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On September 09 2025 21:55 Jankisa wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2025 21:50 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:46 LightSpectra wrote:On September 09 2025 21:38 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:15 Jankisa wrote:+ Show Spoiler +It's hilarious that all these guys have is "well, we are just doing what Fox news told us the left was doing all along".
It's insane power grabs justified by misinterpreted lies, and our resident intellectual right winger fascist boot licker Introvert is presenting it as some sort of a gotcha.
No democratic president has ever:
* used the office of the president to promote it's businesses or businesses of his buddies
* received insane bribes from foreign dignitaries such as golden fucking jets that will cost the US citizens a billion to take apart and check for bugs
* used tariffs as a means to enact personal vendettas against countries that refused to nominate him for Nobel peace prize
* sent troops to American (always blue) cities in a completely illegal manner even when explicitely refused by the governor of that state (can I get one hell yeah from the "states rights" crowd)
* used the office of the president to promote his Crypto meme coins or do very obvious market manipulation by tweeting shit and buying up the specific coins before doing so
* nominated people with incredibly obvious conflict of interest into positions in the DOJ (his personal lawyers) and had them conduct interviews with sex traffickers which (shockingly) exonerate them, only for the same DOJ to give the sex trafficker special treatment
* directed his agencies to pull permits from basically finished projects because he doesn't like windmills
And a million other things that are damaging not only to the US economy but it's world wide reputation. And all this guy has to say to all of this is "but democrats[/republicans]". Honestly pathetic. That one line is US politics in a nutshell. It's not like Democrats couldn't/wouldn't vote for the whole slate of Republican politicians currently in office (including Trump) out of principle. GH repeating another Republican talking point, color me surprised. It's a literal fact. Libs/Dems/ilk rejecting facts that they don't like, color me surprised... That is the difference between you and me, GH, I don't believe that, I know plenty of Americans, I don't think many Democrats would vote for Trump just because he had D next to his name. + Show Spoiler +You derided Democrats for campaigning with Liz Chaney and blamed their electoral failings (partially) on that, that is completely incompatible with what you just wrote.
The fact that you do think that Democrats=Republcians says a lot about you and your view of the world, and to me just shows, once again that you hate the USA and are basically a Tankie. + Show Spoiler +I like the USA, I would be a very different and in many ways less successful and culturally very different person if the USA didn't exist, I don't think you can slot China in the place of USA and have the world be as cool of a place as it is. All of us certainty wouldn't be posting on a TL forum (US company/team) that was created by and for fans of a game like Starcraft.
Unfortunately, Republicans and all conservatives want the USA to be more like China and Russia, most (not even close to all) Democrat politicians want it to be like Clinton's USA or Thatcher's UK.
USA, like most other countries contains multitudes, unfortunately, you guys have a duopoly in your politics, which is a double edged sword, on the one hand, this duopoly makes sure that the pendulum keeps swinging, on the other, it flattens the parties quite a bit, but nowhere close to what you are trying to present it as.
I'm talking about "lesser evilists" (which is basically everyone here and the overwhelming majority of the Democrat party). They literally could/would vote for Trump and any other Republican. This isn't disputable.
I literally don't think Democrats=Republicans, so that isn't a fact.
Republicans, by pretty much any metric, are worse than Democrats.
Try to integrate that information into your next assessment please.
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Yeah Light, but Introvert will ignore all that even when it was mentioned to him explicitly in the last page, a few months ago, as it was happening because it doesn't fit his version of "reality".
He has alternative facts and his alternative facts don't care about your feelings. Owned, you liberal cuck!
These last 2 posts have made me more convinced then ever that he is just oBlade alt, like Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde but both guys are the same person.
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On September 09 2025 23:12 LightSpectra wrote:Show nested quote + They cheered for DACA, for student loan forgiveness, they were silent or totally in denial about Biden's dereliction of duty at the border. DACA doesn't break any laws, the law that regulates student loans explicitly allows for the POTUS to forgive some at his discretion, and Biden explicitly asked Congress for more resources to secure the border and Republicans told him to fuck off because they wouldn't win the election if they couldn't campaign on the border still being broken from Trump's administration. Once again, made-up Republican scandals with no relation to reality whatsoever are used to justify actual authoritarianism. Might as well say that sending in the national guard to violate posse comitatus is totally cool because Obama was going to do it with Jade Helm, even though that was proven multiple times to be a hoax.
I've argued about all these things before in this thread so I won't rehash, but all of those things are wrong. I guess quickly your contention about the border is embarrassing considering it was in trouble long before the failed bill and there was no crisis before or after. So again, there are people on the left who will justify anything, and will do so again for whatever the next Democrat does.
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On September 09 2025 23:20 Jankisa wrote:
Yeah Light, but Introvert will ignore all that even when it was mentioned to him explicitly in the last page, a few months ago, as it was happening because it doesn't fit his version of "reality".
He has alternative facts and his alternative facts don't care about your feelings. Owned, you liberal cuck!
These last 2 posts have made me more convinced then ever that he is just oBlade alt, like Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde but both guys are the same person.
Nah, I don't think they're the same. Introvert just repeats mainstream far-right talking points and then has a meltdown when people aren't convinced. oBlade comes up with the most insane shit you've ever heard in your life on the spot, like tariffs are actually good because they reduce corporate waste.
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On September 09 2025 23:18 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2025 21:55 Jankisa wrote:On September 09 2025 21:50 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:46 LightSpectra wrote:On September 09 2025 21:38 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:15 Jankisa wrote:+ Show Spoiler +It's hilarious that all these guys have is "well, we are just doing what Fox news told us the left was doing all along".
It's insane power grabs justified by misinterpreted lies, and our resident intellectual right winger fascist boot licker Introvert is presenting it as some sort of a gotcha.
No democratic president has ever:
* used the office of the president to promote it's businesses or businesses of his buddies
* received insane bribes from foreign dignitaries such as golden fucking jets that will cost the US citizens a billion to take apart and check for bugs
* used tariffs as a means to enact personal vendettas against countries that refused to nominate him for Nobel peace prize
* sent troops to American (always blue) cities in a completely illegal manner even when explicitely refused by the governor of that state (can I get one hell yeah from the "states rights" crowd)
* used the office of the president to promote his Crypto meme coins or do very obvious market manipulation by tweeting shit and buying up the specific coins before doing so
* nominated people with incredibly obvious conflict of interest into positions in the DOJ (his personal lawyers) and had them conduct interviews with sex traffickers which (shockingly) exonerate them, only for the same DOJ to give the sex trafficker special treatment
* directed his agencies to pull permits from basically finished projects because he doesn't like windmills
And a million other things that are damaging not only to the US economy but it's world wide reputation. And all this guy has to say to all of this is "but democrats[/republicans]". Honestly pathetic. That one line is US politics in a nutshell. It's not like Democrats couldn't/wouldn't vote for the whole slate of Republican politicians currently in office (including Trump) out of principle. GH repeating another Republican talking point, color me surprised. It's a literal fact. Libs/Dems/ilk rejecting facts that they don't like, color me surprised... That is the difference between you and me, GH, I don't believe that, I know plenty of Americans, I don't think many Democrats would vote for Trump just because he had D next to his name. + Show Spoiler +You derided Democrats for campaigning with Liz Chaney and blamed their electoral failings (partially) on that, that is completely incompatible with what you just wrote.
The fact that you do think that Democrats=Republcians says a lot about you and your view of the world, and to me just shows, once again that you hate the USA and are basically a Tankie. + Show Spoiler +I like the USA, I would be a very different and in many ways less successful and culturally very different person if the USA didn't exist, I don't think you can slot China in the place of USA and have the world be as cool of a place as it is. All of us certainty wouldn't be posting on a TL forum (US company/team) that was created by and for fans of a game like Starcraft.
Unfortunately, Republicans and all conservatives want the USA to be more like China and Russia, most (not even close to all) Democrat politicians want it to be like Clinton's USA or Thatcher's UK.
USA, like most other countries contains multitudes, unfortunately, you guys have a duopoly in your politics, which is a double edged sword, on the one hand, this duopoly makes sure that the pendulum keeps swinging, on the other, it flattens the parties quite a bit, but nowhere close to what you are trying to present it as. I'm talking about "lesser evilists" (which is basically everyone here and the overwhelming majority of the Democrat party). They literally could/would vote for Trump and any other Republican. This isn't disputable. I literally don't think Democrats=Republicans, so that isn't a fact. Republicans, by pretty much any metric, are worse than Democrats. Try to integrate that information into your next assessment please.
You make 2 false assertions right from the get go. You can't just say something and pretend like it's an accepted truth. I very much doubt the vast majority of regular posters here who actually have the right to vote in the USA would ever vote for Trump, so that is very much disputable.
You might not "think" that, but you write and act in a way where everyone who reads you can come to the conclusion that you do. The burden of proof is on you, and all you do, including this latest screed is to prove us otherwise.
Normal people who haven't had their brain fried by politics to the point you have understand that the only way any of us can go through life without losing our minds is by choosing the lesser evil.
In the last 2 presidential elections in Croatia I bit my tongue and voted for a guy who I have a very low opinion of, mostly because from a Social Democrat he turned into a Trump cosplaying populist who seems to be on the take from Russia, but, he is smart, eloquent and shares most of my values, he also doesn't have a lot of power and he serves as a counterweight to our criminal organization party in power.
I could have purity tested him and said fuck this, encouraged most of my friends and family to do the same and split the vote or vote for our version of a Republican, but I didn't, because I choose the lesser evil.
That is an adult thing to do. And I'm OK with my choice, he's still an asshole to Ukraine, but he is the only part of our national voice who spends time criticizing Israel. You get some, you lose some, that's life.
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On September 09 2025 23:33 LightSpectra wrote:
oBlade comes up with the most insane shit you've ever heard in your life on the spot, like tariffs are actually good because they reduce corporate waste.
Sounds insane, never said it.
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Northern Ireland25573 Posts
On September 09 2025 23:31 Introvert wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2025 23:12 LightSpectra wrote: They cheered for DACA, for student loan forgiveness, they were silent or totally in denial about Biden's dereliction of duty at the border. DACA doesn't break any laws, the law that regulates student loans explicitly allows for the POTUS to forgive some at his discretion, and Biden explicitly asked Congress for more resources to secure the border and Republicans told him to fuck off because they wouldn't win the election if they couldn't campaign on the border still being broken from Trump's administration. Once again, made-up Republican scandals with no relation to reality whatsoever are used to justify actual authoritarianism. Might as well say that sending in the national guard to violate posse comitatus is totally cool because Obama was going to do it with Jade Helm, even though that was proven multiple times to be a hoax. I've argued about all these things before in this thread so I won't rehash, but all of those things are wrong. I guess quickly your contention about the border is embarrassing considering it was in trouble long before the failed bill and there was no crisis before or after. So again, there are people on the left who will justify anything, and will do so again for whatever the next Democrat does.
I mean sure, some will do that. Equally many, especially amongst the further left of the populace will happily admit that the Constitution is too rigid thru outright anachronistic to adequately deal with modern problems.
Even aside from the sheer volume of Trump’s trampling, especially in his second term, its conservatives at large who couch so much of their rhetoric and beliefs in adherence to the Constitution, and things like states rights, far more so than the left does.
Thus critiques can by themselves be certainly valid, but start to ring entirely hollow when conservatives give their own a pass to trample over their own ostensible sacred cows with much greater frequency.
No amount of ‘but the Dems’ can entirely sidestep that.
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On September 09 2025 23:37 Jankisa wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2025 23:18 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:55 Jankisa wrote:On September 09 2025 21:50 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:46 LightSpectra wrote:On September 09 2025 21:38 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:15 Jankisa wrote:+ Show Spoiler +It's hilarious that all these guys have is "well, we are just doing what Fox news told us the left was doing all along".
It's insane power grabs justified by misinterpreted lies, and our resident intellectual right winger fascist boot licker Introvert is presenting it as some sort of a gotcha.
No democratic president has ever:
* used the office of the president to promote it's businesses or businesses of his buddies
* received insane bribes from foreign dignitaries such as golden fucking jets that will cost the US citizens a billion to take apart and check for bugs
* used tariffs as a means to enact personal vendettas against countries that refused to nominate him for Nobel peace prize
* sent troops to American (always blue) cities in a completely illegal manner even when explicitely refused by the governor of that state (can I get one hell yeah from the "states rights" crowd)
* used the office of the president to promote his Crypto meme coins or do very obvious market manipulation by tweeting shit and buying up the specific coins before doing so
* nominated people with incredibly obvious conflict of interest into positions in the DOJ (his personal lawyers) and had them conduct interviews with sex traffickers which (shockingly) exonerate them, only for the same DOJ to give the sex trafficker special treatment
* directed his agencies to pull permits from basically finished projects because he doesn't like windmills
And a million other things that are damaging not only to the US economy but it's world wide reputation. And all this guy has to say to all of this is "but democrats[/republicans]". Honestly pathetic. That one line is US politics in a nutshell. It's not like Democrats couldn't/wouldn't vote for the whole slate of Republican politicians currently in office (including Trump) out of principle. GH repeating another Republican talking point, color me surprised. It's a literal fact. Libs/Dems/ilk rejecting facts that they don't like, color me surprised... That is the difference between you and me, GH, I don't believe that, I know plenty of Americans, I don't think many Democrats would vote for Trump just because he had D next to his name. + Show Spoiler +You derided Democrats for campaigning with Liz Chaney and blamed their electoral failings (partially) on that, that is completely incompatible with what you just wrote.
The fact that you do think that Democrats=Republcians says a lot about you and your view of the world, and to me just shows, once again that you hate the USA and are basically a Tankie. + Show Spoiler +I like the USA, I would be a very different and in many ways less successful and culturally very different person if the USA didn't exist, I don't think you can slot China in the place of USA and have the world be as cool of a place as it is. All of us certainty wouldn't be posting on a TL forum (US company/team) that was created by and for fans of a game like Starcraft.
Unfortunately, Republicans and all conservatives want the USA to be more like China and Russia, most (not even close to all) Democrat politicians want it to be like Clinton's USA or Thatcher's UK.
USA, like most other countries contains multitudes, unfortunately, you guys have a duopoly in your politics, which is a double edged sword, on the one hand, this duopoly makes sure that the pendulum keeps swinging, on the other, it flattens the parties quite a bit, but nowhere close to what you are trying to present it as. I'm talking about "lesser evilists" (which is basically everyone here and the overwhelming majority of the Democrat party). They literally could/would vote for Trump and any other Republican. This isn't disputable. I literally don't think Democrats=Republicans, so that isn't a fact. Republicans, by pretty much any metric, are worse than Democrats. Try to integrate that information into your next assessment please. You make 2 false assertions right from the get go. You can't just say something and pretend like it's an accepted truth. I very much doubt the vast majority of regular posters here who actually have the right to vote in the USA would ever vote for Trump, so that is very much disputable. You might not "think" that, but you write and act in a way where everyone who reads you can come to the conclusion that you do. The burden of proof is on you, and all you do, including this latest screed is to prove us otherwise. + Show Spoiler +Normal people who haven't had their brain fried by politics to the point you have understand that the only way any of us can go through life without losing our minds is by choosing the lesser evil.
In the last 2 presidential elections in Croatia I bit my tongue and voted for a guy who I have a very low opinion of, mostly because from a Social Democrat he turned into a Trump cosplaying populist who seems to be on the take from Russia, but, he is smart, eloquent and shares most of my values, he also doesn't have a lot of power and he serves as a counterweight to our criminal organization party in power.
I could have purity tested him and said fuck this, encouraged most of my friends and family to do the same and split the vote or vote for our version of a Republican, but I didn't, because I choose the lesser evil.
That is an adult thing to do. And I'm OK with my choice, he's still an asshole to Ukraine, but he is the only part of our national voice who spends time criticizing Israel. You get some, you lose some, that's life.
You weren't really around for when they were first rationalizing "lesser evilism" , so I don't blame you, but yeah, they would. That's how "lesser evilism", as they've articulated it, works. You can verify that with any one of them.
It's objectively (and obviously) true that Republicans ≠ Democrats. I don't have to prove that to you, nor do I have to prove that I believe it to you or anyone else. That assertion is preposterous.
Seems you shouldn't go "ignor[ing] all that even when it was mentioned to [you] explicitly in the last page..." and fixate on your "alternative facts" that "don't care about feelings..." while self-congratulating with a "Owned [tankie punk]!"
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On September 09 2025 23:57 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2025 23:37 Jankisa wrote:On September 09 2025 23:18 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:55 Jankisa wrote:On September 09 2025 21:50 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:46 LightSpectra wrote:On September 09 2025 21:38 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:15 Jankisa wrote:+ Show Spoiler +It's hilarious that all these guys have is "well, we are just doing what Fox news told us the left was doing all along".
It's insane power grabs justified by misinterpreted lies, and our resident intellectual right winger fascist boot licker Introvert is presenting it as some sort of a gotcha.
No democratic president has ever:
* used the office of the president to promote it's businesses or businesses of his buddies
* received insane bribes from foreign dignitaries such as golden fucking jets that will cost the US citizens a billion to take apart and check for bugs
* used tariffs as a means to enact personal vendettas against countries that refused to nominate him for Nobel peace prize
* sent troops to American (always blue) cities in a completely illegal manner even when explicitely refused by the governor of that state (can I get one hell yeah from the "states rights" crowd)
* used the office of the president to promote his Crypto meme coins or do very obvious market manipulation by tweeting shit and buying up the specific coins before doing so
* nominated people with incredibly obvious conflict of interest into positions in the DOJ (his personal lawyers) and had them conduct interviews with sex traffickers which (shockingly) exonerate them, only for the same DOJ to give the sex trafficker special treatment
* directed his agencies to pull permits from basically finished projects because he doesn't like windmills
And a million other things that are damaging not only to the US economy but it's world wide reputation. And all this guy has to say to all of this is "but democrats[/republicans]". Honestly pathetic. That one line is US politics in a nutshell. It's not like Democrats couldn't/wouldn't vote for the whole slate of Republican politicians currently in office (including Trump) out of principle. GH repeating another Republican talking point, color me surprised. It's a literal fact. Libs/Dems/ilk rejecting facts that they don't like, color me surprised... That is the difference between you and me, GH, I don't believe that, I know plenty of Americans, I don't think many Democrats would vote for Trump just because he had D next to his name. + Show Spoiler +You derided Democrats for campaigning with Liz Chaney and blamed their electoral failings (partially) on that, that is completely incompatible with what you just wrote.
The fact that you do think that Democrats=Republcians says a lot about you and your view of the world, and to me just shows, once again that you hate the USA and are basically a Tankie. + Show Spoiler +I like the USA, I would be a very different and in many ways less successful and culturally very different person if the USA didn't exist, I don't think you can slot China in the place of USA and have the world be as cool of a place as it is. All of us certainty wouldn't be posting on a TL forum (US company/team) that was created by and for fans of a game like Starcraft.
Unfortunately, Republicans and all conservatives want the USA to be more like China and Russia, most (not even close to all) Democrat politicians want it to be like Clinton's USA or Thatcher's UK.
USA, like most other countries contains multitudes, unfortunately, you guys have a duopoly in your politics, which is a double edged sword, on the one hand, this duopoly makes sure that the pendulum keeps swinging, on the other, it flattens the parties quite a bit, but nowhere close to what you are trying to present it as. I'm talking about "lesser evilists" (which is basically everyone here and the overwhelming majority of the Democrat party). They literally could/would vote for Trump and any other Republican. This isn't disputable. I literally don't think Democrats=Republicans, so that isn't a fact. Republicans, by pretty much any metric, are worse than Democrats. Try to integrate that information into your next assessment please. You make 2 false assertions right from the get go. You can't just say something and pretend like it's an accepted truth. I very much doubt the vast majority of regular posters here who actually have the right to vote in the USA would ever vote for Trump, so that is very much disputable. You might not "think" that, but you write and act in a way where everyone who reads you can come to the conclusion that you do. The burden of proof is on you, and all you do, including this latest screed is to prove us otherwise. + Show Spoiler +Normal people who haven't had their brain fried by politics to the point you have understand that the only way any of us can go through life without losing our minds is by choosing the lesser evil.
In the last 2 presidential elections in Croatia I bit my tongue and voted for a guy who I have a very low opinion of, mostly because from a Social Democrat he turned into a Trump cosplaying populist who seems to be on the take from Russia, but, he is smart, eloquent and shares most of my values, he also doesn't have a lot of power and he serves as a counterweight to our criminal organization party in power.
I could have purity tested him and said fuck this, encouraged most of my friends and family to do the same and split the vote or vote for our version of a Republican, but I didn't, because I choose the lesser evil.
That is an adult thing to do. And I'm OK with my choice, he's still an asshole to Ukraine, but he is the only part of our national voice who spends time criticizing Israel. You get some, you lose some, that's life. You weren't really around for when they were first rationalizing "lesser evilism" , so I don't blame you, but yeah, they would. That's how "lesser evilism", as they've articulated it, works. You can verify that with any one of them. It's objectively (and obviously) true that Republicans ≠ Democrats. I don't have to prove that to you, nor do I have to prove that I believe it to you or anyone else. That assertion is preposterous. Seems you shouldn't go "ignor[ing] all that even when it was mentioned to [you] explicitly in the last page..." and fixate on your "alternative facts" that "don't care about feelings..." while self-congratulating with a "Owned [tankie punk]!"
I don't know what happened in the last 5000 pages or how it broke your brain, but most of us don't see politics and people through the lore of a politics thread on a non-politics related forum.
I'm also sure that you are basically just putting out your interpretations of how people responded to your usual gotchas or hypotheticals.
Again, you keep posting and even acting like someone who thinks that Republicans are basically the same as Democrats but also somehow worse and more worth of derision because they hurt your feelings, like when you quoted a neo-liberal centrist think tank quote without a shred of irony a few pages back.
Also, conflating one conversation with another in order to write up some "own" that I'm either not well versed enough in English language or your lore to understand isn't as clever as you think it is.
I will, however, stop calling you Tankie when you stop acting like one. It's kind of interesting, tho, that you never denied that you hate the USA or even acknowledged that whole post up until now when you decided to reference that assessment in y[o]ur extrem[e]ly clever post.
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On September 09 2025 22:47 Gorsameth wrote:
The President is directly using the army as a threat against 'opposing' cities against the direct wishes of both the state and the city involved.
Like what? How is this not a much bigger deal.
Actually reconciling what it meant would mean everyone would have to stop being so anti-Maidan
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On September 09 2025 23:08 Introvert wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2025 22:38 Magic Powers wrote:On September 09 2025 22:04 Introvert wrote:On September 09 2025 21:15 Jankisa wrote:
It's hilarious that all these guys have is "well, we are just doing what Fox news told us the left was doing all along".
It's insane power grabs justified by misinterpreted lies, and our resident intellectual right winger fascist boot licker Introvert is presenting it as some sort of a gotcha.
No democratic president has ever:
* used the office of the president to promote it's businesses or businesses of his buddies
* received insane bribes from foreign dignitaries such as golden fucking jets that will cost the US citizens a billion to take apart and check for bugs
* used tariffs as a means to enact personal vendettas against countries that refused to nominate him for Nobel peace prize
* sent troops to American (always blue) cities in a completely illegal manner even when explicitely refused by the governor of that state (can I get one hell yeah from the "states rights" crowd)
* used the office of the president to promote his Crypto meme coins or do very obvious market manipulation by tweeting shit and buying up the specific coins before doing so
* nominated people with incredibly obvious conflict of interest into positions in the DOJ (his personal lawyers) and had them conduct interviews with sex traffickers which (shockingly) exonerate them, only for the same DOJ to give the sex trafficker special treatment
* directed his agencies to pull permits from basically finished projects because he doesn't like windmills
And a million other things that are damaging not only to the US economy but it's world wide reputation.
And all this guy has to say to all of this is "but democrats". Honestly pathetic. You and MP are so beautifully proving my point I have to thank you. There will be no self-reflection. If the conversation has made you tired, I won't hold that against you. Feel free to take time off. But if you're just throwing out a random accusation with no explanation, then you can't expect people to reflect on anything. It is my firm belief that Trump has escalated presidential lawlessness to an unseen level. In terms of criminality and lies, he's worse than Nixon. As the famous rapper Melon Tusk once said: "Let that sink in" Just to be super explicit, I've been making an argument that Billyboy's "can't we all see this is bad and we shouldn't do this" is ill-fated because in fact many on the left don't think these executive boundary pushing orders are bad constitutionally, they just don't like the results. They cheered for DACA, for student loan forgiveness, they were silent or totally in denial about Biden's dereliction of duty at the border. The point in contention isn't about the relative frequency of what Trump is doing now, it's that many people on his side aren't actually in favor of the principle he articulated at the very beginning. And therefore he should temper his hopes. It's the "but Trump!" while steadfastly refusing to even give an inch on his two predecessors that is making my point. So thank you.
The thing about Biden's massive student loan forgiveness is that it's not anywhere near as nefarious as it may sound on a surface level. The cancellation of debt is quite specific and it's mainly about loosening restrictions making it easier for recipients of the program to get what they rightfully deserve to begin with.
As per this article from AP News, most of the recipients of the program should've already had their debt cancelled but couldn't because of legal obstructions resulting in an absurdly high 99% rejection rate. Biden viewed this as an injustice. He didn't just say "look at those poor students, they shouldn't have to pay anything", he viewed it as an act of justice to give them what was rightfully theirs according to law. He was trying to uphold the law, not break or circumvent it.
https://apnews.com/article/student-loans-debt-cancellation-forgiveness-d213afe3ea69da3c6b9e713c7dc16a9a
Republicans are always lying to people about the law. Biden can certainly be criticized, and I have criticized him harshly. But I just don't see the validity of your argument. Biden didn't create the foundation that Trump is now using to trample on people's rights. Trump alone created the foundation.
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United States42887 Posts
On September 09 2025 23:33 LightSpectra wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2025 23:20 Jankisa wrote:
Yeah Light, but Introvert will ignore all that even when it was mentioned to him explicitly in the last page, a few months ago, as it was happening because it doesn't fit his version of "reality".
He has alternative facts and his alternative facts don't care about your feelings. Owned, you liberal cuck!
These last 2 posts have made me more convinced then ever that he is just oBlade alt, like Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde but both guys are the same person. Nah, I don't think they're the same. Introvert just repeats mainstream far-right talking points and then has a meltdown when people aren't convinced. oBlade comes up with the most insane shit you've ever heard in your life on the spot, like tariffs are actually good because they reduce corporate waste.
Remember when Introvert explained that Seig Heils were the way K-pop mega fans communicate their enthusiasm for K-pop at political rallies? I do.
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On September 09 2025 23:53 WombaT wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2025 23:31 Introvert wrote:On September 09 2025 23:12 LightSpectra wrote: They cheered for DACA, for student loan forgiveness, they were silent or totally in denial about Biden's dereliction of duty at the border. DACA doesn't break any laws, the law that regulates student loans explicitly allows for the POTUS to forgive some at his discretion, and Biden explicitly asked Congress for more resources to secure the border and Republicans told him to fuck off because they wouldn't win the election if they couldn't campaign on the border still being broken from Trump's administration. Once again, made-up Republican scandals with no relation to reality whatsoever are used to justify actual authoritarianism. Might as well say that sending in the national guard to violate posse comitatus is totally cool because Obama was going to do it with Jade Helm, even though that was proven multiple times to be a hoax. I've argued about all these things before in this thread so I won't rehash, but all of those things are wrong. I guess quickly your contention about the border is embarrassing considering it was in trouble long before the failed bill and there was no crisis before or after. So again, there are people on the left who will justify anything, and will do so again for whatever the next Democrat does. I mean sure, some will do that. Equally many, especially amongst the further left of the populace will happily admit that the Constitution is too rigid thru outright anachronistic to adequately deal with modern problems. Even aside from the sheer volume of Trump’s trampling, especially in his second term, its conservatives at large who couch so much of their rhetoric and beliefs in adherence to the Constitution, and things like states rights, far more so than the left does. Thus critiques can by themselves be certainly valid, but start to ring entirely hollow when conservatives give their own a pass to trample over their own ostensible sacred cows with much greater frequency. No amount of ‘but the Dems’ can entirely sidestep that.
Well first the Trump era has led to a newfound *rhetorical* respect for the constitution by Dems. Second, MAGA is its own thing. But a lot of people take the view expressed in the tweet I linked a little earlier. They see it as tit-for-tat.
On September 10 2025 01:51 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2025 23:33 LightSpectra wrote:On September 09 2025 23:20 Jankisa wrote:
Yeah Light, but Introvert will ignore all that even when it was mentioned to him explicitly in the last page, a few months ago, as it was happening because it doesn't fit his version of "reality".
He has alternative facts and his alternative facts don't care about your feelings. Owned, you liberal cuck!
These last 2 posts have made me more convinced then ever that he is just oBlade alt, like Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde but both guys are the same person. Nah, I don't think they're the same. Introvert just repeats mainstream far-right talking points and then has a meltdown when people aren't convinced. oBlade comes up with the most insane shit you've ever heard in your life on the spot, like tariffs are actually good because they reduce corporate waste. Remember when Introvert explained that Seig Heils were the way K-pop mega fans communicate their enthusiasm for K-pop at political rallies? I do.
For whatever it's worth the ADL had a similar opnion to mine. What is strange is how this K-pop add on you've been doing keeps changing? Unless I stopped reading closely at some point. I didn't say K-pop and I didn't say it was the fans. Always strange with you lol
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On September 10 2025 03:04 Introvert wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2025 23:53 WombaT wrote:On September 09 2025 23:31 Introvert wrote:On September 09 2025 23:12 LightSpectra wrote: They cheered for DACA, for student loan forgiveness, they were silent or totally in denial about Biden's dereliction of duty at the border. DACA doesn't break any laws, the law that regulates student loans explicitly allows for the POTUS to forgive some at his discretion, and Biden explicitly asked Congress for more resources to secure the border and Republicans told him to fuck off because they wouldn't win the election if they couldn't campaign on the border still being broken from Trump's administration. Once again, made-up Republican scandals with no relation to reality whatsoever are used to justify actual authoritarianism. Might as well say that sending in the national guard to violate posse comitatus is totally cool because Obama was going to do it with Jade Helm, even though that was proven multiple times to be a hoax. I've argued about all these things before in this thread so I won't rehash, but all of those things are wrong. I guess quickly your contention about the border is embarrassing considering it was in trouble long before the failed bill and there was no crisis before or after. So again, there are people on the left who will justify anything, and will do so again for whatever the next Democrat does. I mean sure, some will do that. Equally many, especially amongst the further left of the populace will happily admit that the Constitution is too rigid thru outright anachronistic to adequately deal with modern problems. Even aside from the sheer volume of Trump’s trampling, especially in his second term, its conservatives at large who couch so much of their rhetoric and beliefs in adherence to the Constitution, and things like states rights, far more so than the left does. Thus critiques can by themselves be certainly valid, but start to ring entirely hollow when conservatives give their own a pass to trample over their own ostensible sacred cows with much greater frequency. No amount of ‘but the Dems’ can entirely sidestep that. Well first the Trump era has led to a newfound *rhetorical* respect for the constitution by Dems. Second, MAGA is its own thing. But a lot of people take the view expressed in the tweet I linked a little earlier. They see it as tit-for-tat. Show nested quote +On September 10 2025 01:51 KwarK wrote:On September 09 2025 23:33 LightSpectra wrote:On September 09 2025 23:20 Jankisa wrote:
Yeah Light, but Introvert will ignore all that even when it was mentioned to him explicitly in the last page, a few months ago, as it was happening because it doesn't fit his version of "reality".
He has alternative facts and his alternative facts don't care about your feelings. Owned, you liberal cuck!
These last 2 posts have made me more convinced then ever that he is just oBlade alt, like Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde but both guys are the same person. Nah, I don't think they're the same. Introvert just repeats mainstream far-right talking points and then has a meltdown when people aren't convinced. oBlade comes up with the most insane shit you've ever heard in your life on the spot, like tariffs are actually good because they reduce corporate waste. Remember when Introvert explained that Seig Heils were the way K-pop mega fans communicate their enthusiasm for K-pop at political rallies? I do. For whatever it's worth the ADL had a similar opnion to mine. What is strange is how this K-pop add on you've been doing keeps changing? Unless I stopped reading closely at some point. I didn't say K-pop and I didn't say it was the fans. Always strange with you lol
I think you might be confusing the actual constitution with what the left is wanting: that the government uphold the humanist values that underpin it. And sure, the constitution is securely founded on Lockean principles, and I doubt many of us are Lockeans. But the values of a Lockean society and a government trying to uphold them would absolutely and undoubtedly be preferable to the cronyism and self-aggrandization that seems to be the singular focus of the executive branch at the moment, with neither the legislative nor judiciary branches doing much of anything to halt it. Locke, Madison, Jefferson and Hamilton are all spinning in their graves right now at the travesty that is the "republican" party selling out wholesale to someone who seems, by all accounts, far worse than King George was.
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Norway28682 Posts
On September 09 2025 23:57 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2025 23:37 Jankisa wrote:On September 09 2025 23:18 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:55 Jankisa wrote:On September 09 2025 21:50 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:46 LightSpectra wrote:On September 09 2025 21:38 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:15 Jankisa wrote:+ Show Spoiler +It's hilarious that all these guys have is "well, we are just doing what Fox news told us the left was doing all along".
It's insane power grabs justified by misinterpreted lies, and our resident intellectual right winger fascist boot licker Introvert is presenting it as some sort of a gotcha.
No democratic president has ever:
* used the office of the president to promote it's businesses or businesses of his buddies
* received insane bribes from foreign dignitaries such as golden fucking jets that will cost the US citizens a billion to take apart and check for bugs
* used tariffs as a means to enact personal vendettas against countries that refused to nominate him for Nobel peace prize
* sent troops to American (always blue) cities in a completely illegal manner even when explicitely refused by the governor of that state (can I get one hell yeah from the "states rights" crowd)
* used the office of the president to promote his Crypto meme coins or do very obvious market manipulation by tweeting shit and buying up the specific coins before doing so
* nominated people with incredibly obvious conflict of interest into positions in the DOJ (his personal lawyers) and had them conduct interviews with sex traffickers which (shockingly) exonerate them, only for the same DOJ to give the sex trafficker special treatment
* directed his agencies to pull permits from basically finished projects because he doesn't like windmills
And a million other things that are damaging not only to the US economy but it's world wide reputation. And all this guy has to say to all of this is "but democrats[/republicans]". Honestly pathetic. That one line is US politics in a nutshell. It's not like Democrats couldn't/wouldn't vote for the whole slate of Republican politicians currently in office (including Trump) out of principle. GH repeating another Republican talking point, color me surprised. It's a literal fact. Libs/Dems/ilk rejecting facts that they don't like, color me surprised... That is the difference between you and me, GH, I don't believe that, I know plenty of Americans, I don't think many Democrats would vote for Trump just because he had D next to his name. + Show Spoiler +You derided Democrats for campaigning with Liz Chaney and blamed their electoral failings (partially) on that, that is completely incompatible with what you just wrote.
The fact that you do think that Democrats=Republcians says a lot about you and your view of the world, and to me just shows, once again that you hate the USA and are basically a Tankie. + Show Spoiler +I like the USA, I would be a very different and in many ways less successful and culturally very different person if the USA didn't exist, I don't think you can slot China in the place of USA and have the world be as cool of a place as it is. All of us certainty wouldn't be posting on a TL forum (US company/team) that was created by and for fans of a game like Starcraft.
Unfortunately, Republicans and all conservatives want the USA to be more like China and Russia, most (not even close to all) Democrat politicians want it to be like Clinton's USA or Thatcher's UK.
USA, like most other countries contains multitudes, unfortunately, you guys have a duopoly in your politics, which is a double edged sword, on the one hand, this duopoly makes sure that the pendulum keeps swinging, on the other, it flattens the parties quite a bit, but nowhere close to what you are trying to present it as. I'm talking about "lesser evilists" (which is basically everyone here and the overwhelming majority of the Democrat party). They literally could/would vote for Trump and any other Republican. This isn't disputable. I literally don't think Democrats=Republicans, so that isn't a fact. Republicans, by pretty much any metric, are worse than Democrats. Try to integrate that information into your next assessment please. You make 2 false assertions right from the get go. You can't just say something and pretend like it's an accepted truth. I very much doubt the vast majority of regular posters here who actually have the right to vote in the USA would ever vote for Trump, so that is very much disputable. You might not "think" that, but you write and act in a way where everyone who reads you can come to the conclusion that you do. The burden of proof is on you, and all you do, including this latest screed is to prove us otherwise. + Show Spoiler +Normal people who haven't had their brain fried by politics to the point you have understand that the only way any of us can go through life without losing our minds is by choosing the lesser evil.
In the last 2 presidential elections in Croatia I bit my tongue and voted for a guy who I have a very low opinion of, mostly because from a Social Democrat he turned into a Trump cosplaying populist who seems to be on the take from Russia, but, he is smart, eloquent and shares most of my values, he also doesn't have a lot of power and he serves as a counterweight to our criminal organization party in power.
I could have purity tested him and said fuck this, encouraged most of my friends and family to do the same and split the vote or vote for our version of a Republican, but I didn't, because I choose the lesser evil.
That is an adult thing to do. And I'm OK with my choice, he's still an asshole to Ukraine, but he is the only part of our national voice who spends time criticizing Israel. You get some, you lose some, that's life. You weren't really around for when they were first rationalizing "lesser evilism" , so I don't blame you, but yeah, they would. That's how "lesser evilism", as they've articulated it, works. You can verify that with any one of them. It's objectively (and obviously) true that Republicans ≠ Democrats. I don't have to prove that to you, nor do I have to prove that I believe it to you or anyone else. That assertion is preposterous. Seems you shouldn't go "ignor[ing] all that even when it was mentioned to [you] explicitly in the last page..." and fixate on your "alternative facts" that "don't care about feelings..." while self-congratulating with a "Owned [tankie punk]!"
I mean if my options are a) Pol Pot b) 1943 Hitler c) Trump, I would indeed vote Trump. But not against any R or D candidate from the past 100 years.
If my options are a) Pol Pot and b) 1943 Hitler, I guess I might abstain.
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On September 10 2025 04:46 Liquid`Drone wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2025 23:57 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 23:37 Jankisa wrote:On September 09 2025 23:18 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:55 Jankisa wrote:On September 09 2025 21:50 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:46 LightSpectra wrote:On September 09 2025 21:38 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:15 Jankisa wrote:+ Show Spoiler +It's hilarious that all these guys have is "well, we are just doing what Fox news told us the left was doing all along".
It's insane power grabs justified by misinterpreted lies, and our resident intellectual right winger fascist boot licker Introvert is presenting it as some sort of a gotcha.
No democratic president has ever:
* used the office of the president to promote it's businesses or businesses of his buddies
* received insane bribes from foreign dignitaries such as golden fucking jets that will cost the US citizens a billion to take apart and check for bugs
* used tariffs as a means to enact personal vendettas against countries that refused to nominate him for Nobel peace prize
* sent troops to American (always blue) cities in a completely illegal manner even when explicitely refused by the governor of that state (can I get one hell yeah from the "states rights" crowd)
* used the office of the president to promote his Crypto meme coins or do very obvious market manipulation by tweeting shit and buying up the specific coins before doing so
* nominated people with incredibly obvious conflict of interest into positions in the DOJ (his personal lawyers) and had them conduct interviews with sex traffickers which (shockingly) exonerate them, only for the same DOJ to give the sex trafficker special treatment
* directed his agencies to pull permits from basically finished projects because he doesn't like windmills
And a million other things that are damaging not only to the US economy but it's world wide reputation. And all this guy has to say to all of this is "but democrats[/republicans]". Honestly pathetic. That one line is US politics in a nutshell. It's not like Democrats couldn't/wouldn't vote for the whole slate of Republican politicians currently in office (including Trump) out of principle. GH repeating another Republican talking point, color me surprised. It's a literal fact. Libs/Dems/ilk rejecting facts that they don't like, color me surprised... That is the difference between you and me, GH, I don't believe that, I know plenty of Americans, I don't think many Democrats would vote for Trump just because he had D next to his name. + Show Spoiler +You derided Democrats for campaigning with Liz Chaney and blamed their electoral failings (partially) on that, that is completely incompatible with what you just wrote.
The fact that you do think that Democrats=Republcians says a lot about you and your view of the world, and to me just shows, once again that you hate the USA and are basically a Tankie. + Show Spoiler +I like the USA, I would be a very different and in many ways less successful and culturally very different person if the USA didn't exist, I don't think you can slot China in the place of USA and have the world be as cool of a place as it is. All of us certainty wouldn't be posting on a TL forum (US company/team) that was created by and for fans of a game like Starcraft.
Unfortunately, Republicans and all conservatives want the USA to be more like China and Russia, most (not even close to all) Democrat politicians want it to be like Clinton's USA or Thatcher's UK.
USA, like most other countries contains multitudes, unfortunately, you guys have a duopoly in your politics, which is a double edged sword, on the one hand, this duopoly makes sure that the pendulum keeps swinging, on the other, it flattens the parties quite a bit, but nowhere close to what you are trying to present it as. I'm talking about "lesser evilists" (which is basically everyone here and the overwhelming majority of the Democrat party). They literally could/would vote for Trump and any other Republican. This isn't disputable. I literally don't think Democrats=Republicans, so that isn't a fact. Republicans, by pretty much any metric, are worse than Democrats. Try to integrate that information into your next assessment please. You make 2 false assertions right from the get go. You can't just say something and pretend like it's an accepted truth. I very much doubt the vast majority of regular posters here who actually have the right to vote in the USA would ever vote for Trump, so that is very much disputable. You might not "think" that, but you write and act in a way where everyone who reads you can come to the conclusion that you do. The burden of proof is on you, and all you do, including this latest screed is to prove us otherwise. + Show Spoiler +Normal people who haven't had their brain fried by politics to the point you have understand that the only way any of us can go through life without losing our minds is by choosing the lesser evil.
In the last 2 presidential elections in Croatia I bit my tongue and voted for a guy who I have a very low opinion of, mostly because from a Social Democrat he turned into a Trump cosplaying populist who seems to be on the take from Russia, but, he is smart, eloquent and shares most of my values, he also doesn't have a lot of power and he serves as a counterweight to our criminal organization party in power.
I could have purity tested him and said fuck this, encouraged most of my friends and family to do the same and split the vote or vote for our version of a Republican, but I didn't, because I choose the lesser evil.
That is an adult thing to do. And I'm OK with my choice, he's still an asshole to Ukraine, but he is the only part of our national voice who spends time criticizing Israel. You get some, you lose some, that's life. You weren't really around for when they were first rationalizing "lesser evilism" , so I don't blame you, but yeah, they would. That's how "lesser evilism", as they've articulated it, works. You can verify that with any one of them. It's objectively (and obviously) true that Republicans ≠ Democrats. I don't have to prove that to you, nor do I have to prove that I believe it to you or anyone else. That assertion is preposterous. Seems you shouldn't go "ignor[ing] all that even when it was mentioned to [you] explicitly in the last page..." and fixate on your "alternative facts" that "don't care about feelings..." while self-congratulating with a "Owned [tankie punk]!" I mean if my options are a) Pol Pot b) 1943 Hitler c) Trump, I would indeed vote Trump. But not against any R or D candidate from the past 100 years. If my options are a) Pol Pot and b) 1943 Hitler, I guess I might abstain.
You take that context and shove it where the sun don't shine! We don't need no stinkin' context in this thread! /s
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On September 10 2025 04:46 Liquid`Drone wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2025 23:57 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 23:37 Jankisa wrote:On September 09 2025 23:18 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:55 Jankisa wrote:On September 09 2025 21:50 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:46 LightSpectra wrote:On September 09 2025 21:38 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:15 Jankisa wrote:+ Show Spoiler +It's hilarious that all these guys have is "well, we are just doing what Fox news told us the left was doing all along".
It's insane power grabs justified by misinterpreted lies, and our resident intellectual right winger fascist boot licker Introvert is presenting it as some sort of a gotcha.
No democratic president has ever:
* used the office of the president to promote it's businesses or businesses of his buddies
* received insane bribes from foreign dignitaries such as golden fucking jets that will cost the US citizens a billion to take apart and check for bugs
* used tariffs as a means to enact personal vendettas against countries that refused to nominate him for Nobel peace prize
* sent troops to American (always blue) cities in a completely illegal manner even when explicitely refused by the governor of that state (can I get one hell yeah from the "states rights" crowd)
* used the office of the president to promote his Crypto meme coins or do very obvious market manipulation by tweeting shit and buying up the specific coins before doing so
* nominated people with incredibly obvious conflict of interest into positions in the DOJ (his personal lawyers) and had them conduct interviews with sex traffickers which (shockingly) exonerate them, only for the same DOJ to give the sex trafficker special treatment
* directed his agencies to pull permits from basically finished projects because he doesn't like windmills
And a million other things that are damaging not only to the US economy but it's world wide reputation. And all this guy has to say to all of this is "but democrats[/republicans]". Honestly pathetic. That one line is US politics in a nutshell. It's not like Democrats couldn't/wouldn't vote for the whole slate of Republican politicians currently in office (including Trump) out of principle. GH repeating another Republican talking point, color me surprised. It's a literal fact. Libs/Dems/ilk rejecting facts that they don't like, color me surprised... That is the difference between you and me, GH, I don't believe that, I know plenty of Americans, I don't think many Democrats would vote for Trump just because he had D next to his name. + Show Spoiler +You derided Democrats for campaigning with Liz Chaney and blamed their electoral failings (partially) on that, that is completely incompatible with what you just wrote.
The fact that you do think that Democrats=Republcians says a lot about you and your view of the world, and to me just shows, once again that you hate the USA and are basically a Tankie. + Show Spoiler +I like the USA, I would be a very different and in many ways less successful and culturally very different person if the USA didn't exist, I don't think you can slot China in the place of USA and have the world be as cool of a place as it is. All of us certainty wouldn't be posting on a TL forum (US company/team) that was created by and for fans of a game like Starcraft.
Unfortunately, Republicans and all conservatives want the USA to be more like China and Russia, most (not even close to all) Democrat politicians want it to be like Clinton's USA or Thatcher's UK.
USA, like most other countries contains multitudes, unfortunately, you guys have a duopoly in your politics, which is a double edged sword, on the one hand, this duopoly makes sure that the pendulum keeps swinging, on the other, it flattens the parties quite a bit, but nowhere close to what you are trying to present it as. I'm talking about "lesser evilists" (which is basically everyone here and the overwhelming majority of the Democrat party). They literally could/would vote for Trump and any other Republican. This isn't disputable. I literally don't think Democrats=Republicans, so that isn't a fact. Republicans, by pretty much any metric, are worse than Democrats. Try to integrate that information into your next assessment please. You make 2 false assertions right from the get go. You can't just say something and pretend like it's an accepted truth. I very much doubt the vast majority of regular posters here who actually have the right to vote in the USA would ever vote for Trump, so that is very much disputable. You might not "think" that, but you write and act in a way where everyone who reads you can come to the conclusion that you do. The burden of proof is on you, and all you do, including this latest screed is to prove us otherwise. + Show Spoiler +Normal people who haven't had their brain fried by politics to the point you have understand that the only way any of us can go through life without losing our minds is by choosing the lesser evil.
In the last 2 presidential elections in Croatia I bit my tongue and voted for a guy who I have a very low opinion of, mostly because from a Social Democrat he turned into a Trump cosplaying populist who seems to be on the take from Russia, but, he is smart, eloquent and shares most of my values, he also doesn't have a lot of power and he serves as a counterweight to our criminal organization party in power.
I could have purity tested him and said fuck this, encouraged most of my friends and family to do the same and split the vote or vote for our version of a Republican, but I didn't, because I choose the lesser evil.
That is an adult thing to do. And I'm OK with my choice, he's still an asshole to Ukraine, but he is the only part of our national voice who spends time criticizing Israel. You get some, you lose some, that's life. You weren't really around for when they were first rationalizing "lesser evilism" , so I don't blame you, but yeah, they would. That's how "lesser evilism", as they've articulated it, works. You can verify that with any one of them. It's objectively (and obviously) true that Republicans ≠ Democrats. I don't have to prove that to you, nor do I have to prove that I believe it to you or anyone else. That assertion is preposterous. Seems you shouldn't go "ignor[ing] all that even when it was mentioned to [you] explicitly in the last page..." and fixate on your "alternative facts" that "don't care about feelings..." while self-congratulating with a "Owned [tankie punk]!" I mean if my options are a) Pol Pot b) 1943 Hitler c) Trump, I would indeed vote Trump. But not against any R or D candidate from the past 100 years. If my options are a) Pol Pot and b) 1943 Hitler, I guess I might abstain.
This does basically says exactly what GH said though (even though you arent american) you would vote for every Republican out of principle, based on what youve said here your principles on when to not vote for someone are somewhere between Trump and Hitler/Pol Pot and if Trump isnt close enough to Hitler/Pol Pot to prevent you from voting for him then the rest of the GOP probably aren't either.
I dont strictly grasp what point GH is making here, but this is the sort of response that I think hes referring to in his post.
Its not like this conversation hasnt been had here before either, its literally true that plenty of people here have said that they would vote for whoever is the lesser of two evils in basically any and every instance which means they would, out of that lesser of two evils principle, be willing to vote for Hitler, Pol Pot, Trump, every GOP scumbag etc.
What GH means to show by highlighting this sentiment Im too tired to glean, but from what I can see his post seems fairly correct, if over broad if taken out of the context of this thread.
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United States42887 Posts
On September 10 2025 03:04 Introvert wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2025 23:53 WombaT wrote:On September 09 2025 23:31 Introvert wrote:On September 09 2025 23:12 LightSpectra wrote: They cheered for DACA, for student loan forgiveness, they were silent or totally in denial about Biden's dereliction of duty at the border. DACA doesn't break any laws, the law that regulates student loans explicitly allows for the POTUS to forgive some at his discretion, and Biden explicitly asked Congress for more resources to secure the border and Republicans told him to fuck off because they wouldn't win the election if they couldn't campaign on the border still being broken from Trump's administration. Once again, made-up Republican scandals with no relation to reality whatsoever are used to justify actual authoritarianism. Might as well say that sending in the national guard to violate posse comitatus is totally cool because Obama was going to do it with Jade Helm, even though that was proven multiple times to be a hoax. I've argued about all these things before in this thread so I won't rehash, but all of those things are wrong. I guess quickly your contention about the border is embarrassing considering it was in trouble long before the failed bill and there was no crisis before or after. So again, there are people on the left who will justify anything, and will do so again for whatever the next Democrat does. I mean sure, some will do that. Equally many, especially amongst the further left of the populace will happily admit that the Constitution is too rigid thru outright anachronistic to adequately deal with modern problems. Even aside from the sheer volume of Trump’s trampling, especially in his second term, its conservatives at large who couch so much of their rhetoric and beliefs in adherence to the Constitution, and things like states rights, far more so than the left does. Thus critiques can by themselves be certainly valid, but start to ring entirely hollow when conservatives give their own a pass to trample over their own ostensible sacred cows with much greater frequency. No amount of ‘but the Dems’ can entirely sidestep that. Well first the Trump era has led to a newfound *rhetorical* respect for the constitution by Dems. Second, MAGA is its own thing. But a lot of people take the view expressed in the tweet I linked a little earlier. They see it as tit-for-tat. Show nested quote +On September 10 2025 01:51 KwarK wrote:On September 09 2025 23:33 LightSpectra wrote:On September 09 2025 23:20 Jankisa wrote:
Yeah Light, but Introvert will ignore all that even when it was mentioned to him explicitly in the last page, a few months ago, as it was happening because it doesn't fit his version of "reality".
He has alternative facts and his alternative facts don't care about your feelings. Owned, you liberal cuck!
These last 2 posts have made me more convinced then ever that he is just oBlade alt, like Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde but both guys are the same person. Nah, I don't think they're the same. Introvert just repeats mainstream far-right talking points and then has a meltdown when people aren't convinced. oBlade comes up with the most insane shit you've ever heard in your life on the spot, like tariffs are actually good because they reduce corporate waste. Remember when Introvert explained that Seig Heils were the way K-pop mega fans communicate their enthusiasm for K-pop at political rallies? I do. For whatever it's worth the ADL had a similar opnion to mine. What is strange is how this K-pop add on you've been doing keeps changing? Unless I stopped reading closely at some point. I didn't say K-pop and I didn't say it was the fans. Always strange with you lol
You are more than welcome to clarify which genre of music is the appropriate kind for doing straight arm outstretched at 45 degrees above the plane with flat downward facing palm salutes. Keeping in mind that it’s being done by a political activist at a right wing political rally and not a music festival.
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Norway28682 Posts
On September 10 2025 05:03 Zambrah wrote:Show nested quote +On September 10 2025 04:46 Liquid`Drone wrote:On September 09 2025 23:57 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 23:37 Jankisa wrote:On September 09 2025 23:18 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:55 Jankisa wrote:On September 09 2025 21:50 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:46 LightSpectra wrote:On September 09 2025 21:38 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:15 Jankisa wrote:+ Show Spoiler +It's hilarious that all these guys have is "well, we are just doing what Fox news told us the left was doing all along".
It's insane power grabs justified by misinterpreted lies, and our resident intellectual right winger fascist boot licker Introvert is presenting it as some sort of a gotcha.
No democratic president has ever:
* used the office of the president to promote it's businesses or businesses of his buddies
* received insane bribes from foreign dignitaries such as golden fucking jets that will cost the US citizens a billion to take apart and check for bugs
* used tariffs as a means to enact personal vendettas against countries that refused to nominate him for Nobel peace prize
* sent troops to American (always blue) cities in a completely illegal manner even when explicitely refused by the governor of that state (can I get one hell yeah from the "states rights" crowd)
* used the office of the president to promote his Crypto meme coins or do very obvious market manipulation by tweeting shit and buying up the specific coins before doing so
* nominated people with incredibly obvious conflict of interest into positions in the DOJ (his personal lawyers) and had them conduct interviews with sex traffickers which (shockingly) exonerate them, only for the same DOJ to give the sex trafficker special treatment
* directed his agencies to pull permits from basically finished projects because he doesn't like windmills
And a million other things that are damaging not only to the US economy but it's world wide reputation. And all this guy has to say to all of this is "but democrats[/republicans]". Honestly pathetic. That one line is US politics in a nutshell. It's not like Democrats couldn't/wouldn't vote for the whole slate of Republican politicians currently in office (including Trump) out of principle. GH repeating another Republican talking point, color me surprised. It's a literal fact. Libs/Dems/ilk rejecting facts that they don't like, color me surprised... That is the difference between you and me, GH, I don't believe that, I know plenty of Americans, I don't think many Democrats would vote for Trump just because he had D next to his name. + Show Spoiler +You derided Democrats for campaigning with Liz Chaney and blamed their electoral failings (partially) on that, that is completely incompatible with what you just wrote.
The fact that you do think that Democrats=Republcians says a lot about you and your view of the world, and to me just shows, once again that you hate the USA and are basically a Tankie. + Show Spoiler +I like the USA, I would be a very different and in many ways less successful and culturally very different person if the USA didn't exist, I don't think you can slot China in the place of USA and have the world be as cool of a place as it is. All of us certainty wouldn't be posting on a TL forum (US company/team) that was created by and for fans of a game like Starcraft.
Unfortunately, Republicans and all conservatives want the USA to be more like China and Russia, most (not even close to all) Democrat politicians want it to be like Clinton's USA or Thatcher's UK.
USA, like most other countries contains multitudes, unfortunately, you guys have a duopoly in your politics, which is a double edged sword, on the one hand, this duopoly makes sure that the pendulum keeps swinging, on the other, it flattens the parties quite a bit, but nowhere close to what you are trying to present it as. I'm talking about "lesser evilists" (which is basically everyone here and the overwhelming majority of the Democrat party). They literally could/would vote for Trump and any other Republican. This isn't disputable. I literally don't think Democrats=Republicans, so that isn't a fact. Republicans, by pretty much any metric, are worse than Democrats. Try to integrate that information into your next assessment please. You make 2 false assertions right from the get go. You can't just say something and pretend like it's an accepted truth. I very much doubt the vast majority of regular posters here who actually have the right to vote in the USA would ever vote for Trump, so that is very much disputable. You might not "think" that, but you write and act in a way where everyone who reads you can come to the conclusion that you do. The burden of proof is on you, and all you do, including this latest screed is to prove us otherwise. + Show Spoiler +Normal people who haven't had their brain fried by politics to the point you have understand that the only way any of us can go through life without losing our minds is by choosing the lesser evil.
In the last 2 presidential elections in Croatia I bit my tongue and voted for a guy who I have a very low opinion of, mostly because from a Social Democrat he turned into a Trump cosplaying populist who seems to be on the take from Russia, but, he is smart, eloquent and shares most of my values, he also doesn't have a lot of power and he serves as a counterweight to our criminal organization party in power.
I could have purity tested him and said fuck this, encouraged most of my friends and family to do the same and split the vote or vote for our version of a Republican, but I didn't, because I choose the lesser evil.
That is an adult thing to do. And I'm OK with my choice, he's still an asshole to Ukraine, but he is the only part of our national voice who spends time criticizing Israel. You get some, you lose some, that's life. You weren't really around for when they were first rationalizing "lesser evilism" , so I don't blame you, but yeah, they would. That's how "lesser evilism", as they've articulated it, works. You can verify that with any one of them. It's objectively (and obviously) true that Republicans ≠ Democrats. I don't have to prove that to you, nor do I have to prove that I believe it to you or anyone else. That assertion is preposterous. Seems you shouldn't go "ignor[ing] all that even when it was mentioned to [you] explicitly in the last page..." and fixate on your "alternative facts" that "don't care about feelings..." while self-congratulating with a "Owned [tankie punk]!" I mean if my options are a) Pol Pot b) 1943 Hitler c) Trump, I would indeed vote Trump. But not against any R or D candidate from the past 100 years. If my options are a) Pol Pot and b) 1943 Hitler, I guess I might abstain. This does basically says exactly what GH said though (even though you arent american) you would vote for every Republican out of principle, based on what youve said here your principles on when to not vote for someone are somewhere between Trump and Hitler/Pol Pot and if Trump isnt close enough to Hitler/Pol Pot to prevent you from voting for him then the rest of the GOP probably aren't either. I dont strictly grasp what point GH is making here, but this is the sort of response that I think hes referring to in his post. Its not like this conversation hasnt been had here before either, its literally true that plenty of people here have said that they would vote for whoever is the lesser of two evils in basically any and every instance which means they would, out of that lesser of two evils principle, be willing to vote for Hitler, Pol Pot, Trump, every GOP scumbag etc. What GH means to show by highlighting this sentiment Im too tired to glean, but from what I can see his post seems fairly correct, if over broad if taken out of the context of this thread.
Yeah I'm not saying GH is incorrect in stating that people here could potentially vote for Trump if he was perceived as the lesser of two evils. I'm saying that's the reasonable thing to do if you're presented with a significantly worse alternative - even if getting there requires me to look at the absolute worst we've ever seen.
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On September 10 2025 04:46 Liquid`Drone wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2025 23:57 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 23:37 Jankisa wrote:On September 09 2025 23:18 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:55 Jankisa wrote:On September 09 2025 21:50 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:46 LightSpectra wrote:On September 09 2025 21:38 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 09 2025 21:15 Jankisa wrote:+ Show Spoiler +It's hilarious that all these guys have is "well, we are just doing what Fox news told us the left was doing all along".
It's insane power grabs justified by misinterpreted lies, and our resident intellectual right winger fascist boot licker Introvert is presenting it as some sort of a gotcha.
No democratic president has ever:
* used the office of the president to promote it's businesses or businesses of his buddies
* received insane bribes from foreign dignitaries such as golden fucking jets that will cost the US citizens a billion to take apart and check for bugs
* used tariffs as a means to enact personal vendettas against countries that refused to nominate him for Nobel peace prize
* sent troops to American (always blue) cities in a completely illegal manner even when explicitely refused by the governor of that state (can I get one hell yeah from the "states rights" crowd)
* used the office of the president to promote his Crypto meme coins or do very obvious market manipulation by tweeting shit and buying up the specific coins before doing so
* nominated people with incredibly obvious conflict of interest into positions in the DOJ (his personal lawyers) and had them conduct interviews with sex traffickers which (shockingly) exonerate them, only for the same DOJ to give the sex trafficker special treatment
* directed his agencies to pull permits from basically finished projects because he doesn't like windmills
And a million other things that are damaging not only to the US economy but it's world wide reputation. And all this guy has to say to all of this is "but democrats[/republicans]". Honestly pathetic. That one line is US politics in a nutshell. It's not like Democrats couldn't/wouldn't vote for the whole slate of Republican politicians currently in office (including Trump) out of principle. GH repeating another Republican talking point, color me surprised. It's a literal fact. Libs/Dems/ilk rejecting facts that they don't like, color me surprised... That is the difference between you and me, GH, I don't believe that, I know plenty of Americans, I don't think many Democrats would vote for Trump just because he had D next to his name. + Show Spoiler +You derided Democrats for campaigning with Liz Chaney and blamed their electoral failings (partially) on that, that is completely incompatible with what you just wrote.
The fact that you do think that Democrats=Republcians says a lot about you and your view of the world, and to me just shows, once again that you hate the USA and are basically a Tankie. + Show Spoiler +I like the USA, I would be a very different and in many ways less successful and culturally very different person if the USA didn't exist, I don't think you can slot China in the place of USA and have the world be as cool of a place as it is. All of us certainty wouldn't be posting on a TL forum (US company/team) that was created by and for fans of a game like Starcraft.
Unfortunately, Republicans and all conservatives want the USA to be more like China and Russia, most (not even close to all) Democrat politicians want it to be like Clinton's USA or Thatcher's UK.
USA, like most other countries contains multitudes, unfortunately, you guys have a duopoly in your politics, which is a double edged sword, on the one hand, this duopoly makes sure that the pendulum keeps swinging, on the other, it flattens the parties quite a bit, but nowhere close to what you are trying to present it as. I'm talking about "lesser evilists" (which is basically everyone here and the overwhelming majority of the Democrat party). They literally could/would vote for Trump and any other Republican. This isn't disputable. I literally don't think Democrats=Republicans, so that isn't a fact. Republicans, by pretty much any metric, are worse than Democrats. Try to integrate that information into your next assessment please. You make 2 false assertions right from the get go. You can't just say something and pretend like it's an accepted truth. I very much doubt the vast majority of regular posters here who actually have the right to vote in the USA would ever vote for Trump, so that is very much disputable. You might not "think" that, but you write and act in a way where everyone who reads you can come to the conclusion that you do. The burden of proof is on you, and all you do, including this latest screed is to prove us otherwise. + Show Spoiler +Normal people who haven't had their brain fried by politics to the point you have understand that the only way any of us can go through life without losing our minds is by choosing the lesser evil.
In the last 2 presidential elections in Croatia I bit my tongue and voted for a guy who I have a very low opinion of, mostly because from a Social Democrat he turned into a Trump cosplaying populist who seems to be on the take from Russia, but, he is smart, eloquent and shares most of my values, he also doesn't have a lot of power and he serves as a counterweight to our criminal organization party in power.
I could have purity tested him and said fuck this, encouraged most of my friends and family to do the same and split the vote or vote for our version of a Republican, but I didn't, because I choose the lesser evil.
That is an adult thing to do. And I'm OK with my choice, he's still an asshole to Ukraine, but he is the only part of our national voice who spends time criticizing Israel. You get some, you lose some, that's life. You weren't really around for when they were first rationalizing "lesser evilism" , so I don't blame you, but yeah, they would. That's how "lesser evilism", as they've articulated it, works. You can verify that with any one of them. It's objectively (and obviously) true that Republicans ≠ Democrats. I don't have to prove that to you, nor do I have to prove that I believe it to you or anyone else. That assertion is preposterous. Seems you shouldn't go "ignor[ing] all that even when it was mentioned to [you] explicitly in the last page..." and fixate on your "alternative facts" that "don't care about feelings..." while self-congratulating with a "Owned [tankie punk]!" I mean if my options are a) Pol Pot b) 1943 Hitler c) Trump, I would indeed vote Trump. But not against any R or D candidate from the past 100 years. If my options are a) Pol Pot and b) 1943 Hitler, I guess I might abstain.
What if you can‘t abstain because there‘s soldiers with machineguns outside the booth checking what you vote for ?
That‘s more or less what European leaders must be dealing with at the moment when it comes to calibrating their US-Russia relationships.
And they chose the US before it decided to tariff them anyway.
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EPT
