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Dont-Panic
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Germany567 Posts
July 06 2011 15:26 GMT
#20001
On July 07 2011 00:21 locodoco wrote:
dropped 200 elo in the past few days
zz
annie and alistar iz hard~!


You have to stop playing with saintvicious. That kid is too bad. Only ~120 rating :-D
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
July 06 2011 15:27 GMT
#20002
On July 07 2011 00:21 Shikyo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2011 00:18 Two_DoWn wrote:
On July 07 2011 00:16 Brees wrote:
so warwick nerfs incoming apparently, they are ruining my best junglers one by one, first shaco now warwick. Expect udyr to be nerfed as well or the patch after then ill have no good junglers left cept like trundle. lol gg

They need to nerf q, buff his passive back up. Boom, fixed his lane, keeps jungle the same.

Udyr is a bit more tricky. Prolly have to nerf the shield, buff the passive lifesteal, buff phoenix as well since that is the tank build.

Ehh why would they nerf Udyr? He really isn't too good at all in comparison to many other champions. .

Because max turtle sololane udyr is just as tanky as ww, but does an ass ton of damage since his q hits like a billion with no ad. And he has a stun. Less sustain, but still really powerful. And Riot has a history of nerfing champs out of roles where they feel champs dont belong: eve jungle, soon to be lane ww, ect.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
NeoIllusions
Profile Blog Joined December 2002
United States37500 Posts
July 06 2011 15:28 GMT
#20003
The "current metagame" always seems so easy to break if people were willing to test shit out. zz
ModeratorFor the Glory that is TeamLiquid (-9 | 155) | Discord: NeoIllusions#1984
Brees
Profile Joined January 2010
Marshall Islands3404 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-06 15:33:39
July 06 2011 15:29 GMT
#20004
ive tried them all out with practice, there is zero chance of warwick keeping up with alistar in farm when he just walks up to your wave and pulverize/tramples it and forces you to last hit at tower. you will have to waste mana or lose cs

Cho does the same thing with rupture/scream combo.

malphite can just keep q'ing you and you will never q him ever if hes not full retard

the way to beat sustained laners has always been to just push their shit in
Brees on in
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
July 06 2011 15:30 GMT
#20005
Only you never play with me so I dont have someone to rely on and carry me when my testing fails.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
Mogwai
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States13274 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-06 15:33:32
July 06 2011 15:30 GMT
#20006
On July 07 2011 00:28 NeoIllusions wrote:
The "current metagame" always seems so easy to break if people were willing to test shit out. zz


that's because it is. it's the same way in any ever-changing game that isn't horribly unbalanced.


On July 07 2011 00:29 Brees wrote:
ive tried them all out with practice, there is zero chance of warwick keeping up with alistar in farm when he just walks up to your wave and pulverize/tramples it and forces you to last hit at tower. you will have to waste mana or lose cs

Cho does the same thing with rupture/scream combo.

malphite can just keep q'ing you and you will never q him ever if hes not full retard

I won't bother Qing Malphite, I'll just Q creeps to trade mana with him and we'll end up nowhere except him staying off the creepwave to avoid being the one eating my Qs. I sorta agree with the push him to the tower theory except that a smart team will gank you for it really early in my experience (on this note, Morde is pretty much the same as Cho and Ali in this respect).
mogwaismusings.wordpress.com
Brees
Profile Joined January 2010
Marshall Islands3404 Posts
July 06 2011 15:37 GMT
#20007
you can't 1 shot a wave until about level 7-9 and should have a ward by then and even if you dont those chars are pretty hard to gank.
Brees on in
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
July 06 2011 15:39 GMT
#20008
On July 07 2011 00:18 Two_DoWn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2011 00:16 Brees wrote:
so warwick nerfs incoming apparently, they are ruining my best junglers one by one, first shaco now warwick. Expect udyr to be nerfed as well or the patch after then ill have no good junglers left cept like trundle. lol gg

They need to nerf q, buff his passive back up. Boom, fixed his lane, keeps jungle the same.

Udyr is a bit more tricky. Prolly have to nerf the shield, buff the passive lifesteal, buff phoenix as well since that is the tank build.

IMO the % of damage to healing on Q should scale on rank. He doesn't need the 100% heal to stay full HP in the hungle, and it's retardedly efficient in lane.

Something like 40%/50%60%/70%/80% damage dealt as healing. Drastically cut the heal during laning while not hitting the lategame values too hard.
Moderator
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
July 06 2011 15:42 GMT
#20009
Only problem is that since they took down the passive sustain on his autos from his passive, he has been fairly reliant on his qs to maintain his high levels of health. Cutting the regen is a straight nerf to his jungle. Thats why they need to buff the passive back up, maybe even a bit higher than before. And that way he is manageable in lane, because to heal as efficiently he has to attack creeps more than once, which opens him up to harass.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
July 06 2011 15:50 GMT
#20010
On July 07 2011 00:42 Two_DoWn wrote:
Only problem is that since they took down the passive sustain on his autos from his passive, he has been fairly reliant on his qs to maintain his high levels of health. Cutting the regen is a straight nerf to his jungle. Thats why they need to buff the passive back up, maybe even a bit higher than before. And that way he is manageable in lane, because to heal as efficiently he has to attack creeps more than once, which opens him up to harass.

Oh I agree with that. I'm just hoping Riot identifies the problem as Q's stupidly efficient in-lane harass/sustain.

Of course, given their track record, they'll probably do something silly like nerfing the lategame % damage on Q and ruin both jungle and lanewick alike.
Moderator
NeoIllusions
Profile Blog Joined December 2002
United States37500 Posts
July 06 2011 15:53 GMT
#20011
On July 07 2011 00:50 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2011 00:42 Two_DoWn wrote:
Only problem is that since they took down the passive sustain on his autos from his passive, he has been fairly reliant on his qs to maintain his high levels of health. Cutting the regen is a straight nerf to his jungle. Thats why they need to buff the passive back up, maybe even a bit higher than before. And that way he is manageable in lane, because to heal as efficiently he has to attack creeps more than once, which opens him up to harass.

Oh I agree with that. I'm just hoping Riot identifies the problem as Q's stupidly efficient in-lane harass/sustain.

Of course, given their track record, they'll probably do something silly like nerfing the lategame % damage on Q and ruin both jungle and lanewick alike.


/thinks of Panth's W and E
ModeratorFor the Glory that is TeamLiquid (-9 | 155) | Discord: NeoIllusions#1984
MoonBear
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
July 06 2011 15:54 GMT
#20012
Riot hates anything that lets you sustain in lane. They consider it bad from a design perspective. It's why everything with a heal is currently on target for nerfs/remakes. Heals in their opinion should be a clutch singular move you use as a game-changing maneuver instead of something you can just spam.

In other words, abuse Jungler in lane as much as you can while you still can! Udyr/Noc solo top FOTM, calling it now. (Udyr Q first with AD Runes stacking Dorans is pretty beastly from what I've seen. Adding Turtle stance is nuts.)
ModeratorA dream. Do you have one that has cursed you like that? Or maybe... a wish?
cascades
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Singapore6122 Posts
July 06 2011 15:59 GMT
#20013
Man missed the 1000 page thing.
HS: cascades#1595 || LoL: stoppin
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
July 06 2011 16:03 GMT
#20014
Not a huge fan of noc solo top. He has sustain and harass, but I feel you lose a lot by not being able to make everyone paranoid of you when you ult. Although, it isnt like ult before level 11 is all that useful anyway, but still. Itd be like lane eve. Why bother.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
Haemonculus
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
United States6980 Posts
July 06 2011 16:46 GMT
#20015
On July 07 2011 00:54 MoonBear wrote:
In other words, abuse Jungler in lane as much as you can while you still can! Udyr/Noc solo top FOTM, calling it now. (Udyr Q first with AD Runes stacking Dorans is pretty beastly from what I've seen. Adding Turtle stance is nuts.)

Yah lane Udyr is crazy strong. I got tower-dived by a lvl 8 land udyr as caitlyn. He ate 12 tower shots in the process of killing me, and just sauntered away. Even hit a trap while chasing me in circles but bear = superspeed, turtle = LOLinvulnerable, and tiger = lol half ur hp.
I admire your commitment to being *very* oily
TL Blazeraid
Profile Joined January 2011
566 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-06 16:52:16
July 06 2011 16:51 GMT
#20016
On July 07 2011 00:54 MoonBear wrote:
Riot hates anything that lets you sustain in lane. They consider it bad from a design perspective. It's why everything with a heal is currently on target for nerfs/remakes. Heals in their opinion should be a clutch singular move you use as a game-changing maneuver instead of something you can just spam.


Yorick seems to be a step in the wrong direction in this regards, but I don't blame them; I can't really think of anything other than heal his third ghost could do either.
spinesheath
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Germany8679 Posts
July 06 2011 16:51 GMT
#20017
On July 07 2011 00:16 Brees wrote:
so warwick nerfs incoming apparently, they are ruining my best junglers one by one, first shaco now warwick. Expect udyr to be nerfed as well or the patch after then ill have no good junglers left cept like trundle. lol gg

Calling Lanemumu FOTM into nerf now.

On July 07 2011 00:54 MoonBear wrote:
Riot hates anything that lets you sustain in lane. They consider it bad from a design perspective. It's why everything with a heal is currently on target for nerfs/remakes. Heals in their opinion should be a clutch singular move you use as a game-changing maneuver instead of something you can just spam.

In other words, abuse Jungler in lane as much as you can while you still can! Udyr/Noc solo top FOTM, calling it now. (Udyr Q first with AD Runes stacking Dorans is pretty beastly from what I've seen. Adding Turtle stance is nuts.)

WHAT? Let's see, current champ releases...
Yorick: Lifesteal, spammable
Lee Sin: Lifesteal, spammable
Nocturne: Lifesteal, passive
Maokai: Heal, passive
Karma: Heal
Renekton: Lifesteal, spammable
Trundle: Heal, passive
Irelia: TWO Heals, passive and spammable
Swain: HP + Mana Heal, VERY spammable
Sona: Heal, spammable

The ONLY recent champ releases (looking at the last 19) that don't have insane sustainability due to one reason or another are LeBlanc, Cassiopeia and Vayne.
If you have a good reason to disagree with the above, please tell me. Thank you.
cascades
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Singapore6122 Posts
July 06 2011 16:53 GMT
#20018
On July 07 2011 00:30 Mogwai wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2011 00:28 NeoIllusions wrote:
The "current metagame" always seems so easy to break if people were willing to test shit out. zz


that's because it is. it's the same way in any ever-changing game that isn't horribly unbalanced.


Show nested quote +
On July 07 2011 00:29 Brees wrote:
ive tried them all out with practice, there is zero chance of warwick keeping up with alistar in farm when he just walks up to your wave and pulverize/tramples it and forces you to last hit at tower. you will have to waste mana or lose cs

Cho does the same thing with rupture/scream combo.

malphite can just keep q'ing you and you will never q him ever if hes not full retard

I won't bother Qing Malphite, I'll just Q creeps to trade mana with him and we'll end up nowhere except him staying off the creepwave to avoid being the one eating my Qs. I sorta agree with the push him to the tower theory except that a smart team will gank you for it really early in my experience (on this note, Morde is pretty much the same as Cho and Ali in this respect).


Can any of you smart folks tell me if akali beats laneww?
HS: cascades#1595 || LoL: stoppin
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-06 17:02:46
July 06 2011 16:57 GMT
#20019
On July 07 2011 01:51 spinesheath wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2011 00:16 Brees wrote:
so warwick nerfs incoming apparently, they are ruining my best junglers one by one, first shaco now warwick. Expect udyr to be nerfed as well or the patch after then ill have no good junglers left cept like trundle. lol gg

Calling Lanemumu FOTM into nerf now.

Show nested quote +
On July 07 2011 00:54 MoonBear wrote:
Riot hates anything that lets you sustain in lane. They consider it bad from a design perspective. It's why everything with a heal is currently on target for nerfs/remakes. Heals in their opinion should be a clutch singular move you use as a game-changing maneuver instead of something you can just spam.

In other words, abuse Jungler in lane as much as you can while you still can! Udyr/Noc solo top FOTM, calling it now. (Udyr Q first with AD Runes stacking Dorans is pretty beastly from what I've seen. Adding Turtle stance is nuts.)

WHAT? Let's see, current champ releases...
Yorick: Lifesteal, spammable
Lee Sin: Lifesteal, spammable
Nocturne: Lifesteal, passive
Maokai: Heal, passive
Karma: Heal
Renekton: Lifesteal, spammable
Trundle: Heal, passive
Irelia: TWO Heals, passive and spammable
Swain: HP + Mana Heal, VERY spammable
Sona: Heal, spammable

The ONLY recent champ releases (looking at the last 19) that don't have insane sustainability due to one reason or another are LeBlanc, Cassiopeia and Vayne.

Brand Orianna Jarvan Caitlyn Lux?

Rumble, technically, though in practice his post-Revolver sustain is retardedly good.
Moderator
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
July 06 2011 16:57 GMT
#20020
On July 07 2011 00:28 NeoIllusions wrote:
The "current metagame" always seems so easy to break if people were willing to test shit out. zz


A lot of it is due to lemming mentality (Tier lists etc.) and the fact that 99.99999% of players don't comprehend the game. We've gone over this in our skype chat though like a zillion times so it feels like flogging a dead horse to us :p
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
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