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On March 01 2012 21:30 mememolly wrote:
North korea is poor fuck, large parts of their country have no electricity and their population have been brainwashed in their views of NK and the west, I don't normally support American foreign policy but I'd support a "liberation" of that country, they are living sheltered lives (whether the west's version of capitalist democracy is better than what NK has is open to debate ubt at least they'd have the internet and would be able to listen to music that wasn't state sanctioned).
Currently, anyone who disagrees with the state is sent to a North Korean labour camp that is situated in remote sectors in Russia, here the workers live in shitty conditions and work their "debt" off for no money.
As for their nukes, lol, the boy scouts would roflstomp NK, they aren't a threat to anyone except themselves and the native population who are born into their totalitarian state. The missles they have pointed at south korea is kinda fucked up if true but largely NK is all image both in terms of external and internal politics.
I used to think NK was some badass nation with nukes and shit but after doing some reading and watching some documentaries I've realised they are all poor as fuck and the country is a shithole and they wouldn't even get close to firing their supposed nukes without the west blowing them back into the stone age first.
You are underestimating the power of nukes. The western forces will eventually win against north korea if it decides to use their nukes(which is very unlikely), however, places like seoul would be obliterated before that.
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On March 01 2012 21:30 mememolly wrote:
North korea is poor fuck, large parts of their country have no electricity and their population have been brainwashed in their views of NK and the west, I don't normally support American foreign policy but I'd support a "liberation" of that country, they are living sheltered lives (whether the west's version of capitalist democracy is better than what NK has is open to debate ubt at least they'd have the internet and would be able to listen to music that wasn't state sanctioned).
Currently, anyone who disagrees with the state is sent to a North Korean labour camp that is situated in remote sectors in Russia, here the workers live in shitty conditions and work their "debt" off for no money.
As for their nukes, lol, the boy scouts would roflstomp NK, they aren't a threat to anyone except themselves and the native population who are born into their totalitarian state. The missles they have pointed at south korea is kinda fucked up if true but largely NK is all image both in terms of external and internal politics.
I used to think NK was some badass nation with nukes and shit but after doing some reading and watching some documentaries I've realised they are all poor as fuck and the country is a shithole and they wouldn't even get close to firing their supposed nukes without the west blowing them back into the stone age first.
Then why should we sacrifice money and lives on them? We have every right to liberate them but we don't have an obligation. There needs to be some self-interest in it to justify it.
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Hasn't North Korea done bad things with foreign aid in the past? For some reason i remember reading about how they took millions of dollars of foreign aid and gave it to the upper class types such as government officials and military generals. Could the same happen with food?
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I doubt North-Korea is aiming their nukes at South-Korea. They already have more than enough conventional guns aimed at SK.
It is more likely that they reserve those nukes for Japan, which is within their missile range, and far more hated.
NK has maybe 5-10 nukes. So one nuke on each of the 5-10 largest cities in Japan.
Such a harmless nation that NK.
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Sooo... regular continuation of the status quo?
On March 01 2012 22:53 TheLOLas wrote:
Hasn't North Korea done bad things with foreign aid in the past? For some reason i remember reading about how they took millions of dollars of foreign aid and gave it to the upper class types such as government officials and military generals. Could the same happen with food?
I think it's a given that's what'll happen i mean thats what happens to all the foreign aid that goes into africa.
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On March 01 2012 21:34 pirates wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2012 21:30 mememolly wrote:
North korea is poor fuck, large parts of their country have no electricity and their population have been brainwashed in their views of NK and the west, I don't normally support American foreign policy but I'd support a "liberation" of that country, they are living sheltered lives (whether the west's version of capitalist democracy is better than what NK has is open to debate ubt at least they'd have the internet and would be able to listen to music that wasn't state sanctioned).
Currently, anyone who disagrees with the state is sent to a North Korean labour camp that is situated in remote sectors in Russia, here the workers live in shitty conditions and work their "debt" off for no money.
As for their nukes, lol, the boy scouts would roflstomp NK, they aren't a threat to anyone except themselves and the native population who are born into their totalitarian state. The missles they have pointed at south korea is kinda fucked up if true but largely NK is all image both in terms of external and internal politics.
I used to think NK was some badass nation with nukes and shit but after doing some reading and watching some documentaries I've realised they are all poor as fuck and the country is a shithole and they wouldn't even get close to firing their supposed nukes without the west blowing them back into the stone age first. Its true, they arent much a threat to most developed countries. They are a threat to South Korea. Look how close Pyongyang and Seoul are to eachother. Missile techonology to reach that small distance at low altitude isn't a big deal by todays' standards. North Korea wouldn't have a hard time acquiring these kinds of weapons.
It's really far-fetched that North Korea would attack South Korea. In the korean war, USA used their air superiority to bomb North Korea to smithereens, and they were complaining about air imba. Well, the south's air advantage is even greater today. Back then, North Korea used fairly high tech soviet technology, but today, North Korea is like 30 years behind the South in technology, and the gap is just growing. South Korea and USA are the most advanced military powers in the world and since they have such a strong alliance, anyone who attacks either of them would immediately put themselves on the losing end of a war.
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On March 01 2012 23:18 ninini wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2012 21:34 pirates wrote:On March 01 2012 21:30 mememolly wrote:
North korea is poor fuck, large parts of their country have no electricity and their population have been brainwashed in their views of NK and the west, I don't normally support American foreign policy but I'd support a "liberation" of that country, they are living sheltered lives (whether the west's version of capitalist democracy is better than what NK has is open to debate ubt at least they'd have the internet and would be able to listen to music that wasn't state sanctioned).
Currently, anyone who disagrees with the state is sent to a North Korean labour camp that is situated in remote sectors in Russia, here the workers live in shitty conditions and work their "debt" off for no money.
As for their nukes, lol, the boy scouts would roflstomp NK, they aren't a threat to anyone except themselves and the native population who are born into their totalitarian state. The missles they have pointed at south korea is kinda fucked up if true but largely NK is all image both in terms of external and internal politics.
I used to think NK was some badass nation with nukes and shit but after doing some reading and watching some documentaries I've realised they are all poor as fuck and the country is a shithole and they wouldn't even get close to firing their supposed nukes without the west blowing them back into the stone age first. Its true, they arent much a threat to most developed countries. They are a threat to South Korea. Look how close Pyongyang and Seoul are to eachother. Missile techonology to reach that small distance at low altitude isn't a big deal by todays' standards. North Korea wouldn't have a hard time acquiring these kinds of weapons. It's really far-fetched that North Korea would attack South Korea. In the korean war, USA used their air superiority to bomb North Korea to smithereens, and they were complaining about air imba. Well, the south's air advantage is even greater today. Back then, North Korea used fairly high tech soviet technology, but today, North Korea is like 30 years behind the South in technology, and the gap is just growing. South Korea and USA are the most advanced military powers in the world and since they have such a strong alliance, anyone who attacks either of them would immediately put themselves on the losing end of a war.
Nobody disagrees that in a SK / NK war, it would be SK that gets the victory.
The problem is that it will most likely be a Pyrrhic victory which will leave SK greatly impoverished.
I mean, hell, NK could destroy SK's economy just by disbanding itself.
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On March 01 2012 23:18 ninini wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2012 21:34 pirates wrote:On March 01 2012 21:30 mememolly wrote:
North korea is poor fuck, large parts of their country have no electricity and their population have been brainwashed in their views of NK and the west, I don't normally support American foreign policy but I'd support a "liberation" of that country, they are living sheltered lives (whether the west's version of capitalist democracy is better than what NK has is open to debate ubt at least they'd have the internet and would be able to listen to music that wasn't state sanctioned).
Currently, anyone who disagrees with the state is sent to a North Korean labour camp that is situated in remote sectors in Russia, here the workers live in shitty conditions and work their "debt" off for no money.
As for their nukes, lol, the boy scouts would roflstomp NK, they aren't a threat to anyone except themselves and the native population who are born into their totalitarian state. The missles they have pointed at south korea is kinda fucked up if true but largely NK is all image both in terms of external and internal politics.
I used to think NK was some badass nation with nukes and shit but after doing some reading and watching some documentaries I've realised they are all poor as fuck and the country is a shithole and they wouldn't even get close to firing their supposed nukes without the west blowing them back into the stone age first. Its true, they arent much a threat to most developed countries. They are a threat to South Korea. Look how close Pyongyang and Seoul are to eachother. Missile techonology to reach that small distance at low altitude isn't a big deal by todays' standards. North Korea wouldn't have a hard time acquiring these kinds of weapons. It's really far-fetched that North Korea would attack South Korea. In the korean war, USA used their air superiority to bomb North Korea to smithereens, and they were complaining about air imba. Well, the south's air advantage is even greater today. Back then, North Korea used fairly high tech soviet technology, but today, North Korea is like 30 years behind the South in technology, and the gap is just growing. South Korea and USA are the most advanced military powers in the world and since they have such a strong alliance, anyone who attacks either of them would immediately put themselves on the losing end of a war.
yes, you're right, i agree. I was mostly just clarifying an earlier post that said "NK is harmless". Just pointing out how many nice people could be put in danger by NK if they were heavily pressured.
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good trade for NK . and about the nukes : if they nuke South korea , is like they are nuking themselfs if you know what i mean .
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Awesome, so yet another country the US is providing food too for free while we have people living on the streets and starving over here. Horray for misplaced charity.
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On March 01 2012 23:38 Dekoth wrote:
Awesome, so yet another country the US is providing food too for free while we have people living on the streets and starving over here. Horray for misplaced charity.
I don't really see it that way.
1) You kinda say that people who starves in US are more important than people starving in North Korea
2) US could easily find the money to feed their own people. They could just cut like 10% of their military. But it's not their ideology.
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http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=316674
Same topic, you can actually find a link to another article that seem to have more details such as:
As part of the agreement, the United States said it would send 240,000 metric tons (about 265,000 tons) of food, though it limited the aid to nutritional supplements, rather than the rice and grains that, as two administration officials said, has in previous instances been diverted by the government or the military, or even sold abroad.
The aid is expected to be delivered in monthly shipments of 20,000 metric tons over the next year. The United States also insisted on rigorous monitoring to ensure that the aid would be provided to the neediest, especially women and children, many of whom show the stunting effects of chronic malnutrition.
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On March 01 2012 23:38 Dekoth wrote:
Awesome, so yet another country the US is providing food too for free while we have people living on the streets and starving over here. Horray for misplaced charity.
One does not prevent the other.
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remember, this guy who is in power was educated by that psychopath father of his...I seriously doubt he has better intentions than his father.
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On March 02 2012 00:02 bOneSeven wrote:
remember, this guy who is in power was educated by that psychopath father of his...I seriously doubt he has better intentions than his father.
I believe Kim Jong Un was schooled in Sweden if I recall.
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On March 01 2012 21:10 sigma_x wrote:
I get the impression that this happen somewhat cyclically:
1. North Korea creates a situation of impending conflict (say conventional warfare or developing nuclear weapons)
2. US send food aid to North Korea in exchange for an agreement that North Korea stops whatever it is they were doing in (1).
3. As soon as North Korea receives its aid, it reneges on the deal.
4. Repeat.
it's good that it is repeatable. The thing is, most of the politicians would prefer things to remain how they used to be, so that they can predict what is coming next and how to respond, do a "puppy show" to the public.
For example. US selling weapons to Taiwan almost every year, China complains about it all the time and get all fussed up about it, but in reality, Taiwan is the one that suffer because they are buying tonnes of highly priced weapons from the US. China would impose several economic "punishment" to US/TW but they are not harsh at all
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On March 01 2012 23:38 Dekoth wrote:
Awesome, so yet another country the US is providing food too for free while we have people living on the streets and starving over here. Horray for misplaced charity.
Also, we have to look at it as cost vs benefit. And true cost in time. Maybe the aid will make NK more receptive to disarmament and being open with the free world, thus preventing war in the future? In that case it would probably save more lives than just the food could have saved either here at home or in NK.
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Does anyone else find the North Korean philosophy of self sufficiency quite interesting? I mean in some of the propaganda pieces where western journalists are shown round the 'model' schools, they are full of computers which presumably are all produced domestically. Just think, they must reverse engineer all this stuff or come up with it themselves. Cars, computers, domestic appliances, communications, rockets etc etc. Remarkable really.
Intriguing philosophy, the complete opposite to globalisation. Of course it seems they aren't completely self sufficient...
Also not to mention that you go on google maps and there are no maps of NK. Takes you back a hundred years, before the likes of the Ordnance survey and GPS/Satellite maps. Zoom in on satellite images of Pyongyang and you see large deserted motorways...
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I am all for preventing war from breaking out, but the United States isn't really in a position to be giving out that kind of charity at the moment. The national debt is around 15.5 trillion, shouldn't the government be more interested in fixing this first?
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On March 02 2012 00:48 3Form wrote:
Does anyone else find the North Korean philosophy of self sufficiency quite interesting? I mean in some of the propaganda pieces where western journalists are shown round the 'model' schools, they are full of computers which presumably are all produced domestically. Just think, they must reverse engineer all this stuff or come up with it themselves. Cars, computers, domestic appliances, communications, rockets etc etc. Remarkable really.
Intriguing philosophy, the complete opposite to globalisation. Of course it seems they aren't completely self sufficient...
Also not to mention that you go on google maps and there are no maps of NK. Takes you back a hundred years, before the likes of the Ordnance survey and GPS/Satellite maps. Zoom in on satellite images of Pyongyang and you see large deserted motorways...
It is an idiotic concept.
Make no mistake, any and all of their technological progress is derived from stealing and engineering it at a later point.
North-Korea has never invented anything of its own.
*Edited by the North-Korean committee of socialist wealth and progress and greatness and prosperity:
North-Korea has produced a writing table that can be adjusted in height so that the student can easily read and write, regardless of its height. This remarkable creation has been brought to us by the dear leader and eternal president, Kim-Il-Sung.
North-Korea has also managed to master cold fusion, altough since their announcement they have not been able to fix their energy problems, even though they now posses a source of infinite energy. Surely, this socialist paradise has no need for such capitalist ideas like electricity and food!
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EPT
