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The gun control argument stops now. I know it's fun to argue about it in the heat of the tragedy when you can get all worked up about it but it's pretty disrespectful and if you don't care enough about the issue to make a separate topic for gun control then you don't care enough to shit on the tragedy by exploiting it. A gun control topic can be found here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=313472Also stop posting links to his facebook. TL will be no part of an unconfirmed witch hunt. |
On December 17 2012 04:35 Coagulation wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 03:20 Caihead wrote:On December 17 2012 03:18 Gene wrote:
I know, but I'm surprised by the exact opposite inthis situation. I'm hearing more about the victims, is what I'm saying. But I guess the grain of salt here is that I don't have TV to really lay it on thick with the killer angle. I'm just trying to prove by empirical evidence that this is exactly what's going to happen as time goes by, you won't remember the victim's names either, because there is no need to unless there is some personal stake. The media falsely creates a persona and mystique around the killer and makes him out to be a glorified anti hero, somebody that you are personally interested in, and that's why history always remembers the killers and not the victims. The truth of the matter is, our lives are all ultimately insignificant, and wallow in mundane mediocrity. Only the lucky few get to be involved with anything significant. We all want to be remembered by history and talked about and matter, and we as a species are so fundamentally attracted to the exceptional and the distinctive, regardless of whether it's good or bad. It's so difficult to do anything positive, to contribute and work hard to accomplish something you can be proud of, and in the end you are still likely to be forgotten by society simply because you were unpopular or didn't fit in with the zeitgeist. Yet it's infinitely easier to do something BAD, something so fundamentally appalling that EVERYONE will remember you. That's what's so fundamentally disturbing about the media coverage. I havnt really posted in this thread cause theres really not much to say that hasnt been said already but this post is something that I think about a lot. It is so easy to become immortalized in history for doing something bad and its next to impossible to achieve that same amount of fame doing something good.
I was planning to write another retardedly long post about reasoning and ethics of suicide by cop and mass shootings in the same manner as this one. But since it didn't really provoke much reaction I figured people weren't interested in this sort of a thing.
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On December 16 2012 20:05 lonelyPotato wrote:
Morgan Freeman's Opinion, thought I would post it up xD
"You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here's why.
It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single *victim* of Columbine? Disturbed people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.
CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.
You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news."
Brilliant, just brilliant. He hit the nail on the head with that piece of writing.
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On December 16 2012 20:05 lonelyPotato wrote:
Morgan Freeman's Opinion, thought I would post it up xD
"You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here's why.
It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single *victim* of Columbine? Disturbed people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.
CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.
You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news."
Tim Ferriss backs this up in 4HWW. He calls it "selective ignorance" and says it's crucial to do if you want to be anything in life. You don't make yourself a more productive citizen or a better human being by constantly inhaling all the information being thrown at you. You treat information like food - intake enough at the right time to keep going; too much is just going to bog you down. We would all do ourselves a service by not listening to the news half as much as we do now, or, ideally, never.
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It reminds me of the time I heard about the Virginia Tech shooting.
While I was on vacation.
In Venice.
VENICE.
WHY did it get all the way to Venice?! Freaking sensationalism, that's why...
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What really amazed me in an interview I watched with one of the parents...
Apparently while a teacher was attempting to defend her students(she ended up being shot in the process) all of the kids bum rushed the door and out of the room. One of the students running out of the room described the sound as 'hammers falling on the floor-- they kept running until they hit the main road and down the street. The main point is..
Do kids understand what guns sound like/can do in a situation like this because of video games(COD etc.)?
The student whose parents were in the interview was 'scared that the gunman was going to come back and get him' even in his own home. From a psychological standpoint do kids understand the meaning of death in real life compared to a video game? Honestly I see video games being both a positive and negative factor in this day in age. And if knowing the sound of a gun because of a video game can save at least one life so be it.
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On December 17 2012 03:20 Caihead wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 03:18 Gene wrote:
I know, but I'm surprised by the exact opposite inthis situation. I'm hearing more about the victims, is what I'm saying. But I guess the grain of salt here is that I don't have TV to really lay it on thick with the killer angle. I'm just trying to prove by empirical evidence that this is exactly what's going to happen as time goes by, you won't remember the victim's names either, because there is no need to unless there is some personal stake. The media falsely creates a persona and mystique around the killer and makes him out to be a glorified anti hero, somebody that you are personally interested in, and that's why history always remembers the killers and not the victims. The truth of the matter is, our lives are all ultimately insignificant, and wallow in mundane mediocrity. Only the lucky few get to be involved with anything significant. We all want to be remembered by history and talked about and matter, and we as a species are so fundamentally attracted to the exceptional and the distinctive, regardless of whether it's good or bad. It's so difficult to do anything positive, to contribute and work hard to accomplish something you can be proud of, and in the end you are still likely to be forgotten by society simply because you were unpopular or didn't fit in with the zeitgeist. Yet it's infinitely easier to do something BAD, something so fundamentally appalling that EVERYONE will remember you. That's what's so fundamentally disturbing about the media coverage.
I agree with the spirit of your thoughts on the subject, but I'm not sure you are leveling blame in the proper manner. Our media saturated/dominated culture certainly lends itself to certain sorts of exploitative, fame-garnering actions or at the very least a tacit understanding by all that if one does something dramatic, a huge number of people will know about it via pervasive social and traditional media exposure. But you've conflated the track of human history with our contemporary media issues when you group them together so, and I think you are more directly speaking to an inherent problem in "history" rather than contemporary media trends (though they certainly make things worse, imo) History as we write it and read it revolves around names, be them names of places, people, and things. Consequently, a fair bit of information falls by the wayside in favor of these name-centric historical perspectives. Our remembrance of killers over their victims is a pretty good indicator of this very phenomena, as the historical entry for "was murdered by a famous killer" is far less salient than "killed a ton of people".
I guess my point is that while contemporary media certainly influences a fair bit of cultural velocity/temperament, I think the general manner with which we understand and call upon history in the traditional sense is perhaps even more worthy of our criticism.
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"Guns make impulse killings easy" - Carl Sagan
User was temp banned for this post.
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United Kingdom3482 Posts
I'm curious about schools having 'lockdown plans' for situations like this. I used to live in the US until I was 8 (1998) and we never had anything like that. Is this a fairly new thing because I was really surprised and pretty depressed that elementary schools needed to have something like that.
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On December 17 2012 07:46 imallinson wrote:
I'm curious about schools having 'lockdown plans' for situations like this. I used to live in the US until I was 8 (1998) and we never had anything like that. Is this a fairly new thing because I was really surprised and pretty depressed that elementary schools needed to have something like that.
I was in grade school in the early 90's and we had lockdown plans.
EDIT: They were probably not as rehearsed as they are now though.
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United Kingdom3482 Posts
On December 17 2012 07:59 Medrea wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 07:46 imallinson wrote:
I'm curious about schools having 'lockdown plans' for situations like this. I used to live in the US until I was 8 (1998) and we never had anything like that. Is this a fairly new thing because I was really surprised and pretty depressed that elementary schools needed to have something like that. I was in grade school in the early 90's and we had lockdown plans. EDIT: They were probably not as rehearsed as they are now though.
Maybe I completely forgot about it then, or my school was out of the ordinary.
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On December 17 2012 08:05 imallinson wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 07:59 Medrea wrote:On December 17 2012 07:46 imallinson wrote:
I'm curious about schools having 'lockdown plans' for situations like this. I used to live in the US until I was 8 (1998) and we never had anything like that. Is this a fairly new thing because I was really surprised and pretty depressed that elementary schools needed to have something like that. I was in grade school in the early 90's and we had lockdown plans. EDIT: They were probably not as rehearsed as they are now though. Maybe I completely forgot about it then, or my school was out of the ordinary.
If you ask your parents they might tell you about the air raid drills they used to do?
Teachers were also taught on how to lockdown the school in case of a then suspected Russian invasion. Our current lockdown protocols are basically built around that. Dont even think they have been improved much either.
Do you remember your teachers telling you that in case of an emergency to lineup against the wall that is NOT in direct view of the door? Usually the same wall the door is on.
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Oh God....this Victoria Soto.
WHAT. A. HERO.
I am touched by her actions....telling her students to go to a closet and then shielding them while she died tragically taking shots from the psycho....
What a hero Victoria.....I am awed...
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On December 17 2012 05:13 Gatored wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2012 20:05 lonelyPotato wrote:
Morgan Freeman's Opinion, thought I would post it up xD
"You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here's why.
It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single *victim* of Columbine? Disturbed people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.
CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.
You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news." Brilliant, just brilliant. He hit the nail on the head with that piece of writing.
Typical celebrity bla-bla. He only suggests symbolic solutions, no causal. He's like Obama, secretly not caring at all about a real solution and just enjoying his position. I hate such people.
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On December 17 2012 18:13 Perscienter wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 05:13 Gatored wrote:On December 16 2012 20:05 lonelyPotato wrote:
Morgan Freeman's Opinion, thought I would post it up xD
"You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here's why.
It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single *victim* of Columbine? Disturbed people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.
CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.
You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news." Brilliant, just brilliant. He hit the nail on the head with that piece of writing. Typical celebrity bla-bla. He only suggests symbolic solutions, no causal. He's like Obama, secretly not caring at all about a real solution and just enjoying his position. I hate such people.
Except he never wrote that.
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And still... I agree with him. Hiding details about the murderer while caring for someone like Victoria Soto is a part of a solution.
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On December 17 2012 18:51 OuchyDathurts wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 18:13 Perscienter wrote:On December 17 2012 05:13 Gatored wrote:On December 16 2012 20:05 lonelyPotato wrote:
Morgan Freeman's Opinion, thought I would post it up xD
"You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here's why.
It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single *victim* of Columbine? Disturbed people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.
CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.
You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news." Brilliant, just brilliant. He hit the nail on the head with that piece of writing. Typical celebrity bla-bla. He only suggests symbolic solutions, no causal. He's like Obama, secretly not caring at all about a real solution and just enjoying his position. I hate such people. Except he never wrote that.
Might want to offer a link.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/morgan-freeman-didn-write-anti-media-diatribe-article-1.1221958
oops, I'm a little late, still more people will see it.
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EPT
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