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naggerNZ
New Zealand708 Posts
On October 17 2011 12:12 Chargelot wrote: It's not a real perception. That's why it's called a hallucination. Your logic is horribly/nonexistent. I don't think you understand what the word perception means. | ||
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ShamTao
United States419 Posts
On October 17 2011 12:10 UmiNotsuki wrote: Running shoes don't cause brain deterioration. I'm not arguing for or against the physiology or health implications. I don't think you quite understood what I was saying. Don't think of it so literally, I'm talking about drug use in terms of lifestyle, disregarding health ramifications. As it was already pointed, there's a lot of stuff that kills us, like using our metabolism and stuff. | ||
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kidcrash
United States623 Posts
On October 17 2011 12:12 Chargelot wrote: It's not a real perception. That's why it's called a hallucination. Your logic is horribly/nonexistent. Unless you are one of the very few people to have the innate condition of Synesthesia, good luck experiencing it without drugs. | ||
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Chargelot
2275 Posts
On October 17 2011 12:12 teslar wrote: Reasons to living can be different from person to person regardless of how effective/ineffective their style is. What you're saying about a man killing you isn't wrong it's just what the vast majority of the world agrees with, so do i. But my point is that there's no right or wrong. If you wanna go on a moral quest go right ahead but don't become ignorant. Double check your sources on drugs before you judge a person for being a casual pot smoker. Come up with the actual obvious damage it does without just asuming but with real facts. You're a gamer enlighten yourself stop bullshitting yourself, it's your loss else in the end. http://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/results?term=cannabis I've read all 211 studies done by the various member organizations of the NIH. The ones that support or dispute the uses of Marijuana. Have fun educating yourself too. On October 17 2011 12:15 kidcrash wrote: Unless you are one of the very few people to have the innate condition of Synesthesia, good luck experiencing it without drugs. I don't want to see each number in a spatial array, nor see sound. Those are complications which delay and prevent my ability to function. | ||
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yandere991
Australia394 Posts
On October 17 2011 12:11 Shifft wrote: Gaming excessively can cause people to ignore other responsibilities in their lives in a similar way to heavy drug use. Another similarity between the two is that there are both people who do them to excess and people who enjoy the activity in a controlled fashion that doesn't harm anyone. Does anyone here think it's ok to discriminate against people who play video games because some of them can't control their habits? Of course. If I knew that a person had a video game addiction and would most likely come to work tired and mind preoccupied on something else then I would not hire them. | ||
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Shifft
Canada1085 Posts
On October 17 2011 12:13 MrDudeMan wrote: Yes it is. If playing video games in excess is destroying parts of your life, then it is completely ok for me to judge you. Sorry, I edited another sentence into my post. My point was that being prejudiced against drug users means that you assume that all people who use drugs are using them in a harmful way, similar to the way that many people assume that all people who play online video games do it in an excessive fashion that is harmful to other parts of their lives. I'm pretty sure that nobody on TL is prejudiced against gamers so why be prejudiced against drug users when many of them can control their habits. | ||
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Freyr
United States500 Posts
While many people are saying that drug use is a behavior and can be controlled, there seems to be an implicit condemnation of that particular behavior as universally negative. As others have suggested, it is instructive, in countering this assumption, to consider the fact that alcohol, tobacco, and even caffeine are all legal and regularly used drugs (I suppose tobacco is cocktail of drugs). Just as the scientific community is uncertain of the ultimate health implications of caffeine ingestion, it is relatively uncertain of the long term effects associated with marijuana, psilocybin, LSD, and many of the myriad illegal recreational drugs. Yet, there is essentially no stigma at all associated with low level alcohol or caffeine usage, while there is considerable stigma associated with the use of illegal drugs. This is where prejudice comes in. Merriam-Webster offers this definition of the word: an adverse opinion or leaning formed without just grounds or before sufficient knowledge I wonder how many people condemning drug use have actually consulted the primary literature (supposing they did, how many would actually be capable of understanding the papers and judging the quality of the science within?) or done any comprehensive study whatsoever with the intention of performing an impartial assessment. Those who arrive at their judgement without having done any of this are assuredly embracing prejudice. Illegal drugs, with some notable exceptions, have one primary damning attribute - they happen to be illegal. Many people may unsuspectingly believe that laws are created for logical reasons having to do with the sustenance and advancement of society. They may also believe that laws are created by people with expertise, or at the very least, are created by people who earnestly consult unbiased individuals with the requisite expertise. These assumptions are understandable, but, evidently (in many cases besides drugs) they are not the case. Fortunately in this modern world information of all kinds is readily available. Naturally, the quality of this information is highly variable, but there are some standards to which sources can be held (such as peer review). As such, if we wish to form an opinion on a matter, we actually have the luxury of informing ourselves properly before we do so. (It is interesting to note, though, that the more I know about any particular issue, the more difficult I find it to feel sufficiently knowledgeable to form an opinion - but, if you have the luxury of not forming an opinion, what is the rush to do so?) | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
I'd say the only thing that matters is how you're able to manage your own life and deal with people around you. I don't even mind someone using heavy drugs as long as he can have a normal life. Of course it's gonna be difficult for crackheads. What I mean is some women will be terrible mothers and not even realize it because they'll be constantly under xanax, while some people can take other drugs and have a perfectly good life. | ||
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dupshflayh
Norway49 Posts
On October 17 2011 12:13 UmiNotsuki wrote: Please just stop talking. Everyone knows what sort of things we're talking about and not everything needs to have a perfect definition to carry meaning. Please stop using master suppression techniques. That may work in political debates, but it's naught but rude anywhere else. And no, "everyone" doesn't know what we're talking about, as the entire definition of "drugs" (and to some extent "abuse") is a grey area. | ||
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ShamTao
United States419 Posts
On October 17 2011 12:16 Freyr wrote: Illegal drugs, with some notable exceptions, have one primary damning attribute - they happen to be illegal. Many people may unsuspectingly believe that laws are created for logical reasons having to do with the sustenance and advancement of society. They may also believe that laws are created by people with expertise, or at the very least, are created by people who earnestly consult unbiased individuals with the requisite expertise. These assumptions are understandable, but, evidently (in many cases besides drugs) they are not the case. Fortunately in this modern world information of all kinds is readily available. Naturally, the quality of this information is highly variable, but there are some standards to which sources can be held (such as peer review). As such, if we wish to form an opinion on a matter, we actually have the luxury of informing ourselves properly before we do so. (It is interesting to note, though, that the more I know about any particular issue, the more difficult I find it to feel sufficiently knowledgeable to form an opinion - but, if you have the luxury of not forming an opinion, what is the rush to do so?) This is something I agree with a lot. Drugs are made illegal because more people than not don't know how to use them responsibly. What about the responsible crowd? They get grouped. | ||
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Offhand
United States1869 Posts
On October 17 2011 11:57 RedJustice wrote: The biggest one is smoking-- in my mind when you choose to force other people around you to breathe the air you have polluted with disgusting chemicals, that is the same as driving drunk. If you want to endanger yourself, that's one thing, but when you put innocent people in danger based on your decision, that's wrong. On the other hand, I don't mind tobacco or nicotine patches or whatever, because I don't have to be subjected to them. I know zero smokers who are responsible and don't expose others to their smoking. If you are going to smoke, do it inside your own home, for god's sake never smoke around children, and don't think that just because you're outside it's any better for all the people walking past you on the street, or your neighbors who would like to use their backyard without breathing noxious fumes. This is more like an irrational fear than a prejudice. Seek help, I don't even smoke tobacco. | ||
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Rfaulker
United States53 Posts
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Alay
United States660 Posts
On October 17 2011 11:32 UmiNotsuki wrote: What about in the case of psychological or even physiological dependence on a drug? He sure can't stop then. Still not prejudice? Please be aware I'm just curious what people think, not arguing one way or another. They definitely chose to begin using or abusing for whatever reasons. Either way I'd hold the same low regard for the person who uses, but if they're dependent on the drug to the extent where they could die by stopping (Heroine, etc) then they'd definitely have a higher level of pity from me for paying such a price from their own poor choices. Regardless, every person I've ever met who I've been friends with/related to that has used any sort of substance has always been a big let down or just overall bad news. I steer clear of people who need to alter their mind. On October 17 2011 11:36 BlackJack wrote: It's not about whether he can change, it's about whether he chose to become it. A child murderer can't change from being a child murderer but he definitely chose to murder a child. Your post doesn't make much sense... are you agreeing or arguing against me? | ||
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UmiNotsuki
United States633 Posts
In the short-term, marijuana can cause: problems with learning and memory; distorted perception (sights, sounds, time, touch); diminished motor coordination; and increased heart rate. From the NIDA directly. I don't think it's arguable that there are negative affects of marijuana use. | ||
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VPCursed
1044 Posts
On October 17 2011 12:20 Alay wrote: They definitely chose to begin using or abusing for whatever reasons. Either way I'd hold the same low regard for the person who uses, but if they're dependent on the drug to the extent where they could die by stopping (Heroine, etc) then they'd definitely have a higher level of pity from me for paying such a price from their own poor choices. Regardless, every person I've ever met who I've been friends with/related to that has used any sort of substance has always been a big let down or just overall bad news. I steer clear of people who need to alter their mind. Your post doesn't make much sense... are you agreeing or arguing against me? lol Out of curiosity.. have you ever tried alcohol? | ||
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MrDudeMan
Canada973 Posts
On October 17 2011 12:16 Shifft wrote: Sorry, I edited another sentence into my post. My point was that being prejudiced against drug users means that you assume that all people who use drugs are using them in a harmful way, similar to the way that many people assume that all people who play online video games do it in an excessive fashion that is harmful to other parts of their lives. I'm pretty sure that nobody on TL is prejudiced against gamers so why be prejudiced against drug users when many of them can control their habits. I'd say for most people, the discrimination is usually just a first impression. If I met someone and the only thing I knew about them was that they were a drug user, I would base my opinion off of that, that doesn't mean that that is all I would base my opinion on. Its the same with gaming. If the only thing I knew about someone is that they played video games heavily, I would assume they have certain traits that people who play video games heavily have. Upon learning more about the person I would adjust my opinion of them. That being said, this forming of a first opinion should not be considered prejudice. The way the word prejudice is used in the modern world, it implies forming an opinion on someone based on something they have no control over. The reason this is wrong is because they have no control over this trait. | ||
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darklight54321
United States361 Posts
However, almost every other drug does create a viable prejudice simply because of the effects on the body and mind. There ARE the times when drug users are the victims, such as the whole idea of forced injection for addiction (saw a story about that and how some dealers forcibly injected the bad low quality meth and then sold regular meth at heightened costs) and certain specific scenarios (lsd brainwash is another), the majority of the time these "high end" drugs is not unfair discrimination, but accurate and knowledge based prejudice. | ||
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Metalreflux
United States165 Posts
The OP itself almost promotes drug use, and I personnaly have grown up around people who have heavily used drugs and it's something that I don't want to think of. the majority of people in the world don't live in large houses, inside of nice gated communities, so I'm sure there are other people here who have lived in neighborhoods with drug abuse or in families with drug/alcohol abuse; who'd rather not voice an opinion on the subject, only for a Nay-Sayer to contradict them. | ||
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Alay
United States660 Posts
On October 17 2011 11:39 Necro)Phagist( wrote: And yet their are hundreds of thousands of people who can drink every day or smoke put every day and function just fine in society. Just because your friends fucked up doesn't mean it was all the drugs fault. Why do you just assume its a coping method? Lots of people do it simply because they enjoy it! Some people like to spend their spare time playing sports, some video games and other like to drink or smoke? Why hold it against them? Because it's a choice based negativity that causes harm to themselves or others around them. | ||
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ShamTao
United States419 Posts
On October 17 2011 12:22 UmiNotsuki wrote: From the NIDA directly. I don't think it's arguable that there are negative affects of marijuana use. Who was arguing against this? Smoking ANYTHING isn't going to be good. At the same time, I don't know if I would prejudice somebody just for indulging in anything that harms their own health, as it is not my responsibility. I'd have a bigger problem with somebody who hurts OTHER people with their behavior. | ||
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