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I wasn't aware they broadcasted Thomas the Tank engine outside of Britain, I wasn't even aware that it is actually popular ouside of Britain. I have fond memories of the trains and carriages trying to detrack themselves and generally being utter jerks to one another. A successful export I guess you can say? I just watched the video in order to gain some understanding and at first I thought it was a parody of a crazy ranting white supremacist who sees attempts to promote "political correctness" in everything, except it wasn't a parody, it was the real thing. Though to be fair she did sound a bit confused, but since she is the host I guess she decides what to say.
Still, I don't really understand. Even if the leadership of the NRA is filled with racists, this makes no sense, unless the NRA is actively trying to fill their membership with white supremacists at the expense of everyone else, or they simply don't care about membership and have entirely another agenda.
There's also no real reason to add kkk white hoods to the trains and tracks on fire either. Probably to say that Thomas the Tank engine isn't racist, therefore, here's a picture of them as the KKK? I don't understand white supremacist logic. Perhaps the usual suspects who says that everything that looks like a racist dog whistle actually isn't, can explain this one away?
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Since there seems to be confusion with the Thomas the Tank Engine debacle, I will try to explain it.
According to the actual clip, the hostess is confused/upset by the idea that objects like trains can have an ethnicity or race. She makes the conclusion that different types of trains like girl trains and Chinese/Kenyan trains are superfluous because they’re just trains. Presumably, she’s arguing you would need to be a person to have an ethnicity. Following from this point, she views it as ridiculous that attempts are seemingly made to add diversity to the show because you can’t make trains more diverse. She then posits whether this is being done because the train characters are “too white, even though their faces are gray”, and uses the waaaaaaay over-the-top KKK picture to make a joke saying “oh, yeah I guess they are too white”.
Hope that clears it up.
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Being one of the dreaded SJWs, I’ve seen a fair number of racism memes. Attempting to apply logic or rational thought to them is not the route to go. They are art, meant to evoke the emotion of outrage and make people click on them. Their goal is to resemble a provocative car crash with a vague political message that people will click on. They are also built to confuse because the people making them are normally huge idiots.
On September 14 2018 02:50 Ryzel wrote:
Since there seems to be confusion with the Thomas the Tank Engine debacle, I will try to explain it.
According to the actual clip, the hostess is confused/upset by the idea that objects like trains can have an ethnicity or race. She makes the conclusion that different types of trains like girl trains and Chinese/Kenyan trains are superfluous because they’re just trains. Presumably, she’s arguing you would need to be a person to have an ethnicity. Following from this point, she views it as ridiculous that attempts are seemingly made to add diversity to the show because you can’t make trains more diverse. She then posits whether this is being done because the train characters are “too white, even though their faces are gray”, and uses the waaaaaaay over-the-top KKK picture to make a joke saying “oh, yeah I guess they are too white”.
Hope that clears it up.
But what does that have to do with rifles?
Seriously though, it is a show about talking trains. Once the trains can talk and have faces, them having nationality and culture isn’t really that big of a leap. The leap is that they are literally steam powered monsters with human faces(finds robo-cop Thomas the Train pic).
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On September 14 2018 02:50 Ryzel wrote:
Since there seems to be confusion with the Thomas the Tank Engine debacle, I will try to explain it.
According to the actual clip, the hostess is confused/upset by the idea that objects like trains can have an ethnicity or race. She makes the conclusion that different types of trains like girl trains and Chinese/Kenyan trains are superfluous because they’re just trains. Presumably, she’s arguing you would need to be a person to have an ethnicity. Following from this point, she views it as ridiculous that attempts are seemingly made to add diversity to the show because you can’t make trains more diverse. She then posits whether this is being done because the train characters are “too white, even though their faces are gray”, and uses the waaaaaaay over-the-top KKK picture to make a joke saying “oh, yeah I guess they are too white”.
Hope that clears it up.
No, I'm still dumbfounded by the very idea that this is something someone would waste their time on: A children's show being too diverse, and then attempt to prove it by putting kkk hoods on the characters.. This is not a reasonable line of thinking by any stretch, even if you are super racist.
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I can’t comment on why a show presumably about advocating gun rights would talk about this, or why she would think a human-like being shouldn’t contain human-like aspects of identity.
Although this does raise an interesting question, where does one draw the line to include ethnic/racial aspects of identity on anthropomorhized objects/creatures? Does any form of speech make it fair game, or do they also need to have a face? Or is it simply the moment they become relatable as a human-like character, whenever that is?
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On September 14 2018 03:03 Ryzel wrote:
I can’t comment on why a show presumably about advocating gun rights would talk about this, or why she would think a human-like being shouldn’t contain human-like aspects of identity.
Although this does raise an interesting question, where does one draw the line to include ethnic/racial aspects of identity on anthropomorhized objects/creatures? Does any form of speech make it fair game, or do they also need to have a face?
Is the question interesting? Is it really? Does it matter at all of if there is a line or not? Was there ever a line or did people create it because they wanted to get mad about something on the internet to make money?
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So change the same shit to a more grown up stupid fantasy series?
Netflix just announced that they want to make siri "non white" in their witcher series and the fans are outraged (which is kinda understandable because it does not make any sense and you would have to change the whole "main" kingdom for it to do so).
But naturally the ugliest of right wing assholes show up to be outraged and all nuance is lost... Ugh...
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The explanations make no sense. It's pretty obvious why an entertainment company would try to introduce new characters if they are trying to expand to new markets. I've always assumed all the trains were English except for the Scottish ones anyways. She clearly never watched Thomas the Tank engine before.
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On September 14 2018 03:11 Velr wrote:
So change the same shit to a more grown up stupid fantasy series?
Netflix just announced that they want to make siri "non white" in their witcher series and the fans are outraged (which is kinda understandable because it does not make any sense and you would have to change the whole "main" kingdom for it to do so).
But naturally the ugliest of right wing assholes show up to be outraged and all nuance is lost... Ugh...
First off it's "Ciri" (Pedantic, I know, but it's important...well, not really).
Secondly I would take it with a grain of salt until we hear something confirmed. The ad for Ciri's actor was not published by any reputable source, and the show runners have not confirmed or deconfirmed anything.
That said I'm right there with the rabid fanbase if they actually make Ciri anything other than white. Not only because of the setting (although that is a good enough reason on its own) but because of the entire lore surrounding here making it pretty much impossible for her to have any kind of color. They could literally make any other character in the show non-white, except for Geralt and Ciri, and it could be explained away somehow and possibly make it work. But for it to work on any of those two they would literally have to rewrite their entire backstories.
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The rumor mill is buzzing with regards to a letter received by Feinstein recently. While no one is sure about many of the details, the reporting on it from the New Republic and the Intercept suggests the letter pertains to a possible sexual assault committed by Kavanaugh during his youth. The woman involved has also picked up lawyer Debra Katz, a noted #MeToo victim attorney, and Feinstein referred the matter to the FBI.
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On September 14 2018 03:09 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2018 03:03 Ryzel wrote:
I can’t comment on why a show presumably about advocating gun rights would talk about this, or why she would think a human-like being shouldn’t contain human-like aspects of identity.
Although this does raise an interesting question, where does one draw the line to include ethnic/racial aspects of identity on anthropomorhized objects/creatures? Does any form of speech make it fair game, or do they also need to have a face? Is the question interesting? Is it really? Does it matter at all of if there is a line or not? Was there ever a line or did people create it because they wanted to get mad about something on the internet to make money?
*shrug* I haven’t seen any uproars about the droids in Star Wars, or even alien races, not having diverse cultures despite being clearly human-like. Clearly there’s an aspect to Thomas and the tank engines that isn’t shared by those beings (or maybe I haven’t been looking hard enough). And to be fair, getting mad about things on the internet to make money is a prolific practice used in politics by people of all viewpoints. I’d imagine whether or not you’re annoyed by someone like that depends on whether you agree or disagree with them.
FWIW, I agree that what she did is absolutely ridiculous. As in, deserves to be ridiculed.
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The whole Ciri thing was equally silly because she is reality traveling sword princess power by magic blood from a fantasy world that is vaguely set is a part of fake Poland. If they case a girl that is less that white as the driven snow, it would be just fine. I don’t think they are going to case the girl who played Shuri in black panther just because it would be fun(It would be fun though, she is a good actress).
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On September 14 2018 03:24 Ryzel wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2018 03:09 Plansix wrote:On September 14 2018 03:03 Ryzel wrote:
I can’t comment on why a show presumably about advocating gun rights would talk about this, or why she would think a human-like being shouldn’t contain human-like aspects of identity.
Although this does raise an interesting question, where does one draw the line to include ethnic/racial aspects of identity on anthropomorhized objects/creatures? Does any form of speech make it fair game, or do they also need to have a face? Is the question interesting? Is it really? Does it matter at all of if there is a line or not? Was there ever a line or did people create it because they wanted to get mad about something on the internet to make money? *shrug* I haven’t seen any uproars about the droids in Star Wars, or even alien races, not having diverse cultures despite being clearly human-like. Clearly there’s an aspect to Thomas and the tank engines that isn’t shared by those beings (or maybe I haven’t been looking hard enough). And to be fair, getting mad about things on the internet to make money is a prolific practice used in politics by people of all viewpoints. I’d imagine whether or not you’re annoyed by someone like that depends on whether you agree or disagree with them. FWIW, I agree that what she did is absolutely ridiculous. As in, deserves to be ridiculed.
But there was also no uproar when Thomas and his friends were not diverse. The uproar started when they suddenly started being diverse, when the creators added new characters.
There is only one side roaring here, it seems. And I would ridicule anyone who would actually have complained about the trains not being diverse enough, as I do with everyone bitching about them being too diverse.
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On September 14 2018 03:22 farvacola wrote:
The rumor mill is buzzing with regards to a letter received by Feinstein recently. While no one is sure about many of the details, the reporting on it from the New Republic and the Intercept suggests the letter pertains to a possible sexual assault committed by Kavanaugh during his youth. The woman involved has also picked up lawyer Debra Katz, a noted #MeToo victim attorney, and Feinstein referred the matter to the FBI.
Since when do affairs have the FBI involved. An assualt even would not even get the FBI I don't think.
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Spain17989 Posts
On September 14 2018 03:11 Velr wrote:
So change the same shit to a more grown up stupid fantasy series?
Netflix just announced that they want to make siri "non white" in their witcher series and the fans are outraged (which is kinda understandable because it does not make any sense and you would have to change the whole "main" kingdom for it to do so).
But naturally the ugliest of right wing assholes show up to be outraged and all nuance is lost... Ugh...
Would you though? There were black guys in the Witcher games. And even if there weren't, who cares? Like... who the fuck cares that the Witcher is no longer "fantasy poland (or northern europe)" but is instead "fantasy world"? The books describe her as being pale with green eyes, and the games followed suit, so it is out-ra-geous that she might not be portrayed that way in a tv series. Ciri does not derive her identity from her skin color, but rather from the fact that she's a WITCHER (and a princess).
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On September 14 2018 03:22 farvacola wrote:
The rumor mill is buzzing with regards to a letter received by Feinstein recently. While no one is sure about many of the details, the reporting on it from the New Republic and the Intercept suggests the letter pertains to a possible sexual assault committed by Kavanaugh during his youth. The woman involved has also picked up lawyer Debra Katz, a noted #MeToo victim attorney, and Feinstein referred the matter to the FBI.
Even if this is true nothing will come of it. Look at the way football *cough Big 10* fans went to the mat for their coaches/administrations. One of the most common defenses was "she wouldn't have waited this long to come out if it was true." That, coupled with "the timing is too convenient/this is a political ploy" arguments, will ensure that the truth is irrelevant. Nor will it noticeably slow things down (tho I did see the report that his vote had been delayed... wonder if it's related to this).
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Spain17989 Posts
On September 14 2018 03:24 Ryzel wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2018 03:09 Plansix wrote:On September 14 2018 03:03 Ryzel wrote:
I can’t comment on why a show presumably about advocating gun rights would talk about this, or why she would think a human-like being shouldn’t contain human-like aspects of identity.
Although this does raise an interesting question, where does one draw the line to include ethnic/racial aspects of identity on anthropomorhized objects/creatures? Does any form of speech make it fair game, or do they also need to have a face? Is the question interesting? Is it really? Does it matter at all of if there is a line or not? Was there ever a line or did people create it because they wanted to get mad about something on the internet to make money? *shrug* I haven’t seen any uproars about the droids in Star Wars, or even alien races, not having diverse cultures despite being clearly human-like. Clearly there’s an aspect to Thomas and the tank engines that isn’t shared by those beings (or maybe I haven’t been looking hard enough). And to be fair, getting mad about things on the internet to make money is a prolific practice used in politics by people of all viewpoints. I’d imagine whether or not you’re annoyed by someone like that depends on whether you agree or disagree with them. FWIW, I agree that what she did is absolutely ridiculous. As in, deserves to be ridiculed.
Actually, L3 got quite a lot of flak.
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On September 14 2018 03:25 Plansix wrote:
The whole Ciri thing was equally silly because she is reality traveling sword princess power by magic blood from a fantasy world that is vaguely set is a part of fake Poland. If they case a girl that is less that white as the driven snow, it would be just fine. I don’t think they are going to case the girl who played Shuri in black panther just because it would be fun(It would be fun though, she is a good actress).
I don't think so either. But the ad (Which we have no idea is real) asked for "Black, Asian, or Minority Ethnic.", which could technically include the girl from Black Panther.
I think hand waving it away as "it's just fantasy anyways" is short sighted, because even fantasy needs to be immersive. In the case of the Witcher, it's very dark, gritty, and based heavily on the European medieval period. Not a lot of "BAME" princesses around in those days, and mix in elven blood (Who in all known fiction are snow white) and it makes even less sense to the average viewer, and the immersion is broken.
Like I said, there are plenty of characters in the series which could easily be made non white no problem (And several in the books wasn't). But Witchers and princesses with elven blood? Maybe not such a good idea. Even in fantasy, some things have to make some sort of internal sense.
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