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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 550

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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting!

NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.

Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source.


If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-07-27 19:31:30
July 27 2018 19:30 GMT
#10981
American schools really do a shit job of teaching American History from 1930-1945. Really anything after the civil war is pretty much ignored.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Aveng3r
Profile Joined February 2012
United States2411 Posts
July 27 2018 19:34 GMT
#10982
On July 28 2018 04:30 Plansix wrote:
American schools really do a shit job of teaching American History from 1930-1945. Really anything after the civil war is pretty much ignored.

What makes you say? I thought my classes that covered the period were excellent
I carve marble busts of assassinated world leaders - PM for a quote
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
July 27 2018 19:37 GMT
#10983
On July 28 2018 04:34 Aveng3r wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2018 04:30 Plansix wrote:
American schools really do a shit job of teaching American History from 1930-1945. Really anything after the civil war is pretty much ignored.

What makes you say? I thought my classes that covered the period were excellent

The line of discussion currently going on in this thread shows a foundational miss understanding of the lead up to World War 2 and our relationship with Nazi Germany before the war. It is like 10 grade history stuff.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
July 27 2018 19:45 GMT
#10984
--- Nuked ---
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23619 Posts
July 27 2018 19:49 GMT
#10985
On July 28 2018 04:37 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2018 04:34 Aveng3r wrote:
On July 28 2018 04:30 Plansix wrote:
American schools really do a shit job of teaching American History from 1930-1945. Really anything after the civil war is pretty much ignored.

What makes you say? I thought my classes that covered the period were excellent

The line of discussion currently going on in this thread shows a foundational miss understanding of the lead up to World War 2 and our relationship with Nazi Germany before the war. It is like 10 grade history stuff.


Agreed, makes the US look pretty good though.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
Aveng3r
Profile Joined February 2012
United States2411 Posts
July 27 2018 19:58 GMT
#10986
On July 28 2018 04:37 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2018 04:34 Aveng3r wrote:
On July 28 2018 04:30 Plansix wrote:
American schools really do a shit job of teaching American History from 1930-1945. Really anything after the civil war is pretty much ignored.

What makes you say? I thought my classes that covered the period were excellent

The line of discussion currently going on in this thread shows a foundational miss understanding of the lead up to World War 2 and our relationship with Nazi Germany before the war. It is like 10 grade history stuff.

I hadn't gone more than a page back, must have missed most of it
I carve marble busts of assassinated world leaders - PM for a quote
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
July 27 2018 19:59 GMT
#10987
On July 28 2018 04:45 JimmiC wrote:
Exactly dealing with Germany Pre world war 2 only looks awful in hindsight.

1938 Nazi Germany was just one of many non-democratic nations in the world that the US dealt with. Many European nations was doing business with them at some level right up until they invaded Poland. We saw hints of what was to come, but not under after 1939 did everyone get the proof they needed, a bit to late. And America was mostly isolationist at that point, not really wanting to get involved with the rising tensions in Europe.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15736 Posts
July 27 2018 19:59 GMT
#10988
How fucking wild would it be if Trump visited Russia, then just kinda kept hanging around. Like I imagine a week going by and people wondering "wait is he coming back lol"
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
July 27 2018 20:05 GMT
#10989
I would say that it would never happen, but I’ve learned my lesson. I would be more concerned with the WH staff, security and press that will be traveling with him.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
July 27 2018 20:27 GMT
#10990
--- Nuked ---
mahrgell
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Germany3943 Posts
July 27 2018 20:44 GMT
#10991
On July 28 2018 05:27 JimmiC wrote:
*tin foil hat on* What if Melania is actually a Russian spy and they were playing the long game by entering her in his life.

I think it is more likely that she is a CIA counter intelligence agent intentionally brought into his life!
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
July 27 2018 21:04 GMT
#10992
--- Nuked ---
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
July 27 2018 21:09 GMT
#10993
Apparently there is another hearing today on the separated families that were deported without their children. The government claiming that they all signed waivers to be reunited, but the ACLU and other groups have testified under oath that ICE is lying to the asylum seekers to convince them to sign documents they don’t understand. The number of kids that were “left behind” is around 450.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
July 27 2018 21:39 GMT
#10994
--- Nuked ---
Kyadytim
Profile Joined March 2009
United States886 Posts
July 27 2018 22:30 GMT
#10995
According to immigrant rights advocates, a six-year-old girl separated from her mother under the Trump administration’s “zero tolerance” immigration policy was sexually abused while at an Arizona detention facility run by Southwest Key Programs. The child was then made to sign a form acknowledging that she was told to maintain her distance from her alleged abuser, who is an older child being held at the same detention facility.
www.thenation.com
Because every time you think it couldn't get worse, it does.

I don't even know what to say anymore except that I really hope that the people responsible for the worst of these abuses fail to get off with "I was just following orders" as a defense.
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
July 27 2018 22:53 GMT
#10996
On July 28 2018 06:39 JimmiC wrote:
How is this actually happening in the USA. This is a historical level black mark. It's embarrassing and so much worse than that.

are you looking for an actual answer or just expressing incredulity?
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
July 27 2018 23:20 GMT
#10997
--- Nuked ---
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15736 Posts
July 28 2018 00:59 GMT
#10998
On July 28 2018 07:53 zlefin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2018 06:39 JimmiC wrote:
How is this actually happening in the USA. This is a historical level black mark. It's embarrassing and so much worse than that.

are you looking for an actual answer or just expressing incredulity?


I think it is also intended as somewhat of a invitation to justify the practice. Since it is apparently immoral from any perspective, it is baffling to realize there must be someone out there who sees this as remotely acceptable. I'd be curious to hear what that person thinks.
KlaCkoN
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Sweden1661 Posts
July 28 2018 01:38 GMT
#10999
This (and the story about detainees being forced to work (without compensation obviously) while in ICE detection)
came up over beers after works, one guy loudly exclaimed that "They are not citizens, they have no rights". I imagine that's a decently popular opinion among the people that cheer for this.
They imagine their country is under siege and that violence (even when directed at children) is justified in order to keep it safe.
"Voice or no voice the people can always be brought to the bidding of their leaders ... All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger."
screamingpalm
Profile Joined October 2011
United States1527 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-07-28 05:09:28
July 28 2018 04:36 GMT
#11000
On July 27 2018 19:59 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
A city of 90,000 people is potentially at risk of being burned to the ground as a Wildfire sweeps through. You think this would be major news, hell Gatlinburg nearly burned down a few years ago but the authorities didn't abandon trying to fight the fire. How Oregon, and California haven't declared state of emergencies is bizarre.

From last night:



Show nested quote +
A rapidly expanding wildfire in Northern California surged into parts of the city of Redding late Thursday, sending residents scrambling to escape the inferno.

Images posted on social media showed orange and red flames glowing against the night sky. Long lines of vehicles backed up as people tried to flee parts of Redding, a city of 92,000 people about 100 miles south of the Oregon border.

One person was killed, a privately hired bulldozer operator who was fighting the fire, the authorities said.

“This fire is extremely dangerous and moving with no regard for what’s in its path,” said Bret Gouvea, incident commander for the California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection, or Cal Fire.

Some firefighters and civilians were injured, but the exact number was not yet known, Chief Gouvea said.

At 10:30 p.m., a news anchor at KRCR-TV, an ABC-affiliated television station in Redding, abruptly announced that the station was under evacuation orders.

“Right now we are being evacuated and that’s why we are kind of closing out right now,” said the anchor, Allison Woods. “We are going to leave the station because it is now unsafe to be here.”

The fire was started Monday by “mechanical failure of a vehicle” in the Whiskeytown National Recreation Area, Cal Fire said in a report, without elaborating.

By late Wednesday the fire, known as the Carr Fire, had engulfed 6,700 acres. It expanded to 20,000 acres by Thursday morning and to more than 28,000 acres by Thursday evening, with just 6 percent of it contained.

Hot, dry weather fueled the fire. The temperature peaked at 113 degrees in Redding on Thursday and hovered around 90 late Thursday night.

“Tonight it blew up and blew into the city limits of the city of Redding,” said Scott McLean, a spokesman for Cal Fire.

Multiple structures were on fire on the west side of the city, and the speed of the blaze’s expansion recalled the deadly wildfires north of San Francisco last year.

“This fire is just extremely dynamic,” Mr. McLean said. “We really haven’t seen anything like this except for last year on the Tubbs.”

The Tubbs fire, wind-driven blazes that ravaged Sonoma and Napa Counties, killed 22 people and destroyed more than 5,500 structures, making it the most destructive wildfire in California history.

That disaster raised questions about emergency alert and evacuation systems for fast-moving fires. Sonoma, Napa and other counties used alert systems that send text messages to mobile phones. But those warnings generally go only to the people who have signed up to receive them, and the fires knocked out cellular service in many areas.

The authorities then described a chaotic scramble to evacuate residents. Similar situations were reported on social media on Thursday night in the Redding area.

The weather conditions that fostered the surging flames in Redding — blistering temperatures, low humidity and a steady wind — are expected to continue on Friday.

In addition to the Carr fire, large wildfires are burning in Central and Southern California. The Ferguson fire caused the largest closing of Yosemite National Park in 30 years, and the Cranston fire is only 5 percent contained in the San Jacinto Mountains in Southern California.

A man suspected of starting the Cranston fire was arrested on Wednesday night and charged with five counts of arson to wildland.


Source


Ugh I hate wildfire season, but not because of the wildfires. Every year, we are bombarded with hyperbole and misinformation- not this article, but in general. I can understand when it is national media or out of state, but locally it is just as bad if not worse. Maybe it is part of the Sinclair media problem from Clinton's Telecom Act, but it's like these people haven't lived here long, or understand ecology whatsoever. Most of our western forests require fire to reproduce.

The "devastation" that is said to occur are snag habitat which are extremely valuable to the ecosystem and endangered species like the spotted owl (and very often vulnerable to clear cutting policy). A lot of this propaganda then feeds into timber industry interests and policies adopted by the US Forest Service. "Thinning forests" to reduce severity of wildfire is one example of failed policy that only serves to benefit industry. When you are "thinning" a forest of trees which have thick bark that evolved to withstand most fire, and opening the canopy to undergrowth that actually fuels the fire, it is backwards thinking. We are also having much fewer wildfires overall, compared to other periods in history, despite the rhetoric that is usually seen.

It also illustrates an ideological divide between liberals and progressives out here. While liberals support more funding for suppression techniques and risking more young lives to save someone's property, progressives want stricter building standards using fire resistant materials in these fire zones. You don't build houses in hurricane zones without proper standards, it shouldn't be different out here. Yet they continue popping up these matchboxes and expect young people to go out and risk their lives protecting them each year.
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