I've read everything in this thread twice now over the last 2 days. I thought I'd edit/post this to summarize what I'm getting from this thread, and also, for some closure and maybe something that may be nice to read. If you don't like this for whatever reason, you can "don't judge me, LOVE ME!!!!" (glaex)
So there's like, this separation between physiological depression and social depression. Physiological depression is pretty much very serious and is like manic bipolar stuff which really requires a pill and professional attention. social depression, aka, contant blues is less pressing and can be treated through modifying my lifestyle.
I think/hope it's social depression/blues, albiet maybe something I should look into tackling since it's having a negative impact that's preventing me from doing things. This is based on the fact th... hahaha, the first topic under GENERAL is "i hate condoms." hahah! i'm gotta read that after this. uhm, NEways. This is based on the fact that I think this is somewhat under my control. If behavioral changes don't help me out, I'll go ahead and talk to a doctor.
1) I should set up a schedule that I follow. The closest thing that I have to this right now is my planner, but somedays when I have less work, my "habit" falls apart. I'll try forcing myself to go to sleep around 8-9ish and wake up 7ish every day. I'll try to get a set procedure for everything I do. My food supply is getting kinda low but that's ok. I've promised friends like, billions of times go drive to chinatown to shop and i keep not following through. I should organize my living space too.
2) exercise more regularly. I exercise, but i should set up a time to do it regularly. I think waking up at 7 to train with a friend will be kinda fun and he's been bugging me to do it. i'll try 2-3 times a week for 1-2 hours every morning should help me get on the right foot. I'll eat my supplements again. I stopped a year ago, i dunno why. It shoudl help maybe.
3) Get social support. GF would be great, and it might end up leading to there. I feel like most of the guy friends I know are boarish. GIRL = grinning in real life. right now, have a lot of girl "space" friends who maybe i can just keep in teh "friend" zone so they don't feel weirded out when they're giving me pep talks. My training partner though (guy) is pretty cool. Youth group people are awesome so I'll talk to them more. ^_^. Yup, there are a lot of studys correlating social support to good life and longer life and stuff. I think there should be at least a bit of causal in there.
4) If this stuff doesnt help me feel better in a few months, I'll talk to a doctor. ^_^
For the stuff mentioned about getting a definate purpose in life for better motivation, I've done that. Besides when I'm feeling down, most people who know me would say I have my act extremely together. I think one of the reasons why I get bad sometimes is because the goal I've set for myself in life is pretty close along the hard/impossible border. Granted that's the zone where I want to be, so the issue is just approaching it better without getting all upset and wanting to just give up.
So NEways, glaex "don't judge me, LOVE ME!!!!", your post is wonderful, it really made my lol though I'm in the library so tried not to too much. I'm happy for each of your posts. Travis did PM me to MSN him, and a lot of other people PMed me too all of whom I love now (not in a creepy way).
Hi everyone. Mani, feel free to delete this post if you so feel. I feel like there isn't anyone I can talk to so I'm posting this the only place where I know people might read it and maybe help ^_^;. People in classes aren't close friends. People I do extracurricular work with are extremely status and image focused; not really an option to talk about a topic like this w/ them.
I have serious bouts of depression. 1-2 times a week. Basically, I oscillate between really angry/frustrated or really really sad. I can't get myself to get up or do anything. When I'm fine, I'm extremely productive, but when I get into the bad mood, I wont do anything and don't feel like sleeping or studying or hanging out with people or anything.
I've talked to doctors, but they just suggest taking some stupid pill which first, is expensive, and secondly, I don't want to be on a pill for the rest of my life. That's not how I want to live. I get exercise fine. My GPA is relaly good. My extracurriculars are a bit on the risky/dreamer projects side, but no admission officers or anyone for that matter will bemoan me for that.
I've been sitting in front of the comp reading reddit.com and tlnet for about 5 hours now. it's 5am. I have class at 7pm. Good thing i finished my homework earlier because if I didn't, I wouldn't have done it =P. I broke my cell phone again. Just had a bout of rage, dunno where it came from. threw it agains the wall (it was closed) broke it into 5 pieces. I can't find the 5th piece. My room is kinda torn up too.
If I keep on going like this, I'm going to do something rash eventually, I know it. I've already done some stupid things, but I think, unless I get this worked out, I'm gonna end up dropping out of college, or just disappearing from everyone (again), or maybe worse.
I'm writing here because you people might know where I'm coming from. Has anyone here had seriously, like, issues like this, and what did you do to help make it better? I don't want prescriptions or shit like that. I'm fucking broke as it is and I don't want my parents dishing out any more money. I just... dunno. Maybe there's something obvious that I'm missing. ^____^;; if you are still reading, I hope you'll reply and help out a brother in need. hehe
you may have a chemical imbalance. try the pill. it really works for some people. insurance should help, if not, talk to your doctor, he can certainly help with samples and stuff. good luck
I'm looking at this youtube video. . does anyone know the song at the end? man, i really want to learn it on the piano and sing it for a girl someday. hahaha XD.
btw. I really don't want to do anything involving a pill, at least not until I exaust every other alternative first. they're expensive and i don't want my parents to know, and i don't have a job either. many thanks !!! Travis you're awesome! ^_^ <3
edit: not the "always on your side". at the end, there's another song something like "rain rain go away... etc. special version."
It might be the weather too. Some people's mood according to the weather and the seasons. And everyone goes through the same phase in life when they feel they are just living and are depressed. Try to find things that make you happy. Like hobbies and stuff or try new things out like sports or a club or learn an instrument. Will get your mind off.
Too bad travis responded privatly becaus eI would had been interested as this really is pretty much my case too.
lllcodelll what helps me very much is to get the basic right. You need to have the basic routines ok before you can get better. Do a list of your basic activities and set up some sort of ritual out of it. In the morning, get up, get a shower, shave, make your bed, clean the room. Eat a good breakfast, have a fixed wake up time. If you go to sleep too late then wake up ealier until you start to feel sleepy at night. When your alarm clock rings, jump right out of bed. Dont go first to your computer check teamliquid.
Basicly after doing all this you will start feeling better about yourself and you will think more clearly and you will feel like you have more time on your hands.
Then you should keep it up. After one week start adding stuff to your program, like go run 30 min each day (always fixed time). Get new clothes, add one night in the week you will go out in bar (try friday, its cool)
Also before starting this make a biiiiig cleanup of you room, dishes etc.
To make you feel even less bored, when you go shopping, make a rule you dont buy any ready made food and you dont buy the same food you have already bough on that week.
Some easy changes to make and you will get more color to your life and a healthy background!
i once spent many hours helping this girl out with her depression i'd always call and make sure she felt better, one day i had severe depression and i asked for her help but she said she was too busy and again she fucked me off the next day. ever since then i will take revenge on the world, nah not really but i realised if you're naturally depressed over such simple things just take a good long look at yourself and picture someone in a worse scenario like a gosu guy playing a noob with heaps of obs only to lose embarassingly to a 4pool etc.. O:
I liked 0x64 post Having a stable day is good. Also i dont know if you have, but get a girlfriend can help too. It's nice because then you have someone you can talk too about evrything instead of your parents for example. The best thing really ( atleast i think so) is too have friends and people who care about you around you. And i mean real friends then.. not just people you sit with in class. But people you can talk to about your problems. But if you feel you dont have any real friends then you need to get up and out.Try new things, diffrent sports, get invovled in school activeties, go out in town. Try to be with people as much as you can. And getting a job can also help.. takes your mind off the things that troubles you, and you meet new people at work. But ofc this may not apply to evryone. I dont think taking pills will help you.. You need people around you that care about you and want to help.
I have had some girlfriends in the past that had serious problems with depression and other things that made them very sad sometimes. And i think that they emerged stronger because i was there for them during these periodes. And belive me it was some very fucked up shit. And i think it really helped ..atleast sometimes that they could talk to me about their problems.
man u are really fucked up. you need some faith, so your life will not be "pointless" you may join the church or go back china as a english teacher, that will help you.
I have a friend who is really depressed. She has to take anti-depressants. I personally think it's a load of crap, since depression is non-existant in Korea. I think it's just a social thing. (Of course, I never tell her this).
The thing is, many friends get depressed (along with me) because of the sheer difficulty of school: studying hard, exams, getting bad scores. I always cook for my friends after a hard week so that we can hang out and be happy.
But this particular friend with her chronic depression.... she does not like such things. When I see friends trudging along, I usually bump into them and cheer them up, making them smile even when they don't want to. But this friend tells me to leave her alone, because it frustrates her to be laughing when she's sad. Since she gets really angry if I persist, I have to back off.
The difference between her and non-depressed friends is that she wants to be alone and marinate in her sadness. If I get depressed, I try to get out and exercise so my mind and body is distracted. However, if I stay inside and alone, my sadness just grows.
That's why depression is so large in the US. The US alone has the most "clinically depressed" people in the world.
You just need friends to rely on. People you can talk to and hang out with to make you feel better. Don't go to a mental health clinic. Talking to some stranger about your problems is ridiculous.
On October 24 2006 06:32 Way wrote: is it your looks maybe :\? not being mean just wondering if that's a factor, because ugly/fat people tend to have low self-esteem
if it is... plastic surgery is out of the question, but look on the bright side :-o... i ll get back to you in a bit
Really to me ugly/fat people tend to have higher self-esteem cause they realize looks isnt everything.
edit. and i usually think church wouldn't help depression. It might even make you more.
This isn't really advice, but here's how it went for me... I had people I would hang with at school but no real friends (I'd never even been to their houses or even talked to them on the phone). I was picked on at school by pretty much everyone and then demoralized at home my asshole (ex navy drill sgt) stepdad. My mother was utterly incompitent as a parent and my father lived far away until he died of a drug overdose when I was 13. I was pretty much either frustrated or crushingly depressed all the time. Sometimes I'd punch holes in the walls untill I broke my hand punching the front door, I went to juvi for vandalizing/theft, and sometimes would slowly walk across busy streets at night dressed in black just to see if the cars get out of my way as well as other stupid shit. Pretty much I thought my life was miserable in every way and didn't want to live.
This went on from when I my best friend moved away in the 5th grade (however old that is) until I discovered weed at 12-13 or so. I had no friends and no1 liked me so I got horribly ripped off the first few times buying, but it was worth it. I never really liked getting blazed out of my mind, but when I was feeling down I'd smoke a tiny bit of weed, like half a hit or so, and that would distract me enough from my own frustration/misery enough to do homework/fall asleep/eat. As an added bonus I would feel a bit numb/out of it the next day. I know you're against pills/drugs, but looking back this may have saved my life. Of course prescribed meds avoids some of the downsides such as legal remifications etc. Antidepressants may have been a better option, dunno never tried them, but at that time I wouldn't consider them because of pride and because weed seemed so much "cooler" and because I didn't want anyone to know how pathetic my life was
Then I met a girl who changed my life. Her life was so much worse than mine, and yet she cared about other people and had this great(horribly twisted) sense of humor. And when I say her life was worse than mine I mean she: cut herself, didn't know who her father was, adopted at age 5, was molested by only dad she knew, mom found out and ended up in an asylum after breakdown, etc. I listed to her problems which no1 else could handle (her best friend stopped talking to her after she told him what had happened) and she helped my self esteem in a big way (having a cute popular girl pay attention and be nice to you is huge when your a total geek and have no friends). My problems didn't seem so big compared to hers and just the act of being there for someone else also helped me feel like I was doing something that mattered.
Over the next few years my depression faded away completely and I was truly happy for the first time in my life. Of course the relationship ended up failing, and I became depressed again, but having gone through it once it didn't have the same power over me any more. I knew that if I had acually killed myself like I had wanted to, I never would have had that experience, and even though everything seemed so utterly hopeless now, that didn't mean things would stay that way forever. So I got over that depression too and after all the dust cleared, I realised I had gained a ton of confidence and self respect. And people can sense that, I make friends easily and have several really close friends now and getting women also became easy. Not that my life is perfect or anything, it definately isn't, but I'm pretty thankful to be living it
Yarr, if it was me I'd do something in order to get regular sleep and start eating very well before I relegated my fate to a pill. I feel medication should only be taken as a last resort, especially if you're young and your brain is still developing. There have been many documented cases of medications actually making the problem worse, so be careful.
Get some sleeping aids, get 9 hours of sleep, go buy some healthy food, and save the pill for last =[
On October 24 2006 05:47 ErlinG wrote: Eh having depression 1-2 times a week isnt normal ?
Heh, I had the same thought. You know, doctors can find something wrong with almost anyone. I'm sure any one of us here can go to a doctor and tell him our basic thoughts and we'd get the "oh, this guy has OCD, this guy has ADHD, this guy is depressed, blah blah blah" and we'd all get perscriptions. This doesn't necessarily mean that people don't have some sort of condition, but it does mean that doctors do hand out potentially dangerous medications way too freely.
I'm positive that if I went to the doctor looking for drugs I could get them, as any of us could. But I don't think there's anything wrong with me. Sure, I have the same inexplanable emotional swings that everyone on the planet has, but I don't think these make us different so much as they make us human.
Feeling sad or be in a bad mood is normal. Having depression 1-2 times a week is normal. But constactly waking up every morning and hating your life and everything you see is not. I had this stage but i overcame it two years ago. When i moved to Korea i just had my eyes open. You know its ok to blow some steam or having a bad day but dont let it ruin your life like suicide. I usually just take a walk outside. Also talk with your very close friends. Dont expect someone on tl to magically solve this and make your depression go away or anyone in the world. The first step is correcting your attitude and way of life and thinking.
On October 24 2006 07:31 WhatisProtoss wrote: I have a friend who is really depressed. She has to take anti-depressants. I personally think it's a load of crap, since depression is non-existant in Korea. I think it's just a social thing. (Of course, I never tell her this).
The thing is, many friends get depressed (along with me) because of the sheer difficulty of school: studying hard, exams, getting bad scores. I always cook for my friends after a hard week so that we can hang out and be happy.
But this particular friend with her chronic depression.... she does not like such things. When I see friends trudging along, I usually bump into them and cheer them up, making them smile even when they don't want to. But this friend tells me to leave her alone, because it frustrates her to be laughing when she's sad. Since she gets really angry if I persist, I have to back off.
The difference between her and non-depressed friends is that she wants to be alone and marinate in her sadness. If I get depressed, I try to get out and exercise so my mind and body is distracted. However, if I stay inside and alone, my sadness just grows.
That's why depression is so large in the US. The US alone has the most "clinically depressed" people in the world.
You just need friends to rely on. People you can talk to and hang out with to make you feel better. Don't go to a mental health clinic. Talking to some stranger about your problems is ridiculous.
i think the US example is correlated to the growing obesity rate
talk to your real friends about it, not on here. that will help some. break some habits, dont make bw/tl.net the focus of your life. and do go to a psych and do take the pills. just be smart and read up on what your taking. dont listen to anyone here who says dont go to a psychiatrist, they have no clue what they are talking about. they are professionals. what you have is a real problem. i cant really psychoanalyze you from words, but you being really productive when you happy and then complete opposite when your sad, which varies frequently, is a symptom of bi-polar, manic-depressive disease. it doesnt mean it is, because those symptoms are for a number of other ailments as well. but your best bet is to go to a psychiatrist. you wont get proper help any way else.
try to find the movie "The Secret" (I wont link to a torrent because i got banned from TL by doing so previously) and try to find anthony robbins program on limewire if you don't wanna pay for it. It's great, even though i'm still feeling depressed a bit it has helped me a lot and I see things a lot differently. You need to put some effort into it.. when you are deppressive you are lazy so its hard to get out of it I've been depressive since i dropped out of school at 15 because i had some serious mental issues (anxiety disorder,panic attacks all the time) that I kept hiding to everybody until i was like 18.
Those 2 things helped me and Metal/Hardcore did as well, a lot.
On October 24 2006 07:31 WhatisProtoss wrote: I have a friend who is really depressed. She has to take anti-depressants. I personally think it's a load of crap, since depression is non-existant in Korea. I think it's just a social thing. (Of course, I never tell her this).
non-existant? wow, you're an idiot. you try living up to insane expectations from your parents, being forced to join the military and living in fear of the north coming down to kick the shit out of you your whole life, then tell me that theres no depression there, ok? even if none of those existed, you can still become depressed. it happens to many people because of a chemical imbalance.
So when your entire familiy dies in a car crash and your girlfriend fucks your best friend and you get acid thrown at your balls by accident at work and you cant pay the rent, and you lost to a poor player in a public game do you get depressed?
Weird parentheses name, if you had a lot of shit to do you wouldn't have time to be depressed. All the really depressed philosophers for example showed up as their countries became prosperous enough for them to sit around and think all day instead of getting shit done.
I feel like there isn't anyone I can talk to so I'm posting this the only place where I know people might read it and maybe help ^_^;. People in classes aren't close friends. People I do extracurricular work with are extremely status and image focused; not really an option to talk about a topic like this w/ them.
There's your problem. Get some friends who'll be there for you and not just be like "oh man, that sucks." Tough love or whatever.
Take the pill if you want (I guess you don't), see a counselor and make sure you're not manic-depressive or something instead of just reacting poorly to stress, and work on each day at a time. Get some real friends. Don't spend five hours looking at tl.net late at night.
Honestly you sound like a loser who deep inside knows it - which is what's making you depressed - and is maybe in denial about it. It can't be that hard there to get off the computer and get a life.
On October 24 2006 09:03 Patriot.dlk wrote: So when your entire familiy dies in a car crash and your girlfriend fucks your best friend and you get acid thrown at your balls by accident at work and you cant pay the rent, and you lost to a poor player in a public game do you get depressed?
LOL no depression is non-existant in Korea
Hahahaha I love that you threw in starcraft as a reason to get depressed next to all these horrible things. Here's hoping you're not serious...
On October 24 2006 09:15 des wrote: Honestly you sound like a loser who deep inside knows it - which is what's making you depressed - and is maybe in denial about it. It can't be that hard there to get off the computer and get a life [removed quote within quote]
yea getting friends will help, but without a doubt, being that no one here cant tell you exactly what is wrong with you and youre incapable of diagnosing yourself, a pysch is your best option. you could have a number of things wrong with you, some of which can put you at a high risk of suicide and other shit. take the safe option, go to a psych. when you go, make sure you read up personally on what hes telling you. this is the best thing to do in life with everything when going to see a professinal... ask questions. read up on what he tells you to do. this way, when he tells you to do something or take this pill, you understand what youre doing and not just doing it because someone tells you.
On October 24 2006 09:18 glaex wrote: [removed quote within quote]
Gread advice. Deuche bag.
what hes saying could be true. if youre mentally trapped into playing bw and your life revovling around it, youre gonna get depressed. i dont see how that makes him a deuche for pointing that out.
On October 24 2006 06:33 KrAzYfoOL wrote: i once spent many hours helping this girl out with her depression i'd always call and make sure she felt better, one day i had severe depression and i asked for her help but she said she was too busy and again she fucked me off the next day. ever since then i will take revenge on the world, nah not really but i realised if you're naturally depressed over such simple things just take a good long look at yourself and picture someone in a worse scenario like a gosu guy playing a noob with heaps of obs only to lose embarassingly to a 4pool etc.. O:
You mean the game where oov lost to draco in WCG because draco proxied? i kid, i kid. well he did just win by cheesing and got huge amount of fame because he proxied. for crying out loud he cheesed him and everyone was like "OMFG, he's sooo korean now" when really all he did was execute a cheesy cheese whiz play. what was more interest in the WCG was the fact that Midas lost twice and only a few people were like "OMFG!".
oh and about the depression sorry i'm not going to mention my sever depression because i like to keep it to myself. i can deal with my depression better that way.
Edit:wait a minute, i might be wrong did Draco ever play Midas? did draco ever beat midas?
On October 24 2006 09:15 des wrote: Honestly you sound like a loser who deep inside knows it - which is what's making you depressed - and is maybe in denial about it. It can't be that hard there to get off the computer and get a life
Gread advice. Deuche bag.
what hes saying could be true. if youre mentally trapped into playing bw and your life revovling around it, youre gonna get depressed. i dont see how that makes him a deuche for pointing that out.
Well, its not all what he said so much as how he said it that produced that knee jerk "god what a deuche" reaction. Here, I'll apply his message to you to demonstrate with bolds for emphasis:
It might help to read it out loud in as low and smooth a voice as possible
Honestly you sound ignorant to the true deuchieness of des' post and deep, deep down inside your heart you know it - which is the reason for your problem - and maybe your in denial about that. It can't be that hard to get off the computer and discover inner deuche in all of us (and by that I mean get a life)
Wow I feel so... deuchey just posting this haha. Post is intended purely for comic purposes and should in no way be taken seriously. Fuck, its contagious
On October 24 2006 11:10 doedrikthe2nd wrote: Don't take the pills. Smoke some joints instead. I'm serious.
Not saying it will help though. Cause it most likely won't. But hey, it's still better than taking pills.
I can't think of any redeeming value to this post.
Anyway, I have a family member who has been struggling with depression for years. I understand your wish to not feel as though you need to rely on medication to lead a normal life. My family member (now in low-mid 20s) has been on and off medication for like 10 years, accompanied with weekly meetings with professionals. From my point of view, when she's on the medication everything isn't necessarily wonderful but she doesn't have those really bad days. The pattern she shows is that she gets herself to leading a fairly normal/happy life until she feels confident or lazy enough to not rely on the medication, after which she has a fit of depression and starts the cycle over again.
There is absolutly no correct answer with a wonderful solution to your problem if you aren't already making a tremendous mistake leading towards you feelings of depression. Trying different things to combat the depression (including but not limited to medication) is very important, plus you need to plan how you are going to avoid the mistake my family member has made in the past. As for the cost of insurance: in the short term it won't be that much money even if it isn't covered by insurance and it will give you a handle on whether or not what a psychiatrist prescribes for you can actually have a positive effect on your life. In the long run, even if the medication is expensive, it will be worth it if it prevents large parts of your entire life from sucking.
On October 24 2006 11:24 glaex wrote: [removed quote within quote]
Well, its not all what he said so much as how he said it that produced that knee jerk "god what a deuche" reaction. Here, I'll apply his message to you to demonstrate with bolds for emphasis:
It might help to read it out loud in as low and smooth a voice as possible
Honestly you sound ignorant to the true deuchieness of des' post and deep, deep down inside your heart you know it - which is the reason for your problem - and maybe your in denial about that. It can't be that hard to get off the computer and discover inner deuche in all of us (and by that I mean get a life)
Wow I feel so... deuchey just posting this haha. Post is intended purely for comic purposes and should in no way be taken seriously. Fuck, its contagious
yea, the tone was maybe a little harsh. still true however. but yea, i could see where youre comin fromg.
My ex was in pills. I had to witness multiple panic attacks before. Ever since, I hated and distrusted the pill. She was a nutcase. I dunno if she's the crazy one of the pills are crazy pills but I decided Alcohol is the greatest cure to depression... cuz that's how I handle mine.
I think that's why Koreans aren't "depressed" but more so miserably happy... Alcohol is a byoot.
imo get a gf, it'll definitely help. get a 2nd one if 1 is not enough. seriously, no love no touch = hell babies don't grow up if they don't get touched playing sc and exercise help too, u'll be too tired metally and physically to stay awake
On October 24 2006 08:37 ))(())(( wrote: [removed quote within quote]
non-existant? wow, you're an idiot. you try living up to insane expectations from your parents, being forced to join the military and living in fear of the north coming down to kick the shit out of you your whole life, then tell me that theres no depression there, ok? even if none of those existed, you can still become depressed. it happens to many people because of a chemical imbalance.
What the hell do you know about Korean society? Stop bashing me, you irrational idiot. I'm talking about "clinical depression." Sure, people get sad all the time. But we don't lie in bed all day long feeling sorry for ourselves. Because the parents are so strict, most Korean kids cannot afford to do that. So, in a sense, depression is "beaten" out of us.
I have lived up to the expectations of my parents. And no, we do not live in fear of the North Koreans. Who said we did? Me and all my Korean friends aren't worried about North Korea. And it is an obvious fact that military service is needed.
It is a statistical fact that Americans are the most "depressed." Why are Americans so depressed? You don't have to live up to "insane expectations" from your parents. You don't have required military service. Like said earlier, it is most likely diet.
Many Korean students just don't have the TIME to be depressed. We don't have time to sit around feeling sorry for our pathetic selves. We have to study hard, we are given specific career goals early in life. We are motivated by parents and society to work hard and succeed.
The clinically depressed individuals (many American students) are the ones with too much time on their hands. They have too much time and just use it to drown in their sorrow.
On October 24 2006 12:34 WhatisProtoss wrote: [removed quote within quote] What the hell do you know about Korean society? Stop bashing me, you irrational idiot. I'm talking about "clinical depression." Sure, people get sad all the time. But we don't lie in bed all day long feeling sorry for ourselves. Because the parents are so strict, most Korean kids cannot afford to do that. So, in a sense, depression is "beaten" out of us.
so its suppressed, you cant be upset....man thats really good. by the way retard, clinical depression does exist in korea. it exists all over. go look it up if you get a chance between your 1432432 push ups. its around 3%, roughly 1.5 million of the almost 49mil living there. so much for not existing?
Well man, when Im feeling down / depressed just blaze some chronic or something. Relax a little, read a book, do some thing productive to get your mind off of everything that causes you stress in life. Hobbies man. Pills that doctors give you are shit. They are just temporary relief that really have no long term effect.
On October 24 2006 12:50 BC.KoRn wrote: Well man, when Im feeling down / depressed just blaze some chronic or something. Relax a little, read a book, do some thing productive to get your mind off of everything that causes you stress in life. Hobbies man. Pills that doctors give you are shit. They are just temporary relief that really have no long term effect.
yea, that works if ur just in a temporary funk, but what hes saying is sounding more like hes clinically depressed. pills work for that.
On October 24 2006 12:46 ))(())(( wrote: [removed quote within quote]
so its suppressed, you cant be upset....man thats really good. by the way retard, clinical depression does exist in korea. it exists all over. go look it up if you get a chance between your 1432432 push ups. its around 3%, roughly 1.5 million of the almost 49mil living there. so much for not existing?
I have friends who don't even know what it is. It is not suppressed. Depression is created. You choose whether you want to be depressed or not. People choose to be depressed more so in the US. It's only natural. If you're sad and feeling down, the natural tendency is to be alone. Your bad mood prevents you from wanting to have fun with friends. If our lives were too busy to let in free time like this, then we wouldn't have time to dwell on our sadness and it would move on.
Crying alone or confining yourself to be depressed alone does not help your situation. I go through this all the time at school.
College is tough. We all have to work hard and study, despite how hard it is. There are some people who cannot take the pressure and decide to give up. I had two friends who dropped out in our freshman year of college. After the 2nd round of exams were given back, we were all shocked at our low marks. We just trudged back home, depressed and dishearted. But most of us, the next day, were motivated to correct our mistakes and not let the bad marks let us down. We worked even harder, because we did NOT want to be disappointed again. But two friends stopped going to class, just to stay in their rooms and mope around. All they did was complain about how hard the work was, and how unfair college was. They were required to withdraw by the school administration at the end of the year because they could not motivate themselves.
It's not about acknowledging the fact that you are depressed. Sure, we all get depressed. But just by saying: "I'm clinically depressed.... I can't do this anymore..." won't get you anywhere. You have to force yourself to move on despite how bad your situation is. It isn't suppressing or denying depression. It's fighting past it and not believing in it. If you believe that you can't succeed, then you will NOT succeed. That is my ideology.
depends on how long you have been depressed for, some people go clinically depressed for only some months while others last years+. if you think its long long term you should tell your parents. cant bottle this junk up - maybe try and get a really good friend. if its a chemical imbalance then your probably in trouble and will have to take the pills
jesus christ, parenthesis kid - shut the fuck up, your name looks like a vagina and your posts fit it well. you have this stupid confidence in everything you say but it's painfully clear that you don't know what you're talking about. get out of here so nobody has to ignore your awful posts.
It comes down to the basic choice of every pathethic big-brained mokey living in a shitty world. You can rationalize that as things are, it is perfectly logical that everything is as bad as it is and float in your stale pool of misery.
Or, you can *know* that things *will* change, as they always do, and use your time of depression as best you can. Strange as it may sound, it is a gift of sorts. Time, solitude, another perspective; all things that are gone all too quickly when you start living the happy, outgoing and productive life.
i think its extremely unintelligent to sacrifice your own health to save some money. your health is more important than the money used for the pill. its ok to search for other alternatives, but if its a chemical imbalance, which sounds like the most likely reason for your depression, then the pill is likely your best bet.
You absolutely need to take medicine before something bad happens. I know medication sounds bad but you dont necessarily have to take it for life. But it is absolutely necessary especially for something like depression where really really bad things could result from neglegence. Another thing you could try is to travel, get a change of scenery. Maybe take a year off and just travel. Or goto another country and live there for a while.
On October 24 2006 06:00 0x64 wrote: Too bad travis responded privatly becaus eI would had been interested as this really is pretty much my case too.
lllcodelll what helps me very much is to get the basic right. You need to have the basic routines ok before you can get better. Do a list of your basic activities and set up some sort of ritual out of it. In the morning, get up, get a shower, shave, make your bed, clean the room. Eat a good breakfast, have a fixed wake up time. If you go to sleep too late then wake up ealier until you start to feel sleepy at night. When your alarm clock rings, jump right out of bed. Dont go first to your computer check teamliquid.
Basicly after doing all this you will start feeling better about yourself and you will think more clearly and you will feel like you have more time on your hands.
Then you should keep it up. After one week start adding stuff to your program, like go run 30 min each day (always fixed time). Get new clothes, add one night in the week you will go out in bar (try friday, its cool)
Also before starting this make a biiiiig cleanup of you room, dishes etc.
To make you feel even less bored, when you go shopping, make a rule you dont buy any ready made food and you dont buy the same food you have already bough on that week.
Some easy changes to make and you will get more color to your life and a healthy background!
I second all the above. Not to mention, a hobby really helps. Something involving music (guitar, singing, etc) or other addictive but controllable games has always helped me out. Stay busy.
U should get a goal/dream in life, like u want to gain 30pounds of sheer muscle start bodybuildin itll also make u focus and concentrate on excersises, meals, all sort of things, and thus give ur life a meaning (at least for the point)...
And people should always just once in a while relax take it cool and think "how easy is it to live i don have to do anything no problems at alll" and enjoy the small things in life, like just seeing a friend going for a nice walk and seeing the nature, drinking cold fresh water, going to bed and all simple stuff caus thats what life consist of....
On October 24 2006 13:14 WhatisProtoss wrote: [removed quote within quote] I have friends who don't even know what it is. It is not suppressed. Depression is created. You choose whether you want to be depressed or not.
thats interesting. there seems to be a bunch of pyschology studies that contradict that. manic-depressive is by choice?
People choose to be depressed more so in the US. It's only natural. If you're sad and feeling down, the natural tendency is to be alone. Your bad mood prevents you from wanting to have fun with friends. If our lives were too busy to let in free time like this, then we wouldn't have time to dwell on our sadness and it would move on.
Crying alone or confining yourself to be depressed alone does not help your situation. I go through this all the time at school.
College is tough. We all have to work hard and study, despite how hard it is. There are some people who cannot take the pressure and decide to give up. I had two friends who dropped out in our freshman year of college. After the 2nd round of exams were given back, we were all shocked at our low marks. We just trudged back home, depressed and dishearted. But most of us, the next day, were motivated to correct our mistakes and not let the bad marks let us down. We worked even harder, because we did NOT want to be disappointed again. But two friends stopped going to class, just to stay in their rooms and mope around. All they did was complain about how hard the work was, and how unfair college was. They were required to withdraw by the school administration at the end of the year because they could not motivate themselves.
It's not about acknowledging the fact that you are depressed. Sure, we all get depressed. But just by saying: "I'm clinically depressed.... I can't do this anymore..." won't get you anywhere. You have to force yourself to move on despite how bad your situation is. It isn't suppressing or denying depression. It's fighting past it and not believing in it. If you believe that you can't succeed, then you will NOT succeed. That is my ideology.
brilliant. but your ideology doesnt do shit if you have a chemical imbalance. for normal, rational people, that holds pretty true. but the reality is, not everyone has it as easy as you do. if you were born into a poor family and had a mental disease, youd be singing a different tune.
On October 24 2006 13:18 intrigue wrote: jesus christ, parenthesis kid - shut the fuck up, your name looks like a vagina and your posts fit it well. you have this stupid confidence in everything you say but it's painfully clear that you don't know what you're talking about. get out of here so nobody has to ignore your awful posts.
lol, read up on psychology dipshit. what im saying is right.
If you havent suffered from depression then i suggest you not give this man advice. I have chronic severe depression and take medicine for it. Without the medicine i am a wreck. I have tried commiting suicide once and failed. It's not as simple as "going out with your friends" as a lot of you make it out to be. I am suprised at the narrow mindness of most of these comments. If you wana talk about your depression man, pm me. Most of these people posting dont know a fucking thing of what they are talking about.
I get depressed sometimes. It makes it worse when you stay up late at night, i dunno why.
I strongly suggest forcing yourself to go to bed. A glass of red wine will do the trick
And don't disregard anti-deps so quickly, they've saved lives. And after you get through the rough spots of your life, you can ween yourself from them. My gf just came off a 4-year zoloft stint, and now she's fine
Pick up a hobbie that youre interested in. (not sc something new).
When i get down, analyze the situation. Ask: Why am i feeling this way? What made me feel this way? What can i do to fix it? Just thinking about solutions really helps to project a goal.
On October 24 2006 14:36 tehredbandit wrote: If you havent suffered from depression then i suggest you not give this man advice. I have chronic severe depression and take medicine for it. Without the medicine i am a wreck. I have tried commiting suicide once and failed. It's not as simple as "going out with your friends" as a lot of you make it out to be. I am suprised at the narrow mindness of most of these comments. If you wana talk about your depression man, pm me. Most of these people posting dont know a fucking thing of what they are talking about.
QF Fucking T.
WhatIsProtoss, you are entirely wrong. There are many types of depression, and the type you are thinking of is just "The Blues." Everybody expirences this on a frequent basis and it usually dissapates pretty quick. Clinical Depression, on the other hand, is a serious thing, and it cannot be treated simply by pushing past it, since one of the core charactaristics is the simple inability to move past it, for whatever reason. It truly is an incredibly crushing feeling, and it's almost impossible to really do anything about it, not only because doing something about it is difficult, but you just lack the drive to do anything at all.
OP: if you are seriously depressed, and have been so for a period of longer than two weeks, you need seek professional help rather than TL.net's "help." Nobody on TL.net is qualified to help you, and even if they think they can, they probably can't.
A prescription is not as bad as many of you seem to think. I've been on antidepressants twice (Prozac and Zoloft), and for extended periods. I did not feel numb, and I did not become dependant on them. After a good deal of time, I came off of them and felt significantly better. The only noticable side effect was weight gain with the Zoloft, and it came off very easy once after I got off.
On October 24 2006 14:19 ))(())(( wrote: [removed quote within quote] lol, read up on psychology dipshit. what im saying is right.
no, you're wrong. you have no right to be confident in anything you say if you spew stuff like this:
non-existant? wow, you're an idiot. you try living up to insane expectations from your parents, being forced to join the military and living in fear of the north coming down to kick the shit out of you your whole life, then tell me that theres no depression there, ok? even if none of those existed, you can still become depressed. it happens to many people because of a chemical imbalance.
you are obviously clueless, so keep on talking about things you don't know about please! i don't know or care you who are but from what you write i am certain that i know more than you about probably everything. yes, the op needs to see a psychiatrist, but good job! you've just stated the obvious three times in one thread. and shit from your mouth in every other post i've seen since you joined tlnet and it's fucking awful.
assholes like you who have been here a month shouldn't have three hundred posts, and if they do they better be good ones. stop spamming and posting just to give your worthless support of other people's posts or jumping on the 'lol i hate whatisprotoss' bandwagon, it won't make you popular. i hope you get banned soon.
On October 24 2006 14:16 ))(())(( wrote: [removed quote within quote]
thats interesting. there seems to be a bunch of pyschology studies that contradict that. manic-depressive is by choice?
brilliant. but your ideology doesnt do shit if you have a chemical imbalance. for normal, rational people, that holds pretty true. but the reality is, not everyone has it as easy as you do. if you were born into a poor family and had a mental disease, youd be singing a different tune.
Sure, I agree to that much...
But you know, psychology is not the biological study of the brain, it is the study of the brain through hypothesis of behavior (like phenotypes vs. genotypes). It is the attempt to explain why a human acts a certain way.
Unlike chemistry and biology, psychology is mostly based on observational theory. The best answers are from controlled experiments. If you actually know anything about psychology (which I don't think you do.... since you don't sound like you've taken a college-level psych class), you would know that "new" diseases are being created. And some psychologists believe that the pharmaceutical industry almost "creates" new diseases to match their products. One easy example is: social anxiety disorder.
Didn't you know that most anti-depressant drugs were placebos? Once a patient loses faith in them, the drug does not work. Just google "antidepressant + placebo" and you will see the massive debate over the placebo effect of anti-depressants. It's a pharmaceutical industry thing, for the most part.
I do agree that there are some people who cannot get over depression as easily as other. I do accept the notion that people, if left alone, will be chronically depressed. I also acknowledge that there is lots of doubt in the area of clinical depression itself.
I accept the fact that studies have shown lower levels of neurotransmitters for clinically depressed people. However, I also know that healthy people are known to have shown lower levels of seretonin when depressed for a short period of time. Yes, the mental change in the body does reflect in the number of neurotransmitters which are functioning. But that statistic does not change between the "clinically depressed" and the temporarily depressed people. Clinically depressed ones just might have the "wrong attitude", but that's just a random thought.
The ONE thing I absolutely believe in is that brain dieases could very well cause depression. That is the one thing that is absolute and clinically correct. Parkinsons', M.S.... But that is a side-effect of the brain damage. But that shouldn't be called "clinical depression." It should be called what it really is: brain damage, or specifically "Parkinsons'", "MS", or some other neuro-related disease.
I just see it as: Physical Disorder vs. Social Disorder _______________ I know I'm talking too much on this thread..... but it's a matter that is very close to me. Coming from Korea, I had never considered depression and laughed at friends who would be depressed. But after taking friends to the mental clinic and learning about this, I feel somewhat strongly on this matter.
non-existant? wow, you're an idiot. you try living up to insane expectations from your parents, being forced to join the military and living in fear of the north coming down to kick the shit out of you your whole life, then tell me that theres no depression there, ok? even if none of those existed, you can still become depressed. it happens to many people because of a chemical imbalance.
you are obviously clueless, so keep on talking about things you don't know about please! i don't know or care you who are but from what you write i am certain that i know more than you about probably everything. you've either stated the obvious or shit from your mouth in every post i've seen since you joined so far and it's fucking awful.
assholes like you who have been here a month shouldn't have three hundred posts, and if they do they better be good ones. stop spamming and posting just to give your worthless support of other people's posts or jumping on the 'lol i hate whatisprotoss' bandwagon, it won't make you popular. i hope you get banned soon.
and what out of you quoted isnt true? korea is known to have high academic standards. they all have to join the military and they have a fucking dmz smack across the middle of it, with a now nuclear-capable psychopath above them. thats not living in fear? off my nuts. nothing is this post has been anything but truths. youve really proven you know more then me buddy. i didnt jump on any bandwagon, i simply pointed out that the kid is an idiot and has no clue what hes talking about. maybe you feel the need to be popular in the e-community, but to me, its just passing time during the work day. sorry i took the limelight off you, ok? you can go back to being mr. popular now.
On October 24 2006 15:27 ))(())(( wrote: [removed quote within quote]
and what out of you quoted isnt true? korea is known to have high academic standards. they all have to join the military and they have a fucking dmz smack across the middle of it, with a now nuclear-capable psychopath above them. thats not living in fear? off my nuts. nothing is this post has been anything but truths. youve really proven you know more then me buddy. i didnt jump on any bandwagon, i simply pointed out that the kid is an idiot and has no clue what hes talking about. maybe you feel the need to be popular in the e-community, but to me, its just passing time during the work day. sorry i took the limelight off you, ok? you can go back to being mr. popular now.
You have no clue what you're talking about. Don't make judgements about Korea when you don't know anything.
Yes, we have a DMZone. Yes, we have high academic standards. Yes, we have to join the military. No, we are not living in fear. It is simply a difference in life. We understand that high academic expectations are for the betterment of us.
You have no idea, since you have not lived this life. You're just in awe at how strict Asian parents are compared to American ones. Our parents aren't crazy, they don't hate us. They want us to be better people in life. Going to the military isn't a punishment. Everyone has to do it. People aren't afraid to go, it's not like we're going to war. Don't make rash judgements on things that you have no idea about.
On October 24 2006 15:27 ))(())(( wrote: [removed quote within quote]
and what out of you quoted isnt true? korea is known to have high academic standards. they all have to join the military and they have a fucking dmz smack across the middle of it, with a now nuclear-capable psychopath above them. thats not living in fear? off my nuts. nothing is this post has been anything but truths. youve really proven you know more then me buddy. i didnt jump on any bandwagon, i simply pointed out that the kid is an idiot and has no clue what hes talking about. maybe you feel the need to be popular in the e-community, but to me, its just passing time during the work day. sorry i took the limelight off you, ok? you can go back to being mr. popular now.
are you serious? so all koreans are scared of dying, and the academic stress makes them depressed. military service scars them, so they get fucked up there too just like everybody in countries like taiwan where military service also certainly causes depression? they get no benefit from the discipline and better opportunities from higher education?
while in america we're all fine because we have shitty education, increasing amounts of homeless people, unhealthy eating habits, terrible political issues, and hatred in the eyes of the rest of the world?
you are fucking ignorant, i don't even know where you get the nerve to post. try asking a korean, any korean anywhere if anything you've said is right and come back here and pm me apologizing after you get face trounced.
On October 24 2006 15:26 WhatisProtoss wrote: [removed quote within quote] Sure, I agree to that much...
But you know, psychology is not the biological study of the brain, it is the study of the brain through hypothesis of behavior (like phenotypes vs. genotypes). It is the attempt to explain why a human acts a certain way.
Unlike chemistry and biology, psychology is mostly based on observational theory. The best answers are from controlled experiments. If you actually know anything about psychology (which I don't think you do.... since you don't sound like you've taken a college-level psych class), you would know that "new" diseases are being created. And some psychologists believe that the pharmaceutical industry almost "creates" new diseases to match their products. One easy example is: social anxiety disorder.
Didn't you know that most anti-depressant drugs were placebos? Once a patient loses faith in them, the drug does not work. Just google "antidepressant + placebo" and you will see the massive debate over the placebo effect of anti-depressants. It's a pharmaceutical industry thing, for the most part.
I do agree that there are some people who cannot get over depression as easily as other. I do accept the notion that people, if left alone, will be chronically depressed. I also acknowledge that there is lots of doubt in the area of clinical depression itself.
I accept the fact that studies have shown lower levels of neurotransmitters for clinically depressed people. However, I also know that healthy people are known to have shown lower levels of seretonin when depressed for a short period of time. Yes, the mental change in the body does reflect in the number of neurotransmitters which are functioning. But that statistic does not change between the "clinically depressed" and the temporarily depressed people. Clinically depressed ones just might have the "wrong attitude", but that's just a random thought.
The ONE thing I absolutely believe in is that brain dieases could very well cause depression. That is the one thing that is absolute and clinically correct. Parkinsons', M.S.... But that is a side-effect of the brain damage. But that shouldn't be called "clinical depression." It should be called what it really is: brain damage, or specifically "Parkinsons'", "MS", or some other neuro-related disease.
I just see it as: Physical Disorder vs. Social Disorder _______________ I know I'm talking too much on this thread..... but it's a matter that is very close to me. Coming from Korea, I had never considered depression and laughed at friends who would be depressed. But after taking friends to the mental clinic and learning about this, I feel somewhat strongly on this matter.
i know what pyschology is, i majored in it for two years. yes, there are psychologists who believe that the pharm industry creates new diseases. and in a sense, yes, they are right. sad is a good example of that. however, like any science, its constantly being studied, tested and retested. im sure there are some people who truly do have some kind of social disorder that is not correctable by therapy alone.
however, its like add, every single person that might possibly fall into that category gets handed a persciption right away. there are good psychologists and bad ones, just like doctors. ive seen/heard of idiots supposedly 'diagnosing' a patient with a mental disorder in under 20 or 30 minutes. i dont care how good you are, thats simply not possible. thats an example of a dumbass dr., probably the ones who are handing out aderol perscriptions like candy.
as for plecebos, you can make anything into a placebo. many psychologists will actually do this to determine if the person truly has a condition, or if they are manifesting it in their head. depression can come in many forms, and it could be just depression, or it could be a symptom of soemthing much worse. i dont doubt this at all. one of the first things you learn in psych is how dificult it can be to diagnose stuff, esp depression. this is why i told the thread started to go to psych asap. its better to be safe then sorry.
what your saying about seretonin is a decent argument, im sure if you dig aroudn o nthe subject, you can find many cases that support clinical depression. my friends sister was a brilliant student, all the advanced classes, popular girl, always busy with sports, etc. however, no one knew she was clinically depressed. she was 9 years old and had been this way since about 6 or 7. her journal entries showed this, because her parents found it out with one of the pages talking about planning her suicide. at that age, you dont just hit a bump in the road that puts you in a funk and makes you thin kabout suicide, esp for that long. thats clinical depression stemming from a lack of seretonin.
defintely dead on about brain diseases causing depression. even other diseases can cause that. my dad had hodskins disease about 4 years ago and became clinically depressed a few months in and is just starting to come around now with treatment. the reason i attacked you was because you said it straight up doesnt exist in korea, which was just a flat out dumb statement to say, esp for someone who apparently has a decent head on their shoulders.
Um, why are you agreeing with me all of a sudden? I haven't changed my views or anything....
And you haven't proved that you actually know anything about psychology. Placebos aren't proven to distinguish between a clinically depressed patient and a temporarily depressed patient. Once my friend found out that she had been taking placebos, her condition just kept getting "worse". And that's just probably because she lost faith in the drugs that were being given to her.
The problem with psychology is that it is a observational science. It cannot create absolute truths in the current state that it is in.
And, I still stand by my initial statement. In Korea, many people don't even know what depression is. There is no "time" for depression. And it is called "불경기", and basically clinics for 불경기 are sucicide-prevention hospitals. Because, you either aren't depressed, or suicidal from stress. Which I think is almost ridiculous as well, since there isn't much of a middle ground, but whatever. That's how it is in Korea.
On October 24 2006 15:39 intrigue wrote: [removed quote within quote]
are you serious? so all koreans are scared of dying, and the academic stress makes them depressed. military service scars them, so they get fucked up there too just like everybody in countries like taiwan where military service also certainly causes depression? they get no benefit from the discipline and better opportunities from higher education?
while in america we're all fine because we have shitty education, increasing amounts of homeless people, unhealthy eating habits, terrible political issues, and hatred in the eyes of the rest of the world?
you are fucking ignorant, i don't even know where you get the nerve to post. try asking a korean, any korean anywhere if anything you've said is right and come back here and pm me apologizing after you get face trounced.
1. dipshit, i never once said that america all fine and dandy. i can see with my own eyes how fucked our society is. i dont need your dumbass shoving words down my throat, ok? 2. i never once said all koreans are in fear, or any of that shit. i was simply insinuating that it can most certainly contribute to depression, which protoss said doesnt exist. but certainly, if there was absolutely no element of fear, there wouldnt be a fucking dmz, there wouldnt be talks with the north about not havign a nuke.
On October 24 2006 15:57 WhatisProtoss wrote: Placebos aren't proven to distinguish between a clinically depressed patient and a temporarily depressed patient. Once my friend found out that she had been taking placebos, her condition just kept getting "worse". And that's just probably because she lost faith in the drugs that were being given to her.
a temporarily depressed patient would 'get better'. a clincally one wouldnt, their levels would be off. they might get temporary relief, but the chemical imbalance is stil lthere. seretonin production isnt right. i dont see how i dont know shit aobut psychology, but whatever, its not like really matters whether u beleive it or not. i agree with that post because, for the most part, what you said there was correct. i disagreed with your original post about depression being non-existant and your ideology.
On October 24 2006 16:06 intrigue wrote: so basically you were stating the obvious, again. but managing to sound like an idiot while you did so. good job!
couldnt have been so obvious if protoss didnt think it exsisted eh? guess you forgot about that?
On October 24 2006 16:09 ))(())(( wrote: [removed quote within quote]
couldnt have been so obvious if protoss didnt think it exsisted eh? guess you forgot about that?
I don't think he really cared about what I was saying, so it doesn't matter what I say. The way you were making your points wase insulting.
And I acknowledge it's existence, just not as a failsafe physical disorder. Like I said, it is more of a social disorder than a provable physical disease.
vagina man - no. learn to read. i'm saying that you cited awful sources for how koreans could get depressed. not to mention that anything CAN cause depression. so saying that 'blah blah blah CAN cause koreans to be depressed' is just retarded, and doubly so if the 'blah blah blah' is completely inaccurate.
i haven't been reading whatisprotoss' posts because the rancid stupidity in yours is too much so don't involve me with him. if you want to keep this up pm me or just let it go. i'm sick of looking at this thread and any reply you make to this that's not a pm will just mean you're a fucking pussy.
ROFL what are you hovz? YOURE A FUCKING PUSSY, YOU DIDNT PM. am i gonna get a pm now challenging me to meet you? grow up kid. you havent posted anyting relevant, youve just been on my nuts trying to pick a fight.
On October 24 2006 16:19 WhatisProtoss wrote: [removed quote within quote] I don't think he really cared about what I was saying, so it doesn't matter what I say. The way you were making your points wase insulting.
And I acknowledge it's existence, just not as a failsafe physical disorder. Like I said, it is more of a social disorder than a provable physical disease.
Truth.
Clinical depression doesnt JUST stem from a chemical imbalance. This is certainly the cause in some cases, but not everyone suffers from a chemical imbalance and still get diagnosed with clinical depression. If you meet certain criterias (sad, depressed mood, dont eat right, hate self, etc etc) you have "clinical depression."
In US, its pretty much accepted. There are commercials that spew out crap to make you believe you are depressed and you have to take medication. In many cases, a different environment and attitude could probably have prevented it.
Things like father abusing the shit outa you, neglecting mother, and having no friends are all societal. These kinds of problems are not as prevalent in Korea. The social and cultural differences accounts for the difference in depression rates.
I can't believe someone thinks that clinical depression is non existent in their country. Jesus Christ what a dumb fuck. I dont need to live there, to know that there is depressed koreans in your society, its just fucking common sense. Sure, MAYBE it is lower percentage than america. But it is irrational to think its non existent.
i suggest you read this. http://www.springerlink.com/content/ql0262642l26kg28/ funny thing it says there are more korean adolescents that are depressed due to the intensive studying and lack of leisure activities.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/10/03/health/main524231.shtml "South Korea, for example, a recent survey said 67 percent of parents admitted whipping their children to discipline them, and 45 percent reported hitting, kicking or beating them, the report said. "
National Statistical Office reported that 26.1 out of every 100,000 South Koreans committed suicide last year. Why are koreans suiciding if they "Dont have time to get depressed"
On October 24 2006 17:27 CultureMisfits wrote: I can't believe someone thinks that clinical depression is non existent in their country. Jesus Christ what a dumb fuck. I dont need to live there, to know that there is depressed koreans in your society, its just fucking common sense. Sure, MAYBE it is lower percentage than america. But it is irrational to think its non existent.
i suggest you read this. http://www.springerlink.com/content/ql0262642l26kg28/ funny thing it says there are more korean adolescents that are depressed due to the intensive studying and lack of leisure activities.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/10/03/health/main524231.shtml "South Korea, for example, a recent survey said 67 percent of parents admitted whipping their children to discipline them, and 45 percent reported hitting, kicking or beating them, the report said. "
National Statistical Office reported that 26.1 out of every 100,000 South Koreans committed suicide last year. Why are koreans suiciding if they "Dont have time to get depressed"
I believe I already addressed these points. And, it's just a difference of culture. Americans don't discipline their kids, so Asian children naturally turn out to be more obedient and disciplined.
Depression is more widely accepted in the US, because the influence of pharmeceuticals is stronger and social diseases are more abundant. Many of these "social disorders" center around not being able to control kids (ADHD).
You'll be surprised at how many people don't know what depression is around here. "Isn't that just an excuse? How can it be a disease? It's probably just an excuse to get out of doing work." That is a common response among my friends. Depression has much US support since the US has created a wide range of propaganda and "study" for it.
lol... anybody professional would tell you that clinical depression is a disease. Its a world fact, so please stop arguing that right now, its just plain wrong.
And no... most social disorders are formed through physical/emotional/sexual abuse and neglect. I do believe koreans score pretty high in the physical abuse area. ADHD is usually argued that you are born with it, and not due to the effect of improper parenting. Although one might argue that alcohol and tobacco during pregnancy cause ADHD.
So what depression is more widely accepted. It shows we are trying to do something about it rather than keeping it to ourselfs like you koreans appear to do. It doesnt mean you are not affected by it.
i mean really, if you keep yourself busy it can be a) productive and b)maybe help you get over it dont sit there and be idle, make everything a task and be productive
PMed you. The thread has descended into a public flame war and I don't think any of it is very helpful.
On an unrelated note, I just love the way WhatIsProtoss goes pyscho if anyone else ever speaks about Korea. And the way he speaks for all of Korea. It makes me want to provoke him.
On October 24 2006 17:49 CultureMisfits wrote: lol... anybody professional would tell you that clinical depression is a disease. Its a world fact, so please stop arguing that right now, its just plain wrong.
And no... most social disorders are formed through physical/emotional/sexual abuse and neglect. I do believe koreans score pretty high in the physical abuse area. ADHD is usually argued that you are born with it, and not due to the effect of improper parenting. Although one might argue that alcohol and tobacco during pregnancy cause ADHD.
So what depression is more widely accepted. It shows we are trying to do something about it rather than keeping it to ourselfs like you koreans appear to do. It doesnt mean you are not affected by it.
Anybody professional? A psychologist? Surely not a biologist. It is not proven to be a real physical disease. Sure, social disorders exist. I admitted that much. Depression as a social disorder, fine. I accept that. Not as a physical disease which cannot be cured unless through medicinal treatment. No wonder most anti-depressants are placebos.
On October 24 2006 17:49 CultureMisfits wrote: lol... anybody professional would tell you that clinical depression is a disease. Its a world fact, so please stop arguing that right now, its just plain wrong.
And no... most social disorders are formed through physical/emotional/sexual abuse and neglect. I do believe koreans score pretty high in the physical abuse area. ADHD is usually argued that you are born with it, and not due to the effect of improper parenting. Although one might argue that alcohol and tobacco during pregnancy cause ADHD.
So what depression is more widely accepted. It shows we are trying to do something about it rather than keeping it to ourselfs like you koreans appear to do. It doesnt mean you are not affected by it.
You are unable to grasp the difference in western and eastern culture.
Yea, I got hit with bigass sticks when I did something wrong as a kid. It hurt like shit. Sometimes, I even thought it was unjustified. Like what I did was OK. As you grow up though, you will know it was all out of love. Its not like I harbor any ill feelings because I got physically disciplined. In Korea there is much more emphasis on family values and respect. Parents care for their children, and the children care for their parents when they grow up. Thats why you dont see shit like sexual abuse and neglect as much.
Its not a fucking disease if its societal in nature. Its a SOCIAL DISORDER like whatisprotoss pointed out many times.
And the Korean kids can be deemed as being more stressed I guess. Its not the same thing as being "clinically depressed."
There is much controversy in whether depression is a disease or disorder. I think many are starting to consider it a disease. Disorder or disease is irrevelant in this discussion. He is implying that depression is an excuse to get out of work. Which may be true for some, but definitly not for the mass majority. It should viewed as something serious and to be treated if it is severe.
I personally have been battling depression and there is some supplements I reccommend if you have 40-50 dollars(vitamins will last 1-2 months).
B vitamins- These are essential for health, especially mental health. Deficiencies have been known to cause depression and stress, and this is usually the first supplement a nutritionist will reccommend.
Fishoil - This supplement gives our bodies the much needed Omega 3's, which have been shown to fight all sorts of mental illness's or disorders, whatever you want to call them.It helps ADHD, Depression, Bi Polar. Here is one small link I quickly found to back me up. Fishoil and depression
5htp - Helps your brain make seretonin. Good for anxiety, depression, among other things. Another link 5-htp info
Bcomplex costs like 10-20,Fishoil costs around 20 dollars for a bottle which lasts 1-2 months. 5-htp costs around 5-20 dollars depending on the brand you get. I use both of these and they got rid of my depression. They take a few weeks to take full effect. If you are thinking about either of these supplements, for fish oil I suggest Cod Liver Oil which is fish oil, but has higher amounts of DHA to EPA(DHA is good for the brain, EPA is good for the heart, and in your case I think you are more worried about your brain,although either type will work). For 5htp, you should get one with vitamin b6 and vitamin C in it so it synthesizes in your body optimally.
Remember I am just talking about these supplements for their anti depressant properties, they have a ton of other good things about them for your health. Also, all of these things are natural and healthy for you, they are naturally found in food, but practically no one eats healthy enough to get all of these vitamins. Thats why EVERYONE should be supplementing with these.
Also check around on the net for natural anti depressants, you will be pleasantly suprised by what you find..
I've been prescribed 4 weeks of fluoxetine (prozac). I would like to hear stories from those who are experienced with this medication, and maybe include a brief background of your depression if possible. I've taken prozac before but quit after a week because I was feeling emotionally numb and apathetic. The doctor today said it was because I quit too soon. However he also told me prozac had "absolutely no side effects" which is obviously not true so I am not sure how he became a doctor.
I enjoyed this discussion about the validity of treating depression through medication. There are indeed neurological causes to clinical depression but the importance of their effect is uncertain. Furthermore various forms of couseling such as cognitive therapy have proven to be effective methods of treatment. Two particular antidepressant/placebo studies are quite unnerving.
A 1998 study by Kirsch, Irving, a UConn psychologist who conducted 19 double-blind trials to find the placebo effect in all of them as high as 75% and "the correlation between placebo effect and drug effect [to be] .90," the result of which assuming the experiements were done correctly and all factors accounted for, signify that the effect of Prozac on patients tested is largely insignificant. (Insignificant in the general sense, not statistically)
Fours years later, a report investigating studies submitted to the FDA by major drug companies for approval of antidepressants shows amazingly smiliar results. Six different antidepressants were used in "47 randomized placebo controlled short-term efficacy trials" only to have the placebo effect appear in 80% of the groups. This report, also by Dr. Irving Kirsch, details amazingly lackadaisical practices by the FDA in approving antidepressant drugs. Some excerpts:
"Although the FDA approved the drugs for "the treatment of depression" not otherwise specified, all but one of the clinical trials were conducted on patients described as moderately to severely depressed (their mean baseline Hamilton Depression Scale [HAM-D] scores ranged from 21.0 to 29.7)."
"In order to generalize the findings of the clinical trial to a larger patient population, FDA reviewers sought a completion rate of 70% or better for these typically 6-week trials. Only 4 of 45 trials, however, reached this objective."
"The use of other psychoactive medication was reported in 25 trials. In most trials, a chloral hydrate sedative was permitted in doses ranging from 500 mg to 2000 mg per day."
There exist theories that attempt to explain the unusually high occurence of the placebo effect. I don't know what they are but I assume they involve underlining the ambiguity of depression leading to inconclusive results of those who were given the placebo and later being "cured". In whatever case, these published studies show the effectiveness of antidepressants as at the very least, controversial.
Apart from clinical studies, there have been thousands (wiki) of lawsuits against drug companies over the effects of antidepressants. One case involving a serial killer, Joyce Fentress, et al. v Shea Communications et al or the Fentress Case
was undone by highly unethical and shady conduct on the side of Eli Lilly, the drug company that produces Prozac. On September 14, 1989, Joseph Wesbecker, who was severely depressed and had been taking Prozac for a month, a new antidepressant drug on the market, brought an AK-47 to work, shot and killed 8 of his fellow employees, wounded 12, and committed suide by shooting himself in the head after. Halfway through the ensuring trial, Chief plaintiffs' counsel Paul Smith asked oddly to withhold important evidence against Eli Lilly after repeatedly asking to present it previously. The evidence detailed another case that involved the drug Oraflex. Eli Lilly pleaded guilty to misreporting detrimental side effects of the drug that eventually led to four deaths and a court order to withdraw Oraflex from the market. Smith, it was later revealed in a Supreme Court investigation, secretly agreed to a "tremedous" settlement with Eli Lilly during a courtroom break moments after the judge allowed his request to present his evidence. After ruling the case in favor of Eli Lilly, Judge Potter appealed to the Supreme Court over his own decision. He won his case unanimously. However before any ruling was reached, Judge Potter signed a document declaring the case settled. A very bizzare turn of events that may never be fully explained but certainly involve more shady conduct from Eli Lilly.
Not surprisingly, after finding all of this out I am appalled by the unethical behavior of drug companies. I might still take the prozac to see what effect it has, but if it doesn't work after a month I am becoming rachel weisz in the constant gardner and dedicating my life to uncovering and exposing dirty scandals perpetrated by giant pharmaceutical companies all over the world.
EPT
Having a stable day is good. Also i dont know if you have, but get a girlfriend can help too. It's nice because then you have someone you can talk too about evrything instead of your parents for example. The best thing really ( atleast i think so) is too have friends and people who care about you around you. And i mean real friends then.. not just people you sit with in class. But people you can talk to about your problems. But if you feel you dont have any real friends then you need to get up and out.Try new things, diffrent sports, get invovled in school activeties, go out in town. Try to be with people as much as you can. And getting a job can also help.. takes your mind off the things that troubles you, and you meet new people at work. But ofc this may not apply to evryone. I dont think taking pills will help you.. You need people around you that care about you and want to help.
