part of his kit that doesn't really follow what I stated above.

His R. People keep assuming it is to INITIATE on someone. Fuck, no, it's not. It's there to COUNTERINITIATE on someone. (Who came up with the idea that a skill that needs someone without a gapcloser to be in meleerange is an initiate and therefor bad?)


Think you're Janna. You stay next to your carry. When Janna would press R, you press R and click the greatest single threat to your carry who just casted his gapcloser. Then you pull that threat back into your bruisers and in the ideal range for your carries so your team can 5n1 that fucker properly. Once that's done he's permaslowed and can't get back into his chasemode (where he shines).

If you think in medieval formations: Skarner reestablishes the perfect formation for your team after an assassin dived in there and turned it all around (carry has to retreat, bruisers have to run back and save their carry).



Skarner is THE single strongest counter in the game to champions who:
-Outshine everyone 1n1.
-Hate to be focussed for more than the time it takes to go in and fuck someone up.



So let's change the "if"s people keep failing around:

IF the other team has stuff like: Nocturne/Irelia/Akali and all those fuckers who shine 1n1 & anti-squishy but hate to be focussed.
IF you have vulnerable carries who are instant targets for them (e.g. aka not-Tristana/Orianna. Really depends on matchups and the amount of "fuckers" in the other team though.)
IF you have someone who can initiate fights properly.

Skarner is a fucking great pick. Why?

He get's through laning, not great, but solid.
He shuts down the task a single major threat has to perform consistently and in an almost uncounterable way. If his target can't perform that task he's pretty much fucked.



Combine the thoughtprocess above with Odds way of itemizing Skarner (his ideas > mine there) and you realize that Skarner is WAY underrated. Not sure if other people find other ways of playing him, but imho he's a very situational pick but a great "secret weapon" if it's the correct time to play him.

You can thank us later. (;
"We don't make mistakes here, we call it happy little accidents." ~Bob Ross
Brees
Profile Joined January 2010
Marshall Islands3404 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-02 05:57:12
September 02 2011 05:56 GMT
#2123
^quicksilver sash

Ashe has been slain!

durp im a scorpion.
Brees on in
Lanzoma
Profile Joined February 2011
Mexico813 Posts
September 02 2011 06:08 GMT
#2124
You almost had me Evo, but Bree's articulate response is hard to ignore.
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
September 02 2011 06:09 GMT
#2125
My Irelia shits on Skarner no matter how anti-carry you may attempt to build him.
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
TieN.nS)
Profile Joined August 2003
United States2131 Posts
September 02 2011 06:15 GMT
#2126
On September 02 2011 15:09 Southlight wrote:
My Irelia shits on Skarner no matter how anti-carry you may attempt to build him.


[10:47:06 PM] nightseternal: irelia is a terrible hero
[10:52:35 PM] nightseternal: worst hero ever
[10:52:37 PM] nightseternal: why do ppl play her?

real hypocrite
red_
Profile Joined May 2010
United States8474 Posts
September 02 2011 06:23 GMT
#2127
On September 02 2011 15:15 TieN.nS) wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 02 2011 15:09 Southlight wrote:
My Irelia shits on Skarner no matter how anti-carry you may attempt to build him.


[10:47:06 PM] nightseternal: irelia is a terrible hero
[10:52:35 PM] nightseternal: worst hero ever
[10:52:37 PM] nightseternal: why do ppl play her?

real hypocrite


Further magnifying how terrible Skarner is =p
How did the experience of working at Mr Burns' Nuclear Plant influence Homer's composition of the Iliad and Odyssey?
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
September 02 2011 06:29 GMT
#2128
I agree with the fact that skarner doesn't really seem to shine in any role but it's just weird 'cause every time I've ever played skarner i've raped :O

gunblade+triforce op
r.Evo
Profile Joined August 2006
Germany14081 Posts
September 02 2011 06:34 GMT
#2129
On September 02 2011 14:56 Brees wrote:
^quicksilver sash

Ashe has been slain!

durp im a scorpion.


Actually. lol. You're right.

Fun fact: I never had a single of those champs build it before it was too late. 1-2 fights where it works is all you need. =D
"We don't make mistakes here, we call it happy little accidents." ~Bob Ross
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
September 02 2011 06:37 GMT
#2130
On September 02 2011 15:15 TieN.nS) wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 02 2011 15:09 Southlight wrote:
My Irelia shits on Skarner no matter how anti-carry you may attempt to build him.


[10:47:06 PM] nightseternal: irelia is a terrible hero
[10:52:35 PM] nightseternal: worst hero ever
[10:52:37 PM] nightseternal: why do ppl play her?

real hypocrite


In case it wasn't obvious Irelia's my go-to carry hero. I was being facetious and in a long-winded rage being frustrated at how a certain duo q partner insists on solo laning despite being horrendous at it.
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17303 Posts
September 02 2011 06:54 GMT
#2131
On September 02 2011 14:19 Ryuu314 wrote:
i dont see the problem with elo resets. baddies will be bad and not get higher elo regardless of how many times they reset their elo. it's just more money for Riot.

1.) It breaks the "we don't sell power" rule of Riot.
2.) It inflates Elo and does so in an uncontrolled fashion
3.) It muddles up the bronze-silver Elo range even more, which means you have a higher chance of having someone who belongs at a lower Elo in your game. It's not enjoyable to play with random people significantly below your skill-level -- it undermines the whole idea of Elo.
twitch.tv/cratonz
Odds
Profile Joined May 2008
Canada1188 Posts
September 02 2011 07:01 GMT
#2132
On September 02 2011 14:56 Brees wrote:
^quicksilver sash

Ashe has been slain!

durp im a scorpion.

yeah because QSS works real fucking well against permaslow
Odds.633, AM. Plat level currently. Would love more practice partners, add me, let's play!
zalz
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Netherlands3704 Posts
September 02 2011 07:07 GMT
#2133
On September 02 2011 15:29 Ryuu314 wrote:
I agree with the fact that skarner doesn't really seem to shine in any role but it's just weird 'cause every time I've ever played skarner i've raped :O

gunblade+triforce op


This man knows!

Gunblade + Triforce and scorpio starts raping faces everywhere.


Only problem Skarner has is that his build is pretty much too expensive. Once you do get those items though, it's raping time. The gunblade let's you connect your perma slow from up to 700 range. Combined with your ulti it pretty much means that if you can take the other guy, he's dead once he leaves the tower.

But Skarner is a pain to play atm. Feels too much that you need to rely on the enemy top champ to be weak or an easy matchup for Skarner. You can't really get away with playing him top if the other guy is doing his job right/is a proper top champ.
arnath
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1317 Posts
September 02 2011 07:07 GMT
#2134
Two issues with this theory:

1) What's stopping said anti-carry from just turning and killing you instead?

2) Even if this "anti anti-carry" idea works, where are you going to lane as Skarner? He'd get shit on top or mid and is useless as a support bottom.
r.Evo
Profile Joined August 2006
Germany14081 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-02 07:16:14
September 02 2011 07:16 GMT
#2135
On September 02 2011 16:07 arnath wrote:
Two issues with this theory:

1) What's stopping said anti-carry from just turning and killing you instead?

2) Even if this "anti anti-carry" idea works, where are you going to lane as Skarner? He'd get shit on top or mid and is useless as a support bottom.


Just re-thought the QSS with brain and all. 1.5s suppression. I dno, QSS would skip like half of that. I'm not sure if it's effective.

If said anti-carry turns and tries to kill you instead? You're still far more tanky than your carry which then gets free shots at the evil assassin and is save. Profit.

Lane? Top, exclusively. I don't feel as shit on when playing Skarner as most people here. o.O
"We don't make mistakes here, we call it happy little accidents." ~Bob Ross
TieN.nS)
Profile Joined August 2003
United States2131 Posts
September 02 2011 07:42 GMT
#2136
On September 02 2011 15:37 Southlight wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 02 2011 15:15 TieN.nS) wrote:
On September 02 2011 15:09 Southlight wrote:
My Irelia shits on Skarner no matter how anti-carry you may attempt to build him.


[10:47:06 PM] nightseternal: irelia is a terrible hero
[10:52:35 PM] nightseternal: worst hero ever
[10:52:37 PM] nightseternal: why do ppl play her?

real hypocrite


In case it wasn't obvious Irelia's my go-to carry hero. I was being facetious and in a long-winded rage being frustrated at how a certain duo q partner insists on solo laning despite being horrendous at it.


Quotes are funnier out of context~
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-02 08:08:33
September 02 2011 08:08 GMT
#2137
Just making sure :p

Edit:
Cuz I have a tendency to switching between serious mode and sarcastic mode and that doesn't translate well on the intarnetz.
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
rewtamus
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States327 Posts
September 02 2011 08:24 GMT
#2138
how about putting a limit on how many times u can do it? once per season sounds reasonable.
Seuss
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States10536 Posts
September 02 2011 08:28 GMT
#2139
The whole spiel about Skarner being an anti-anti-carry is neat, but he's by far not the first. It's basically exactly how Doublelift described playing Blitzcrank, except Blitzcrank:

  • Has better/safer initiation.
  • Is a part of some pretty nasty duos.
  • Doesn't need farm to be effective in an anti-anti-carry role.
  • Isn't defeated by QSS.


If my goal is to have someone to protect my carry from assassins, I'll pick Blitzcrank or Alistar over Skarner any day.

The fact that Skarner isn't a champion with a blatantly obvious item build doesn't help.
"I am not able to carry all this people alone, for they are too heavy for me." -Moses (Numbers 11:14)
Odds
Profile Joined May 2008
Canada1188 Posts
September 02 2011 08:30 GMT
#2140
Gunblade is awful on skarner.

STOP MAKING ME CRY WITH THESE BUILDS

I'll try to make a thread tonight
Odds.633, AM. Plat level currently. Would love more practice partners, add me, let's play!
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