UK Politics Mega-thread - Page 424

On June 07 2018 18:52 Jockmcplop wrote:


Pretty much everyone still wants us to back out of Brexit

On June 07 2018 18:52 Jockmcplop wrote:


I can see why they would lie about it. Pretty much everyone still wants us to back out of Brexit, and the political situation in the UK is 'fluid' to say the least.
I'm not saying they are lying though. The tories do have a reputation for carrying out policy in a short sighted and disorganized manner, but then the EU would surely play that aspect up to turn the public against Brexit if they can.

On June 14 2018 05:37 Zaros wrote:
What does it matter, we aren't actually leaving now and all the major brexiteers have given up, depressing.

On June 14 2018 07:12 Gorsameth wrote:
It was pretty clear the EU would be aggressive in its negotiations, anything else would only embolden others to leave.
It's in the EU's best interest to screw over the UK has hard as it can get away with as a deterrent.

On June 14 2018 22:16 KwarK wrote:
How can there be no doubt about the will of the people after a referendum went nearly 50/50?

On June 14 2018 23:10 TheDwf wrote:
If the guy is so much into "the will of the people," why doesn't he suggest a second referendum about how to implement the Brexit? If people are divided about how to proceed, it's the simplest solution.

On June 14 2018 23:16 kollin wrote:

I used to support that, but I think a second referendum has two problems. The first is that constitutionally referendums are advisory, and the more often they happen the more often the parliamentary aspect of British democracy is undermined or confused. It becomes less clear how MPs actually play a part in a vague, uncodified cocktail of direct and representative democratic norms. The second problem is that the form the second referendum would have to take would almost inevitably lead to a third referendum on how to proceed, unless the deal presented in the second referendum is accepted (seems unlikely). I think the easiest way for Brexit to be 'stopped' or reversed is for it to actually happen first, though the conditions of British re-entry into the Eurozone would likely be even more popularly unacceptable than staying in the EU is now.

On June 14 2018 23:33 TheDwf wrote:

The counter-argument about the Parliament is valid, but is it really more democratic to leave the method of the Brexit to the internal struggles and power games of the majority?

You meant re-entry in the EU? Because UK was not part of the eurozone

On June 15 2018 06:09 Jockmcplop wrote:
I think its safe to say now that Brexit is the worst thing to happen to British politics in years. Its not the act of leaving the EU itself, but the divisions it has created in the two major parties. People who should be allies are enemies based on the pot luck of the constituency they happen to represent, there's mini rebellions all over the place, and nothing but confusion and second guessing for leadership, on both sides.
I can't see how anything good will come from the chaos.

On June 15 2018 06:15 Gorsameth wrote:
The division and backstabbery in itself is not the main issue I think. Its that no one actually wants to take charge because to do so means your the party that gets blamed for the inevitable issues of the Brexit.
The usual outlet of this chaos, someone winning and taking control, doesn't exist and likely won't until after the exit so it just keeps on festering.

On June 15 2018 10:09 KwarK wrote:
It'd be worse without FPTP. FPTP exaggerates slight advantages into heavy majorities. The problem is May completely dropped the ball in the last election. They will need to call another election before any Brexit treaty is passed, and I think they all know it. The problem is they know they will lose it and so they're just going to run out the clock anyway.

On June 15 2018 15:26 Zaros wrote:


May would lose it, I think another Candidate could beat Corbyn for a majority but every day that passes with May in charge reduces that chance and the conservatives seem to scared to do anything.

Only way I see any Brexit not in name only(leave single market, customs union and ECJ) happening is a mini constitutional crisis with May's deal being rejected by Parliament, EU not offering anything else and a new election/confidence vote in May unwilling to be called/won. In that scenario Parliament just gets stuck on Brexit with nowhere to move and the clock ticks down to no deal. The only other possibility is the Cons get rid of May, a brexiteer wins the leadership and goes to the country for another early election and gets a majority which is probably very unlikely

On June 15 2018 18:39 iamthedave wrote:


The only Tories who could realistically replace May are Boris Johnson, Michael Gove and Jacob Rees-Mogg. Of them, maybe Rees-Mogg could pull it off, but he'd be a disastrous PM, going by the things he's said in interviews. Seems very much a politician from 20 years ago.

And regardless, all of them are smart enough to know full well what will happen to the person in charge when it all goes down.

Meanwhile, Labour is still recovering from trying to stab Corbyn in the back and discovering that actually, their voters do actually want Corbyn in charge for now, so all they got from months of bullshit was making Labour the weakest its been in over a decade at a time when Labour needs to be stronger than ever.

A non-functional Labour, a barely functional Tory party, and a weak government lead by a Remainer who has no idea how to navigate through a mess she almost certainly thought was an impossibility.