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Russo-Ukrainian War Thread - Page 394

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NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.

Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source.
Sent.
Profile Joined June 2012
Poland9331 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-03-01 18:41:56
March 01 2023 18:41 GMT
#7861
On March 02 2023 03:08 hitthat wrote:+ Show Spoiler +



I knew the guy is retarded, but he doesn't even try to hide it.
BTW Ardias, what do your fellow coutryboys mean by common "religious values", "historical cultural identity", "national identity"... and connect it with centuries-old russian Warsaw? Do I am suppose to believe that in head of the regular Styopa from Whereveryelsk we have anything in common? And these clowns are treated as serious jurnalists?
Because for now more I find out about Russians, less I respect them.

Western propaganda doesn't even need to work, your own talking apes from TV do all the work for them.


Thank God foreigners don't learn about Poland from watching our state tv clowns. If they did, their respect for us would plummet and they'd have a very hard time differentiating us from those "dum Ruskies".
You're now breathing manually
hitthat
Profile Joined January 2010
Poland2349 Posts
March 01 2023 18:46 GMT
#7862
On March 02 2023 03:41 Sent. wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 02 2023 03:08 hitthat wrote:+ Show Spoiler +

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bU31eLXzdnI&lc=UgySJ68Da0_8COPpIg14AaABAg.9migaji9Oqg9mip0NkvNX7

I knew the guy is retarded, but he doesn't even try to hide it.
BTW Ardias, what do your fellow coutryboys mean by common "religious values", "historical cultural identity", "national identity"... and connect it with centuries-old russian Warsaw? Do I am suppose to believe that in head of the regular Styopa from Whereveryelsk we have anything in common? And these clowns are treated as serious jurnalists?
Because for now more I find out about Russians, less I respect them.

Western propaganda doesn't even need to work, your own talking apes from TV do all the work for them.


Thank God foreigners don't learn about Poland from watching our state tv clowns. If they did, their respect for us would plummet and they'd have a very hard time differentiating us from those "dum Ruskies".


Nah, everyone knows our "worth"...
Shameless BroodWar separatistic, elitist, fanaticaly devoted puritan fanboy.
ZeroByte13
Profile Joined March 2022
799 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-03-01 20:57:12
March 01 2023 20:55 GMT
#7863
If you judge all Russians - not just warmongering ones - by Solovyev example then he achieved success at least partially.
They want to create a rift that will be very hard to bridge.

"you see, they hate us all unconditionally so we never had a choice, and you don't have any choice now, they will never be your friends, so you might as well join our efforts to screw them" - is a useful message to spread in this case.
Ardias
Profile Joined January 2014
Russian Federation618 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-03-01 22:05:35
March 01 2023 21:50 GMT
#7864
On March 02 2023 03:08 hitthat wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bU31eLXzdnI&lc=UgySJ68Da0_8COPpIg14AaABAg.9migaji9Oqg9mip0NkvNX7

I knew the guy is retarded, but he doesn't even try to hide it.
BTW Ardias, what do your fellow coutryboys mean by common "religious values", "historical cultural identity", "national identity"... and connect it with centuries-old russian Warsaw? Do I am suppose to believe that in head of the regular Styopa from Whereveryelsk we have anything in common? And these clowns are treated as serious jurnalists?
Because for now more I find out about Russians, less I respect them.

Western propaganda doesn't even need to work, your own talking apes from TV do all the work for them.

ZeroByte is correct that you shouldn't put all Russians in a single line. But answering your question - I didn't make a survey, but in my (offline) surrounding very few people bother with Solovyev or state channels at all (which are mostly aimed at older population still watching regular TV), so they don't base their views (whichever they have) on it.
Not sure if it could be considered common or not, but quite a few Russians consider Polish one of the most nationalist people in Europe, though to be fair, assessment is mostly based on my online communication circle (I rarely discuss politics with friends and relatives nowadays since it regularly stirs up very heated arguments between different people)/

Also the last two sentences from your post I regularly see on different Russian forums in regards to the Europe/US and their people.
Mess with the best or die like the rest.
hitthat
Profile Joined January 2010
Poland2349 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-03-01 22:12:24
March 01 2023 22:07 GMT
#7865
On March 02 2023 06:50 Ardias wrote:
Also the last two sentences from your post I regularly see on different Russian forums in regards to the Europe/US and their people.


Strange. I only read pikabu from time to time and never post there. Looks like not only my thoughts.

On March 02 2023 06:50 Ardias wrote:
Not sure if it could be considered common or not, but quite a few Russians consider Polish one of the most nationalist people in Europe


Probably well founded belief, unless they claim we realy want to annex Lviv or something. In that case you may consider them bullshitters.
Shameless BroodWar separatistic, elitist, fanaticaly devoted puritan fanboy.
maybenexttime
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
Poland5866 Posts
March 01 2023 22:32 GMT
#7866
It's remarkable how many Russians don't bother with the state TV but recite the same talking points verbatim. ;-)
Ardias
Profile Joined January 2014
Russian Federation618 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-03-02 07:12:07
March 02 2023 02:55 GMT
#7867
On March 02 2023 07:07 hitthat wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 02 2023 06:50 Ardias wrote:
Also the last two sentences from your post I regularly see on different Russian forums in regards to the Europe/US and their people.


Strange. I only read pikabu from time to time and never post there. Looks like not only my thoughts.

I meant that those Russians say that they are losing respect to the Western people and becoming anti-West due to the claims made by Western public personas. Sorry if I phrased this wrong initially.
Mess with the best or die like the rest.
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
March 02 2023 02:57 GMT
#7868
--- Nuked ---
Sermokala
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States14210 Posts
March 02 2023 05:30 GMT
#7869
On March 02 2023 07:32 maybenexttime wrote:
It's remarkable how many Russians don't bother with the state TV but recite the same talking points verbatim. ;-)

You have to understand that its entirely legitimate that they don't watch state tv at all. Its just that those talking points filter down into the tiktok's the telegram channels, the youtube channels. All those creators that they see content from are watching state TV and are just retransmitting the state tv talking points for their audience.
A wise man will say that he knows nothing. We're gona party like its 2752 Hail Dark Brandon
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
March 02 2023 13:44 GMT
#7870
Ukraine is claiming that Russia has lost over 100 Tanks in a nearly 3 week long battle at Vuhledar.

Ukraine is claiming that Russia has lost at least 130 tanks and armoured personnel carriers in a three-week battle near the southern Ukrainian town of Vuhledar.

This footage was released last week showing a Russian tank being targeted in the area.

The claims have not been independently verified. In the meantime, what is clear is that Russian shelling has left a trail of destruction in the town.


Source
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Deleted User 173346
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
16169 Posts
March 02 2023 14:53 GMT
#7871
--- Nuked ---
maybenexttime
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
Poland5866 Posts
March 02 2023 17:08 GMT
#7872
On March 02 2023 14:30 Sermokala wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 02 2023 07:32 maybenexttime wrote:
It's remarkable how many Russians don't bother with the state TV but recite the same talking points verbatim. ;-)

You have to understand that its entirely legitimate that they don't watch state tv at all. Its just that those talking points filter down into the tiktok's the telegram channels, the youtube channels. All those creators that they see content from are watching state TV and are just retransmitting the state tv talking points for their audience.

I know. I just find it amusing that so many of them wear it like a badge of honor and are convinced that they're unaffected by Russian propaganda while they're thoroughly brainwashed. ;-)
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
March 02 2023 22:11 GMT
#7873
New aid package to be announced tomorrow.



Hometown papers have yet to report this, only Reuters apparently. No idea if there will be a FBI press conference to ya announce such an event.

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Evotroid
Profile Joined October 2011
Hungary176 Posts
March 02 2023 22:42 GMT
#7874
On March 03 2023 02:08 maybenexttime wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 02 2023 14:30 Sermokala wrote:
On March 02 2023 07:32 maybenexttime wrote:
It's remarkable how many Russians don't bother with the state TV but recite the same talking points verbatim. ;-)

You have to understand that its entirely legitimate that they don't watch state tv at all. Its just that those talking points filter down into the tiktok's the telegram channels, the youtube channels. All those creators that they see content from are watching state TV and are just retransmitting the state tv talking points for their audience.

I know. I just find it amusing that so many of them wear it like a badge of honor and are convinced that they're unaffected by Russian propaganda while they're thoroughly brainwashed. ;-)


I think its basically the political equivalent of "I can't be racist, I have a black friend".
I got nothing.
Ardias
Profile Joined January 2014
Russian Federation618 Posts
March 03 2023 09:21 GMT
#7875
Video of Ukraine forces training on Challengers

4:05 - "Most of them haven't seen a tank".
I guess they don't send a lot of previously trained crews on Challys, wonder how it would be with other types.
Mess with the best or die like the rest.
pmp10
Profile Joined April 2012
3399 Posts
March 03 2023 09:42 GMT
#7876
Latest ISW accesment has one interesting take.
German Chancellor Olaf Scholz stated on March 2 that Germany is negotiating with allies about providing security guarantees to Ukraine but provided no further details on these proposed guarantees.[...] Scholz’s statements are consistent with reports of a proposed Ukraine-NATO defense pact that would provide enough arms to Ukraine to force Russia to the negotiation table, but would not offer Article V protection or obligate NATO states to deploy forces to Ukraine. ISW has recently assessed that such an agreement appears to reflect a desire to pressure Ukraine to accept a negotiated settlement on unfavorable terms, especially as Russian President Vladimir Putin is currently unlikely to compromise on his maximalist goals of demilitarization and de facto regime change in Ukraine.[22]

The idea of arming Ukraine instead of providing guarantees is being mentioned more often by the west lately.
Amui
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Canada10567 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-03-03 10:27:30
March 03 2023 10:21 GMT
#7877
On March 03 2023 18:21 Ardias wrote:
Video of Ukraine forces training on Challengers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5cu3N0y7Sf8
4:05 - "Most of them haven't seen a tank".
I guess they don't send a lot of previously trained crews on Challys, wonder how it would be with other types.

As far as experience goes, I think only the commander benefits hugely. The loader position doesn't exist in Russian tanks (and is relatively simple), the western tanks have significantly better optics, and the computers do a lot of the aiming so the gunner position is easier.

The drivers can likely get more miles in a week of training between simulator and testing grounds than they would during the rest of the war. With the fully automatic transmissions, and fully stabilized guns, as long as the driver doesn't do anything stupid they should be fine.

It's interesting that they mention weight/acceleration though. Only the Challenger 2 is notably more sluggish than the Russian tanks. The M1 and Leopard 2 might be heavier, but they have larger engines for a comparable power/weight.
Porouscloud - NA LoL
Hvvacha
Profile Joined April 2018
82 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-03-03 11:19:54
March 03 2023 10:54 GMT
#7878
On March 03 2023 19:21 Amui wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 03 2023 18:21 Ardias wrote:
Video of Ukraine forces training on Challengers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5cu3N0y7Sf8
4:05 - "Most of them haven't seen a tank".
I guess they don't send a lot of previously trained crews on Challys, wonder how it would be with other types.

As far as experience goes, I think only the commander benefits hugely. The loader position doesn't exist in Russian tanks (and is relatively simple), the western tanks have significantly better optics, and the computers do a lot of the aiming so the gunner position is easier.

The drivers can likely get more miles in a week of training between simulator and testing grounds than they would during the rest of the war. With the fully automatic transmissions, and fully stabilized guns, as long as the driver doesn't do anything stupid they should be fine.

It's interesting that they mention weight/acceleration though. Only the Challenger 2 is notably more sluggish than the Russian tanks. The M1 and Leopard 2 might be heavier, but they have larger engines for a comparable power/weight.


Without air superiority you can't seriosuly expect western tanks to make any strategic difference, latest Ramstein promised 74 main battle tanks and Ukraine already lost 78 in 2023, in addition to twice the amount of promised howitzers and 3x of AFVs. [image loading]

User was warned for this post
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22607 Posts
March 03 2023 11:04 GMT
#7879
It also makes sense for these to be new tank crews. The existing tank crews are experienced with certain types already and so long as Ukraine has those types to put them in your better of training new crews for new tanks rather then training old crew for new tanks and new crew for old tanks all at the same time.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
Artesimo
Profile Joined February 2015
Germany627 Posts
March 03 2023 11:08 GMT
#7880
On March 03 2023 18:42 pmp10 wrote:
Latest ISW accesment has one interesting take.
Show nested quote +
German Chancellor Olaf Scholz stated on March 2 that Germany is negotiating with allies about providing security guarantees to Ukraine but provided no further details on these proposed guarantees.[...] Scholz’s statements are consistent with reports of a proposed Ukraine-NATO defense pact that would provide enough arms to Ukraine to force Russia to the negotiation table, but would not offer Article V protection or obligate NATO states to deploy forces to Ukraine. ISW has recently assessed that such an agreement appears to reflect a desire to pressure Ukraine to accept a negotiated settlement on unfavorable terms, especially as Russian President Vladimir Putin is currently unlikely to compromise on his maximalist goals of demilitarization and de facto regime change in Ukraine.[22]

The idea of arming Ukraine instead of providing guarantees is being mentioned more often by the west lately.

That is probably the only realistic solution in the near future since nobody is willing to go to war with russia over ukraine. Just looking at how difficult the pretty safe Nato membership of sweden (and by proxy finland) are, or how long and difficult the process for EU membership are even without political motivated resistance.

Both Nato and EU membership for ukraine is probably only realistic after it got so armed up that nobody thinks russia can invade them, and that status remaining in place for long enough to make everyone at ease. And even then you probably still have to worry about some separatist movements 'coincidentally' springing up all of a sudden and jeopardizing the process.
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