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Although never fully discussed here, as I gather from searching, I'm sure a lot of TL have been thinking about it and been wanting to exchange ideas with others, especially those who have already made the commitment and being married.
So here I am, soon approaching the middle of my 20s, and with a gorgeous and wonderful girlfriend for 2 years. I recall Seth Rogen saying on TV that women thing about marriage all the time, and it's almost something that defines them. Men, on the other hand, think about it only when it's time. And I agree with him. Since after our first year of being together, my girlfriend has always tried to bring this up. To be honest, while I like the idea, I really don't know how to respond to it. To be completely honest, whenever I'm out, I think to myself "WOW all these lovely ladies and you're going to be with ONE woman for the rest of your life!" In short, panic.
But it's not that I'm completely adverse to the idea. It's just that It's not on my mind at the moment. Lately, I tried to assure here that 2012 will be our year, and if we had a chance, we can ever do it in the ruins of the Mayans, just to make it more memorable. I am sure that we would make each other good company, and would have the best of times ahead of us. But am I just being a barbar of the male species if I say that somewhere, somehow, you looks for other things, while keeping your wife as a constant, a home. It's unfair, yes, but it's a very strong drive. Really, the thought scares me to death. Millions and millions of women in the world, and you choose to be with one for the rest of your life. Damn.
Who among TL here are married already? How is married life so far? And who are in the same process as I am? It'd be interesting to hear your thoughts.
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I think 2 or 3 years is not enough, 5 years is the best time I think.
Reason being that many relationships end after 1 or 2 or 3 or 4 years but if you are together for 5 years I think it can be assumed that it holds. But even then I have a friend that married after 5 and 1 year after that they divorced but you can never be sure...
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A more interesting debate in my mind is: Why do people NEED to get married these days?
The sanctity of marriage is out the window completely, along with all religious reasons for it. So other than the chance to have a big party and a fuss made of the couple, why to they bother to get married at all? If your relationship is such that you NEED to have some form of "commitment" ceremony to bind yourselves together, then I'd question whether the relationship is strong enough for marriage in the first place.
I'm not sure of any legal benefits to getting married, so I won't comment on those, but I'd be suprised if they were such that a couple had to get married.
Myself, I don't care either way about marriage. I've never cheated on a girl in my life, and if I find a girl that I want to spend the rest of my life with, then I'm capable of doing that without a band of metal on my finger to remind me. However, the girl I'm with may want to get married, or at least have a ceremony of some sort. So I guess I'll have to stay open minded to the concept.
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On October 05 2011 21:52 NikonTC wrote:
A more interesting debate in my mind is: Why do people NEED to get married these days?
The sanctity of marriage is out the window completely, along with all religious reasons for it. So other than the chance to have a big party and a fuss made of the couple, why to they bother to get married at all? If your relationship is such that you NEED to have some form of "commitment" ceremony to bind yourselves together, then I'd question whether the relationship is strong enough for marriage in the first place.
I'm not sure of any legal benefits to getting married, so I won't comment on those, but I'd be suprised if they were such that a couple had to get married.
Myself, I don't care either way about marriage. I've never cheated on a girl in my life, and if I find a girl that I want to spend the rest of my life with, then I'm capable of doing that without a band of metal on my finger to remind me. However, the girl I'm with may want to get married, or at least have a ceremony of some sort. So I guess I'll have to stay open minded to the concept.
This also. But my thought are actually more basic. I'm sorry for being too honest about this as well. You may call it cheating, but can a man actually be satisfied with just one woman (at least sexually?)
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5 ways to know it's time to get married
I am not married, but I loved the above article and it summarizes my opinion as well. If you panic thinking about marriage, then it's probably not a good idea to do it.
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When you have children, marriage makes a lot of things easier. Healthcare is a lot easier when you are married as well. Not to mention, the tax benefits.
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On October 05 2011 21:55 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2011 21:52 NikonTC wrote:
A more interesting debate in my mind is: Why do people NEED to get married these days?
The sanctity of marriage is out the window completely, along with all religious reasons for it. So other than the chance to have a big party and a fuss made of the couple, why to they bother to get married at all? If your relationship is such that you NEED to have some form of "commitment" ceremony to bind yourselves together, then I'd question whether the relationship is strong enough for marriage in the first place.
I'm not sure of any legal benefits to getting married, so I won't comment on those, but I'd be suprised if they were such that a couple had to get married.
Myself, I don't care either way about marriage. I've never cheated on a girl in my life, and if I find a girl that I want to spend the rest of my life with, then I'm capable of doing that without a band of metal on my finger to remind me. However, the girl I'm with may want to get married, or at least have a ceremony of some sort. So I guess I'll have to stay open minded to the concept. This also. But my thought are actually more basic. I'm sorry for being too honest about this as well. You may call it cheating, but can a man actually be satisfied with just one woman (at least sexually?)
I think if you're having these concerns it would definitely be best if you waited a few more years to establish decisively if you are interested in getting married.
Not that I have any experience in the matter. But I'd be clear with my girlfriend that I would want to wait a few more years before deciding if you're ready to spend the rest of your life her.
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It's not the wedding ceremony that matters, it's the promise. If you care enough about a person that you want to devote your life to her/him, then it's reasonable that you swear it to that person, declare your intentions. With a promise of such gravity, you'll of course want witnesses, usually family and friends, and an authority figure to preside over your promise, be it a religious figure, judge, captain, etc.
Contracts are very important, they bring stability to a chaotic world.
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On October 05 2011 22:00 getSome[703] wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2011 21:55 The Black wrote:On October 05 2011 21:52 NikonTC wrote:
A more interesting debate in my mind is: Why do people NEED to get married these days?
The sanctity of marriage is out the window completely, along with all religious reasons for it. So other than the chance to have a big party and a fuss made of the couple, why to they bother to get married at all? If your relationship is such that you NEED to have some form of "commitment" ceremony to bind yourselves together, then I'd question whether the relationship is strong enough for marriage in the first place.
I'm not sure of any legal benefits to getting married, so I won't comment on those, but I'd be suprised if they were such that a couple had to get married.
Myself, I don't care either way about marriage. I've never cheated on a girl in my life, and if I find a girl that I want to spend the rest of my life with, then I'm capable of doing that without a band of metal on my finger to remind me. However, the girl I'm with may want to get married, or at least have a ceremony of some sort. So I guess I'll have to stay open minded to the concept. This also. But my thought are actually more basic. I'm sorry for being too honest about this as well. You may call it cheating, but can a man actually be satisfied with just one woman (at least sexually?) I think if you're having these concerns it would definitely be best if you waited a few more years to establish decisively if you are interested in getting married. Not that I have any experience in the matter. But I'd be clear with my girlfriend that I would want to wait a few more years before deciding if you're ready to spend the rest of your life her.
What if after 5 years I still feel the same. Am I bound to not get married? Or be cheating within marriage?
dotHead is right though, there are a lot of legal benefits to getting married.
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On October 05 2011 21:56 Inex wrote:5 ways to know it's time to get marriedI am not married, but I loved the above article and it summarizes my opinion as well. If you panic thinking about marriage, then it's probably not a good idea to do it.
seconded..... John Cheese is the fucking man
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If you go around banging women and never get married, what is that really going to achieve? Sure it gets your rocks off and you feel good. But at the end of the day, you won't raise children of your own, or have a stable environment with social support to raise a child of your own, unless you get married and devote yourself to one girl (eventually). And to be honest, as a human being, raising offspring is pretty much your only purpose.
There's plenty of reasons to get married. But its not something you should rush into. There's no magical sign that you should marry someone either. Its up to the both of you to commit. It takes 2 to tango so to speak.
So yeah, I dunno what I'm really trying to say. Do what you want, I guess.. but I believe never getting married will just set you up to have a purposeless and ultimately lonely existence. Unless you wanna die young lol
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On October 05 2011 22:00 Harbinger631 wrote:
It's not the wedding ceremony that matters, it's the promise. If you care enough about a person that you want to devote your life to her/him, then it's reasonable that you swear it to that person, declare your intentions. With a promise of such gravity, you'll of course want witnesses, usually family and friends, and an authority figure to preside over your promise, be it a religious figure, judge, captain, etc.
Contracts are very important, they bring stability to a chaotic world.
The way you say that, you make it sound like marriage is just a tool of the paranoid and the self-conscious. "Oh you love me do you? Well then you won't mind signing this contract that means I get half your stuff if it turns out you're lying!"
Surely if you "care enough about a person that you want to devote your life to her/him" as you say, then you don't NEED to make a promise.
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i'm not married but engaged to be married with my beautiful fiance. We've been living together for 5 years and i finally proposed last winter and were getting married this summer.
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On October 05 2011 21:56 Inex wrote:5 ways to know it's time to get marriedI am not married, but I loved the above article and it summarizes my opinion as well. If you panic thinking about marriage, then it's probably not a good idea to do it.
Damn. That ending was actually really clever haha
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I think I am a rare sort here on TeamLiquid. I am 23 and have been married for 3 1/2 years. I have never regretted getting married even though I blame the fact that I am still in Diamond league on it. :D I think the stability it gives is a large plus, largely for kids. Sure, you are with one woman (presumably planning on being with her the rest of your life as well) but I think looking at other woman and wondering is often a case of "the grass is greener on the other side". My 2 cents...
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Just based on some replies in this thread: Is it ok to still make the promise *without* the marriage hooplah? Would I be wrong for *wanting* to make that promise to someone?
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On October 05 2011 22:08 NikonTC wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2011 22:00 Harbinger631 wrote:
It's not the wedding ceremony that matters, it's the promise. If you care enough about a person that you want to devote your life to her/him, then it's reasonable that you swear it to that person, declare your intentions. With a promise of such gravity, you'll of course want witnesses, usually family and friends, and an authority figure to preside over your promise, be it a religious figure, judge, captain, etc.
Contracts are very important, they bring stability to a chaotic world. The way you say that, you make it sound like marriage is just a tool of the paranoid and the self-conscious. "Oh you love me do you? Well then you won't mind signing this contract that means I get half your stuff if it turns out you're lying!" Surely if you "care enough about a person that you want to devote your life to her/him" as you say, then you don't NEED to make a promise.
It's not about NEEDING to make a promise, it's wanting too. If you really want to devote your life to one person, you should be able to shout it from the rooftops. If you're worried about your stuff, then you obviously don't want to devote yourself to your spouse, and you shouldn't get married. If you don't want to make a promise, but think that you care enough to make it work, then you're holding back and somethings wrong.
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If you really love someone and want to spend the rest of your life with that person, there is no good reason to not get married 
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You're missing my point I think, I'm perfectly happy with "promising" myself to someone I care about, my question was why do I have to do it using a word, a band of metal, and a priest of a religion I don't even follow?
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Damnit, Marriage is one tough deal bro,
I've been married for 2.5 years now and I'm very happy with my wife. I still love her and we share a very special soulmate bond thingie. We've been trough very hard times in our relationship and also personal problems we've had almost drove us apart in 2010. Let's just say the subject children and an inablitly to conceive puts the greatest pressure imaginable on a husband and wife. However we've overcome (we are bent on adopting children from Africa).
Imagine this. If you feel that the woman you're with is your soulmate. That no matter how hot other women may be, you'd still rather be with her than with the hottest celebrity / model / pornstar no matter wat, then you know. Love is more than worrying about not being able to fuck around with other woman.
Alsof if your marriage fails, it fails. Best to accept it then, not the end of the world.
I can recommend marriage. However I may argue knowing someone for 2 years may mean that you've not fully explored each other emotionally.
I would not leave my wife anytime. She is soooo precious to me, my soul belongs to her. She is my angel. If she would end up in a wheelchair, become horrbily skinny or obviously overweigth, still I'd prefer being with her. When you put your forehead against her forehead in an emotional moment and you feel like this is the best place to be at this given time you will know that you want to be with her forever.
Hell, even if my wife and I would divorce at some time by unforseen hardships that have pushed the limits of tolerable emotional pain, I'm still convinced that our love will be eternal, even after death. She's my wife bloody hell and I'd have it no other way.
In my hearth for ever until I die!
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On October 05 2011 22:26 NikonTC wrote:
You're missing my point I think, I'm perfectly happy with "promising" myself to someone I care about, my question was why do I have to do it using a word, a band of metal, and a priest of a religion I don't even follow?
In the US, at least, there are several "marriage" style ceremonies that are both religious and non-religious that are both legally binding and non-legally binding. The idea is to allow the celebratory parts of the marriage without including some of the legal parts.
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I preferred your Soulmerge line before the edit. It made marriage sound like becoming an archon.
Sure there are sacrifices, you lose your cloaking/psionic storm, but the shield gain more than makes up for it.
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Kyrgyz Republic1462 Posts
I have been married for 3 years now and I have come to the conclusion that overall this was a pretty even trade-off between comfort of living and personal freedom. Sometimes you wish you could be alone, sometimes you are extremely happy that your wife is always with you. However my wife is an extremely loyal and tolerant person, and that is what makes it work. If she were closer to the nagging/manipulative or the useless/glamour type I would have quit this relationship long ago.
Before you get married, you both need to think about the habits or the personality traits of your partner that annoy you. If there is something like that, but you keep ignoring it or just lying to yourself about it, it will get worse with each year of living together.
With regards to another women, it's not really a big problem. You just have to realise that you don't actually want to spend time with other women, you just want to be able to do that. There really is nothing that they can give you that your wife cannot, but not the other way around.
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Being married has indeed benefits to it, not 100% clear to what that exactly translates to in each part of the world, but I do believe one get's more "support" from the goverment when one is married compared to living together as a couple.
So for that matter one can get married, the difference in the "support" one get's is pretty big from what I have heard. Other reasons to get married is for the promise one makes in marriage, to spend the rest of your life with your other half is a big promise. And while one can make this promise without the form of marriage, it's the fact that marriage is done through church and/or the goverment that most people find the promise having more meaning to it. It's most likely in most people's eyes a bigger show of commitment then just promosing you will forever stay by their side on the couch.
Further more, marriage can also be done because of religious reasons, enough people out there that still believe in no sex after marriage for example. Or just are religious and like to get married because they believe in that.
Now on to my personal view, I hate marriage. I got nothing against people who do get married, after all it's up to everyone to make that call for themselves, not me to do so or judge upon it. But I believe if one truly loves a other, then a marriage isn't needed to bind them together for the rest of their lives. Of course, it's not bad to do so and if you do it then that doesn't mean the love isn't there or big enough to survive, but I don't feel it as a need.
My girlfriend on the other hand thinks otherwise, I have known her almost my whole life (together now for just over 3 years) and I know she loves to get married. She isn't super crazy about getting married or anything, she just likes to get married. I love her and for this I have put aside my own opinion about marriage and asked her to marry, because that's what she loves and when she is happy, I am. Even so, I asked her twice so far and both times she said no. She thinks in the same manner as me, she loves me and knows I hate marriage and for that reason refuses to marry me as long as I hate marriage.
Right now I have no doubts that I will ask her once again in the near future and again and again. Even though I am pretty sure she will say no each of those times, for me. Still I will keep asking her as a show that I love her enough to put aside my own wishes and fulfill hers. Wheter one day she will finally say yes to me or not I don't know, somewhere I hope she does and somewhere I hope she doesn't. I guess till she says yes, I will keep asking her, which may be till the end of our lives together.
As for you The Black, I can't say much on what you should/need to do in the situation you'r in. As you put it, she likes to get married to you, which in turn you aren't too sure about. You shouldn't worry too much about having doubts in what form that may be, it's better to question yourself now then after, really. I think the best way to put it is, "time will tell". Don't rush things, after all you are together for about 2 years, that is quite something, but not super long in my eyes.
I am sure that within the near future you will realise that the worries/doubts you had about marriage either fade away at the thought of actually getting married with your loved one or not. I know that sounds easy and perhaps even silly, but all I can say is, you will know what you want as long as you give yourself time to listen to both your heart and mind. (cheesy advice ftw. xD)
Also, sorta a sidenote, a guy (asuming you'r a guy.) doesn't have to propose to a woman. It's rather silly to see a woman really having the need for a guy to propose and pushing the subject of getting married over and over onto the guy's mind instead of asking herself. You can always raise this subject to her whenever she raises getting married, though do note that you do need to be careful about how you raise this. Alot of women out there are still rather, traditional about this and don't like the idea of hearing that they themselves perhaps should propose instead of the guy.
No idea if this was of any help at all. >.<
Ps, If I happen to have offended/insulted any married people out there, my deepest apologies, it wasn't my intention nor meaning to do so.
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On October 05 2011 21:28 The Black wrote:
Who among TL here are married already? How is married life so far? And who are in the same process as I am? It'd be interesting to hear your thoughts.
Married at 23. My wife and I were friends for three years, and it ended up that we went from friends to "lets get married" (and I mean friends, not "friends with benefits") - totally skipped the 'dating' relationship. No regrets, and 'married life' is great (oh, and 'government benefits' weren't a factor... I don't know why people keep bringing them up).
...Never did get cold feet either, or feelings of "what if" or "look at all these women".
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I've been with my girlfriend for well over 8 years, we've been living together for 4 years now. All I can say is everyday is a compromised. It's not a matter of love, it's more subjective.
Even though we both are extrememly busy individuals, we still find times to argue with one another through precious windows of time that we have. Think about marriage carefully; most people don't commit until they are in there 30s.
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Marriage exists currently so women can cheat on men and then legally rob them of half their belongings.
I mean, 4 T3H LOVEEE1!1!!1
On topic:
If you do get married, make sure to set up a bank account in your own name. A few of my friends did the "together forever" crap, put their money in a shared account with their wives, and then were left penniless when their wives decided to get a divorce.
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Ok these are my thoughts:
Legal benefits - understood and agree
Life stability - ok I get it
Commitment - Clear
Problem is, is it not natural for a man to really go hunting. It's not even about the grass being greener on the other side. It's about pleasure, or, forgive me, conquest! Maybe one can get married and just secretly be "hunting" on the sides, but still be in love and committed to the marriage. Is that such a bastardly thought? Perhaps there will be such a woman in time that will tame a man, right?
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I just want to add some information that is lacking on financial disadvantages/advantages of marriage.
I'm no expert, but two quick google searches confirmed my suspicions.
I was always under the impression that the combined income of both married individuals could put you in a higher tax bracket.
Here are two links to support that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marriage_penalty
http://www.bankrate.com/finance/taxes/are-tax-rates-higher-if-you-get-married.aspx
Then again, there ARE financial benefits to being married:
-Save money on car insurance
-Raise your credit score
-Get favorable loan offers
-Share employer benefits (healthcare)
-Financial stability
http://money.msn.com/family-money/6-financial-benefits-of-marriage-investopedia.aspx
Being in a higher tax bracket may be worth the benefits.
Although I'm certain is varies greatly.
Edit: More on topic:
I agree with Kirdies advice. I know too many people that get married at a young age, after being together for SHORT periods of time. Which, in my book is 1-2 years.
And what do you know, the divorce, or at least serious relationship problems, comes after, in too many cases.
Also, having children brought into a dysfunctional marriage, will only damage the child. A broken home(divorce) will do so even more; although not in all cases.
This is a decision that shouldn't be made lightly.
On October 05 2011 21:34 kirdie wrote:
I think 2 or 3 years is not enough, 5 years is the best time I think.
Reason being that many relationships end after 1 or 2 or 3 or 4 years but if you are together for 5 years I think it can be assumed that it holds. But even then I have a friend that married after 5 and 1 year after that they divorced but you can never be sure...
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On October 05 2011 21:52 NikonTC wrote:
A more interesting debate in my mind is: Why do people NEED to get married these days?
The sanctity of marriage is out the window completely, along with all religious reasons for it. So other than the chance to have a big party and a fuss made of the couple, why to they bother to get married at all? If your relationship is such that you NEED to have some form of "commitment" ceremony to bind yourselves together, then I'd question whether the relationship is strong enough for marriage in the first place.
I'm not sure of any legal benefits to getting married, so I won't comment on those, but I'd be suprised if they were such that a couple had to get married.
Myself, I don't care either way about marriage. I've never cheated on a girl in my life, and if I find a girl that I want to spend the rest of my life with, then I'm capable of doing that without a band of metal on my finger to remind me. However, the girl I'm with may want to get married, or at least have a ceremony of some sort. So I guess I'll have to stay open minded to the concept.
This is about exactly how I'm thinking. Also, my parents who've been togheter for I think 21 years+ now are not married, so I don't think there is any need at all.
It is simpler to get married though, legally, because if you're married, and one of you die, then the other one gets all the stuff automatically. Meanwhile if one of my parents died and they hadn't fixed anything legally in beforehand, me and my sister would've been the ones to inherit everything. Obviously this shouldn't be to much of a problem in most cases, if you still have a good relationship with your Children they are quite likely to let you keep the things you want to keep, but still it's probably better to just have everything figured out legally in beforehand.
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Married for 13 years now, will probably be married for at least another 13 at this point.
In short, if you aren't 100% without a shred of doubt sure..Don't get married. Honestly there is little reason to get married anymore. The Tax benefits have all but been wiped out and frankly if it doesn't work (Lets be honest, this is a thing you must consider), the Legal system is absolutely stacked against you as a man. There is a phrase "It's cheaper to keep her", and it is extremely true. In most cases Divorce no matter how amicable will just about financially ruin the man and have zero impact on the woman. Obviously the hope is that this never comes up, but you have to plan for the worst case either way.
That said..a V relationship or polyamorous relationship where a couple has a single girlfriend that is dating them both is the best relationship imaginable.
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I might be able to bring some different perspective, since I'm getting married in exactly 1 month. Though we have only dated proper for a little over 2 years, we've known each other since we were kids, so take with that what you will as far as "the right time" goes.
The thing is, there's no formula, and there's no best way to go about this. When I talked to my dad about proposing, he tore into me for almost an hour on all the problems and doubts that I might have. Some of them were like yours, that I'd have but one woman for the rest of my life, etc. But then he gave me some great advice: if you're waiting for the perfect time to get married, you might as well stay single, because it's never going to happen. There will always be doubts and problems and issues and whatever. The real question you have to ask yourself is do you want to make the commitment to this girl? Is she worth spending your time and effort on taking care of for the rest of your life, and do you want to make her spend her time and effort taking care of you?
There are lots of great reasons to get married. Let me caveat before I get into them, however, that these are reasons that work for most folks but not all. Some people can be committed and unmarried and be totally cool with it, some folks can have open marriages or swing and that's no big deal, either. If you have that goin' for you, that's cool, but it's certainly not the majority of folks out there. I'm gonna gamble that you're the average guy, and thus talk about average things. If I don't always say that below, just know I'm not being presumptuous, I know that what I have to say doesn't apply to every person or relationship.
As far as sanctity, it is what you make of it. I'm totally committed and we're religious folks, so I'd disagree that there's no sanctity to marriage. A friend of mine once called her man "good first husband material." Not much sanctity there, haha, but for us, the perspective is totally different. If y'all aren't religious, as well, then I can understand how this wouldn't be a huge factor.
Besides that though, the express commitment to taking care of each other for life simply cannot be accomplished for most relationships without marriage. I know that logically marriage isn't necessary for two people to be together, but really, try telling that to your potential mate for life. Such an attitude will break far more relationships than it saves, because marriage is how most of our cultures express the desire to be committed to another for life. It's what most people who want to be so committed expect, especially among females, if I might. If you don't have a significant other, you can comfort yourself with all the logic in the world behind not needing to be married to be committed for life, but in practice don't be surprised is this gets shot down in about 3 seconds with an angry stare. Relationships are built on logic, at least not in large part.
As far as that being taken care of thing, let me tell you, it doesn't get any better than it. The difference is stark to me right now, because we are long distance until the wedding, and I feel discernibly empty because of it. When we're together, she just keeps my life on track in a way I never could myself. It makes me feel special to know that I have someone who believes in me and loves me enough to devote so much of her day to my own well-being, and it inspires me to do as much or more for her in return. In that way, we build each other up, make each other better. I go to work happy to know that I'm helping take care of her, even if my job sucks. To put it more simply, she improves my quality of life by a large degree, and I her. Yes, I'm giving up certain freedoms to gain this, but for me there's no comparison to waking up next to her as opposed to mostly waking up alone, perhaps occasionally with another. Furthermore, we have complete trust and comfort with one another.The perpetual dating world features games and unknowns that simply don't exist in married life (or at least they shouldn't, haha). I can walk around in my underwear no big deal, she can snore and not feel self-conscious. We get to be ourselves without worry and still receive affection and love, a great comfort.
Another big plus is that we're eventually going to have kids and such, and marriage is a great benefit for family stability. Kids thrive on structure, and marriage, as a construct, is naturally more of a structure than non-marriage. If you're not into kids, which really how many guys in their mid-20s are, then this might not be such a strong factor, haha. However, for me, when I have kids, I want them to feel secure in their parents always being together and being there for them, which marriage does better than any amount of logical convincing. Again, logically, this is unnecessary, but in practice, it simply tends to work better.
Legally, in the US, marriage has a ton of benefits. Tax-wise, there can be a penalty or a benefit depending on what you both make, but as far as being the family that can be there in the hospital past closing hours, getting healthcare plans together, etc., there's lots of good stuff. None of these are very strong reasons to get married though, so I don't think they're worth much consideration for most folks.
There are lots of other reasons, but many of them are relationship specific. Consider how she makes you feel, and consider how you'd feel without that. Don't focus only on the positives of being alone, like having more freedom. Focus on the negatives as well, because it's always easier to consider what you're missing than what you've got. I'm not saying go off and get married, because I consider it a serious commitment that you need to be as sure of as possible before you take the leap. However, if you're worried that marriage in general is just not worth it, please allow me to dissuade you from such notions. It's the best decision I've ever made, so there's obviously some benefits for the average guy out there.
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I've been dating my gf for over six years now, first two were great, like a love story; third was shaky as fuck, fourth was worse, fifth was better, but still pretty bad. Obviously lots of fights and attempts to break up etc.
At this point however, we both think it's going great, and I'm pretty sure we'll end up getting married some time in the near future.
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On October 05 2011 22:42 The Black wrote:
Ok these are my thoughts:
Legal benefits - understood and agree
Life stability - ok I get it
Commitment - Clear
Problem is, is it not natural for a man to really go hunting. It's not even about the grass being greener on the other side. It's about pleasure, or, forgive me, conquest! Maybe one can get married and just secretly be "hunting" on the sides, but still be in love and committed to the marriage. Is that such a bastardly thought? Perhaps there will be such a woman in time that will tame a man, right?
If this is your thought process, stop kidding yourself and your girlfriend. You aren't ready for marriage, and she doesn't sound like someone you really want to marry. You're being unfair to her.
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It's pretty simple - you will know if marriage is right for you if you have no hesitation in making that commitment, and the prospect of spending your life with that one person does not scare you at all (the thought of being seperated should be scary, not the prospect of being "bound" to that person).
If you have been with this person for two years, and you have any doubts about commitment, you should be thinking about SPLITTING UP, not marriage. If you are in a long term relationship and the answer to the question "could I see myself potentially spending my life with this person" is not 'yes', when what are you still doing in that relationship?
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OP you'll know when it's right. That simple. It's not about making a checklist or thinking about her vs. other women. If you're thinking the way you're thinking, it's not right yet.
It may never be right with this girl or with any girl - who knows. Not worth stressing about imo (like trying to figure out your MMR). When you know you'll know, otherwise everything else is theorycrafting 
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When I like a girl I tend to disregard the rest.
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I have been married for 7 years now.. even I can not believe it. I was blessed enough to have met my wife online playing Quake III. Yes, that's a true story. There are a lot of great things about being married and if you are able to compromise your 'gaming' a bit for the better of the marriage, its even better. Not many guys will find a women that games or even understands it.. but oddly enough.. Facebook games has changed that a bit. It is easier now to meet someone that understands online gaming a bit more...to a degree.
If you are questioning how you feel about a woman... do not get married.
If you think the 'next step' in your life is to get married... do not get married.
BUT.. if neither one of those thoughts/feelings are present.. and you feel truly blessed to be sharing your life with the other person..then go for it! Its a commitment that takes work, a little luck and lots of love.. but one that is surely worth it.
my 3 cents...
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I am married and it is better than being single.
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I proposed to my wife after 1 week and a half of dating, we were sure. been together 2+ years now.
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On October 05 2011 21:28 The Black wrote:
Although never fully discussed here, as I gather from searching, I'm sure a lot of TL have been thinking about it and been wanting to exchange ideas with others, especially those who have already made the commitment and being married.
So here I am, soon approaching the middle of my 20s, and with a gorgeous and wonderful girlfriend for 2 years. I recall Seth Rogen saying on TV that women thing about marriage all the time, and it's almost something that defines them. Men, on the other hand, think about it only when it's time. And I agree with him. Since after our first year of being together, my girlfriend has always tried to bring this up. To be honest, while I like the idea, I really don't know how to respond to it. To be completely honest, whenever I'm out, I think to myself "WOW all these lovely ladies and you're going to be with ONE woman for the rest of your life!" In short, panic.
But it's not that I'm completely adverse to the idea. It's just that It's not on my mind at the moment. Lately, I tried to assure here that 2012 will be our year, and if we had a chance, we can ever do it in the ruins of the Mayans, just to make it more memorable. I am sure that we would make each other good company, and would have the best of times ahead of us. But am I just being a barbar of the male species if I say that somewhere, somehow, you looks for other things, while keeping your wife as a constant, a home. It's unfair, yes, but it's a very strong drive. Really, the thought scares me to death. Millions and millions of women in the world, and you choose to be with one for the rest of your life. Damn.
Who among TL here are married already? How is married life so far? And who are in the same process as I am? It'd be interesting to hear your thoughts.
This sounds like you think there is someone better out there. Is this true? If you do think that, then you aren't ready to get married...
Men tend to blame the fact they dont think about marriage because they are men. If you truly want too you would have talked to her about it and you would have given it serious thought. The fact that you haven't says there is something about you or her that's holding you back.
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My cousin once told me "when you know, you know." She and her husband were married very quickly within 6 months of meeting each other. When I was single or dating, I never really understood those words. I would question, "Is this it?" "Is she the one?" and never really come up with a concrete answer.
I met my wife 2 years ago and we've been married 1.5 years. After a couple months, I realized she was someone I could imagine myself living with for the rest of my life. It was like a lightbulb went off in my head. I thought to myself "if I were to die today and never marry her, would I regret it?" In my heart, I knew would regret it if I didn't marry her. A lot of friends and family were saying to take it slow and take our time. In the end, it boiled down to what my cousin told me "when you know, you know." Haven't looked back ever since.
P.S. We have a 2 week old son now.
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Probably not the best idea to get married and already be planning to cheat on her. Just saying.
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i recently celebrated my 6th wedding anniversary in Sept. my wife was on me about getting married for years. i wasn't ready. all women have a mindset that follows like this: engagement, wedding, kids. why? cuz thats all any of them talk about. "when are you getting married?" "when you gonna have kids?". its peer pressure from everyone around them, cuz thats what people think they have to do.
know what changed after we got married? nothing! its just a little piece of paper saying you legally share your lives.
remember, this isn't all about her. you guys have to make this decision together, if you feel she is the right girl, then yes, by all means...go get hitched. if you still aren't sure, wait it out for awhile, if she loves you, she'll understand. just don't string her along for too long.
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On October 05 2011 23:15 rogzardo wrote:
Probably not the best idea to get married and already be planning to cheat on her. Just saying.
You understood me perfectly. Does it still count as cheating if I still love here and commit to here forever?
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The thought of getting married was easy for me. Being married is easy for us. Been married for a little over three years now. We've been together since 10th grade. We are both 27. We also have a two year old daughter.
I still don't understand how EVERYONE says "marriage takes a lot of work blahblahblaaahhh".
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Eh although, I can't really agree with Seth Rogen as the best source of info. Time before marriage isn't really that big of a deal people make it out to be. My parent met 2 months before their marriage and have been married for 25+ years and continuing.
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On October 05 2011 23:38 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2011 23:15 rogzardo wrote:
Probably not the best idea to get married and already be planning to cheat on her. Just saying. You understood me perfectly. Does it still count as cheating if I still love here and commit to here forever?
Yes. Fucking another person counts as cheating.
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On October 05 2011 23:38 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2011 23:15 rogzardo wrote:
Probably not the best idea to get married and already be planning to cheat on her. Just saying. You understood me perfectly. Does it still count as cheating if I still love here and commit to here forever?
Now I'm beginning to think your a troll....
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Let me give you my opinion.
1) How many years you have been with the person doesn't make any conclusive sense : it's about how much you went through together(nice and bad things), of course if you have been with the person for 5 years, you are more likely to have encountered those moments than someone who is dating for 2 weeks that's just common sense, but you will find people that share more in one year than other in 5 years.
2) Being attracted physically by other persons,married or not, is completely normal, it's not the problem, it's about understanding that you will never be able to share the kind of relationship you have with your girlfriend with a stranger, who doesn't know you and that you don't know either. Simple example I'm pretty sure that if I say "noob" to a stranger he will not understand it, we will not laugh together about it, if I say "noob" to my fiancee right now she would start the PS3 and try to kick my ass at the game we play at that moment...It's just a completly random example that could apply to every situation you encounter in life with your partner.
3) Put all those legal benefits out of your decision, it shouldn't even come to mind seriously, it's about choosing if you're going or not to build the rest of your life with a person (whether it's a religious mariage or not doesn't matter)
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On October 05 2011 23:07 csn_JohnClark wrote:
If you are questioning how you feel about a woman... do not get married.
If you think the 'next step' in your life is to get married... do not get married.
BUT.. if neither one of those thoughts/feelings are present.. and you feel truly blessed to be sharing your life with the other person..then go for it! Its a commitment that takes work, a little luck and lots of love.. but one that is surely worth it.
my 3 cents...
Can't really say I agree with both of those "if's", to a extent you may be right though. But I still go by "a good follower questions his leader", in this sense I find it only natural to question your feelings about your loved one from time to time. After all, when you have a loved one and life is so amazing with her/him, isn't it natural for you to question those "perfect" moments in life and in that way question your love for him/her?
Doing this doesn't mean you aren't ready or shouldn't get married in any way, it may be a sign that you aren't ready yet, true, but not that often to really make it a general sign for everyone to watch out for. I do it alot, questioning her love for me and mine love for her and each and every time I or she proves me wrong about my doubts. I don't see how that would be a sign in any way to not get married or not being ready to get married.
As for the next step, that thought often comes to mind with people because of society labeling marriage as "the next step". Thinking about it in that way is a pretty regular thing to do for someone I do believe and not a reason to not get married yet. Though if you mean, and I think you do, that you "solely" think of marriage as the next step for.. a longer period of time and feel like you should do it because of this, then it may be best to not get married on that thought/feeling.
Just my view on this.
On October 05 2011 23:38 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2011 23:15 rogzardo wrote:
Probably not the best idea to get married and already be planning to cheat on her. Just saying. You understood me perfectly. Does it still count as cheating if I still love here and commit to here forever?
Uuh, yes?
Unless you discuss this with your gf/wife (if you get married) and she has no issues with you sleeping with other women (or men, your choice ^ ^), then it simply does count as cheating. No matter how much you love her or commit to her, if you do such a thing behind her back or out in the open without her approval then it's just plain cheating on her.
Seeing this post and the rest (+ the reactions of some other posters on you), I do believe you'r indeed not ready to get married and most likely she isn't the right person for you. She, seeing from your post, obviously wants to commit to you, but you on the other hand aren't sure about that (nothing wrong with that alone) and at the same time question wheter it's oke to cheat on her or not when you do commit.
Unless you want to go for a open marriage, then I do believe you'r better off not comitting to her at this point. If you do and these thoughts about going around with other women stays, then you will most likely end up hurting her when you give in to those thoughts/feelings. Which isn't something she wants to happen (of course) or you if you truly love her.
I guess it isn't so much about wheter you are ready to get married, but more or less wheter you are ready to commit in general here. Seeing this all, I do believe you'r not ready to commit seriously to a relationship, wheter in marriage or not, perhaps time will change this and you will end up marrying her and spend the rest of your life faithfully to her, who knows.
But for know I advice you to not marry her if you seriously are considering such thoughts/feelings.
Not meaning to offend you in any way btw with this, if I did my apologies, just trying to help out.
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26 years atm, been married for 2 years and a bit. My wife and I were friends for just under a year when we got together as a couple. One year later we both moved out of our parents houses (as students) and moved in together. 5 years later we got married.
Now, we never were (and still aren't) the traditional romantic types, so marriage was never something that was very high on the to-do list (more of a "yeah, we could do that at some point" thing). In fact, I can truthfully say that we got married for the money My wife works as a particle physicist (doing a PhD) in the Netherlands, and as a part of her work, she had to live and work at CERN in Geneva, Switzerland, for one year. To compensate for the additional costs and related downsides of this year abroad, a persons salary is increased during this year and a number of return trips back home are refunded. The size of the salary-increase and the number of return-trips goes up quite a bit if you're in a legal partnership or marriage.
So already sharing all financial resources and costs and having settled on the whole staying together forever business, we decided that we'd go for the extra money. Since my wife has the Dutch, Swiss and US nationalities, the standard Dutch legal partnership would probably not carry over too well to the other 2 countries. In addition, our line of work has a really high chance of us ending up working in countries other than the Netherlands and especially when you have kids, things just get simpler if you're married.
So that's our completely unromantic story... Note that we did decide on having a "proper" wedding day, with a dress, a cake and stuff (though none of it very high budget) and it was an amazing day that was totally worth it. But afterwards, nothing really changed in our lives as we already lived together and shared everything.
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Marriage is either a religious (pseudo cult) ritual to discourage infidelity, a legal agreement between two people, or a celebration of a commitment.
If you feel the need or desire to participate in any of these things feel free to do so. Otherwise marriage is outdated and irrelevant.
+ Show Spoiler +i hope i get married one day foreveralone.jpg
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On October 05 2011 23:50 wingweaver415 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2011 23:38 The Black wrote:On October 05 2011 23:15 rogzardo wrote:
Probably not the best idea to get married and already be planning to cheat on her. Just saying. You understood me perfectly. Does it still count as cheating if I still love here and commit to here forever? Now I'm beginning to think your a troll....
No you don't understand me. Let me ask this question among men here, is it just me or is it natural to desire sex with beautiful women, many of them. That among the core issues I tried to bring up in the OP, other than of course the act of marriage.
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Well, I've waited a long time...I'm 35 now. And I recently got engaged to me girlfriend of three years.
I don't buy Seth Rogan's distinction between men and women. Plenty of women I have met show little interest in marriage. Plenty of men I've known imagine themselves having a family.
For me, I did not want to settle for the wrong person or for someone who was mostly right for me. Given that my parents divorced when I was in my early twenties, I decided to take the decision seriously.
I'm happy to be engaged and as soon as I finish my dissertation, I'll have the peace of mind to pursue the planning of the future.
tl;dr Don't settle. There is not rush to get married. Men have this easier as their are fewer social taboos and biological limitations on having kids later in life.
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"Don't even think about marriage until you are at least thirty..."
-- Barney Stinson
However, I never had a long (or very successful for that matter) relationship...
(I'm twenty five.)
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Lord_J
Kenya1085 Posts
I'm not married and don't plan to marry. For me, it's a matter of personal preference. While I recognize that there are many people in the world who would be happier married than otherwise, I don't think that I'm among them.
When it comes down to it, I prefer freedom and independence over stability and belonging. I'm a private person who needs a lot of personal space and a lot of time to myself. I don't want children, but I do want the freedom to pick up and move to another city, or even another country, if the right opportunity presents itself, without worrying about how it will affect someone else.
In the end, that kind of commitment is a deeply personal choice. If you're having the kind of doubts about it that you seem to be, then you should take that as a huge warning sign that marriage is not right for you--at least, not right now. That may change. It could change for me too: I am open to that possibility. However, you definitely don't want to get into the mindset of "it's time to get married" because of social pressure or expectations. If and when you decide to get married, it should be because you personally and genuinely want to do it.
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On October 06 2011 00:00 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2011 23:50 wingweaver415 wrote:On October 05 2011 23:38 The Black wrote:On October 05 2011 23:15 rogzardo wrote:
Probably not the best idea to get married and already be planning to cheat on her. Just saying. You understood me perfectly. Does it still count as cheating if I still love here and commit to here forever? Now I'm beginning to think your a troll.... No you don't understand me. Let me ask this question among men here, is it just me or is it natural to desire sex with beautiful women, many of them. That among the core issues I tried to bring up in the OP, other than of course the act of marriage.
You did a poor job at bringing this subject up at your OP to be honest. xD
I will reply, even though I am not a guy, because this goes beyond just being a guy. After all, wheter you'r a guy or a woman, we both have feelings and both have lust and desires. Wheter that is for a guy or a woman doesn't really matter in this case in my eyes.
Now onto what you are asking, yes and no. I can't speak for every person out there obviously, but I do believe that having thoughts/desires about having sex with beautiful women (or men for that matter) isn't unnatural, wheter you are in a relationship or not.
Though to what extent this desire goes is what matters here, you have put this rather short and simple which doesn't give anyone here much insight to what extent you really mean. After all, having the desire or thought about having sex with beautiful women/men doesn't really sound alien to anyone in these forums I do believe.
But is this desire so big that you feel like you "have" to give in to it, no matter wheter you'r in a relationship or not?
Or is this desire just something that comes up now and then when you see/hear something that reminds you of such a matter and lingers in your head for a while?
Simply put, are the desires so big that they can and will completely control your actions at a point or not?
If not then I doubt one can call such desires unnatural, but if it's something you can't ignore even though you love/commited completely to one person, then one can say it's "unnatural" I do believe. (by "society standards")
In the end though, I can't look inside other people's heads and thus can't call on what's natural or what not. And for that matter, what's natural? That's all just a opinion formed by each person for themselves, often influenced by society though, so my view on this can differ greatly compared to other posters here. ^ ^
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It looks like I'm the only one who thinks that 2 years is a long time to be with someone. I guess it's just cause of the people I know who are married. Most of them didn't know each other for more than a year.
My parents were together for maybe 2 months before they got married, and they've been together so, so happily for about 20 years. A lot of my older cousins have been married for almost 10 years after only knowing each other for about 2-3 months.
I'm not saying I think it's bad to be with someone that long, in fact I think it's awesome. Yeah there are millions of women in the world and the possibility of picking only one to be with for your entire life can be mind boggling, but in my opinion, I feel that it's a very important part of life and if you can spend 2 years with her and things are wonderful, then why not?
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Lord_J
Kenya1085 Posts
On October 06 2011 00:00 ComaDose wrote:
Marriage is either a religious (pseudo cult) ritual to discourage infidelity, a legal agreement between two people, or a celebration of a commitment.
Well, there's also much of the world--and the overwhelming weight of history--in which marriage is essentially a form of ownership of women by men.
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Modern marriage is still the sign of ultimate commitment to another person, whether or not you believe in the associated sanctities or not.
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On October 06 2011 00:14 Gnight wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 00:00 The Black wrote:On October 05 2011 23:50 wingweaver415 wrote:On October 05 2011 23:38 The Black wrote:On October 05 2011 23:15 rogzardo wrote:
Probably not the best idea to get married and already be planning to cheat on her. Just saying. You understood me perfectly. Does it still count as cheating if I still love here and commit to here forever? Now I'm beginning to think your a troll.... No you don't understand me. Let me ask this question among men here, is it just me or is it natural to desire sex with beautiful women, many of them. That among the core issues I tried to bring up in the OP, other than of course the act of marriage. You did a poor job at bringing this subject up at your OP to be honest. xD I will reply, even though I am not a guy, because this goes beyond just being a guy. After all, wheter you'r a guy or a woman, we both have feelings and both have lust and desires. Wheter that is for a guy or a woman doesn't really matter in this case in my eyes. Now onto what you are asking, yes and no. I can't speak for every person out there obviously, but I do believe that having thoughts/desires about having sex with beautiful women (or men for that matter) isn't unnatural, wheter you are in a relationship or not. Though to what extent this desire goes is what matters here, you have put this rather short and simple which doesn't give anyone here much insight to what extent you really mean. After all, having the desire or thought about having sex with beautiful women/men doesn't really sound alien to anyone in these forums I do believe. But is this desire so big that you feel like you "have" to give in to it, no matter wheter you'r in a relationship or not? Or is this desire just something that comes up now and then when you see/hear something that reminds you of such a matter and lingers in your head for a while? Simply put, are the desires so big that they can and will completely control your actions at a point or not? If not then I doubt one can call such desires unnatural, but if it's something you can't ignore even though you love/commited completely to one person, then one can say it's "unnatural" I do believe. (by "society standards") In the end though, I can't look inside other people's heads and thus can't call on what's natural or what not. And for that matter, what's natural? That's all just a opinion formed by each person for themselves, often influenced by society though, so my view on this can differ greatly compared to other posters here. ^ ^
Oh, a lady member of TL. Suddenly I feel like fixing my tie and modulating my voice Well regarding the OP, I wanted to be subtle about it, until the discussion evolves to it.
Simply put, are the desires so big that they can and will completely control your actions at a point or not?
Yes. And I can say with certainty that with the opportunity, I will do it, even if we are married already. Of course I will do it in such a way that she will NEVER know and our relationship will NEVER be affected by it. Am I with the wrong company? Why do I think this is ok, even normal. For me, it's not even a question of desire and controlling it. It's about how to handle this desire well (you know what I mean). Beyond all this, I can say that I love her and imagine life and a family with her, as these are simply... transgressions, nothing more.
Gentlemen, speak up please. Am I alone in this thought???
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Regardless of religious reasons, marriage is saying you care about 1 person enough to be with them forever. It's stupid to get married if you don't know 100 percent. If you don't. don't get married. To many divorces happen because people think its a good idea. Like the op stated, when the time is right. Your just going to know. And if it isn't that simple, no point in getting maried.
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Ah marriage... be extremely careful with this.
Its really easy to be the romantic and say "I love her despite her flaws" but keep in mind that this is probably the most important decision of your life and if it backfires you're fucked (assuming you're a male)
Divorce ruins a man's life for good, be extremely careful in picking your significant other. It does go without saying but I still see people making this mistake all the time.
On October 06 2011 00:23 Suvorov wrote:
don't do it
9 times out of 10, this guy is right. I've seen successful marriages, but they're rare
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I can not believe noone has brought this up so far. Marriage is the most stable way to bring up children. And all of us have the obligation to produce the progamers of the future!
<3 MiniWheat
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I honestly think that the state of the relationship between the two people is overemphasized in the discussion about when to get married. Yes, being on good terms with your potential future spouse is great, but I think it more depends on the maturity of the two people involved. These are of course interrelated, but let me explain.
My girlfriend and I, for example, never fight. It just doesn't happen. A lot of this is knowledge we have about each other, but it's more that we are simply two adults who know how to communicate; she doesn't instigate arguments, and I don't instigate arguments. We can disagree about something without ever raising our voices or making it personal. We both know how to keep cool under stress, and know how to react to the other person's stress. This is how we understand each other.
Basically, we both understand the concept of respect, and we respect each other 24/7. She's not a bitch, and I'm not a prick. This is really all it takes for two people to exist harmoniously.
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I am still an adolescent, and I know that a lot can change during the course of my life, but the idea of marriage just boggles me. Don't get me wrong, I am fortunate enough to live with a rather happy family, and having both of my parents still. Therefore I do not think that my parents' relationship has influenced my views much.
The thing is, in today's world I do not see much use for being married. The world itself is so corrupt anyways, with people cheating on each other and just doing what they please. Chances for ever having a lasting marriage are slim. Now I am not in full against the idea of marriage, if one loves a person very much and you know that your partner loves you too, then go for it. But otherwise do not, as uncertainty can be the downfall of the relationship.
So, today I wonder if I will ever have the courage to make that commitment, by entrusting my life with another person. Only time will tell though, as that prospect for me seems rather bleak at present.
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Well to the poster above me, I wouldn't do it if I was in a relationship because there is always a chance that they find out and that's absolutely devastating if they do, not to mention the fact that like most "sinful" things there sort of is a slippery slope per say where if you can get away with it once or twice you start to do it more and more frequently when the opportunity arises. Huge example of this is drugs (selling and using).
As for marriage, at least in Canada there are benefits to being married, like you have lower insurance rates for you car when you are married, and in case you don't have a will your loved one would be entitled to at least a part of your estate should you die young and have spiteful parents that dislike them. I really can't set a guideline for marriage because of the people I know, some people who dated for 1-2 years have had marriages (including my parents) that have lasted for over 5 years and are still going on (parents are approaching 30 years quickly), and I've know people that have dated for 5+ years and are divorced after less than 5 years of marriage, but imo if you are going to marry someone you have to be sure of the following:
1) You can work out your issues in a sensible manor with them. Fighting isn't necessarily bad, but constant fighting especially over petty issues is a pretty tell tale sign the marriage wont work.
2) You can stand living with them pretty easily (IE they aren't a money sucking bum who can't contribute anything, not they piss you off because they leave the toilet seat in x position)
3) Your relationship has give and take, not just give or just take. This obviously is probably true if you are thinking about marriage, but to some people its not really I guess. Basically if your whole relationship is buying her stuff or its sleeping with him then its not really a relationship and the marriage won't make it one.
I think those are the main principles anyways and thats what I will look for in a girlfriend who wants to up the relationship.
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On October 06 2011 00:43 RosaParksStoleMySeat wrote:
I honestly think that the state of the relationship between the two people is overemphasized in the discussion about when to get married. Yes, being on good terms with your potential future spouse is great, but I think it more depends on the maturity of the two people involved. These are of course interrelated, but let me explain.
My girlfriend and I, for example, never fight. It just doesn't happen. A lot of this is knowledge we have about each other, but it's more that we are simply two adults who know how to communicate; she doesn't instigate arguments, and I don't instigate arguments. We can disagree about something without ever raising our voices or making it personal. We both know how to keep cool under stress, and know how to react to the other person's stress. This is how we understand each other.
Basically, we both understand the concept of respect, and we respect each other 24/7. She's not a bitch, and I'm not a prick. This is really all it takes for two people to exist harmoniously.
Wise words you have there RosaParksStoleMySeat. If only every relationship in the world was based on those virtues, the world would have been a much better place indeed.
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On October 06 2011 00:46 Hipsv wrote:
Well to the poster above me, I wouldn't do it if I was in a relationship because there is always a chance that they find out and that's absolutely devastating if they do, not to mention the fact that like most "sinful" things there sort of is a slippery slope per say where if you can get away with it once or twice you start to do it more and more frequently when the opportunity arises. Huge example of this is drugs (selling and using).
As for marriage, at least in Canada there are benefits to being married, like you have lower insurance rates for you car when you are married, and in case you don't have a will your loved one would be entitled to at least a part of your estate should you die young and have spiteful parents that dislike them. I really can't set a guideline for marriage because of the people I know, some people who dated for 1-2 years have had marriages (including my parents) that have lasted for over 5 years and are still going on (parents are approaching 30 years quickly), and I've know people that have dated for 5+ years and are divorced after less than 5 years of marriage, but imo if you are going to marry someone you have to be sure of the following:
1) You can work out your issues in a sensible manor with them. Fighting isn't necessarily bad, but constant fighting especially over petty issues is a pretty tell tale sign the marriage wont work.
2) You can stand living with them pretty easily (IE they aren't a money sucking bum who can't contribute anything, not they piss you off because they leave the toilet seat in x position)
3) Your relationship has give and take, not just give or just take. This obviously is probably true if you are thinking about marriage, but to some people its not really I guess. Basically if your whole relationship is buying her stuff or its sleeping with him then its not really a relationship and the marriage won't make it one.
I think those are the main principles anyways and thats what I will look for in a girlfriend who wants to up the relationship.
I'm assuming you are not referring to my post dear sir, given that you could not have responded in 1 minute, and more to the point; that your post is not related to mine
Just remember next time when responding to someone's post to quote theirs so as to not confuse others by mistake 
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On October 06 2011 00:29 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 00:14 Gnight wrote:On October 06 2011 00:00 The Black wrote:On October 05 2011 23:50 wingweaver415 wrote:On October 05 2011 23:38 The Black wrote:On October 05 2011 23:15 rogzardo wrote:
Probably not the best idea to get married and already be planning to cheat on her. Just saying. You understood me perfectly. Does it still count as cheating if I still love here and commit to here forever? Now I'm beginning to think your a troll.... No you don't understand me. Let me ask this question among men here, is it just me or is it natural to desire sex with beautiful women, many of them. That among the core issues I tried to bring up in the OP, other than of course the act of marriage. You did a poor job at bringing this subject up at your OP to be honest. xD I will reply, even though I am not a guy, because this goes beyond just being a guy. After all, wheter you'r a guy or a woman, we both have feelings and both have lust and desires. Wheter that is for a guy or a woman doesn't really matter in this case in my eyes. Now onto what you are asking, yes and no. I can't speak for every person out there obviously, but I do believe that having thoughts/desires about having sex with beautiful women (or men for that matter) isn't unnatural, wheter you are in a relationship or not. Though to what extent this desire goes is what matters here, you have put this rather short and simple which doesn't give anyone here much insight to what extent you really mean. After all, having the desire or thought about having sex with beautiful women/men doesn't really sound alien to anyone in these forums I do believe. But is this desire so big that you feel like you "have" to give in to it, no matter wheter you'r in a relationship or not? Or is this desire just something that comes up now and then when you see/hear something that reminds you of such a matter and lingers in your head for a while? Simply put, are the desires so big that they can and will completely control your actions at a point or not? If not then I doubt one can call such desires unnatural, but if it's something you can't ignore even though you love/commited completely to one person, then one can say it's "unnatural" I do believe. (by "society standards") In the end though, I can't look inside other people's heads and thus can't call on what's natural or what not. And for that matter, what's natural? That's all just a opinion formed by each person for themselves, often influenced by society though, so my view on this can differ greatly compared to other posters here. ^ ^ Oh, a lady member of TL. Suddenly I feel like fixing my tie and modulating my voice Well regarding the OP, I wanted to be subtle about it, until the discussion evolves to it. Show nested quote +Simply put, are the desires so big that they can and will completely control your actions at a point or not? Yes. And I can say with certainty that with the opportunity, I will do it, even if we are married already. Of course I will do it in such a way that she will NEVER know and our relationship will NEVER be affected by it. Am I with the wrong company? Why do I think this is ok, even normal. For me, it's not even a question of desire and controlling it. It's about how to handle this desire well (you know what I mean). Beyond all this, I can say that I love her and imagine life and a family with her, as these are simply... transgressions, nothing more. Gentlemen, speak up please. Am I alone in this thought???
There's a lot of things you say that heavily suggest your relationship probably is already affected by it and you haven't even done anything yet. I don't think you can say with any confidence that she would both never know and your relationship would be unaffected by it.
You should take a moment and consider whether marriage, etc. is a lifestyle choice you could live with for any period of time. I know a guy who is in an open marriage, in that they both sleep around sometimes and know the other does it, and they're both pretty happy with it overall. No kids, though, and I have a sneaky suspicion that kids would affect their marital choices.
It's easier to imagine the rest of your life with someone you know compared to someone you don't.
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If you are cheating, don't be in a relationship. You are lying to her every day. That is no basis for a relationship, which must be built foremost on trust. As far as I can see, you shouldn't be thinking about marriage at all.
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I had to give up playing Starcraft since I started to live with my girlfriend.
I was quite successful and known in times of SC1 and Quake 2, but now "I'm gettin' too old for this shit" . And I regret that i spent so much my time for something that did not result any good for my future.
This activity is not for a "real man", most of women would tell you. It does not bring money, respect in society etc. It is considered (by most of my friends) as a leisure activity for geeks.
In fact, I could not even tell my friends from upper middle class, socially successful people etc. that I played regularly a computer game, it would hurt my image.
I do not intend to offend somebody. When you are 30+ and still dedicate a lot of time to Starcraft, I believe that at least you must realize that you pay a price for it. And if you have nothing else to do - that's a problem too.
I believe if somebody is getting married, it's a good reason to sort out his life.
Unless you are White-Ra or generally can earn playing the game money considered in your country good. Which is not the case in 99.999% and anyway it does not have long term future.
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We saved $700 a year on car insurance by getting married. Nice little perk.
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Coming from someone who is married, here are two thoughts that I'll leave you with:
1) When you meet the right person, you'll know it. Choosing to marry someone should be an easy decision. If it's not easy, then there's probably something wrong -- either you personally are not prepared to marry, or the girl that you're with is not right for you.
2) You don't need to spend several years with someone to know whether they're the right person. If you still have doubts after two years, chances are that it's time to move on.
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I'm in my early 20's, but marriage is something that's been on my mind recently. I know that I want to be married before I'm 30, if only to make sure that my kid's friends don't wonder whether I'm the dad or the grand-dad, or the grand-dad's grand-dad. This kind of decision is big though, so I totally understand your hesitation. The thing about marriage is that it forces you to put a lot of things on hold. Any dreams you might have had are put off because of new responsibilities. Any "What if?"s are essentially gone. TL;DR - I would say that if you have any doubts, any reason to believe you wouldn't be happy getting married...it's probably not time yet.
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On October 06 2011 00:29 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +Simply put, are the desires so big that they can and will completely control your actions at a point or not? Yes. And I can say with certainty that with the opportunity, I will do it, even if we are married already. Of course I will do it in such a way that she will NEVER know and our relationship will NEVER be affected by it.
...
Really? I find your lack of self control.... pitiful.
It's natural to find other people attractive. It's also normal to imagine what it might be like to sleep with that person; what they might look like naked; what the experience might be like. But you should have no desire to actually want that experience to happen, nevermind to actually intentionally seek it out.
No matter how careful you think you will be, she will find out (or at least suspect), and your relationship will be in jeapordy. Talking about entering a marriage, while simultaneously planning to go behind her back to sleep with other people, is preposterous. You would destroy her if she found out. Not only that, but you would shame and embarass not only her but her entire family - the reason for a divorce would not be a secret.
You say you care for her, yet you clearly do not care enough to resist being a filthy manslut.
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PLEASE READ THIS.
if you aren't already living together, live together.
Studies show that if you live together for 18 months, after that period of time, you're either broken up or married. just try it out. If you do decide to get married, HL GF MATE!
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I don't think I'm ever going to get married. I don't mean that I'm going to be a bachelor for life, but I'd rather not be officially married with someone else. It harkens back to a time when women were considered property.
Pretty sure my opinions are going to change quite a bit once I'm actually at that point though.
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On October 06 2011 01:08 Hairy wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 00:29 The Black wrote:Simply put, are the desires so big that they can and will completely control your actions at a point or not? Yes. And I can say with certainty that with the opportunity, I will do it, even if we are married already. Of course I will do it in such a way that she will NEVER know and our relationship will NEVER be affected by it. ... Really? I find your lack of self control.... pitiful. It's natural to find other people attractive. It's also normal to imagine what it might be like to sleep with that person; what they might look like naked; what the experience might be like. But you should have no desire to actually want that experience to happen, nevermind to actually intentionally seek it out. No matter how careful you think you will be, she will find out (or at least suspect), and your relationship will be in jeapordy. Talking about entering a marriage, while simultaneously planning to go behind her back to sleep with other people, is preposterous. You would destroy her if she found out. Not only that, but you would shame and embarass not only her but her entire family - the reason for a divorce would not be a secret. You say you care for her, yet you clearly do not care enough to resist being a filthy manslut.
"manslut" LOL. Wait a bit. Don't take it too personally folks, we are here to discuss, and not to fight or to judge others.
Does every man here agree? If you are married, you should NEVER be with another woman? Even if, for the purpose of argument, it never interferes with your relationship? Or that IF you have found THE WOMAN, you will not have a desire to be with any other woman. I'm NOT trying to be a pig, I'm just trying to understand this primal feeling at an important crossroads in my life.
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I'm trying to be a pig, I'm just trying to understand this primal feeling at an important crossroads in my life.
You made a typo there good sir. I think it should read: "I'm not trying to be a pig".
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Ive been married for 2 years, gonna be 3 in february. Our baby is due at the end of december. I still love my wife the same as I did when I met her. Yes I am "aware" of all the hotties out there. But its a good thing to not look too longingly at other women. Besides, I dont think Id ever find someone who is a better match for myself than her. Even when we have disagreements I think of how stupid it would be not having an alternate opinion and her agreeing with me on every subject.
But.....
if your not comfortable with it than dont do it. Period.
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Umm where do i start
First - doesn't really matter how long you are dating and how long you are living together.
I'm married for 3 years, have a daughter of 2 years old and i'm happy with how everything's going so far.
I decided to marry my wife after 2 months of dating her and we lived 3 months before the actual marriage.
If you think this is crazy - you have no idea. The reason why i could do so and why it worked - is that:
- i was really ready to start up the family
- my lady was really ready to start a family with ME
- it is important to be open and discuss in advance your opinion on the adult life like children, parents, travelling, job career, place of living etc...
- in the end if this is the right person for you - you are totally fine
i play sc:bw since 2000, got married in 2008, now play sc2 when i feel like playing, sometimes like 30 games in a row with total responsibility for my home and my little daughter.
Cheers.
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On October 06 2011 01:46 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 01:08 Hairy wrote:On October 06 2011 00:29 The Black wrote:Simply put, are the desires so big that they can and will completely control your actions at a point or not? Yes. And I can say with certainty that with the opportunity, I will do it, even if we are married already. Of course I will do it in such a way that she will NEVER know and our relationship will NEVER be affected by it. ... Really? I find your lack of self control.... pitiful. It's natural to find other people attractive. It's also normal to imagine what it might be like to sleep with that person; what they might look like naked; what the experience might be like. But you should have no desire to actually want that experience to happen, nevermind to actually intentionally seek it out. No matter how careful you think you will be, she will find out (or at least suspect), and your relationship will be in jeapordy. Talking about entering a marriage, while simultaneously planning to go behind her back to sleep with other people, is preposterous. You would destroy her if she found out. Not only that, but you would shame and embarass not only her but her entire family - the reason for a divorce would not be a secret. You say you care for her, yet you clearly do not care enough to resist being a filthy manslut. "manslut" LOL. Wait a bit. Don't take it too personally folks, we are here to discuss, and not to fight or to judge others. Does every man here agree? If you are married, you should NEVER be with another woman? Even if, for the purpose of argument, it never interferes with your relationship? Or that IF you have found THE WOMAN, you will not have a desire to be with any other woman. I'm trying to be a pig, I'm just trying to understand this primal feeling at an important crossroads in my life.
In reality, it all depends upon what you and your wife agree to do. If sex outside of the marriage is acceptable and openly acknowledged as such beforehand, then it's ok. Just make sure that you and your wife have a frank and open discussion about it so that the groundrules are clearly set.
That said, I will say this: open relationships are more prone to breaking down because of the stress that is placed upon the trust component of the relationship. If you plan on having children, its gets even more complicated and difficult. I'd recommend keeping it monogamous, but it's up to you.
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I guess vows mean absolutely shit here in the states. Divorce rate is above 50%, is it not? 
People who cheat on their spouses are nothing but scum. If you are going to cheat, why the fuck get married in the first place? You just don't have the decency and morals to tell your spouse you are unhappy. Scum.
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On October 06 2011 01:46 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 01:08 Hairy wrote:On October 06 2011 00:29 The Black wrote:Simply put, are the desires so big that they can and will completely control your actions at a point or not? Yes. And I can say with certainty that with the opportunity, I will do it, even if we are married already. Of course I will do it in such a way that she will NEVER know and our relationship will NEVER be affected by it. ... Really? I find your lack of self control.... pitiful. It's natural to find other people attractive. It's also normal to imagine what it might be like to sleep with that person; what they might look like naked; what the experience might be like. But you should have no desire to actually want that experience to happen, nevermind to actually intentionally seek it out. No matter how careful you think you will be, she will find out (or at least suspect), and your relationship will be in jeapordy. Talking about entering a marriage, while simultaneously planning to go behind her back to sleep with other people, is preposterous. You would destroy her if she found out. Not only that, but you would shame and embarass not only her but her entire family - the reason for a divorce would not be a secret. You say you care for her, yet you clearly do not care enough to resist being a filthy manslut. "manslut" LOL. Wait a bit. Don't take it too personally folks, we are here to discuss, and not to fight or to judge others. Does every man here agree? If you are married, you should NEVER be with another woman? Even if, for the purpose of argument, it never interferes with your relationship? Or that IF you have found THE WOMAN, you will not have a desire to be with any other woman. I'm trying to be a pig, I'm just trying to understand this primal feeling at an important crossroads in my life.
I guess I'll switch this around and ask what it is that is keeping you with her? I seems rather obvious to me that you shouldn't marry her. Why not just break up with her and start banging all the chicks you can instead of wondering? Not that it's what I'd do, but just because I can tell you that your marriage will be a lie so might as well drop the pretense and just do what you REALLY want.
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On October 06 2011 01:46 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 01:08 Hairy wrote:On October 06 2011 00:29 The Black wrote:Simply put, are the desires so big that they can and will completely control your actions at a point or not? Yes. And I can say with certainty that with the opportunity, I will do it, even if we are married already. Of course I will do it in such a way that she will NEVER know and our relationship will NEVER be affected by it. ... Really? I find your lack of self control.... pitiful. It's natural to find other people attractive. It's also normal to imagine what it might be like to sleep with that person; what they might look like naked; what the experience might be like. But you should have no desire to actually want that experience to happen, nevermind to actually intentionally seek it out. No matter how careful you think you will be, she will find out (or at least suspect), and your relationship will be in jeapordy. Talking about entering a marriage, while simultaneously planning to go behind her back to sleep with other people, is preposterous. You would destroy her if she found out. Not only that, but you would shame and embarass not only her but her entire family - the reason for a divorce would not be a secret. You say you care for her, yet you clearly do not care enough to resist being a filthy manslut. "manslut" LOL. Wait a bit. Don't take it too personally folks, we are here to discuss, and not to fight or to judge others. Does every man here agree? If you are married, you should NEVER be with another woman? Even if, for the purpose of argument, it never interferes with your relationship? Or that IF you have found THE WOMAN, you will not have a desire to be with any other woman. I'm trying to be a pig, I'm just trying to understand this primal feeling at an important crossroads in my life.
Umm, yeah, it's not conducive to a healthy family. You can't claim that it will never be discovered. If you're stupid enough to cheat on someone you've made a life-long commitment to, you're stupid enough to leave evidence and get caught. And if you really care about them, the guilt will tear you up inside.
I never understood people's propensity for cheating. Aren't we all 100% completely aware of how our testosterone level controls our sexual behaviour? Just walk away and crack one off like the rest of us. Jesus.
There's no shame in masturbation, even if you're in a committed relationship. It's just an itch that needs scratching. Nothing more.
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Look I am not a religious person myself, but do you find how often people use Jesus' name for no apparent reason? For me, it just reflects your moral values when using such blasphemous language.
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On October 06 2011 03:29 Bibdy wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 01:46 The Black wrote:On October 06 2011 01:08 Hairy wrote:On October 06 2011 00:29 The Black wrote:Simply put, are the desires so big that they can and will completely control your actions at a point or not? Yes. And I can say with certainty that with the opportunity, I will do it, even if we are married already. Of course I will do it in such a way that she will NEVER know and our relationship will NEVER be affected by it. ... Really? I find your lack of self control.... pitiful. It's natural to find other people attractive. It's also normal to imagine what it might be like to sleep with that person; what they might look like naked; what the experience might be like. But you should have no desire to actually want that experience to happen, nevermind to actually intentionally seek it out. No matter how careful you think you will be, she will find out (or at least suspect), and your relationship will be in jeapordy. Talking about entering a marriage, while simultaneously planning to go behind her back to sleep with other people, is preposterous. You would destroy her if she found out. Not only that, but you would shame and embarass not only her but her entire family - the reason for a divorce would not be a secret. You say you care for her, yet you clearly do not care enough to resist being a filthy manslut. "manslut" LOL. Wait a bit. Don't take it too personally folks, we are here to discuss, and not to fight or to judge others. Does every man here agree? If you are married, you should NEVER be with another woman? Even if, for the purpose of argument, it never interferes with your relationship? Or that IF you have found THE WOMAN, you will not have a desire to be with any other woman. I'm trying to be a pig, I'm just trying to understand this primal feeling at an important crossroads in my life. Umm, yeah, it's not conducive to a healthy family. You can't claim that it will never be discovered. If you're stupid enough to cheat on someone you've made a life-long commitment to, you're stupid enough to leave evidence and get caught. And if you really care about them, the guilt will tear you up inside. I never understood people's propensity for cheating. Aren't we all 100% completely aware of how our testosterone level controls our sexual behaviour? Just walk away and crack one off like the rest of us. Jesus. There's no shame in masturbation, even if you're in a committed relationship. It's just an itch that needs scratching. Nothing more.
People's propensity for cheating is the same propensity that allows their credit card bills to run up to the point that they are in life long debt because of interest, Impusivity. They do, then think about it later. It also doesn't help that our primordial instincts for males is to have sex with just about every woman we can get our hands on. The fact of the matter is that someone who cheats is going to leave evidence because cheating is an impulsive thing much more so than a planned event. The only type of planned cheating is usually by someone who wants to be caught anyways or exact revenge in both cases its meant to be transparent anyways.
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On October 06 2011 00:29 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 00:14 Gnight wrote:On October 06 2011 00:00 The Black wrote:On October 05 2011 23:50 wingweaver415 wrote:On October 05 2011 23:38 The Black wrote:On October 05 2011 23:15 rogzardo wrote:
Probably not the best idea to get married and already be planning to cheat on her. Just saying. You understood me perfectly. Does it still count as cheating if I still love here and commit to here forever? Now I'm beginning to think your a troll.... No you don't understand me. Let me ask this question among men here, is it just me or is it natural to desire sex with beautiful women, many of them. That among the core issues I tried to bring up in the OP, other than of course the act of marriage. You did a poor job at bringing this subject up at your OP to be honest. xD I will reply, even though I am not a guy, because this goes beyond just being a guy. After all, wheter you'r a guy or a woman, we both have feelings and both have lust and desires. Wheter that is for a guy or a woman doesn't really matter in this case in my eyes. Now onto what you are asking, yes and no. I can't speak for every person out there obviously, but I do believe that having thoughts/desires about having sex with beautiful women (or men for that matter) isn't unnatural, wheter you are in a relationship or not. Though to what extent this desire goes is what matters here, you have put this rather short and simple which doesn't give anyone here much insight to what extent you really mean. After all, having the desire or thought about having sex with beautiful women/men doesn't really sound alien to anyone in these forums I do believe. But is this desire so big that you feel like you "have" to give in to it, no matter wheter you'r in a relationship or not? Or is this desire just something that comes up now and then when you see/hear something that reminds you of such a matter and lingers in your head for a while? Simply put, are the desires so big that they can and will completely control your actions at a point or not? If not then I doubt one can call such desires unnatural, but if it's something you can't ignore even though you love/commited completely to one person, then one can say it's "unnatural" I do believe. (by "society standards") In the end though, I can't look inside other people's heads and thus can't call on what's natural or what not. And for that matter, what's natural? That's all just a opinion formed by each person for themselves, often influenced by society though, so my view on this can differ greatly compared to other posters here. ^ ^ Oh, a lady member of TL. Suddenly I feel like fixing my tie and modulating my voice Well regarding the OP, I wanted to be subtle about it, until the discussion evolves to it. Show nested quote +Simply put, are the desires so big that they can and will completely control your actions at a point or not? Yes. And I can say with certainty that with the opportunity, I will do it, even if we are married already. Of course I will do it in such a way that she will NEVER know and our relationship will NEVER be affected by it.
Uh, it's less of a "getting caught" issue, and more of an ethical issue. I'm sure I could steal money from old ladies and they'd never know about it, and hey they'd probably never even miss it! So why not?
That's right, it's unethical. Downright scumbag-ish in fact. How can you possibly want to commit an (arguably worse) slight against a girl you supposedly love, all the while justifying it with a "what she doesn't know won't hurt her!" attitude? Mind boggling :p
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On October 06 2011 01:52 NeThZOR wrote:Show nested quote +
I'm trying to be a pig, I'm just trying to understand this primal feeling at an important crossroads in my life.
You made a typo there good sir. I think it should read: "I'm not trying to be a pig".
What the... at the worst possible moment to miss it too. lol. Thanks
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On October 06 2011 00:29 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 00:14 Gnight wrote:On October 06 2011 00:00 The Black wrote:On October 05 2011 23:50 wingweaver415 wrote:On October 05 2011 23:38 The Black wrote:On October 05 2011 23:15 rogzardo wrote:
Probably not the best idea to get married and already be planning to cheat on her. Just saying. You understood me perfectly. Does it still count as cheating if I still love here and commit to here forever? Now I'm beginning to think your a troll.... No you don't understand me. Let me ask this question among men here, is it just me or is it natural to desire sex with beautiful women, many of them. That among the core issues I tried to bring up in the OP, other than of course the act of marriage. You did a poor job at bringing this subject up at your OP to be honest. xD I will reply, even though I am not a guy, because this goes beyond just being a guy. After all, wheter you'r a guy or a woman, we both have feelings and both have lust and desires. Wheter that is for a guy or a woman doesn't really matter in this case in my eyes. Now onto what you are asking, yes and no. I can't speak for every person out there obviously, but I do believe that having thoughts/desires about having sex with beautiful women (or men for that matter) isn't unnatural, wheter you are in a relationship or not. Though to what extent this desire goes is what matters here, you have put this rather short and simple which doesn't give anyone here much insight to what extent you really mean. After all, having the desire or thought about having sex with beautiful women/men doesn't really sound alien to anyone in these forums I do believe. But is this desire so big that you feel like you "have" to give in to it, no matter wheter you'r in a relationship or not? Or is this desire just something that comes up now and then when you see/hear something that reminds you of such a matter and lingers in your head for a while? Simply put, are the desires so big that they can and will completely control your actions at a point or not? If not then I doubt one can call such desires unnatural, but if it's something you can't ignore even though you love/commited completely to one person, then one can say it's "unnatural" I do believe. (by "society standards") In the end though, I can't look inside other people's heads and thus can't call on what's natural or what not. And for that matter, what's natural? That's all just a opinion formed by each person for themselves, often influenced by society though, so my view on this can differ greatly compared to other posters here. ^ ^ Oh, a lady member of TL. Suddenly I feel like fixing my tie and modulating my voice Well regarding the OP, I wanted to be subtle about it, until the discussion evolves to it. Show nested quote +Simply put, are the desires so big that they can and will completely control your actions at a point or not? Yes. And I can say with certainty that with the opportunity, I will do it, even if we are married already. Of course I will do it in such a way that she will NEVER know and our relationship will NEVER be affected by it. Am I with the wrong company? Why do I think this is ok, even normal. For me, it's not even a question of desire and controlling it. It's about how to handle this desire well (you know what I mean). Beyond all this, I can say that I love her and imagine life and a family with her, as these are simply... transgressions, nothing more. Gentlemen, speak up please. Am I alone in this thought???
sorry my man, after reading this... you should never get married.
the truth is out there
and she will find out
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On October 06 2011 01:46 The Black wrote:
Does every man here agree? If you are married, you should NEVER be with another woman? Even if, for the purpose of argument, it never interferes with your relationship?
The very fact you think you could screw around, keep it from your wife, and your relationship would be unaffected demonstrates that you don't have a fucking clue what a relationship worth marrying for actually is.
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On October 06 2011 03:36 NeThZOR wrote:
Look I am not a religious person myself, but do you find how often people use Jesus' name for no apparent reason? For me, it just reflects your moral values when using such blasphemous language.
Thanks for the good laugh.
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Well I shall add my 2 cents.
First of all, I am young (ish) 18 years old 19 in 19 days.
I have been in a relationship for just over a year now with a girl whose ideal life would be to get married and have children and be a kept woman, basically.
I personally do not believe in marriage anymore. My own mother being my primary reason and I will not say anymore on the subject as I think it would be a little off topic.
However, the way I see it, as was said in one of the first posts. If you two REALLY love one another, why should you need to get married?
The reasons women HONESTLY want it is obvious to me at least now in my infinite wisdom of nearly 19 years of age
They don't like being shown up by their friends and if you are married they consider it a one up.
Also they like a big engagement ring, I cannot recall the amount of times I have seen women comparing theirs to my mothers. It is another one up. (Here is the point where I realise it leaves a bitter taste to call her that)
They want "THE WEDDING" the white dress, the church (even if they aren't religious), the vows (which mean nothing to them most of the time after the ceremony. Has anyone here actually ever seen a married woman who has vowed "to honour and obey" actually agree that they still want to obey their life partner/husband? Perhaps not) This is a big party centralised around THEM and another one up.
I think you will find it is from a woman's point of view a status symbol, like many other things (designer clothes? < perhaps a bad example I hope my point comes across) do they really NEED these things? No they just want to show that they are in some ways better than their "friends".
Also women like to say it would make me "more secure". I believe this shows the vindictive nature of people. What these women are really saying is "I can fuck him financially if he dare upset me" and I will NOT accept anyone disagreeing with the fact that women in court especially divorce courts are favoured. In England we have no prenuptial agreements and I know that EVERY man who has been divorced that I have come across has far less than half of what it is he started with.
I will make this seem less scorned young child taking it out with some research to back it up.
"to be happy you need to think yourself better off than those around you."
It is a phenomenon called 'relative comparisons'.
I know this to be a fact because you can watch endless movies/tv shows whatever of people personifying the feelings of a single woman jealous of all her married friends, but no I am not going to list them.
On the other hand I also agree that there are those women (99.999% of which are now over 50) who believe what they are saying when they say "till death do us part" and they are the ones to look out for, but then again they will be the ones who if you explain your worries to will never push you into it to start with.
tl/dr :
Women are jealous and vindictive, watch out.
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On October 06 2011 03:40 NikonTC wrote:
Uh, it's less of a "getting caught" issue, and more of an ethical issue. I'm sure I could steal money from old ladies and they'd never know about it, and hey they'd probably never even miss it! So why not?
No. Unfortunately that's bad logic. Let's stay on course please
That's right, it's unethical. Downright scumbag-ish in fact. How can you possibly want to commit an (arguably worse) slight against a girl you supposedly love, all the while justifying it with a "what she doesn't know won't hurt her!" attitude? Mind boggling :p
Really is it that bad? I'll be brutally honest. Why will I do it? Sex, and the Conquest! Do I feel bad about it? No. Damn, maybe I was not brought up correctly. But I'm still convinced this is not an anomaly, especially among men. Deep inside everyone wants to do it, and they only restrain it due to certain social expectations and consequences to the relationship.
I don't buy this "love" drama/thing. If I love the woman I'm going to be having sex with outside marriage, then perhaps I should marry her. But no. It's just a mere transgression. An itch.
On the bigger picture, do married men tell this themselves like "Ok I will get married now and will do it with no one else other than my wife" and commit to it, or does it come naturally with the decision to get marries?
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On October 06 2011 04:02 NorNor wrote:Well I shall add my 2 cents. First of all, I am young (ish) 18 years old 19 in 19 days. I have been in a relationship for just over a year now with a girl whose ideal life would be to get married and have children and be a kept woman, basically. I personally do not believe in marriage anymore. My own mother being my primary reason and I will not say anymore on the subject as I think it would be a little off topic. However, the way I see it, as was said in one of the first posts. If you two REALLY love one another, why should you need to get married? The reasons women HONESTLY want it is obvious to me at least now in my infinite wisdom of nearly 19 years of age They don't like being shown up by their friends and if you are married they consider it a one up. Also they like a big engagement ring, I cannot recall the amount of times I have seen women comparing theirs to my mothers. It is another one up. (Here is the point where I realise it leaves a bitter taste to call her that) They want "THE WEDDING" the white dress, the church (even if they aren't religious), the vows (which mean nothing to them most of the time after the ceremony. Has anyone here actually ever seen a married woman who has vowed "to honour and obey" actually agree that they still want to obey their life partner/husband? Perhaps not) This is a big party centralised around THEM and another one up. I think you will find it is from a woman's point of view a status symbol, like many other things (designer clothes? < perhaps a bad example I hope my point comes across) do they really NEED these things? No they just want to show that they are in some ways better than their "friends". Also women like to say it would make me "more secure". I believe this shows the vindictive nature of people. What these women are really saying is "I can fuck him financially if he dare upset me" and I will NOT accept anyone disagreeing with the fact that women in court especially divorce courts are favoured. In England we have no prenuptial agreements and I know that EVERY man who has been divorced that I have come across has far less than half of what it is he started with. I will make this seem less scorned young child taking it out with some research to back it up. "to be happy you need to think yourself better off than those around you." It is a phenomenon called 'relative comparisons'. I know this to be a fact because you can watch endless movies/tv shows whatever of people personifying the feelings of a single woman jealous of all her married friends, but no I am not going to list them. On the other hand I also agree that there are those women (99.999% of which are now over 50) who believe what they are saying when they say "till death do us part" and they are the ones to look out for, but then again they will be the ones who if you explain your worries to will never push you into it to start with. tl/dr : Women are jealous and vindictive, watch out.
This is not a healthy perspective with which to enter adulthood, my friend
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On October 06 2011 03:58 Bibdy wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 03:36 NeThZOR wrote:
Look I am not a religious person myself, but do you find how often people use Jesus' name for no apparent reason? For me, it just reflects your moral values when using such blasphemous language. Thanks for the good laugh.
Just look at that attitude.
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On October 06 2011 04:07 NeThZOR wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 03:58 Bibdy wrote:On October 06 2011 03:36 NeThZOR wrote:
Look I am not a religious person myself, but do you find how often people use Jesus' name for no apparent reason? For me, it just reflects your moral values when using such blasphemous language. Thanks for the good laugh. Just look at that attitude.
My attitude is that if someone is going to get offended at my usage of a slang term for incredulity, it says a lot more about their sensitivity than my insensitivity. What does one more person getting offended at something utterly trivial and banal in the world mean to me? Get over yourself. Your opinion means as much to me, as mine does to you.
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On October 06 2011 04:07 Umpteen wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 04:02 NorNor wrote:Well I shall add my 2 cents. First of all, I am young (ish) 18 years old 19 in 19 days. I have been in a relationship for just over a year now with a girl whose ideal life would be to get married and have children and be a kept woman, basically. I personally do not believe in marriage anymore. My own mother being my primary reason and I will not say anymore on the subject as I think it would be a little off topic. However, the way I see it, as was said in one of the first posts. If you two REALLY love one another, why should you need to get married? The reasons women HONESTLY want it is obvious to me at least now in my infinite wisdom of nearly 19 years of age They don't like being shown up by their friends and if you are married they consider it a one up. Also they like a big engagement ring, I cannot recall the amount of times I have seen women comparing theirs to my mothers. It is another one up. (Here is the point where I realise it leaves a bitter taste to call her that) They want "THE WEDDING" the white dress, the church (even if they aren't religious), the vows (which mean nothing to them most of the time after the ceremony. Has anyone here actually ever seen a married woman who has vowed "to honour and obey" actually agree that they still want to obey their life partner/husband? Perhaps not) This is a big party centralised around THEM and another one up. I think you will find it is from a woman's point of view a status symbol, like many other things (designer clothes? < perhaps a bad example I hope my point comes across) do they really NEED these things? No they just want to show that they are in some ways better than their "friends". Also women like to say it would make me "more secure". I believe this shows the vindictive nature of people. What these women are really saying is "I can fuck him financially if he dare upset me" and I will NOT accept anyone disagreeing with the fact that women in court especially divorce courts are favoured. In England we have no prenuptial agreements and I know that EVERY man who has been divorced that I have come across has far less than half of what it is he started with. I will make this seem less scorned young child taking it out with some research to back it up. "to be happy you need to think yourself better off than those around you." It is a phenomenon called 'relative comparisons'. I know this to be a fact because you can watch endless movies/tv shows whatever of people personifying the feelings of a single woman jealous of all her married friends, but no I am not going to list them. On the other hand I also agree that there are those women (99.999% of which are now over 50) who believe what they are saying when they say "till death do us part" and they are the ones to look out for, but then again they will be the ones who if you explain your worries to will never push you into it to start with. tl/dr : Women are jealous and vindictive, watch out. This is not a healthy perspective with which to enter adulthood, my friend
Probably most would agree with you however I have yet to have someone show me otherwise. Also I consider myself to be open-minded so I await with open arms someone to show me I am wrong.
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On October 06 2011 04:02 NorNor wrote:Well I shall add my 2 cents. First of all, I am young (ish) 18 years old 19 in 19 days. I have been in a relationship for just over a year now with a girl whose ideal life would be to get married and have children and be a kept woman, basically. I personally do not believe in marriage anymore. My own mother being my primary reason and I will not say anymore on the subject as I think it would be a little off topic. However, the way I see it, as was said in one of the first posts. If you two REALLY love one another, why should you need to get married? The reasons women HONESTLY want it is obvious to me at least now in my infinite wisdom of nearly 19 years of age They don't like being shown up by their friends and if you are married they consider it a one up. Also they like a big engagement ring, I cannot recall the amount of times I have seen women comparing theirs to my mothers. It is another one up. (Here is the point where I realise it leaves a bitter taste to call her that) They want "THE WEDDING" the white dress, the church (even if they aren't religious), the vows (which mean nothing to them most of the time after the ceremony. Has anyone here actually ever seen a married woman who has vowed "to honour and obey" actually agree that they still want to obey their life partner/husband? Perhaps not) This is a big party centralised around THEM and another one up. I think you will find it is from a woman's point of view a status symbol, like many other things (designer clothes? < perhaps a bad example I hope my point comes across) do they really NEED these things? No they just want to show that they are in some ways better than their "friends". Also women like to say it would make me "more secure". I believe this shows the vindictive nature of people. What these women are really saying is "I can fuck him financially if he dare upset me" and I will NOT accept anyone disagreeing with the fact that women in court especially divorce courts are favoured. In England we have no prenuptial agreements and I know that EVERY man who has been divorced that I have come across has far less than half of what it is he started with. I will make this seem less scorned young child taking it out with some research to back it up. "to be happy you need to think yourself better off than those around you." It is a phenomenon called 'relative comparisons'. I know this to be a fact because you can watch endless movies/tv shows whatever of people personifying the feelings of a single woman jealous of all her married friends, but no I am not going to list them. On the other hand I also agree that there are those women (99.999% of which are now over 50) who believe what they are saying when they say "till death do us part" and they are the ones to look out for, but then again they will be the ones who if you explain your worries to will never push you into it to start with. tl/dr : Women are jealous and vindictive, watch out.
You can view marriage in two totally different ways; signing a piece of paper or something truly meaningful. I think getting married in and of itself is obviously not meaningful, but the act and what it represents and having a celebration for it is an awesome idea. If you truly love them then WHY NOT celebrate a real promise to be together for the rest of your lives. You two may already know it but why not let the world know too?
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On October 06 2011 04:19 NorNor wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 04:07 Umpteen wrote:On October 06 2011 04:02 NorNor wrote:Well I shall add my 2 cents. First of all, I am young (ish) 18 years old 19 in 19 days. I have been in a relationship for just over a year now with a girl whose ideal life would be to get married and have children and be a kept woman, basically. I personally do not believe in marriage anymore. My own mother being my primary reason and I will not say anymore on the subject as I think it would be a little off topic. However, the way I see it, as was said in one of the first posts. If you two REALLY love one another, why should you need to get married? The reasons women HONESTLY want it is obvious to me at least now in my infinite wisdom of nearly 19 years of age They don't like being shown up by their friends and if you are married they consider it a one up. Also they like a big engagement ring, I cannot recall the amount of times I have seen women comparing theirs to my mothers. It is another one up. (Here is the point where I realise it leaves a bitter taste to call her that) They want "THE WEDDING" the white dress, the church (even if they aren't religious), the vows (which mean nothing to them most of the time after the ceremony. Has anyone here actually ever seen a married woman who has vowed "to honour and obey" actually agree that they still want to obey their life partner/husband? Perhaps not) This is a big party centralised around THEM and another one up. I think you will find it is from a woman's point of view a status symbol, like many other things (designer clothes? < perhaps a bad example I hope my point comes across) do they really NEED these things? No they just want to show that they are in some ways better than their "friends". Also women like to say it would make me "more secure". I believe this shows the vindictive nature of people. What these women are really saying is "I can fuck him financially if he dare upset me" and I will NOT accept anyone disagreeing with the fact that women in court especially divorce courts are favoured. In England we have no prenuptial agreements and I know that EVERY man who has been divorced that I have come across has far less than half of what it is he started with. I will make this seem less scorned young child taking it out with some research to back it up. "to be happy you need to think yourself better off than those around you." It is a phenomenon called 'relative comparisons'. I know this to be a fact because you can watch endless movies/tv shows whatever of people personifying the feelings of a single woman jealous of all her married friends, but no I am not going to list them. On the other hand I also agree that there are those women (99.999% of which are now over 50) who believe what they are saying when they say "till death do us part" and they are the ones to look out for, but then again they will be the ones who if you explain your worries to will never push you into it to start with. tl/dr : Women are jealous and vindictive, watch out. This is not a healthy perspective with which to enter adulthood, my friend Probably most would agree with you however I have yet to have someone show me otherwise. Also I consider myself to be open-minded so I await with open arms someone to show me I am wrong.
Women are just as guilty of acting petty, immature and stupid at a young age as men are. They've got just as much growing up to do as men do, they just like to play 'adult' like it's a game.
I suggest, like my father did to me, steering well clear of serious relationships with women until both of you are in your mid-late 20s.
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On October 06 2011 04:19 NorNor wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 04:07 Umpteen wrote:On October 06 2011 04:02 NorNor wrote:Well I shall add my 2 cents. First of all, I am young (ish) 18 years old 19 in 19 days. I have been in a relationship for just over a year now with a girl whose ideal life would be to get married and have children and be a kept woman, basically. I personally do not believe in marriage anymore. My own mother being my primary reason and I will not say anymore on the subject as I think it would be a little off topic. However, the way I see it, as was said in one of the first posts. If you two REALLY love one another, why should you need to get married? The reasons women HONESTLY want it is obvious to me at least now in my infinite wisdom of nearly 19 years of age They don't like being shown up by their friends and if you are married they consider it a one up. Also they like a big engagement ring, I cannot recall the amount of times I have seen women comparing theirs to my mothers. It is another one up. (Here is the point where I realise it leaves a bitter taste to call her that) They want "THE WEDDING" the white dress, the church (even if they aren't religious), the vows (which mean nothing to them most of the time after the ceremony. Has anyone here actually ever seen a married woman who has vowed "to honour and obey" actually agree that they still want to obey their life partner/husband? Perhaps not) This is a big party centralised around THEM and another one up. I think you will find it is from a woman's point of view a status symbol, like many other things (designer clothes? < perhaps a bad example I hope my point comes across) do they really NEED these things? No they just want to show that they are in some ways better than their "friends". Also women like to say it would make me "more secure". I believe this shows the vindictive nature of people. What these women are really saying is "I can fuck him financially if he dare upset me" and I will NOT accept anyone disagreeing with the fact that women in court especially divorce courts are favoured. In England we have no prenuptial agreements and I know that EVERY man who has been divorced that I have come across has far less than half of what it is he started with. I will make this seem less scorned young child taking it out with some research to back it up. "to be happy you need to think yourself better off than those around you." It is a phenomenon called 'relative comparisons'. I know this to be a fact because you can watch endless movies/tv shows whatever of people personifying the feelings of a single woman jealous of all her married friends, but no I am not going to list them. On the other hand I also agree that there are those women (99.999% of which are now over 50) who believe what they are saying when they say "till death do us part" and they are the ones to look out for, but then again they will be the ones who if you explain your worries to will never push you into it to start with. tl/dr : Women are jealous and vindictive, watch out. This is not a healthy perspective with which to enter adulthood, my friend Probably most would agree with you however I have yet to have someone show me otherwise. Also I consider myself to be open-minded so I await with open arms someone to show me I am wrong.
This is not really an issue as I think it is more of a phase. When one is young and naive, as I once was, you have a strong rebellious reason for things, as you do now, and as I am sure as you do too with other things in life such as religion, education, etc. But as you get older it's more practical.
I am not against marriage because of the religious pretensions, etc. It's plain and simple for me. 1. I am not thinking about it AT ALL. So maybe when it's on my mind already then I'd act on it. 2. It MAY hinder me from having sex with other girls. Simple.
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On October 06 2011 04:22 Bibdy wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 04:19 NorNor wrote:On October 06 2011 04:07 Umpteen wrote:On October 06 2011 04:02 NorNor wrote:Well I shall add my 2 cents. First of all, I am young (ish) 18 years old 19 in 19 days. I have been in a relationship for just over a year now with a girl whose ideal life would be to get married and have children and be a kept woman, basically. I personally do not believe in marriage anymore. My own mother being my primary reason and I will not say anymore on the subject as I think it would be a little off topic. However, the way I see it, as was said in one of the first posts. If you two REALLY love one another, why should you need to get married? The reasons women HONESTLY want it is obvious to me at least now in my infinite wisdom of nearly 19 years of age They don't like being shown up by their friends and if you are married they consider it a one up. Also they like a big engagement ring, I cannot recall the amount of times I have seen women comparing theirs to my mothers. It is another one up. (Here is the point where I realise it leaves a bitter taste to call her that) They want "THE WEDDING" the white dress, the church (even if they aren't religious), the vows (which mean nothing to them most of the time after the ceremony. Has anyone here actually ever seen a married woman who has vowed "to honour and obey" actually agree that they still want to obey their life partner/husband? Perhaps not) This is a big party centralised around THEM and another one up. I think you will find it is from a woman's point of view a status symbol, like many other things (designer clothes? < perhaps a bad example I hope my point comes across) do they really NEED these things? No they just want to show that they are in some ways better than their "friends". Also women like to say it would make me "more secure". I believe this shows the vindictive nature of people. What these women are really saying is "I can fuck him financially if he dare upset me" and I will NOT accept anyone disagreeing with the fact that women in court especially divorce courts are favoured. In England we have no prenuptial agreements and I know that EVERY man who has been divorced that I have come across has far less than half of what it is he started with. I will make this seem less scorned young child taking it out with some research to back it up. "to be happy you need to think yourself better off than those around you." It is a phenomenon called 'relative comparisons'. I know this to be a fact because you can watch endless movies/tv shows whatever of people personifying the feelings of a single woman jealous of all her married friends, but no I am not going to list them. On the other hand I also agree that there are those women (99.999% of which are now over 50) who believe what they are saying when they say "till death do us part" and they are the ones to look out for, but then again they will be the ones who if you explain your worries to will never push you into it to start with. tl/dr : Women are jealous and vindictive, watch out. This is not a healthy perspective with which to enter adulthood, my friend Probably most would agree with you however I have yet to have someone show me otherwise. Also I consider myself to be open-minded so I await with open arms someone to show me I am wrong. Women are just as guilty of acting petty, immature and stupid at a young age as men are. They've got just as much growing up to do as men do, they just like to play 'adult' like it's a game. I suggest, like my father did to me, steering well clear of serious relationships with women until both of you are in your mid-late 20s.
I found you passing on your fathers advice actually quite touching :') so I thank you sir. Probably not how you meant it but I am a bit mooshy
However I do believe I will never get married for my own sanity
To the poster above (I am such a lurker I don't know how to multi quote) I agree if you two really both feel that way and you really mean what you say then by all means throw the biggest party from here to there! But remember you only ever KNOW half the story, the other half is what someone told you.
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On October 06 2011 04:03 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 03:40 NikonTC wrote:
Uh, it's less of a "getting caught" issue, and more of an ethical issue. I'm sure I could steal money from old ladies and they'd never know about it, and hey they'd probably never even miss it! So why not? No. Unfortunately that's bad logic. Let's stay on course please Show nested quote +That's right, it's unethical. Downright scumbag-ish in fact. How can you possibly want to commit an (arguably worse) slight against a girl you supposedly love, all the while justifying it with a "what she doesn't know won't hurt her!" attitude? Mind boggling :p Really is it that bad? I'll be brutally honest. Why will I do it? Sex, and the Conquest! Do I feel bad about it? No. Damn, maybe I was not brought up correctly. But I'm still convinced this is not an anomaly, especially among men. Deep inside everyone wants to do it, and they only restrain it due to certain social expectations and consequences to the relationship. I don't buy this "love" drama/thing. If I love the woman I'm going to be having sex with outside marriage, then perhaps I should marry her. But no. It's just a mere transgression. An itch. On the bigger picture, do married men tell this themselves like "Ok I will get married now and will do it with no one else other than my wife" and commit to it, or does it come naturally with the decision to get marries?
If you enter the marriage with your wife knowing your intentions, then that's fine. But if she marries you with the apparently false notion you will be faithful to her, this is a train wreck waiting to happen. If you don't want to suppress your primal urges, don't enter an institution of marriage under the promise of faithfulness. If you do, your lack of regard for your wife/girlfriend, and the consequences that could arise as the result of your incredulity are truly sickening, and in my opinion would make you an awful husband.
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On October 06 2011 04:24 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 04:19 NorNor wrote:On October 06 2011 04:07 Umpteen wrote:On October 06 2011 04:02 NorNor wrote:Well I shall add my 2 cents. First of all, I am young (ish) 18 years old 19 in 19 days. I have been in a relationship for just over a year now with a girl whose ideal life would be to get married and have children and be a kept woman, basically. I personally do not believe in marriage anymore. My own mother being my primary reason and I will not say anymore on the subject as I think it would be a little off topic. However, the way I see it, as was said in one of the first posts. If you two REALLY love one another, why should you need to get married? The reasons women HONESTLY want it is obvious to me at least now in my infinite wisdom of nearly 19 years of age They don't like being shown up by their friends and if you are married they consider it a one up. Also they like a big engagement ring, I cannot recall the amount of times I have seen women comparing theirs to my mothers. It is another one up. (Here is the point where I realise it leaves a bitter taste to call her that) They want "THE WEDDING" the white dress, the church (even if they aren't religious), the vows (which mean nothing to them most of the time after the ceremony. Has anyone here actually ever seen a married woman who has vowed "to honour and obey" actually agree that they still want to obey their life partner/husband? Perhaps not) This is a big party centralised around THEM and another one up. I think you will find it is from a woman's point of view a status symbol, like many other things (designer clothes? < perhaps a bad example I hope my point comes across) do they really NEED these things? No they just want to show that they are in some ways better than their "friends". Also women like to say it would make me "more secure". I believe this shows the vindictive nature of people. What these women are really saying is "I can fuck him financially if he dare upset me" and I will NOT accept anyone disagreeing with the fact that women in court especially divorce courts are favoured. In England we have no prenuptial agreements and I know that EVERY man who has been divorced that I have come across has far less than half of what it is he started with. I will make this seem less scorned young child taking it out with some research to back it up. "to be happy you need to think yourself better off than those around you." It is a phenomenon called 'relative comparisons'. I know this to be a fact because you can watch endless movies/tv shows whatever of people personifying the feelings of a single woman jealous of all her married friends, but no I am not going to list them. On the other hand I also agree that there are those women (99.999% of which are now over 50) who believe what they are saying when they say "till death do us part" and they are the ones to look out for, but then again they will be the ones who if you explain your worries to will never push you into it to start with. tl/dr : Women are jealous and vindictive, watch out. This is not a healthy perspective with which to enter adulthood, my friend Probably most would agree with you however I have yet to have someone show me otherwise. Also I consider myself to be open-minded so I await with open arms someone to show me I am wrong. This is not really an issue as I think it is more of a phase. When one is young and naive, as I once was, you have a strong rebellious reason for things, as you do now, and as I am sure as you do too with other things in life such as religion, education, etc. But as you get older it's more practical. I am not against marriage because of the religious pretensions, etc. It's plain and simple for me. 1. I am not thinking about it AT ALL. So maybe when it's on my mind already then I'd act on it. 2. It MAY hinder me from having sex with other girls. Simple.
Oh please don't put me in that light. I do have strong views yes. However they are well founded (mostly, zerg UP ) I was well educated and sent to a very prestigious English Public School (private to you Americans) and as for religion etc I was brought up as an Anglican by my Roman Catholic father who is happy to read about everything under the sun (failed astrology joke)
So yes I agree I am young and probably naive but I have seen a lot for such a young person so don't put me in a "rebellious" category and just rule my opinions out for those reasons.
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I'm 28 and been married for 4 years to a gamer girl. Its been a blast and I've never second guessed the decision to get married.
The only question you need to ask is if the specific variety added to sex by allowing for differing partners is worth losing a lifetime with the woman you are with. There is a million different ways to keep sex interesting with one partner.
Much like playing only one race rather than random, by focusing on how well you perform with just one girl you'll find that can your experience is better because you know the map, how to exploit it, and your "opponent's" weaknesses. Plus you can more deftly experiment and add in new 'strategies'.
So, unless you are something of a sexual athlete who has peaked under the constraints of your partner's sexual failings you're clearly better off sexually with a single woman.
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i dont believe it is possible to completely own the physical nature of a human. i might have worded it wrong but in short i dont think its in reason to think you wont ever cheat or she wont ever cheat. you can love her and she can love you, but you never really own her physical body, unless your cock is huge
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On October 06 2011 04:03 The Black wrote:
On the bigger picture, do married men tell this themselves like "Ok I will get married now and will do it with no one else other than my wife" and commit to it, or does it come naturally with the decision to get marries?
You're approaching it with the wrong mindset. You're approaching it like being monogamous is some shackle of punishment imposed upon you by marriage. If you were in a truly healthy relationship, you wouldn't cheat because you don't want to be with anyone else, you don't want to hurt them, and you respect them too much.
I'll say it again, as long as you have this mindset that you have, you shouldn't get married. I would say the act of cheating in that case would be secondary to entering into a marriage knowing that you'll cheat. Electing to marry this girl knowing you will cheat on her WOULD make you a terrible person. You could try to rationalize it with biological reasons all you like, but it wouldn't change the truth.
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I've got a feeling that your potential future wife may not appreciate some of the things written in this thread OP. Maybe she's cool with it, we obviously don't know her.
Typically, you wouldn't have this type of convo straight up with her... "Can I really be happy with YOU?? And never being with ANY other woman?"
.....
So yeah, based on you even asking this, probably waiting is a good idea.
I'm of the opinion that you just know when it's right. 100%, without any doubts. This is coming from a guy who got married at 20, divorced at 23, and remarried in 2010 and is basically the happiest/ luckiest guy in his opinion.
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On October 06 2011 05:51 thebigdonkey wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 04:03 The Black wrote:
On the bigger picture, do married men tell this themselves like "Ok I will get married now and will do it with no one else other than my wife" and commit to it, or does it come naturally with the decision to get marries? You're approaching it with the wrong mindset. You're approaching it like being monogamous is some shackle of punishment imposed upon you by marriage. If you were in a truly healthy relationship, you wouldn't cheat because you don't want to be with anyone else, you don't want to hurt them, and you respect them too much. I'll say it again, as long as you have this mindset that you have, you shouldn't get married. I would say the act of cheating in that case would be secondary to entering into a marriage knowing that you'll cheat. Electing to marry this girl knowing you will cheat on her WOULD make you a terrible person. You could try to rationalize it with biological reasons all you like, but it wouldn't change the truth.
bigdonkey I'm with you on this one. Unfortunately yes, it is a shackle for me.
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I think you all approach this from the wrong direction. Marriage is ihmo not about advantages for you but about the advantages for your girlfriend. Women have a biological clock ticking and also need to find someone as long as they are still attractive. If they are too old even if they can still have kids they may have to settle for someone less then ideal so they don't want to invest years into a relationship with no security that it holds.
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On October 05 2011 22:28 frontliner2 wrote:
Damnit, Marriage is one tough deal bro,
I've been married for 2.5 years now and I'm very happy with my wife. I still love her and we share a very special soulmate bond thingie. We've been trough very hard times in our relationship and also personal problems we've had almost drove us apart in 2010. Let's just say the subject children and an inablitly to conceive puts the greatest pressure imaginable on a husband and wife. However we've overcome (we are bent on adopting children from Africa).
Not to sound like a dick, but why are you caving into the media and getting a child from Africa? I'm sure there are plenty of kids in your own country (or maybe even your own city), that can also be adopted. It's not as though you're a better person for picking an African child.
Not to mention how alienated the kid will be, with everyone being a different skin colour from his own (and yes it does matter). Especially in a nearly all-white place like the Netherlands.
On Topic:
I'm not married but I consider getting married more of something you do just to conform to society (not necessarily a bad thing). It has some very big cons, and very few pros. The biggest pros are that most people see your relationship as more "solid", and they give you a bit more respect for it. Cons are mainly about how much you can lose if things go wrong, and since marriage is so loosely viewed things go wrong very often.
People can and usually do change over time though, so you should keep that in mind before deciding. The person you marry now may be different from the person you are married to 10+ years from now.
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I'm engaged to be married, (Tentative date: 12th May 2012) and I love it. Been engaged for five months. Before I met this woman I never, ever though I'd be married. Didn't really get it, and then we met and it seemed like the most natural thing in the world to ask her to marry me. Never been happier than when she said yes.
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On October 06 2011 06:02 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 05:51 thebigdonkey wrote:On October 06 2011 04:03 The Black wrote:
On the bigger picture, do married men tell this themselves like "Ok I will get married now and will do it with no one else other than my wife" and commit to it, or does it come naturally with the decision to get marries? You're approaching it with the wrong mindset. You're approaching it like being monogamous is some shackle of punishment imposed upon you by marriage. If you were in a truly healthy relationship, you wouldn't cheat because you don't want to be with anyone else, you don't want to hurt them, and you respect them too much. I'll say it again, as long as you have this mindset that you have, you shouldn't get married. I would say the act of cheating in that case would be secondary to entering into a marriage knowing that you'll cheat. Electing to marry this girl knowing you will cheat on her WOULD make you a terrible person. You could try to rationalize it with biological reasons all you like, but it wouldn't change the truth. bigdonkey I'm with you on this one. Unfortunately yes, it is a shackle for me.
Then your not ready for marriage. Not sure how else it can be put simpler than it already has.
Marriage is about commitment, you don't want to commit, therefore your not ready.
Do you really need to wreck a partner's life to understand this?
If you want the benefits of an open relationship without being a cheating asshat then go find a girl that is into that. There are some that are out there.
My rule of thumb is the golden rule, do you want her doing to you what you want to do to her. Do you want her doing guys on the side because there are millions of guys out there she could have so why should she tie herself down to just you?
You commented earlier how your mature and have gotten past your childish ways of looking at the world and maybe that is so but to me maturity is seeing things as if they happened to you. How would you feel if someone agreed to marry you and then acted as you suggest?
Be honest and go for an open relationship, dont try to justify cheating one someone with the backing of the TL community.
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On October 06 2011 06:13 killa_robot wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2011 22:28 frontliner2 wrote:
Damnit, Marriage is one tough deal bro,
I've been married for 2.5 years now and I'm very happy with my wife. I still love her and we share a very special soulmate bond thingie. We've been trough very hard times in our relationship and also personal problems we've had almost drove us apart in 2010. Let's just say the subject children and an inablitly to conceive puts the greatest pressure imaginable on a husband and wife. However we've overcome (we are bent on adopting children from Africa).
Not to sound like a dick, but why are you caving into the media and getting a child from Africa? I'm sure there are plenty of kids in your own country (or maybe even your own city), that can also be adopted. It's not as though you're a better person for picking an African child. Not to mention how alienated the kid will be, with everyone being a different skin colour from his own (and yes it does matter). Especially in a nearly all-white place like the Netherlands.
Who says he and his wife are caving in to the media by getting a child from Africa?
That's something you made up from reading his post, that doesn't mean that it's actually true. Whatever their reason is to adopt a child from Africa, even if it's because of the media, does it really matter where one adopts there child from? Everywhere in the world there are children that are in a position where adoption would do them good, wheter you adopt a child from across the street or from across the world, it's the fact that one adopts a child that matters, not their origin.
And the Netherlands has more then enough coloured people, I know because I live there as well. So that "nearly all-white place like The Netherlands" seems like a made up comment from your side (no offense, but that's how I see it).
Furthermore, while skin colour can matter, it's more or less the society and family they are raised up in that makes the difference and not their origin or skin colour. If the kid is raised in a loving dutch family (and I am sure that front and his wife will do just that), get's education like any other child in The Netherlands then it's skin colour will not hold him back in The Netherlands.
On October 06 2011 06:02 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 05:51 thebigdonkey wrote:On October 06 2011 04:03 The Black wrote:
On the bigger picture, do married men tell this themselves like "Ok I will get married now and will do it with no one else other than my wife" and commit to it, or does it come naturally with the decision to get marries? You're approaching it with the wrong mindset. You're approaching it like being monogamous is some shackle of punishment imposed upon you by marriage. If you were in a truly healthy relationship, you wouldn't cheat because you don't want to be with anyone else, you don't want to hurt them, and you respect them too much. I'll say it again, as long as you have this mindset that you have, you shouldn't get married. I would say the act of cheating in that case would be secondary to entering into a marriage knowing that you'll cheat. Electing to marry this girl knowing you will cheat on her WOULD make you a terrible person. You could try to rationalize it with biological reasons all you like, but it wouldn't change the truth. bigdonkey I'm with you on this one. Unfortunately yes, it is a shackle for me.
Pretty much what others have put forth as well, if you see marriage as just this then it clearly isn't something for you. As I see it, a open marriage is something you seek and perhaps you will find someone (who knows, maybe even your current gf is open to that) who you hold dear to share such a marriage with.
Other then that, one can also "resort" to threesomes and alike to... feed your urges, sorta say. If you'r really feeling so strongly about doing with other women while still being commited to one, then such a thing may also be a solution without you feeling "shackled" to one person in marriage.
Aside those two, open marriage and group sex, I don't believe you should commit yourself into marriage or a serious relationship with a girl/woman while going behind their back doing others. Such a thing is, in my eyes, just plain wrong and will most likely end up hurting the one you have a relationship with, which in turn you shouldn't want if you truly love them. If you don't care about hurting them, then you are clearly not in love with that person and there isn't really a meaning to having a relationship with that person in the first place.
So, my advice here is, try to find a woman that fits your needs, one who doesn't mind a open relationship or marriage, or perhaps isn't dirty of having some form of group sex once in a while. That's all I can say to help you out here, I guess.
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Marriage is betting half your shit that you will get a long for the rest of your life. How many best friends have you had that you swore were going to be best friends forever, maybe even saved each others lives when doing stupid shit....and then sometime down the road ended up not being friends anymore after something?
If you get married, get a pre-nup. Period.
Why get married? There are tax benefits. Healthcare benefits. etc. Society (in the US atleast) is set up to favor couples. It's also set up to be rigged against men in cases of divorce. Badly. Very badly.
So, if you like/love the person enough...go ahead. Get a prenup though.
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On October 06 2011 06:44 dogabutila wrote:
Marriage is betting half your shit that you will get a long for the rest of your life. How many best friends have you had that you swore were going to be best friends forever, maybe even saved each others lives when doing stupid shit....and then sometime down the road ended up not being friends anymore after something?
If you get married, get a pre-nup. Period.
Why get married? There are tax benefits. Healthcare benefits. etc. Society (in the US atleast) is set up to favor couples. It's also set up to be rigged against men in cases of divorce. Badly. Very badly.
So, if you like/love the person enough...go ahead. Get a prenup though.
To the OP, THIS.
However I think you are incorrect Dogabutila, my father lost 75% and what he brought to the relationship was 100% SO I think you should have put "betting at least half your shit, but probably more"
God Bless creative accounting.
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I personally think we need marriage for the same reason we need, funerals, birthdays, bar mitzvah's or whatever. Human beings have a profound need to ritualize important events in our lives. The commitment can be made regardless of whether or not you have a wedding ceremony. However it sticks in our minds more and gains additional importance when we ritualize things. It's the difference between going to just another high school dance and going to the prom. They are the same things it's just that one has more ceremony and therefore seems more important to us.
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On October 06 2011 07:11 Magic_Mike wrote:
I personally think we need marriage for the same reason we need, funerals, birthdays, bar mitzvah's or whatever. Human beings have a profound need to ritualize important events in our lives. The commitment can be made regardless of whether or not you have a wedding ceremony. However it sticks in our minds more and gains additional importance when we ritualize things. It's the difference between going to just another high school dance and going to the prom. They are the same things it's just that one has more ceremony and therefore seems more important to us.
Or the whole swearing in front of a gathering of friends family and witnesses a declaration of intent which is ritual I agree but its also a wee bit more than that, thus courts recognizing this fact.
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If not, maybe the whole 'only opportunity in your life you will EVER be able to enjoy a party with all of your family and friends in the same room together, and be the center of attention' thing might sway you.
You don't need to have a ceremony, but there are a lot of good, fun reasons to have one. My parents didn't have one, they just got married by a local registrar, but my mother was still mad jelly of our wedding.
Contrary to popular e-nerd, practical, down-to-business attitudes around here, it's totally okay to have your 15 minutes of fame and enjoy it.
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Ask Al bundy
![[image loading]](http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQt_LoFSvbfU2Arnd6JZjgAiRVBDMyblxvai8T2Pz2--TtAljHo)
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On October 06 2011 04:22 Divinek wrote:
You can view marriage in two totally different ways; signing a piece of paper or something truly meaningful. I think getting married in and of itself is obviously not meaningful, but the act and what it represents and having a celebration for it is an awesome idea. If you truly love them then WHY NOT celebrate a real promise to be together for the rest of your lives. You two may already know it but why not let the world know too?
Because marriage often entails a whole bunch of other things, besides letting the world know.
For one thing, it's a contract that allows a woman to secure her financial future before the ravages of time starts decreasing her sexual market value. As a simple test of this, ask how many women would be willing to sign a prenuptial agreement to waive all alimony. The percentage unwilling is the percentage that think that marriage is more than just a "celebration of commitment" (those who are willing, on the other hand, are the keepers).
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For people here discerning whether or not marriage is right for them, here is hands down the best resource I've found. It's a book called "1001 Questions to Ask Before You Get Married". It's just that, it's questions about prior experiences with other people's marriages, your own expectations with marriage, children, political/religious perspectives, physical/emotional expectations, finance, etc. I've been working on it with my lovely girlfriend for the past 4 months or so, and it's really clarified for me that this is a person I can give myself to.
If you're going through this book, you must be completely open with your partner. If you're softening your belief or stance on something in a way you think your sig. other will handle better, or outright lying, consider that a major red flag that marriage isn't right for you.
http://www.amazon.com/1001-Questions-Ask-Before-Married/dp/0071438033
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GRAND OLD AMERICA16375 Posts
Ask Xellos, got married after 7 years
just saying.
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On October 06 2011 08:07 Harbinger631 wrote:For people here discerning whether or not marriage is right for them, here is hands down the best resource I've found. It's a book called "1001 Questions to Ask Before You Get Married". It's just that, it's questions about prior experiences with other people's marriages, your own expectations with marriage, children, political/religious perspectives, physical/emotional expectations, finance, etc. I've been working on it with my lovely girlfriend for the past 4 months or so, and it's really clarified for me that this is a person I can give myself to. If you're going through this book, you must be completely open with your partner. If you're softening your belief or stance on something in a way you think your sig. other will handle better, or outright lying, consider that a major red flag that marriage isn't right for you. http://www.amazon.com/1001-Questions-Ask-Before-Married/dp/0071438033
Normally I hate links that promote shit offsite but this is a really good one, I got to reading it after my ex-fiance and I broke and I think it would have saved a lot of trouble ahead of time. Obviously some of the shit is subjective to time and place but its mainly put together extremely well.
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On October 05 2011 22:26 NikonTC wrote:
You're missing my point I think, I'm perfectly happy with "promising" myself to someone I care about, my question was why do I have to do it using a word, a band of metal, and a priest of a religion I don't even follow?
you don't have to get married with a priest.
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On October 06 2011 01:13 Kinetik_Inferno wrote:
I don't think I'm ever going to get married. I don't mean that I'm going to be a bachelor for life, but I'd rather not be officially married with someone else. It harkens back to a time when women were considered property.
Pretty sure my opinions are going to change quite a bit once I'm actually at that point though.
so marriage, = woman your property.
k. Sound logic bro
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On October 05 2011 22:42 The Black wrote:
Ok these are my thoughts:
Legal benefits - understood and agree
Life stability - ok I get it
Commitment - Clear
Problem is, is it not natural for a man to really go hunting. It's not even about the grass being greener on the other side. It's about pleasure, or, forgive me, conquest! Maybe one can get married and just secretly be "hunting" on the sides, but still be in love and committed to the marriage. Is that such a bastardly thought? Perhaps there will be such a woman in time that will tame a man, right?
If you honestly felt you were ready for the commitment of love there is no way you'd be saying stuff like this. I've only been with my girlfriend for less than six months and the concept of "hunting and conquest" leaves me no temptation whatsoever... in fact it is repulsive.
I sincerely hope you don't let your girlfriend pledge her life to your side if you think so shallow of her. If you're not good enough for marriage, that's your own deal. Don't ruin someone else's life who wants to actually get married. Stop with the sexist bullshit about "men are meant to hunt and conquest." Men and women both ruin their marriages with cheating -- making excuses for it now just means you're likely going to end up being one of the statistics. Sheesh, no wonder half of marriages end within five years if this is the kind of people that enter it.
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On October 05 2011 23:50 wingweaver415 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2011 23:38 The Black wrote:On October 05 2011 23:15 rogzardo wrote:
Probably not the best idea to get married and already be planning to cheat on her. Just saying. You understood me perfectly. Does it still count as cheating if I still love here and commit to here forever? Now I'm beginning to think your a troll....
Going to have to agree here... I was baited.
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On October 06 2011 08:43 VPCursed wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 01:13 Kinetik_Inferno wrote:
I don't think I'm ever going to get married. I don't mean that I'm going to be a bachelor for life, but I'd rather not be officially married with someone else. It harkens back to a time when women were considered property.
Pretty sure my opinions are going to change quite a bit once I'm actually at that point though. so marriage, = woman your property. k. Sound logic bro
He was saying the act of marriage is an outdated concept which in the past symbolized that the woman was your property. He didn't once explicitly state that he thinks if he gets married then the woman is his property.
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Don't get married until you're a good bit passed 25. And if you're still in school, college, don't get married until you've had a job for at least 3 years. You haven't seen enough of "real" life, meaning adult life, until you've met either or both of these conditions.
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On October 06 2011 09:00 VonLego wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2011 23:50 wingweaver415 wrote:On October 05 2011 23:38 The Black wrote:On October 05 2011 23:15 rogzardo wrote:
Probably not the best idea to get married and already be planning to cheat on her. Just saying. You understood me perfectly. Does it still count as cheating if I still love here and commit to here forever? Now I'm beginning to think your a troll.... Going to have to agree here... I was baited.
Not necessarily.
Different people around the world have different views on the meaning of sex. Given your moral compass I would assume that you believe sex is an intimate act that should only be performed between loving couples (or something similar to that train of thought). Other people view sex as merely an act of pleasure, something that is fun to do. If a person views sex as "for fun" then is it really the same as if it is viewed as an intimate act?
My point being, is it cheating to watch a movie with a female friend? Its something you do for fun, so if your view is sex is just something to be done for fun rather than a commitment of love then is it really the same?
There are people in happy and healthy open relationships, where they have sex with people other than their partner but still feel completely and totally in love with their partner. They have intimacy with their partner beyond that of sex. It goes back to their partner is their best friend, their soul mate. They don't feel the need to keep sex as something they only do with each other because they have so much more to share with each other that is special other than what is in their pants. After all, billions of people have vaginas and penises and for the most part there isn't anything that special about the one your partner has. What makes people an individual is what is in their head, their thoughts and feelings, not their genitalia.
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On October 06 2011 09:00 Tektos wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 08:43 VPCursed wrote:On October 06 2011 01:13 Kinetik_Inferno wrote:
I don't think I'm ever going to get married. I don't mean that I'm going to be a bachelor for life, but I'd rather not be officially married with someone else. It harkens back to a time when women were considered property.
Pretty sure my opinions are going to change quite a bit once I'm actually at that point though. so marriage, = woman your property. k. Sound logic bro He was saying the act of marriage is an outdated concept which in the past symbolized that the woman was your property. He didn't once explicitly state that he thinks if he gets married then the woman is his property.
I'm quite ignorant in what the past symbolized for women. Modern marriage has changed. However i think basing a decision on the past in this case is... stupid? I cant find a better word..
but he said he would rather not be "Officially" married so its not as if he doesn't believe in the commitment between a partnership.
I really haven't a clue about the history of "marriage"
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On October 05 2011 22:21 Harbinger631 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2011 22:08 NikonTC wrote:On October 05 2011 22:00 Harbinger631 wrote:
It's not the wedding ceremony that matters, it's the promise. If you care enough about a person that you want to devote your life to her/him, then it's reasonable that you swear it to that person, declare your intentions. With a promise of such gravity, you'll of course want witnesses, usually family and friends, and an authority figure to preside over your promise, be it a religious figure, judge, captain, etc.
Contracts are very important, they bring stability to a chaotic world. The way you say that, you make it sound like marriage is just a tool of the paranoid and the self-conscious. "Oh you love me do you? Well then you won't mind signing this contract that means I get half your stuff if it turns out you're lying!" Surely if you "care enough about a person that you want to devote your life to her/him" as you say, then you don't NEED to make a promise. It's not about NEEDING to make a promise, it's wanting too. If you really want to devote your life to one person, you should be able to shout it from the rooftops. If you're worried about your stuff, then you obviously don't want to devote yourself to your spouse, and you shouldn't get married. If you don't want to make a promise, but think that you care enough to make it work, then you're holding back and somethings wrong.
Meh, With more than 50% of marriages ending in divorce I dont think this argument really holds water anymore. More than half the people who got married felt like that at one point or another. What about people who have been together 10+ years and have a common-law marriage, is there something more wrong with them vs someone who gets divorced after a year?
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All the older couples who I've talked about this to all say the same thing. It's a mistake to get married if you don't know you can't spend the rest of your life with someone. A lot of people who say they're in love just really like each other, but don't really NEED each other in their lives. It's natural to be worried about being with just one person for the rest of your life, but in the end, you know you wouldn't want to be with anyone else. They could be wrong, but just a few words from people who were married successfully for 50+ years
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Let's see... I'm in the US Air Force, I've been in Korea for almost 4 years. I have had 4 Korean girlfriends and the previous three were all unbearable. I've had my random dates in between. I finally found someone that doesn't drive me completely crazy. I don't want to rush into marriage too, but I feel like we can live our lives together. My time is running up in Korea and I don't want to call it a "shotgun marriage" because the Air Force wants me to move and I have to decide on whether I break up or get married to my girlfriend of 16 months. I proposed to her in June and we should be tying the knot by the end of this year.
Marriage is obviously serious since it affects your whole life, your friends, family, and your significant others life, friends, family, and etc. However if you feel like you two can properly communicate with each other about goals, financial situations, personality conflicts, and etc. you should be fine.
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On October 06 2011 08:43 VPCursed wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 01:13 Kinetik_Inferno wrote:
I don't think I'm ever going to get married. I don't mean that I'm going to be a bachelor for life, but I'd rather not be officially married with someone else. It harkens back to a time when women were considered property.
Pretty sure my opinions are going to change quite a bit once I'm actually at that point though. so marriage, = woman your property. k. Sound logic bro
He has some reason, but I think that marriage today has become more of an emotional bonding,as opposed to the binding it was in the past.
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I actually had a chance to read all of the posts in the thread now. A lot of people say marriage is "just a piece of paper" but for some people it means a hell of a lot.
US Military doesn't give a shit about your girlfriend, but supports wives so much more. We're talking family separation pay, higher housing pay for dependents, health care benefits, moving benefits, and etc. You don't get any of that if you're single. Oh yeah and if your GF gets pregnant out of wedlock good luck getting time off from work to raise the newborn. I'm not trying to say get married for benefits, but saying that "marriage is just a piece of paper" sounds a bit misinformed in my opinion. Also in my situation in able for me and my GF to be together she has to have an approved Visa immigration to live in the US so the best way to do that is through a Fiancee/Wife visa petition.
Anyways me and my girlfriend are 24 and she's always told me "When I get married I will do this for my husband and bla bla bla." I remember once when we were together she asked me when I would get married. I laughed and told her when I was an old man, but honestly I just wanted to hide the fact that I was observing her as marriage potential. She told me 26, but I'm pretty sure she meant 25 in Western age so I guessed when I proposed to her she happily did it at 25 Korean age.
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On October 05 2011 21:52 NikonTC wrote:
I'm not sure of any legal benefits to getting married, so I won't comment on those, but I'd be suprised if they were such that a couple had to get married.
.
To a degree they are. Depending on where you live, you can lose your home or miss out on health insurance etc etc.
Say your gf/bf dies, your home is in her/his name. His/her parents will inherit your house and you'll have to gtfo.
Then theres health insurance. Quite the incentive in some countries. Idk, there are many scenarios you and I have not thought about. Basically when you get married, everything is owned by both and shared. Up until then nothing is, unless contracts are explicitly signed with both names.
Think 100 years back, or more, when people married for money/wealth and social standing. Marriage was rarely about love
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Hello everyone, long time lurker here, but seeing this topic made me write my first post, having a similar problem to the OP, and seeing all the good answers he has received, my faith in the TL community grew even larger. So i present to you my situation:
I have only been with 1 girl my whole life (since i was 15, i am 23 now), both of us lost our virginity to each other, and we really got along easy from the beginning, tolerated each others faults, and for the first 3 years (the years we were still both in high school, being in the same class and linked by both of us going to chemistry and biology national olympics) we were deeply in love.
Then we both went to medicine university, got accepted among the first, and after a few months moved in together. Then i started playing WoW. So 3 more years passed, i didnt like school any more, simply didnt have any interest in it anymore, and doubt infiltrated my mind, thinking maybe im not right for medicine, so i decided to quit and find my 'true' calling in another profession. After i made this decision the urge to play wow dissapeared, so i now regard it as only a simpotm of unhappiness.
So i studied to get into the psychology univesity, and i got accepted-'yipee' at being a 1st year student all over again. So everything was going fine, or so i thought. I had quit my addiction and was on the path to healing. But all those years of neglecting her had taken their toll and i didnt feel quite as attracted to her, even though i still loved her deeply, she was the only one who knows me and understands me. Oh and i forgot to mention, even since we were in highschool i have told her that i would marry her in the future, because i honestly believed that.
But what happens now, i go into a different environment, and for the first time after so many years, i go into my work place without her ( remember highschool-same class, medicine-same group). I feel a bit awkward and antisocial for a while, but i try to overcome my feelings, knowing that after years spent in a world of illusion reality would sting a bit. But one day this weird thing happens, i have to go do an assignment with some of my colleagues, and guess what, i see this girl, not from my group, and i start to feel something weird for her. Sort of what i felt for the girl im with now. She isnt much by my normal standards, she doesnt seem like 'my type' (though i have to admit she is pretty hot, though ive seen better). Its that feeling i have that turns my world upside down. I had confused that feeling with love , its what ive been told, but i ask myself, why am i feeling it again? I dont do anything, i dont ask her out because i wouldnt dare cheat on my gf, i just know it would break her. But it starts to break me. The more i try to repress it, the more it haunts me. I start not wanting to go to college for fear of seeing her.
So i tell my gf about it. You can imagine she isnt very happy. And for the last year most of my energy went into rationalizing this, mostly to no avail. This summer, after feeling i cant take it anymore, i decide to split up with my gf. It only lasted me for 2 weeks. In those 2 weeks every other thought dissipated except for my gf. I did hit on other girls but it left a shallow feeling in me, i just wanted my gf back. So i decided to man up, stop caring about picking up other girls ( u can imagine her being the only girl i ever slept with has its ups and downs, i dont get to be jealous on ex-bfs, but my grass is greener on the other side is widely amplified by not having ever tasted that grass), and commit.
But guess what after 1 month of 'honeymoon' my doubts are starting to pour in again, especially thoughts about that girl. So now i feel im in deep shit again. I dont want to hurt my gf, i love her, i really care about her, and i realize what a selfish mongrel i am but i just cant stop it.
Sorry for the wall of text, i tried to sum it up as best as i could, so if anyone has been in a similar situation or would just care to help with some advice, insight or just tell me im a pussy and flame me i would welcome it. She wants me to commit to her, but i just cant, and that other girl that i know nothing about nor care in a serious way is the only thing holding me back... how do i get rid of this feeling?
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On October 05 2011 21:55 The Black wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2011 21:52 NikonTC wrote:
A more interesting debate in my mind is: Why do people NEED to get married these days?
The sanctity of marriage is out the window completely, along with all religious reasons for it. So other than the chance to have a big party and a fuss made of the couple, why to they bother to get married at all? If your relationship is such that you NEED to have some form of "commitment" ceremony to bind yourselves together, then I'd question whether the relationship is strong enough for marriage in the first place.
I'm not sure of any legal benefits to getting married, so I won't comment on those, but I'd be suprised if they were such that a couple had to get married.
Myself, I don't care either way about marriage. I've never cheated on a girl in my life, and if I find a girl that I want to spend the rest of my life with, then I'm capable of doing that without a band of metal on my finger to remind me. However, the girl I'm with may want to get married, or at least have a ceremony of some sort. So I guess I'll have to stay open minded to the concept. This also. But my thought are actually more basic. I'm sorry for being too honest about this as well. You may call it cheating, but can a man actually be satisfied with just one woman (at least sexually?)
to be completely honest, after a while, you just put sex into a much lower priority than other stuffs and unless there are some super hot chicks who want a threesome with another super hot babe, then you just will learn to say no to these stuff.
Of cause, being young, you can still have your regrets and get more sex but then again, is it worth the loss is the question.
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On October 05 2011 21:34 kirdie wrote:
I think 2 or 3 years is not enough, 5 years is the best time I think.
Reason being that many relationships end after 1 or 2 or 3 or 4 years but if you are together for 5 years I think it can be assumed that it holds. But even then I have a friend that married after 5 and 1 year after that they divorced but you can never be sure...
That's bullshit. I knew my current wife for 1 year before I proposed and one year later we got married. We are now happily married for over 3 years and got a second kid on the way.
Marriage is a double-edged sword though, as it can as well screw as fix your life. I'm sure that if we wouldn't be married our relationship would fall apart some time ago. Marriage helps in the way that you're commited and can't really 'quit' for some bullshit reasons. Especially when you live together and have kids. You can't just walk away from that if something's pissing you off, you need to work to resolve any issues. The good side of that is that once you resolve those issues your relationship keeps getting better and better.
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Amnezie, you made the fatal mistake to solve personal problems within a relationship. It's usually better to 'grow' outside them, instead of burdening your partner with various personal issues. From your post it seems pretty clear you have just been following your gf around on jobs, studies whatever and so you were too dependent on her.
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On October 06 2011 19:30 Amnezie wrote:
Hello everyone, long time lurker here, but seeing this topic made me write my first post, having a similar problem to the OP, and seeing all the good answers he has received, my faith in the TL community grew even larger. So i present to you my situation:
I have only been with 1 girl my whole life (since i was 15, i am 23 now), both of us lost our virginity to each other, and we really got along easy from the beginning, tolerated each others faults, and for the first 3 years (the years we were still both in high school, being in the same class and linked by both of us going to chemistry and biology national olympics) we were deeply in love.
Then we both went to medicine university, got accepted among the first, and after a few months moved in together. Then i started playing WoW. So 3 more years passed, i didnt like school any more, simply didnt have any interest in it anymore, and doubt infiltrated my mind, thinking maybe im not right for medicine, so i decided to quit and find my 'true' calling in another profession. After i made this decision the urge to play wow dissapeared, so i now regard it as only a simpotm of unhappiness.
So i studied to get into the psychology univesity, and i got accepted-'yipee' at being a 1st year student all over again. So everything was going fine, or so i thought. I had quit my addiction and was on the path to healing. But all those years of neglecting her had taken their toll and i didnt feel quite as attracted to her, even though i still loved her deeply, she was the only one who knows me and understands me. Oh and i forgot to mention, even since we were in highschool i have told her that i would marry her in the future, because i honestly believed that.
But what happens now, i go into a different environment, and for the first time after so many years, i go into my work place without her ( remember highschool-same class, medicine-same group). I feel a bit awkward and antisocial for a while, but i try to overcome my feelings, knowing that after years spent in a world of illusion reality would sting a bit. But one day this weird thing happens, i have to go do an assignment with some of my colleagues, and guess what, i see this girl, not from my group, and i start to feel something weird for her. Sort of what i felt for the girl im with now. She isnt much by my normal standards, she doesnt seem like 'my type' (though i have to admit she is pretty hot, though ive seen better). Its that feeling i have that turns my world upside down. I had confused that feeling with love , its what ive been told, but i ask myself, why am i feeling it again? I dont do anything, i dont ask her out because i wouldnt dare cheat on my gf, i just know it would break her. But it starts to break me. The more i try to repress it, the more it haunts me. I start not wanting to go to college for fear of seeing her.
So i tell my gf about it. You can imagine she isnt very happy. And for the last year most of my energy went into rationalizing this, mostly to no avail. This summer, after feeling i cant take it anymore, i decide to split up with my gf. It only lasted me for 2 weeks. In those 2 weeks every other thought dissipated except for my gf. I did hit on other girls but it left a shallow feeling in me, i just wanted my gf back. So i decided to man up, stop caring about picking up other girls ( u can imagine her being the only girl i ever slept with has its ups and downs, i dont get to be jealous on ex-bfs, but my grass is greener on the other side is widely amplified by not having ever tasted that grass), and commit.
But guess what after 1 month of 'honeymoon' my doubts are starting to pour in again, especially thoughts about that girl. So now i feel im in deep shit again. I dont want to hurt my gf, i love her, i really care about her, and i realize what a selfish mongrel i am but i just cant stop it.
I feel you man. Maybe try to be open, You'll be ok. It's not clear to me. Are you back together now?
Sorry for the wall of text, i tried to sum it up as best as i could, so if anyone has been in a similar situation or would just care to help with some advice, insight or just tell me im a pussy and flame me i would welcome it. She wants me to commit to her, but i just cant, and that other girl that i know nothing about nor care in a serious way is the only thing holding me back... how do i get rid of this feeling?
I feel you man. Maybe go out and enjoy? By the way I don't understand. Are you back together now?
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On October 06 2011 19:30 Amnezie wrote:
so if anyone has been in a similar situation
I've been in a sort-of similar situation. Not as thoroughly involved as yours though, but we'd been together since we were 17 and after 4 years a change in my education and social environment happened. I started to heavily doubt my relationship because of this, being too anxious to tell her what was going on, the doubt went on for months until I cheated on her. I decided to tell her the very next day. Obviously she wasn't happy and we broke up for about half a year. When we got back together the same doubt came back after some months but I didn't want to give in to it. At a certain point I started talking to another girl and I knew that if I wouldn't act, things could possibly go wrong again. I didn't want to do that to her anymore, I couldn't ever get myself to cheating again after having gone through it once. I also knew the relationship was over, it was just so obvious but I didn't want to commit to the feeling since we had so much built up together.
When I did eventually get the insight, a couple of weeks later, I broke up with her basically straight away, telling myself that this had to be it, even though my feelings for her might still be strong, rationally the relationship couldn't continue. Not because of the love I still felt for her, but because we both had changed over the years, which is inevitable for young people, and both in a different direction. Rationally I decided it was over, and told myself to not see or get in touch with her for a very long time. Hard since we shared a lot of friends, but basically my strong connection with and empathy for her made me see that this was the best thing I could do to make it bearable for both of us. I didn't see or talk her for a year. After that year, we met up again, had a drink at some café and talked about the past. It was slightly awkward, she told me she had a new relationship, but for some reason the only thing I could feel was happiness for her. No regrets, no jealousy. I just really liked seeing her again as she is someone I shared a long period of my life with and can still closely relate to, but the deep emotional connection was gone, thanks to the long period of her absence.
I hope this helps you in some way. You don't have to act immediately, maybe you will come to an insight like mine after a while, maybe something needs to happen but don't wait the rest of your life.
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On October 05 2011 22:26 NikonTC wrote:
You're missing my point I think, I'm perfectly happy with "promising" myself to someone I care about, my question was why do I have to do it using a word, a band of metal, and a priest of a religion I don't even follow?
Symbolism, Tradition, Legal Benefits, etc.
Things of this nature outweigh the petty Counter-Culture anti-marriage beliefs at some point in your life. Taking your vows imo has nothing to do with the old religious connotations it was prescribed. Monogamy may have bared it's head through religion; but, the commitment in modern society has taken on a new life. I have no problem going through a ceremony pledging my life to my life to someone I will spend the rest of my life with.
My girlfriend and I have spent the past 2 years living with each other; currently, I'm memorializing my life through a series of letters to give to her, with the conclusion being my proposal. The only thing I can advise the o.g. poster is if you have found your greatest confidant, friend, and the person who makes you strive to better yourself; then you have found the "one".
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Some parenting advice from a heavy thinking child:
Judging by my parents (who are now divorced), and a lot of my friends' parents that I've gotten close to: learn how to communicate properly. Learn some debate skills, critical thinking, and logic. This are imperative to having rational discussions about differences (and differences are built in to the way humans function).
This is why my parents got a divorce: My mom only understands Catholic/blind faith logic, and my dad will never believe he is wrong. This leads to ridiculous arguments where absolutely nothing is even capable of getting accomplished. It's stupid to watch and it's horrible to be around. Please don't argue without logic.
Everytime you enter a conversation, you have to be prepared to find out that everything you've ever known to be true, was absolutely wrong. This is the only way to have a truly productive conversation about differences (in my opinion).
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Married here, for half a year now.
Me and my wife were neither pro or con on this subject, but when you decide to have children it's so much easier to take care of the 'legal stuff' when you're married.
We have legally seperate bank accounts though (prenuptial agreement) because I have my own company and in the rare case should we get separated, then I won't lose my company.
In fact, everthing will go back to as it was before the marriage.
bottom line: Should you get married, get a prenuptial...
It's little effort, and it has nothing to do with not trusting the other completely.
It just prevents fights over money in case the marriage doesn't work out.
Better to discus these things while you're still talking to eachother right?
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I'm 25 and I have been married for two years already. It's best decision I ever made. So many people seem to think of marriage as some sort of limiting or restricting concept, when in my opinion it's great. My wife and I travel all over the world, we work hard and we share the same goals and dreams. It's awesome to have a constant friend at your side who can always be there to back you up... I wouldn't give that up for anything... If you get married, marry the right person and for the right reasons...
Obviously not everybody here will share my point of view...
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So maybe I can add a few things to this discussion. I'm a woman, was married for 7 years before we got divorced, and I have a degree in anthropology where I studied some of this stuff.
First off, if you don't think you can deny the impulses, you shouldn't be in a serious, committed relationship, let alone a marriage. And no matter how much she pressures you, you're only going to both be miserable if you are thinking the way you're stating.
Second, marriage is the not the best way to raise children, as someone stated. A stable, committed relationship is. Has nothing to do with with a ceremony.
Third, breaking up after several years of living with a girlfriend/boyfriend is just as emotionally charged and horrendous as a divorce. The only difference is the legal part. Especially if you had kids. So people who say not to get married because it's easier to break apart, that's bullsh*t. You still have to divide things up, and common law marriage laws can be used to still get half of everything.
Fourth, you're somewhat right about the urges. From the research I've done and the stuff I've read, men are predisposed towards wanting to spread their seed. It's survival of their genetics, and their made for that. But the best outcome for the infant has always been a committed relationship, and so there are primal urges in place for sticking around when a child is born. But there's things out there that show it fades as the child gets to be more independent. The 7 year itch has genetic basis. That's long enough to raise a healthy child. There are a lot of less advanced cultures that are based on this. In one culture, the child is what the marriage ceremony is, and they're considered married for 5 years. Or at least, the woman is. She can't have sex with anyone else. The man actually goes through fake labor when the child is being born to prove that the child is his and that's his claim to the woman and the child. And the 5 years is what gives the child the best chance at growing to survival.
Anyway, our culture is different. Obviously. And long term relationships are what the norm is. Doesn't mean there still isn't urges. It means you don't act on them. Whether you get married or not, you have to make a decision and a commitment. I'm not religious, and feel, for the most part, that marriage is just a ceremony of a commitment that should already be there, so I don't need another marriage. My boyfriend, on the other hand, has lived with 2 other women before, and he wants to prove this is different. So he wants the ceremony. And I'm fine with that. But even now, when we're not married, neither of us act on the urges we might feel. Because that's what commitment is.
Alright, soapbox done..
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A lot of people here have mentioned that if you are haveing those feelings of being trapped by the idea, or feeling limited by being shackled to one woman for the rest of your life, then you probably shouldn't get married and I have to agree. Some people just aren't ready for a committed relationship at an early stage of their lives - I read through some of the people who had relationships lasting a number of years and then feeling different about their partner. I noticed many of them were young when they got together - maybe too young to think about settling down with each other?
I was in a deep committed relationship where the woman was pressuring me into proposing. She had a schedule for her life and wanted me to do my part, which was proposing as we left uni together. My problem wasn't so much that I was questioning settling down, I just couldn't see myself fitting into her plan of married life. Ever see Desperate Housewives? Yeah, she was Bree.
You shouldn't get married because you feel you should, or because it seems like now is the time to do it. You devote yourself to another person because you cannot see your life without them in it, because you want to declare that you are a pair to the world. Throw out the religious aspects of marriage too - you don't get married to please your family or theirs. You get married to deepen your relationship with your partner. Marriage isn't for everyone - some people like their relationship to be less defined, or like to have that feeling of freedom for themselves. Others have been burned by marriage in the past and don't see a point in being married again. Each to their own.
Personally, I have been adamant I would get married and try my best to make it stick from an early age. My parents and my close family have been through several marriages and I always hated that to many people marriage is just a case of 'well, that one didn't work out. Oh well, I'll get a divorce and try again'. Divorce is supposed to be when all else fails, not a failsafe for when people rush into marriage and need an escape hatch. I got married less than a month ago now to a wonderful woman I have been with for four years, and I intend it to damn well stick. I realise that we haven't been through everything, but we've faced a lot and I feel confident we'll be able to fight through whatever we come across. But I feel that way because I'm confident we understand each other and keep talking. From seeing my family when they've split up it's when you grow apart and stop talking that the real trouble begins.
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Married man reporting in
Marriage is like not being married, except you can make references to being married with one another. We've been a couple already for .. 5 years or so before getting married, and our two daughters were bride maids, which should give you a clue as to how the marriage got together.
For me, marriage is not a necessity, for a long lasting relationship. I see it as a symbol of commitment. There's also the law side of it, which I don't see any risk in, but some people want to factor that in with their decision. My wife was eager to get married before I put my thought into it, as she values the symbolism and expressed commitment (I assume) of it highly.
I did not get married in a church or in front of a priest otherwise. I have witnessed a wedding in that style, and being atheist/absurdist, combined with sticking to my morals, I wouldn't be able to keep a straight face in church. My wife wanted that, but backed down on that wish.
How to propose: Do it your own way X). You hear stories of some really complicated routines, or super special places and so. I am not the person to organize such a thing. I proposed whilst sitting on the ground with my wife, cuddling. Beforehand I wished for some .. awe inspiring setting as well, but it's not really the thing that counts.
Good luck whatever you decide
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On October 06 2011 23:11 Dude. wrote:
Some parenting advice from a heavy thinking child:
Judging by my parents (who are now divorced), and a lot of my friends' parents that I've gotten close to: learn how to communicate properly. Learn some debate skills, critical thinking, and logic. This are imperative to having rational discussions about differences (and differences are built in to the way humans function).
Debate skills are nice, but humility > any amount of logical reasoning skills IMO.
It doesn't really matter how well-reasoned your arguments are if you can't realize that your values aren't the ones worth believing in.
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I've been with a girl for almost 3 years and I'm planning on asking within the next year. Good luck man!
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I was thinking about this thread last night and I remember that sometimes I have to just bare the small things you don't like about your significant other. For example, I'm laying down and my GF would sometimes bug the shit out of me with these small pranks, but I just relax and wait till it ends. No one is perfect. I do things that annoy her sometimes and vice-versa. I just try to focus on the positive things and cope with the small negative things. It's not worth cutting a relationship over small things.
I have to see my my fiancee's dad before marriage, but I've seen here mom couple times in person. I really don't know how Korean dads react to their daughter getting married, but I know it will be pretty awkward. I heard a story from someone where the dad was trying to hit the guy for coming to his home asking to marry his daughter. I just got to win over her dad and I'm cool because her mom is perfectly cool with it. I've seen her mom couple times and she already treats me like her son-in-law.
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heh, feels familiar.
I've been together with my GF for 10 years now, time flies. (32 yrs. old myself)
Living together for 7 years.
I've only proposed to her last June, we will get married next June 2012.
The reason i hadn't asked her before was children.
I've always known i would want children some day and she didnt.
Only the last two years she has come around , probably due to the fact many of our friends started having them too and thus experiencing first or second hand how it actually is.
We had a lot of open talks about this issue in the past where i admiited to her i would never ask her to marry me if she didnt want children.
Wasnt meant as a means of emotional blackmail , but i did want them , so commiting my life to someone who didnt , didnt seem honest to myself.
Luckily for me she has turned 180 degrees about the subject.
Asking her father for her hand was one the funniest things i ever did , was so nervous and akward.
The marriage itself , i dont expect it will change what we have now , just that we both wanted too.
10 years seems like a really long time to take before you ask , but it didnt feel as " the time " before , can't explain it better than that.
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Marriage is no biggy really. Divorce is always right around the corner if you need it.
Having children is THE thing imo. You don't want to screw up on this one, but marriage bah. Worse thing will be divorce + another marriage/party/honeymoon.
GO FOR IT
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/WaFL8.jpg)
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On October 06 2011 19:30 Amnezie wrote:Hello everyone, long time lurker here, but seeing this topic made me write my first post, having a similar problem to the OP, and seeing all the good answers he has received, my faith in the TL community grew even larger. So i present to you my situation: + Show Spoiler +I have only been with 1 girl my whole life (since i was 15, i am 23 now), both of us lost our virginity to each other, and we really got along easy from the beginning, tolerated each others faults, and for the first 3 years (the years we were still both in high school, being in the same class and linked by both of us going to chemistry and biology national olympics) we were deeply in love.
Then we both went to medicine university, got accepted among the first, and after a few months moved in together. Then i started playing WoW. So 3 more years passed, i didnt like school any more, simply didnt have any interest in it anymore, and doubt infiltrated my mind, thinking maybe im not right for medicine, so i decided to quit and find my 'true' calling in another profession. After i made this decision the urge to play wow dissapeared, so i now regard it as only a simpotm of unhappiness.
So i studied to get into the psychology univesity, and i got accepted-'yipee' at being a 1st year student all over again. So everything was going fine, or so i thought. I had quit my addiction and was on the path to healing. But all those years of neglecting her had taken their toll and i didnt feel quite as attracted to her, even though i still loved her deeply, she was the only one who knows me and understands me. Oh and i forgot to mention, even since we were in highschool i have told her that i would marry her in the future, because i honestly believed that.
But what happens now, i go into a different environment, and for the first time after so many years, i go into my work place without her ( remember highschool-same class, medicine-same group). I feel a bit awkward and antisocial for a while, but i try to overcome my feelings, knowing that after years spent in a world of illusion reality would sting a bit. But one day this weird thing happens, i have to go do an assignment with some of my colleagues, and guess what, i see this girl, not from my group, and i start to feel something weird for her. Sort of what i felt for the girl im with now. She isnt much by my normal standards, she doesnt seem like 'my type' (though i have to admit she is pretty hot, though ive seen better). Its that feeling i have that turns my world upside down. I had confused that feeling with love , its what ive been told, but i ask myself, why am i feeling it again? I dont do anything, i dont ask her out because i wouldnt dare cheat on my gf, i just know it would break her. But it starts to break me. The more i try to repress it, the more it haunts me. I start not wanting to go to college for fear of seeing her.
So i tell my gf about it. You can imagine she isnt very happy. And for the last year most of my energy went into rationalizing this, mostly to no avail. This summer, after feeling i cant take it anymore, i decide to split up with my gf. It only lasted me for 2 weeks. In those 2 weeks every other thought dissipated except for my gf. I did hit on other girls but it left a shallow feeling in me, i just wanted my gf back. So i decided to man up, stop caring about picking up other girls ( u can imagine her being the only girl i ever slept with has its ups and downs, i dont get to be jealous on ex-bfs, but my grass is greener on the other side is widely amplified by not having ever tasted that grass), and commit.
But guess what after 1 month of 'honeymoon' my doubts are starting to pour in again, especially thoughts about that girl. So now i feel im in deep shit again. I dont want to hurt my gf, i love her, i really care about her, and i realize what a selfish mongrel i am but i just cant stop it.
Sorry for the wall of text, i tried to sum it up as best as i could, so if anyone has been in a similar situation or would just care to help with some advice, insight or just tell me im a pussy and flame me i would welcome it. She wants me to commit to her, but i just cant, and that other girl that i know nothing about nor care in a serious way is the only thing holding me back... how do i get rid of this feeling?
I am gonna call you a pussy yes, you should decide whether u really want to be with her or not, I am not saying this for your sake but for hers. Because the one who is the real victim here is her because you are not able to choose. I would also like to add that if you are not certain then you should NOT do it, it will most likely just come back and bite you later, you should be 100% about something like this.
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At 27 I'm very glad I have not gotten married yet like most of my peers. I do not want to get married for ~ another 10 years. And even then I'm not necessarily going to seek it out. Nor am I in a hurry to raise a kid, if I even want to that is. Right now, heeeeell no. I enjoy my 20s being fucking fun as hell, not being tied down to the house where the baby is.
What annoys me is when meeting women my age the majority of available ones are usually single moms and are divorced. Or they are one of the few remaining single women in their circle of married friends. Those usually feel left out and want to steer quickly towards marriage with anybody they date that's even somewhat compatible. The peer pressure to get married from their friends is great.
Generally I date younger to avoid that. And most of my relationships are open ones as monogamous relationships seem like a gigantic waste of time to me. At this point in life why devote myself solely to one woman when there are eleventy billion other ones that would be just as awesome to meet and hang out with and get to know.
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EPT
