US Politics Mega-thread - Page 2480

Administration officials are planning to intensify what they hope is a sharper, and less conflicting, message of the pandemic next week, according to senior administration officials, after struggling to offer clear directives amid a crippling surge in cases across the country. On Thursday, the United States reported more than 55,000 new cases of coronavirus and infection rates were hitting new records in multiple states.

At the crux of the message, officials said, is a recognition by the White House that the virus is not going away any time soon — and will be around
through the November election.

As a result, President Donald Trump's top advisers plan to argue, the country must figure out how to press forward despite it. Therapeutic drugs will be showcased as a key component for doing that and the White House will increasingly emphasize the relatively low risk most Americans have of dying from the virus, officials said.

Officials also plan to emphasize high survival rates, particularly for Americans who are within certain age groups and don't have underlying conditions. The overall death rate from COVID-19 in the U.S. has been on the decline. More than 130,000 Americans have died of the virus.

On July 04 2020 10:55 LegalLord wrote:
and even traditionally red states like Arizona and Texas are starting to pull back on their original "coronavirus is a lie" stance.

On July 04 2020 09:28 GreenHorizons wrote:
Trump supporters screaming "go home" at Sioux/Lakota people protesting at 'Mount Rushmore' is so 2020 I can barely handle it.

On July 04 2020 09:28 GreenHorizons wrote:
Trump supporters screaming "go home" at Sioux/Lakota people protesting at 'Mount Rushmore' is so 2020 I can barely handle it.

On July 04 2020 17:01 Simberto wrote:


Really reminds me of this xkcd comic from ages ago. But back then, i saw it as a totally absurd thing. Nowadays it is just "sure, of course they say that". I guess my view of the american population has really deteriorated.

On July 04 2020 17:40 Simberto wrote:
Yes, that is what i wanted to say with that. Not necessarily that the american people have changed, but instead that my view of them has shifted. Basically if i didn't have any info, i assumed that they are decent, intelligent and compassionate. The more information i get, the more this perception crumbles.

On July 04 2020 17:53 Biff The Understudy wrote:

Well it's a big country with plenty of room for intelligent and compassionate people, as well as for hateful or ignorant ones. I don't think Trump base is a very representative segment, and if you were to take Marine Le Pen's base in France or Nigel Farage's base in England, you would get more or less the same result.

But if anything, people will be people, and to lamente over human awfulness is not very productive. The question is what in the fabric of American society generates such hatred or such fear. I guess there are plenty of answers, some obvious, some less so.

On July 04 2020 18:24 Gorsameth wrote:
How can they not be representative when they are numerous enough to vote in a majority of representatives?
(and yes I know, gerrymandering ect, but still, they are not a small minority)

Unlike France where 66% of the country said "hell no" to Le Pen. In the US that would have been one of the biggest landslide histories ever.

You know, to just be grossly generalistic, you could put half of Trump's supporters into what I call the basket of deplorables. They're racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic – Islamophobic – you name it. And unfortunately, there are people like that. And he has lifted them up. He has given voice to their websites that used to only have 11,000 people – now have 11 million. He tweets and retweets their offensive hateful mean-spirited rhetoric. Now, some of those folks – they are irredeemable, but thankfully, they are not America.

But the "other" basket – the other basket – and I know because I look at this crowd I see friends from all over America here: I see friends from Florida and Georgia and South Carolina and Texas and — as well as, you know, New York and California — but that "other" basket of people are people who feel the government has let them down, the economy has let them down, nobody cares about them, nobody worries about what happens to their lives and their futures; and they're just desperate for change. It doesn't really even matter where it comes from. They don't buy everything he says, but — he seems to hold out some hope that their lives will be different. They won't wake up and see their jobs disappear, lose a kid to heroin, feel like they're in a dead-end. Those are people we have to understand and empathize with as well.

On July 04 2020 19:51 Biff The Understudy wrote:

Yes, and I would agree the US is a much more broken society than the French one, for all its disfunctionalities.

Than being said, I don't think that most Trump voters would join the ones chanting "Lock her up" and "Go back home". I am not into giving excuses to people for voting for awful leaders, but you have to remember that a big portion of the people that elected him are not very enthusiastic about his shenanigans and his inflammatory bs.

In that respect, I would like to quote a great political scientist (/irony) that did put it better than I could:


So to use Hillary Clinton's terminology, when we talk about Trump base, we talk about people who enthusiastically endorse what he does and say, the "basket of deplorables".

Because the context is so different, I think that in France, to vote for Le Pen is a much more radical gesture than in the US it is to vote for Trump. And what we would call her "base", the hardcore ones that totally agree with her fascist and racist ideology are much greater proportion among the people who vote for her than it is the case with Trump.

but you have to remember that a big portion of the people that elected him are not very enthusiastic about his shenanigans and his inflammatory bs.

On July 04 2020 09:46 Nevuk wrote:
So, this seems like an idiotically bad strategy to me. Trump's team is going to roll out a new message for handling covid : "Learn to live with it". The top line take away sounds bad, but the details are worse.

Basically, lockdowns must end because they realize what it would do their election chances to have another 20 million unemployed in October, even though we're seeing massive spikes in a lot of places.

This is according to NBC news.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/we-need-live-it-white-house-readies-new-message-nation-n1232884


High level summary -


I found this section particularly amusing, in a macabre way -

Play up how only the elderly are going to die, in the middle of an election season. This is just bad politics, rather than bad policy, at least.



They're also worried if they can get Trump to stay on message, but that's not new.

Texas Lt. Governor: Old People Should Volunteer to Die to Save the Economy

On July 04 2020 20:36 Nouar wrote:


What do you expect when you see this openly stated by a vice-governor ?


https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/03/dan-patrick-coronavirus-grandparents

On July 04 2020 20:36 Nouar wrote:


What do you expect when you see this openly stated by a vice-governor ?


https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/03/dan-patrick-coronavirus-grandparents




To be realistic though, since they horribly failed at containing it in the initial phase, the only way I see now is, in fact, to re-open while taking the appropriate protection measures you can, to delay a maximum until at least an effective treatment is found. It's nearly unfeasable to RE-shut everything down for 2 months, since there is no guarantee it would even work, since it didn't the first time.
This is due to a lot of different issues, among them a large amount of anti-mask idiots, governors not being able to work together across the US etc.
The death rates are not horrific currently, and hospitals are not yet overwhelmed, so maybe there is a chance things can just keep going for 6/8months without becoming too horrendous...

What we have here with masks compulsory in every indoor space, gel at the entrance of every shop, and masks/social distanciation at work, seems to be sufficient in keeping things low, so if properly applied in the US, could be enough to not aggravate things ? If they can even do it.

This is totally a failure on the republicans side though, I don't believe there is even any question about that. They own it.