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United States44340 Posts
On June 25 2016 08:20 plasmidghost wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2016 08:18 Deleuze wrote:On June 25 2016 08:07 plasmidghost wrote:
So is Boris Johnson going to become the new prime minister? How does that work in the UK? Cameron said he'd expect a new party leader to be appointed by the autumn conference. So all party member will need to vote someone in. Johnson is forerunner but Harriet Harmen (home secretary) is second favourite. Is that similar to the US's secretary of state position?
No, it's similar to your President. In a parliamentary system the executive is drawn from the legislative. The party that controls what is effectively congress can legislate as they wish. Therefore whoever has the allegiance of the largest bloc in "congress" gets to form a government (the executive). Prime Minister is a mix of speaker of the house and president.
Cameron has concluded that this defeat means that he has lost the support of the people and therefore has chosen to stand down as the leader of the Conservative party. This means that he no longer leads them in the House of Commons. Someone must always lead the MPs in the House of Commons and as the Conservative party has the majority of MPs it is assumed that whoever replaces Cameron as leader will be invited by the queen to form a government.
It's kinda funny that Americans have no idea how political systems other than their own work.
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United Kingdom10823 Posts
On June 25 2016 08:11 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2016 08:07 plasmidghost wrote:
So is Boris Johnson going to become the new prime minister? How does that work in the UK? The guy is a (former) mayor not a member of the government. (Tho it is possible) As I understand it the Tory (conservatives) party (of which Cameron was the leader) will chose a new leader who will then become the new prime minister.
He's a member of parliament now; totally possible.
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On June 25 2016 08:29 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2016 08:20 plasmidghost wrote:On June 25 2016 08:18 Deleuze wrote:On June 25 2016 08:07 plasmidghost wrote:
So is Boris Johnson going to become the new prime minister? How does that work in the UK? Cameron said he'd expect a new party leader to be appointed by the autumn conference. So all party member will need to vote someone in. Johnson is forerunner but Harriet Harmen (home secretary) is second favourite. Is that similar to the US's secretary of state position? No, it's similar to your President. In a parliamentary system the executive is drawn from the legislative. The party that controls what is effectively congress can legislate as they wish. Therefore whoever has the allegiance of the largest bloc in "congress" gets to form a government (the executive). Prime Minister is a mix of speaker of the house and president. Cameron has concluded that this defeat means that he has lost the support of the people and therefore has chosen to stand down as the leader of the Conservative party. This means that he no longer leads them in the House of Commons. Someone must always lead the MPs in the House of Commons and as the Conservative party has the majority of MPs it is assumed that whoever replaces Cameron as leader will be invited by the queen to form a government. It's kinda funny that Americans have no idea how political systems other than their own work.
The concept of electing people to then vote on the head of a goverment confuses us. That an multiparty systems where you have to form functional governments. We just like our left vs right are we worn issues, because we like stability.
Ok, thats a lie, we fucking hate it so much. But our media loves it because its easy programming.
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I agree with time, it was a victory for the common people against the ruling elite.
http://time.com/4381313/brexit-vote-david-cameron-elites/
The Brexit Vote Is a New Milestone in the Global War on Elites
In a stunning victory for the anti-establishment forces that have upended mainstream politics across the Western world, British voters chose on Thursday to pull their country out of the European Union, sending global markets into a tailspin and encouraging anti-E.U. forces across the continent to push for their own referenda on whether to break away.
“The E.U. is failing, the E.U. is dying,” declared the leader of the U.K. Independence Party, Nigel Farage, one of the leaders of the campaign for the British exit, or Brexit, from the union formed from the ruins of Europe after World War II. “It’s a victory against big business…against big politics,” he told reporters early on Friday morning, as the results showed 52% of the votes had been cast in favor of leaving and 48% against.
“In a sense, the result of this referendum is a victory for Trumpism the world over,” says Tony Travers, a noted political scientist in London and adviser to the British parliament. “It definitely has the same roots.” Trump supporters, much like backers of Brexit, tend to feel that traditional parties have ignored their concerns over migration and economic inequality for too long. Their response has been a wide-ranging revolt against the status quo that has opened the political arena to a variety of upstart candidates for the first time in a generation or more.
In France, Denmark, Sweden, Austria and the Netherlands, among other E.U. members, right wing and Eurosceptic parties have made enormous gains in popularity, especially after more than a million asylum seekers poured into Europe last year from across the Middle East and North Africa. Many of these parties have reacted to the U.K. referendum by urging their countries to follow suit. “Now it’s our turn,” the far-right leader of the Dutch Party for Freedom, Geert Wilders, told a local radio station on Friday.
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United States44340 Posts
Anyone want a sig bet on whether the UK actually leaves the single market? I'm thinking no.
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On June 25 2016 06:45 Espers wrote:
the salt from the remain side is unreal.. older people should have their voting rights removed, working class are xenophobic, links between a lack of university education and voting leave so they're all uneducated plebians. so mad.
Exact same shit can be heard in US politics about people voting for Hillary. Modern day left is offensive that it's no wonder people call leftists communists
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United Kingdom10823 Posts
I don't think Britain will leave the single market. It's just down to how much it'll cost to stay in
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On June 25 2016 08:36 KwarK wrote:
Anyone want a sig bet on whether the UK actually leaves the single market? I'm thinking no.
They won't but they'll have to stump up a fee similar to Norway, 95% of a membership fee, not paid to the EU but paid all the same 
http://leavehq.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=157
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On June 25 2016 08:37 pellejohnson wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2016 06:45 Espers wrote:
the salt from the remain side is unreal.. older people should have their voting rights removed, working class are xenophobic, links between a lack of university education and voting leave so they're all uneducated plebians. so mad. Exact same shit can be heard in US politics about people voting for Hillary. Modern day left is offensive that it's no wonder people call leftists communists
If the stay had won, they other side would be doing the same thing. Talking about the educated elite forcing multiculturalism, bowing for other nations, calling them traitors. A 1% victory is not overwhelming. Its just sqweeking by.
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United States44340 Posts
On June 25 2016 08:41 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2016 08:37 pellejohnson wrote:On June 25 2016 06:45 Espers wrote:
the salt from the remain side is unreal.. older people should have their voting rights removed, working class are xenophobic, links between a lack of university education and voting leave so they're all uneducated plebians. so mad. Exact same shit can be heard in US politics about people voting for Hillary. Modern day left is offensive that it's no wonder people call leftists communists If the stay had won, they other side would be doing the same thing. Talking about the educated elite forcing multiculturalism, bowing for other nations, calling them traitors. A 1% victory is not overwhelming. Its just sqweeking by.
When stay was winning for the first hour or two the leave side made a large number of accusations of rigging.
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United Kingdom10823 Posts
On June 25 2016 08:46 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2016 08:41 Plansix wrote:On June 25 2016 08:37 pellejohnson wrote:On June 25 2016 06:45 Espers wrote:
the salt from the remain side is unreal.. older people should have their voting rights removed, working class are xenophobic, links between a lack of university education and voting leave so they're all uneducated plebians. so mad. Exact same shit can be heard in US politics about people voting for Hillary. Modern day left is offensive that it's no wonder people call leftists communists If the stay had won, they other side would be doing the same thing. Talking about the educated elite forcing multiculturalism, bowing for other nations, calling them traitors. A 1% victory is not overwhelming. Its just sqweeking by. When stay was winning for the first hour or two the leave side made a large number of accusations of rigging.
But that's impossible, we took our own pens!
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On June 25 2016 08:36 KwarK wrote:
Anyone want a sig bet on whether the UK actually leaves the single market? I'm thinking no.
I take the bet. They'll leave.
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On June 25 2016 08:46 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2016 08:41 Plansix wrote:On June 25 2016 08:37 pellejohnson wrote:On June 25 2016 06:45 Espers wrote:
the salt from the remain side is unreal.. older people should have their voting rights removed, working class are xenophobic, links between a lack of university education and voting leave so they're all uneducated plebians. so mad. Exact same shit can be heard in US politics about people voting for Hillary. Modern day left is offensive that it's no wonder people call leftists communists If the stay had won, they other side would be doing the same thing. Talking about the educated elite forcing multiculturalism, bowing for other nations, calling them traitors. A 1% victory is not overwhelming. Its just sqweeking by. When stay was winning for the first hour or two the leave side made a large number of accusations of rigging.
If I have learned anything from anti-establishment voters in the US primaries is that gloat when they win, whine about cheating when they lose. That the system should be respected, unless it doesn't go in their favor.
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United States44340 Posts
On June 25 2016 08:50 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2016 08:46 KwarK wrote:On June 25 2016 08:41 Plansix wrote:On June 25 2016 08:37 pellejohnson wrote:On June 25 2016 06:45 Espers wrote:
the salt from the remain side is unreal.. older people should have their voting rights removed, working class are xenophobic, links between a lack of university education and voting leave so they're all uneducated plebians. so mad. Exact same shit can be heard in US politics about people voting for Hillary. Modern day left is offensive that it's no wonder people call leftists communists If the stay had won, they other side would be doing the same thing. Talking about the educated elite forcing multiculturalism, bowing for other nations, calling them traitors. A 1% victory is not overwhelming. Its just sqweeking by. When stay was winning for the first hour or two the leave side made a large number of accusations of rigging. If I have learned anything from anti-establishment voters in the US primaries is that gloat when they win, whine about cheating when they lose. That the system should be respected, unless it doesn't go in their favor.
The weird thing about is that they thought that the rigging was specifically by providing pencils so votes could be erased and recast. That seems like both an extremely unreliable way of rigging an election and also quite a pointless one. Tony Blair didn't sneak WMDs into Iraq to convince the British public, he just lied about them. Why would you need thousands of vote counters all secretly changing votes when you could just lie about the outcome.
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On June 25 2016 08:52 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2016 08:50 Plansix wrote:On June 25 2016 08:46 KwarK wrote:On June 25 2016 08:41 Plansix wrote:On June 25 2016 08:37 pellejohnson wrote:On June 25 2016 06:45 Espers wrote:
the salt from the remain side is unreal.. older people should have their voting rights removed, working class are xenophobic, links between a lack of university education and voting leave so they're all uneducated plebians. so mad. Exact same shit can be heard in US politics about people voting for Hillary. Modern day left is offensive that it's no wonder people call leftists communists If the stay had won, they other side would be doing the same thing. Talking about the educated elite forcing multiculturalism, bowing for other nations, calling them traitors. A 1% victory is not overwhelming. Its just sqweeking by. When stay was winning for the first hour or two the leave side made a large number of accusations of rigging. If I have learned anything from anti-establishment voters in the US primaries is that gloat when they win, whine about cheating when they lose. That the system should be respected, unless it doesn't go in their favor. The weird thing about is that they thought that the rigging was specifically by providing pencils so votes could be erased and recast. That seems like both an extremely unreliable way of rigging an election and also quite a pointless one. Tony Blair didn't sneak WMDs into Iraq to convince the British public, he just lied about them. Why would you need thousands of vote counters all secretly changing votes when you could just lie about the outcome.
Most conspiracy theories are based moon logic and space law anyways. We had a state convinced of a goverment take over for a while, because there was a military training exercise in the state. That same state also thinks our president is Muslim, so it all fits.
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I just love how people love to point fingers, making statements how an entire group of people on the political spectrum behaves without any nuance, falling into the exact same caveat. It's just so god damn hilariously self defeating..
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Thanks Obama!
![[image loading]](http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user3303/imageroot/2016/06/23/20160624_obama.jpg)
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how many other things does that correlate wtih? given how generic that is; there coudl be tons of correlates.
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On June 25 2016 07:12 Dangermousecatdog wrote:
Oh dear, the UK politics thread has been taken over by non UK people. To quickly answer the last 3 pages of randomness:
Since Scotland and Ireland will be likely to secede, Little England(er) would be an appropriate name. Wales might take offence. BTW Great Britain is the name of the main island, not the name of the country. The name of our country is actually The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland or UK for short.
No, UK will not ally with Russia. Don't be silly. Perhaps if England feels like invading France. Or Ukraine. Got to use that most powerful military in the EU somewhere to detract from lack of oil revenue when Scotland leaves I guess.
The Leave media vastly outperformed Remain media. It was so lopsided that if you got the opposite impression, congratulations, you read one of the only few remaining quality newspapers in UK.
Nobody has a clue what a brexit actually means. It's unprecedented and it wasn't laid out by the "leaders" of the brexit camp who seems rather suprised that they have won. Especially Boris Johnson who did a runner when left his house in the moring.
The youth population are pro-EU because they are the ones most affected by leaving the EU.
Scotland CAN'T secede, any independence referendum has to be approved by Westminster, you really think they're going to allow that right now?
I agree morally and ethically they should be allowed to secede if they want but I'm talking politically here. What can Scotland do if Westminster tells them to fuck off? Vote for the SNP in the next UK election so they gain the three seats they don't ALREADY have? Vote for Scottish Labor? The same Scottish Labor that led the campaign to remain?
Scotland can talk about seceding all it wants and morally and ethically they're on the right side. Politically though, they're stuck for as long as Westminster wants them to stay
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On June 25 2016 09:23 showstealer1829 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2016 07:12 Dangermousecatdog wrote:
Oh dear, the UK politics thread has been taken over by non UK people. To quickly answer the last 3 pages of randomness:
Since Scotland and Ireland will be likely to secede, Little England(er) would be an appropriate name. Wales might take offence. BTW Great Britain is the name of the main island, not the name of the country. The name of our country is actually The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland or UK for short.
No, UK will not ally with Russia. Don't be silly. Perhaps if England feels like invading France. Or Ukraine. Got to use that most powerful military in the EU somewhere to detract from lack of oil revenue when Scotland leaves I guess.
The Leave media vastly outperformed Remain media. It was so lopsided that if you got the opposite impression, congratulations, you read one of the only few remaining quality newspapers in UK.
Nobody has a clue what a brexit actually means. It's unprecedented and it wasn't laid out by the "leaders" of the brexit camp who seems rather suprised that they have won. Especially Boris Johnson who did a runner when left his house in the moring.
The youth population are pro-EU because they are the ones most affected by leaving the EU.
Scotland CAN'T secede, any independence referendum has to be approved by Westminster, you really think they're going to allow that right now? I agree morally and ethically they should be allowed to secede if they want but I'm talking politically here. What can Scotland do if Westminster tells them to fuck off? Vote for the SNP in the next UK election so they gain the three seats they don't ALREADY have? Vote for Scottish Labor? The same Scottish Labor that led the campaign to remain? Scotland can talk about seceding all it wants and morally and ethically they're on the right side. Politically though, they're stuck for as long as Westminster wants them to stay UK could use Scotland as a bargain chip in the negotiations with the EU.
Thought it would be a very foolish thing to do, but so was betting your reelection on a close referendum.
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EPT
