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On October 17 2011 11:22 UmiNotsuki wrote:
People who are on drugs are committing what some call a "victimless crime," which some people may argue isn't a crime at all; the only one they are hurting are themselves. Assuming we only consider drugs which don't cause people to become more violent, such as marijuana or tobacco (which is a drug,) then there is no damage done to others around the drug user due to his or her drug use.
The crime is not victimless.
Drug users are less productive members of society therefore they are hurting economy(which is kinda serious business, if you are reading newspapers).
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i guess you could also say they fund illegal activities and gangs
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On October 19 2011 16:49 Seriyvolk wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2011 11:22 UmiNotsuki wrote:
People who are on drugs are committing what some call a "victimless crime," which some people may argue isn't a crime at all; the only one they are hurting are themselves. Assuming we only consider drugs which don't cause people to become more violent, such as marijuana or tobacco (which is a drug,) then there is no damage done to others around the drug user due to his or her drug use. The crime is not victimless. Drug users are less productive members of society therefore they are hurting economy(which is kinda serious business, if you are reading newspapers).
Oh. So do you think drug users hurt the economy more than the $42 billion a year that we spend prosecuting them?
Another question: Do you think a drug user in jail is either a more or a less productive member of society than one that isn't?
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On October 19 2011 17:05 shinosai wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2011 16:49 Seriyvolk wrote:On October 17 2011 11:22 UmiNotsuki wrote:
People who are on drugs are committing what some call a "victimless crime," which some people may argue isn't a crime at all; the only one they are hurting are themselves. Assuming we only consider drugs which don't cause people to become more violent, such as marijuana or tobacco (which is a drug,) then there is no damage done to others around the drug user due to his or her drug use. The crime is not victimless. Drug users are less productive members of society therefore they are hurting economy(which is kinda serious business, if you are reading newspapers). Oh. So do you think drug users hurt the economy more than the $42 billion a year that we spend prosecuting them? Another question: Do you think a drug user in jail is either a more or a less productive member of society than one that isn't?
Well, if they didn't do drugs we wouldn't have to prosecute them. And they'd be more effective workers.
+ Show Spoiler +Yeah, half-ass logic, I know. Can't resist. Pull. Of fallacies. + Show Spoiler + but really, when you think about it, it's a member of society engaging in behavior that society has deemed against the rules for whatever reason, so the statement kinda floats
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after reading the entire thread the only conclusion i have for certain is that this mozzarella poster guy is a complete troll, has zero point zero points to make, and frankly should have been banned years ago
other than that. good reads fellas for the most part. its always good for one such as myself to take a step back and realize my place in my various communities, TL just being one of many.
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On October 19 2011 16:49 Seriyvolk wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2011 11:22 UmiNotsuki wrote:
People who are on drugs are committing what some call a "victimless crime," which some people may argue isn't a crime at all; the only one they are hurting are themselves. Assuming we only consider drugs which don't cause people to become more violent, such as marijuana or tobacco (which is a drug,) then there is no damage done to others around the drug user due to his or her drug use. The crime is not victimless. Drug users are less productive members of society therefore they are hurting economy(which is kinda serious business, if you are reading newspapers).
"drug users are less productive members of society" ? there is a lot you dont know about society.
big business is known for its cocaine habit, especially brokers and bankers and especially on wall street.
academics are known for their pot smoking, especially among university professors.
read newspapers, but don't believe everything you read !
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Drug users are not hurting the economy, they are helping it. (Or rather, the alcohol industry more specifically.)
As an absolutist I can't help but to question the consumption of drugs for recreational purposes. It defies logic and my personal philosophy. Why would I consume something odd to alter the way I feel and operate because I want to have fun? I have fun, I don't need fun-enhancers.
And of course, I want to think that I don't think differently of people who drink/use, but in reality it's hard being the sober person at the party. Wanting conversations and comfortable conversations over drinking competitions and very loud music. (Which people don't seem to listen to anyway?)
My sad experiences at parties is that on every occasion, everything will become less and less interesting for me in terms of social interaction and in discussions on overall, andeveryone else (who is drinking) seems to have fun over things I only can laugh at when I'm really tired.
It makes me bid good bye to the party and walk home. And on later years I usually hesitate on going to parties, and skip them usually.
I am the dull guy who seems to have less fun at parties, but is fun to hang around with during daytime, when the social groups are smaller and you're actually talking to people for the sake of.. talking.
I think it's a behaviour that has persisted with humanity for ages, that we want it all and want to try it all. And in parties you want to be off-edged and overall nice. And drugs really help that, and music really takes the uncomfortable silences away.
But I don't really like conforming to traditions and behaviour which I feel might be uncessary and unhealthy. And while people directly don't have anything against my non-drug use, there seems to be other things that they want to adress on why I'm not happy.
I don't have anything against drug users, but I sure do get a lot of questions being a non-user. That's for sure.
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How can this community be this uptight?
How shallow can you be if your opinion of someone you know changes just because they use drugs? If you are sincere with other people you base your opinion on their behavior/actions. Whether they are using drugs or not should be as trivial as which kind of clothes they wear.
IMO there is only one answer to Poll: When an acquaintance tells you that he/ she uses illegal drugs... and that is It does not affect your opinion of him/ her.. If you already disliked the person because he isn't a well functioning part of society and later you find out he uses drugs than that's 100% fine but if you need to know first whether he/she uses drugs to form you opinion, than your mind is clouded and this will restrain you from getting to know a lot of great people.
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On October 19 2011 16:49 Seriyvolk wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2011 11:22 UmiNotsuki wrote:
People who are on drugs are committing what some call a "victimless crime," which some people may argue isn't a crime at all; the only one they are hurting are themselves. Assuming we only consider drugs which don't cause people to become more violent, such as marijuana or tobacco (which is a drug,) then there is no damage done to others around the drug user due to his or her drug use. The crime is not victimless. Drug users are less productive members of society therefore they are hurting economy(which is kinda serious business, if you are reading newspapers).
ok troll. have some evidence to back your claims ? try harder.
On October 19 2011 20:43 SnetteL wrote:
How can this community be this uptight?
How shallow can you be if your opinion of someone you know changes just because they use drugs? If you are sincere with other people you base your opinion on their behavior/actions. Whether they are using drugs or not should be as trivial as which kind of clothes they wear.
IMO there is only one answer to Poll: When an acquaintance tells you that he/ she uses illegal drugs... and that is It does not affect your opinion of him/ her.. If you already disliked the person because he isn't a well functioning part of society and later you find out he uses drugs than that's 100% fine but if you need to know first whether he/she uses drugs to form you opinion, than your mind is clouded and this will restrain you from getting to know a lot of great people.
kinda shows how stupid ppl can be. Nerds are too pussy to try it themselves, would rather form a false opinion based on 50y old hear-say.
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Ahahaha sure you guys are more productive than someone like Poe, Hendrix or Van Gogh.
This thread cracks me up!
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On October 19 2011 20:43 SnetteL wrote:
How can this community be this uptight?
How shallow can you be if your opinion of someone you know changes just because they use drugs? If you are sincere with other people you base your opinion on their behavior/actions. Whether they are using drugs or not should be as trivial as which kind of clothes they wear.
IMO there is only one answer to Poll: When an acquaintance tells you that he/ she uses illegal drugs... and that is It does not affect your opinion of him/ her.. If you already disliked the person because he isn't a well functioning part of society and later you find out he uses drugs than that's 100% fine but if you need to know first whether he/she uses drugs to form you opinion, than your mind is clouded and this will restrain you from getting to know a lot of great people.
So when one of your buddies walks up to you, telling you he started shooting up, that would not affect your opinion of him?
It's not a matter of black and white here.
It all depends on the drugs, the person, the quantity and the situation. To give a definite "Yes it will affect my opinion regardless of drugs, person, quantity or situation." makes you in my eyes as blind as someone who says it will definitely not affect your opinion regardless of drugs, person, quantity or situation.
Pretending drugs are never relevant to a person's behaviour/what a person is like is straight up idiotic. Have you ever met a serious drug addict? (Im not talking about people who smoke their occasional joint)
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On October 19 2011 20:52 Linkirvana wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2011 20:43 SnetteL wrote:
How can this community be this uptight?
How shallow can you be if your opinion of someone you know changes just because they use drugs? If you are sincere with other people you base your opinion on their behavior/actions. Whether they are using drugs or not should be as trivial as which kind of clothes they wear.
IMO there is only one answer to Poll: When an acquaintance tells you that he/ she uses illegal drugs... and that is It does not affect your opinion of him/ her.. If you already disliked the person because he isn't a well functioning part of society and later you find out he uses drugs than that's 100% fine but if you need to know first whether he/she uses drugs to form you opinion, than your mind is clouded and this will restrain you from getting to know a lot of great people. So when one of your buddies walks up to you, telling you he started shooting up, that would not affect your opinion of him? It's not a matter of black and white here. It all depends on the drugs, the person, the quantity and the situation. To give a definite "Yes it will affect my opinion regardless of drugs, person, quantity or situation." makes you in my eyes as blind as someone who says it will definitely not affect your opinion regardless of drugs, person, quantity or situation. Pretending drugs are never relevant to a person's behaviour/what a person is like is straight up idiotic. Have you ever met a serious drug addict? (Im not talking about people who smoke their occasional joint)
i know people who drink about 5 litres of beer everyday and smoke weed all day long... still good people.
and why should your opinion of your friend change when he tells you that he's using heroine? he's still the same person. i'd be worried about him, sure. but other than that? he's not a worse person at all...
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On October 19 2011 20:52 Linkirvana wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2011 20:43 SnetteL wrote:
How can this community be this uptight?
How shallow can you be if your opinion of someone you know changes just because they use drugs? If you are sincere with other people you base your opinion on their behavior/actions. Whether they are using drugs or not should be as trivial as which kind of clothes they wear.
IMO there is only one answer to Poll: When an acquaintance tells you that he/ she uses illegal drugs... and that is It does not affect your opinion of him/ her.. If you already disliked the person because he isn't a well functioning part of society and later you find out he uses drugs than that's 100% fine but if you need to know first whether he/she uses drugs to form you opinion, than your mind is clouded and this will restrain you from getting to know a lot of great people. So when one of your buddies walks up to you, telling you he started shooting up, that would not affect your opinion of him? It's not a matter of black and white here. It all depends on the drugs, the person, the quantity and the situation. To give a definite "Yes it will affect my opinion regardless of drugs, person, quantity or situation." makes you in my eyes as blind as someone who says it will definitely not affect your opinion regardless of drugs, person, quantity or situation. Pretending drugs are never relevant to a person's behaviour/what a person is like is straight up idiotic. Have you ever met a serious drug addict? (Im not talking about people who smoke their occasional joint)
You said he "started" shooting up. That makes a big difference to me. If a friend i've known for a long time says he's been on crack for the past 5 years I would admire him because he doesn't look like a crackhead to me. Your hypothetical situation is very off by the way because you imply that it is possible for people I am friends start "shooting up", I think you can agree your friends will resemble you in character/personality/upbringing/social background/(and many more) at least a little bit and these factors hugely affect your choices in life concerning drug use.
A lot of my friends smoke often and some of them experiment with other stuff but it shows how alienated you are to this world that you can see someone coming to you who says "yo, i think i'm gonna take up heroin". Not many people have hard drugs addicted friends to begin with unless they are themselves related to them. There is no changing of opinion in that neither.
The OP doesn't specify addicts by the way, only drug users in general so stick to the topic please.
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When I found out djWheat is a stoner my respect for him went up from "good" to "OMG I WANT TO MEET HIM AND SHAKE HIS HAND". Need I say more?
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On October 19 2011 17:11 Kaonis wrote:
but really, when you think about it, it's a member of society engaging in behavior that society has deemed against the rules for whatever reason, so the statement kinda floats
Well last time I checked, most Americans was for legalizing marijuana. So your logic is very flawed.
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I hate the term "victimless crime" if somebody is hurting themselves then it hurts anybody close to them deeply. Sometimes the worst part of drug abuse is watching somebody you care about systematically destroy themselves. Drug abuse is far from a victimless crime.
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On October 19 2011 05:28 Luepert wrote:
Well technically its the law, if your willing to go against the laws set by the country that uses its power to protect your rights, there's something a little out of line even in that regard.
How about a country that uses it power to depress your rights. Have you Americans learned nothing in history class? Did you think the American revolution was following the British law?
Thats why the law is in a constant change. The law may not always be in the best interest of the people. The government is lot always correct or "right". Thats why you should always challenge that, and not settle for easy answers.
When something is unjust, it is your duty to fight it!
Imo, that is the American spirit and lost legacy.
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On October 19 2011 21:27 acidfreak wrote:
When I found out djWheat is a stoner my respect for him went up from "good" to "OMG I WANT TO MEET HIM AND SHAKE HIS HAND". Need I say more?
Really? o.O Why?
I mean, I'm for legalization of marijuana and I don't see a problem with pot in general, but I think it's a little odd that you would go from "I like this SC2 personality" to "He is now a legendary icon in my life" just because he does drugs.
Out of everything djWheat has done for our community, smoking pot is the thing that's made you most impressed? When you meet him, are you gonna be like "I smoke pot too!" (assuming you do, sorry if I'm wrong... otherwise I don't see why you'd care).
On a sidenote, he's a very cool guy in person. I met him (and Day[9], Artosis, and Tasteless) at MLG Columbus.
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This all depends on if this would be a person that if you had no idea they use drugs you would hang around or not. If you met them on the street, had a conversation and thought they were someone you could get along with but later found out they smoke weed and decided not to hang out with them because of that fact alone of course that is wrong. Is it the same a racial prejudice? Not at all, but it would still be wrong if nothing about their behavior made you not like them other than the fact they do drugs which you may not have been aware of by having a conversation with them.
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On October 19 2011 12:28 N3rV[Green] wrote:I recently heard something along the lines of "we already have laws to stop and deter bad behavior, we don't need additional laws about drugs to prevent the behavior we already have laws in place to handle" Seriously, go watch http://vimeo.com/30715947 and see if that doesn't change your mind about "drug abusers"
Can i just say these podcasts are amazing, listing to #142 now, are they on itunes? I am going to follow this guy 
really interesting
thanks dude
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EPT
