EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 634
| Forum Index > General Forum |
Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets. Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source. If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread | ||
|
farvacola
United States18819 Posts
| ||
|
DarkPlasmaBall
United States43805 Posts
On August 22 2018 23:00 Biff The Understudy wrote: Oh i meant in the alternative between Trump and Pence. Of course I would also rather not have my eyes bleeding every time I open the news.. But between a sleazy, slightly deranged conman and a religious fanatic, I would chose the first one every day of the week and twice on sunday. I prefer the amount of damage I think Trump can do to the amount of damage I think Pence can do, too. That being said, I'd also like criminals to be held accountable for their actions and not be given free passes. I want the system to work too (and for Congressional Republicans to do the right thing, for once), and that may end up being a greater good in the long run, to make future Trump-like candidates think twice before running for president. I don't know, honestly. That being said, there's pretty much 0% chance that Trump is actually removed from the presidency. | ||
|
Acrofales
Spain17852 Posts
On August 22 2018 23:00 Biff The Understudy wrote: Oh i meant in the alternative between Trump and Pence. Of course I would also rather not have my eyes bleeding every time I open the news.. But between a sleazy, slightly deranged conman and a religious fanatic, I would chose the first one every day of the week and twice on sunday. I dunno. I think that is a rather serious simplification. I think there is a failure in the political system that allows the VP to finish the term after a president is impeached. Even though people voted for the whole ticket, there is no doubt that the VP's role on the ballot is to make the P look good, and he is never actually expected to do much of anything. It's quite possible that people who don't support Pence supported Trump: they don't actually represent the same group of people at all. Oppose that to something like Obama and Biden, or even Bush and Cheney: they may not be the same people or personality, but they do represent the same political flavor (as did Hillary and Kaine). But there is no reason that needs to be the case, and with Trump and Pence that is clearly not the case: one is a demagogue and the other is a religious fundamentalist. That represents a problem, because you cannot really expect Pence to continue Trump's politics but without being an actual criminal, which is what you'd want from a system in which the VP continues to serve out the term until the next scheduled elections. But given that the system isn't gonna change, I still think you'd still want to "suck up" 1-2 years of Pence in favor of a system that *chooses* to leave a known criminal in charge just to avoid a lunatic. Weakening your institutions is not something you should want to do. | ||
|
FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Netherlands30548 Posts
Lanny Davis, the attorney representing President Donald Trump’s former longtime personal lawyer Michael Cohen, said Wednesday that Cohen knew of efforts by Trump to conspire with Russia to rig the 2016 presidential election. Davis had previously teased that Cohen had “knowledge on certain subjects that should be of interest to the special counsel,” but he came right out and suggested a smoking gun on MSNBC’s “Morning Joe” on Wednesday morning. Cohen pleaded guilty in federal court on Tuesday to multiple charges, including campaign finance violations that he said he committed on the direction of Trump. While discussing the possible implications for Trump, Davis went on to give some details about information he said Cohen had that relate to the special counsel’s investigation into Russian election interference. Specifically, he said Cohen was willing to provide the special counsel Robert Mueller with evidence that Trump worked with Russia to sway the election. Do you think Cohen will hurt GOP as a whole given that he was the deputy finance chair of the Republican National committee? | ||
|
Plansix
United States60190 Posts
I don’t know if it will work. Going on TV and overtly asking for a cooperation agreement with the Special Counsel is the exact opposite of what a prosecutor wants. But this entire thing is so abnormal that the normal rules may not apply any more. | ||
|
Gorsameth
Netherlands21373 Posts
Cohen is publicly threatening to throw Trump under the bus hoping to force his hand to give a pardon to keep Cohen quiet, rather then wait and hope he gets one. | ||
|
Mohdoo
United States15401 Posts
On August 22 2018 23:23 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote: Cohen is going to give testimony of election rigging with Russia according to his lawyer. Gonna be some interesting tweet days. As of now Trump is praising Manafort for 'not breaking' like Cohen and he feels really bad for poor Paul and his family. His tweets actually read like a mob boss lol Do you think Cohen will hurt GOP as a whole given that he was the deputy finance chair of the Republican National committee? I'm curious if there are pieces Mueller needs from Manafort or if Cohen is himself a silver bullet. There are likely things Manafort was independently responsible for, such as making connections, but it seems like Cohen was likely involved. Also curious if Cohen's story regarding Prague ends up changing. That was a big part of the dossier. If he says he actually was in Prague for all the dossier reasons, it would.be harder for people to assume everything else is fake. | ||
|
Plansix
United States60190 Posts
| ||
|
farvacola
United States18819 Posts
| ||
|
Doodsmack
United States7224 Posts
On August 22 2018 23:23 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote: Cohen is going to give testimony of election rigging with Russia according to his lawyer. Gonna be some interesting tweet days. As of now Trump is praising Manafort for 'not breaking' like Cohen and he feels really bad for poor Paul and his family. His tweets actually read like a mob boss lol Do you think Cohen will hurt GOP as a whole given that he was the deputy finance chair of the Republican National committee? This is crazy right here. I sure hope he has evidence beyond his own word. | ||
|
IyMoon
United States1249 Posts
On August 23 2018 00:18 Doodsmack wrote: This is crazy right here. I sure hope he has evidence beyond his own word. Didn't he tape a bunch of his convos with trump? He strikes me as the guy to keep records of the dumb shit he does Kinda like the guy from casino | ||
|
Plansix
United States60190 Posts
| ||
|
Biff The Understudy
France7811 Posts
On August 22 2018 23:36 Gorsameth wrote: 7d chess. Cohen is publicly threatening to throw Trump under the bus hoping to force his hand to give a pardon to keep Cohen quiet, rather then wait and hope he gets one. Trump cannot pardon either Manafort or Cohen. That would be absolutely suicidal. Meanwhile a good summary of what going on in the conservative post factual bubble: Trump fans chanting « lock her up » the day his personal lawyer and campaign managers get jail time. What a time to be alive... | ||
|
brian
United States9610 Posts
On August 23 2018 01:11 Biff The Understudy wrote: Trump cannot pardon either Manafort or Cohen. That would be absolutely suicidal. Meanwhile a good summary of what going on in the conservative post factual bubble: Trump fans chanting « lock her up » the day his personal lawyer and campaign managers get jail time. What a time to be alive... it’s all that liberal hysteria i’ve been hearing about. | ||
|
Biff The Understudy
France7811 Posts
On August 23 2018 01:12 brian wrote: it’s all that liberal hysteria i’ve been hearing about. Unfortunately the only time in relatively recent memory where such a large chunk of people in the West decided that facts or truth didn’t matter anymore at all were the 1930s. | ||
|
Mohdoo
United States15401 Posts
On August 23 2018 00:00 farvacola wrote: They prolly wanted Flynn to marinate in Cohen's plea/Manafort's conviction before finalizing their sentencing recommendation. "Cohen is fully cooperating. You sure there's nothing else you want to share?" is a conversation I imagine took place, which resulted in Flynn needing to replace his underwear ~6 times. Cohen is just absolutely massive. The fact that he broke is so, so big. He can likely bring down Manafort himself. Cohen testifying against Manafort is likely not necessary at this point, but could be used as yet another way to get. Edit: I also think it is very likely that given what we know about Trump's technical prowess, it is very likely there are a lot of things Cohen did as an extension of Trump. This likely includes things like working directly with Manafort/Pence. I have a hard time believing there is much that Cohen was kept away from. I think we can approximate Cohen to Trump himself in many ways. At least regarding knowledge/understanding of their various schemes. | ||
|
brian
United States9610 Posts
| ||
|
Gorsameth
Netherlands21373 Posts
On August 23 2018 03:03 brian wrote: Is that so unusual? I imagine most of people spilling the beans about major cases spend a long time in interviewsI was listening to Pod Save America, so take this for whatever it’s worth to you, but they said reports were out that McGahn sat with Mueller for over thirty hours. | ||
|
Mohdoo
United States15401 Posts
On August 23 2018 03:10 Gorsameth wrote: Is that so unusual? I imagine most of people spilling the beans about major cases spend a long time in interviews All depends what you consider usual at this point. Extremely high level lawyers defecting from a sitting president is generally considered unusual. Or at least prior to 2016. We're in a weird timeline, so no, this is just another day. | ||
|
Gorsameth
Netherlands21373 Posts
On August 23 2018 03:14 Mohdoo wrote: All depends what you consider usual at this point. Extremely high level lawyers defecting from a sitting president is generally considered unusual. Or at least prior to 2016. We're in a weird timeline, so no, this is just another day. McGahn or Cohen defecting is big/weird. But a person in their position spending 30h in interviews with the prosecutor once they flip doesn't sound that improbable to me. | ||
| ||
