US government shutdown - Page 93

On October 12 2013 08:21 Danglars wrote:

It wasn't too much different than the socialist he responded too. Corporations are evil (when compared to the state), capitalism only helps the rich, consumers are powerless against corporate greed, and all the rest of their tripe. My opponents are idealists, but I am a realist yada yada.

On October 12 2013 08:28 Forumite wrote:

What do you mean? Obamacare forbid the death panels that insurance companies have used until now. Under Obamacare insurance companies can´t deny treatment due to preexisting conditions or put a cap on payments.

On October 12 2013 08:37 Gorsameth wrote:


Woooosh.

That one went right over your head

+ Show Spoiler +

On October 12 2013 08:16 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
This is cute: Obamacare is the new slavery.



~ http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/11/ben-carson-obamacare_n_4086065.html?1381514228&ncid=webmail1

This is just getting more and more absurd. Next up: Barack becomes Hitler and his ACA is called "The Obamacaust".

On October 12 2013 10:28 Roe wrote:
I was thinking, wouldn't a compromise be some tax increases and some spending cuts? A compromise to a bully is giving him everything he wants and in return he gives you what you used to have for a short period of time until he extorts you again. The baseline should be returning to the status quo of government functioning.

On October 12 2013 08:48 Forumite wrote:

I know, it´s ironic and/or horrible.

ObamaCare’s cost-cutting board — memorably called a “death panel” by Sarah Palin — is facing growing opposition from Democrats who say it will harm people on Medicare.

Former Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean drew attention to the board designed to limit Medicare cost growth when he called for its repeal in an op-ed late last month.

Dean was quickly criticized by supporters of the Independent Payment Advisory Board (IPAB), who noted his ties to the healthcare industry as an adviser to a major D.C. lobbying firm.

But the former Vermont governor is not the only Democrat looking to kill the panel.

A wave of vulnerable Democrats over the past three months has signed on to bills repealing the board’s powers, including Sen. Mark Pryor (Ark.) and Reps. Ron Barber (Ariz.), Ann Kirkpatrick (Ariz.), Kyrsten Sinema (Ariz.) and Elizabeth Esty (Conn.).

On October 12 2013 12:16 Danglars wrote:

Democrats were pretty surprised that end-of-life care would be delegated to a panel appointed by bureaucrats.

thehill

Don't worry guys, you did need to pass it first to figure out what's in it.

On October 12 2013 12:26 Velocirapture wrote:


I would like to point out that these panels already exist as a part of every insurance and hospital board in the country. Every day people lose their shot at life due to the rulings of a panel, whether they are too high risk for a transplant, their surgery is too experimental or even simple pricing issues. Somebody has to make rules and I for one would rather have it be a uniform public matter than a highly variable opaque issue that you don't even know is a problem until you are denied.

Issues WILL arise whenever you implement new rules and if there is loss of life it will be tragic but at least this way there will be accountability. Or at least there will be when we get to single payer.

On October 12 2013 13:01 KwarK wrote:
"a panel appointed by bureaucrats" is very different from a panel of bureaucrats. How would you like your panels created if not by being appointed by someone and why does whether or not that person works at a desk have any impact on their ability to select competent people to make that assessment?

Comparable bodies already exist all around the world, including in America in the healthcare industry. Whenever you need to make a decision about financing care you need that panel. It's a non story based upon a paranoid fear of something that already exists and indeed must exist for the system people want to function. It's a really, really dumb talking point and you should really think less of anyone who tries to present death panels as a serious argument. Next you're going to tell me we have law panels where appointed individuals make rulings.

Hope for a deal to end the ongoing government shutdown shifted to the Senate Saturday as talks between the White House and House Republicans yielded no agreement.

In a Saturday morning meeting, House Speaker John Boehner told GOP lawmakers there is no deal with President Barack Obama to end the fiscal impasse.

The message of that meeting, sources in the room said, was a "let's stick together" pep rally.

After what appeared to be a productive meeting with Obama on Thursday, the two sides have been unable to reach any agreement on spending even the shutdown approaches the end of its second week and a deadline to raise the nation's debt ceiling looms.

House leaders told the conference Saturday that the White House has not yet responded to their latest proposals.

Majority Leader Eric Cantor told House members that it is "up to Senate Republicans to hold strong," as attention shifts to the upper chamber, where Republicans have been outlining the framework of a compromise deal.

Boehner informed the conference that they're waiting to see what Senate Republicans offer to the White House, but that if the House GOP stays strong and united, they can reject any proposal that they think does not go far enough.

Sen. Susan Collins of Maine has proposed a plan that would reopen the government, extend the debt ceiling for several months, and eliminate a tax on medical devices. She presented that plan to Obama at the Friday meeting.

The House does not plan to vote on any legislation Saturday to address the shutdown or the debt ceiling, although members have been advised that they could be called back for votes on short notice. After a series of unrelated measures to be considered Saturday before noon, there are no House votes currently scheduled until 6:30 p.m. on Monday.

House Democrats kept up attempts to bring up a "clean" continuing resolution that would restore funding for the government, marching into the House chamber and making repeated procedural requests for a vote. But without support from moderate House Republicans, those efforts were just for show.

The Senate is set to take a test vote Saturday afternoon on a measure that would extend the debt ceiling until after the 2014 midterm elections.

One sticking point in the negotiations so far has been the length of the debt ceiling extension.

House Republicans had put forward a six-week delay, which Democrats argue would set up another fiscal crisis right before the crucial holiday shopping season.

On October 12 2013 23:43 Caihead wrote:

I'm not a conservative myself, yet I completely understand the ideological basis for many successful Western diplomats and leaders to fundamentally mistrust democracy (Otto Von Bismarck) and instead prefer that a handpicked well-trained, well-educated, and capable people be in control of the country. How individuals derive a position of power should be based on their aptitude, not popularity. I wish people would realize that functional representative democracies are systems where the end goal is exactly that - capable individuals being put into positions of power with the scrutiny of the public. Successful examples of panels or positions being appointed by bureaucrats exist today, most notably in Singapore, which is simultaneously rated as a "hybrid regime" by The Economist yet remains consistently one of the least corrupt countries in the world.

Speaker John Boehner told House Republicans Saturday morning that his efforts to strike a deal with President Barack Obama are at a standstill.

There is no agreement, Boehner said in a room in the Capitol Saturday, and there are no negotiations between House Republicans and the White House, since Obama rejected the speaker’s effort to lift the debt ceiling for six weeks and reopen government while setting up a budget negotiating process.

With that, a familiar dynamic has resurfaced 12 days into the government shutdown and five days before Treasury says the nation runs out of borrowing authority: The pendulum has swung back to Senate Republicans, who now look more likely to cut a deal with Obama to end the first government shutdown since 1996, and avoid the first default on U.S. debt in history.

After the news that talks between Boehner and Obama have broken down, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) emerged on the floor to emphasize that the nation’s eyes are firmly fixed on the chamber.

On October 13 2013 07:27 Danglars wrote:
politico

Basically, Obama met with Boehner and other Congressional leaders and they talked. For a little bit, it looked like some kind of deal would be reached. Now, we know it didn't happen.

On October 13 2013 07:37 Gorsameth wrote:

I never got the idea a deal would be reached. Either the Republicans open the government or it stays close. Dem's have made it perfectly clear there not negotiating while the country is held hostage.