Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting!
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On December 16 2025 16:14 KwarK wrote: No. The 37 pencils speech was not about the excesses of consumerism.
POTUS stable genius is not only a prolific thinker and philosopher king of our time graciously ruling over us little people. no, he showers us with wisdom of 37 pencils being slightly too many.
let me just say I for one am thankful for his words, and if I may be so bold to interpret Trump's actual meaning: 25 pencils are enough, 10 out of those however should be dipped in gold. and from at least 4 different continents.
//edit: scratch the 4 continents. tariffs... US made of course!
People are not ready to revolt en masse against the child eating demons if the chance of your children being grabbed is 0.001% or some shit. The lives are too comfortable and the incidence is too low. You'll get the occasional highlight and public awareness campaigns and some funds being allocated for the victims and potentially even some activist groups fighting against the demons but also those enabling the demons. However, that's still infinitely better than the society wiping eldritch horrors you can also choose from. Sometimes you just roll with the punches until you're fed up with it.
Let's look at it from another angle actually: doing house chores. Some people have an extremely high tolerance for shit being littered throughout the house before they deem it problematic. Some people only need a single speck of dust and they lose their shit. Most people are somewhere between those 2 extremes. You seem to veer more towards the single speck of dust people (for hyperbole's sake) and you keep cleaning it over and over pointing out how messy your house is when people come over and they just see an absolutely spotless house. And everytime they visit you start about those pesky specks of dust and how you need yo clean your house every single time you find one. At some point people will just not visit you anymore. Not only is your house too clean, the conversation about you having to clean it is just exhausting because it's a one way street with thresholds being completely deviated to the point of non-understanding despite speaking the same language.
Our revolutionaries are not even willing to go to the biggest protests against a US president in its history. So I'd say their is still a long runway between the keyboard warrioring about it and actually doing anything about it.
On December 16 2025 03:15 KwarK wrote: There is no level beyond which he can’t sink. But this was known to the voting public when they made their choice. This is literally presidential behaviour.
It‘s bad all things considered, but it could be worse.
There is basically no realistic situation where you couldn't say that. "Yeah, demons emerging from hell and devouring all of the children on earth is bad. But it could be worse, they could also eat the adults!"
And lesser evilism would have people voting for the child eating demons (irrespective of which party is which), based on this "it could be worse" observation.
Now you’re getting it. The only other thing you need to work out now is that you don’t have to only vote. You can do more than one thing. And not having all the adults eaten by demons might be handy for that thing.
On December 16 2025 03:15 KwarK wrote: There is no level beyond which he can’t sink. But this was known to the voting public when they made their choice. This is literally presidential behaviour.
It‘s bad all things considered, but it could be worse.
There is basically no realistic situation where you couldn't say that. "Yeah, demons emerging from hell and devouring all of the children on earth is bad. But it could be worse, they could also eat the adults!"
And lesser evilism would have people voting for the child eating demons (irrespective of which party is which), based on this "it could be worse" observation.
People are not ready to revolt en masse against the child eating demons if the chance of your children being grabbed is 0.001% or some shit. The lives are too comfortable and the incidence is too low. + Show Spoiler +
You'll get the occasional highlight and public awareness campaigns and some funds being allocated for the victims and potentially even some activist groups fighting against the demons but also those enabling the demons. However, that's still infinitely better than the society wiping eldritch horrors you can also choose from. Sometimes you just roll with the punches until you're fed up with it.
Let's look at it from another angle actually: doing house chores. Some people have an extremely high tolerance for shit being littered throughout the house before they deem it problematic. Some people only need a single speck of dust and they lose their shit. Most people are somewhere between those 2 extremes. You seem to veer more towards the single speck of dust people (for hyperbole's sake) and you keep cleaning it over and over pointing out how messy your house is when people come over and they just see an absolutely spotless house. And everytime they visit you start about those pesky specks of dust and how you need yo clean your house every single time you find one. At some point people will just not visit you anymore. Not only is your house too clean, the conversation about you having to clean it is just exhausting because it's a one way street with thresholds being completely deviated to the point of non-understanding despite speaking the same language.
This is the crux of it. There are people "having their babies eaten". There are people that are content to materially support "the baby eaters" as long as they keep "eating the babies" of people sufficiently distanced from themselves.
The point of the Niemöller quote is to draw attention to the devastating consequences of that mindset.
On December 16 2025 16:14 KwarK wrote: No. The 37 pencils speech was not about the excesses of consumerism.
When people use the words "afford" and "affordability" and "affordability crisis," they are talking about spending money in the economy. They are not talking about whether they can afford to gambit a piece on a chessboard. Spending money. This is consumption, making them consumers. If they fall into the habit of constantly spending increasingly more money buying increasingly large amounts of stuff of questionable value in an endless cycle, it becomes consumerism. Like 37 dolls.
Everyone is in an "affordability crisis" compared to a situation where they can afford more than they do now. Whether past, future, or hypothetical. Nonetheless, this is relative. An affordability crisis in the US because footlong subs are up 30% relative to real wages is still an abundance surplus of heaven for North Korea.
If you measure the crisis by people's ability to afford things that it's not sustainable for them to have lots of, and that they don't need, the "crisis" is overblown. That was the point of the excerpt your talking head clipped. Understanding how that's connected to consumerism was my contribution, not Trump's. Exhorting Americans to buy steel instead of Barbies in a bizarro American Great Leap Forward was nobody's idea. Policy that benefits US steel and key industries while disadvantaging individual consumers who can't get their hands on as much dropshipped garbage may just be good policy.
Gee, if only child molester Donald Trump campaigned on "the economy is actually great, you're just buying too much shit" in 2024 instead of "Biden wrecked the economy and I'll make everything affordable again on day 1".
On December 16 2025 23:06 LightSpectra wrote: Gee, if only child molester Donald Trump campaigned on "the economy is actually great, you're just buying too much shit" in 2024 instead of "Biden wrecked the economy and I'll make everything affordable again on day 1".
Little did we know that Trump's economic plan included raising taxes on penguins.
Don't know if that would've mattered. The working class voted for Reagan twice even though he cut taxes for the ultra-wealthy, and for George W. Bush twice even though he cut taxes for the ultra-wealthy, and for Trump twice even though he cut taxes for the ultra-wealthy in his first term and promised to do so again in his second term. Apparently MAGA's position is that it's patriotic for the working class to pay higher taxes because billionaires shouldn't have to spend a penny improving the country that made them wealthy.
On December 16 2025 23:06 LightSpectra wrote: Gee, if only child molester Donald Trump campaigned on "the economy is actually great, you're just buying too much shit" in 2024 instead of "Biden wrecked the economy and I'll make everything affordable again on day 1".
Little did we know that Trump's economic plan included raising taxes on penguins.
people forced by their little ones to be familiar with the Penguins of Madagascar know that they are into all sorts of shenanigans. taxing them is the least we should do.
Even amongst Republicans mainlining Fox news it's slowly dipping below 2 thirds, but I'm sure those high paying easy jobs in steel industry are going to make them change their minds.
On December 16 2025 23:13 LightSpectra wrote: Don't know if that would've mattered. The working class voted for Reagan twice even though he cut taxes for the ultra-wealthy, and for George W. Bush twice even though he cut taxes for the ultra-wealthy, and for Trump twice even though he cut taxes for the ultra-wealthy in his first term and promised to do so again in his second term. Apparently MAGA's position is that it's patriotic for the working class to pay higher taxes because billionaires shouldn't have to spend a penny improving the country that made them wealthy.
There are no poor people in America, only temporarily embarrassed millionaires. Any day now, they to will be rich.
Don't know if that would've mattered. The working class voted for Reagan twice even though he cut taxes for the ultra-wealthy, and for George W. Bush twice even though he cut taxes for the ultra-wealthy, and for Trump twice even though he cut taxes for the ultra-wealthy in his first term and promised to do so again in his second term.
Apparently MAGA's position is that it's patriotic for the working class to pay higher taxes because billionaires shouldn't have to spend a penny improving the country that made them wealthy.
They believe they should spend money to improve the country, but it should be at the discretion of the billionaires and the businesses/charities of their choosing (subject to the free market). This is in part because they believe the US government can't be trusted to effectively use these resources (with some exceptions, namely the military). This is at the very core of believing there's any rationale for billionaires to exist in the first place.
Spamming them with accusations of being idiots and hypocrites is useless because they would all be the "ultra-wealthy" (or close enough) if only their ostensible political opposition would get out of the way.
On December 16 2025 16:14 KwarK wrote: No. The 37 pencils speech was not about the excesses of consumerism.
When people use the words "afford" and "affordability" and "affordability crisis," they are talking about spending money in the economy. They are not talking about whether they can afford to gambit a piece on a chessboard. Spending money. This is consumption, making them consumers. If they fall into the habit of constantly spending increasingly more money buying increasingly large amounts of stuff of questionable value in an endless cycle, it becomes consumerism. Like 37 dolls.
Everyone is in an "affordability crisis" compared to a situation where they can afford more than they do now. Whether past, future, or hypothetical. Nonetheless, this is relative. An affordability crisis in the US because footlong subs are up 30% relative to real wages is still an abundance surplus of heaven for North Korea.
If you measure the crisis by people's ability to afford things that it's not sustainable for them to have lots of, and that they don't need, the "crisis" is overblown. That was the point of the excerpt your talking head clipped. Understanding how that's connected to consumerism was my contribution, not Trump's. Exhorting Americans to buy steel instead of Barbies in a bizarro American Great Leap Forward was nobody's idea. Policy that benefits US steel and key industries while disadvantaging individual consumers who can't get their hands on as much dropshipped garbage may just be good policy.
This is embarrassing, even by your standards. How would all Americans cutting their pencil budgets and going out and buying extra steel help with affordability?
On December 16 2025 23:06 LightSpectra wrote: Gee, if only child molester Donald Trump campaigned on "the economy is actually great, you're just buying too much shit" in 2024 instead of "Biden wrecked the economy and I'll make everything affordable again on day 1".
Little did we know that Trump's economic plan included raising taxes on penguins.
people forced by their little ones to be familiar with the Penguins of Madagascar know that they are into all sorts of shenanigans. taxing them is the least we should do.
Touché. They definitely had it coming. They're also half-black and half-white, which triggers Trump and the entire Republican party (especially if they wear a tan suit).
On December 16 2025 03:09 Jankisa wrote: I live to see the day when someone proposes a new way of taxation, in any way, shape or form which will not be met with people explaining why it's impossible or how it would never work.
It reminds me of other times when someone would propose anything to fix the guns issue in the USA and be met with a very similar response.
Or, you know, any time that anyone would suggest any way to fix the US healthcare system.
In other news, I sure hope that "how do we fix the US fascism problem" doesn't become the new one of those, especially when it's giving us all such great obituaries for beloved artists like this one:
One of Rob Reiner's kids was arrested as a suspect. Doesn't seem to be related to Trump at all.
"Police have arrested Nick Reiner, the son of Rob Reiner, on a charge of murder following the death of the acclaimed Hollywood director and his wife, Michele Singer. Nick Reiner, a 32-year-old screenwriter and the middle child of Rob Reiner and Singer, was taken into custody on Sunday, Dec. 14, and booked on Monday, according to Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department records reviewed by USA TODAY. He is being held on $4 million bail. Los Angeles Police Department Chief Jim McDonnell revealed Reiner had been charged with murder during a press conference on Monday. "Our hearts go out to the family and friends of the Reiners, a tragic incident," McDonnell said." https://www.usatoday.com/story/entertainment/celebrities/2025/12/15/rob-reiner-son-nick-reiner-arrested-death-michele-singer/87775318007/
some people have bristled at my use of displaying the popular art forms of the day to convey social attitudes and tendencies. Nothing could be more illustrative of the issues of the 70s than "Meathead" in "All In The Family".
Back in the 1970s it was well recognized that sociology degrees, psychology degrees, and poli sci degrees were all useless unless they got you into a professional school. "Meathead", the genius of the family, could never get a job. So when people whine in the modern era about a 4 year degree not getting them a job... and act like they just discovered this for the first time... i kinda shake my head and can not take them seriously. Educated people not getting jobs has been going on since forever.
Any how, Rob Reiner was a great actor, film producer and American. I do not agree with most of his political views. Bowling For Columbine was great though.
On December 16 2025 23:13 LightSpectra wrote: Don't know if that would've mattered. The working class voted for Reagan twice even though he cut taxes for the ultra-wealthy, and for George W. Bush twice even though he cut taxes for the ultra-wealthy, and for Trump twice even though he cut taxes for the ultra-wealthy in his first term and promised to do so again in his second term. Apparently MAGA's position is that it's patriotic for the working class to pay higher taxes because billionaires shouldn't have to spend a penny improving the country that made them wealthy.
There are no poor people in America, only temporarily embarrassed millionaires. Any day now, they to will be rich.
If there are no poor people then who are all the lazy welfare leeches Republicans keep telling me are taking their jobs by working harder for less pay?
On December 16 2025 23:55 JimmyJRaynor wrote: Rob Reiner was a great actor, film producer and American. I do not agree with most of his political views. Bowling For Columbine was great though.
oh, how could I forget Spinal Tap. Rob Reiner did a genius job making fun of Heavy Metal fans. Pure genius. My wife and I are watching Spinal Tap this Saturday night and inviting the whole family.
On December 16 2025 23:55 JimmyJRaynor wrote: Rob Reiner was a great actor, film producer and American. I do not agree with most of his political views. Bowling For Columbine was great though.
Wasn't that Michael Moore, not Rob Reiner?
you could be right!
Here is Rob Reiner at his best. The over-educated, unemployed nice guy.
"All In The Family" and Rob Reiner did a great job surfacing the political issues of the 1970s. Sources: + Show Spoiler +
It is one thing to read the statistics that were part of Carter-Era Stagflation... its another to see it live on TV. @5:44 Meathead Reiner: "Archie, did you see the latest unemployment figures?" Archie Bunker: "I'm looking at an unemployment figure right now"
@2:56 seconds they debate whether or not Archie's daughter, A WOMAN, should get a job. its great theatre.
@6:45 Archie and Meathead discuss the very real possibility that a man walking on Mars could happen in Archie's, a very old man, lifetime or in a year. So much hope for expanding space travel in the early 70s. Really cool to see.
Shows like this provide insight into the 1970s that you can't really get out of a book of statistics. These moments have to be experienced to get an idea what the 70s felt like. A google search won't do it.
Any how, it is a crying shame Rob Reiner was murdered.
Spinal Tap is pretty legendary, I am definitely going to check out Spinal Tap 2 at some point.
RIP Rob Reiner and his wife and shame upon POTUS shameless. and his whole House Of Turdsand all the best for the rest of his family in the interest of the Christmas spirit.
EPT
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