EPTShooting of Trayvon Martin - Page 171
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This is a sensitive and complex issue, please do not make comments without first reading the facts, which are cataloged in the OP. If you make an uninformed post, or one that isn't relevant to the discussion, you will be moderated. If in doubt, don't post. | ||
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Tewks44
United States2032 Posts
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czylu
477 Posts
On June 28 2013 02:48 ranshaked wrote: I think everyone has a different idea of what they consider "danger of their life" When I was jumped years ago, I was genuinely in danger of my life. If I had a gun on me, I would have shot the people, but I didn't. Instead, I had to have someone drive me to a hospital with blood everywhere. It turns out I was fine (didn't crack the orbital), but at the time I genuinely would have used a gun if I had one. In the heat of the moment, anything can happen, so in a way I see why Zimmerman shot Trayvon. and after the moment has passed, you suffer the consequences, as Mr. Zimmerman has/will. On June 28 2013 02:49 Tewks44 wrote: What is the point of guns if you can't use them to defend yourself? There is a lot of stuff that's not clear, but what is clear is that Zimmerman sustained injuries on his face and head. He was getting beaten up. What is the purpose of carrying a fire arm if you aren't allowed to use it? Are you expected to objectively determine how severely you are getting beaten up while fists are slamming you in the face? Are you suppose to analytically weigh the likelihood of the individual killing you while he's on top of you? Bringing a gun to a fist fight, is not self-defense, it's murder. How much you feared for your life is irrelevant to the actual danger to your life. Trayvon was in more danager from Zimmerman, then Zimmerman was from Trayvon. Regardless of Mr. Zimmerman's intentions, it is abundantly clear that he is very incompetent, should have never been in the situ | ||
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Thieving Magpie
United States6752 Posts
On June 28 2013 02:49 Tewks44 wrote: What is the point of guns if you can't use them to defend yourself? There is a lot of stuff that's not clear, but what is clear is that Zimmerman sustained injuries on his face and head. He was getting beaten up. What is the purpose of carrying a fire arm if you aren't allowed to use it? Are you expected to objectively determine how severely you are getting beaten up while fists are slamming you in the face? Are you suppose to analytically weigh the likelihood of the individual killing you while he's on top of you? And hence why we have people who want more gun control. Getting punched once should not be valid reason to shoot someone. | ||
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Kaitlin
United States2958 Posts
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Ghostcom
Denmark4783 Posts
EDIT: I take Katilins post to mean "yes" :p | ||
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farvacola
United States18872 Posts
On June 28 2013 02:49 Tewks44 wrote: What is the point of guns if you can't use them to defend yourself? There is a lot of stuff that's not clear, but what is clear is that Zimmerman sustained injuries on his face and head. He was getting beaten up. What is the purpose of carrying a fire arm if you aren't allowed to use it? Are you expected to objectively determine how severely you are getting beaten up while fists are slamming you in the face? Are you suppose to analytically weigh the likelihood of the individual killing you while he's on top of you? This isn't the juncture in which most people are judging Zimmerman. It isn't the threat once being beaten that is important to dissect, because as you point out, at that point self-defense is already justified. What's important is how Zimmerman and Martin ended up in conflict in the first place, and framing the background of said conflict is pretty much what this case is all about. | ||
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m4inbrain
1505 Posts
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ranshaked
United States870 Posts
On June 28 2013 02:50 czylu wrote: and after the moment has passed, you suffer the consequences, as Mr. Zimmerman has/will. Why should I get in trouble? I was jumped, they instigated it? How do I know that I'm not going to die unless it happens? If I'm bleeding everywhere, and I'm having the shit kicked out of me, at what point do I get to shoot? Or, do I just let them continue to beat the hell out of me until they stop? Why isn't lethal force on my end allowed in order to say myself from bodily harm/possible death? (you CAN die from freak shit like being punched once and fall down unconscious) Personally, if someone ever does it again to me, I'd have no problem shooting them in self defense. If you want to punch me in the face, fine, then take a bullet to the face imo | ||
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dAPhREAk
Nauru12397 Posts
i am on a phone deposition and cant watch the feed. | ||
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Tewks44
United States2032 Posts
On June 28 2013 02:51 Thieving Magpie wrote: And hence why we have people who want more gun control. Getting punched once should not be valid reason to shoot someone. I don't know why you keep insisting Trayvon only punched Zimmerman once as if it's an accepted fact. EDIT: according to the post below me this is something ZImmerman said himself. My apologies. | ||
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m4inbrain
1505 Posts
On June 28 2013 02:54 Tewks44 wrote: I don't know why you keep insisting Trayvon only punched Zimmerman once as if it's an accepted fact. Afaik, that's what Zman said. edit: daphreak, up until now it was the judge lecturing the defense. does LR mean liverecord? | ||
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biology]major
United States2253 Posts
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ragz_gt
9172 Posts
On June 28 2013 02:53 ranshaked wrote: Why should I get in trouble? I was jumped, they instigated it? How do I know that I'm not going to die unless it happens? If I'm bleeding everywhere, and I'm having the shit kicked out of me, at what point do I get to shoot? Or, do I just let them continue to beat the hell out of me until they stop? Why isn't lethal force on my end allowed in order to say myself from bodily harm/possible death? (you CAN die from freak shit like being punched once and fall down unconscious) Personally, if someone ever does it again to me, I'd have no problem shooting them in self defense. If you want to punch me in the face, fine, then take a bullet to the face imo If you instigated the situation in the first place, then you will be, and that's what's on trial now: did Zimmerman instigate the situation? | ||
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dAPhREAk
Nauru12397 Posts
punched once, and then slammed his head against the concrete. so, yes, only one punch according to zimmerman so far. | ||
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Thieving Magpie
United States6752 Posts
On June 28 2013 02:54 Tewks44 wrote: I don't know why you keep insisting Trayvon only punched Zimmerman once as if it's an accepted fact. No DNA on Travyon's fist, no blood on sidewalk. Bunch of DNA on the front and back of Zimmerman's head. Damage on Zimmerman's head are the front and back. One hit, to cause the bleed, no following hits afterwards to spread the DNA | ||
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m4inbrain
1505 Posts
On June 28 2013 02:56 dAPhREAk wrote: punched once, and then slammed his head against the concrete. so, yes, only one punch according to zimmerman so far. LR = liverecord? Since i would. | ||
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farvacola
United States18872 Posts
On June 28 2013 02:55 m4inbrain wrote: Afaik, that's what Zman said. edit: daphreak, up until now it was the judge lecturing the defense. does LR mean liverecord? It means Daphreak wants a TL court reporter on the case  | ||
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dAPhREAk
Nauru12397 Posts
On June 28 2013 02:56 ragz_gt wrote: If you instigated the situation in the first place, then you will be, and that's what's on trial now: did Zimmerman instigate the situation? even if he instigated, he can still claim self defense. see no. 2. However, the use of deadly force is not justifiable if you find: 1. (Defendant) was attempting to commit, committing, or escaping after the commission of (applicable forcible felony); or 2. (Defendant) initially provoked the use of force against [himself] [herself], unless: a. The force asserted toward the defendant was so great that [he] [she] reasonably believed that [he] [she] was in imminent danger of death or great 63 bodily harm and had exhausted every reasonable means to escape the danger, other than using deadly force on (assailant). b. In good faith, the defendant withdrew from physical contact with (assailant) and clearly indicated to (assailant) that [he] [she] wanted to withdraw and stop the use of deadly force, but (assailant) continued or resumed the use of force. | ||
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ranshaked
United States870 Posts
On June 28 2013 02:56 ragz_gt wrote: No. I told them to quit being rude to the lady behind me. They didn't like what I said, and started throwing punches.If you instigated the situation in the first place, then you will be, and that's what's on trial now: did Zimmerman instigate the situation? What is considered instigating? To me, the first person to throw a punch is the instigator, regardless of what chit chat went on before. | ||
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dAPhREAk
Nauru12397 Posts
On June 28 2013 02:57 farvacola wrote: It means Daphreak wants a TL court reporter on the case LR = live report. i will forgive you if you dont write everything down, just the highlights. ;-) | ||
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