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On October 06 2011 04:07 Umpteen wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 04:02 NorNor wrote:Well I shall add my 2 cents. First of all, I am young (ish) 18 years old 19 in 19 days. I have been in a relationship for just over a year now with a girl whose ideal life would be to get married and have children and be a kept woman, basically. I personally do not believe in marriage anymore. My own mother being my primary reason and I will not say anymore on the subject as I think it would be a little off topic. However, the way I see it, as was said in one of the first posts. If you two REALLY love one another, why should you need to get married? The reasons women HONESTLY want it is obvious to me at least now in my infinite wisdom of nearly 19 years of age  They don't like being shown up by their friends and if you are married they consider it a one up. Also they like a big engagement ring, I cannot recall the amount of times I have seen women comparing theirs to my mothers. It is another one up. (Here is the point where I realise it leaves a bitter taste to call her that) They want "THE WEDDING" the white dress, the church (even if they aren't religious), the vows (which mean nothing to them most of the time after the ceremony. Has anyone here actually ever seen a married woman who has vowed "to honour and obey" actually agree that they still want to obey their life partner/husband? Perhaps not) This is a big party centralised around THEM and another one up. I think you will find it is from a woman's point of view a status symbol, like many other things (designer clothes? < perhaps a bad example I hope my point comes across) do they really NEED these things? No they just want to show that they are in some ways better than their "friends". Also women like to say it would make me "more secure". I believe this shows the vindictive nature of people. What these women are really saying is "I can fuck him financially if he dare upset me" and I will NOT accept anyone disagreeing with the fact that women in court especially divorce courts are favoured. In England we have no prenuptial agreements and I know that EVERY man who has been divorced that I have come across has far less than half of what it is he started with. I will make this seem less scorned young child taking it out with some research to back it up. "to be happy you need to think yourself better off than those around you." It is a phenomenon called 'relative comparisons'. I know this to be a fact because you can watch endless movies/tv shows whatever of people personifying the feelings of a single woman jealous of all her married friends, but no I am not going to list them. On the other hand I also agree that there are those women (99.999% of which are now over 50) who believe what they are saying when they say "till death do us part" and they are the ones to look out for, but then again they will be the ones who if you explain your worries to will never push you into it to start with. tl/dr : Women are jealous and vindictive, watch out. This is not a healthy perspective with which to enter adulthood, my friend 
Probably most would agree with you however I have yet to have someone show me otherwise. Also I consider myself to be open-minded so I await with open arms someone to show me I am wrong.
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On October 06 2011 04:02 NorNor wrote:Well I shall add my 2 cents. First of all, I am young (ish) 18 years old 19 in 19 days. I have been in a relationship for just over a year now with a girl whose ideal life would be to get married and have children and be a kept woman, basically. I personally do not believe in marriage anymore. My own mother being my primary reason and I will not say anymore on the subject as I think it would be a little off topic. However, the way I see it, as was said in one of the first posts. If you two REALLY love one another, why should you need to get married? The reasons women HONESTLY want it is obvious to me at least now in my infinite wisdom of nearly 19 years of age They don't like being shown up by their friends and if you are married they consider it a one up. Also they like a big engagement ring, I cannot recall the amount of times I have seen women comparing theirs to my mothers. It is another one up. (Here is the point where I realise it leaves a bitter taste to call her that) They want "THE WEDDING" the white dress, the church (even if they aren't religious), the vows (which mean nothing to them most of the time after the ceremony. Has anyone here actually ever seen a married woman who has vowed "to honour and obey" actually agree that they still want to obey their life partner/husband? Perhaps not) This is a big party centralised around THEM and another one up. I think you will find it is from a woman's point of view a status symbol, like many other things (designer clothes? < perhaps a bad example I hope my point comes across) do they really NEED these things? No they just want to show that they are in some ways better than their "friends". Also women like to say it would make me "more secure". I believe this shows the vindictive nature of people. What these women are really saying is "I can fuck him financially if he dare upset me" and I will NOT accept anyone disagreeing with the fact that women in court especially divorce courts are favoured. In England we have no prenuptial agreements and I know that EVERY man who has been divorced that I have come across has far less than half of what it is he started with. I will make this seem less scorned young child taking it out with some research to back it up. "to be happy you need to think yourself better off than those around you." It is a phenomenon called 'relative comparisons'. I know this to be a fact because you can watch endless movies/tv shows whatever of people personifying the feelings of a single woman jealous of all her married friends, but no I am not going to list them. On the other hand I also agree that there are those women (99.999% of which are now over 50) who believe what they are saying when they say "till death do us part" and they are the ones to look out for, but then again they will be the ones who if you explain your worries to will never push you into it to start with. tl/dr : Women are jealous and vindictive, watch out.
You can view marriage in two totally different ways; signing a piece of paper or something truly meaningful. I think getting married in and of itself is obviously not meaningful, but the act and what it represents and having a celebration for it is an awesome idea. If you truly love them then WHY NOT celebrate a real promise to be together for the rest of your lives. You two may already know it but why not let the world know too?
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On October 06 2011 04:19 NorNor wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 04:07 Umpteen wrote:On October 06 2011 04:02 NorNor wrote:Well I shall add my 2 cents. First of all, I am young (ish) 18 years old 19 in 19 days. I have been in a relationship for just over a year now with a girl whose ideal life would be to get married and have children and be a kept woman, basically. I personally do not believe in marriage anymore. My own mother being my primary reason and I will not say anymore on the subject as I think it would be a little off topic. However, the way I see it, as was said in one of the first posts. If you two REALLY love one another, why should you need to get married? The reasons women HONESTLY want it is obvious to me at least now in my infinite wisdom of nearly 19 years of age They don't like being shown up by their friends and if you are married they consider it a one up. Also they like a big engagement ring, I cannot recall the amount of times I have seen women comparing theirs to my mothers. It is another one up. (Here is the point where I realise it leaves a bitter taste to call her that) They want "THE WEDDING" the white dress, the church (even if they aren't religious), the vows (which mean nothing to them most of the time after the ceremony. Has anyone here actually ever seen a married woman who has vowed "to honour and obey" actually agree that they still want to obey their life partner/husband? Perhaps not) This is a big party centralised around THEM and another one up. I think you will find it is from a woman's point of view a status symbol, like many other things (designer clothes? < perhaps a bad example I hope my point comes across) do they really NEED these things? No they just want to show that they are in some ways better than their "friends". Also women like to say it would make me "more secure". I believe this shows the vindictive nature of people. What these women are really saying is "I can fuck him financially if he dare upset me" and I will NOT accept anyone disagreeing with the fact that women in court especially divorce courts are favoured. In England we have no prenuptial agreements and I know that EVERY man who has been divorced that I have come across has far less than half of what it is he started with. I will make this seem less scorned young child taking it out with some research to back it up. "to be happy you need to think yourself better off than those around you." It is a phenomenon called 'relative comparisons'. I know this to be a fact because you can watch endless movies/tv shows whatever of people personifying the feelings of a single woman jealous of all her married friends, but no I am not going to list them. On the other hand I also agree that there are those women (99.999% of which are now over 50) who believe what they are saying when they say "till death do us part" and they are the ones to look out for, but then again they will be the ones who if you explain your worries to will never push you into it to start with. tl/dr : Women are jealous and vindictive, watch out. This is not a healthy perspective with which to enter adulthood, my friend Probably most would agree with you however I have yet to have someone show me otherwise. Also I consider myself to be open-minded so I await with open arms someone to show me I am wrong.
Women are just as guilty of acting petty, immature and stupid at a young age as men are. They've got just as much growing up to do as men do, they just like to play 'adult' like it's a game.
I suggest, like my father did to me, steering well clear of serious relationships with women until both of you are in your mid-late 20s.
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On October 06 2011 04:19 NorNor wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 04:07 Umpteen wrote:On October 06 2011 04:02 NorNor wrote:Well I shall add my 2 cents. First of all, I am young (ish) 18 years old 19 in 19 days. I have been in a relationship for just over a year now with a girl whose ideal life would be to get married and have children and be a kept woman, basically. I personally do not believe in marriage anymore. My own mother being my primary reason and I will not say anymore on the subject as I think it would be a little off topic. However, the way I see it, as was said in one of the first posts. If you two REALLY love one another, why should you need to get married? The reasons women HONESTLY want it is obvious to me at least now in my infinite wisdom of nearly 19 years of age They don't like being shown up by their friends and if you are married they consider it a one up. Also they like a big engagement ring, I cannot recall the amount of times I have seen women comparing theirs to my mothers. It is another one up. (Here is the point where I realise it leaves a bitter taste to call her that) They want "THE WEDDING" the white dress, the church (even if they aren't religious), the vows (which mean nothing to them most of the time after the ceremony. Has anyone here actually ever seen a married woman who has vowed "to honour and obey" actually agree that they still want to obey their life partner/husband? Perhaps not) This is a big party centralised around THEM and another one up. I think you will find it is from a woman's point of view a status symbol, like many other things (designer clothes? < perhaps a bad example I hope my point comes across) do they really NEED these things? No they just want to show that they are in some ways better than their "friends". Also women like to say it would make me "more secure". I believe this shows the vindictive nature of people. What these women are really saying is "I can fuck him financially if he dare upset me" and I will NOT accept anyone disagreeing with the fact that women in court especially divorce courts are favoured. In England we have no prenuptial agreements and I know that EVERY man who has been divorced that I have come across has far less than half of what it is he started with. I will make this seem less scorned young child taking it out with some research to back it up. "to be happy you need to think yourself better off than those around you." It is a phenomenon called 'relative comparisons'. I know this to be a fact because you can watch endless movies/tv shows whatever of people personifying the feelings of a single woman jealous of all her married friends, but no I am not going to list them. On the other hand I also agree that there are those women (99.999% of which are now over 50) who believe what they are saying when they say "till death do us part" and they are the ones to look out for, but then again they will be the ones who if you explain your worries to will never push you into it to start with. tl/dr : Women are jealous and vindictive, watch out. This is not a healthy perspective with which to enter adulthood, my friend Probably most would agree with you however I have yet to have someone show me otherwise. Also I consider myself to be open-minded so I await with open arms someone to show me I am wrong.
This is not really an issue as I think it is more of a phase. When one is young and naive, as I once was, you have a strong rebellious reason for things, as you do now, and as I am sure as you do too with other things in life such as religion, education, etc. But as you get older it's more practical.
I am not against marriage because of the religious pretensions, etc. It's plain and simple for me. 1. I am not thinking about it AT ALL. So maybe when it's on my mind already then I'd act on it. 2. It MAY hinder me from having sex with other girls. Simple.
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On October 06 2011 04:22 Bibdy wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 04:19 NorNor wrote:On October 06 2011 04:07 Umpteen wrote:On October 06 2011 04:02 NorNor wrote:Well I shall add my 2 cents. First of all, I am young (ish) 18 years old 19 in 19 days. I have been in a relationship for just over a year now with a girl whose ideal life would be to get married and have children and be a kept woman, basically. I personally do not believe in marriage anymore. My own mother being my primary reason and I will not say anymore on the subject as I think it would be a little off topic. However, the way I see it, as was said in one of the first posts. If you two REALLY love one another, why should you need to get married? The reasons women HONESTLY want it is obvious to me at least now in my infinite wisdom of nearly 19 years of age They don't like being shown up by their friends and if you are married they consider it a one up. Also they like a big engagement ring, I cannot recall the amount of times I have seen women comparing theirs to my mothers. It is another one up. (Here is the point where I realise it leaves a bitter taste to call her that) They want "THE WEDDING" the white dress, the church (even if they aren't religious), the vows (which mean nothing to them most of the time after the ceremony. Has anyone here actually ever seen a married woman who has vowed "to honour and obey" actually agree that they still want to obey their life partner/husband? Perhaps not) This is a big party centralised around THEM and another one up. I think you will find it is from a woman's point of view a status symbol, like many other things (designer clothes? < perhaps a bad example I hope my point comes across) do they really NEED these things? No they just want to show that they are in some ways better than their "friends". Also women like to say it would make me "more secure". I believe this shows the vindictive nature of people. What these women are really saying is "I can fuck him financially if he dare upset me" and I will NOT accept anyone disagreeing with the fact that women in court especially divorce courts are favoured. In England we have no prenuptial agreements and I know that EVERY man who has been divorced that I have come across has far less than half of what it is he started with. I will make this seem less scorned young child taking it out with some research to back it up. "to be happy you need to think yourself better off than those around you." It is a phenomenon called 'relative comparisons'. I know this to be a fact because you can watch endless movies/tv shows whatever of people personifying the feelings of a single woman jealous of all her married friends, but no I am not going to list them. On the other hand I also agree that there are those women (99.999% of which are now over 50) who believe what they are saying when they say "till death do us part" and they are the ones to look out for, but then again they will be the ones who if you explain your worries to will never push you into it to start with. tl/dr : Women are jealous and vindictive, watch out. This is not a healthy perspective with which to enter adulthood, my friend Probably most would agree with you however I have yet to have someone show me otherwise. Also I consider myself to be open-minded so I await with open arms someone to show me I am wrong. Women are just as guilty of acting petty, immature and stupid at a young age as men are. They've got just as much growing up to do as men do, they just like to play 'adult' like it's a game. I suggest, like my father did to me, steering well clear of serious relationships with women until both of you are in your mid-late 20s.
I found you passing on your fathers advice actually quite touching :') so I thank you sir. Probably not how you meant it but I am a bit mooshy 
However I do believe I will never get married for my own sanity
To the poster above (I am such a lurker I don't know how to multi quote) I agree if you two really both feel that way and you really mean what you say then by all means throw the biggest party from here to there! But remember you only ever KNOW half the story, the other half is what someone told you.
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On October 06 2011 04:03 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 03:40 NikonTC wrote:
Uh, it's less of a "getting caught" issue, and more of an ethical issue. I'm sure I could steal money from old ladies and they'd never know about it, and hey they'd probably never even miss it! So why not? No. Unfortunately that's bad logic. Let's stay on course please Show nested quote +That's right, it's unethical. Downright scumbag-ish in fact. How can you possibly want to commit an (arguably worse) slight against a girl you supposedly love, all the while justifying it with a "what she doesn't know won't hurt her!" attitude? Mind boggling :p Really is it that bad? I'll be brutally honest. Why will I do it? Sex, and the Conquest! Do I feel bad about it? No. Damn, maybe I was not brought up correctly. But I'm still convinced this is not an anomaly, especially among men. Deep inside everyone wants to do it, and they only restrain it due to certain social expectations and consequences to the relationship. I don't buy this "love" drama/thing. If I love the woman I'm going to be having sex with outside marriage, then perhaps I should marry her. But no. It's just a mere transgression. An itch. On the bigger picture, do married men tell this themselves like "Ok I will get married now and will do it with no one else other than my wife" and commit to it, or does it come naturally with the decision to get marries?
If you enter the marriage with your wife knowing your intentions, then that's fine. But if she marries you with the apparently false notion you will be faithful to her, this is a train wreck waiting to happen. If you don't want to suppress your primal urges, don't enter an institution of marriage under the promise of faithfulness. If you do, your lack of regard for your wife/girlfriend, and the consequences that could arise as the result of your incredulity are truly sickening, and in my opinion would make you an awful husband.
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On October 06 2011 04:24 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 04:19 NorNor wrote:On October 06 2011 04:07 Umpteen wrote:On October 06 2011 04:02 NorNor wrote:Well I shall add my 2 cents. First of all, I am young (ish) 18 years old 19 in 19 days. I have been in a relationship for just over a year now with a girl whose ideal life would be to get married and have children and be a kept woman, basically. I personally do not believe in marriage anymore. My own mother being my primary reason and I will not say anymore on the subject as I think it would be a little off topic. However, the way I see it, as was said in one of the first posts. If you two REALLY love one another, why should you need to get married? The reasons women HONESTLY want it is obvious to me at least now in my infinite wisdom of nearly 19 years of age They don't like being shown up by their friends and if you are married they consider it a one up. Also they like a big engagement ring, I cannot recall the amount of times I have seen women comparing theirs to my mothers. It is another one up. (Here is the point where I realise it leaves a bitter taste to call her that) They want "THE WEDDING" the white dress, the church (even if they aren't religious), the vows (which mean nothing to them most of the time after the ceremony. Has anyone here actually ever seen a married woman who has vowed "to honour and obey" actually agree that they still want to obey their life partner/husband? Perhaps not) This is a big party centralised around THEM and another one up. I think you will find it is from a woman's point of view a status symbol, like many other things (designer clothes? < perhaps a bad example I hope my point comes across) do they really NEED these things? No they just want to show that they are in some ways better than their "friends". Also women like to say it would make me "more secure". I believe this shows the vindictive nature of people. What these women are really saying is "I can fuck him financially if he dare upset me" and I will NOT accept anyone disagreeing with the fact that women in court especially divorce courts are favoured. In England we have no prenuptial agreements and I know that EVERY man who has been divorced that I have come across has far less than half of what it is he started with. I will make this seem less scorned young child taking it out with some research to back it up. "to be happy you need to think yourself better off than those around you." It is a phenomenon called 'relative comparisons'. I know this to be a fact because you can watch endless movies/tv shows whatever of people personifying the feelings of a single woman jealous of all her married friends, but no I am not going to list them. On the other hand I also agree that there are those women (99.999% of which are now over 50) who believe what they are saying when they say "till death do us part" and they are the ones to look out for, but then again they will be the ones who if you explain your worries to will never push you into it to start with. tl/dr : Women are jealous and vindictive, watch out. This is not a healthy perspective with which to enter adulthood, my friend Probably most would agree with you however I have yet to have someone show me otherwise. Also I consider myself to be open-minded so I await with open arms someone to show me I am wrong. This is not really an issue as I think it is more of a phase. When one is young and naive, as I once was, you have a strong rebellious reason for things, as you do now, and as I am sure as you do too with other things in life such as religion, education, etc. But as you get older it's more practical. I am not against marriage because of the religious pretensions, etc. It's plain and simple for me. 1. I am not thinking about it AT ALL. So maybe when it's on my mind already then I'd act on it. 2. It MAY hinder me from having sex with other girls. Simple.
Oh please don't put me in that light. I do have strong views yes. However they are well founded (mostly, zerg UP ) I was well educated and sent to a very prestigious English Public School (private to you Americans) and as for religion etc I was brought up as an Anglican by my Roman Catholic father who is happy to read about everything under the sun (failed astrology joke)
So yes I agree I am young and probably naive but I have seen a lot for such a young person so don't put me in a "rebellious" category and just rule my opinions out for those reasons.
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I'm 28 and been married for 4 years to a gamer girl. Its been a blast and I've never second guessed the decision to get married.
The only question you need to ask is if the specific variety added to sex by allowing for differing partners is worth losing a lifetime with the woman you are with. There is a million different ways to keep sex interesting with one partner.
Much like playing only one race rather than random, by focusing on how well you perform with just one girl you'll find that can your experience is better because you know the map, how to exploit it, and your "opponent's" weaknesses. Plus you can more deftly experiment and add in new 'strategies'.
So, unless you are something of a sexual athlete who has peaked under the constraints of your partner's sexual failings you're clearly better off sexually with a single woman.
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i dont believe it is possible to completely own the physical nature of a human. i might have worded it wrong but in short i dont think its in reason to think you wont ever cheat or she wont ever cheat. you can love her and she can love you, but you never really own her physical body, unless your cock is huge
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On October 06 2011 04:03 The Black wrote:
On the bigger picture, do married men tell this themselves like "Ok I will get married now and will do it with no one else other than my wife" and commit to it, or does it come naturally with the decision to get marries?
You're approaching it with the wrong mindset. You're approaching it like being monogamous is some shackle of punishment imposed upon you by marriage. If you were in a truly healthy relationship, you wouldn't cheat because you don't want to be with anyone else, you don't want to hurt them, and you respect them too much.
I'll say it again, as long as you have this mindset that you have, you shouldn't get married. I would say the act of cheating in that case would be secondary to entering into a marriage knowing that you'll cheat. Electing to marry this girl knowing you will cheat on her WOULD make you a terrible person. You could try to rationalize it with biological reasons all you like, but it wouldn't change the truth.
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I've got a feeling that your potential future wife may not appreciate some of the things written in this thread OP. Maybe she's cool with it, we obviously don't know her.
Typically, you wouldn't have this type of convo straight up with her... "Can I really be happy with YOU?? And never being with ANY other woman?"
.....
So yeah, based on you even asking this, probably waiting is a good idea.
I'm of the opinion that you just know when it's right. 100%, without any doubts. This is coming from a guy who got married at 20, divorced at 23, and remarried in 2010 and is basically the happiest/ luckiest guy in his opinion.
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On October 06 2011 05:51 thebigdonkey wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 04:03 The Black wrote:
On the bigger picture, do married men tell this themselves like "Ok I will get married now and will do it with no one else other than my wife" and commit to it, or does it come naturally with the decision to get marries? You're approaching it with the wrong mindset. You're approaching it like being monogamous is some shackle of punishment imposed upon you by marriage. If you were in a truly healthy relationship, you wouldn't cheat because you don't want to be with anyone else, you don't want to hurt them, and you respect them too much. I'll say it again, as long as you have this mindset that you have, you shouldn't get married. I would say the act of cheating in that case would be secondary to entering into a marriage knowing that you'll cheat. Electing to marry this girl knowing you will cheat on her WOULD make you a terrible person. You could try to rationalize it with biological reasons all you like, but it wouldn't change the truth.
bigdonkey I'm with you on this one. Unfortunately yes, it is a shackle for me.
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I think you all approach this from the wrong direction. Marriage is ihmo not about advantages for you but about the advantages for your girlfriend. Women have a biological clock ticking and also need to find someone as long as they are still attractive. If they are too old even if they can still have kids they may have to settle for someone less then ideal so they don't want to invest years into a relationship with no security that it holds.
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On October 05 2011 22:28 frontliner2 wrote:
Damnit, Marriage is one tough deal bro,
I've been married for 2.5 years now and I'm very happy with my wife. I still love her and we share a very special soulmate bond thingie. We've been trough very hard times in our relationship and also personal problems we've had almost drove us apart in 2010. Let's just say the subject children and an inablitly to conceive puts the greatest pressure imaginable on a husband and wife. However we've overcome (we are bent on adopting children from Africa).
Not to sound like a dick, but why are you caving into the media and getting a child from Africa? I'm sure there are plenty of kids in your own country (or maybe even your own city), that can also be adopted. It's not as though you're a better person for picking an African child.
Not to mention how alienated the kid will be, with everyone being a different skin colour from his own (and yes it does matter). Especially in a nearly all-white place like the Netherlands.
On Topic:
I'm not married but I consider getting married more of something you do just to conform to society (not necessarily a bad thing). It has some very big cons, and very few pros. The biggest pros are that most people see your relationship as more "solid", and they give you a bit more respect for it. Cons are mainly about how much you can lose if things go wrong, and since marriage is so loosely viewed things go wrong very often.
People can and usually do change over time though, so you should keep that in mind before deciding. The person you marry now may be different from the person you are married to 10+ years from now.
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I'm engaged to be married, (Tentative date: 12th May 2012) and I love it. Been engaged for five months. Before I met this woman I never, ever though I'd be married. Didn't really get it, and then we met and it seemed like the most natural thing in the world to ask her to marry me. Never been happier than when she said yes.
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On October 06 2011 06:02 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 05:51 thebigdonkey wrote:On October 06 2011 04:03 The Black wrote:
On the bigger picture, do married men tell this themselves like "Ok I will get married now and will do it with no one else other than my wife" and commit to it, or does it come naturally with the decision to get marries? You're approaching it with the wrong mindset. You're approaching it like being monogamous is some shackle of punishment imposed upon you by marriage. If you were in a truly healthy relationship, you wouldn't cheat because you don't want to be with anyone else, you don't want to hurt them, and you respect them too much. I'll say it again, as long as you have this mindset that you have, you shouldn't get married. I would say the act of cheating in that case would be secondary to entering into a marriage knowing that you'll cheat. Electing to marry this girl knowing you will cheat on her WOULD make you a terrible person. You could try to rationalize it with biological reasons all you like, but it wouldn't change the truth. bigdonkey I'm with you on this one. Unfortunately yes, it is a shackle for me.
Then your not ready for marriage. Not sure how else it can be put simpler than it already has.
Marriage is about commitment, you don't want to commit, therefore your not ready.
Do you really need to wreck a partner's life to understand this?
If you want the benefits of an open relationship without being a cheating asshat then go find a girl that is into that. There are some that are out there.
My rule of thumb is the golden rule, do you want her doing to you what you want to do to her. Do you want her doing guys on the side because there are millions of guys out there she could have so why should she tie herself down to just you?
You commented earlier how your mature and have gotten past your childish ways of looking at the world and maybe that is so but to me maturity is seeing things as if they happened to you. How would you feel if someone agreed to marry you and then acted as you suggest?
Be honest and go for an open relationship, dont try to justify cheating one someone with the backing of the TL community.
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On October 06 2011 06:13 killa_robot wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2011 22:28 frontliner2 wrote:
Damnit, Marriage is one tough deal bro,
I've been married for 2.5 years now and I'm very happy with my wife. I still love her and we share a very special soulmate bond thingie. We've been trough very hard times in our relationship and also personal problems we've had almost drove us apart in 2010. Let's just say the subject children and an inablitly to conceive puts the greatest pressure imaginable on a husband and wife. However we've overcome (we are bent on adopting children from Africa).
Not to sound like a dick, but why are you caving into the media and getting a child from Africa? I'm sure there are plenty of kids in your own country (or maybe even your own city), that can also be adopted. It's not as though you're a better person for picking an African child. Not to mention how alienated the kid will be, with everyone being a different skin colour from his own (and yes it does matter). Especially in a nearly all-white place like the Netherlands.
Who says he and his wife are caving in to the media by getting a child from Africa?
That's something you made up from reading his post, that doesn't mean that it's actually true. Whatever their reason is to adopt a child from Africa, even if it's because of the media, does it really matter where one adopts there child from? Everywhere in the world there are children that are in a position where adoption would do them good, wheter you adopt a child from across the street or from across the world, it's the fact that one adopts a child that matters, not their origin.
And the Netherlands has more then enough coloured people, I know because I live there as well. So that "nearly all-white place like The Netherlands" seems like a made up comment from your side (no offense, but that's how I see it).
Furthermore, while skin colour can matter, it's more or less the society and family they are raised up in that makes the difference and not their origin or skin colour. If the kid is raised in a loving dutch family (and I am sure that front and his wife will do just that), get's education like any other child in The Netherlands then it's skin colour will not hold him back in The Netherlands.
On October 06 2011 06:02 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 05:51 thebigdonkey wrote:On October 06 2011 04:03 The Black wrote:
On the bigger picture, do married men tell this themselves like "Ok I will get married now and will do it with no one else other than my wife" and commit to it, or does it come naturally with the decision to get marries? You're approaching it with the wrong mindset. You're approaching it like being monogamous is some shackle of punishment imposed upon you by marriage. If you were in a truly healthy relationship, you wouldn't cheat because you don't want to be with anyone else, you don't want to hurt them, and you respect them too much. I'll say it again, as long as you have this mindset that you have, you shouldn't get married. I would say the act of cheating in that case would be secondary to entering into a marriage knowing that you'll cheat. Electing to marry this girl knowing you will cheat on her WOULD make you a terrible person. You could try to rationalize it with biological reasons all you like, but it wouldn't change the truth. bigdonkey I'm with you on this one. Unfortunately yes, it is a shackle for me.
Pretty much what others have put forth as well, if you see marriage as just this then it clearly isn't something for you. As I see it, a open marriage is something you seek and perhaps you will find someone (who knows, maybe even your current gf is open to that) who you hold dear to share such a marriage with.
Other then that, one can also "resort" to threesomes and alike to... feed your urges, sorta say. If you'r really feeling so strongly about doing with other women while still being commited to one, then such a thing may also be a solution without you feeling "shackled" to one person in marriage.
Aside those two, open marriage and group sex, I don't believe you should commit yourself into marriage or a serious relationship with a girl/woman while going behind their back doing others. Such a thing is, in my eyes, just plain wrong and will most likely end up hurting the one you have a relationship with, which in turn you shouldn't want if you truly love them. If you don't care about hurting them, then you are clearly not in love with that person and there isn't really a meaning to having a relationship with that person in the first place.
So, my advice here is, try to find a woman that fits your needs, one who doesn't mind a open relationship or marriage, or perhaps isn't dirty of having some form of group sex once in a while. That's all I can say to help you out here, I guess.
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Marriage is betting half your shit that you will get a long for the rest of your life. How many best friends have you had that you swore were going to be best friends forever, maybe even saved each others lives when doing stupid shit....and then sometime down the road ended up not being friends anymore after something?
If you get married, get a pre-nup. Period.
Why get married? There are tax benefits. Healthcare benefits. etc. Society (in the US atleast) is set up to favor couples. It's also set up to be rigged against men in cases of divorce. Badly. Very badly.
So, if you like/love the person enough...go ahead. Get a prenup though.
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On October 06 2011 06:44 dogabutila wrote:
Marriage is betting half your shit that you will get a long for the rest of your life. How many best friends have you had that you swore were going to be best friends forever, maybe even saved each others lives when doing stupid shit....and then sometime down the road ended up not being friends anymore after something?
If you get married, get a pre-nup. Period.
Why get married? There are tax benefits. Healthcare benefits. etc. Society (in the US atleast) is set up to favor couples. It's also set up to be rigged against men in cases of divorce. Badly. Very badly.
So, if you like/love the person enough...go ahead. Get a prenup though.
To the OP, THIS.
However I think you are incorrect Dogabutila, my father lost 75% and what he brought to the relationship was 100% SO I think you should have put "betting at least half your shit, but probably more"
God Bless creative accounting.
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I personally think we need marriage for the same reason we need, funerals, birthdays, bar mitzvah's or whatever. Human beings have a profound need to ritualize important events in our lives. The commitment can be made regardless of whether or not you have a wedding ceremony. However it sticks in our minds more and gains additional importance when we ritualize things. It's the difference between going to just another high school dance and going to the prom. They are the same things it's just that one has more ceremony and therefore seems more important to us.
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EPT
